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Wealth (Conversations)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:

Prabhupāda: The point is just how popular leader He was. Even in His young age, when He was only twenty years old, how popular He was. So..., and because He was a learned brāhmaṇa, people would send Him many presentation. A brāhmaṇa is not expected to work. That is dhana pratigraha. Pratigraha means accept offerings from others. Just like you offered so many things to me-money, clothing, food—so a sannyāsī, a brāhmaṇa, can accept. Not others. A gṛhastha cannot. There are restriction. A brahmacārī can, but he can accept on behalf of his spiritual master, not personally. These are the rules. So He was learned brāhmaṇa, and people used to present Him profusely, so He had no economics problem. Not that He renounced the world on account of poverty or some strain. He had no poverty, He was opulent. A brāhmaṇa does not require any great amount of wealth just to pull on his family. So that much amount was more than that He was receiving. He was teacher also.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Prabhupāda: There is no difference in the body. Simply by that special mark, some special hair on the chest and there is Bhṛgu, I mean to say, sole, sole, a mark of the feet of Bhṛgu Muni. So by some special marks one can recognize He is Viṣṇu. Otherwise, from bodily features and from dress and from ornaments, there is no distinction between Viṣṇu and His devotees in Vaikuṇṭha. They're all four-handed. Svarūpa sāyujya sālokya sārṣṭi. They have got equal, I mean to say, situation of prosperity, wealthy, equally, almost equally powerful. So practically there is no difference between Viṣṇu and Viṣṇu-bhakta. In Kṛṣṇaloka also. Only Kṛṣṇa is little blackish. Otherwise there is no... In the Kṛṣṇaloka they are two-handed, and Viṣṇuloka they are four-handed. All the Vaikuṇṭhas, the residents, they are four-handed. You want four-hand or two-hand? (laughter) Mr. Murti? What do you want? Four hands?

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- London, August 10, 1971:

Śyāmasundara: Yeah. Those men might help do legwork, but they're not wealthy in themselves.

Prabhupāda: So you raise one fourth million.

Śyāmasundara: Okay. (begins laughing)

Prabhupāda: And Mr. Arnold will help for the bank one fourth.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London:

Guest (2): When you come into this movement, you come in from on the outside, in the material world and so on. Do you, as some monks do in monasteries, do you give all your wealth, all your possessions, everything, as it were, to the movement?

Prabhupāda: Not necessarily. Why?

Revatīnandana: Not necessarily. But generally yes. Because we're coming here to serve Kṛṣṇa and we understand that everything is Kṛṣṇa's. So whatever we come with is automatically Kṛṣṇa's, so we use it in His service.

Prabhupāda: Actually, we don't possess anything. Everything is Kṛṣṇa's. What we possess, so-called possession, that is illegal. Because I cannot possess your property. I can possess your property by stealing. Not by fair dealings.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with John Griesser (later initiated as Yadubara Dasa) -- March 10, 1972, Vrndavana:

Yadubara: Has this happened before, the material wealth that we have now? Has it happened in past ages?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yadubara: Technological advancement, scientific?

Prabhupāda: All scientific. As this is winter season, so there will be a summer season. Anyone can say that after two months there will be summer season. Similarly, these ages are also, what is called, changing. So now it is Kali-yuga. After this Kali-yuga, there will be Satya-yuga. Cycle. So everything is happening. When there is winter season, everyone feels cold. So there is no question of asking. The particular type of age and its reaction of the quality of the nature, it will be there. So as there are many Kali-yugas, so it is to be understood that many times these things happened, and many times again will happen. Seasonal flowers, fruits. In the past, there were many times all those flowers and fruits, and in the future also they will appear. What is the difficulty to understand? But if in all these changing circumstances, if you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then your position becomes transcendental. You are no more subjected to all this changing process. So that opportunity is in the human life. It doesn't matter whether he is in the Kali-yuga or Satya-yuga. Because he has got this human form of life, he must be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Then his problem is solved. So you have to preach like this, that we are giving the best human welfare activities to utilize this human form of life.

Room Conversations -- April 22, 1972, Japan:

Prabhupāda: Temple must have. Even ordinary gṛhastha. That is Vedic civilization, not that we cook for ourself, for my husband, for my wife and children, eat it sumptuously and go to bed. No. Even gṛhastha, he should be always prepared to receive guest. Yes. And even a guest comes, your enemy, you should receive him in such a nice way that he will forget that you are all enemies. Gṛhe śatrum api prāptaṁ viśvastam akutobhayam. This is Vedic civilization, not that "Beware of dog. Please don't enter here. You are forbidden to come here. And if you come, I shall shoot you." Sometimes they do that. This is not human civilization. It is cats' and dogs' civilization. So actually we are teaching what is human civilization. But we must be also like human being, not cats and dogs. Otherwise how can you teach? If I am like cats and dogs, I cannot criticize others as cats and dogs. I must be first of all human being. Then I shall teach others how to become human being. I must become first of all devotee. Then I shall request others to become devotee. Āpani ācari jīve śikhāilā bhakti. First behave yourself perfectly; then teach others to become perfect. That is preacher. Now we are selling The Process of Creation but if I do not know what is the process of creation, we do not read, if you go to sell some book, then if he says, "What is the process of creation? You explain," and if you say, "All right, let me consult my book..." Kuto gata vedyaḥ para-hasta-gataṁ dhānam. Para-hasta-gataṁ dhānam means, "I have got enough wealth." "Where it is?" "It is in other hands. It is not in my possession, in others' possession." This kind of possessing wealth has no value.

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: The government may create a prisonhouse, but why do you go there? Does the government invite you there? No, you become a criminal and go there. The prisonhouse is there and the university is there. Why do some people go to prison rather than the university? The government is not partial to people; it does not say, "You live in this university and be educated, and you go to the prison and live there." It is in the individual's choice. Similarly, God has created so many things, but it is our duty to follow God's instructions. God says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja: (BG 18.66) "Just give up all nonsense and surrender unto Me. I shall give you all protection." That is God's declaration. Why don't you take to that? God is all powerful, and He may create so many things for some purpose, but why don't you follow God's instructions? God says, "Surrender unto Me," so why not surrender? Why surrender to māyā? That is the individual's choice. Another example: the government does not want the youth to become hippies, but they are abandoning a wealthy life just to lie down in the street. In London I've seen many boys lying on the street. Why? We Indians may lie on the street because we are poor, but they are not poor, nor the Americans. Why has some of the younger generation accepted this way of life? You have enough food, enough house, enough money, facilities, machines—everything. Why are they accepting this kind of life?

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: If one gets a diamond, he possesses something valuable. But in this civilization you are simply making plastic plates and plastic cups. Indeed, in Japan I have seen pasteboard homes. And everyone is thinking that he is advanced. Formerly people used to have golden and silver utensils, but now they have plastic ones, and still they are very proud to be so materially advanced. What is your position? You have a bunch of paper and think, "I am a millionaire." What is the value of that paper? Is that not cheating? However, if we possess gold or diamonds worth a million dollars, that is actual wealth. But we are educated in such a way that we think we are millionaires by paper only. As soon as there is some catastrophe, millions of such dollars could not buy bread. This actually happened in Germany; millions of marks could not purchase one piece of bread. All this is going on in the name of advancement of civilization, and the real purpose of life, God consciousness, is missing. So every thoughtful man should come forward to understand this movement and take it seriously. Why are the people being misled? We just have to try to understand this philosophy, the basic principles of God consciousness.

Room Conversation -- October 25, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. These rascals at any time can arrest anyone and keep in him the concentration camp. Oh, it is a dangerous government. And they will take you anywhere, nobody will know. Just like even a great person, Kruschev, nobody knows his whereabouts. It is a very dangerous government. But as they are advertising, people are not happy. Moscow city is nice, but it is old constructed. The same Communistic government has not done anything. There are very big, big buildings, nice roads, everything, but they are all old, not new.

Devotee (3): What they are doing with their wealth?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Devotee (3): What they are doing with their wealth?

Prabhupāda: Wealth?

Devotee (3): What are they doing with their wealth if they are not investing it in economic...

Prabhupāda: They're simply spending for military, that's all.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Dr. Arnold Toynbee, Famous Historian, at his home or office -- July 22, 1973, London:

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: Well, the western countries are mostly concerned with economics, money, wealth...

Prabhupāda: No, that is...

Dr. Arnold Toynbee: It's about the same as...

Prabhupāda: That they can continue. But the spirit of Vedic culture should be accepted. It is not that because one has to accept the Vedic culture, he has to stop industry or material progress. Not like that. Bhagavad-gītā does not teach that. Simply to change the consciousness. Therefore we have named the Society "Kṛṣṇa Consciousness." One has to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. Then everything will be adjusted. Not the mode of life should be changed. Little change. Just like we recommend that four things should be avoided: illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication and gambling. So to give up these four kinds of activities, which are considered to be sinful, that is not very difficult. That is not very difficult. These English and, I mean to say, European and American boys, they are young men. They have given up. So in the society, if there is prevalence of sinful activities, then there will be reaction. So these four things are considered sinful activities: illicit sex, meat, unecessarily killing of animals, and intoxication, and gambling. Yatra pāpas catur-vidhaḥ. These are four kinds of sinful activities. So Vedic civilization means they should be freed from the sinful activities. Then other things will automatically come.

Room Conversation -- September 19, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Give means, you want to take something from God. "God, give me wealth, give me fame" Yaśo dehi.

Guest (1): No, if we want to give to God...

Prabhupāda: Yes, when you learn to give God. Generally...

Guest (1): Therefore, if a man feels empty, what he can offer?

Prabhupāda: No, no, empty... God says that you can give Him patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam (BG 9.26). You can give Him little flower, little fruit, little leaf, little water. He is satisfied. Not that you have to give millions of dollars. But if you have got millions of dollars, and if you think, "God will be satisfied with little fruit," that is cheating. God knows, "He is a cheater. He has got millions of dollars and offering me little leaf, little water." He is intelligent enough. He knows that he's a cheater. People do that. Bhakti in the mind God, and for others, garama garama puri. And for Kṛṣṇa, within the mind, meditate. (laughter) God knows that "He is a cheater number one. He is preparing puri for himself, and for Me he is meditating." What is this nonsense? How meditation will help?

Guest (1): God expects something from you.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Banker: And they never left India. I don't know how they make this comparison. They say they have happiness here and we have wealth, and because of our wealth we are unhappy people.

Prabhupāda: The Americans say?

