Proposal (Conversations 1968 - 1973)

Expressions researched:
"proposal" |"proposals"

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- February 1, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is offering respect. The whole, our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, is to ask people to surrender to God. They have rebelled against God. Somebody says, "There is no God." Somebody says that "I am God." These nonsense things are to be eradicated from human society. So they should be trained to submit. So the submission is symbolized by bowing down: "Yes, you are great; I am humble." This should be taught. Otherwise, whimsically somebody is thinking that "I am God." They do not know what is God. It is most foolish proposal if somebody claims that he is God. He is dog. We very much hate this proposal, when a man claims that he is God. It is most blasphemous.

Interviewer: Have you... Did you... Well, you've only been over here about four years. But have there been dropouts, out of the movement, of the hundred that were initiated?

Prabhupāda: They are doing nicely. They are making progress. They are understanding the philosophy. They are working for it. Now I am the only man who came from India, and still, I am one. I have no... There are many Indians, but I have no Indian follower here. Of course, in India we have got. That's a different thing. But these, all these American boys, they are cooperating with me. That means they are taking this movement very seriously. We have got two great papers, magazines, already, Back to Godhead. One is published from New York, and the other is published from Montreal. (break) In French language. Montreal it is published in French language, and they are well received. Recently I have received one letter from my disciple, Janardana. He is Janus Dambergs, M.A., he is the editor of that paper. He is a very good scholar in French language. His wife is also good scholar, Muna. She is also very good scholar in French language. So they are publishing, and the magazine is well received by the French-speaking people there. And we have contemplation to publish the same magazine in German language also from Germany.

Questions and Answers -- September 6, 1968, New York:

Prabhupāda: No. The yoga practice is like that. It is very good, that "Why we should bother ourself with such things?" That is the opinion of the devotees. The devotees, they do not want any such miracles to perform or to make some jugglery to the people. They are satisfied with the service of the Lord. So that is the position of the devotee. But generally, the yogis, they want such things. There are many instances of great yogis in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, just like Durvāsā Muni. He wanted to show his power to Ambarīṣa Mahārāja. That's a very nice story. I shall narrate next meeting. The yogis, everyone, yogis... Yoga practice is, therefore... It is more or less material activity. Because when they are powerful to show some miracles and people become captivated, "Oh, he is performing such miracle thing." In Benares in India there was a yogi. His business was anyone who will go there, he immediately produced two or four rasagullās and offer him. And many hundreds and thousands of educated men became his disciple simply for the matter, rasagullā, which is only four annas worth. So people want to see this jugglery. And those who want following some or some material achievement, they want to show... Actually it is a fact. Suppose if I could manufacture rasagullās by some mantra, Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, oh, thousands of people will come immediately. You see? People want to see me, and those persons who want to have a cheap following, they want to show such jugglery. But a devotee sees... (break) ...is not of that mentality. They will simply, humble servant. They are satisfied by serving the Lord. That is devotee's position. So your statement, that "Why one should bother with these things?" That's a very nice proposal. Why? There is no necessity. Suppose if I can manufacture some rasagullā, what is the worth of this rasagullā? Oh, we can, if we spend ten cents, we can make it. So why shall I waste my energy for manufacturing rasagullā in the yoga system? Actually, therefore, Kṛṣṇa says that the perfection of, real perfection of yoga, the first-class yogi is he who is always thinking of Kṛṣṇa. That is first-class. He is recommended.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Devotee (1): They shouldn't force her to get married, though. That was kind of a bad choice that they gave her, "Either get married or don't come on saṅkīrtana." You can't force somebody.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, that wasn't the situation. It was not that choice.

Devotee (1): What? You can't... I mean to say that you can't force somebody to get married. You know. That isn't proper.

Prabhupāda: There was no force. There was no force. Only proposal. That's all. When it was proposed before me, I also said, "It depends on the choice." So anyway, go on with your work, saṅkīrtana movement you have started. It is very nice. And it is being responded. So increase it. If simply brahmacārīs can do it, that is best.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We would all like it that way. We would prefer it that way.

Prabhupāda: Or married couple. If some girls want to go, then she may marry somebody. That will be nice. Of course, in your country there is no such restriction if unmarried girls go with you. But if she is married, that is better. So you make your choice in that way. So she is going? This girl?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīmatī?

Prabhupāda: Śrīmatī?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. She wishes to go. I asked her, I told her, "So you have to get married." And she just said, "Oh, I have been married. I just want to marry Kṛṣṇa now."

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: This is renounced. I have no family connection.

Journalist: Oh, oh. (pause as journalist reads letter)

Prabhupāda: I used to cooperate with everyone, but they are declining. What can I do? I am prepared to talk with any God conscious man. Let us chalk out a program so that people may be benefited, but they want to go in their own stereotyped way. The Pope himself is harassed by the contraceptive proposal. People want sanction from him to use unrestricted contraceptive method.

Journalist: But you've received no reply at all.

Prabhupāda: If we see that following a particular type of religious principle one is developing his love of Godhead, that is first-class religion. But if one is developing his love for demon or mammon then where is the religion?

Journalist: True.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) You see. That is our test. If you have developed... We don't say that you follow Christianism or Muhammadanism or Jewism or Hinduism—we don't say. Whether you are developing your love of Godhead. But they deny, "Oh, I am God. Who is God? I am God." You see? Everyone is taught nowadays that everyone is God. Just see how fun. Everyone is God. Do you think like that?

Journalist: You know from Meher Baba?

Prabhupāda: He is also another rascal. He is preaching this that everyone is God.

Journalist: He says he's God.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 12, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. Somebody is inclined to some thing, somebody is inclined to some thing. That is going on, and it will go on till the end of the creation. (laughing)

Allen Ginsberg: Yuga.

Prabhupāda: But our process is that, you are searching after the center, here is the center. That is our proposal.

Allen Ginsberg: But what do you do when different religious groups claim to be the center? What do you do when different religious groups...

Prabhupāda: No, we welcome every religion. We don't decry any religion. Our point is the love of Godhead. Or Kṛṣṇa is love, all-attractive. So we want to be attracted by Kṛṣṇa. Just like a magnetic force and iron. Unless iron is rusty, it is automatically attracted by the magnetic force. Similarly, we are contaminated by material coverings. So we are trying to make it rustless so that immediately we shall be attracted. This is the program. Kṛṣṇa is all-attractive. That is a fact. And we are attracted. But being covered with this rust, we are, instead of being attracted by Kṛṣṇa, we are being attracted by māyā. This is our whole program. So our central program is how to love Kṛṣṇa, or how to love God. So we want to see... That is the Bhāgavata definition, that how much you have enhanced your love of God. You call Kṛṣṇa or something else, that doesn't matter. Phalena paricīyate. The result. Your religious principle, what is the result? Are you enhancing your love for God or dog? That we want to see. If you are enhancing your love for God, it is all right. We don't say anything. But if... People should learn how to love. That is the perfection of life. That we are teaching.

Allen Ginsberg: If you're identifying love, however, with the sabda Kṛṣṇa, what of those people who identify love with the sabda Allah?

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: So you want to stop chanting and reading?

Satyabhāmā: No. No. (laughs)

Kīrtanānanda: We don't want to stop chanting. I don't want to. That's not the proposal. The proposal was...

Satyabhāmā: Which comes first? If... The work seems to have to be done, but the...

Prabhupāda: You can forego your sleeping and eating.

Satyabhāmā: Haribol.

Prabhupāda: The Gosvāmīs were doing like that. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau **. They were discharging their duties, and if sometimes they still could not finish the chanting, they would forego their eating and sleeping. Eating and sleeping, say, seven to nine hours. Then we have to sacrifice our sleeping and eating.

Paramānanda: But the Gosvāmīs, they didn't swing axes all day, did they?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (chuckles)

Paramānanda: They didn't do hard physical work.

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: No, you will hold meeting and decide in that meeting. If you form a committee, then whatever you do, something serious, you should consult the committee and do it.

