Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: There's a second part to this question also, Śrīla Prabhupāda. They ask: if it's false that actually Hinduism is not fatalistic or sanātana-dharma is not fatalistic...
Prabhupāda: No, no. Fatalistic in this sense, that the destiny cannot be changed. Just like I have given already the example, that the Mahatma Gandhi, nobody expected that he would be killed by his own countryman. Why it happened? This means destiny cannot change. This is a prominent example, that Mahatma Gandhi, he was in a big meeting. Who expected that Mahatma Gandhi could be killed, and by his own countryman? But it was done. That is destiny. You cannot check it. So our point is that... The whole Vedic civilization is that destiny, a certain amount of happiness in this material world... Nobody is enjoying uninterrupted happiness. That is not possible. A certain amount of so-called happiness and certain amount of so-called distress. There must be always. So as you cannot check your distressed condition of life, similarly you cannot check your happy condition of life. It will come automatically. So don't waste your time for these things. You better utilize your energy for advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So those who are not Kṛṣṇa conscious, they think that "These people are wasting time."
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So then, is it true then that people who have this conception, they would not try for progress?
Prabhupāda: No, no. Progress... The thing is that if you try progress vainly, what is the use of trying? If it is a fact you cannot change your destiny, so why should you try for that? Better... That is the... Tasyaiva hetoḥ prayateta. Therefore whatever energy you have got, you utilize it for understanding Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Make it clear. Just like our society. We are, our main business is how to make advancement in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We are not very enthusiastic to open big, big factories and big, big money-earning machine. No. We are not interested. We'll be satisfied with the amount of happiness or distress, whatever we are destined. Let us utilize our energy for Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is the point. So the Vedic civilization is meant for realization of God. Viṣṇur aradhyate. So they try for that. And now, at the present moment.... Actually, the varṇāśrama-dharmi, they never tried for economic development. You'll find in India still, thousands of men taking bath in the Ganges. In the Kumbhamela... You have been in Kumbhamela?
Devotee: No.
Prabhupāda: At the Kumbhamela millions of people are coming to take bathing in the Ganges because they are interested how to become liberated. They're not lazy. They're going thousands miles, two thousand miles away, to take bathing in the Prayāgaa. So they are not lazy. But they are not busy in the dog's race. Yā niśā sarva-bhūtānāṁ tasyāṁ jāgarti saṁyamī. Saṁyamī. He keeps night, he does not sleep. Others are sleeping. So similarly, the dogs and asses, they think that "They are not working." And they are working. The different platforms. So the Vedic civilization which is practiced in India... Now it is distorted, but actually, they are not lazy. They are very, very busy. Not only very, very busy, but from, they are trying to become self-realized from the very beginning of life. Kaumāraṁ...
Devotee: Kaumāraṁ acaret prajñā?
Prabhupāda: Prajño dharmaṁ bhāgavatan iha. That is recommended. They are not lazy. They are so busy that want to begin the business from the very childhood. So it is a wrong conception that they are lazy.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So then if this is false that actually they're not...
Prabhupāda: they do not know what is the aim of life. They think that "they are not racing like dog; therefore, they are lazy." But they are busy, very busy, from the childhood. But they have no eyes to see what is, business means.
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The second point is, in connection with this question, that there's a certain class of people in India—he describes them as being advanced, well-meaning and highly educated people in India today—that they're accusing Hinduism of inhibiting progress and he wants to know why is this.
Prabhupāda: That is explained. They do not know what is progress. The Vedic civilization is not interested in this so-called false progress. Just like from hut to skyscraper. They think this is progress. But the Vedic civilization thinks how much he is advanced in self-realization. Either he is in cottage or in skyscraper. But if he wastes his time to turn the huts into skyscrapers, then the whole life is finished. And next time he is going to be a dog. He does not know. That's all.
Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Śrīla Prabhupāda? They want to know how this can be counteracted, this idea?
Prabhupāda: Huh?
Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Don't get...