Banker: No, no, that is what they say here. Especially in my bank. Our clerks are the top five per cent of the nation's income earners, five thousand rupees or more a year, near the top five percent. But they still say that they're poor and happy. But then once a year they forget that when they ask us for more money. I don't understand it. Contradictory philosophy.

Prabhupāda: There are two things. One material, one spiritual. Spiritually, India is happy, those who are actually spiritualists. But materially, India is unhappy. Spiritually, even if you still go in the interior of village, poor man, living in a cottage, he is taking bath three times and doing his professional work, a cultivator, having little food, and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. They are happy actually. They have got their family, husband, wife, some children. If one lives spiritual life, he is actually happy. Materially, nobody can be happy. In your country, although there is enough facility for material enjoyment, actually they are not happy.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Banker: We have had a long history of debate in America over wealth. We have had one group, the fundamentalist Protestants, who argue that... Most of them are poor, and they feel very guilty if they have money. And then you have another group of Protestants, the Gospel of Wealth Protestants, who say that if you are truly holy, then it is better that the money be entrusted to your hands than to a man who is unholy. And then you have still another group that regards money as an end in itself, rather than a means to, committing you to do other things, And this confuses people in America. Your parents will be one thing, you'll be another. In my case, my mother is a Gospel of Poverty person. Blessed are the poor. She thinks you won't get into heaven unless you are poor. And I'm in the Gospel of Wealth category. (laughter) And you just select your own philosophy along the way. Carnegie was in that philosophy. He even wrote a book about it a one hundred years ago. The steel Carnegie, Carnegie steel.

Prabhupāda: Yes, Carnegie's name I know.

Banker: He was one of the number one advocates of this philosophy, that if you are holy, then the money should be in your hands, because you can use it for better purposes.

Prabhupāda: That is a good philosophy.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is a good philosophy.

Banker: Therefore, then he started building libraries all over the country and everything else, besides his steel company. But this has been a big fight. It still is a big fight. Today you have the people who support welfare and those who oppose it.

Prabhupāda: No. We don't oppose wealth.

Banker: Welfare. Payment to people who don't work.

Prabhupāda: No, everyone should work. Our Vedic philosophy is that everyone must work. But there must be division of work. Just like in your body there are different parts. The head department, the arms department, the belly department, and the legs department. These are different parts. So all these departments must work for the total benefit of the body. That is our philosophy. Nobody should sit idle. But he must work according to his capacity. Brain must work for giving direction. Hand must work for giving protection. Belly must work for supplying food, energy. And leg must work for carrying the body. So similarly the society must be divided: the brain of the society, the arms of the society, the belly of the society and the legs of the society. That will make perfection. The brain will give direction That is the brāhmaṇas.

Morning Walk -- December 31, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. The sinful activities have increased because the world has produced too much wealth. Because they can purchase sinful activities. And that is being increased by inflation. False money I have got, and with that false money I can purchase all this illicit sex, wine, intoxication, and... It is just like nowadays, bank is giving you a card, "Americard..." What is that?

Karandhara: Charge card. Bank Americard.

Prabhupāda: Ah. So you simply show the card, you get the goods. So to exchange, it has become very cheap. So cheaply you can purchase. Therefore cheaply you can purchase sinful things also. The people are becoming sinful. The modern economy is, "Engage people in hard working to produce, and by artificial cheating, secure the goods, commodities." This is modern economy. So a worker is getting three thousand dollar per month, but he is getting paper. But he is thinking that "I am getting money." He is giving his labor, and things are being produced. This is the policy. "Cheat him. Without giving money, give him paper, and get his labor, and produce goods." This is modern economy. Is it not? A laborer, a worker, is given high salary, high wages. So what he is getting? It is paper. And he is very enthusiastic to give his labor. So production is more. And when you go to purchase the products, then you have to pay again. Whatever you have earned, you have to pay everything, pay to the bank or pay to the man. Simply cheating process is going on. There is no solution. People are cheaters.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Hṛdayānanda: From the very beginning we should teach Bhagavad-gītā?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But our, our position is that we are above varṇāśrama. But for management or ideal society, we are introducing this. We, so far we are concerned, Kṛṣṇa conscious men, we are above varṇāśrama. But to show the people that we are not escaping, we can take part in any order of life. That is our position. Just like if I brush somebody's shoes, that does not mean I am shoemaker. My position is the same. But to show how to do it... Just like a servant is doing. The master is, "Oh, you cannot do. Just see." Just like I show you sometimes how to mop. So I am not a mopper, but I am showing how to mop. So our position is like that. We do not belong to any varṇa and āśrama. But we have to show these rascals. Just like Dhruva Mahārāja. He, he was perfect Vaiṣṇava, but when he was king, he was fighting like anything. Not that, "Oh, I am now become Vaiṣṇava. I cannot kill." What is this? He killed like anything. When the Yakṣas attacked his kingdom, he was killing like anything then the Yakṣa-rāja came and asked him to pardon this. He immediately accepted. So he wanted to give him some benediction, that "You are so great that simply on my request, you have stopped killing these rascals, Yakṣas. So you can take some benediction from me." He said, "That's all right. Thank you. You give me the benediction that I may be a pure lover of Kṛṣṇa. That's all." This benediction he asked. Although he was so powerful and, the Yakṣa-rāja, he could give him the wealth of the whole universe.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Anna-vastra, anna-vastra-dhana. Charity means to give in charity anna and vastra and cows. (break) ...give in charity some paper, one hundred rupees. (laughs) Another cheating. And he is also satisfied, "One hundred rupees." What is this one hundred? It is a paper, a piece of paper. (break) ...earned, black market, white market. Because when one does business, he has to do it, but it should be purified. I have seen the Marwaris, they do that. Although when earning money, they don't care, they do anything, but they give in charity. (break) ...purify the body by taking bath, similarly, the wealth is purified by the charity process, giving it to the brāhmaṇas and Vaiṣṇavas. Just like Rūpa Gosvāmī. He accumulated much wealth. He brought in a big boat, all gold coins. So... So he distributed fifty percent to the brāhmaṇa and Vaiṣṇava and twenty-five percent he gave to the relatives, and twenty-five percent he kept for his personal emergency. This is example shown by Rūpa Gosvāmī. (break) Kṛṣi-go-rakṣya-vāṇijyam vaiśya-karma svabhāva-jam (BG 18.44). So where is that vaiśya, giving protection to the cows? Although they were village men, they were very rich. That is the old Vedic civilization. Now you go to the village—all poor. The cows are skinny, people have no home, no nice cloth. This is the position. And we are still advanced, advanced. They are proud of "advanced." And here is the... Just hear the description of the village, with cows only. So how much fallen we have become, we can just imagine.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Śrīdhara: "Their wealth was in milk, yogurt, clarified butter and many other milk products. And by trading their agricultural products, they were rich in various kinds of jewelry, ornaments and costly dresses." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...even the richest man, their wife has no bangles. You see? And they are jewelries. Jewelries. Cow, butter, throwing butter like anything, and silk sari and enough food grains. What is more want for material advancement? That is real material ad... You have got everything, material needs. (break) If a man can feed his wife and children, then he is successful. There is no question of charity. There is no question of charity. But here it is said they were also giving in charity. (break) ...stopped to become real brāhmaṇa and give instruction to the society, and they also stopped giving charity to the brāhmaṇas. So therefore the society is so fallen. There is no instruction from the brāhmaṇas and no charity from the kṣatriya and vaiśya. (break) ...proṣita bhārtṛkā. By the dress a woman is recognized. When she does not dress very nicely, it is to be understood that her husband is out of home. When there is the vermillion, that means she is married. When the, what is called, division? Siti. Siti is in this side, then she is prostitute. The dress, when the woman dresses with white dress, they are widow, no husband.

Morning Walk -- April 14, 1974, Bombay:

Girirāja: "Generally it is seen that one who has risen from a poverty-stricken life and becomes wealthy creates some charitable institution at the end of his life..." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...goes to market and gets some of this... What is called, bhūta bhūta?

Yaśomatīnandana: Corns.

Prabhupāda: Corns. (break)

Dr. Patel: That is why I say that rasanā (tongue) is not so strong as śiṣṇa (genital).

Prabhupāda: No, if you do not allow rasanā to enjoy much, śiṣṇa will be subdued.

Morning Walk -- April 23, 1974, Hyderabad:

Mahāṁsa: They have a wealth tax. So if you save that means you have more wealth, and then they tax.

Prabhupāda: And they will "relax" by drinking, "relax" minister. "You save money for our relaxation. That is our necessary. You don't spend money." And people are... Because they see that "If I save, it will be taken away. Let me spend lavishly." Yes. Just like we stayed there at Mr. Patel's house. There are three men only in the family: Mr. Patel, his son and his daughter-in-law. They have got eight cars, big, big cars, Rolls Royce. And about twenty servants. They know that "They will take it away. Better spend." Everyone is doing that. Because they know, "If I save, one day the government will take 98 per cent of my savings. Then why save? Better spend." They cannot give in religious institution. If they say they want to give something, no, that will not allowed. Yes. The whole idea is that "You save, and one day I shall take the whole money and we shall distribute amongst the ministers, Indira Gandhi and company. And we relax. We are working so hard, how to impose taxes upon you. So we must have relax." This is going on.

Morning Walk -- April 29, 1974, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: No, he has sold some, but still lying in the store. He published only one thousand copies. Our Nectar of Devotion, the translation of the same book, is selling like hotcakes. Yes. In the university, Temple University, they have made a textbook. And everywhere they like it, Nectar of Devotion. I think... What is our edition at the present moment? Fourth or Fifth edition. And we don't publish less than ten thousand copies. So we have to depend on Kṛṣṇa sincerely. Serve Him, everything, what is required, that will come, some way or other. That is miracle. Why should we try to cheat others, that "I can manufacture gold"? This rascal, if he can manufacture gold, then why he is doing himself business? That is simply jugglery. Even the magicians, they can do. They create so much money. But he is a poor man. Why he remains poor? And everyone thinks of us, that we have got unlimited wealth. You know that?