Hayagrīva: Well, you make the final decision. You can have anybody you want in charge here. I just make a request, personal request, that I not stay here. That's all. So I mean you can put anybody you want in charge. What I have given of the place is yours. I don't even care to have it.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) This is not a good proposal. Then where you want to stay?

Hayagrīva: I'd like to go to India. Well, maybe I could travel with you. That would be nice.

Prabhupāda: No. That is not good idea. You have started this New Vrindaban. You must finish it. So you must be in charge of this place. We have to do so many things. So...

Hayagrīva: What about... Why can't two people be in charge? Why can't we both...?

Prabhupāda: No. Then he will work as vice president? Or what do you want? Temple command?

Hayagrīva: I don't know. The title doesn't make any difference. The title doesn't matter. It's just that we agree on basic issues which I think that we should agree on, not that an issue comes up, and I have one idea about, and he says, "No. I want it this way," and I can't do anything about it. For instance, say I don't want to cut down the tree there, and he says the tree must be cut down. That doesn't leave me anywhere. See? That leaves me to say, well... He can pull rank on me, which is something... I mean I'd just as soon not be involved.

Prabhupāda: So you disagree in every point?

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: As soon as the literature is prepared. Huh?

Kīrtanānanda: In the meantime we'll work on something.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You finish it and give me. I will get it printed, and then he goes. In the meantime you... So he remains as consultant. Your proposal, that you remain president, he is secretary, and treasurer, and he is consultant so long he is here and when he comes.

Hayagrīva: So he can be... He'll be general supervisor?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Naturally when he comes, he becomes overhead everyone, when he comes, because he is a sannyāsī. Just like here, when I am present, you take all final decision from me, so that should be the honor of the sannyāsī. But he should actually... He is not in charge of this place. Just like in other centers the president, secretary, are in charge.

Hayagrīva: So that's not called maṭha commander. That's called general supervisor.

Prabhupāda: He will be, for the time being, the superintendent of the society. He will go everywhere and see and report me what, how things are going on. And then we are going to make a central committee gradually. Everything will be done. Let us work very seriously and sincerely. Everything will come out.

Hayagrīva: So then Śyāma dāsī is our treasurer..., secretary.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And he is treasurer, Hṛṣīkeśa?

Hayagrīva: He's treasurer and temple commander.

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: (laughs) We can have so many connection with Kṛṣṇa, as friend, as servant, as parents, as lover, whatever you like. Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). You cultivate that consciousness, how you like Kṛṣṇa. He is prepared to accept you in that capacity. And that makes a solution of all problems. Here nothing is permanent, nothing is blissful, and nothing is full of knowledge. Here... This year we held examination on bhakti-śāstrī, and here is the answer of a girl, Himavati. She has written very nice. I have read it. So we are training these boys and girls to Kṛṣṇa consciousness according to the Kṛṣṇa science. Anyone can take advantage of it. It is a very nice thing. So you also try to understand, and if it is nice, you take it up. You are after something very nice. Is my proposal unreasonable? (chuckles) You are all intelligent boys. Try to understand it.

Gurudāsa: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: And you have got a very good talent, music. Na vidyā sangīta uttamam. The Vedic mantras were all through music. Sāma Veda. Sāma Veda is full of music.

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Who is your enemy?

Guest (1): Even physical, bodily, whatever it is, whatever it is, but you must know who your enemies are. Your enemy may be my friend. (part indistinct)

Prabhupāda: That's nice proposal. Unless you find an enemy, how you can fight? So of course, we do not say... We Vaiṣṇavas do not say that there is no need of fighting. We never say. When there is need of fighting we must fight. Rather, somebody in New York, some Goldsmith, he was that, "Why Kṛṣṇa is advising Arjuna to fight, to become violent?" So somebody protests like that. But there is no meaning of protesting against the action of the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That is our view. So we Vaiṣṇavas, we are chanting. It does not mean that when there is need of fighting with avaiṣṇava we shall lack in strength. We can fight. One gentleman inquired from me that "Vaiṣṇavism makes one dull. He cannot act." And, "No. You have not seen a Vaiṣṇava." In the two fightings, great fighting, the Rāmāyaṇa and Mahābhārata, the hero was Hanuman and Arjuna, and they fought.

Guest (1): They fought.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And who can be better Vaiṣṇava than them?

Guest (1): Nobody.

Prabhupāda: So Vaiṣṇava does not mean he is dull. No.

Guest (1): No, that is well proved. If there is need...

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: But those who are rigid, they are prepared to die even.

Yamunā: Vaiṣṇavas, wouldn't they just chant?

Prabhupāda: Their proposal is "Death is sure today or tomorrow, so why shall I change my principles? Death will take place even if I live for ten years more, and what is the benefit? Why shall I change my principles? It is not that by taking that medicine or liver extract I shall be amara, immortal." That is not possible. If somebody gives some medicine that one can make himself immortal, that is another thing. Nobody is going to be immortal. Why he should be afraid of death? Death will take place. "As sure as death." So today, or tomorrow, or hundred years after. So if one moment is utilized for Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that makes life successful. Why shall I live for hundred years, waste my time? One moment is sufficient for living.

Himāvatī: Śrīla Prabhupāda? I just have one question about the ending, that Ajāmila, he was calling the name of his youngest son.

Prabhupāda: Nārāyaṇa.

Himāvatī: He was thinking but he was calling out to him, and after calling, he was reminded of his early life, of his worshiping the real Nārāyaṇa.

Prabhupāda: Nārāyaṇa.

Himāvatī: And therefore Nārāyaṇa saved him. Isn't that true?

Room Conversation -- December 21, 1970, Surat:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. To the members, not to the public. It is very difficult for import-export, and sales tax, this, that, so many botherations government has created. Therefore our proposal is that... Thank you. We don't sell. No. Simply who becomes a member, we give him. You give us something, and whatever we have got, we give you. Business finished. Not finished, but business established. (laughs) Then if you read our books, if you inquire, then we get opportunity to explain. And our distribution of books means that is indirectly propagating our mission. Yes. So therefore we have adopted this way, that only to the members. That's all. We have printed that "These books are not for sale in India." Yes. Because the government machine is so implicated-sale tax, this tax, that tax...

Guest (3): I want to put in India also.(?) They are for sale there.(?)

Prabhupāda: Because there we have no difficulty.

Haṁsadūta: There's difficulty with the authorities.

Guest (3): Not in India. You can sell to Indians.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. We are selling.

Haṁsadūta: America, Japan.

Guest (3): You can sell, but not in India.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 17, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is already there but when you see, you see, you see that it is birth. The sunrise is already somewhere, and the sunset is also already somewhere but in your angle of vision there is no sun. That is going on. Similarly, Kṛṣṇa's birth, every moment; Kṛṣṇa's disappearance, every moment; Kṛṣṇa's existence, every moment. You have to learn that. Therefore Kṛṣṇa said, janma karma me divyam (BG 4.9), transcendental. Yo janati tattvataḥ. Anyone who knows it perfectly, in truth, he becomes liberated. If you have known Kṛṣṇa, then you are liberated. But Kṛṣṇa knowing is not so easy. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye yatatām api siddhānāṁ kaścid vetti māṁ tattvataḥ (BG 7.3). It is very difficult to understand Kṛṣṇa in truth. Then how one can understand? That is also stated: bhaktyā mām abhijānāti yāvān yaś cāsmi tattvataḥ (BG 18.55). Not by speculation of knowledge. Bhaktya. And what is that bhakti? Anyābhilaṣita-śunyaṁ jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam, ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānuśīlānaṁ bhaktir uttama (CC Madhya 19.167)(Brs. 1.1.11). So these things you have to learn. Then there is possibility of knowledge, tad-vijñāna. The difficulty is at the present moment the theory that everyone can invent his way of understanding God. He can speculate. Therefore there is chaos. There is chaos. If you want to save yourself from this chaotic condition of life you must take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is our proposal. Give me that knife. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Not so many. Begin. Aiye. (break) ...friend of Kṛṣṇa. How much exalted he is, a great warrior, and he has the right to talk with Kṛṣṇa on equal level. Still, he accepted Kṛṣṇa as spiritual master. And he said, "The confusion which I have created, it is not possible for me to clear it. It is You only who can clear, I know. Therefore I accept You as spiritual master." Therefore it is required that one should know who can clear your confusion, and there you must surrender. (aside:) Anyone? Everyone. Come on. Not in the left hand. Don't give anything by left hand; don't take anything. That is a etiquette. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Yes. Yes.

