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Profit (Conversations 1976 - 1977)

Expressions researched:
"profit" |"profitable" |"profitably" |"profited" |"profiteering" |"profiteth" |"profiting" |"profitless" |"profitlessly" |"profits" |"profitted"

Conversations and Morning Walks

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 8, 1976, Nellore:

Harikeśa: How to take the money that's being donated.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is the beginning. They are making a show now, but eventually the plan will be to close all the temples.

Mahāṁsa: Nationalize all temples.

Harikeśa: Not close, 'cause you can make a lot of money. It's easier than enacting taxes.

Mahāṁsa: Just like banks.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, but when they don't become profitable then they'll close it. That's the point. Milk 'em dry. Instead of the state or the government being the servant of the Deity, they are making the Deity the servant of the government.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Money-earning servant.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. The tax collector.

Acyutānanda: Just like they nationalize industries, they want to nationalize the temple, Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- January 19, 1976, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Europe that was the system also.

Prabhupāda: Everywhere that was the system. That is called.... What is called?

Harikesa: Feudalism?

Prabhupāda: Feudalism, yes. What is this nonsense, maintaining so many idle men without any profit? Very, very bad system. And nowadays especially, when there is atomic energy, what is the value of the soldiers?

Harikesa: We need the soldiers to start.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Harikesa: The soldiers, they start the war. One stands on one side, the other stands on the other side, and there's one shot, one shot, ten shots, ten shots, then mortars, then tanks, then atom bombs.

Prabhupāda: No, why this is? If you have improved scientifically, let two, three scientists keep flying and the handy atom bomb. As soon as war starts, "plum," finished.

Morning Walk -- February 12, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: It is less than demonic. Demonic qualities, they have some activity and laziness is ignorance, darkness. Therefore too much sleeping is very, very bad. That is another part of laziness. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau **, one has to conquer over this sleeping and laziness. Eating, nidrā, ahāra, vihāra, sense gratification, vihāra means sense gratification. One has to minimize these things up to the point of nil, that is perfect. When there is no more sleeping, no more eating, no more mating, and no more fearing, that is perfection of spiritual life. And that is not possible, but as much as possible. (break) ...they cannot sleep more that the culture (?) is very great gain, profit.

Hṛdayānanda: Consider a rich man. A rich man can sleep, a poor man must work.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Morning Walk -- February 21, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Twelve rupees. So you can sell, ten rupees, eight rupees.

Acyutānanda: Now the one, when...

Prabhupāda: Still, you keep profit, two, three rupees.

Yaśodānandana: Oh, yes, always. We always make sure of that.

Acyutānanda: When the Teachings of Lord Caitanya, small size, came, something happened, but it cost us from the BBT... How much does the Teachings of Lord Caitanya cost us?

Yaśodānandana: That's very expensive.

Acyutānanda: It's very expensive.

Yaśodānandana: That's about twenty-two rupees that we have to pay, and we cannot resell it for twenty-eight rupees.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no...

Acyutānanda: Twenty-two rupees, we shall pay.

Prabhupāda: We shall print. It will cost not more than ten to twelve rupees.

Morning Walk -- March 13, 1976, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: What he says?

Satsvarūpa: "Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, the Indian classic par excellence on bhakti-yoga, attributed to Vyāsa, is one of the most important and influential religio-philosophical works within the Vedic tradition. Thanks to the devoted and scholarly endeavors of Śrī A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda, the entire work of twelve cantos will be available in a superb English edition for the benefit of the English-reading peoples. In his impeccable style the author presents each verse in original Sanskrit, followed by roman transliteration, English equivalents, translation, and elaborate commentary. The lucid and cogent exegesis brings into relief the theory and practice of Bhāgavata philosophy in relation to contemporary man and his problems of life. I have read the first volume containing First Canto, Part One, Chapter 1-7, with pleasure and profit. A brief account of the life of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu included in this volume illustrates the central theme of the entire text, the loving service of God. A glossary and index to Sanskrit verses and a general index have been added for the convenience of scholars. This monumental work is immensely valuable alike to historians of religion, linguistic scholars, cultural anthropologists, pious devotees, as well as to the general reader interested in spiritual matters. I recommend it highly to every student of Indian philosophy, culture, and religion."

Devotee (1): Then he ordered two standing orders for the library, and they took it. (break)

Prabhupāda: Oh, that Australian...? (break)

Satsvarūpa: "It is a work to be treasured. The opportunity to receive the profound teachings of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam in the West has been made possible by the devoted labor of Śrīla Prabhupāda. The clarity and precision of his commentaries on the text have rarely been equaled. No one of whatever faith or philosophical persuasion who reads this book with an open mind can fail to be both moved and impressed. The spirit of its message shines brightly from the pages."

Rāmeśvara: Jaya!

Ghanaśyāma: And he's a psychologist. Usually psychologists, they're very much sort of against spiritual life. Śrīla Prabhupāda, this one here, this is one of the biggest linguistic schools in the world, and this gentleman was the chairman of the department, so he's known all over the world for his studies in different kinds of languages.

Prabhupāda: Hm. What does he say?

Morning Walk -- April 9, 1976, Vrndavana:

Akṣayānanda: I don't know.

Prabhupāda: No, for village the government is not going to keep such nice road. This government department, forest department.... The government policy is to develop these places for industry in future. This industry is the cause of falldown of the human society—industry. So the reaction is.... The industry, two things required—four things required: land, labor, capital, and organization. So now the industry is going on, and the capitalists and labor, there is fight. The laborers, they are finding out that "We are working. Why the capitalists will take the profit?" This is communism. Is it not?

Akṣayānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So the Communists, they are thinking, "By changing the hand, things will improve." But they do not know that very industry is the cause of falldown. They're simply trying to change the hand. The principle should go on, industry, only the proposal is that the capitalists should give up and the workers should take it.

Morning Walk -- April 9, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: India has no, had no such ideas. They are borrowing ideas. India's idea is self-realization. Live very simple life—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. The brāhmaṇas, they are living simple life, becoming very learned scholar, pure character, advanced in spiritual life—one class, ideal. And kṣatriyas, they are supposed to be the king. They distribute the land on nominal taxation, and the vaiśyas utilize the land for cultivation and cow-keeping, and the śūdras, they are engaged as weaver, blacksmith, goldsmith, mean other necessities of life. In this way the whole society is simplified, and the central point is how to become advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness by cooperation. This is India's civilization. There is no question of industry. Ugra-karma. It has been condemned in the Bhagavad-gītā as ugra-karma, laboring very hard for livelihood. This industry means engage the poor worker class to work very hard, and there is huge profit, and some directors of the capitalists, they take it. And they have one dozen motorcars, palatial building, no work, simply wine and woman, that's all. This is going on. And the others, they are seeing: "There is no classification, neither real brāhmaṇa nor kṣatriya nor vaiśya. So he is enjoying like that. He has got so many cars. He has got such a nice apartment. Why not me?" There is struggle. This is actual picture.

Morning Walk -- April 9, 1976, Vrndavana:
Pṛthu-putra: We also should be free from the extension of this, which is profit, adoration, and distinction.

Prabhupāda: Hm? Pṛthu-putra: We also should be free from profit, adoration and distinction, which are just extensions of these desires. Prabhupāda: A Vaiṣṇava does not require any, what is adoration or distinction. Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: There's a line of preaching in our society that subtle manifestation of sex attraction is adoration, profit, and distinction. Prabhupāda: Yes. That is.... Mahāprabhu says, tṛṇād api sunīcena. Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: There's another path going this way if you'd like to walk some more, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Prabhupāda: (break) ...that garden.

Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Dharma cannot be. Therefore Bhāgavata said, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). Dharmārtha-kāma-mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90)—these are all cheating. These are all cheating. Yes. Dharma means you become... Generally people go to temple to get some material gains: "O God, give us our daily bread." That is the idea. Dharma is to get some material profit. And why material profit? For sense gratification. Dharma, artha, kāma. And when he's baffled in sense gratification, he wants to become one with God, mokṣa. These are all cheating. Therefore Bhāgavata says, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra (SB 1.1.2). And Śrīdhara Swami says, atra mokṣa-vāñchām api nirastam. So long one is stuck up even up to mokṣa-vāñchā, he'll be.... He is in trouble. Therefore Kṛṣṇa, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). Beginning from dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa (SB 4.8.41, Cc. Ādi 1.90), you give up everything. Then you'll become purified. Even if you have got mokṣa-vāñchā, then you are in the material world. Yes.

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: We are increasing our movement. We are opening centers. We are printing more books. This is my books. I have made a Bhaktivedanta Book Trust. That is my will, and I have given my will that fifty percent of the collection should be spent for reprinting the books and fifty percent should be spent for spreading the movement. So there is no question of material profit.

Carol Jarvis: I wonder if I could ask you just finally, then, if you have a message.

Prabhupāda: Yes, this is the message, that people are under the impression that one is this body, but that is not the fact. The soul, or the man, he is within the body. Just like you are not your, this shirt and coat. You are within the shirt and coat. Similarly, the living entity, the living being, is within this body, the gross body and the subtle body. The subtle body is composed of mind, intelligence and ego, and the gross body is a composition of these material things, earth, water, air, fire, like that, five elements. Altogether, eight elements. This is inferior energy. And the superior energy is within these eight elements, five gross and three subtle. So we have to study about that thing. Just like I asked that boy that "You can manufacture a huge machine, flying in the sky, 747, but why don't you manufacture the pilot?"

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Now, suppose I am old man. If by some medical process, if I am given a young man's body to be more enthusiastic for working, is it not benefit for me? Similarly, in old age, when the body is changed, he gets another new body. That is a profit. There is no loss. The old body, it cannot work nicely. It cannot move nicely. Just old car.... If your old car is changed into new car, will you not accept it? So it is just like machine, car.

Brian Singer: You're not aware of this...

Prabhupāda: Aware? You have to aware, become aware by the books, by the knowledge.

Brian Singer: How was the soul originally created? This...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Brian Singer: The original creation...

Prabhupāda: There is no creation. That you have to understand.

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: That means the little children's policy. Children, just like imagining so many things, "I shall do that. I shall do." The potter's imagination. You know that? Potter's imagination? You do not know the story? One potter is selling earthen pots, and he is saying that "Now, these two paisā, it has cost me one paisā. I shall make one paisā profit. Then I can make such profit. I shall invest again. I shall make another profit, another profit. In this way I shall become millionaire. Then I shall marry, and my wife shall be very obedient. And if (s)he does not become obedient, I shall give him a kick like this." And he, what was.... One pot was there. He kicked that pot and broke. (laughter) It broke. "Oh, again I am poor man." So this is going on, imagination. Imagination.... "I shall become so great that I shall kick Kṛṣṇa's law," and whatever pot he had-broken. That's all. Rascals, simply rascals. If anyone thinks like that, that "I shall surpass the laws of nature," then he's madman. He's madman. So what is the use of dealing with madmen? And as soon as you challenge them that "Show us that you have surpassed the laws of nature," "Yes, we are trying. In future we shall do." That's all. This is their reply. So it is better to avoid such men. But if you peacefully you can introduce, "All right, you will do. You are wonderful men, so kindly if you read some pages of this, it is not very costly. You can keep. At leisure hour you can read," in this way, imploring, then they will be benefited. That much we can do to any rascal. He sādhavaḥ sakalam eva vihāya dūrāt caitanya-candra-caraṇe: "Oh, you are so nice. Therefore I am flattering you. I humbly obeisance. Kindly hear one thing. Keep some books. It is not very costly." Bas. This much you can do. And let them become puffed up by their false notions. But if they keep some books, sometimes they will read or their sons will read. That's all.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Mm. We are not very anxious to get done immediately, we shall do slowly.

Guru-kṛpā: So we are, me and Tamāla Kṛṣṇa, we have organized the saṅkīrtana here. The saṅkīrtana should increase about ten times. Before they were doing three hundred dollars a day, now they should be doing at about one thousand three hundred dollars a day.

Prabhupāda: That is nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Therefore I think if we have profit, fifty percent can go for books, and fifty percent can be banked. And when they have enough money, then we can build the temple. But it's the only question...

Prabhupāda: No, with what, whatever collection is there, fifty percent, go on. Why wait?

Guru-kṛpā: And what about my collections in Japan?

Prabhupāda: We also spent here for the time.

Guru-kṛpā: 'Cause I will be getting nice collections this year.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Small books print first of all, see. How the black market takes it, and then big books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There is also all of the eastern European countries.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they have got black market. There must be intermediate man who deals in black market.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There is.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Get them. Let them make good profit. We want to put up, that's all. And let them take money, we don't mind. Śaṭhe śaṭhuṁ samācaret. When there is trickery, you become trickery. Śaṭhe śaṭhuṁ samācaret. Kṛṣṇa's play, those who are plain, Kṛṣṇa is very kind and plain. Those who are tricky, "All right, I am also tricky." We shall adopt all the means of the materialistic persons, simply for Kṛṣṇa. (break) Just like Kṛṣṇa's rāsa dance, any materialistic person at the dead of night will be glad to dance with young girls, what is the difference? (break) But because it was Kṛṣṇa's dancing, so this association of the woman and Kṛṣṇa is taken by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu as the first class worship. ramyā kācid upāsanā vraja-vadhū-vargeṇa yā kalpitā. Kṛṣṇa should become a little tricky with the gopīs, "Oh, you have come in dead of night, what your husband, father would think, and there are so many (indistinct) and saintly (indistinct), please get out immediately." You have got that?

Devotees: Mm, hm.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: And the gopīs were thinking "What this rascal says, say?" (chuckles) They are so sorry that, "We have come leaving everything and this rascal is giving us moral instruction." This is love, they can chastise Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...somehow or other, black market, white market, red market. Let them make... And as soon as there is taste, there will be very good demand. And this black marketeer will make profit and they'll do. This Chinese policy or the Russian policy will not stand. Simply we require to make ourselves strong. As soon as we become stronger than the communist movement, we shall finish it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Finish everyone?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You mean attack them?

Prabhupāda: That I shall tell later. You become little strong. We cannot allow them. Because Kṛṣṇa's policy is, paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtam (BG 4.8). You have to take that policy.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Fangs, fangs. That is broken. So make... First of all try to push books, everywhere all over the world. They have got so many languages, like Russian or... Blackmarket. Chinese also. Blackmarket, they cannot check.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, no, and you don't need permission either.

Prabhupāda: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And there's more profit too.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In black market.

Prabhupāda: Ah yes, if there is demand, then you will make good profit also. And there will be demand.

Hari-śauri: They'll be big demand for your books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Very big, very big.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) They sent one translation of Tulasi dāsa's Rāma-caritra-mānasa. It was sold, all, in a week. And therefore they have stopped now.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is your business.

Rāmeśvara: What is the purpose of the cheating?

Candanācārya: Prabhupāda said to ask for taxes.

Prabhupāda: Lābha, pūjā, pratiṣṭhā. These three things are materially wanted. Some material profit, some reputation and some.... Eh?

Devotees: Distinction.

Prabhupāda: Adoration. These are the material demands.