Morning Walk Excerpts -- May 2, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No. There is no such thing. That is separation. Just like gopīs, they are full of anxiety: "Oh, Kṛṣṇa has gone to the pasturing ground." Their anxiety is there. Just like Rukmiṇī, she was thinking, "Oh, Kṛṣṇa may not give me up. He is talking in this way." She fainted. So anxiety is there. So the anxiety is that one may not be separated from Kṛṣṇa. That is the anxiety. And actually there is no separation, but the feeling of separation out of ecstatic love. Just like one who has got love for the other person, beloved, he always thinks like that, "My beloved may not be separated from me." This is ecstasy of love. Just like a miser man who has got much wealth, he always thinks, "My money may not be lost. My money may not be lost." Out of his too much attachment for the money, he thinks like that. Is it not? "How shall I protect this money? How shall I protect this?" To earn money is also troublesome. To keep money also troublesome. And when it is lost, that is also troublesome. This is the position. But there is no such thing, loss, but the anxiety is there. We shall return from here? (break) ...vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām. So both the sādhu and the duṣkṛtina, by Kṛṣṇa's two activities, act differently to the devotees and to the demons. They realize. That is their achievement. By punishment, this Kāliya realized, "Oh, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Lord." And devotees, by out of love, they realize. Therefore Kṛṣṇa is Absolute. In either process He is realized. Mama vartmānuvartante manuṣyāḥ pārtha sarvaśaḥ. If one is sincere, then they gradually make progress. Yes. (break) ...vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Yogeśvara: Perhaps to make it clear for you, one of the natural results of this system is that a man that might be considered today impoverished, as you were mentioning for example some of the problems, a poor man, by our standards, is not necessarily poor if he is Kṛṣṇa conscious. For example, in the Vedic culture, we are learning that a man is considered to be wealthy if he simply has a small patch of land and a cow and God consciousness. Because his God consciousness will lead him to be satisfied by growing his own foods, taking milk from the cow. This is wealth, according to Vedic standards.

Prabhupāda: Therefore cow is specially recommended, go-rakṣya, because very important animal to the society. If those who are meat-eaters, they can eat the hogs and dogs, they can eat. The Vedic injunction is not prohibiting them. If you actually... Actually, a human being does not require to eat meat. He has got many other substitutes. But still, if he wants to eat, let him eat the less important animals. Just like dog, hog. From the social point of view it has no utility. But why killing cows? It is delivering such a nice nutritious food, milk. Not only milk. According to Vedic system, the cow is so important, even the urine, even the stool, of cow is important.

Room Conversation with Christian Priest -- June 9, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara:

mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat
kiñcid asti dhanañjaya
mayi sarvam idaṁ protaṁ
sūtre maṇi-gaṇā iva
(BG 7.7)

"O conqueror of wealth (Arjuna), there is no Truth superior to Me. Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread."

Prabhupāda: So "Nobody is superior to Me," there is nobody controller. Kṛṣṇa is not controlled by anyone. Therefore, He is īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ (Bs. 5.1). That is final God. Otherwise God... You will find, you are more powerful than me, he is more powerful than you, and somebody is more powerful than him, go on, go on, seeing, seeing. But when you come to Kṛṣṇa, nobody is more powerful than Him. Mattaḥ parataram. Parataram means better or higher principle, no.

Room Conversation with Reverend Gordon Powell, Head of Scots Church -- June 28, 1974, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: But that is imperfect idea. Our philosophy is everything belongs to God. So unless they come to this conclusion, they'll remain imperfect. The equal distribution of wealth, everything belongs to God—that is very good idea. But if it is limited within certain area... Just like the communistic state. Besides that, this is imperfect in the sense, they have no idea who are nationals. Not only they, even the capitalists. National means those who are born in that particular land. So there are animals also. They are also national. But because they are imperfect, either the communists or capitalists, they do not accept the animals as nationals. They are sent to the slaughterhouse. These things are happening because they are imperfect. They have no God conscious views. They have crippled views. They are imperfect.

Morning Walk at Marine del Rey -- July 13, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: "We shall burn it down." They are seeing practically. After all, they are businessmen. "Shopkeeper's nation." They see practically that if such kind of movements go on... People are already, have no interest in the church. In Chicago, they wrote "American Hindus." They wrote in the paper. Then Hindu, Hindu religion will be prominent.

Bahulāśva: The Catholic Church is a very wealthy institution, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Bahulāśva: The Catholic Church is very wealthy. They don't want to lose their...

Prabhupāda: So what will wealth do? If it does not appeal to the people, what wealth will do? In Chicago also, the Christians came with some wooden signboard. You have seen?

Bali Mardana: No, I didn't see.

Prabhupāda: "It is through Christ. It is through..." They were showing me. So that has been criticized by the newspapermen, that "Nobody cares for you." (laughter) Yes.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Tripurari -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: Push on this. Then our movement is successful. All Americans should have at least one set of book. That is not very difficult for them, to purchase one set book. But it will be a good asset for them if they keep and see sometimes. Any line he reads, he will get transcendental knowledge.

Devotee (1): There is one very wealthy man in Atlanta who... We went and did a nice presentation at his home. And then afterwards we distributed prasādam and had a nice bhajana, kīrtanas. Then afterwards he bought the whole set of literatures and gave a hundred dollar donation for all of the literatures, and he has them now.

Prabhupāda: Yes. For an American gentleman one hundred dollars is nothing.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: There is a natural tendency to hear. Artificially they stopped. Nitya siddha kṛṣṇa bhakti. Appeals to the heart immediately. Unless he is too much sinful it will appeal immediately.

Amogha: In Sydney there was one teacher in a school, a private school, for rich men's sons, very, very wealthy. And he is the head of general studies and the school chaplain. A Christian. One boy from the school became a devotee, although he still went to the school. And the discussion came up in class about what the Hare Kṛṣṇaś believe. So he invited us to come.

Prabhupāda: The clergyman?

Amogha: Yes, school chaplain, and he liked it so much. I remember he was taking notes, and he was smiling every time one point came up that he liked. So he asked us to come again the next week, and again, and then the next time we went through six classes in one day. For about two months he asked us again and again, and then to show the film. And he was always taking notes. He would say, "What was that again? Part and parcel?"

Prabhupāda: He is sincere.

Room Conversation with Ganesa dasa's Mother and Sister -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa:

mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat
kiñcid asti dhanañjaya
mayi sarvam idaṁ protaṁ
sūtre maṇi-gaṇā iva
(BG 7.7)

Translation: "O conqueror of wealth (Arjuna), there is no Truth superior to Me. Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread."

Prabhupāda: God is the Supreme Truth. So Supreme Truth cannot be Hebrew truth, Christian truth, Hindu truth. Truth is truth. Just like gold. Because gold is found in America, nobody says, "It is American gold." It is gold. So similarly, God is one. He is for Hebrew, He is for Hindu, He is for Muslim, He is for everyone. Simply we have to know what is God. So if you try to understand through Hebrew religion, that's all right. But if you come to know what is God, that is all right. Otherwise useless. If you cannot understand what is God, then Hebrew, Hindu, Muslim, Christian, these different names, they are useless. And if you understand God, then whatever method it is, it is all good.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Devotee (1): We can see, Śrīla Prabhupāda, by the distribution of wealth and minerals in each loka, in each planet, it is meant to be governed by one ruler. One place there is gold, one place grain to grow. Is this true?

Prabhupāda: No. Everywhere there is everything, maybe proportionately in different quantities.

Hari-śauri: Is that governing that Brahmā does in the universe, he does that in relationship with all the other demigods like they are departmental heads? So he is not personally directing every single thing.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he is given in charge. Just like we have got different GBC's for different jobs. Similarly, they are doing their duty nicely. All these planets are the different residential quarter of different demigods. They are controlling the whole universal affairs. In comparison to them, this human being is nothing. We are controlled; we are not controller. That they do not realize. The modern civilization they do not realize, although they are being controlled they do not recognize it. That is the defect.

Room Conversation with Dr. Copeland, Professor of Modern Indian History -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Madhudviṣa:

cirāṇi kiṁ pathi na santi diśanti bhikṣāṁ
naivāṅghripāḥ para-bhṛtaḥ sarito 'py aśuṣyan
ruddhā guhāḥ kim ajito 'vati nopasannān
kasmād bhajanti kavayo dhana-durmadāndhān
(SB 2.2.5)

"Translation: Are there no torn clothes lying on the common road? Do the trees, which exist for maintaining others, no longer give alms in charity? Do the rivers, being dried up, no longer supply water to the thirsty? Are the caves of the mountains now closed, or, above all, does the Almighty Lord not protect the fully surrendered souls? Why then do the learned sages go to flatter those who are intoxicated by hard-earned wealth?"

Prabhupāda: That... Saintly person should depend on Kṛṣṇa. If Kṛṣṇa is not supplying cloth, all right, find out some torn, thrown-out cloth on the street. And food? Go to the tree. Take some fruit. And for water, go to the river. There is sufficient water. And for shelter, go to the cave. So these are already arranged. And above, over and above, do you think that the Supreme Lord does not take care of the person who has fully surrendered unto Him? Then why you are going to flatter this rich class of men for your food? This is the... And that is the... Especially throughout the history in India you will find, many hundred thousands of these sādhus. They do not go anywhere. I have seen at Allahabad, Kumbha-melā. They take bath in the Ganges and sit down in their place, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, without caring wherefrom the food will come. They sit down. And everything is coming. Still in India, if there is information, even in the remotest villages, "There is a saintly person has come in the village," they will approach.

Room Conversation with Yogi Bhajan -- June 7, 1975, Honolulu:

Devotee: Chapter Seven, text seven. You'd like it read?

mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat
kiñcid asti dhanañjaya
mayi sarvam idaṁ protaṁ
sūtre maṇi-gaṇā iva
(BG 7.7)

"O conqueror of wealth, Arjuna, there is no Truth superior to Me. Everything rests upon Me, as pearls are strung on a thread."

Prabhupāda: And so all the ācāryas of India, including Guru Nanak, Rāmānujācārya, Madhvācārya, Viṣṇu Svāmī, Śaṅkarācārya, Guru Nanak, they have accepted God Kṛṣṇa. So why not present this God all over the world?

Morning Walk -- June 29, 1975, Denver:

Satsvarūpa: That wealth should be shared by everyone.

Prabhupāda: That means they also do not wish to work so hard. They are seeing that "Capitalists are sitting very comfortably and (we) working." They are also thinking, "Escaping." Is it not? So the natural tendency is that "I will not work, and still, I will get my necessities." That is natural tendency. The material world means avidyā-karma-samjñānya tṛtīyā śaktir iśyate. This is out of ignorance they are working so hard. In the spiritual world there is no question of working. You get everything. Cintāmaṇi-prakara-sadmasu. Everything, whatever you want. So why not endeavor to go there? Why should you work like hogs and dogs?

Viśakha: Śrīla Prabhupāda, they will accuse us of being parasites.

Prabhupāda: No, I am not parasite. Your master. How do you say parasite? I am not going to beg from you. Parasites?