Discussion with Indians -- January 18, 1971, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: They are all nonsense! Therefore I say they are all nonsense, who deviates from the original text of the Bhagavad-gītā.

Guest (2): Swamiji, by declaring other interpretation as nonsense...

Prabhupāda: Yes! You cannot interpret! First of all if you cannot interpret. First of all my proposal, that you cannot interpret.

Guest (2): We'll come to that, that you are not interpreting correctly, does not make me correct. I must be correct also to...

Prabhupāda: I am correct so long I present the correct thing, so long I am... If I present Kṛṣṇa as it is, then I am correct.

Guest (2): My solution, Swamiji, most respectfully, is how do you judge that "I am correct"?

Prabhupāda: Because I am presenting what Kṛṣṇa says. First of all you answer this: what is correct, the standard of correctness? You cannot create correctness. When Kṛṣṇa says this, man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ: "You just surrender unto Me; become My bhakta," how you can say, "It is not to Kṛṣṇa." This is not nonsense? If I say, "Give me a glass of..." Hear me. If I say, "Give me a glass of water," if you say, "It is not to Swamiji," is that interpretation?

Guest (1): I do not, and again I say...

Prabhupāda: No, no, first of all you answer me. If I say, "Give me a glass of water," and you say, "It is not to Swamiji."

Guest (1): (indistinct) ...what the Christ says, Mohammed says, everyone says, that...

Room Conversation -- London, August 10, 1971:

Prabhupāda: Then I will need the help of this Mr. (indistinct). I can try to raise that one fourth million, and one fourth million if the bank advances, then we can negotiate immediately.

Śyāmasundara: It would be nice if the Indians could help.

Prabhupāda: Do some practical proposal.

Śyāmasundara: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: So far George is concerned, now it is more or less Utopian.

Śyāmasundara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Because...

Śyāmasundara: You can't count on him at all.

Prabhupāda: ...if he was willing, he would have done long ago, but he is not very serious.

Śyāmasundara: Well, I've never asked him for it, to do that.

Prabhupāda: So what is this asking? When he visited our Los Angeles temple, he appreciated and he said, "Why not a temple like this in London?"

Śyāmasundara: Well he's..., I..., He's been waiting for me to come here and talk to him here about it. I haven't...

Prabhupāda: But it is difficult to meet him.

Room Conversation -- London, August 10, 1971:

Śyāmasundara: It's right over here, isn't it?

Mr. Arnold: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: So, so long I am here, let us try some tangible, not simply proposal.

Śyāmasundara: Yeah. Now we've seen how nice places we can get, so we have to work on these other angles: the Indian community and George.

Mr. Arnold: The bank

Śyāmasundara: And the bank. There's... What about Mr. Gopal? Did you see him? He's very wealthy.

Dhanañjaya: Yes, but he helps by donating material things. Not material things, but he likes to give things rather than...

Śyāmasundara: No, he's never been tactfully approached for anything else. He used to like us. He'd come around all the time. He lost his son, so he adopted us, like that. He used to give us presents, money.

Dhanañjaya: The most he's given is carpets.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Dhanañjaya: Carpets. He was giving carpets. The purple carpet in the temple.

Śyāmasundara: The carpet in the temple cost how many hundreds of pounds?

Dhanañjaya: Three hundred pounds. And the material for the Rathayātrā cart. All the material.

Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: There is no question of increased population. This is, I say always, this is foolishness.

Guest: That's foolish?

Prabhupāda: Yes. When you say "increase of population," it is a proposal of foolish persons.

Guest: Oh, so someone, someone who's foolish...

Prabhupāda: No. Even the... Just like the birds and beast, they are also increasing their population. Yes. If you find one hole in the room, millions of ants will come out. So who is giving their food? There are millions of elephants in the forest. Who is giving their food? There are millions and trillions... There are 8,400,000 species of life. Out of that, eight million species are other than human being, and 400,000 species human being. Out of that, civilized persons are very few. And all the problems are in the civilized, so-called civilized population.

Guest: And that's because, you would say that we have the wrong...

Prabhupāda: No, I, I... We are believer in God. You see. So we know God is the original father. He is supplying maintenance for everyone. So there is no question of increasing population. If there is increase of population, God has enough resources to feed them. It is not the question of increasing population. But what is the question of demonic civilization.

Journalist (1): Well, I was going to ask you about that, civilization.

Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: Now just try to understand Christian religion is good, provided the followers of the Christian actually follow. But they are not following. They are not following. They are simply artificially stamping, "I am Christian." In the Christian religion the first order is thou shall not kill." But the Christians are very expert in killing. So who is Christian? First of all let me see. Their First Commandment is, Lord Jesus Christ, that "Thou shall not kill." Now, every one is killing and still he is Christian. So this kind of Christian religion, or Hindu religion, what will be the benefit? If you don't follow, simply you stamp yourself that "I am Christian," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim..." That is going on. Nobody is Christian. Nobody is Hindu. Nobody is Muslim. Everyone is demon. Everyone is demon. That is our proposal. There is no Christian, there is no Hindu, there is no Muslim. That is our proposal.

Journalist (1): Except people who have accepted the Kṛṣṇa consciousness presumably. That...

Prabhupāda: Well, Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not so easy. First of all, you were talking about the Christian religion. I say that Christian religion or Hindu religion or Muslim religion, there may be different religions, but what is the aim of religion? That you should understand. The aim of religion is to know God. If you profess some religion, but if I ask you what is God, if you cannot explain, then what is the use of your becoming religious?

Journalist (1): Probably none. But people like to have, or seem to like to have a religion.

Prabhupāda: They don't like. They don't like God. They don't like God. As soon as somebody speaks of God, "They say they are crazy." So actually there is no Christian, no Hindu, no Muslim. All demons. That's all.

Journalist (1): How do you stop that?

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1971, London:

Haṁsadūta: I mean in that respect... see, everything must go through Maṇḍalībhadra's hands. Before it can be printed, everything has to go through his hands because he is the chief translator. But at the present moment it's going so slowly that... We haven't even been able to produce the magazine.

Prabhupāda: So find out somebody else.

Haṁsadūta: Well, that's my proposal. Or make a different arrangement. But one arrangement I proposed was to pay him some money.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Haṁsadūta: I proposed that we pay him some money so that he can do it full time instead of...

Prabhupāda: So yes, you can do.

Haṁsadūta: Is that okay?

Prabhupāda: Yes. He's a gṛhastha. If he needs some money...

Haṁsadūta: Cause right now he's working full time, eight hours and day and still he's...

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Haṁsadūta: So if that's okay.

Prabhupāda: If he requires some money, give him. What can be done? That is not unusual. A gṛhastha, he requires some money.

Haṁsadūta: Yes, I understand. I just wanted to know if it was acceptable.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Why not acceptable? No. Yes. Yes. That's all right. Let him take. We are paying Hayagrīva also. What can be done?

Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: What benefit you will derive by going to (indistinct)?

Reporter: But, well, he'll go to the... Supposing somebody is out to kill me. That's changing, if you can't tell him...

Prabhupāda: But suppose (indistinct) does not kill you. Will you be safe?

Reporter: No, sir. That I can see, but...

Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of going to (indistinct)? You will die today or tomorrow. That's all. If you want to save yourself, then go to Kṛṣṇa. That is our proposal. (laughter) As soon as you go the (indistinct), he does not fight, do you mean to say you will live forever?

Reporter: No, no, sir. I've got...