Hari-śauri: Because, originally, it was built up as a big thing between Russia and America, who would get to the moon first.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now they are shaking hands, and none of them has gone. "I thank you."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's like the emperor's new clothes.

Prabhupāda: "You failed, my dear sir. I failed also. Come on."

Morning Walk -- June 7, 1976, Los Angeles:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What was in the pot?

Prabhupāda: That.... A potter, potter boy, he had got some earthen pots selling. So he was dreaming, that "By selling this earthen pot, I'll make so much profit. Then I shall purchase another batch, I shall make profit. In this way, I shall be millionaire. Then I shall marry, and my wife must be very obedient. Otherwise I shall kick." So in this way, he kicked over the pots and (laughs) all of them broken.

Rāmeśvara: And in the end, nothing.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Devotee: So by his dreaming he, he...

Prabhupāda: Yes, first of all be rich man, then do all things, how you shall kick your wife. This is going on. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said that "My Guru Mahārāja found Me rascal number one; therefore he ordered, 'You cannot study Vedānta. You chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.' " They will not read this portion. That Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He posed Himself as a rascal.

Room Conversation Excerpt -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He was my college friend. We studied in the same college.

Indian Man: Is that right?

Prabhupāda: He was one year senior to me. He appeared(?) from the year 1919, I appeared(?) in 1920.

Indian Man: Yes. And then he was in a plane crash? Or...?

Prabhupāda: There is a great history.

Indian Man: Yes. I don't know if it is true. (break) ...taken sannyāsa, and just gone out somewhere.

Prabhupāda: So anyway, although you have got independence, India, oh, what is the profit?

Hari-śauri: The independence is just about to come, Śrīla Prabhupāda, when you start preaching there.

Prabhupāda: Real sva-raja is to go back to home, back to Godhead. (end)

Room Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He has some inquiries?

Jagadīśa: Well, he seems to be eating up the philosophy of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. He's very eager to hear.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Jagadīśa: He's downstairs right now.

Rāmeśvara: He's charging us lower rates, doing, working as hard as he can for us at practically no profit to himself.

Prabhupāda: Yes, something must be given.

Jagadīśa: Can I ask him to come up?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hṛdayānanda: This is the greatest gift, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Rāmeśvara: The greatest contribution, Prabhupāda said.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda has asked that all the sannyāsīs take one shirt. (break) (conversation continues after entrance of guest)

Prabhupāda: He wants chair?

Rāmeśvara: He likes sitting Indian style. (Prabhupāda laughs)

Jay Warner: No, this is fine, thank you.

Rāmeśvara: His name is Jay Warner.

Prabhupāda: Yes, I.... Ācarati śreṣṭhas tat tad evetaro janaḥ:"Anything which is accepted by leading men, that is accepted by others." So you are one of the leading men in the society, lawyer. If you understand our philosophy, then many others will follow. So kindly try to understand our philosophy thoroughly, and then others will follow: "He's big lawyer. He's a Kṛṣṇa conscious man." If you have any doubt, you can ask. We will try to explain. Asaṁśayaṁ samagraṁ māṁ yathā jñāsyasi tac chṛṇu (BG 7.1). Find out this verse. (break) It must be distinct from other paintings.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Therefore, next verse?

Nalinīkaṇṭha:

tat-prayāso na kartavyo
yata āyur-vyayaḥ param
na tathā vindate kṣemaṁ
mukunda-caraṇāmbujam

"Endeavors merely for sense gratification or material happiness through economic development are not to be performed, for they result only in a loss of time and energy, with no actual profit. If one's endeavors are directed toward Kṛṣṇa consciousness, one can surely attain the spiritual platform of self-realization. There is no such benefit from engaging oneself in economic development."

Prabhupāda: Yes, now just see how people are being misguided. Throughout the whole world, the education is for economic development. And here it is condemned that one should not waste his time for so-called economic development. Now our preaching is here, and who will accept it? They'll call us all crazy fellows. We are thinking they are crazy, they're wasting time for economic development, and they are thinking of us, that "These people are crazy, they are doing nothing, escaping." Escaping, do they not say like that?

Nalinīkaṇṭha: Yes.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Purport.

Hari-śauri: Purport: "Activity in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or acting for the benefit of Kṛṣṇa without expectation of sense gratification, is the highest transcendental quality of work. Even a small beginning of such activity finds no impediment, nor can that small beginning be lost at any stage. Any work begun on the material plane has to be completed, otherwise the whole attempt becomes a failure. But any work begun in Kṛṣṇa consciousness has a permanent effect, even though not finished. The performer of such work is therefore not at a loss even if his work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness is incomplete. One percent done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness bears permanent results, so that the next beginning is from the point of two percent;, whereas, in material activity, without one-hundred-percent success, there is no profit. Ajāmila performed his duty in some percentage of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but the result he enjoyed at the end was one hundred percent, by the grace of the Lord. There is a nice verse in this connection in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam: 'If someone gives up self-gratificatory pursuits and works in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and then falls down on account of not completing his work, what loss is there on his part? And, what can one gain if one performs his material activities perfectly?' (SB 1.5.17) Or, as the Christians say, 'What profiteth a man if he gain the whole world yet suffers the loss of his eternal soul?' Material activities and their results end with the body. But work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness carries the person again to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, even after the loss of the body. At least one is sure to have a chance in the next life of being born again as a human being, either in the family of a great cultured brāhmaṇa or in a rich aristocratic family, that will give one a further chance for elevation. That is the unique quality of work done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness."

Prabhupāda: So everyone should join this movement and be sure of his activity, result, good result. That is real United Nations—to work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Every, any department, if we work for Kṛṣṇa, then it is perfect. That is sure. And it is open to everyone. Now this American government is giving so much welfare contribution, but still they are not happy. Huge amount is spent in welfare activities, but still they are dissatisfied. Then how you can make them satisfied? The American government is practically giving money to the sufferers, and why they are still suffering? What is the answer?

Morning Walk -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: The government is promising.

Ambarīṣa: Oh, that's good.

Prabhupāda: We have already applied for twenty-five acres. Mr. Candrali,(?) he wanted to make some profit out of it.

Ambarīṣa: Yes.

Devotee (1): I think you won the heart of that government official yesterday by saying that Kṛṣṇa's black and we worship Him. (laughter) He liked that.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Ambarīṣa: Yes, Detroit River, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Big, big ships, they pass under this bridge?

Ambarīṣa: No, on the other side of this island, there's a channel, a freighter channel. That's Canada over there, and this is a small island, Belle Isle.

Hari-śauri: What is that project up ahead?

Ambarīṣa: I guess.... It's got problems.

Prabhupāda: What is that problem?

Ambarīṣa: No, he was asking if they are..., big project, Renaissance Center. They are having some problems building it. (short conversation about where to stop)

Devotee (1): Yes, this is where we are going to walk.

Room Conversation with Mother and Sons -- June 13, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Because they are spiritually enlightened. That is the cause of brightness. And materially involved-moroseness. Because it is ignorance. Material life means life of ignorance. And spiritual life means life of enlightenment. That is the difference. Material life is called tamas. Tamas means darkness. Tamaso mā jyotir gamaya. This is the Vedic mantra. Don't remain in darkness. But people cannot understand. "I am living in the light. Why I'm darkness?" Darkness means without any spiritual enlightenment. That is darkness. So the Vedic injunction is "Don't remain in darkness. Come to the light." The light is my spiritual life, and material life means darkness. Because he does not know what is going to happen next. You are under the laws of material nature. The nature will act according to the association you make, exactly. You do not know that you are infecting some contagious disease. You may not know it, but it will act. In due course of time, you'll develop that disease and suffer. Similarly, without knowledge, in ignorance, imperceptibly we are associating with a certain law of nature, and we shall be victimized. We may not know it, but we shall be victimized. That is the life of ignorance. A child does not know that if he touches the fire it will burn and it will cause some disease, some sore. He does not know. But he, somehow or other, if he touches fire, these things will come. This is the life of ignorance. You do something, you do not know what is the effect. But the effect will come, and you'll have to suffer. You know or not know, it doesn't matter. That is ignorance. Life of darkness. The Christian theologicians, they say that "Why shall I suffer for my...?" They do not believe in the karma, fruitive activity. But that means ignorance. They have no sufficient knowledge. Karma is there and effect is there, but they do not know it. Poor fund of knowledge. Therefore it is failing. They have failed, these Christian priest, to explain everything philosophically. So advanced Westerners, they are now educated in science philosophy, they are not attracted with these dogmatic views. So to remain in ignorance is animal life. To be enlightened is human life. And the topmost enlightenment is to understand God and to love Him. That is the topmost enlightenment. Unfortunately, there is no education to know what is God, and what to speak of loving Him. This is modern civilization. Ignorance. A civilization of ignorance. They do not know what is what. Simply speculating, wasting time, talking all nonsense. This is going on in the name of education, but actually they are in ignorance. They do not know what is what. They are reading so many philosophical speculation, horrible condition of the so-called philosopher, scientist. Simply "I believe," "In this believe, that believe." You believe.... Believe something. That is your (indistinct). But your belief is not final. That is creating chaotic condition. You believe some way, I believe something, he believes something. What is the profit? Chaos. So all these philosophers, scientists, they believe "I believe," as if his belief will be a doctrine. Why he believes like that? People also accept like that. Nobody questions that a person says "I believe," that means he is not in perfect knowledge. But in Vedic śāstra, there is no question of belief. This is the fact. Jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi. It never says that "I believe there are so many aquatics." No. Clear declaration: Jalajā nava-lakṣāṇi. There are nine hundred thousand different forms of life in the water. Bas. This is Vedic knowledge. It never says, "I believe." What is the meaning of belief? You must know definitely and declare it. That is Vedic knowledge. Speculation is not allowed. Truth must be declared as it is. (aside:) That Bengali woman wanted to see me? Mrs. Dasgupta.

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Hmm? Yes. You follow strictly the instructions. If you commit offense, how it is offenseless?

Makhanlāl: It's considered offenseless if, chanting, if one follows the orders of the spiritual master carefully?

Prabhupāda: There may be offense. You should go on chanting. That will be adjusted as you advance in chanting. Harer nāma harer nāma, harer nāma eva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21). Simply go on chanting. We shall see later on what is offense and not offense. (laughter) Chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, not for any profit. But go on serving Him. That's all. Material calculation, "Now, this much I have profited..." (break) .... there is no animal?

Devotee (1): This jungle?

Prabhupāda: There are some deers.

Ambarīṣa: Yes. Yes. I just saw a raccoon just now when I was getting the car. There are some in there.

Prabhupāda: There is no monkey?

Ambarīṣa: (laughter) No. (break)

Satsvarūpa: No monkey in the United States. (break) "Nature Center" it says.

Prabhupāda: Nature?

Morning Walk -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Who cares for it? (laughter) Wine is highly taxed in India. When I was manager in Dr. Bose's laboratory, he was manufacturing alcohol(?) for medicinal purposes. The cost was one rupee eight annas per gallon. The government was levying duty. For medicinal purpose, five rupees per gallon, whereas purchasing liquor, fifty-eight. The government would take profit out of it, fifty-eight rupees.

Satsvarūpa: (indistinct) Fifth Canto (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Today, there was description, there is description, the fight was so severe that the blood sprinkled up to the sun planet. So why not moon planet? Why they say sun planet? The sun is the nearest planet from the earth. So this calculation.... They say the sun planet is 93,000,000 miles away from earth? And if you add further 1,600,000 miles, it comes to about fifteen (50?) million miles. Fifteen (50?) million miles, they have calculated, go there by the sputnik at the rate of 13,000 miles per hour. (indistinct)

Ambarīṣa: They said they went fifteen million?

Hari-śauri: No, according to our calculation.... We agree with the figure 93,000,000, as approximate to the sun, but then our figure is 1,600,000 beyond it to the moon.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) Ambarīṣa does not agree. (laughs)

Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: No, God consciousness is the highest level. It is not possible for everyone. But in whatever platform he is, if there is cooperation with God consciousness movement, then he gets the result. Just like in this body.... Same example: leg's duty is different and brain duty is different, hand's duty is different, belly's duty different, but when there is cooperation, all the parts of the body derive the same benefit.

Scheverman: Yes, I see. So if one has the experience of God in a cooperative, well, good and sound social body, then all will profit from that experience.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Scheverman: I'd like to perhaps ask you, what is the role of prayer? You may have another word that you utilize.

Devotee (1): Prayer is also accepted as devotional service.

Scheverman: As devotional service.

Prabhupāda: Yes. There are nine kinds of devotional service. They are all the same. Different processes. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam arcanaṁ vandanaṁ dāsyam (SB 7.5.23). Vandanam, this vandanam is prayer. We are worshiping, Deity worship, and you are offering prayers in the church. So both of them we take as devotional service. We don't say that because you are offering prayer, it is less important than.... No. Because it is, prayer is offered to the Supreme Lord. So that is devotional. That is devotion.

Conversation with Clergymen -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: The desirer of wealth.

Prabhupāda: Yes. In need of money, "God, I am so poor. Kindly give me some money." So he's approached God. That is his piety. Although God should not be asked. Pure devotion means God should not be bothered. Simply we shall render service. "God is great. I am His servant. So my duty is to render service without any profit." The profit is there. To be accepted as God's servant, that is the greatest profit.

Scheverman: That's what Jesus said: "Behold the lilies of the field, they neither toil nor spin, and yet not even Solomon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. Seek first the kingdom of heaven, and all these things—what you shall eat, what you shall drink—shall be added to you besides." Yes.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Jijñāsu, the inquisitive, curious.

Prabhupāda: Inquisitive, one is trying to understand what is God, and he is also pious.

Scheverman: "Lord teach me, show me."

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: In Calcutta, yes.

Prabhupāda: The state is in the management of official trustee. And this trustee in charge of the trust board men, they give us so much trouble and exploit the position for his personal profit. I have seen. Horrible. For instance, I can give you, if in some property there is some repair, it will cost you, say, one hundred rupees. And they'll give it to a contractor, and the contractor will present a bill, twelve hundred rupees. And he'll pass. And the contractor will be given, say, two hundred rupees, and balance he'll take. I have seen.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Stealing from the trust.

Prabhupāda: In this way he's.... The money's in his hand. If you want money for expenditure, so if I press you, you have need of money, so you do everything, give some back, get the money. You are in urgent need. Everywhere. All, whole world they have become dishonest. Even the high-court judges, magistrate, they are getting bribe.

Room Conversation -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Jagadīśa: They've taken over the city.

Prabhupāda: Without them, the factories cannot go on. That's all. The white men cannot work so hard. How they...? No gentleman can do that. This kind of work is meant for the fourth-class, fifth-class men. Therefore they cannot say anything. They require. And they know that their money will be taken away again by supplying them wine. They'll pay, and next moment, the wine merchant will take away. And the government will get huge profit without doing anything. And excise tax. Excise tax, government hasn't got to invest or do anything—simply take the tax.

Hari-śauri: Every time they put a tax increase, it's always on beer and cigarettes. Always, every time. And motorcars. Because they know the people are so much addicted that even if they squeeze and squeeze and squeeze, they will still get more, and the people will still pay.