Brahmānanda: Parasite lives off another.

Morning Walk -- July 2, 1975, Denver:

Brahmānanda: You tell the story of the potter. He has many pots. (Prabhupāda laughs) And he tries to imagine what it will be like when he becomes very wealthy.

Prabhupāda: That is nonsense, waste time. (break) ...you are eating you will understand yourself, "Yes, I am eating, I am getting strength, I am getting satisfaction." But simply theory..., "What will happen after eating? What will happen?" You eat and you see what is happening. What is the use of asking this question? You eat and you will understand.

Room Conversation with the Mayor of Evanston -- July 4, 1975, Chicago:

Bhavānanda: This is a very wealthy community.

Prabhupāda: Oh, wealthy community. So invite all the young men to come and live with us for some time, and simply chanting, dancing, and give them prasādam. And if they like, they can read the books. Give this chance.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda? Of course, it would be beneficial if we had such a big building, but why can't we do it with the present building?

Prabhupāda: We cannot accommodate many men there.

Morning Walk -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Jagadīśa: ...the wealthiest neighborhood. It's about six blocks away.

Brahmānanda: Is it a crime place?

Jagadīśa: No.

Jayatīrtha: In Detroit... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...also, there is threatening of life. Some brāhmaṇa boys who were living with us, so they were threatened, "You are living with these mlecchas. If you don't give up, then your life is in danger." So they have gone to Māyāpur.

Room Conversation with Lt. Mozee, Policeman -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Lt. Mozee: Sir, do you think that the wealth of the United States and some certain other countries would be a block to spiritual faith? In Christianity there is a parable that "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to come before the throne of God." Would wealth in itself be a block toward spiritual awareness?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Too much wealthy condition is a block. It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, bhogaiśvarya-prasaktānāṁ tayāpahṛta-cetasām. If one is very materially opulent, he forgets God. Therefore, to be too much materially rich is a disqualification for understanding God. Although there is no more impediment, that "Only the poor man will understand God and rich man will not understand," it is not that. But generally, if one is extraordinarily rich or his one aim is only to acquire money, it is difficult for him to understand God.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Jayatīrtha: ...depending on how wealthy they are. He kidnaps them and tries to brainwash them that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not good.

Devotee: He calls it deprogramming. He says... He tries to deprogram the devotees that we have simply been hypnotized by chanting. So he has to snap us out of it by deprogramming. And he uses very severe techniques, very harsh.

Prabhupāda: And the parents are inducing him.

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Press Conference -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Jayatīrtha: Wealthy, riches.

Reporter (3): Riches, strong, wise, beautiful, education, and renunciation.

Prabhupāda: These six opulences, when you find in the greatest quantity, nobody can excel. Here in America you have got rich man, but nobody can say that "I am the richest of all." But God can say that He is richest of all. He is strongest of all, He is wisest of all, He is the most beautiful, in this way where nobody can compete and nobody can surpass, that is God.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That detachment is a form of wealth for the renounced order.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the gain of human life. Arthadam. This is meaning. Artha means meaning. Arthadam. Durlābhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma tad apy adhruvam arthadam. This human life, form of life, is very, very rare. So one can say, "You will also die like cats and dog. How it is rare?" No, yes, adhruvam arthadam: "Although it is temporary, it will not stay, but you can have meaning of life." Adhruvam arthadam. Everything is there.

Conversation with Professor Hopkins -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prof. Hopkins: There is a passage in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, I forget where, where Viṣṇu is asked "Why is it that the followers of the ascetic Śiva are all wealthy and prosperous people and the followers of You who are the Lord of the universe are all poor?" Is that the way you would see it then, that those that follow Śiva are after more material gain?

Prabhupāda: More material gain means you become more implicated.

Prof. Hopkins: More what?

Prabhupāda: Implicated. Our problem is birth and death, old age and disease. (break) ...this birth, death, old age and disease. For them, liberation, the ultimate liberation is to transfer oneself to the spiritual world.

Room Conversations -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:

Guest: Sir, are you familiar with Yogananda's Self-Realization Fellowship and the practice of recruiting wealthy people as patrons for people who are sincerely interested in following a spiritual pursuit?

Prabhupāda: Hm, what is...?

Rāmeśvara: He asked if you were, Śrīla Prabhupāda, if you were familiar with another yoga society founded by one swami called Yogananda. He called it the Self-Realization Fellowship. And they have a practice to recruit wealthy men as their members. He simply asked if you knew of that.

Guest: Do you think that this hinders with their development?

Prabhupāda: No. Spirit soul is the same thing either in wealthy man or poor man. The spirit soul is not different. Therefore in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said,

vidyā-vinaya-sampanne
brāhmaṇe gavi hastini
śuni caiva śva-pāke ca
paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ
(BG 5.18)

If Yogananda thinks like that—"Only rich man is able to practice yoga"—that is wrong. A poor man can also practice yoga. Because yoga means connecting, linking up with the Supreme. So as spirit soul, everyone is fit to connect himself with the Supreme. That is the statement in the Bhāgavatam. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). That is first-class self-realization, when one tries to connect himself with the Supreme. And the Supreme can be connected by anyone. That is also stated in the Bhagavad-gita, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). According to Vedic philosophy, one becomes poor on account of his sinful activities. So pāpa-yoni... So although he has taken birth in a degraded family or poor family, spiritually he is pure.

Morning Walk -- August 29, 1975, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: Actually by placing such an ad, then all the wealthy people read the ad in the newspaper, and they think, "Oh, they are doing such nice work." So then they go and collect, and they say, "Oh, you see? We are placing the ads." So on the basis of the ad alone.

Akṣayānanda: That means there is no work.

Prabhupāda: But no educated man, at least in India, is interested any more with philosophy and preaching. No Indian. (Aside) Jaya. (break)

Akṣayānanda: ...preach more, then that would help? Because he was previously a principal of a school.

Prabhupāda: No, how he is preaching? Have you heard? No, you cannot understand in Hindi.

Morning Walk -- November 11, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Time is eternity, but your formation is not eternity. Your formation is temporary. Time is eternity. (aside:) Thank you. No. Time is eternity, that's a fact, but your formation... Asann api klesada asa deha. It is temporary. That's all right. You know, I know, everyone. But it will simply give you pains, although it is asat. That you do not know. Time is... Body is temporary, but so long the body is there, you have to suffer. That body may be a ant's body or Brahma's body. So as soon as you get a material body, you have to suffer and go on examining urine and stool. (laughter) Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...and that is good wealth. And take some urine and find out, "Here is life." That's all. They are examining very scientifically. Why don't you...? The dead man's urine, if you examine and find out some injection and give it in life. Life is gone away, soul, and they are finding out life from the urine. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. (break) ...but it is very reasonable. They are finding out out so many atoms, particles, but in the Bhagavad-gītā it is clearly said that all these atoms are aparā, inferior. Find out the parā, the superior atom. That is life. (Hindi question and answer) But you cannot bring in life by so-called mantras. That is not possible. Hare Kṛṣṇa. (Hindi) (break) ...can write to these particle men that "You are finding so many, but there is another particle which is one ten-thousandth part of the upper portion of the hair. Find out that. That is life. That is superior." And quote Bhagavad-gītā, apareyam itas tu viddhi me prakṛtiṁ parām. "Another atom." Give them information at least. (break)...Kṛṣṇa's message. Simply by reading one book, Bhagavad-gita, you become learned.

Morning Walk -- November 20, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...the richest in the world.

Dr. Patel: Maybe richer because they are very serious in... Wherever they are, they are serious. In collecting wealth also they are very serious. In collecting, I mean...

Girirāja: Life members.

Dr. Patel: ...them also they are serious. In knowledge also they are serious. And in preaching also.

Girirāja: Prasādam.

Dr. Patel: Look at the Christ. Look at the Christ. Against all odds he's, I mean, up to the end of his life he remained one, truthful to his convictions. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...keśa-dharanam. Every young man is keeping big, big hair. Lavanyaṁ keśa... That is the symptom of this age. It is written in the Bhāgavata, lavanyaṁ keśa-dharanaṁ. Vipratvaṁ sūtram eva hi. Vipratvaṁ sūtram eva hi: "A man becomes brāhmaṇa simply by that thread."

Morning Walk -- November 29, 1975, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: No, what Marx has explained that a man is born in a rich family, from the birth he is millionaire, and another man is trying whole life, but he could not secure more than his provision? That's all. Why this is here?

Harikeśa: That's due to the capitalistic system. Because he is born in a certain kind of a system, then this hereditary birth and wealth comes. But that capitalistic system, if it's more in a socialistic or communistic system, then there is no possibility of that happening. So therefore this inequality doesn't exist.

Prabhupāda: They are trying for the last fifty years. Why the capitalism is not yet gone? Fifty years at least. They started their movement in 1917. Huh? So how many years? More than fifty. Sixty years. Sixty years. What they have done, progress?

Harikeśa: Well, actually, Russia was the wrong place for communism to go. According to Marx, Russia was the last place that should be communistic, because it was agricultural. But the first place should have been like England,

Prabhupāda: So why they did not do that? Another rascaldom. Why you are taking chance in Russia, the foolish country?

Harikeśa: So that when if a country like England or America would become communistic, that would be very good.

Prabhupāda: Why would become? It is not the dictation of rascal Marx. Why they would? Why he is expecting like a fool like that? Why they would accept that philosophy?

Harikeśa: Well, they will have to accept it.

Prabhupāda: No, when they... That is another thing. Again, "they will have," future. Again rascal.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Not according to his birth and position of money, birth and wealth.

Prabhupāda: And anyone can be trained up to be qualified. That medical science is open to everyone. It is not that "Such and such caste can come here." No, anyone, if you are qualified, that's all. They are accusing me that I am ruining Hinduism, but they have ruined the Hinduism.

Dr. Patel: You say, sir, "The Bengalis have ruined Hinduism; I am salvaging it." Another Bengali is salvaging the ruined Hinduism. Bengalis ruined the.... Whole Bengal, half of Bengal turned Islamic and this because of these brāhmaṇas.

Prabhupāda: That is everywhere, in Punjab also. Punjab also, the same thing.

Morning Walk -- January 19, 1976, Mayapur:

Bhavānanda: We had one day guard on our front gate last week. He worked for three days. His monthly salary was forty rupees plus his meals. So after he was here for three days the rickshawallas, they said, "Why you are working for them for so little money? They are so wealthy." And he left.

Prabhupāda: Who is supervising this department?

Bhavānanda: Tapomaya.