Prabhupāda: Then what is the use of telling (indistinct)? Trust Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa so that you may perpetually be saved. Why don't you take that?

Reporter: I was only thinking in terms of collective security, not... I can see your point now.

Prabhupāda: You should know that you are always in danger.

Reporter: Yes, sir. We agree.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Reporter: The great Einstein said the same thing when he was actually... He said there was no question...

Prabhupāda: That is our position.

Reporter: I could many times fall from here...

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1971, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Not... So many things. So, if you do not follow the principles of Christianity, simply by stamping yourself as Christian, will that do? So why Jesus Christ will be responsible for you? Simply by stamping yourself that "I am Christian." Is that very reasonable proposal?

Nara-Nārāyaṇa: Lord Jesus himself never claimed that he would be responsible. As a matter of fact, he would heal certain persons who by their karma were blind, or lame deaf, or some disease, even dead, he would bring them back to life, so many things. And then when he healed them, he invariably said after, he said, "Now go thou and sin no more lest the worst thing befall you." And he has been saved by Jesus personally, yet Jesus is saying, "lest the worst thing befall you." How can the worst thing befall you if everything he does then is all right? So that means Jesus does not take that responsibility.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why he should be responsible? If you are not a Christian, why he should be responsible? Now, here he says that "Now you have sinned, full reaction I have washed, don't do it again."

Nara-Nārāyaṇa: Yeah.

Prabhupāda: But they are going to church, confessing every week, and doing the same thing. Who is a Christian, first of all find out, then Jesus Christ will take responsibility.

Devotee: They are gambling and eating flesh right in the churches, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 1, 1972, Sydney:

Prabhupāda: They have not gone. We have got our tests. I am speaking from the very beginning, "They have not gone." And practically you see, even if you have gone, what utility you have made? They are simply planning, again planning. "We shall get petrol from there. We shall have defense from there." Simply bluffing, simply bluffing. The Americans will go to the moon planet to defend his country from the Russians. Just see. And we have to believe all these nonsense proposals. What defense they will do from there? Is it not the proposal? Yes.

Śyāmasundara: This morning you were saying that civilization means peace. So this is not civilization.

Prabhupāda: This is no civilization.

Bhūrijana: We must become convinced. (break)

Prabhupāda: Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura said, jaḍa-vidyā jato māyāra vaibhava tomāra bhajane bādhā, anitya soṁsāre moha janamiyā jībake karaye gādhā. Jaḍa-vidyā, this material advancement, jaḍa vidyā, they are simply stumbling blocks for advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The more one is enamored by this so-called material advancement, the more he is disqualified to advance in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Because time we have got limited. If we waste our time for so-called material advantages, then we spoil our time. We cannot utilize the time for Kṛṣṇa consciousness, which is the necessity of human life. Therefore, in the history of India there is opulence, but that opulence is of different kind. By nature they used to enjoy life—enough jewels, enough gold, enough silk, enough food, enough metals. You see? By natural product. They could find where there is a big hill of gold only. These are there. And actually gold is found in some mine within the material arrangement. Why there should not be any hill of gold? As there are hills of stone, and marble, why not gold? You do not know. Your utensils are only plastic. It is worth nothing. So that was their material advancement. Gold, silver, jewels, corals, sapphire, diamond. Just see Kṛṣṇa's palace described. Not these rascal chairs, cushions, but with ivory, gold. And the cushion is as soft as the foam of milk. (laughter) These things are description there. And the rooms are bedecked with jewels. You don't require this electric light at night. And outside these parijāta flowers. You have read all this?

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Well, it is still man's duty to become the husband and woman's duty to become the wife; so these propensities are there. But all this can be adjusted. I have many students and am getting them married, and they are living peacefully and advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Not that everyone is brahmacārī. We have many gṛhasthas and children. In this way the propensities of the women and those of the man are adjusted. A man wants a woman, and a woman wants a man, so we say, "All right, take it. Live peacefully, but don't change partners." We don't allow divorce; once they're married there is no separation. Nor do we allow boys and girls to live together as friends. If a man wants a woman and a woman wants a man, they should become united by marriage, live peacefully and advance in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is our proposal. In this way all facilities are there in this movement. Our program is to make people become godly, and everyone should help us. Every sane man should help this movement for the good of society.

John Nordheimer: What about the United States government?

Prabhupāda: Yes, it should come forward. My students here are all United States citizens. I have not imported them from India. They are Americans, and they are in difficulty. So why shouldn't the government come forward? Their character is being formed, and they are becoming God conscious by participating in this movement. The government is spending millions of dollars to stop LSD and other drug intoxication, but my students are giving up everything simply by following my word. So why isn't the government coming forward to help me?

John Nordheimer: They don't care about the people, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: But don't they want good for their own men? I am stopping American boys and girls from taking LSD and other drugs, and the government is spending millions of dollars to do this. It is only practical that they come forward to support this movement.

Conversation with Bajaj and Bhusan -- September 11, 1972, Arlington, Texas, At Their Home:

Prabhupāda: That I have explained. Just like Arjuna, who was a fighter, warrior, means he fought for Kṛṣṇa. For himself, he was hesitating. He put all these questions that "If I kill my brothers, then their wives will be widow, and they will be prostitutes and there will be varṇa-saṅkara, and then there will be no piṇḍa-dāna and then the whole nation will go to hell," in this way, as he could think. But he was not thinking in terms of Kṛṣṇa. He was thinking in terms of his own benefit, "whether I shall go to hell or heaven." That was his contemplation. Therefore he was taught Bhagavad-gītā. And after understanding Bhagavad-gītā he agreed to Kṛṣṇa's proposal. Kariṣye vacanaṁ tava naṣṭo mohaḥ smṛtir labdhā: (BG 18.73) "Now my illusion is gone. I have got my real consciousness, so I shall fight." So the fighting was Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And when he was trying to become nonviolent, very benevolent to the family, he was chastised by Kṛṣṇa. Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādām: (BG 2.11) "You are talking like a very learned man but you are fool." So this is our position. We may talk very learned, scholarly, but if we have no Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then we are subjected to the chastisement. Aśocyān anvaśocas tvaṁ prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase (BG 2.11). So this is the position. So nothing is bad if it is engaged for the service of Kṛṣṇa. Otherwise, however good it may be in the estimation of material conception, it is the cause of bondage, good or bad. It doesn't matter. So you have to learn the art, how to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. That art you have to learn. Then your life is perfect.

Morning Walks -- October 1-3, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No. If you have the determination, Kṛṣṇa will help. If she is determined that "Even if I die, I shall not smoke," then Kṛṣṇa will help her. And if she thinks, "So I'll not do it. If Kṛṣṇa likes, He will help me." (indistinct) Just like (indistinct). He has prepared some nice foodstuff. So he says, "If Kṛṣṇa comes, I will give Him; otherwise I shall eat." (laughter) "And if Kṛṣṇa is very hungry, He will come." So this alternative proposal is not accepted. "If Kṛṣṇa comes, I will offer Him this. Otherwise I shall eat."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is personal motivation.

Prabhupāda: This is not surrender.

Jayatīrtha: Kṛṣṇa is not attracted by the foodstuff; He's attracted by the devotion.

Prabhupāda: Devotion, yes. For Kṛṣṇa we can offer (indistinct). (break)

Jayatīrtha: You will go from London to Bombay?

Prabhupāda: If need be. (indistinct) (break)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It is dark.

Prabhupāda: It's getting darker and darker. (indistinct) So we will have to change our plan. (break) (indistinct) ...and they are also making dog show.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Whatever you like. That independence is there always. But he has... Just like we are speaking. This is the aim of life. Now if you like then take, you'll not take—that depends on your independence. So that independence is all... Before that independence is there, therefore we are sometimes degrading from this human life to cats' and dogs' life. So it is the duty of the human society to save the human being to degrade, from becoming again cats and dogs, or to elevate him higher and higher. Does it mean that we are, we shall be satisfied with our present stage of life without knowing what we are going to accept? Is that very nice proposal? Or we shall try to elevate the human society, that is higher.