Prabhupāda: And addicted people, they, they're after the.... Get money some way or other. Beg, borrow or steal. So these black men especially, they are expert. They are not expert in begging, but borrowing and stealing.

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That is not for the foreigners. If some Chinese men or Indian want to come...

Kīrtanānanda: It used to be. But not anymore for anybody.

Prabhupāda: Just see. Why?

Kīrtanānanda: Because it has become very profitable for people to keep it. Because people are making money on it now.

Prabhupāda: Money they must make; otherwise, why they should come? But what is the objection? Just like in the marketplace, still, in India, the system is, the marketplace, anyone can go and sell his goods, and when he's selling, the proprietor takes some contribution. Not that he has to take permission. He's selling there, that's all right, "Give me some..., a little contribution." The king has the right to tax for maintenance.

Prabhupada Visits Palace and Garden -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: No. Pālikā, you came before here?

Pālikā: Six years ago. There was just that one small, original farm.

Prabhupāda: Now it is a big property. And when the palace will be ready, many people will.... You simply advertise "Come and see palaces in New Vrindaban." It will be a combination of Western and Eastern culture. For the profit of the whole human society. So Vṛndāvana-candra will come here? No. Vṛndāvana-candra Deity?

Kīrtanānanda: No.

Prabhupāda: His palace will be different.

Kīrtanānanda: His palace will be where the building is now. We're planning to move Him into the new building next to the present temple, the four-story building. He will occupy the fourth floor for now. Then we will take down that old building and put up a nice big temple.

Prabhupāda: So why you dismantle, construct another?

Kīrtanānanda: The building is not in such good condition.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. As soon as the new temple is, move it; or you want to dismantle it.

Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. If they had to do it themselves they would consider it abominable.

Prabhupāda: No, some of them can do it, make business. As there are butchers, as they are selling meat, they can take it, they'll make more profit. From slaughterhouse, if they purchase, they have to pay, but here they get free. The hotel man, they can get free. The tannary expert, he'll get this skin free. I have seen they are eating the lobster, it is so decomposed it has become exactly like puss and they are eating. That argument is not valid.

Kīrtanānanda: They cannot even eat the animal when it is fresh. They never eat beef fresh. It must age for at least three weeks, otherwise it is not tasty. (laughter)

Hari-śauri: I remember once there was one man, he was advertising himself, he was touring from one country to another, and he was advertising himself as being an expert meat-eater. And he said, one of his statements was you couldn't eat a beefsteak until it had little white spots all over it, then it was ready to eat.

Prabhupāda: White spot means decomposed. Fungus. Nānā yoni brāhmaṇa kare kadārya bhakṣaṇa kari' tāra janma adho pate yāya.

Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Oh. His father came to see me in London.

Kulaśekhara: He used to chauffeur you in his car. He would drive you in his car from the airport.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Kulaśekhara: He is a good man, but he's not intelligent.

Prabhupāda: No, he'll profit by your activities. Kṛṣṇa will give concession to your family. Because you are Vaiṣṇava, everyone will get the profit.

Kulaśekhara: In London you said thirteen generations.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. That is special concession. Hiraṇyakaśipu was given, such a demon. But your father is not a demon. He may be less intelligent, that is another thing. So Kṛṣṇa is prepared to give facility to a demon father of a devotee.

Morning Walk -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Mucis?

Prabhupāda: Muci, yes. Their business is shoe maker. So when the cow is dead, they take it, they eat the meat and take the skin and the hoof. They make business without any, what is called, investment. Harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21). That is economic. He gets the skin without any price, and he makes shoes and gets full profit. But that is for a class of men, not for all. Economic gain for a cobbler is not the economic gain for a brāhmaṇa. "One man's food another man's poison."

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is considered, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that when a brāhmaṇa is engaged in the activities of plowing and cultivating, that he has become a vaiśya?

Prabhupāda: No. If there is nobody to help, he can do.

Hari-śauri: As long as he keeps up his brahminical standards.

Prabhupāda: Huh? Yes. This is our car?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Because a class of men will demand to eat the flesh. You cannot stop it. So we are giving free: you eat. And from economic point of view, we require the skin for our mṛdaṅga making. So give us the skin. That's all.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda says the butcher, even, he can sell the meat cheaply, make profit. He's getting it free of charge.

Hari-śauri: Maybe some time in the future this could happen when Kṛṣṇa consciousness becomes very powerful influence in the country, but unless we could actually close the slaughterhouse...

Prabhupāda: No, but now by imploring, we are requesting him that "You can take this cow and sell in your shop, butcher shop, you give us the skin. And you can tell the customer that it is as good, it is cheaper. So whatever money you get, that is your profit. You haven't got to invest anything."

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Do you propose that we should do this now, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: (laughs) No, no, this is... Think over.

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: I am proposing, think over it. Because it is a fact that in spite our vigorous propaganda, we cannot stop meat-eating. That is not possible. People will eat. So those who are eating, let us make some arrangement that "You take it free of charges." From economic point of view, they get it free. They can make good profit. And we are interested with the skin. So why not make some arrangement? It is practical.

Hari-śauri: That's very good.

Prabhupāda: Instead of the thing being wasted for nothing, let us devise some means, that you are eating, you can eat. And we want the skin, let us give him. What is the wrong there?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Perfect economics.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We require the skin, that's a fact. And you want to eat, all right, eat.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Could such a thing be done today in India also?

Prabhupāda: No, why it will be done? Everywhere it should be. That is the... Who does not eat meat? First of all, you try this. From economic point of view, why one thing should be wasted?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Practical preaching.

Interview with Mike Darby -- June 30, 1976, Wheeling, W. Virginia:

Darby: They get big profit, and no one else does.

Prabhupāda: And they are going to the moon planet, Mars planet, and bring some dust.

Darby: They try to keep the people busy by showing them other planets.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Busy means they can show all these bluff busy programs to the rascals, not to the sane man.

Darby: Could you tell us a little about your spiritual master's life? I've never heard anything.

Prabhupāda: This is spiritual master, one who is representative of God. And one who speaks what God has said, then he's spiritual master.

Darby: But I have never heard anything of Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta, and I wondered if you would tell me a little bit about him, if you would.

Prabhupāda: What shall I say? He was my spiritual master, and whatever he taught, we are speaking, that's all. We don't talk any nonsense.

Darby: Yes. That's all I have to ask you. Thank you for allowing me your time.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- July 2, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Hari-śauri: It's from the Bhāgavatam?

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is mentioned in the Caitanya-caritāmṛta. Any process you accept, rejecting devotional service, the result will be that there is no profit. You simply labor for nothing, as much as to beat the husk, you'll never get the rice, you will simply be tiresome, that's all. Just like so-called religion. There is no faith in God. There is no need of God, and "religion." This is nonsense. Religion means without God? This is going on. God, you can accept anyone, Ramakrishna Mission. Any rascal...He was a fool, illiterate rascal, Ramakrishna. He became God. No standard, and they are propagating Ramakrishna Mission. As we are preaching Kṛṣṇa is God, they are preaching Ramakrishna. And who's accepting them? For the last hundred years, they are preaching. So who has become a devotee of Ramakrishna?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: It's absurd to even think about becoming a devotee of Ramakrishna.

Prabhupāda: You have got Caitanya-caritāmṛta?

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa:

tat-prayāso na kartavyo
yata āyur-vyayaḥ param
na tathā vindate kṣemaṁ
mukunda-caraṇāmbujam

Translation: "Endeavors merely for sense gratification or material happiness through economic development are not to be performed, for they result only in a loss of time and energy, with no actual profit. If one's endeavors are directed towards Kṛṣṇa consciousness, one can surely attain the spiritual platform of self-realization. There is no such benefit from engaging oneself in economic development."

Prabhupāda: This is our philosophy, and the whole world is engaged in economic development. So which is better? (laughs) Here it is said tat-prayāso na kartavyo. We see, especially in the Western country, they are very busy for economic development, and unless one is engaged... I think that Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan, they questioned that in India, people being fatalist...

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They questioned, many people think this is a hindrance to progress.

Prabhupāda: So what is progress? In India still, in so fallen condition, we have got practical experience. If there is some arrangement... Sometimes we arrange Hare Kṛṣṇa festival. Each day not less than twenty thousand, thirty thousand, forty thousand people come. Although these, mostly these foreigners, they are chanting, and we are speaking in English, still, to hear the kīrtana, they come from remote villages. In Calcutta I have seen. That is natural tendency of Indians. Bhārata-bhūmi, anyone who has taken birth in India, naturally Kṛṣṇa conscious. By artificial means, they are being suppressed. Just like this Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan, they have questioned that... What they have said?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: They said that there are many thinkers in India who consider that the Hinduism is fatalistic, and therefore it doesn't encourage people to make material progress.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Who's name?

Devotee (1): Gansfield. They say the Gansfield effect.

Prabhupāda: Who is Gansfield, somebody know?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's an article about Maharishi. You want to read it? There's some points in here, it says "Profit without honor." This man hates Maharishi, says he's completely bogus.

Prabhupāda: His picture is hateful.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says "Profit without any honor." He quotes you in here. It says "Swami Prabhupāda, spiritual leader of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, and Bill Faill, Durban, South Africa, of the Natal Mercury Reporter, had the following dialogue: (reads from magazine) Bill Faill: 'Do you think that Transcendental Meditation is helping people?' Prabhupāda: 'They do not know what real meditation is. Their meditation is simply a farce, another cheating process by the so-called swamis and yogis. So everyone is talking about meditation, but no one knows what meditation really is. These bluffers use the word meditation, but they do not know the proper subject for meditation. They are simply talking bogus propaganda.' Bill Faill: 'But isn't meditation helpful in getting people to think straight?' Prabhupāda: 'No, real meditation means to achieve a state in which the mind is saturated by God consciousness.' "

Prabhupāda: Dhyānāvasthita-tad-gatena manasā paśyanti yaṁ yoginaḥ (SB 12.13.1). This is the Vedic version. When one man's mind is fully absorbed in the Supersoul, Viṣṇu, that is called meditation. And Bhagavad-gītā confirms,

yoginām api sarveṣāṁ
mad-gatenāntarātmanā
śraddhāvān bhajate yo māṁ
sa me yuktatamo mataḥ
(BG 6.47)

These are the Vedic version. These rascals, some light, some this, some that.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So you have reduced the price?

Devotee (5): To forty-five rupees. Gopāla Kṛṣṇa made it very, very reasonable for them that they can partake.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. They are taking the book. That is wanted. We don't want much profit.

Devotee (5): Many, many reviewers also from those big Sanskrits, the largest in the world (indistinct) professors here they also read the reviews and very much appreciate the books. All of the different parts we visited, from north to south, east to west.

Prabhupāda: They're welcome. That's fine. So make world party.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, we're very excited to do that. We're going to present it to the GBC.

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Satsvarūpa: What our practical plan is. Take this same party everywhere, Europe and then India and then other places too.

Prabhupāda: We are getting good response for our books all over the world.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Wholesale business is better than retail business. My father was a wholesale, cloth seller, cloth merchant. So, he liked wholesale business, not retail.

Mr. Kallman: The wholesale is much better. It's more financial...

Prabhupāda: A little profit, but aggregate is better.

Mr. Kallman: The volume is more.

Prabhupāda: Yes, volume is more. In those days, he was making cloth business, he was making profit one anna or two paise per piece.

Mr. Kallman: Very small profit.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The Marwari business man, they want to sell, for suppose, one lakh of worth goods, if there is customer to pay him immediately one lakh ten rupees, he'll sell, immediately sell. He thinks "I've got that ten rupees," that's all. Again person. That is their way of doing it. They are not calculating that I have invested one lakh of rupees, I must get at least ten percent profit. No. Not at loss. A little profit. "Never mind, give me cash." That is Marwari business. And he, when he goes to purchase from his supplier, he sees that this man is purchasing at the time one lakh, two lakh. So he gives him all credit.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: And next moment he phones another gold merchant, "What is the price," he says. Say one anna less... I'll sell one hundred tolās. So he'll purchase without any investment and sells immediately and makes one hundred tolās, one anna profit, some (indistinct).

Mr. Kallman: Sure.

Prabhupāda: By telephone.

Mr. Kallman: Very quick.

Prabhupāda: In this way, they become very, very big. They know how to use this art, these Marwaris. If you are going in India, you'll see Marwaris are very quickly, they will come. They know how to do business.

Mr. Kallman: Volume.

Prabhupāda: Volume. Volume of the... Of course, volume of business can be done which is easily seller.

Mr. Kallman: A very good market, the United States for clothing.

Prabhupāda: Clothing.

Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: That is the sign of love. That is in material field also. There are so many philosophers, scientists and artists, they have done out of love for their subject matter, not for payment. That is love.

Bali-mardana: But aren't they also purified spiritually by doing this?

Prabhupāda: Yes. This spiritual realization means the more you give service to God, you become spiritually profited, in any way.

Interviewer: What are some of the other, aside from...? I mean, I see people selling things. What other practices are involved?

Prabhupāda: Then you stay one day, whole day and night, and see practically, from morning four o'clock to night ten o'clock, how we are engaged in different practices.

Interviewer: You rise at four?

Hari-śauri: Three-thirty.

Rāmeśvara: In this temple three, three-thirty.

Interviewer: And chant.

Rāmeśvara: Chant, study.

Prabhupāda: You go any room of this house. You'll find simply Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: What do you mean?

Hari-śauri: Are we surprised at the way the movement has expanded and prospered in just a few short years.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not surprising, it is natural. If you do, just like if you do business in proper way there will be profit. Similarly, as it is enjoined in this book of knowledge, if you do like that it will expand, it will prosper. Two plus two equal to four. Mathematical calculation. If you make two plus two, it will become four. It will neither become three nor five. So here it is said, you have read the, that "One who is engaged twenty-four hours in My service, so I, yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham (BG 9.22), I supply whatever he requires and I protect whatever he has got." So if you actually serve Kṛṣṇa, then everything you want, it will come.

Rāmeśvara: Do you have any questions about our festival coming up this Sunday? You know we're marching down Fifth Avenue.

Interviewer: Are you going to march?

Rāmeśvara: He asks if you are going to participate in the Ratha-yātrā Parade.

Hari-śauri: This is the parade that it's based on.

Rāmeśvara: This is a photograph of what takes place in India every year. It's a traditional festival in India, we are bringing it to New York. We've got our permits and everything.

Prabhupāda: We have already got in San Francisco, in Chicago...

Rāmeśvara: Philadelphia.

Prabhupāda: In Philadelphia.

Car Ride -- July 20, 1976, New York:

Devotee: Whew!

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Easily, I'm sure, with advertisements.

Prabhupāda: Where the profit is going?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Where is the profit? Into distributing more books.

Prabhupāda: That's nice, very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That is our only business. (break) ...completely cleansed all of the grounds throughout the night, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Last night all night long we were cleaning up the grounds.