Prabhupāda: Where is Tapomaya? (Bengali)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is all our, for our sugarcane?

Tapomāyā: Another two.... (break)

Prabhupāda: So we shall pay reasonable price for all the lands.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't think the price will be more than eight hundred rupees.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They will take statistics for ten years and make an average. That is the way. (Bengali) (break) ...scheme requires very huge land. So if we purchase in that way they will go on charging more and more.

Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:

Indian man (1): Just to get material wealth. Material happiness.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that's it. Tad bhavaty alpa-medhasām. Antavat tu phalaṁ teṣām. All this material happiness, you may get it, but it will be finished with your body. Kṛṣṇa says that teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, dadāmi buddhi-yoga (BG 10.10). He says, "I will give intelligence. There is no question of asking. If you become a devotee, sincere devotee, I'll give you everything without your asking." You understand, follow? So you qualify yourself. That is wanted. That qualification is sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam (BG 18.66). He is always prepared to give you light. Just like sunlight is open always, but if you keep yourself in the dark room, how you can take benefit of the sunlight? Your business is to come before the sun; then everything will be all right. (break) ...used to sing like that, sab ke sampatti de bhagavān.(?)Huh? Raghupati rāghava rāja... You know? Sab ke sampatti de bhagavān. De bhagavān? What is this nonsense? He's asking, de bhagavān.

Morning Walk -- March 14, 1976, Mayapur:

Hariśauri: "...all wealth, all strength, everything that you could possibly ever want." And He's offering to everyone, "So just surrender to Me, and I will take complete charge of you." But people are so foolish that they don't do it. They don't take any notice.

Prabhupāda: Why...? Suppose a big man, Rockefeller, says, "You simply surrender to me. I will take charge of you." Immediately one takes up. So why the man does not take Kṛṣṇa's word?

Haṁsadūta: They are envious of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam... (BG 18.66).

Haṁsadūta: Envious of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: No, no, envious...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They're ignorant.

Prabhupāda: Men are such a great fool, they have been described as mūḍhas. That is perfect word. Na māṁ duṣkṛtiṇo mūḍhāḥ prapadyante (BG 7.15). Duskṛtino mūḍhāḥ, the most sinful rascal, he does not surrender. That is a fact.

Morning Walk -- March 15, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Both of you become as gentlemen, American gentlemen. Kibā vipra kibā śūdra nyāsī kene naya. Everyone. Yei kṛṣṇa-tattva-vettā sei guru haya (CC Madhya 8.128). (break) We shall talk on the philosophy, or distribution of equal wealth.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Īśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvam (ISO 1).

Prabhupāda: No, don't quote. Then they will drive you.

Conversation with News Reporters -- March 25, 1976, Delhi:

Hṛdayānanda: Yes, all coming from very nice families, the majority, education. Many, many of them coming from very wealthy families.

Prabhupāda: Now, if you should take good family means wealthy family, then America, there is no poor family. There is no question of poverty. So how do you distinguish that he's coming from good family, he's coming from bad family? Poverty is unknown to them. Nobody is uneducated. Then how you distinguish who is bad and who is good? Everyone is good—unless he voluntarily becomes bad, hippie. Otherwise everyone is coming from very good family, rich family, educated family.

Meeting with Bankers -- April 6, 1976, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: Now, whatever is done, you stop it." Then this Kuvera was very much pleased because his descendants were being killed and the fight is stopped, so he was very pleased. This is our point to understand. The Kuvera was very pleased, and he offered Dhruva Mahārāja that "You have become so kind. You could kill all my descendants, but you have stopped, so I am very much pleased upon you that you saved my family. So I want to give you some benediction. Whatever benediction you want, you can take from me." Now this benediction.... He is Kuvera. He is the treasurer of the demigods, unlimited wealth. And he offered him that "Whatever you like, you can take." But what Dhruva Mahārāja did? Dhruva Mahārāja said that "Kuverajī, I am very much obliged to you that you are offering me benediction and you are the treasurer of the demigods. I can take money from you as much as I like. But my prayer to you—that I don't require any money. Kindly give me your blessings that I'll remain a devotee of Kṛṣṇa."
Morning Walk -- April 14, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: He is such a man. He has all the characteristics of a sannyāsī in the home. He is a multi-millionaire's son. But absolutely untouched by wealth, and very fine man, extremely fine.

Prabhupāda: If our gurukula children comes here they can have very good sporting. And this idea I have given you?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Remain healthy.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Twice a day.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Twice a day can come, take bath and enjoy sporting life and then chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, take good prasādam. That's all. Why they should waste their time in technology to become a coolie?

Girirāja: Actually there was once a case. A newspaper once wrote that Henry Ford was ignorant. So Henry Ford filed a case against the newspaper. So in the hearing, the defense asked so many questions about science and history to Henry Ford. So Henry Ford said to the judge that "In my office I have a panel of buttons, and I can press any button and someone will come running to answer any of these questions. So am I ignorant?" (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Just see.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: But they do not know how to keep clean. So in India there is no question how to keep clean. They do not know. They'll not take bath for days together. And he likes stop bathing(?), so many germs carrying. And he's a first-class person, sāheb, on account of the wealth (?). Last maybe. First-class.(?) Don't take bath, neither wash their mouth or hand. And that is...

Hari-śauri: That habit is spreading. I've seen in India. Even the Indian businessmen that come to see you...

Prabhupāda: They are imitating.

Room Conversation -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Indian man: But they have process. They earn wealth. That's all. And no future for the child, they don't...

Prabhupāda: Because they have no education. The guru's duty is to give them education; the sannyāsī's duty is to give.... They do not give. They say, "Yes, you are all right. Give me some money." That's all. That they go: "I am avatāra, I am this, I am that," that's all. And he is.... He return (indistinct) to darkness. That's all. (break) ...they used to discover, whole method is finished.

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: So that is artificial way of.... Unless one is prepared to.... Just like why they are inducing persons to sacrifice their accumulated wealth for the state? Why? Communistic idea that everyone should be equal. So if somebody has more than others, they want to take it away. Just like in India this policy is now growing. So everyone should give away, but now it is being done by law, by force. But that will not stay.

Morning Walk -- June 6, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that I say also. That you are fortunate. Take Kṛṣṇa consciousness and be the best nation in the world. Simply you take Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The Indians would argue that "Just see. The Americans are not so religious, but they have good material wealth."

Prabhupāda: No. In America, Kṛṣṇa consciousness has developed. What you have done? Why don't you say?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But our forefathers have done, and just see the mess we are in because of it.

Prabhupāda: Forefathers ate ghee, so lick up your hand. My forefathers ate ghee.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All you have is dalda now,

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Why dalda? Your forefathers had ghee. You enjoy it now.

Garden Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Now, if He is ordering to become His devotee, how can I try to become another God, competitor? This is the folly, and for this we are suffering. He asked him, "You become My devotee." And I want to become another God, competitor. And therefore we are suffering. We cannot become another God. That is not possible. But artificially you are trying. Therefore you are suffering. Anything you try artificially, you'll suffer. If you try for a thing artificially, then what is the result? Result will be suffering and disappointment. Therefore śāstra says, tasyaiva hetoḥ prayeteta kovidaḥ. Don't try for such things... You have tried all through in different forms of life. You have failed. So don't try for that. But try to become servant of God. Then your life will be successful. Because in the material world the endeavor is how to become God in different varieties: how to become president, how to become minister, how to become master, how to become very strong man, very wealthy man, very beautiful man, so on, so on, so on, up to—when everything fails—then how to become God.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rāmeśvara: That way, wealthy, upper-class people will get a chance to appreciate. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...said that beef-eating is the cause of cancer.

Devotee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Which is correct?

Hṛdayānanda: Too much addicted. (Prabhupāda laughs)

Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "O best among the Bhāratas, four kind of pious men render devotional service unto Me—the distressed, the desirer of wealth, the inquisitive, and he who is searching for knowledge of the Absolute Truth."

Prabhupāda: These are four classes. One distressed, he also seeks the help of God. And another?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: The desirer of wealth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. In need of money, "God, I am so poor. Kindly give me some money." So he's approached God. That is his piety. Although God should not be asked. Pure devotion means God should not be bothered. Simply we shall render service. "God is great. I am His servant. So my duty is to render service without any profit." The profit is there. To be accepted as God's servant, that is the greatest profit.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Hari-śauri: Nothing. It's just imaginary wealth.

Prabhupāda: That's it. Bank will give you loan, they are eager to give you loan, and you haven't got to pay anything in gold and silver. One check, that's all. And with that check you can purchase lots of commodities and hoard it, and price will be increased. If I have to pay gold for (indistinct), then I have limited source. The price will not increase. This is the only way. Introduce gold only, gold and silver. In the British period in our childhood there was practically no notes. Silver. If I have to take payment from you, one thousand rupees, you will give me so much silver. For counting, counting, I have to see whether it is.... There were some imitation, counterfeit. So each coin you have to see, they were saying like that, that, "For thousand rupees I have to occupy so much space."

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Eight hours. Without any recreation?

Hari-śauri: Well, one break, for lunch. It was just indescribable. There's so much heat and fumes, and always covered in oil and grease, crawling around on your hands and knees to fix some machine.

Jagadīśa: All for the advantage of some wealthy man.

Prabhupāda: And after this hard labor, his only recreation is wine. Did you drink?

Hari-śauri: (laughs) Yes, we used to go straight from the steel works to the pub, public house.

Jagadīśa: I also worked in a factory for a while. Same thing. And people were always getting hurt.

Prabhupāda: You are not meant for that. (laughs)

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because they thought, "This is a third-class nation, a small island, fishermen, and they have wealthy (indistinct)?" That is natural. Whole world. In our childhood, we used to see map, almost whole world red-red means British. (laughter) They said that there was no sunset in the British Empire.

Conversation in Airport and Car -- June 21, 1976, Toronto:

Hari-śauri: Is that special arrangement that they seem to be impoverished? Say like the villagers, they're not very wealthy, or, uh...

Prabhupāda: That is due to misgovernment. There is no king; all rogues and thieves are in the government. Mismanagement. It is the government duty to see that everyone is doing nicely so that they can live peacefully, happily. There must be direction. Just like parentless children. Nobody is to take care; they'll be wretched. So India's position is like that. The parentless children. There is no good government. And they supply this control wheat that is not even touchable. Unfit for human consumption.