Scholar: Our aim is the same, to elevate the human being, but...

Prabhupāda: But then you have to accept the means.

Devotee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: If you do not accept the means, simply expecting that our aim is the same, will not act. You have to accept the means. That means, it is explained in the next verse, sixty-four, sarva dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). What is that? Sixty-four?

Scholar: Sixty-four, sarva-guhyatamaṁ bhūyaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sarva-guhyatamaṁ bhūyaḥ śṛṇu me paramaṁ vacaḥ, iṣṭo 'si me dṛḍham iti tato vakṣyāmi te hitam. Then sixty-five, man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65), mām evaiṣyasi satyaṁ te pratijāne priyo 'si me. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Morning Walk -- April 19, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: It is, it is something like, giving post-dated check. I pay you one lakh of rupees, post-dated. Although I have no money,... What is the value of that check? Will anybody accept that check? "Oh, I have received the money." That is foolishness. Why future? You are talking of future, and you are talking of perfectness at present. What is this nonsense? You are claiming that your science is perfect, and, at the same time, when practical example wanted, you say; "I shall do it." The same example. I am saying I am millions, owner of millions of dollars. And you ask me: "Give me some payment." "Yes, I give you post-dated check." Will you accept? At present, if you give me five dollar, I see something tangible. And you're talking of big, big word, but you'll pay me in the future. So is it very sanguine proposal? And I am to accept it? So what kind of intelligent man I am also? You cannot produce even a grass by biological chemistry. You cannot do anything. Still you are claiming: "It is produced of chemistry, biology." What is this nonsense? Nobody questions?

Karandhara: Even it's produced by chemistry, there's laws...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Karandhara: There's laws to those chemical reactions. They never consider who makes the laws?

Prabhupāda: Then? What is this? As soon as there is law, it must be considered that somebody made the law.

Karandhara: It's just a thief's mentality.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Karandhara: If a thief comes on something valuable, he does not think who owns this. He simply thinks how he'll steal it.

Prabhupāda: That is thief's business.

Morning Walk -- April 28, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Handling every day. Still they'll not. Dog's obstinacy. That's all. They're seeing practically, that the material energy cannot work independently unless the spiritual energy joins. So how they can expect the whole cosmic manifestation, which is matter only, has come out automatically? We are practically seeing, a very nice car, Cadillac. But if there is no driver, what is the use of that car? A computer machine. Unless the man knows how to work it, pushes the button, it does not work. So practically we are seeing that without superior energy, the material energy does not act. Still they'll not believe it. Therefore in this wonderful cosmic manifestation, there must be handling of a superior energy. And that they do not know. They are amazed with this material arrangement. Just like a foolish person is amazed by seeing the mechanical, big machine. So many parts. But another person knows that, however wonderful machine it may be, unless the operator comes and pushes the button, it will not work. This is intelligence. Therefore who is important? The operator or the machine? So we are concerned with the operator, Kṛṣṇa, not with the machine. If you say: "How do you know that He's the operator?" He says: mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). "Under My superintendence, the whole cosmic manifestation is working." The difference is you don't believe. I believe. That's all. I take it immediately: "Yes, Kṛṣṇa is operating." Therefore I have no problem. Somebody's operating, that you have to accept. But you do not know who is that person. At least, we have got knowledge, here is the person. That's all. Now if you say: "No, Kṛṣṇa is not the person," then you have to accept another person. So present him, that "Here is the person, not Kṛṣṇa. Another..." That you cannot. So in the absence of your knowledge, you have to accept my proposal. (break) Can you create a stem like this in your laboratory?

Conversation with Mr. Wadell -- July 10, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Well, every religion is authority. That's a fact.

Mr. Wadell: It is, yes. That's true. But every individual is free and must find for themselves.

Prabhupāda: No, we, we... Our proposition is, our proposition is that sa vai puṁsāṁ paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje (SB 1.2.6). "That is first-class religion which teaches the followers how to love God." This is our proposal.

Mr. Wadell: Well, we shall see. We have a lot to... (laughs) It is quite possible that I too have been sent.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Give him some prasāda. Just wait little. Take prasādam. Our only fighting is against atheism, godlessness. This is our main fight.

Mr. Wadell: I agree.

Prabhupāda: Yes. People say, "There is no God, God is dead. This is all humbug." And so many there are, atheistic proposals. We are giving fight against this atheism.

Mr. Wadell: Will you excuse me. I must go.

Pradyumna: He's just bringing little...

Mukunda: We are just bringing you a little prasādam.

Mr. Wadell: Oh, no, no, I must. I have my boys. They wait for me and I must be with them. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: There is some prasādam.

Śyāmasundara: He is teacher just down the road in the school.

Room Conversation with Educationists -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: That you have to learn. Not in a moment you can understand. Then you have to come to the schooling process. Otherwise how you can learn? In a moment? Such a big subject matter?

Guest (1): Yes.

Prabhupāda: We are going to solve all the problems of life. Such a nice proposal. Don't you think it requires little patience to understand how to do it?

Guest (1): It requires a little bravery.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Guest (1): It requires bravery too.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because we have got background, Kṛṣṇa, so bravery, personally we haven't got to practice. Just like a child is in the protection of an able father. He's happy. "Whatever happens, father will see." He's happy. He's confident. "My father is there; my mother is there. Who can do any harm to me?" He's confident.

Guest (1): There is so much that's wrong.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes. Now it has come to another platform. So anyway, the knights, they are respectable gentlemen of the society, leading men of the society. So our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is meant for enlightening people to the right standard of understanding the goal of life. Because after this life, after this body is annihilated, we do not know what kind of body we are getting next. We must prepare. Just like you are elevated to the position of lordship. So you had to prepare yourself. Not that this lordship is offered to anyone and everyone. One who is qualified, he is offered this position. Similarly, we should know how we are becoming qualified for the next life. But that education is lacking. There is no such education. In the university or anywhere, nobody thinks, "What we are going to become next life?" But we should be prepared. If, after becoming Prime Minister in this life, or President, like Mr. Nixon, and again, by his activities, he's going to be another animal, oh, that is not very successful proposal. But there is such chance. Because after death, after giving up this body, we are completely under the grip of material nature.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Find out this verse. Prakṛti, nature, will offer the body, and there are so many varieties of body. So one should know at least, what kind of body I'm going to get next. That is intelligence. And if he remains in the darkness, and if he becomes other than human being, that is not very good proposal. They should know. What is that? Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni...?

Pradyumna:

prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni

guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ

ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā

kartāham iti manyate

(BG 3.27)

"The bewildered spirit soul, under the influence of the three modes of material nature, thinks himself to be the doer of activities, which are in actuality carried out by nature."

Prabhupāda: Yes. So the whole problem is how to get out of the control of material nature. That is also mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā.

daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī

mama māyā duratyayā

mām eva ye prapadyante

māyām etāṁ taranti te

(BG 7.14)

Seventh Chapter. (pause)

Pradyumna:

daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī

mama māyā duratyayā

mām eva ye prapadyante

māyām etāṁ taranti te

(BG 7.14)

"This divine energy of Mine, consisting of the three modes of material nature, is difficult to overcome, but those who have surrendered unto Me can easily cross beyond it."

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So that is natu... That is good. Big, big man. Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He was lear... "I am fool number one." And the author of Caitanya-caritāmṛta, he says that "I am lower than the, a worm in the stool." So this is good attitude. Nobody... Sir Isaac Newton also used to say that "What knowledge I have got. I have simply collected..." They're... Every, every big man thinks like that. That is good attitude. But there is comparative study, that "Here is a big man, here is a common man." So our proposition is that it is a great science, great philosophy. So western countries, they are intelligent, especially the Britain, British people. They had very good opportunity. Still they have got opportunity. So my request is that let us study this philosophy and science and if possible introduce it in the human society. That is our proposal.