Rāmeśvara: At the park.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: At the park. One woman who lives next to the park said "In all my years of living here I've never seen such a wonderful festival held." And one..., the official of the park, who's in charge of the park, was on CBS television, and he said that "You see? Spiritual life is still present in Washington Square Park." He made that comment. He said "We are very proud to be able to say that in our... This park was founded hundreds of years ago, when America was religious." And he said "Spiritual life is still present in Washington Square Park."

Prabhupāda: So why not ask the mayor to construct a temple there? (laughter)

Morning Walk Around Grounds -- August 2, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Devotee (3): Henna. We're going to produce ten different coloring henna. (break) ...leaf of acacia making noncoloring henna.

Prabhupāda: Where you get?

Devotee (3): This is coming from India I think. But there's much acacia in France, and so we're going to pick it ourselves. This will make us a producer, which will increase our profit.

Bhagavān: Spiritual Sky is paying right now almost eighty thousand dollars a year to the association here.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Devotee (3): This is..., we're doing a cheaper line called Scented Garden, and the more expensive, this is for the cheaper customers.

Prabhupāda: This is scent?

Devotee (4): They're different.

Devotee (5): This is the cheaper oil. (laughter)

Devotee (3): This belongs to the previous owner of the chateau. He let us use these machines. He also helps us make very nice stands for displaying. These here are some for putting in the coloring, make them different colors. These come from India also.

Prabhupāda: What is this, sand?

Devotee (3): This belongs to the owner. (break)

Bhagavān: It stays light until quarter to eleven here.

Prabhupāda: Like Moscow also. I was there in June or July(?). Sarasvatī, you like this place?

Hari-śauri: You like this place?

Sarasvatī: Yes.

Room Conversation -- August 2, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: There's no question of starvation for want of money. Anywhere sit down and do something palatable, and people will purchase. So your livelihood will go on. Pakorā, kacuri, jalebi, anything. You make some palatable, people are fond of eating some palatable things. That is their hobby. In Allahabad, there was a brāhmaṇa. I had my business, and he was neighborhood, he was living. So in the morning, the husband and wife would go to take bath in the Ganges. They would very nicely take bath, and while coming they will purchase some ingredients and then come home. The husband will perform pūjā, etc., and the wife will prepare many nice preparations-baḍā, pakori, puskar (?), this, that. Then he'll take his meals, rest awhile, and in the evening he will sit down, he was sitting just in front of my shop, about four or five o'clock. All the preparations his wife had made whole day, and the small shop. And the university students will come up to night, ten o'clock, he'll finish. Nothing will remain. Everything will be... And he'll make at least ten rupees profit, minimum. In those days, 1925, in those days ten rupees means nowadays at least fifty rupees. So, and living very happy. Living humbly as a brāhmaṇa, he was having his pūjā, going to the Ganges, taking bath, husband and wife, in the morning, and the wife's business is to prepare and his business was to sell. So they'll make at least ten, fifteen rupees profit daily, very prosperous. Living peacefully, husband and wife. There are many such families. The... If wife is very good, then his home is very nice. They cannot be unhappy at any circumstances. Dampatyoḥ kalaho nāsti tatra śrīḥ svayam āgataḥ.(?) Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. When there is full agreement between husband and wife, cooperation, then the goddess of fortune comes there without application. You haven't got to ask goddess of fortune, "Please come and help me." She'll come automatically. This is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita's instruction.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: We have got three platforms, generally. Material platform divided into two-gross and subtle, and there is spiritual platform. The body is material platform, divided into two, gross and subtle. And then if you are fortunate enough to come to the spiritual platform, then your life is successful. So the karmīs generally... Just like we see in the city, they are all busy, working very hard. They are on the gross material platform. And then next class, just like scientist, poet, philosopher, they are in the subtle platform. And above them, there are persons who are simply interested in spiritual understanding. They are on the spiritual platform. So according to the platform, there are thoughts and activities also. Your question is what is about these so many things. So first of all you have to understand in which platform he is situated. Then his activities are ascertained. If you are in the material platform, doing some business, making some profit, and if you bring there question—"What is this, use of material profit, this body is temporary, why I am..."—then your material activities will be diminished.(?) So we have to understand first of all what is our actual objective. And then if we stand in that platform, then our life is successful.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Mrs. Sahani: Creates the desire to get knowledge.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). Caitanya Mahāprabhu has recommended, paraṁ vijāyate śrī-kṛṣṇa-saṅkīrtanam, ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam. Just like if you remain in touch with the fire, certainly you become warm. So if you remain always in touch with Kṛṣṇa, then you become Kṛṣṇized. Very easy. You haven't gone to the forest or Himalaya or meditate. Simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. That is recommended in the śāstra: harer nāma harer nāma harer nāmaiva kevalam, kalau nāsty eva nāsty eva nāsty eva (CC Adi 17.21). You cannot perform any severe austerities, penance. Wherever you remain, you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. And you become perfect. If not in one day... But you will become, if you continue chanting. And where is the difficulty? Where is the loss? And if there is some gain, why don't you try it? That is intelligence. I am not losing anything by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. If there is any gain, why not chant? Huh? Why is the argument not to chant? There is no loss, but if there is any profit, why don't you try to take it. Śāstra recommends. Kṛṣṇa recommends, satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 9.14). Find out this verse. Satataṁ kīrtayanto mām.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Well, that is their business. Let them do. You try to understand the position. Meditation is also something. Asuras, they do not take to meditation. Meditation is something beginning to the path of devatā. Dhyānāvasthita. If they are actually serious then they can profit. Meditation is not always bad, if they are properly guided. But that is not the business of the asuras. They say, "On whom I shall meditate?" The asuras do not do that.

Devotee: They have special meditation for asuras.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Devotee: They have special classes in meditation for asuras. They give them some meaningless word to meditate upon.

Prabhupāda: So what is the purpose of this meditation?

Devotee: To make..., to relax the mind.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that is another thing. Material. That is, er, Transcendental Meditation.

Room Conversation -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Jñānagamya: They say on Mars there can be life because the conditions are a little bit like earth.

Prabhupāda: Suppose there is life, then what you gain?

Devotee: They say that our knowledge now is not mere theoretical because now we have gone there.

Prabhupāda: But what profit you have gained? You have spent some millions of dollars, that's all.

Devotee: More theories.

Prabhupāda: (chants japa)

Devotee: The government encourages this spending of money while the citizens are unhappy and cannot be safe in their own city.

Prabhupāda: Yes, you must have such government. Dasyu-dharyogi (?). They will snatch your money by force. You cannot say anything. That is punishment. Godless civilization, that is punishment, that your own government will snatch, by force, take away your hard labor accumulation, by taxes. That is written in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. You cannot fight. You will be harassed in so many ways you will become mad. Ācchinna-dāra-draviṇā yāsyanti giri-kānanam. Hopelessly you will leave hearth and home and go to the forest. This godless civilization will be punished like that. That day is coming like that. Nobody will be peaceful. They will be mad. Just like when a man becomes mad, he commits suicide, he blows off his head. This will be done. There will be no rain—this is one punishment—and scarcity of food and heavy taxation by government. They are all mentioned. What more suffering you want? But still they are advancing, scientists.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Harikeśa: Why is that?

Prabhupāda: No, the first thing is that we have to accept there is God. Now, to inquire about God, this facility is given to the human being. So you must utilize it. Otherwise you are not human. Your business is, by nature's creation, your business is. The human being... Just like you dress yourself nicely, you comb your hair. That is possible by the human being. An animal may have big hair, but it cannot dress because he has no intelligence. So if you have got intelligence, if you utilize it, then life's profit is there. If you don't utilize it, then you remain lower-grade animal. So in the human form of life, the preliminary is that he can inquire about God, he can understand about God. So if he does not utilize his life for that purpose, then he is animal. So Aniruddha Prabhu requires spectacle? Or it is...

Arundhatī: No, it is just a toy glasses, toy. He does not require.

Prabhupāda: You require spectacle, glass?

Arundhatī: No.

Morning Walk -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: He creates the difficulty.(?) He came to Vṛndāvana as retired life, but instead of that he wanted to make some personal profit. That is his difficulty.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: So, is he, does he have any sincerity?

Prabhupāda: No, I don't think.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: He has no sincerity. We should not encourage him to come here.

Prabhupāda: No, no. He's after sense gratification. He requested you?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes.

Prabhupāda: What he'll do?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Well, I thought that he's a devotee and I should engage him, we should engage him here. But of course, if he's not sincere...

Prabhupāda: He's trying to get such opportunities. He's requesting so many, "Take me here, take me there."

Ātreya Ṛṣi: So I should not do it because we will have problem. We would be in anxiety here.

Prabhupāda: He came to Vṛndāvana for the purpose of devotion, but he had some other motive.

Morning Walk -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: But you cannot create such lust.

Harikeśa: Oh, yes, I create it all the time.

Prabhupāda: Then why there is no life?

Jñānagamya: If I am a lusty scientist then I can be lusty with a woman or I can be lusty with the test tubes and the chemicals. The lust is there, so why is there no artificial semina? The same lust is there. Desire for profit, adoration, distinction is there. So they are a failure.

Harikeśa: Our proposition is nothing like this, our proposition is that lust is the creation of everything.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I charge.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: So we put you in a room with a lot of lust and you create a baby.

Harikeśa: No, that will happen automatically, you just, the ingredients come together automatically.

Prabhupāda: Obstinate rascals. Not only rascal, but obstinate rascal. Their only remedy is shoe. That's all. Obstinacy. There is a story about obstinacy. Two friends were talking. One friend said, "This is cut by a scissor." So another friend says, "No, it is cut by the knife." So then there was fight. So the friend who was talking of the knife, he was strong enough. So he captured him: "You accept it is scissor, otherwise I'll throw you in the water." So other, "No, it is scissor," so he threw him in the water. So when he was dying, he was doing like this. (Prabhupāda makes a hand motion like scissor) (laughter) So he is obstinate rascal. It is as good as that garden here. Rather, here there is no disturbance of outsiders, and there there are so many disturbances. It is better. Our theory is... Not theory, fact-daiva-netreṇa. These things are arranged by superior management.

Room Conversation -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Harikeśa: They have olive oil here.

Prabhupāda: No olive oil. Vaseline will be very cheap here. And you can, if you want to engage him, if he wants to do something, that Praṇava, let him supply nim leaves, dry, from Vṛndāvana. If he actually wants some money, let him do some business. Let him collect all nim leaves and give him twenty percent profit. Suppose he collects nim, collects and dry, and then packs it and dispatch. The cost of...

Ātreya Ṛṣi: The cost of dispatching, we give him twenty percent for him.

Prabhupāda: Some arrangement he may make some profit. Honest business. Not that by cheating get something. That is not good. If he wants money, let him take.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Have you had your massage, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, I'll come back and do.

Evening Darsana -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Education you cannot give. Education means it is practical practice. But to show something, that you can attract even without film. The yatra-party can.

Guest (5): Yatra-party, sir, here again the problem is India's a vast country and for that purpose if you take the whole world as a place, how many yatra-parties can you...

Prabhupāda: No, I mean to say, that even if you attract better crowd, what will be the benefits? Unless, because unless you come to the point of practicing, there is no profit. Who will be attracted to practice Kṛṣṇa Consciousness. Nobody is... We are getting practical experience.

Yaśomatīnandana: In other words just being attracted to philosophy is not sufficient. There has to be... Let them become a devotee. (indistinct remarks)

Prabhupāda: Now just like we are attempting—not only here, everywhere—we have got nice buildings, and (indistinct) and Bombay we have constructed such big, big house so we are asking, at least those who are learned people, that if they retire, come here and practice Kṛṣṇa consciousness. No, nobody's prepared to practice. And this is a thing, without practice you cannot realize.

Guest (4): That is why sir, we don't going outside.

Evening Darsana -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because they're asses. Asses, they want... Even in Tehran, I saw the ass. This is Indian civilization. Loaded.

Indian man: With pots or something.

Prabhupāda: Right. Some tons of things. The ass does not know why he is carrying so much load. Therefore mūḍha. What for he is carrying? What is his profit? He does not know. But he's carrying so much. "I am big industrialist. I have got so much business." What for you are doing industry? That he does not know. Ass. Karmīs are described as asses. They do not know what is the interest.

Indian man (2): How does it matter what people call Kṛṣṇa, whether they call Bhagavān or Viṣṇu or what, Kṛṣṇa? If it is just only one God. We are talking removing Kṛṣṇa from Gītā but putting Bhagavān there instead of Kṛṣṇa. How does it matter?

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa said, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). "There is no more superior authority than Me."

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Gargamuni: But some of these men are workers. They're not...

Prabhupāda: No, our cloth necessities are supplied by ourselves? The cloth?

Jayapatākā: The difficulty is right now we have twenty thousand rupees worth of cloth in stock. That is all profit. We only are three thousand rupees in debt. But we have all the cloth. We have no customers.

Prabhupāda: Why?

Gargamuni: There's no customers. We have a huge stock...

Prabhupāda: You send immediately to America. They will pay.

Gargamuni: we sent a newsletter to get people to buy cloth the cloth because we have a huge stock of it.

Prabhupāda: Now, you ask Bhagavān. He is very clever. He's expert.

Jayapatākā: We are worried that now we're getting good men to join, they're doing good work, then how...

Prabhupāda: I think if you prepare according to the order of our foreign centers, then you won't be... They will all give. You can make fine cloth?

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Gargamuni: And then take out.

Prabhupāda: Yes, then do that. And we are inviting everyone. We have no distinction. Anyone can come to the park. Convince them. (continued on another tape) "Come on! Take prasādam "sumptuously." They'll be satisfied. They are hungry. Actually they are hungry, poorly paid, capitalist and worker. The trouble is, capitalists, they are taking all the profit, and they are enjoying life in wine and women. Naturally the worker will see that "Why? We are working so hard, and they are making profit, and they are enjoying, and we do not live in a very nice house. It is a slum." Naturally they will be envious. If the capitalists spend the money for Kṛṣṇa consciousness—in each and every factory they hold festivals and give them eatables like anything everything will be successful.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Gargamuni: If we invest in books... Just like this little pamphlet I printed. It cost me fifty paisa. If we sell it in one month...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: Then we will get fifty paisa profit. We will double our investment.

Prabhupāda: That was nicely... That was nicely printed. So in this way invest our books or land. We don't want to keep cash.

Jayapatākā: And if they want to keep branch or not, that is up to them. We can't give them any money. If they want to keep branch or not, that's up to them.

Prabhupāda: That should be up to them. If they keep branch we can take that. They'll go on.

Gargamuni: We will tell them frankly that for us to invest in books is more profitable because after one month we get more.

Prabhupāda: We cannot keep money and without any... They will give interest. What is that interest? And he said we have printed fifty paisa and selling hundred paisa. So that much interest they cannot give. They'll give, utmost, ten percent. Ten percent per annum—not even one percent in a month.

Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: How the books are being supplied? From Bombay?

Prabhā Viṣṇu: When we were working from Bombay, Bombay was sending them by rail. But now Gargamuni Swami, he has given us some books to supply immediately to the libraries, and then others that we can't... If we don't have enough to supply all the libraries, he's going to arrange for more to be sent. I think he wants to send a van, a vehicle around all the colleges to deliver the books.