Room Conversation and Reading from Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 1 and 12 -- June 25, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: This is because foolish materialistic men do not care to listen to others who are actually in a position to explain the Vedic rites. In the Vedas it is distinctly said that the perfection of life is never to be attained either by voluminous work or by accumulation of wealth or even by increasing the number of population, but it is so attained only by renunciation. The materialistic men do not care to listen to such injunctions. According to them, the so-called renounced order of life is meant for those who are unable to earn their livelihood because of some corporeal defects or for persons who have failed to achieve prosperity in family life. In histories like the Mahābhārata, of course, there are topics on transcendental subjects along with material topics.
Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:
Prabhupāda: This is not a sign of hatred for women as a class, but it is a stricture imposed on a sannyāsī not to have close connections with women. One has to follow the rules and regulations of a particular status of life in order to purify his existence. For a sannyāsī, intimate relations with a woman and possessions of wealth for sense gratification are strictly forbidden. The ideal sannyāsī was Lord Caitanya Himself, and we can learn from His life that He was very strict in regards to women. Although He is considered to be the most liberal incarnation of Godhead, accepting the most fallen conditioned souls, He strictly followed the rules and regulations of the sannyāsa order of life in connection with association with women.
Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Yes, it was mistake.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Everyone is envious of such persons, Śrīla Prabhupāda. They think that "Yes, he could not enjoy his wealth, but if I had that wealth I would enjoy it." But then if they get it, then they also fail.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. Next, what is next?

Hari-śauri: Half past eight.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Should we take your leave now, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, I have no objection to sit down here. If you want to stop, we can stop, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Hari-śauri: We are the only ones that could live there.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (long pause) What is the reason they are given equal facility, still they are so wretched, poor, ruffian?

Hari-śauri: Just low class. There's no intelligence how to utilize their wealth correctly.

Prabhupāda: Same thing in Africa.

Hari-śauri: I think you gave that example. If you give... If there's a dog and you put him on a king's throne, (Prabhupāda laughs) he'll still come and lick your feet.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he'll lick up shoes. Another example is given: (Bengali saying) aṅgārā śveta... (indistinct). If you take a piece of coal, you can wash it hundreds and thousands of times, it never becomes white. And these are material things, but spiritually you can reform. It doesn't matter. If one comes to the spiritual platform then everything possible. Otherwise not.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, they are worshiping... This is... First of all, you must forget that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is not Hinduism. It is Vaiṣṇavism. Vaiṣṇava means Viṣṇu is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and one who loves Viṣṇu or loves God, he is Vaiṣṇava. So Hinduism is not like that. Present conception of Hinduism, they have got so many demigods. Demigods are there in the Vedas, but demigod worshipers, they are all materialistic persons. It is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā that kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ yajanti anya-devatāḥ (BG 7.20). Those who are worshiper of demigods, they are lusty. Kāmuka. And the kāmuka platform is material world, lusty. Everyone is trying to enjoy sense gratification. So demigod worship is for sense gratification. If you worship Durga, then you pray, "Mother Durga, give me name, fame, wealth, good wife, and so on, so on."

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Chapter Sixteen, text number seventeen.

ātma-sambhāvitāḥ stabdhā
dhana-māna-madānvitāḥ
yajante nāma-yajñais te
dambhenāvidhi-pūrvakam

Translation: "Self-complacent and always impudent, deluded by wealth and false prestige, they sometimes perform sacrifices in name only, without following any rules or regulations."

Prabhupāda: Modern yogic society. "Transcendental Meditation." Whatever nonsense they like, they do. In the Bhagavad-gītā it is stated that yogis should sit down in a secluded, sacred place, and they are seeking after America's big, big cities. Hmm? They find out yogic class in America's big, big cities, hotels. This is their program. The prescription is that one should sit down in a solitary sacred place, alone, and these rascals are holding class. All smokers, drunkard, woman-hunters, (laughs) they are yogis. Hmm? What do you think? Is it all right? This is going on. And they are accepted, "Yogi this," "Yogi that." This is going on. In India they cannot find out because people are not so fool as yet that in big, big cities, in a big, big hotel, "yoga practice." India, although so fallen, they will not accept. They will at once detect, "Here is a rascal." But here, their dhana-māna, their qualification... They have got money. So whatever they accept, that is all right, because they have got money. No other qualification required. They have money; they can pay. That's all.

Arrival Room Conversation -- July 2, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Rūpānuga: But this is Washington, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Everything, this neighborhood is one of the most wealthy neighborhoods in the country. It is very big. We did not think we would be able to get in so easy. But now people are appreciating how we have fixed up the property. So they have accepted us into the community, but it is very wealthy. You will see some of the houses.

Prabhupāda: They have seen our books?

Rūpānuga: I don't know. Have you made some...? Well, basically we've been just getting them used to us. We have not approached them so much, because we've only been here a short time. How long have we been here altogether?

Vṛṣākapi: Four months.

Rūpānuga: In four months, they have transformed this.

Prabhupāda: That's good. This wooden wall was there?

Vipina: Yes. We refinished them.

Vṛṣākapi: It was all dirty.

Prabhupāda: It was not used.

Morning Walk -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: What is that building?

Vṛṣākapi: This is the neighborhood. It is a very rich neighborhood, Prabhupāda. Very wealthy. This is the most wealthy neighborhood, practically all of America. The builders are putting up houses all in here just like that house over there.

Prabhupāda: Oh, bungalow type (?). Very good. This is very nice. Is it not? Very nice.

Morning Walk -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So he's already a big man.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, he's an industrialist.

Rāmeśvara: He became famous during the Korean war with the Chinese. He fought against the Chinese, and then he became very wealthy. As a result of that war he became very wealthy. He was selling ammunition.

Prabhupāda: America was in favor of Korea?

Rāmeśvara: They were trying to prevent the Chinese from conquering.

Prabhupāda: During Truman's?

Rāmeśvara: Yes.

Morning Walk -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: And why you have accepted?

Rāmeśvara: We said that, why have so many Americans now given up voluntarily, from wealthy families they have given up so many material things. But then he said "But you haven't given up material things. Just look at this building, just see how opulent, how can you claim you have given up.

Prabhupāda: So what do you mean by...? We shall live in the sky?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Flower in the sky.

Prabhupāda: You shall live in the building and we shall live in the sky, in the air? You mean to say like that?

Morning Walk -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Daily.

Kīrtanānanda: That is inconceivable wealth.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Kīrtanānanda: That is inconceivable wealth. And they were fully decorated.

Rāmeśvara: We can never imagine where all those cows were able to be situated.

Prabhupāda: No... The whole world.

Room Conversation -- July 27, 1976, London:

Bhagavān: Most of the people who..., they are becoming attracted to this communist philosophy. They have no idea how to practically apply it. All they are saying is "It is an opportunity to take from the rich and give me to enjoy." But they are not seeing any scope of community cooperation. This is all impractical. They are saying, "I will get money from my boss. I will take his wealth and distribute." They are simply materialists.

Prabhupāda: "That also distribute for me. More share for me." (laughs) Now there is drought; there is no rain. What the capitalists or communists can do in this connection? If they are able to present any program how to counteract? Then where is your progress? When there is some calamity, you both of you simply (indistinct). That's all. You cannot do anything. Then where is your progress?

Room Conversation -- August 4, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: That means they are rich.

Hari-śauri: Just like in India they used to measure wealth by how many cows, (laughs) in the West they measure wealth by how many cars.

Prabhupāda: And we have both. Cows and cars, both.

Hari-śauri: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So the devotees like this evening class?

Hari-śauri: They like?

Prabhupāda: Evening class.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That's very good, very good idea. When we want God, to understand, we must try to understand what is God. What do you mean by God? The God definition is given in the dictionary, what is that? "Supreme being, supreme controller." So how do you understand that supreme controller? What do you mean by supreme controller? In this way we should try to understand what is the idea carried by the word God. We have got, in our Vedic language, we have got definition of God, that

aiśvaryasya samagrasya
vīryasya yaśasaḥ śriyaḥ
jñāna-vairāgyayaiś caiva
ṣaṇṇāṁ bhaga itīṅganāḥ
(Viṣṇu Purāṇa 6.5.47)

"God" means He must possess all the wealth. Just like in Persia you have got so many wealthy persons, but nobody can claim, even the Shah cannot claim, that he possesses all the wealth. That is not possible. Persia. Do you follow what I say? So this is one of the items, that God is the richest, or He possesses all the wealth. Similarly, He possesses all the strength, He possesses all the beauty, He possesses all knowledge, and He is the renouncer also, the most exalted renouncer.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: I have got this body, but we do not know everything of this body. I do not know how many hairs are there. Is it not? So, so many things. I am eating, and it is transformed into blood, and it is directed towards brain, towards other parts of the body and we are working very strong, but we do not know how things are happening. Although I am claiming I am this body, I am my body. But God knows every particular, any... anvayād itarataḥ. How the stone is made, He knows. How this flower is colored, He knows. That is called wise, wisdom. Vedāhaṁ samatītāni (BG 7.26). He knows. That is God. He is the possessor of all wealth, all knowledge, all beauty, all strength, all influence. In this way you have to understand God.
Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Jayapatākā: Even if people give, a life, patron member, 2,222, if they are not so big, they want to give in installment and even though they'll give at one time with postdated... They want different receipt because if they give one lump sum, then it makes it seem that they are very rich. Although they'll give you at one time, they want small, small receipt so that the income tax won't think, "Oh, they are are giving so much donation? They must be very rich. They must have hidden wealth which we can capture from them by investigation." So in this way they are very much pressurized. Sometimes they prefer to give money without receipt.

Prabhupāda: Soon the whole, our program is going on.

Gargamuni: Oh, yes. No, it's going on more. The book distribution is going on more. More people are joining. There's no hindrance.

Prabhupāda: That I want.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: No, kāca dhun kāca kaphe (?): "If some property is offered, we should take it." That is the... And washed cloth. Kācā dhun kācā kapha (?). If somebody offers you very nicely washed cloth, you should use it. And some property, you must use it. They are... You can utilize this property by inhabiting the persons, if they are inclined to develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They are rotting outside Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They may come to live. We are for everyone. So he... Where does he reside, this gentleman?

Gargamuni: In Calcutta. His businesses are there. He's a wealthy man, very nice man.

Prabhupāda: Where does he live?

Gargamuni: He's lives in Bara Bazaar. His name is Mr. Buwalka.

Prabhupāda: Bara Bazara Marwaris are all businessmen.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: God... Kṛṣṇa means all-attractive. So God must be all-attractive, full controller. Our definition of God is

aiśvaryasya samagrasya
vīryasya yaśasaḥ śriyaḥ
jñāna-vairāgyayoś caiva
sannam iti bhagam itīṅganāḥ
(Viṣṇu Purāṇa 6.5.47)

All wealth, all power, all intelligence, all beauty, all renunciation. In this way.