Śyāmasundara: I think Lord Brockway was saying that his ideal is that, at present moment, that men of the world try to make an understanding, intellectual understanding of the problems and try to make an intellectual solution...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: ...philosophical, conscious...

Prabhupāda: So here is the opportunity. Here is the opportunity.

Śyāmasundara: ...consciousness, become conscious, conscious of...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: ...the problem.

Room Conversation with Lord Brockway -- July 23, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So here is the opportunity. Here is the opportunity.

Śyāmasundara: ...consciousness, become conscious, conscious of...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: ...the problem.

Prabhupāda: We can, we can discuss on higher intellectual platform this philosophy. It is a science. Therefore we invite the best intelligent person to take part in it. Then other people will follow. That is our proposal.

Śyāmasundara: Interchange of ideas.

Lord Brockway: Well, I don't want to keep you.

Prabhupāda: No, it is very nice...

Lord Brockway: It has been very, very kind of you.

Prabhupāda: ...to associate with you.

Lord Brockway: And, uh...

Śyāmasundara: She's bringing some dinner for you. Just, just coming.

Lord Brockway: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: One minute.

Prabhupāda: Give him this garland. I forgot to give the garland.

Room Conversation with Reporter from Researchers Magazine -- July 24, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Reporter: Like poverty, and this lack of balance between rich and poor. How these problems can be solved?

Prabhupāda: That, that... Gandhi wanted to solve it, but you rejected. Gandhi wanted it to... Village organization. He started that Wardha Ashram. But you have rejected. What Gandhi can do? That was good proposal—to remain satisfied in one's own place. That was Gandhi's proposal. That "Don't go to the city, town, for so-called better advantage of life. Remain in your own home, produce your food, and be satisfied there." That was Gandhi's policy. The economic problem he wanted to solve by keeping cows, by agriculture, by spinning thread. "You want food, shelter and cloth? Produce here, and remain here. Don't be allured by the capitalists and go to cities and engage in industries." But Jawaharlal Nehru wanted, overnight, to Americanize the whole India. That is the folly.

Reporter: Hm. Hm. I agree.

Prabhupāda: The Congress side, the followers of Gandhi should have followed Gandhi's principles—from political point of view. Village organization. But they won't do that.

Devotee: (to guests:) Some kṣīra?

Reporter: Oh!

Prabhupāda: That's all? Don't get more?

Reporter: (indistinct)

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Some, (laughs) yes.

Mother: But they were, they were very fine men.

Jesuit Priest: Well, anyhow, thank you very much, father, for letting us talk and for letting us listen to you.

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much for your coming here.

Jesuit Priest: Very nice to come here, and congratulations for...

Prabhupāda: No, our only proposal is that you try to love God. That's all. God is one. God is neither Hindu, nor Muslim, nor Christian. God is God. So let us love God. That's all. That is perfection of life.

Mother: Well, you can rest assured, we do that.

Prabhupāda: Yes, do that.

Mother: Yes, we do that.

Prabhupāda: That is our...

Jesuit Priest: I wouldn't have given up my life to Him fifty-two years ago to be a Jesuit priest unless I loved God, would I?

Prabhupāda: No. Unless you love God, how you have become priest?

Jesuit Priest: And I'm not only one, but there happen to be thirty-three thousand of us in the world.

Prabhupāda: Because you have become a priest, that means you love God.

Jesuit Priest: Yes. Fifty-two years ago I made up my mind.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is understood.

Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: You, you take the milk from the mother...

Cardinal Danielou: Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: And when she's old, she cannot give you milk, therefore she should be killed?

Cardinal Danielou: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Is that very good proposal?

Yogeśvara: (translates)

Cardinal Danielou: Oui, oui, oui.

Yogeśvara: He says yes, it is.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yogeśvara: He says: "Yes, it is a good proposition."

Cardinal Danielou: If, if the men are hungry, it is the life of men is more important than the life of cow.

Prabhupāda: Therefore, because we are propagating this Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we ask people to, not to eat meat, any kind.

Cardinal Danielou: Yes, yes, yes.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No, no. That is artificial. That is artificial. We are not concerned with artificial things. Just like you require to eat. Now artificially you can increase so many things for eating purposes. But you must eat. That is the economic question. It is not that you should starve. It is not our proposal that you become Kṛṣṇa conscious by starving. No. You must have sufficient necessities of life.

Reporter: All right. So... The purpose for economic plan of all the planet, for the world would be everybody can eat, and I suppose just, just eating and some clothes and some roof to be, if you are in a cold country...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Eating, sleeping... Sleeping requires roof, apartment. So it includes your housing, your eating, your sex urge, and your defence. Everything should be nicely... So arrangement should be made that people are not harassed for these necessities of life.

Reporter: And all the rest is superfluous. Is too much.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Reporter: All the rest is superficial, is superficial.

Prabhupāda: What is superficial?

Devotee: Extra. Not needed.

Yogeśvara: Anything beyond these four basics is...

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: No, suppose the United Nations is the organization of the whole human society, so if I ask the United Nations, as an organization that: "What is the purpose of this cosmic manifestation?" That is a fact. There is a cosmic manifestation. The scientists, they are also trying to understand. So there are so many scientists, philosophers, what is their answer? Suppose I am inquisitive to know something. So where shall I inquire?

Dr. Inger: Now if you were to inquire from... Because the only organization which deals with culture, therefore philosophy, therefore religion, therefore art, therefore music, is UNESCO Paris. Not New York. And if you did put such a question, you would get some kind of reply from one of the directors who says: "We, we... Such a proposal has not been made. But if such a proposal is made, let us say, presented, by any member state, out of the hundred and twenty-six or twenty-seven member states, and it is submitted to the general conference where it meets in session, two years in October, and is passed through, we will be able..." Now usually what happens is one country presents it and if the, and what it means in terms of expense, how much, how many people are going to be invited, and what is going to be the plan. And if that is done, they would say: "Yes, I think such a study has to be made." And it's possible to make it.

Prabhupāda: A sectarian question.

Dr. Inger: No, no, no. It won't be.

Prabhupāda: It is... Why it should be presented to Pārtha-sārathi. Even American representative or English representative or French representative, any representative can do...

Dr. Inger: Because being a governmental organization, the only kind of reply one would get from such a question would be a very polite and courteous one, but it wouldn't have... No action would be taken. Action can only be taken, if it is governmentally presented. That is the only problem. There are many ideas which come forward, boundless ones, but the people need to present them officially. And... (break)

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Whatever it is, we are discussing this point, that this illusion is going on. But human form of life, a human being can get out of this illusion. We have got sufficient sources of knowledge, especially in the Vedic knowledge. So why do we not take advantage of this knowledge and make our life successful? Yes. That is my proposal. And we are struggling with this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement with this purpose only, that these people are missing the point and wasting their time and life unnecessarily under some illusion. To try to save them, that is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. (break) ...talked with so many Christian priests. Naturally while discussing I asked them that "In your Bible it is said, 'Thou shall not kill.' Why you are maintaining slaughterhouse?" They cannot answer properly. In this way and this way they try to avoid and support this slaughterhouse.

Dr. Inger: It's difficult to answer it.

Prabhupāda: This is going on.

Dr. Inger: When I asked a group of priests at a meeting which was to celebrate the anniversary of a leading Catholic thinker, I.R. Shadder(?), I just asked him about the Sermon on the Mount, referring to similarities between the teachings of Sermon on the Mount and Hindu thought. He says, "You see, but the point is this, that the Sermon on the Mount is not meant for everybody. It is only meant for a very few. And therefore most of us, including the present company," he said, "cannot use it in everyday life." I said, "Do you mean it is only meant for monks?" He hesitated but said, "If you like, yes." But I said, "I imagined that this was meant for everyone and that anyone could follow it." And he said, "Well, it is too dangerous a teaching to give to everyone."

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1973, Paris:

Yogeśvara: There are so many young people who, when we try to preach to them Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we explain that it means to accept the position of service, service position, they reject it because they have no experience of service that is satisfying.