Prabhupāda: He will make some good profit? (laughs) Never mind. If books are distributed, that is our satisfaction. Let anyone make some profit. We don't mind.

Hari-śauri: No, he wants to send one of our vehicles around. Yes?

Prabhupāda: Never mind. The books must reach there. That is my...

Prabhā Viṣṇu: One way or the other the books will get there.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's all. Doesn't matter. We are not after profit.

Prabhā Viṣṇu: Besides, any profit it goes toward the development of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So what is the total amount?

Prabhā Viṣṇu: Of standing orders? So many. Over two hundred.

Prabhupāda: Anyway, wherever you go, they take it.

Room Conversation with Endowments Commissioner of Andhra Pradesh -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:

Commissioner: They don't have people. They said, "We don't have men even for our own missions."

Prabhupāda: No. How long they can go on with false pretense? And these people, they have no idea what is spiritual life. It is a profession for collecting money. So if you... We do not like to criticize. Bharatiya Vidya Bhavan, Kanayalal Munshi, he did not believe there is life after death or he did not believe there is Kṛṣṇa, fact. This is the founder. So what is their knowledge? And Vivekananda made Nārāyaṇa daridra. So this is their manufacturing ideas. They have no sound knowledge, vacant. They are misled themselves, and they will mislead others. This is going on. But if you say that, "You are the only man?" I can say, "Yes, I am the only man" at the present moment. You believe or not believe. And why? Because I am following Kṛṣṇa's instructions. That's all. I do not touch anything. That is our process. What Kṛṣṇa has said, we say, that's all. Therefore there is little success. I don't manufacture. I have no extraordinary power or I cannot show magic or jugglery of words. But I do sincerely to present what Kṛṣṇa has said. So if you do that, you'll be successful. If you do not do that, you'll never be successful. If you manufacture idea... We must know that we are defective. Our manufacturing of idea all defective. We must take standard instructions from Kṛṣṇa. Then everything... So if you stick to this point, then we can guide you. And you'll be successful. Guidance is Kṛṣṇa. Our duty is to present Kṛṣṇa. Just like somebody has sent you money order, 1,000 rupees. I am a peon. I am not giving you the money. The money is sent by somebody. But I do not open it, adulterate it—that is my honesty. That is my honesty. So the instruction is Kṛṣṇa's. If I honestly deliver the same message to you then you are benefited, I am benefited. And as soon as I pilfer it, then it is useless. I am useless and you don't get profits, success. So if you decide to take Kṛṣṇa's instruction rightly, then we can give you very good guidance. Everywhere you'll be successful. Everything is there.

Meeting With Member of Parliament, Mr. Krishna Modi -- August 31, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: This is the important point that my books are sold daily sixty thousand dollars all over the world. I have made the Trust so all the collections should be divided fifty percent for constructing temple and fifty percent for reprinting books. So we don't take a paisa profit. So far as an author, they are selling sixty thousand dollars. And even if I would have taken ten percent royalty then it would have been six thousand dollars. Six thousand dollars means...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Hundred and eighty thousand dollars a month.

Prabhupāda: No no no. Six thousand dollars means, say ten rupees.

Krishna Modi: Sixty thousand per day.

Prabhupāda: Sixty thousand per day. Actually. But we are all foregoing it for pushing on this movement, and if we bring that money and construct big, big temple or planetarium, what is the harm to India?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda is bringing in more foreign exchange than even big business export concerns.

Prabhupāda: I'm bringing regularly not less than ten lakhs of rupees per month.

Room Conversation -- September 11, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Arrange everything. But don't turn this, and very easily give the other guest room. Then it will be awkward like anything. Very cautious. So this is the program I am giving, and if you can give some practical sense, it will be very nice profitable business.

Dhanañjaya: Yes. But it will require some capital in the beginning.

Prabhupāda: So capital required we can give. There is no scarcity of capital. But it must be consulted between three-Gopāla, Viśvambhara, and yourself. And then if capital is required, how capital you will repay. Make them assured. I shall give you. There is no difficulty. Capital you will have, provided you can make profit. Not that we give capital and never return. That will not be possible. Take any amount of capital, but we must be paid interest as bank gives loan. I can say bank will give you. If I order the bank, bank will give you. So capital there is no question. The question is how you shall utilize it. How you shall make profit. Capital, by the grace of Kṛṣṇa, you can take lakhs and lakhs. That I can arrange. The bank, if I say to the bank they will have to give you, or I shall personally give you. There is no question of capital scarcity. So only thing is how will you utilize this capital and how you will make profit. You make that program. So far capital is concerned, there is no concern. You'll get any amount of capital. And you can develop the business. Now we have got credit in the bank, any bank will give you if I say yes. There will be no scarcity of capital.

Room Conversation -- September 11, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Aligarh is maternal uncle's house. So many relatives. So Aligarh, if the Deities are manufactured there, so there is no (indistinct) Money I shall bring. (indistinct) We shall bring any amount of money provided I am sure that you will make some profit. There is no scarcity.

Indian man: Prabhupāda, I was sick last night very much.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Indian man: So I could not come to you.

Prabhupāda: Last night you did not come?

Indian man: I came to see only to have your darśana but I was in fever so much.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So capital you'll get, rest assured. Anyone will give. He will give, or I will give, the bank will give. That is (indistinct). But you must utilize it properly.

Room Conversation -- September 16, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Especially in your country. Packing is more important than the... They sent me some presentation in a huge package.

Haṁsadūta: Consequently those persons who are farmers, they become discouraged.

Prabhupāda: Now it has become a problem how to throw these packings.

Haṁsadūta: Yes, this is another problem.

Hari-śauri: Yes. Plastic they can't dispose of, glass.

Prabhupāda: Simply creating problems. Lavana haila ithe gatila jagya.(?) This modern civilization, they could not make any profit. They have created some problems, that's all. Very dangerous civilization.

Haṁsadūta: There was one writer, he wrote a book about the cities, these big modern cities. And he said that in the future the price of labor will become so enormous that to break down the old buildings in these cities which have been built to become obsolete, will be impossible. And the whole place will become swamp land by that. (end)

Room Conversation with U.N. Doctor -- September 29, 1976, Vrndavana:

Doctor: Maybe so.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the difficulty. He has come to give you instruction, yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati (BG 4.7). When you forget, there is glānir, discrepancies, in the discharge of your duties, He comes to give you instruction, but you don't accept. Now what, can be done? The teacher is giving you instruction, but you don't accept. Then how you'll be educated? This is going on. Mūḍho 'yaṁ nābhijānāti loko mām ajam avyayam (BG 7.25). They do not accept. They will write comments on Bhagavad-gītā in their own way. You see? Therefore we are presenting Bhagavad-gītā As It Is. Yes. As it is. Don't comment in your own way. You'll not get any profit. Take for example any law, government law. Can I comment in my own way?

Doctor: No.

Prabhupāda: Then why you comment on Bhagavad-gītā?

Doctor: The law is meant for obedience.

Prabhupāda: That's all. Similarly, if you accept Kṛṣṇa as the Supreme Lord then whatever He has said... Just like Arjuna says, sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye yan māṁ vadasi keśava (BG 10.14). "Whatever you are saying Keśava, I accept them in toto." That is acceptance. (end)

Room Conversation -- November 4, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Here they never satisfied. This is the modern mentality. Nobody is satisfied with his income. He wants more money. And for that purpose he can do anything rascal. I have seen it. This peon puts his bag without any responsibility. Letters are strewn and maybe some letters stolen. Who can say? And he came to earn some money. For some time he'll compose and get some labor. And in Calcutta I have seen all the office peons, they are sleeping in Dalhousie Square, the peon book as the pillow, for hours together. And when they, after distributing, when they return to the office it is going to be closed. And if they are asked explanation, "Why you are so late?" "Oh, he was not there. I had to wait three hours," and so on, so on, so on. Everyone is dishonest. Nobody is working honestly. Especially in India, because poverty-stricken. If they can sleep two hours he thinks that he has made some profit. Formerly people were God conscious. They did not like to cheat, that "God will be displeased." Now they don't believe in God, so they can do anything.

Room Conversation on Farm Management -- December 10, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Rādhikā with Her friends, they are cooking. And they cook so nicely that parama ānande kṛṣṇa korena bhojana. With great pleasure Kṛṣṇa is eating. And that we have to distribute. Not dog's food. You do not know what is the purpose of this mission. No need. Here is a good chance, don't spoil it. Produce food. Make profit, you spend for Kṛṣṇa. Train all devotees how to cook. All women. Don't distribute dog's eatable things. Kṛṣṇa prasādam.

rādhikāra pakka anna vividha byañjana
parama ānande kṛṣṇa korena bhojana

Kṛṣṇa is taking with great pleasure. That prasādam you have to distribute. Not that dog is rejecting and you have and you distribute that prasādam. Why do you think like that? This prasādam, this so-called, rubbish thing which is rejected by dog and you are offering to the human being. You do it. If you have no money I shall pay. There is no question of scarcity of money. Don't spoil money, but spend for real purpose, that's all. And you arrange for huge agricultural... Whatever is required, water, we shall arrange for that. Labor. Everything. And if you perform yajña, there will be rain. Anyway, I asked you the other day to fill up the tank. What is the difficulty?

Mahāṁśa: Which tank?

Prabhupāda: That big tank. Well, big well.

Press Conference -- December 16, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: And offer them to Kṛṣṇa and distribute prasādam.

Mahāṁśa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is our mission. We are already giving prasādam daily in the evening. There is no question of making profit.

Guest (5): So anyone can come and live here.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Guest (5): Irrespective of religion...

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Actually that is happening. Somebody has come from Germany, somebody from (indistinct), somebody Australia, somebody...

Guest (6): And even if he doesn't subscribe the śikṣā to which you want them to. Even those who don't subscribe to...

Prabhupāda: Then how he can live? If he does not live like us, then how he can live?

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Yogi Amrit Desai: You consider that as a material. Only bhakti-yoga is more... That's true.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Karma... What is the difference between the karmīs and yogis? Yogis want some siddhis, and karmīs want some material profit. Both of them are in want. They are not free from want. Is it not?

Yogi Amrit Desai: No, it depends on the yogi. My guru is a yogi, but he never demonstrated any power ever.

Prabhupāda: No, no... Yogi, he wants siddhi. Yogis... Of course, nowadays yogis, they have no siddhis.

Yogi Amrit Desai: (laughs) That's right. Even they don't have that.

Prabhupāda: They simply say, "yogi." But the real yogi means they have got siddhis, aṣṭa-siddhi: aṇimā, laghimā, mahimā, prāpti, īśitā, vaśitā. These are siddhis. Yogis, if they are real yogi, then I can put you into the room, lock it, and you can come out. That is yogi, not by simply showing some posture.

Yogi Amrit Desai: That's right. They're the real siddhis.

Prabhupāda: That is another thing to control the senses. But real yogis mean the first siddhi is aṇimā.

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Yogi Amrit Desai: I'll call them.

Prabhupāda: So Govinda dāsī, you are feeling all right? Like this atmosphere? So Caitya-guru, your program, that you are going to construct temple there? (break) Aiye (break) You must accept the standard way, then you'll get siddhi, you'll get sukha and parāṁ gati. Unless you follow the standard way, na sukhaṁ na parāṁ gatim. So if you have interest in bhakti-yoga, then you practice the bhakti-yoga properly. That will make you successful. Otherwise, teṣām asau kleśala eva śiṣyate, simply whatever labor you are doing, that is your profit and no other profit. Kleśala eva. Nānyad yathā sthūla-tuṣāvaghātinām. The example is tuṣa. Tuṣa you know? The skin of rice? Husk. Yes. So if there is paddy, if you beat it, you'll get rice. But if you beat on the husk, then...

Yogi Amrit Desai: You won't get anything.

Prabhupāda: But your gain is only that labor. So similarly, if you don't know what is the substance, you go on laboring, that laboring is your only achievement and nothing else.

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Śrama eva hi kevalam.

dharmaḥ svanuṣṭhitaḥ puṁsāṁ
viṣvaksena-kathāsu yaḥ
notpādayed yadi ratiṁ
śrama eva hi kevalam
(SB 1.2.8)

Śrama eva hi kevalam. What is the profit? (Hindi) Suar. Pigs. These are the natural examples. (Hindi) Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyed sattvam (SB 5.5.1). Just purify your existence, that tapasya. Then you'll get... Yasmād brahma-saukhyam anantam. Ramante yoginaḥ anante (CC Madhya 9.29). That is real yogic perfection. Satyānande cid-ātmani. (Hindi) So if you have taken the bhakti-yoga system, do it nicely. You'll get success very quickly. Otherwise, śrama eva hi kevalam. So why should we waste our time, simply satisfied with the labor?

Trivikrama: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (guests leave) This is Japanese?

Trivikrama: Chinese. I'm in China now.

Prabhupāda: In China proper?

Trivikrama: No, no. But that is from China proper.

Prabhupāda: So what is the news?

Trivikrama: We have distributed about 2,500 now of Chinese Bhagavad-gītā.

Room Conversation -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I'll get you some.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He mentioned that, that "My Kṛṣṇa is different imagination. My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." That is his position. He imagines. He has... (Hindi) "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa..." This is... How he can believe Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa is preaching violence, and he's trying to draw nonviolence. The people will challenge, but he makes his own commentation, his own imagination. He said, "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." This is his word. And actually... He is the student of Bhagavad-gītā and in his āśrama there is not a single picture of Kṛṣṇa. He does not believe in Kṛṣṇa. But believe or not believe, he was reading Bhagavad-gītā, had respect. That will give him some profit, there is no doubt. (break) Yeṣām anta-gataṁ pāpam. Everything is clearly said in the Bhagavad-gītā. I speak, therefore, to my disciples that "You simply repeat like parrot Bhagavad-gītā and follow by your life. Don't try to become very big scholar, do interpretation. Remain foolish and believe in Kṛṣṇa. Then life is perfect." And actually that is happening. They never tried to eschew and... What is called, the English word? Draw out some meaning. Eschew or something?

Jagadīśa: Eschew is the right word.

Room Conversation -- January 4, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes, with a stick. (chuckles) They are so submissive. The cow is going this side, "Raa-raa!"—immediately. (Jagadīśa laughs) When in Bible they say, "The animal is given to the care of man," like that... There is. This is care of, not that "Because we care of, we shall kill them." What is this interpretation? How demonic this Western civilization. "Because Jesus Christ, the God, has given the animals to our care, therefore we shall kill and eat." Anyway, try to introduce a renovation of civilization. Therefore they are trying to oppose us. Now they are conscious about the movement, that "If it is allowed to increase, then our program will be finished. And young men are taking. They are not rejecting." That is their concern. They are concerned about their business and industry. If these young men are held up in plain living, then where their industry...? Industry means to exploit the work of others and give them one dollar and make profit ten dollars. This is industry, at the cost of others some capitalist gaining huge profit. This is industry. "And let them live in a hellish condition, go to hell. Never mind. You work in the factory, and we make profit." The Communist is trying to take over the industry and get the whole profit. (laughs) That's all. The condition remains the same—hellish. But... What is called...? Complacent, he's satisfied that "I am getting the profit." All foolish. The Iran is also imitating European method of exploiting. They're bringing men from village. In India also, British period, they used to, that, but Indian people are little clever. They would come from the village to the city alone, not with family. They earn money and send to the family. And whenever they like, they go away. They're not dependent.

Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Read the purport.

Devotee: In this verse the words matir na kṛṣṇe refer to devotional service rendered to Kṛṣṇa. So-called politicians, erudite scholars and philosophers who read Bhagavad-gītā try to twist some meaning from it to suit their material purposes, but their misunderstandings of Kṛṣṇa will not yield them any profit. Because such politicians, philosophers and scholars are interested in using Bhagavad-gītā as a vehicle for adjusting things materially, for them constant thought of Kṛṣṇa, or Kṛṣṇa consciousness, is impossible (matir na kṛṣṇe). As stated in Bhagavad-gītā, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti: (BG 18.55) only through devotional service can one understand Kṛṣṇa as He is. The so-called politicians and scholars think of Kṛṣṇa as fictitious. The politician says that his Kṛṣṇa is different from the Kṛṣṇa depicted in Bhagavad-gītā. Even though he accepts Kṛṣṇa and Rāma as the Supreme, he thinks of Rāma and Kṛṣṇa as impersonal because he has no idea of service to Kṛṣṇa. Thus his only business is punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30)—chewing the chewed again and again. The aim of such politicians and academic scholars is to enjoy this material world with their bodily senses. Therefore it is clearly stated herein that those who are gṛha-vrata, whose only aim is to live comfortably with the body in the material world, cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. The two expressions gṛha-vrata and carvita-carvaṇānām indicate that a materialistic person tries to enjoy sense gratification in different bodily forms, life after life, but is still unsatisfied. In the name of personalism, this ism or that ism, such persons always remain attached to the materialistic way of life. As stated in Bhagavad-gītā:

bhogaiśvarya-prasaktānāṁ
tayāpahṛta-cetasām
vyavasāyātmikā buddhiḥ
samādhau na vidhīyate
(BG 2.44)

"In the minds of those who are too attached to sense enjoyment and material opulence, and who are bewildered by such things, the resolute determination for devotional service to the Supreme Lord does not take place." Those who are attached to material enjoyment cannot be fixed in devotional service to the Lord. They cannot understand Bhagavān, Kṛṣṇa, or His instruction, Bhagavad-gītā. Adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram: (SB 7.5.30) their path actually leads toward hellish life. As confirmed by Rsabhādeva, mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ: (SB 5.5.2) one must try to understand Kṛṣṇa by serving a devotee. The word mahat refers to a devotee.

mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha
daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ
bhajanty ananya-manaso
jñātvā bhūtādim avyayam
(BG 9.13)

"O son of Prtha, those who are not deluded, the great souls, are under the protection of the divine nature. They are fully engaged in devotional service because they know Me as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, original and inexhaustible." (BG 9.13) A mahātmā is one who is constantly engaged in devotional service, twenty-four hours a day. As explained in the following verses, unless one adheres to such a great personality, one cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. Hiranyakasipu wanted to know where Prahlāda had gotten this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Who had taught him? Prahlāda sarcastically replied, "My dear father, persons like you never understand Kṛṣṇa. One can understand Kṛṣṇa only by serving a mahat, a great soul. Those who try to adjust material conditions are said to be chewing the chewed. No one has been able to adjust material conditions, but life after life, generation after generation, people try and repeatedly fail. Unless one is properly trained by a mahat—a mahātmā, or unalloyed devotee of the Lord—there is no possibility of one's understanding Kṛṣṇa and His devotional service."

Prabhupāda: I have seen in San Francisco, what is that (indistinct)?

Devotee: (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: I think San Francisco. What is that park?

Girirāja: Golden Gate.

Room Conversation -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Nine annas. (laughs)

Dr. Patel: So my place, I bought in 1958 for fifteen rupees. Today it would take me four hundred, five hundred rupees a square yard, only within these two, three years, twenty years.

Prabhupāda: Mr. Nair told me that "I have purchased not more than twenty rupees per square yard. So I shall charge you seventy rupees. It is my profit."

Dr. Patel: Seventy rupees also you were wise as compared to the modern, present prices.

Prabhupāda: No, at that time it was selling 150. And now it is more than four hundred. Our land is, only one crore, apart from these buildings. Therefore everyone is envious.

Dr. Patel: Most envious men are... That fellow was himself burned by pouring kerosene on. He was a most envious fellow. He even once told me, "Why do you go there?"

Prabhupāda: Ācchā?

Dr. Patel: I used to treat his family. I was doctor. And I stopped treating him because he has not, he was so envious. He has got half a dozen girls in his family. I mean, where you will get...

Prabhupāda: In Kali-yuga there is no marriage. Svīkāra eva codvāhe. Agreement.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all right. There is Gurudāsa and there others.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Because there's lot of work to do, and I'm printing lot of books now, so...

Prabhupāda: No, you stay here.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Plus there's lot of income tax. The income tax is so bad, the government laws, that ISKCON cannot even sell books. Even if we sell books we are considered to be a profit-making organization. We can give books away for a donation but not sell it. They are such... Tomorrow our auditor is coming on site. He's coming with two, one income tax lawyer, who is our new lawyer now. Very nice man.

Prabhupāda: So you want to keep there? (end)

Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Shaven-headed. These Buddhist monks, they are shaven-headed.

Hari-śauri: Even in the West they shave their heads. And they look something like that.

Prabhupāda: Well, there was some income tax office pleader. So I have given the idea that "The fifty percent, that is promotion expenditure." So he accept..., "Yes, it can be done." Where is the profit? Whatever is profit is promotion expenditure. We give to ISKCON commission, or some way or other, it is spent. So he admitted, "Yes, it can be done." And last night I was suggesting, "For promotion spend." Even if we open a temple, that is promotion.

Jagadīśa: Profit means that people are putting money in their pocket and enjoying. And we don't.

Prabhupāda: But we're not. No. If we open a center, that is propaganda center. Why do you say "temple"? But this is the way of propaganda.

Jagadīśa: Opening a new branch.

Prabhupāda: Do you follow?

Rāmeśvara: Yes.

Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Do you follow?

Rāmeśvara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So it is promotion for the books. Whatever we do, it is promotion. That's all. And the main point is that it is not profitable, er profit concern, because you are not giving any royalty to the author. So where is his profit-making? Nobody's making profit—the author, the worker, everyone.

Trivikrama: That's a fact.

Prabhupāda: That's a fact. So all expenditure—promotion, that's all. The cost of paper, cost of printing, cost of promotion—finished everything. Make account like that. The income tax father will not touch it.

Hari-śauri: Everything we're doing is propaganda work, everything.

Prabhupāda: That's all. If still there is excess, give some bonus to the gṛhasthas bhaktas. They're family men. Let them have some expenditure.

Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Finished all... No account. So they admitted, both of them, "Yes, sir, that is... That can be done."

Trivikrama: You're a genius.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) And our Gopāla, he is going three times and to—"How to do it?" Do it like that. Everything spend for promotion. Bas. No money. And actually, that is the fact. Where is the profit, and who is going to take the profit? Nobody is there.

Hari-śauri: We're not opening our temples for a comfortable place to live.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Trivikrama: Sleep on the floor.

Jagadīśa: There's no sense gratification.

Prabhupāda: That I was explaining, that what is Vṛndāvana life. In Vṛndāvana life there is everything—the cowherds boy, the calves, the cows, the elderly person like Nanda Mahārāja, Yaśodāmayī, friend. What is their aim? The aim is Kṛṣṇa. The demons... (laughter) Everything is Kṛṣṇa. The demon is coming there. That is also... Center is Kṛṣṇa. And gopīs are dancing. That is also... Center is Kṛṣṇa. And Brahmā is stealing the friends and cows. That is also center Kṛṣṇa.

Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So nowhere they have mentioned my name. That is good. (laughter) Otherwise, I would have been the target. That was very dangerous.

Rāmeśvara: Sometimes... One of the general charges they make against all the different religious groups in America is that the leader is actually making a lot of profit for himself.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: Like this Reverend Moon, he lives in a very, very big house, and he has a big car. And this Guru Maharaj-ji, he has his own airplane.

Prabhupāda: Guru Maharaj-ji has got?

Rāmeśvara: He had his own airplane, which they had to sell.

Hari-śauri: That fat boy, Guru Maharaj-ji.

Prabhupāda: No, he had. So what is his position now?

Rāmeśvara: His family has called him a false guru. So there's a slip.

Prabhupāda: His mother.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: How nice he has...

Rāmeśvara: His name is Dr. Harvey Cox. He is widely known all over the world as a leading Christian theologian. He has written many books. And he said that Christianity today is synonymous with profit, material gain, accumulation, performance, material success. So it has lost or it has forgotten its original message. And it takes something as exotic as the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement from India to remind a Christian that there's another way of life, based on simplicity and truth and spirituality.

Prabhupāda: He's right. And he's a very important man.

Rāmeśvara: He has joined this society to defend us. He's now traveling different places in the United States to speak on our behalf.

Prabhupāda: He's serious gentleman. That is wanted. Kṛṣṇa will help us.

Dr. Patel: Aldous Huxley is another, he's also very...

Trivikrama: He's dead.

Room Conversation -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: For child only?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No. Those who don't have children, their expenses are low so they should get less.

Prabhupāda: They have no expenditure. What expenditure? They are getting free boarding and lodging. Maybe little. But that our ISKCON can supply. Of course, one who has got children, they require little. So manage like that, that there is no profit. That's all. Keep account in that way. So this one lakh of rupees, if you take, when you'll return?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: I'll return it by March, because on this export order, it's very high profit just on the...

Rāmeśvara: When you borrow, do you give Śrīla Prabhupāda interest on it?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We can give. I have never borrowed so far money. I haven't borrowed a penny so far except once when I came...

Prabhupāda: "That I did not pay." (laughs) When he takes money, he says, "No, it is not to be paid." Therefore it is no borrowing. Several times I have given you money.

Room Conversation -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So who will be the big ticket purchaser?

Rāmeśvara: Satsvarūpa. Oh. You mean in Los Angeles?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The Hindus.

Rāmeśvara: There are approximately eight thousand Hindus living in Los Angeles, and we have rented one auditorium that seats six thousand people. So if they only sell two thousand seats, it does not cost any money. It covers all the expenses. Anything over two thousand seats is profit for ISKCON.

Prabhupāda: So how many Indians are there?

Rāmeśvara: Altogether in Los Angeles, eight thousand. Plus Indians from San Francisco will come to this concert because she is very popular. Gopāla sent one devotee, Jagat-puruṣa, to manage the ticket selling.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he is expert.

Rāmeśvara: And we are trying to print one souvenir book also and take advertisements from local stores and shops. In this way we will also make money.

Prabhupāda: So you have to go back? (break)

Rāmeśvara: They want me to be there to make sure the concert is a success. And Satsvarūpa Mahārāja is coming for Kumbha Mela. So he's planning to stay on with you for the whole month of February and March as secretary.

Prabhupāda: Oh. And you are going to Vṛndāvana?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: He's going to Kumbha Mela first.

Arrival of BBT Manager -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Heavy tax.

Haṁsadūta: We don't pay them anything. They come to us.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We are getting advertise, publicity, paying nothing. This is our profit.

Rāmeśvara: We still have to work very hard to defeat them.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. That is necessary. You don't sleep. Never Kṛṣṇa said to Arjuna that "I am your friend. I am God. You sleep here. (laughter) I'll do everything." No! "You must fight." That is wanted. Yuddhyasva mām anusmara: (BG 8.7) "You fight and remember Me. Then I'll do everything." This is an opportunity of remembering Kṛṣṇa always—"Kṛṣṇa, save us." (break) So what are these pictures? Against us?

Rāmeśvara: Yes. This shows that if they kidnap you and they convince you to give up your belief in God, you will be very happy. You will have nice girlfriend. You will be very happy.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). This material world means this sex. That is happiness. And we are saying, "Don't enjoy this happiness like hogs." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). "This kind of happiness available in the hog's life, dog's life. Why you are anxious for this happiness?" This is our philosophy. Real happiness? Tapo divyam: just undergo some austerity for attaining Kṛṣṇa. This is our.... How they will understand it? Therefore they are thinking, "Unless there is brainwash, how this philosophy is being preached?" Just opposite. They are thinking, "This is happiness," and we are condemning, "This is happiness of the hogs." Actually that is.... Hog is also enjoying that sex without any discrimination whether it is mother or sister or daughter. That is going on. Sex must be there. It doesn't matter who is. This is the world's position, hog civilization. Why a person is condemned as hog, especially in India? He's our "suar kavaca." Why? The hog has no discrimination of sex. No animal has got, especially this hog. You'll find a study, that one side, drinking the milk, and next, plies over him. Cannot reach. Still, hog wants.... Small kiddies for sex. That sex desire is so strong from the very beginning of.... And no sense that "It is my mother."

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is Indian printed?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, I'm printing that.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Right on that, there's already a profit of more than twenty thousand rupees. So just with export...

Prabhupāda: So you can return that twenty thousand rupees I have given you for Jayapataka. (laughter) Yes.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually, we will invest that as further expansion, but if you want...

Prabhupāda: Then you should also take it as loan.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: This all, advertisement?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Certainly. It is business.

Rāmeśvara: From one pocket to another.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Not only that, if he makes bill for the paper, then he has to pay sales tax.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Also the income tax will say, "Your sales were so high," so he doesn't want the paper account to come under that. So what I'm saying, Śrīla Prabhupāda... The demand for our books is there. And like BBT Los Angeles sells a Bhāgavatam to the temples for $3.50, and we are selling it for $1.45. And that includes our profit already. Our real cost is 90 cents, 95 cents. So we can expand our printing capacity here. As I discussed with you last week, there's one machine from England that Usa Printers wants to import. And if we give him a loan... It will be his machine. He'll give us documents, and he'll pay back interest every month. In two years he'll pay back the whole money plus interest, which will be higher than what the bank gives us.

Prabhupāda: Is that all right?

Rāmeśvara: What is the bank rate?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The bank rate's about 12%. We'll do higher than the bank rate.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And we are going to order few small extras. We're going to offer a few small extras like small ribbons with plastic cover.

Rāmeśvara: Has Prabhupāda told you how much profit you should make? Because in America you have always said it should be marked up one hundred percent. If a book costs us one dollar, we should sell to the temple at two dollars. So your book is costing over one dollar, and you are only selling it for $1.45.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, no. The Bhāgavatam's costing less. The Gītās we are selling for $1.50.

Rāmeśvara: Oh.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The Bhāgavatams... Also the freight from here is less. That's another feeling that we have. Prabhupāda told me England, Australia, Africa should get books from India, and America, Canada, from America.