Jagadīśa: These are new books in French, Kṛṣṇa Book and Upadeśāmṛta. This devotee has just brought them from Bhagavān dāsa.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Thank you. When you have come?

Devotee: Two days ago.

Prabhupāda: Oh. You know French language?

Dr. Kneupper: Yes. Yes, I saw a copy earlier today at the... The man who did the translation, I forget his name. He worked on the translation. It's very beautiful.

Prabhupāda: Oh, you have seen it.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1976, Vrndavana:

Pradyumna: He started out in the military, he was in the Navy. Then afterwards... His father had a peanut farm, and then his father became sick, so then he gave up his Navy thing. He came back to take care of the family. Then he began that peanut business. Now he doesn't have to do it any more because now he has made millions. He is wealthy man, very wealthy. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...capture American government. Then all world will follow. As they are known as Communists, we should be known as Hare Kṛṣṇas. We are already known as such, Hare Kṛṣṇas. Keep that name. People at least chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Jagadīśa: Hare Kṛṣṇa Party.

Prabhupāda: It is already well advertised all over the world. So keep this name, Hare Kṛṣṇas. "Vote for Hare Kṛṣṇas." Anywhere you live, you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. All right, you can go.

Room Conversation -- November 15, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What is the process?

Jagadīśa: Well we had, because we were dealing with a Ford, the grandson of Henry Ford, because he was wealthy, he had a lawyer friend who had a connection in the zoning board so...

Prabhupāda: Influence.

Jagadīśa: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 15, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He does not know. We have got the definition of God,

aiśvaryasya samāgrasya
vīryasya yaśasaḥ śriyaḥ
jñāna-vairāgyayoś caiva
ṣaṇṇaṁ bhāga itiṅgaṇa
(Viṣṇu Purāṇa 6.5.47)

Aiśvaryasya samāgrasya, that one who is in possession of all the wealth, vīryasya all strength, all faith yaśasaḥ, all beauty, all knowledge and all renunciation, that is God. Now so far Kṛṣṇa is concerned, He showed all these things. Aiśvaryasya... For example Kṛṣṇa married sixteen thousand wives and for each wife a different palace. And for each wife ten sons. Woman requires very nice accommodation, sons, husband, that is their ambition that He fulfilled, although he married sixteen thousand one hundred and eight wives. This is aiśvaryasya samāgrasya vīryasya. This so-called rascal Bhagavān, who has shown this? Why shall I accept this cheap god? Show me something that you are God. Seven years old Kṛṣṇa, He lifted the Govardhana hill. (Hindi) There is, but they have no knowledge to compare with the idea of God. So far knowledge is concerned, Bhagavad-gītā, left by Kṛṣṇa, it is adored all over the world. Especially nowadays we are presenting Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, and millions of copies we are selling. Now we are advertising, where is that picture? Million, 1.5 million.

Press Conference -- December 16, 1976, Hyderabad:
Prabhupāda: These are the bhagas, opulences. One who possesses all these opulences, He is God, Bhagavān. Asty arthe vatup.(?) So all opulences. God is not shortage of opulence. All opulences. All the riches. Bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ sarva-loka-maheśvaram (BG 5.29). This is God. He is the proprietor of everything. So unless you accept this formula, how you get conception of God? God is not a proprietor of three bighās of land. Here is God, sarva-loka-maheśvaram. That is God. God is not limited. He is unlimited. I can say I have got lakh of rupees, you can say you have got crore of rupees, but God says, "I am the proprietor of all the riches." That we cannot say. That is God's wealth. And because He is the proprietor, He is the enjoyer, supreme enjoyer, bhoktā. But we are manufacturing different bhoktās; therefore there is controversy.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Where is the question of empty stomach? Kasmād bhajanti kavayo dhana-durmadāndhān. Last line.

Girirāja: "Why, then, do the learned sages go to flatter those who are intoxicated by hard-earned wealth?"

Prabhupāda: They think that "Why should we go to God? The devotees come here to beg from us. We are bigger than God."

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Puffed-up.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they say, "empty stomach." (break) Kim ajito na avati upasannan. Read the meaning.

Girirāja: "kim—whether; ajitaḥ—the Almighty Lord; avati—give protection; na—not; upasannān—the surrendered soul."

Prabhupāda: That's it. Kṛṣṇa says "You surrender." And one who has surrendered, does it mean Kṛṣṇa has no responsibility? So why you are bothering to go to this dhana-durmadāndhān?

Mr. Asnani: Unconditional surrender.

Prabhupāda: Huh? You have done already upasannān. So is Kṛṣṇa unable to maintain you? Why should you go to this blind man? So we go not for our maintenance. We want to engage his hard-earned money to this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. That is our mission. Not for this belly. For belly we refuse to go anywhere. You'll find in Kumbhamela, still there are sādhus, they are not going anywhere. And they are starving? We go-gṛhināṁ dina-cetasām—"This rascal is absorbed in the thought of comfortable life, and he has taken only these wife and children, everything. Give him some other..." This is our mission. Yāre dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa.' Let him go there and sit down and talk with him and give some instruction of Kṛṣṇa. This is our... We are not going for this belly.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: How they are contributing their hard-earned money, how it is, the are collecting money, huge amount.

Rāmeśvara: Yes, they'll interview very wealthy people also. Good idea.

Prabhupāda: They're not all wealthy. Wealthies are giving more, and poor men also give.

Rāmeśvara: But in America, if they see that a wealthy man is also worshiping Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: They can only do it twenty minutes a day.

Prabhupāda: If that is the goal, that you have to give up, so we give up immediately, without any difficulty.

Rāmeśvara: But they're making propaganda against this Transcendental Meditation also. The biggest Christian preacher in America—his name is Billy Graham—he is a good friend of former president Nixon and very wealthy. And he has stated publicly that this Transcendental Meditation... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...sees practically.

Gargamuni: These people, though, who follow these processes, they don't dedicate their lives. They follow it for two years, then they get married and they forget the whole thing. While they're students...

Prabhupāda: It is a hobby.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: You are the only one who is using that formula, "American wealth, Indian culture."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: This Maharishi is using "American wealth, Maharishi culture." He's not doing anything valuable with his money.

Hari-śauri: He's increasing his own name and fame.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: This problem practically ruined Australia's economy. Five years ago Australia was a very wealthy country, and then they elected a new government, socialist government, and they began increasing all sorts of benefits, pensions, welfare benefits. And millions of people... Not millions, but many working people stopped working because it was easier just to get the free money. In this way...

Prabhupāda: So you should be very careful. Because you are giving free prasādam, similarly all lazy fellow may not come and take free prasāda. Therefore engagement must be there. Otherwise this lazy fellow will come, sleep and take prasāda.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: The southern part.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. South of Florida. So his main motive was how to find India, to get the wealth of India.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: So it seems all over the world there was a greater interest in education, in art, and in India at the time when Lord Caitanya appeared.

Hari-śauri: The church was its strongest as well in Europe at that time, religion, very strong.

Prabhupāda: Christ also went, came to India.

Rāmeśvara: That is not believed in the West.

Prabhupāda: That is to keep their prestigious position.

Room Conversation -- January 29, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: But Japanese are very intelligent, Bengalis are intelligent, by taking fish and rice. In Bengal ninety percent people, they take fish. Here also, Orissa, cent percent, even the Jagannātha pūjārīs. In Bihar also, fifty percent. The more you go towards Western part of India, you get more wealthy province, just like Uttar Pradesh, very wealthy province, enlightened. All the big cities are there: Allahabad, Kanpur, Agra, Lucknow. Every hundred miles you get a very nice city in UP, the best province in India. All the holy places-Vṛndāvana, Prayāga, Hardwar, Ayodhyā, many celebrated holy places. Ganges and Yamunā flowing, two sacred rivers. Both of them through in Uttar Pradesh. And all the cities are either on the bank of the Yamunā or Ganges. And that is the best province, state, in India. It has got fifty districts. And fifty districts means fifty towns. Little more or less important. But the Kanpur is the third important city in India. First Calcutta, Bombay, and next, Kanpur.

Conversation on Roof -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: People have become poor, poor materially and spiritually. Actually it's clear that the devotees are becoming wealthy materially and spiritually, and that is one of the reasons that these demons are so angry—because they see our opulence.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They are surprised (laughs) that "These people do not do anything, and they're living so opulent?" They inquired in Los Angeles. You know that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Hm? Brahmānanda you know that?

Brahmānanda: Yes the neighbors.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They were envious that "How do you live so opulently? You do not do anything? You have got so many cars. You eat so nicely. You live in such a nice house. And no anxiety." (laughs)

Room Conversation about BTG the Moon -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Rich family.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Rich. Wealthier than Dhṛṣṭadyumna's parents.

Prabhupāda: He's also good gentleman.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You met...

Prabhupāda: Hm. He came to see me.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Ādi-keśava's mother is very big in the field of education. Public speaker and intelligent. His father owns a number of industries.

Prabhupāda: You can bring case against them. Just like fight in same position, that brainwashing. Not brainwashing. Whatever they have said.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bring a case against them?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Back to back.

Room Conversation -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is...

Hari-śauri:

āḍhyo 'bhijanavān asmi
ko 'nyo 'sti sadṛśo mayā
yakṣye dāsyāmi modiṣya
ity ajñāna-vimohitāḥ

"The demoniac person thinks, 'So much wealth do I have today, and I will gain more according to my schemes. So much is mine now, and it will increase in the future more and more. He is my enemy, and I have killed him, and my other enemy will also be killed. I am the lord of everything. I am the enjoyer. I am perfect, powerful and happy. I am the richest man, surrounded by aristocratic relatives. There is none so powerful and happy as I am. I shall perform sacrifice, I shall give some charity, and thus I shall rejoice.' In this way such persons are deluded by ignorance."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Then he gets a toothache and it's all finished. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Yes. The rascal Sai Baba says, "I am God."

Room Conversation -- March 22, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Big family. Very wealthy. (break) I was just explaining to Bhavānanda why... (break)

Prabhupāda: Suppose I am a very big business magnate. Next life, if I am going to become a dog—according to my karma, the nature's law will act—then what is benefit? One day before, Indira Gandhi was so important. Next day I'll maybe(?) nowhere, finished. Nobody knows where is Indira Gandhi. Just twenty-four hours she was most prominent woman. And after twenty-four hours nobody cares to look at her. This nature's law, how you can check? This is going on. Any moment, anything can be changed by the laws of nature. So India's importance is there. They know the law. Therefore so long the body, full of intelligence, human body, is there, they'll utilize it very... That is life, not to be carried away by the waves of nature. This is India's duty. So we want to make our institution at least a place for understanding this knowledge. It doesn't matter only a few persons may understand. That is sufficient.