Prabhupāda: Hm? They have rejected so many things. Why not your proposal? Just like the hippies. They have rejected so many things. Why shall he accept your proposal? Why you think that your proposal is so nice, he'll accept immediately?

Yogeśvara: That doesn't mean we don't preach to them.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yogeśvara: That doesn't mean we don't preach...

Prabhupāda: You preach. You just purify them. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Let him hear. Then he'll accept. Then he will gradually come. Yes. He's now in diseased condition. The best thing is to chant. By hearing the Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, he'll be gradually purified, cleansed, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). You must polish him. Just like this is unclean. Polish it and you'll see the reflection. Our process is paraṁ vijayate śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam. (break) ...śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ hṛdy antaḥ stho hy abhadrāṇi... (SB 1.2.17).

Yogeśvara: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Guest (1): So in order to understand what is God one has to leave his family and come to some...

Prabhupāda: Why do you surmise like that? You do not know what is God. Why do you surmise your proposal?

Guest (1): No, I mean, ah...

Prabhupāda: Now why you are asking this question? You know, I've explained, that one has to become brāhmaṇa. There are still there are many brāhmaṇas, those who are with children. Even Caitanya Mahāprabhu, although He had no children, He was family man. Nityānanda Prabhu was family man, and Advaita Prabhu was family man. They're all brāhmaṇas, family men, but they knew what is God. The real thing is to know God. Not to, because everything is allowed. These eight, four varṇas and four āśramas. There is no such thing that one has to become, to come to this form of life or that form of life. So varṇāśramācaravatā. You must execute the varṇāśrama-dharma. Then you'll understand. It doesn't matter whether you are a brāhmaṇa or kṣatriya or vaiśya or śūdra, that is a cooperation. Just like in your body there must be the head, there must be the arms, there must be the belly, and there must be the legs. By comparative study head is more important than the leg. But leg is also required. You cannot do without leg. Similarly, brāhmaṇa is the head, kṣatriya is the arms, vaiśya is the belly and śūdra is the leg. So as much I require my head so much I require the leg also. But the leg must do the leg's duty and the head must do the head's duty. Then it is perfect. And if the head is cracked, then everything is gone, madman. So at the present moment there is no brāhmaṇa, qualified. Therefore the society is in chaos. In chaotic condition, all are searching after something substantial. That is the position of the Western countries. They have heard so many things about India's culture. Still, they respect India's culture, spiritual culture. They are hankering after. But unfortunately the so-called yogis, swamis, come and cheat them. That is the difficulty. This is the first time that systematically we are presenting what is actual Vedic dharma or Bhāgavata-dharma. This question was raised by Rāmānanda Rāya before Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Varṇāśrama, he quoted this verse from Viṣṇu Purāṇa. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, eho bāhya, āge kaha āra. "Yes, it is all right, varṇāśrama-dharma, but it is now external. If you know something better, you speak."

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: I would like to open temples in every village, every city, what to speak of Greece. But we haven't got sufficient men.

Karandhara: This boy is from Greece.

Citraka: I will translate the books later.

Prabhupāda: Oh, then you can open. But alone... You can be assisted with some of our men. That's nice proposal. We want to open in every city, every village, village to village. So go this way or around the...?

Karandhara: This isn't too bad. We can go this way. It's not too wet.

Citraka: Sometimes you have said that the Greek mythology comes from the Purāṇas.

Prabhupāda: Yes, certainly. In Greece I think some people know of our movement. Because in the airport as soon as some young men saw us, they chanted "Hare Kṛṣṇa!" Yes. Maybe they are Europeans, but I had practical experience. (break) which..., that Park Avenue?

Bali Mardana: Wednesday they are having a meeting. Perhaps on Wednesday.

Prabhupāda: Wednesday. So you have to attend? No.

Bali Mardana: No, I don't have to attend. The lawyers attend. If I attend, it may ruin everything. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...one is yogi. Karmī, jñānī, yogi or bhakta. What is the difference between karmīs, jñānīs, yogis and bhakta?

Hṛdayānanda: Karmī wants to enjoy the gross senses, the jñānī wants to enjoy the subtle mind, mental speculation, the yogi wants to manipulate the universe, mystic powers,...

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, but who gives the seed? That is answered in Bhagavad-gītā. Bījo 'haṁ sarva-bhūtānām (Bg 7.10). Bījo 'haṁ sarva-bhūtānām. He gives the seeds, and He is life.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But the scientists are now trying to make the seed.

Prabhupāda: Then kick on their face with boot. With boot, rascal. You are trying. That is rascaldom. We protest against this. "We are trying." What is this nonsense, trying? Do it immediately. Then we shall accept. Trying, everyone is trying. Just like a child is trying to build a house with this sand. So is that very nice proposal, that here will be house? That is childish. Then you accept that you are child in the field of knowledge. Don't pose yourself that you know everything, or your knowledge is everything. That is our protest. "We are trying." Trying, everyone is trying. What is the difference between the scientists and ordinary man?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They are saying that they are coming very close.

Prabhupāda: Oh! That is also another foolishness. That is called will o' the wisp. The ass. Ass is trying to get the grass, and the washerman is showing only, and the ass is advancing, the grass is advancing. (laughter) You see. This is their thing.

Dr. Wolfe: But in all humility, Śrīla Prabhupāda, supposing that they would succeed in actually creating the living cell artificially, what would we say?

Prabhupāda: What is the credit there? It is already there. So what credit he can get?

Karandhara: Best they just imitated what has already happened.

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is why the scientists are saying that God didn't give us everything so that we can make very happy.

Prabhupāda: Then God is there. Accept. Then why do you say there is no God? Then God is life. Then everything comes from life. You have to accept. That is our proposal. If they accept that "God has not given us the capacity," then they are intelligent. They are accepting God.

Karandhara: Well, they say, "God hasn't given us everything because we are not able to live forever here."

Prabhupāda: Why? That means God is controller. You are controlled. You admit this.

Yaśomatīnandana: If these people are allowed to live forever then they will make this place more than a hell, worse than hell.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughs) God has given them everything actually, to live peacefully and try to understand God, but that they will not do. They will do something to try to forget God. That is their aim.

Yaśomatīnandana: Prabhupāda, is it true that if a person is very sinful, he reduces some years from his life? If a person is very, very sinful, extremely sinful, then he reduces some...

Prabhupāda: Reduce or increase, what is the profit?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We see the practical example. If you are alcoholic...

Morning Walk -- December 6, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Umāpati: They say, "Man was made in the image of God," and now women are saying, "Women are made in the image of God. Therefore God is female." And that is their logic.

Prabhupāda: No, no, man or woman, you cannot create God. That is the first proposal. God is not your creation. You are creation of God. You cannot say, "God should be like this. God should be like that." That is nonsense. God is not under your dictation. You are under the dictation of God. That is God. If you manufacture, if you dictate, then how He is God? He's your dog. Just like a dog. He dictates. He abides by your order. He's not God. He's dog. What is the scientist says? Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The scientist says that God didn't... One of the astronomers said that "If I were present at the time of creation..."

Prabhupāda: Ah, you were present. Therefore you are a rascal. You were not allowed to (be) present. Therefore God is great. You are a rascal. God did not allow you to be present there. Now you are lamenting. Therefore God is great.

Hṛdayānanda: Jaya. Because God doesn't lament. He laments.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Guru Maharaja, Dr. Mishra, and this and that, they'll go. They'll not go to the real person. The real person is strict. Suppose somebody comes here, if he comes to me. I shall immediately order, "You have to do this." But these rascals, they do not say that. They (say), "You pay me, and you become perfect." That is their proposal. So your money is very cheap. They pay and flock together. That is going on. That is called sumanda-mataya, misled. Manda, by nature they are rascals, and if they take some path, that is sumanda-mataya, again rascaldom. Why? Manda-bhāgyā, unfortunate, disturbed. They cannot find out. Therefore real guru has to canvass. This is the position. Shortage, alpāyus, they are not going to live for many years, and most of them are unfortunate rascals, and if they are eager to accept a guru, they accept a false guru, and they are materially disturbed. This is the position of the people of this age. So against so many disturbances and counter-facts, we have to preach.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Is it, is it also not the mercy of Kṛṣṇa that He has descended to incarnate(?) and...

