Prabhupāda: (Sanskrit) If you want to be learned, then you have to read Bhāgavatam. Vidvāṁś cakre satvata. Vidvāṁ means Vyāsadeva. He compiled Bhāgavatam for the education of these rascals. Na te vidhuḥ svārtha-gatim. The same thing. They do not know what is their self-interest. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi visnu. And another place, anartha. This is anartha. Without knowing the real self-interest, they are engaged in so many so-called duties. Kṛṣṇa says sarva-dharmān: "Give up all these duties," but they will not do. Therefore Vyāsadeva says, anārthopasamaṁ sākṣād... These unnecessary engagements cannot be given up, anarthopasamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje (SB 1.7.6). To teach them bhakti yoga... And, anārthopasamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhoksaje lokasyājānato. These rascals, they do not know it. Lokasya ajānata. Ajānato lokasya. They do not know how to get free from this unwanted situation. But to get them free, vidyā... Vyāsadeva is vidvān, vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām. Anārthopasamaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam adhokṣaje lokasya ajanataḥ. Ajanato lokasya, they do not know, Hm? The same thing, a dog, what does he know what is the interest of life? Therefore Kṛṣṇa Caitanya Mahāprabhu has advised that because all these rascals are filled up all over the world, "Each one of you become a guru." Yes. So many gurus required. Āmāra ajñāya guru haya tāra ei deśa, wherever you are living, you just try to deliver your family, your neighborhood, your friends. Deliver, tāra. Tāra means deliver. "How can I do it? I am not a guru; I am a common..." "No. You have to become a guru." "How?" Yāre dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa-upadeśa': (CC Madhya 7.128) simply repeat the instruction given by Kṛṣṇa. Then you will become guru.
Dr. Patel: But for the saṁsārīs, sir...
Prabhupāda: Saṁsārīs, (indistinct) for the saṁsārīs. When Kṛṣṇa says, annād bhavanti bhūtāni (BG 3.14), this is for saṁsārīs. Saintly person doesn't require anna. It is meant for the saṁsārī. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni. Catur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭam: (BG 4.13) This division of society is meant for the saṁsārī, to control division of labor. Everything is for the saṁsārī. It is not meant for the paramahaṁsa. Paramahaṁsa-saṁhitā is Bhāgavata. This is ABC. These people, they do not understand even the ABC. This is the difficulty. They cannot learn even the ABCD of spiritual knowledge.
Dr. Patel:
- śreyo hi jñānam abhyāsāj
- jñānād dhyānam viśiṣyate
- dhyānāt karma-phala-tyagās
- tyāgāc chāntir anantaram
Whether tyāga is meant for the saṁsārīs?
Prabhupāda: Tyāgāt means one must be disgusted with this material way of life. This is tyāga. But they are being educated to be more attached to this material world.
Dr. Patel: This modern education.
Prabhupāda: Yes.
Dr. Patel: How to make a successful life. Like...
Prabhupāda: Vairāgya-vidyā-nija-bhakti-yogam (CC Madhya 6.254). That is bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yoga also, vidyā. Vyāsadeva also says, anārthopasanaṁ sākṣād bhakti-yogam. To get rid of this entanglement, unnecessary things, the only means is bhakti.
Dr. Patel: Modern advancement of science is actually here, entangle the man in more and more bonds. But by raising, creating more bonds for comfort, comfortable life...
Prabhupāda: What comfort?
Dr. Patel: Comfortable life means...
Prabhupāda: That is another...
Dr.Patel: Comfortable life means comfort of the body.
Prabhupāda: To get a comfortable life, one has to work so hard: "Where is comfort?"
Dr. Patel: (laughs) Yes. That is his foolishness. In Europe they actually run in the morning to go to their work. They run like mad dogs.
Prabhupāda: But we are also...
Dr. Patel: They may start running now. They are following them.
Prabhupāda: No...
Dr. Patel: And I remember that I used to laugh, the way they were running in the work, sir.
Prabhupāda: That is here also. Everywhere. Therefore Bhāgavata says, "No, no, no. This is not life." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājām nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān (SB 5.5.1). So much labor for getting your bread. That is immediately stopped.