Room Conversation -- March 26, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Bombay is the best city in India, undoubtedly. From the very beginning, and the richest city. The government revenue is collected from Bombay sixty-three percent. Bombay is so rich. Sixty-three percent from Bombay and thirty-seven percent from whole of India. That is the position.

Śrīdhara: Calcutta is also very wealthy.

Prabhupāda: No.

Girirāja: They keep the money in black.

Śrīdhara: Oh, in black money.

Prabhupāda: And religiously-minded.

Room Conversation about Harijanas -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So their staple food is rice and fish.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: East Bengal is very wealthy from that point of view. Rice.

Prabhupāda: Pakistan was rich only on account of East Bengal. The pān. Practically it supplies pān to all over India. And betel nut.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's a place that we have not...

Prabhupāda: And milk also produced in very large quantity. East Bengal is rich in vegetables, milk, fish.

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And this is also mercy of Ānandamaya(?). Some young yogis she was keeping?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, there was one who was coming to America who seemed that to have been very intimate with her. He was able to call her on the telephone. She would come to the telephone. He helped us, though, in our court case. Ādi-keśava warned him. Because he was sometimes meeting all these women. Many women were coming to see him in New York. Many fashionable wealthy people. So Ādi-keśava Mahārāja warned him that "If you associate with these women, you will fall down." He liked Ādi-keśava very much and helped him, because he could see that he was strict sannyāsī. (break)

Prabhupāda: At this time, in other parts of India it is very hot.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: April, very hot. Actually, I'm pretty...

Prabhupāda: Except in Calcutta.

Conversation with M.P., Shri Sita Ram Singh -- May 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Rather, they are more distressed. Take for example, in our childhood my father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees. So we were not very rich men. But we had no want. Father was maintaining his family, getting children married, distributing the wealth. Everything very nice. And we never felt any want. In this mango season, because father saw it that "There must be a full basket of mangoes daily for the children," so we were jumping, playing and eating mangoes. And now, taking consideration of gold standard... At that time my mother was purchasing gold, twenty rupees...

Sita Ram Singh: Per tolā.

Prabhupāda: Twenty-two rupees. Now the same gold is six hundred rupees. So three hundred times more?

Sita Ram Singh: Yes.

Prabhupāda: If my father's income was three hundred rupees, increased by three hundred, it becomes nine thousand. So where is the nine thousand rupees income for a middle-class man?

Sita Ram Singh: Quite.

Prabhupāda: Nine thousand rupees', ten thousand rupees' income is for very, very big man. But comparing, say, sixty-seventy years ago, we were a middle-class man, so a middle-class man has not increased his income from three hundred rupees to ten thousand rupees. That means everybody has become poor. So where is the advancement? Simply beating the drum, will this...? In our childhood we have seen mustard oil, first-class, made in Kanpur. We were purchasing, eight annas per two and a half ser.

Short Dissertations -- May 24-25, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They are very rich man, that Singh jeweler. They can give. He is very nice man, very nice man and very well-to-do. You have seen them?

Jayapatākā: Yes, before I went I saw him, and he gave me three or four names of very wealthy people in Bangladesh to see, and those people are also... One person already became a member, and they'll give us much support.

Prabhupāda: No, you'll get.

Morning Conversation -- June 23, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, they were very good politician. (pause) I can say, in the British period there was no scarcity, and leniency. I recall the way. Didn't require... And when they like... With three hundred rupees they were so happy. Now you calculate that three hundred rupees means ten thousand. So where is that ten thousand rupees?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, only the wealthier...

Prabhupāda: For children one anna tiffin is sufficient. One anna. (looking at monkeys) You see?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, a whole family of them. This is their feeding place, the garbage can here. They don't come when they see people, though. Around all the holy places I always see a lot of monkeys and cows in India. Is there some reason, special, about... I mean, cows, there's obvious reason, but what about the monkeys? Why are they around the holy places?

Prabhupāda: Because they are fed by the visitors.

Conversation: 'How to Secure Brahmacaris' -- June 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (indistinct-bad tape) (break) So now our next business is to bring students, brahmacārī. So easy process is to approach wealthy(?) gentleman. In their family there are many children, one, two, three, like that. So approach them and plead them that "Children from your family are expected to be very respectable boys, character and devotee, educated. From your family, people expect like that. According to Cāṇakya Paṇḍita's instruction, he says, ko 'rthaḥ putreṇa jātena yo na vidvān na bhaktimān. 'What is the use of begetting children like cats and dogs?' The children must be vidvān, that is, learned, and bhaktimān, devotee. This is the ideal. And what is the use of begetting cats and dogs? Ko 'rthaḥ putreṇa jātena yo na vidvān na bhaktimān. Either he should be bhaktimān or vidvān. This vidvān and bhaktimān, that is ideal. So we are going to teach your son to become vidvān and bhaktimān. So don't you like to bring your son?" You have to tell them like that. And present it rightly. The Prime Minister and her son or his son, he is debauch number one. Do you think the society can be happy? The father and mother is Prime Minister, and the son is a debauch number one. What is this? That is going on. So we are... "For the good of the society you can send your son to become vidvān, bhaktimān. Then, after some time, you can engage your son in any way. That is the... If they are found it, vidvān and bhaktimān, then everything will be all right. And if gone rascals, then what good for the society? Just think. Am I right or wrong?" You have to convince like that.

Gurukula Inspection -- June 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Intelligent class. We cannot make them interested. Some of them may come out, but not all. It is not possible.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, sometimes wealthy people are afraid that if their sons come to this gurukula, they'll become sādhus.

Prabhupāda: So that I am seeing, how to... That was the problem. They said, "What will be the benefit, satyavādī?" Satya śamo damo titikṣa, jñāna... (Hindi) So culture is lost. That is the difficulty.

Indian man (4): The other day two parents have come, and they have said, "We will give our two boys and let them be first class, for the school here."

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) That is... (Hindi) This is the defect of modern civilization. And Kṛṣṇa wants to impress in the beginning, na jāyate na mriyate vā. (Hindi) Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). (Hindi) This darkness is going on. People are kept in darkness in the name of so-called university education. This is... (Hindi) It will be successful. It may take time. That's all.

Talk About Varnasrama, S.B. 2.1.1-5 -- June 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Well, different family, different room, but they can live very humbly. Those who have little income, they'll somehow or other take one room, live in. And in that house, everything is there. You can purchase. And you earn money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes you see a very wealthy may living in only two, three rooms with his whole family.

Prabhupāda: That's all. And generally one room. Otherwise two rooms—one stock room, one sleeping room. They live very economically and save money.

Conversation with Bhakti-caitanya Swami-New GBC -- June 30, 1977, Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: There is a special name of that place. Everyone, every poor man or rich man, must use quantity of spice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was surprised. In Bombay this one life member, very wealthy man... I thought, "Oh, this man must have many businesses." And I found that he only had one business. He simply exports cardamom. And he's a very wealthy man, and he simply exports little cardamom seeds, but such quantities, and it fetches a very good price abroad.

Prabhupāda: Yes, there are many merchants. They deal in quantity and stock huge. Nobody can compete with him.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, they buy everybody out.

Prabhupāda: He can give so cheap one lakh. Somebody gives you a black, what is called...? Berries, berries.

Room Conversation -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And they are hearing the philosophy also. In the evening class they come.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Oh, yes. Bhavānanda always has young people coming to Māyāpur. Intelligent, well-educated, wealthy people's children come. He yells at them like anything. He tells them that "Why are you imitating the West when you have the greatest culture?" Bhavānanda Mahārāja yells at them, chastises them. They like it. Naturally they like it because he's praising their culture.

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is a fact. And the books are selling very nice, hm, Bengali?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yeah. Now there's about seven or eight parties traveling around India, simply doing book distribution.

Prabhupāda: That is our aim.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: We have seen many persons... The other day, he was our member. One Mr. Agarwal? Very rich man. He committed suicide falling down from the bridge to the Ganges. What is that? Very rich man. The happiness cannot be attained in that way. Happiness is in Kṛṣṇa. It is so sublime that... Dhruva Mahārāja went for kingdom, and he performed austerities. When he saw Kṛṣṇa he said, "I don't want anything." Svāmin kṛtārtho 'smi varaṁ na yāce: (CC Madhya 22.42) "I came to ask You something, but I am now fully satisfied." That is happiness. Sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir... yayātmā supra... (SB 1.2.6). You want to satisfy your ātmā. So that can be satisfied when you are fully devoted to Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise simply by material wealth, increasing your economic position, that is not... They do not know it. The European civilization, they are struggling very hard-colonization, industrialization, this... (end)

Room Conversation Gaurasundara, Dr. Kapoor -- July 26, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Now you're going to also get that planetarium in Washington.

Prabhupāda: Hm? Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's very important.

Dr. Kapoor: What is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One of our devotees, Ambarīṣa dāsa, his name is. He's very wealthy person.

Prabhupāda: He is grandson of Ford, great-grandson.

Room Conversation -- October 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Girirāja made one life member aboard the train, a very nice gentleman living on Marine Drive, quite wealthy. He says he never takes the train, only flies. But he went to the airport at four o'clock, and the airport said, "We have no flights. All flights cancelled." They didn't even give the courtesy to call up the people to tell them the flight was cancelled, although they had the telephone numbers of the ticket purchasers. So the man had to take the train.

Prabhupāda: The strike instrument invented by modern civilization, so dangerous.

Hari-śauri: Means the government becomes completely controlled by the lowest working class.

Prabhupāda: Naturally. Without hands and legs, how one can function? Therefore Vedic civilization, that everyone is engaged.

Room Conversation -- October 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: It is great opportunity.

Jayatīrtha: It's the wealthiest family in the world, much more wealthy than Rockefeller.

Prabhupāda: He goes alone or with somebody else?

Rāmeśvara: For now he's going alone. They are very interested in haṭha-yoga also, and he knows something of it, so he teaches them. The prince and the princess have already become vegetarian.

Prabhupāda: And they are not making any chānā preparation?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Are they cooking anything with chānā in it? No chānā preparations? Chick peas.

Page Title:Wealth (Conversations)
Compiler:Rishab, Mayapur
Created:23 of May, 2011
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=113, Let=0
No. of Quotes:113