Prabhupāda: What do you mean by retire? Retire means . . .
Dr. Patel: Retire from the worldly affairs.
Prabhupāda: From the worldly affairs. That is retire. We are not śūnyavādi. The retirement means . . .
Dr. Patel: Our religions are dharma, artha, kāma and mokṣa. It is in a continuity. It is a sort of a string . . . (indistinct) . . . first you have artha . . .
Prabhupāda: The real thing is, they do not retire on account of their strong sense of gratification. That is the reason, not that poverty-stricken. Even though poverty-stricken, still they want to enjoy. This is the basic thing. There is nothing to be enjoyed; still, he wants to enjoy. That mentality.
Dr. Patel: Why with all that glorious past and glorious culture they have to . . . (break)
Prabhupāda: . . . the principle, varṇāśrama-dharma.
- varṇāśramācāravatāṁ
- puruṣena paraḥ puman
- viṣṇur aradhyate puṁsaṁ
- nānyat tat-toṣa-kāraṇam
- (CC Madhya 8.58)
(aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. Nanyat tat-toṣa-kāraṇam. Tat-toṣa means to satisfy Viṣṇu, Kṛṣṇa. They don't want to do that. They want to satisfy their senses.
Dr. Patel: Our culture was so built as to do work for Kṛṣṇa throughout the life, from brahmācārya, gṛhastha āśrama, vānaprastha, sannyāsa.
Prabhupāda: But where is the question. Unless . . .
Dr. Patel: But how they have forgotten this is the greatest, I mean, mystery to me. Because the sādhus voluntarily, I mean, embrace poverty?
Prabhupāda: No, no.
Dr. Patel: All those, sir . . .
Prabhupāda: This service to Kṛṣṇa has disappeared on account of this Māyāvāda philosophy.