Prabhupāda: There is no consideration of big profit. Simply we want big number, distribution. That's all.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Because once BBT India starts making profit, then the burden on BBT America will also be lessened. BBT India can start giving money for construction and other things. I foresee that if BBT India goes on, next, in 1977 we should make a profit of at least twenty-five lakhs rupees, twenty-five to thirty lakhs.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. And open center village to village, town to town. Pṛthivīte āche yata nagarādi-grāma. (CB Antya-khaṇḍa 4.126) See first printing is very first class and it is distributed very widely. Not shabby thing. No. Just like our Godbrothers, they printed... They have no printing; still, whatever they print, all shabby.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Full of mistakes.

Prabhupāda: Full of mistakes. Full of mistakes, the get-up is not good, but they'll sell. And they print only in Bengali.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Rāmeśvara: It costs a lot of money.

Prabhupāda: Either produce food in the farm or earn money and purchase, but give prasādam.

Rāmeśvara: We saw it, that they know it was Kṛṣṇa prasāda, and they were standing up in the crowds, "Kṛṣṇa! Here!" and begging for it.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) So they have at least chanted "Kṛṣṇa." That is our profit.

Rāmeśvara: And everyone liked it. And we were giving it out for free. That they very much appreciated.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: Everyone else is taking their money, but when we give them prasāda for free, they very much appreciate it.

Prabhupāda: So do that. There is no need of accumulating money and pay income tax and botheration. Spend it. Always remain empty pocket.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Rāmeśvara: In America, say a music group becomes popular, very popular. Then automatically, every time they make their record album, one million people will buy it in the stores without any salesmen. Automatically one million. It's considered very popular.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So make records "Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa."

Rāmeśvara: And for each record our profit is $2.50. So $2.50 times one million records becomes millions of dollars.

Prabhupāda: Spend it for prasāda distribution. Don't squander it. Every cent should be utilized for Kṛṣṇa, not for sense gratification.

Rāmeśvara: Now, some of the money could be sent to India for ISKCON Food Relief.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Rāmeśvara: That would be very good.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. That will make our movement very popular in India.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: So kindly send me as much as possible. Therefore these farming projects will be very nice.

Rāmeśvara: That'll be great, if we can use the money... Do you think I should set up a separate account for the records, so that all the profit is used for food distribution?

Prabhupāda: Why not? Very good idea.

Rāmeśvara: So that will be a special means of raising money for prasāda.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Rāmeśvara: This idea will be very popular with the devotees.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. So now you can distribute...

Hari-śauri: Take prasāda... (indistinct) (break) (train stops)

Rāmeśvara: That's the British propaganda, that they came to India and made India more civilized.

Prabhupāda: This is civilization, that running, congested, hanging on.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: So we can take money for food. That is also our program.

Rāmeśvara: Well, I'm going to try to develop this record business. I think we can make a million dollars a year, profit.

Prabhupāda: And send it for our farms, and we invite, "Come here. Take prasādam."

Rāmeśvara: Oh, the farm communities. Oh, not just food relief, but also developing the farm projects.

Hari-śauri: That's food relief.

Prabhupāda: Now, my project is that we shall actually give them food, shelter and...

Rāmeśvara: Cottages, little cottages.

Prabhupāda: And cloth, whatever primary necessities and simple living, and let them chant.

Rāmeśvara: They chant and also work the fields.

Prabhupāda: So they, in the beginning, if they are not working... They'll work. We shall supply food, everything. And that... That is well beginning. In Hyderabad they are coming daily, two hundred people. And I kept with them fifty thousand rupees and told... But as soon I came, they have stopped, this, our Haṁsadūta. I do not know what is the reason. He said, "There is no money." I gave them fifty thousand rupees. He said, "There is no money." He's not good manager at all. It has been proved. He's not a good manager. Everywhere failure.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Rāmeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, could I ask one more question about the records?

Prabhupāda: Mm.

Rāmeśvara: Suppose we make a profit. Someone may enquire, "Isn't it better to use the money to distribute more books rather than giving it to the food program."

Prabhupāda: No, no, books department, that is already sufficient income.

Rāmeśvara: I would personally like to use it for the food program.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Book we are getting.

Rāmeśvara: So that's the answer then.

Prabhupāda: And we are not taking any profit. Neither the seller, neither the author is taking any profit. So there is enough money. You haven't got to pay either to the seller or to the writer, then why not spend the whole income? No profit. So we save income tax. And whatever little excess is there, (indistinct), advertise or pay some gṛhasthas some pocket expenses. In this way make it meet. No profit. By our arrangement there is no question of profit but even there is profit, we should pay the gṛhasthas some expenditure. He has... Family man there is... In this way, make always no profit. I was doing from the very beginning (indistinct), then I began to sell books. I was working, I was selling, I was collecting, I was spending, going to the printer, everything. Forcing (indistinct) I was publishing. Work nicely. If I don't force (indistinct), they'll not give me the concession rate, still I am doing. So I think this book department (indistinct) all right, you don't require to invest. But whatever income you'll get from this record business, spend it for giving prasādam. So we have got so many centers, they will feed.

Room Conversation on 1976 Book Scores -- January 16, 1977, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: So the first attempt was only 20,000. I calculated. Anyway, Kṛṣṇa is giving us all facility. Let us utilize it to the best of our capacity. We have no other ambition. We want to see that everyone may accept the Supreme Personality of Godhead and be happy. This is our mission. We have no other ambition, not to make any cost-profit. But when we see that so many people are reading Kṛṣṇa book, that gives us very good encouragement. Otherwise what...? Two capatis we can get anywhere.

Rāmeśvara: We wrote in the newsletter to the Society that even though our movement is being attacked is so many ways, the best counterattack is through book distribution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the best answer to this opposition. And when the case is there, put all the books before the judge: "Now you read and give your judgment. Don't... You are learned lordship. Please read these books and give your judgment. We have got already judgment from the scholars." Present like that. "But still, because in your court it is presented, so we pray that you give your judgment after understanding our method of brainwash." That will make him flat.

Conversation During Massage -- January 23, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: And they were supplying. They want interest money—"Never mind against our country." Therefore Hitler decided, "Kill all the Jews."

Rāmeśvara: These banks in the West, they supported Lenin. They made it possible to finance his revolution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They have got money. The Jews have got money. They want to invest and get some profit. Their only interest is how to get money, no nationalism, no religion, nothing of the sort. Therefore it is not now; long, long ago... Therefore Shakespeare wrote "Shylock, the Jew."

Hari-śauri: Yes. "Shylock."

Prabhupāda: "One pound of flesh." The Jews were criticized long, long ago.

Hari-śauri: They were hated in the Middle Ages.

Rāmeśvara: America now has this policy that they will sell their guns to both sides.

Prabhupāda: That is all right, because they are doing business. So I am shopkeeper. Anyone pays, I shall... That is good.

Room Conversation -- January 26, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Everywhere. Why you say, speak India or in England? The human intelligence is the same. There is no change. They have made like this: "East," "West" and "England," and... The psychology is the same. The ass is the same. The camel is the same. The dog is the same. We are talking of these dogs. Do you think that in Europe the dog is different from Indian dog? (laughs) They have created another problem. But we take: "You are all dogs. Either you be Indian or England or German, you are, after all, after dog. Your mentality is dog." They have created that "Indian dog is better than the English dog" or "English dog is better than German." What is better? It is dog. You are doglike and hankering after some job in America and amongst Europeans. The Indians are all doing that, the same education. Recently for a post of five hundred men there were three lakhs of applications. This is education. And you'll find uneducated Indian, still he's independent. You will find in Calcutta especially we have seen. Yes. In the morning they'll purchase a bag of potato. Say, he invests twenty rupees. Nowadays he'll sit down in a corner and make two rupees' profit. He invests twenty rupees, and he gets twenty-two. He's satisfied, poor man. Then in the, say, ten to twelve he'll purchase some dāl. He'll go home to home. He'll make another two rupees' profit. In the evening he'll take some kerosene oil, and he'll sell. Evening everyone requires kerosene oil. He'll make another two rupees. So he's illiterate. He makes six rupees' profit, five rupees' profit, and if he can, ten rupees' profit. And takes some chana cho(?), some peanuts, sit down. In this way he's independently earning five to ten rupees. And educated? He's just like dog—"Give me job"—and unemployed and eating at the cost of father or welfare activities, welfare department, and moving like dog. Just see practically. The uneducated, he's earning because he knows that "If I go with application, what education I have got? Nobody will like me." He's hopeless in that way. "So let me try in my own way." He's earning ten rupees. And the other man, he's starving and taking help from the government, eating at the cost of father. This is education.

Room Conversation -- January 26, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: All debauch. Because they're getting fat salary. What they'll do? They do not know how to use it. Wine, woman, restaurant, dance-finish. So we have got very pessimistic view of this modern world. You may like or not. Simply spoiling time. Śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). Simply work without any profit of the human form of life. And nobody is interested to correct the procedure. If we try to correct them, they will accuse us that "These people are brainwashed. They deviating these young men from the general procedure of human civilization." Hm? What is this? Illicit sex stopped? Then where is life? This is life, if young boys and young girls mix freely and have sex, and as soon as she is pregnant, you go away, let her suffer, no responsibility. The poor girl, long before, father, mother divorce—no protector. And as soon as she selects somebody husband, and as soon as pregnancy, he goes away. And old age—there is no family, no son. Ninety-nine percent the woman class live like that. How hopelessly the old ladies are sitting down—only one cat, one dog, one television. The old men also like that, hopelessness. Or drinking or seeing the television. And a dog friend. Is that life? And we want to correct it—"brainwash."

Room Conversation -- February 2, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And now they're getting two vans for book distribution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And now Gargamuni is asking to purchase this van and with that money they will purchase Indian van. That will solve the problem. Those who are coming... (break) Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī (BG 6.1). Kṛṣṇa says. Anāśritaḥ, now you are working so hard not for your benefit, personal, and that is sannyāsī. That is sannyāsī. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryam. "Oh it is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa." And he is sannyāsī. Anyone who has got this consciousness that "It is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa. I must serve Him with my life and soul and everything," he's a sannyāsī. Not the dress. So you are doing that. Now fix up. Go on doing this. Life is successful. That's all. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī. Find out this verse. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalam. It is so nice to work for Kṛṣṇa without any personal profit. This is Vṛndāvana. The gopīs, they sacrificed everything for Kṛṣṇa, their position, their honor, their prestige. So do like that. I am very glad to see when you work so hard for Kṛṣṇa. That gives me much pleasure.

Room Conversation -- February 12, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Not labor class.

Jayapatākā: Not labor class. But we need them also for translation and other things. So to make up the gap them we had to hire. But that's lessened... Now we're getting also. Some labor class are joining.

Prabhupāda: So hire. That also he can become devotee. He can spare fifty percent of his income. Then he becomes a devotee. Hiring men and working, I don't think that will be very profitable. Then we can purchase from the market.

Jayapatākā: Even a lot of men are used for making the garden. In the beginning, converting the land to garden land for flowers requires a lot of labor. Because flowers require very...

Prabhupāda: Fertile.

Jayapatākā: ...fertile and particularly fine soil that has to be dug and chopped and cleaned out.

Prabhupāda: Ordinary soil flower does not grow?

Jayapatākā: No, it... Not so well.

Room Conversation -- February 12, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Where you have?

Jayapatākā: Where... Just the place would have to be... Their place is a bit irregular. Seeing the ultimate plan, we have to find out one place. It would be in this area somewhere. Now they're keeping records of how much is spent on agriculture, and how much is received. So what is the profit or loss, that can be ascertained. And actually that's not such a threat because I know that many of the things he is doing by contract. If at some time we need outside laborer for, say, harvest time, we need to harvest—so we pay them ten rupees or twenty rupees to harvest one bighā. So there is no question of labor. That is the contract.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Jayapatākā: In so many ways we can...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Jayapatākā: ...go around that.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Room Conversation Varnasrama System Must Be Introduced -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: You'll get the path of yānti deva. You go to Mother and become a goat and be sacrificed. You cut throat of a goat now by satisfying Mother, and next life the goat will cut throat, yours. Go to mother. That's all. If you like, you can go. And if you think that is good—by worshiping Mother, "I am getting daily nice goat flesh. Why shall I go to Kṛṣṇa?" That's all right, but be prepared, that so many times you'll be also cut, your head, and this goat will get chance to cut your head. Mother is witness. Mother is for the goat and for you also. So you are cutting the throat of the goat, so why the Mother will not give the chance to the goat to cut your head? Why do you think like that, rascal? "The Mother is kind to me and unkind to the goat?" That means naṣṭa-buddhi, lost intelligence. If you think Mother, then you must think that Mother of the goat also. Why Mother will tolerate? This is justice. Actually the mantra is there, that "Goat, you are sacrificing your life. You get immediately chance of human being." That is his profit. He would have evolved himself in so many lives and then get a human life. But because he's sacrificing his life before Mother, he gets immediately an lift to become a human man. And the human, because he becomes, he has got the right to cut the throat of the man who sacrificed him. This is the mantra. So if you take this risk, do that because how to become a goat, how to become a man, that is in the hands of Mother. That is not in your hand. So Mother, if she gives lift to the goat to become a man and if she degrades you to become a goat, that is in the Mother's hand. You cannot check it.

Room Conversation -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: They have no case.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're simply creating some, you know, making propaganda against our society.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That will advertise us. Indirect profit.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. So many people now are being forced to take our side and defend us. So many, all the intelligent people of the country, they are supporting us.

Prabhupāda: That is our profit.

Brahmānanda: Initially there was a big conference of all the lawyers and they were all indirectly supporting our position. They just wanted to advertise this big controversy. They say that this controversy is the most important issue of the 1970's. Just like in the 1960's, the Vietnam War was a big issue. So it's becoming very important.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa movement. So we have got very good certification by the psychiatrist of Calcutta University. You have seen it?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't think I've seen that yet.

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: And their loaf, that is three hundred years old, (laughter) with little butter like...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually they are eating just like prisoners.

Prabhupāda: So from restaurant you have got good income there?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Approximately, I would say, between $7,500 and $10,000 a month. That is not all profit, but that is the gross income. Profit? At least more than half profit. And much milk products are used. We supply the temple and the restaurant from the farm four hundred gallons of milk per week.

Prabhupāda: You get from the farm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Every week we give to New York temple four hundred gallons milk.

Prabhupāda: And you turn into chānā?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Chānā and also milk, straight as milk. The devotees get sufficient milk, and also cheese for cooking.

Prabhupāda: Sandeśa, rasagullā.

Morning Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is everywhere. Here also.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is there some mention in the Bhāgavatam about this, that the religious men will wear only the clothes to make a profit? That people will wear religious clothing simply for making profit? Now religion is a good business. They take it like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Good business.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They exploit the sentiment.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: A man, when he thinks of his occupation, he thinks, "I can still get married and be the leader of the church. I'll get married, have a family, and this will be my profession, to be a priest."

Hari-śauri: Yes. That's what it is. It's a profession only.

Prabhupāda: Profession.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That is a respectable business for the Americans.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Restaurant and prasādam carts, and we're getting good profit from it.