Prabhupāda: Yes, therefore guru is called the, Kṛṣṇa's mercy-incarnation. Kṛṣṇa's mercy-incarnation is guru. Guru-kṛṣṇa-prasāde pāya bhakti-latā-bīja (CC Madhya 19.151). Kṛṣṇa is so merciful, He's trying to educate from within, and outside He sends His representative to teach. So He's trying to bring all these living entities back to home, back to Godhead. Two ways, from inside, and outside. His propaganda is going on. His propaganda is going on.

Govardhana: You are just like the reservoir of mercy, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Morning Walk -- December 13, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: There was one physician in Dacca. He was... Morning, he was washing his face. So one man was going, and he was coughing. So he asked that man, "Come here. Where you are going?" So he was a cultivator—"I am going to the field." So he said, "Better go home. Don't go to the field." So he was a respectable physician, so he went back. So his students asked that, "How is that, you asked him to go home?" So he chastised his stu..., "You do not know that he is coughing and the sound is like this? He will die after eight hours." It is experience. The students did not know but he could understand, "Coughing under such and such sound, it means death after such and such time." Yes. That, kavirāja can tell. When my father died, the kavirāja said, "Now you can do the rituals because he will die before next morning." He said. And actually it so happened. He said me this about ten, eleven o'clock, and he said exactly, "Before next morning he'll die." So that is experience. If you say, "After twenty days the month of January is coming," the child cannot understand, "How father said that twenty days after, January is coming?" But it is better experience only that one can say, "Today is 10th, and after twenty days, 1st January, will come." Everything is experience but supreme experience is Kṛṣṇa. Therefore if we receive experience from Him, then our experience becomes perfect. This is our proposal.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: If I am the boss of my body...

Prabhupāda: You are boss of your body in the sense that you can utilize your body in any manner you like, so much. But there are other condition which is beyond your... Suppose... so long you are living, you can utilize your body, your senses, to understand the ultimate goal of life. But you cannot utilize your life in such a way that you will never die. That is not possible.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So I am controlled also.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why don't you understand that? You are controlled always. (break) You are walking. This is also controlled. At any moment you can be paralyzed, at any moment.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: But how all of a sudden there can be explosion? What is this nonsense proposition? As soon as there is question of explosion, before the explosion takes place, there must be some arrangement. The time bomb explosion. So the bomb is prepared by something, some bomb is kept by somebody, and after some time it explodes. So how all of a sudden? Where does he get this idea? Just like if there is bomb explosion here, a child may think, "All of a sudden there is a bomb explosion," but a sane man will not think that. There will be inquiry, "Who kept this bomb? Who brought this bomb?" That is sanity. "And all of a sudden explosion," this is all rascal proposal. Therefore the people have become so rascal, guided by these rascals, "All of a sudden, by chance," and they accept them as scientist... This is the drawback of the present civilization. Because they are śūdras, like animals, they have got no brain to answer that "How all of a sudden there can be explosion." They have no brain even to ask. Rather, they are giving Nobel Prize. This rascal is speaking like a rascal, still, he should get Nobel Prize. That is the defect. The people at the present moment, they are all rascals. Just like animals. And yes, actually they are animals. Just like animals are eating, sleeping, mating, and eating meat. The other one animal is eating another animal. That's all. No discretion, nothing. This is a civilization of animals, polished animals. Their consciousness has become animalistic. Therefore this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Just like children. They are animals, just like animals. They have no fixed program. Whatever they like, they are doing. Whatever they like, they are speaking. Simply they are interested in eating. So at the present moment, because they have lost all their power of reasoning and understanding, they are all animals. "All of a sudden there is an explosion." How explosion can take place like that? Any sane human being will ask that "How is that?" Same example: If there is some explosion in the park, a rascal will say, "All of a sudden there is explosion." But the government, police department, immediately inquire, "How this bomb came? Wherefrom? Who placed it?" That is humanity. That is human reasoning. "And all of a sudden there is explosion," you have to accept that. You accept that?

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: They will come forward and say, "Now, what practical can we do to help implement these in the government, in the world? What can we do practical?"

Prabhupāda: Yes. That you take instruction from us. Because you are all rascals, you do not know. We are experienced. Take advice from us. First thing is that you close the slaughterhouse. Close the liquor house. Will they do that?

Prajāpati: It is a question of business. Businessmen have so much control...

Prabhupāda: Business or whatever nonsense it may be, but our first proposal is that you become sinless. But they will not agree. They will remain sinful, and still they will say, "In God we believe, we trust," these slogans. "We go to church, we pray," like that. This is the defect. A man has come for your... You are a physician for treatment. As soon as the physician says that "You don't do this," you say, "I cannot give up this." Then how he will be cured? Let him rot. This is the position.

Śrutakīrti: You said to me in the garden the other day that there are two kind of ignorant people. One is ignorant innocent and the other is rascal ignorant, and that we should preach to the innocent. But all these politicians, they are not innocent, they are rascal.

Prabhupāda: They are rascal. They are rascal. Maybe some of them are innocent also. But mostly they are rascal because without being first-class rascal, one cannot go into politics. Just like if somebody says... Now, election. Somebody says that "You become vice-president." So why shall I become vice-president? Because I know I shall not be able to do anything. So why shall I waste my time? So another rascal, he will be ready. "Oh, offering vice-president?" But I know that if I want to manage the state, I have to make the people sinless. So if I propose that "Stop this slaughterhouse," so who will accept me? So why shall I go there? Nobody will accept me. Senate, senators, they will say, "Oh, this is business. This is impractical. You have no experience." He will immediately reject. So therefore mass of people must be conscious what is God, what is sin. So when they will be prepared, these rascals will be changed.

Morning Walk -- December 30, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Too much, yes. Luxury leads to poverty. Too much luxury. Now it will deteriorate.

Nalinīkaṇṭha: I was reading in one of the books you translated that you said that as more people become Kṛṣṇa conscious, the mentality of all of the people in that area, they lose their desires for material enjoyment.

Prabhupāda: No. Material enjoyment, you enjoy, but not like cats and dogs. You enjoy material life like human being. That is our proposal. Not like cats and dogs. Is it not enjoyment when you sit down in the Deity room and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and read philosophy? It is not enjoyment?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: Yes, it is very nice.

Prabhupāda: So this is human enjoyment. And to go to the brothel and drink and fight and talk all nonsense, is that enjoyment?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: No.

Prabhupāda: That is cats' and dogs' enjoyment. We must enjoy like human being. Enjoyment is not denied. Why should we deny?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: No, but as more people become Kṛṣṇa conscious, there will more of a desire to live simply.

Prabhupāda: That is good for them. That is good for them. Because at the present moment they are missing the aim of life. That is the defect. They do not know what is the goal of life. They are thinking, "We are also cats and dogs." And that is the defect of the modern civilization. Our human life is to achieve the highest perfection. Otherwise this āhāra-nidra-bhaya... Even the small birds they know. Just see how they are protecting themselves. They are also afraid of danger, and they are doing their own way. So if we simply discover atomic weapons for defense, that is not final advancement of civilization. Final civilization is how to save yourself from death. That is civilization. And there is no such program. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). The highest perfection is how to save oneself from these four miserable conditions: birth, death, old age and disease. They do not know. Nobody knows. Here is the process, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. If people become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then he can solve these problems. That is real defense. (pause) So defense automatically, the small birds are taking. See. They are so alert that the water cannot overcome them. Immediately, they flee, by nature. This boy, his leg became full of water, but they are not. (laughter) They are so careful. Just see. By nature they are defending. Just see. Such a big wave is coming for him, "Yes, fly away," immediately.