Prabhupāda: We can do everywhere the same.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Here we're doing.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, here also, in India. That is very good, honest.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. And it's very spiritual. There is no contamination there.

Prabhupāda: Now in Hyderabad we have got the farm. We can produce ghee and grains and make restaurant.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Hyderabad.

Prabhupāda: City.

Evening Darsana -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So why there is war? They cannot stop war?

Acyutānanda: They start wars. (Prabhupāda chuckles) And in the chaos they make profit.

Prabhupāda: That means there are many like you.

Acyutānanda: Yes. (Prabhupāda chuckling) They're all in Canada, Mexico.

Prabhupāda: And Canada give them good shelter.

Acyutānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: People is proud to give American shelter. Is it not?

Acyutānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: What other?

Satsvarūpa: This is an article... This is not very new. I don't know where all these articles came from, but it's about our movement in Chicago. It says, "The path of Kṛṣṇa is like a sharpened razor. Whether selling incense or salvation, this band refuses to split hairs." "Uncompromising," it describes us.

Prabhupāda: That is Kali's sign. Lāvaṇyaṁ keśa-dhāraṇam. Five thousand years ago it was predicted, and now it is happening. Just see. This is śāstra. Lāvaṇyaṁ keśa-dhāraṇam. "Younger generation will think by keeping long hair they have become beautiful." It is mentioned in Bhāgavata. Dāmpatye ratim eva hi: "Marriage means sex life." As soon as there is disturbance in rati, it is divorce.

Evening Darsana -- February 26, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That he should act simply for the benefit of the guru. This is the process. He has no personal interest. He'll go by the order of guru to beg alms from different householders and... They are innocent children. They'll go, ask, "Mother, give me some alms." And the mother also knows that "My child or his child, they are all neighbors' child. They will give." And whatever collection is there, he'll bring it to guru. So he does not claim that "I have collected. It is my property." No. It is guru's property. This is the first training. He works so hard to collect, but the property belongs to the guru. Guror hitam. This is first training. And that is the meaning of karmaṇy evādhikāras te mā phaleṣu kadācana. That gentleman was quoting this. He does not know what is the meaning. He... Karmaṇy e... He is engaged to work, to collect. Just like you are doing that. You are, whole day you are working for the selling books, but you don't make a farthing even out of the profit. That is for the guror hitam, for the benefit of guru.

Room Conversation -- March 26, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Now you have got science background, book background, knowledge background—everything is there strong. Make this movement... Art also. Art, literature, science, philosophy, religion, culture, character—everything, strong background. Let everyone come. You have to try to fashion this. Nārāyaṇa-parāḥ sarve na kutaścana bibhyati. If you have got Nārāyaṇa background, then what is the cause of being afraid?

nārāyaṇa-parāḥ sarve
na kutaścana bibhyati
svargāpavarga-narakeṣv
api tulyārtha-darśinaḥ
(SB 6.17.28)

Prahlāda Mahārāja, so much obstacles by his father at home. Still, he is speaking to his father:

tat sādhu manye 'sura-varya dehināṁ
sadā samudvigna-dhiyām asad-grahāt
hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ
vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta
(SB 7.5.5)

The father was astonished that "After so much chastising, still the boy is speaking the same way. He has not changed?" Hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta. "Incorrigible. Kill him." "All right, kill me. I don't care." They have got so exalted character like Prahlāda Mahārāja, Dhruva Mahārāja, all great personalities. Apart from big, big devatās... Svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ (SB 6.3.20). We have got small boys also as good as Brahmā, more than Brahmā. Svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ prahlādaḥ kapilo manu, prahlāda. Immediately comes Prahlāda also. Amongst svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ.... janako bhīṣmo balir vaiyāsakiḥ. Read Bhāgavatam, amalaṁ purāṇam. Read yourself, let them read. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. There is no question of cheating or getting some some material profit out of this movement. We have no such thing. Material profit will automatically... My Guru Mahārāja used to say, "You are thinking of material things so. We should come and fall down at your feet, 'Why you are worrying? You go and speak the real truth.' " (Bengali:) " 'Go and speak the truth.' " No compromise. So I never had scarcity of money. He is from the very beginning.

Room Conversation -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Finished.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: He was a good soul, but he wanted a little material profit. That doesn't matter. So his father is there.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yeah, his father is actually still alive. Some day, if I get an opportunity, I will pay a visit.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He is very intelligent.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. I even asked him to join this writing of our book, to contribute some chapters, and he agreed to that.

Prabhupāda: Never mind. He has given some service. It will not go in vain. (coughing)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He had the greatest respect for Śrīla Prabhupāda. Every letter he wrote me, nothing but praise of Śrīla Prabhupāda, though he had some difficulty in getting along with some of the prabhus here. He wrote me something about those points, but he never said anything against Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: That is natural. If one gets little prominence, other becomes envious. So it is so polluted. Mātsarya. So we have to adjust. (aside:) Give me my shirt. So take care of your health and circumstances. You have to adjust things according to... (long pause) If there is difficulty, his wife and children may come to Vṛndāvana.

Room Conversation -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The most dangerous type of fear is if my next life I become an animal. That is the most dangerous. But those who have taken to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, given some service, for them there is no such fear. He gets another chance. Hmm.

Hari-śauri: (reads) Purport. "Activity in Kṛṣṇa consciousness or acting for the benefit of Kṛṣṇa without expectation of sense gratification is the highest transcendental quality of work. Even a small beginning of such activity finds no impediment, nor can that small beginning be lost at any stage. Any work begun on the material plane has to be completed. Otherwise the whole attempt becomes a failure. But any work begun in Kṛṣṇa consciousness has a permanent effect, even though not finished. The performer of such work is therefore not at a loss even if his work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness is incomplete. One percent done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness bears permanent results, so that the next beginning is from the point of two percent, whereas in the material activity, without one hundred percent success, there is no profit. Ajāmila performed his duty in some percentage of Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, but the result he enjoyed at the end was one hundred percent by the grace of the Lord. There is a nice verse in this connection in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

tyaktvā sva-dharmaṁ caraṇāmbujaṁ harer
bhajann apakvo 'tha patet tato yadi
yatra kva vābhadram abhūd amuṣya kiṁ
ko vārtha āpto 'bhajatāṁ sva-dharmataḥ
(SB 1.5.17)

If someone gives up self-gratificatory pursuits and works in Kṛṣṇa consciousness and then falls down on account of not completing his work, what loss is there on his part? And what can one gain if one performs his material activities perfectly? (SB 1.5.17) Or, as the Christians say, 'What profiteth a man if he gains the whole world yet suffers the loss of his eternal soul?' Material activities and their results end with the body, but work in Kṛṣṇa consciousness carries the person again to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, even after the loss of the body. At least one is sure to have a chance in the next life of being born again as a human being, either in the family of a great cultured brāhmaṇa or in a rich aristocratic family that will give one a further chance for elevation. That is the unique quality of work done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness."

Prabhupāda: Yes. These chances are there. Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati (BG 9.31). Find out this verse. Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati. At the time of death, if you simply offer Kṛṣṇa, He will know everything, what I have tried to do. "Now You consider my position. Send me wherever You like." Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati.

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, not...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "14) All foreign language editions of BTG will include a section of the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam."

Prabhupāda: Hm, that's nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "15) Foreign temples will receive records for approximately 75 cents, while North American temples will pay one dollars. All profits made by the BBT for records will go to ISKCON Food Relief. Prices may increase if the costs rise. 16) Harikeśa Mahārāja will take responsibility to prepare the Māyāpur brochure. 17) The BBT Trustees for each division are responsible for setting priorities in each division." That means printing priorities. "18) The US BBT will experiment with importation of books from India as soon as..."

Prabhupāda: What happened to that book, Dialectic Spiritualism?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Spiritual Dialectics?

Prabhupāda: Yes, Dialectic Spiritualism.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dialectical Spiritualism. I think Harikeśa was working on that, wasn't he, when he was here...

Prabhupāda: No, no, it is finished. It was being edited by...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, okay, well, I'll write and ask.

Prabhupāda: ...Hayagrīva. But he is doing nothing and taking money.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Where there is?

Bhakti-caru: New Delhi. (Bengali) "The instructions have been issued in this regard to Assam authorities. Mr Brahmacari is known to be close to Mr. Sanjay Gandhi." "Morarji Wants Prices. The Prime Minister, Mr. Morarji Desai, today promised in a radio broadcast to check the recent rise in prices on certain goods. 'If necessary by comparing quotas in the current stocks and even by imports, where feasible.' Mr. Desai observed that prices had declined since between February 25 and the end of March but have again increased in the last few weeks in the case of essential goods like oil seeds, cotton, edible oil, til, pulses and food grains. This has raised apprehensions in the minds of (indistinct). Some traders and some stockists have taken advantage of the shortage of certain commodities to increase prices. The form of exploitation would not be tolerated. The Prime Minister said that 'Lifting of the emergency does not mean that traders should try and make extra profits. That will hinder them in the eyes of the law, the people and government. I should like to emphasize that the ordinary law of the land is sufficient to deal with any antisocial conduct.' "

Prabhupāda: They should severe punishment. Then... We shall see.

Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Don't pay?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. My... I have told the temples that "BBT will give you as many books as you want, but once you sell, the cost must go to BBT and the profit goes to the temple." But sometimes the temples don't pay. So...

Prabhupāda: Why?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, they take it very easy, like they're doing in America also. So I wanted to stop sending them books or at least threaten them that I won't send them books.

Prabhupāda: No, if you have... Why threatening? You settle up with temples authorities.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay.

Prabhupāda: How is that, you do not...?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Like what Rāmeśvara does, Rāmeśvara Mahārāja, if temples don't pay, he says, "In all future orders you have to give cash in advance with every order."

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Chanting.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But as soon as there is restriction, that means, "Don't do it." Otherwise naturally they have got sex desire. What is the use of giving shastric injunction? That means to control him. The meat-eating... So everyone has got tendency to eat meat, but why śāstra should agree? Restriction means stop. The government's opening liquor shop—so much restriction in a heavy duty. The government charges excise duty. The liquor is produced, utmost, one rupee, eight annas, per gallon. This I know. I know. And government charges excise duty, sixty rupees. So it becomes sixty-one rupees spoiled. Then they have got to make profit. Huge profit government... They haven't got to do anything. The liquor manufacturer, he has to maintain the establishment, and everything he has to do. But when the actual liquor comes, it is there. This is the working system. The excise inspector is there. So unless the... When he takes liquor out of stock, that excise inspector shall come. He has his own key, just like bank, such custody. So in this way... And you have to pay duty first. Suppose stock is there, liquor, hundred gallons, say, thousand gallons. If you want to take ten gallons, so the excise inspector will see whether you have paid duty for hundred gallons. Then you'll be allowed to. So government, for nothing, has... They make huge profit. This is Kali-yuga government. They think that "To condone these are very common practice. Let them be drunk. Let them drink." They encourage them. And government means big ministers, secretaries. They get the profit and divide amongst themselves. So who cares for public? Similarly cloth. What is the cost of one...? One rupee per pound. But if you weigh one cloth, what is the weight? Not even one pound. And they charge twenty rupees.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Duty.

Prabhupāda: Duty, profit, so on, so on. And all these big, big millionaires, they are exacting money from the poor like that, and when they have got money, they spend little for daridra-nārāyaṇa. "Oh, very big man." And our program? Why you making daridra? Daridra? Our policy is this, that "Why should you make him daridra?" First of all make him daridra, and then take credit—"daridra-nārāyaṇa"? Just see how cheating is going on. But we are projecting this path for them: let them remain in their home, produce their own food only and cloth and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is our policy. Our policy means Kṛṣṇa's policy. Let them have sufficiently to eat, and they'll be all satisfied. If the mind is Kṛṣṇa conscious, then they don't want anything, either liquor or meat or anything. No. This is the advantage. And this is not social... What is that? That first of all drag him from the innocent life of village and engage him in the factory in the hope of getting more money, and then he's habituated to liquor. When he cannot pay, they purchase this poison and die.

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is already known, "Hare Kṛṣṇa movement."

Rāmeśvara: Every year we are selling at least fifteen to twenty million books now, books and magazines.

Prabhupāda: It will increase more. People will be inquisitive. Yes, everything there is. What is the wrong? We are talking of Kṛṣṇa, and all of a sudden I collapse. Oh, that is the greatest profit. Greatest profit. Kṛṣṇa tvadīya...

Ādi-keśava: Kṛṣṇa tvadīya-pada-paṅkaja-pañjarāntam.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Kṛṣṇa tvadīya-pada-paṅkaja-pañjarāntam adyaiva viśatu me mānasa-rāja-haṁsaḥ (MM 33), prāṇa-prayāṇa... Ordinary dying, kapha-pitta-vāyu: "Ghara ghara ghar," choking and... But in the kīrtana if we die, oh, it is so successfully... Injection, operation... Who needs it? That atmosphere death and kṛṣṇa-kīrtana death? Glorious death. Oxygen gas... (laughs) Dying and so much trouble. Never call. Please accept my request. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, bas, and let me die peacefully. Never be disturbed, call doctor—no. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Go on chanting. Chanting, hearing, chanting. You have got so much material. Read. Read something from this book. Rāmeśvara, you can read. It is your book.

Morning Conversation -- May 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Jagadīśa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Jagadīśa.

Prabhupāda: He made some profit. Actually the boat belonged to the house. Anyway, palace is palace. Very big, big rooms. Now it would have cost ten million dollars. And we have paid only three percent of ten million. Is it not? Three hundred thousand?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: Govardhana wants to have dolls on the outside grounds.

Prabhupāda: Do. Yes, very good. You do.

Rāmeśvara: 'Cause they have so much lands, so right outside the temple there'll be doll exhibits for all the tourists.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So they are doing very freely and dangerously. And this rascal is always after change, Rādhā-vallabha. He's a great rascal. (pause) Read.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Translation: Previously all the great sages rendered service unto the Personality of Godhead due to His existence above the three modes of material nature. They worshiped Him to become free from material conditions and thus derive the ultimate benefit. Whoever follows such great authorities is also eligible for liberation from the material world.

Purport: The purpose of performing religion is neither to profit by material gain nor to get the simple knowledge of discerning matter from spirit. The ultimate aim of religious performances is to release oneself from material bondage and regain the life of freedom in the transcendental world, where the Personality of Godhead is the Supreme Person. Laws of religion, therefore, are directly enacted by the Personality of Godhead, and except for the mahājanas, or the authorized agents of the Lord, no one knows the purpose of religion. There are twelve particular agents of the Lord who know the purpose of religion, and all of them render transcendental service unto Him. Persons who desire their own good may follow these mahājanas and thus attain the supreme benefit.

Prabhupāda: Read.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Next verse?

Prabhupāda: No. Yes. Here is... So this is the aim, that one should know Kṛṣṇa. And the human life is meant for that purpose. That is the distinction between animal life and human life. Therefore the next verse is yato bhaktir adhokṣaje.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Kāmasya nendriya-prītir lābho jīveta... (SB 1.2.10).

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kāmasya, sense gratification, required, but not for sense gratification's sake. It requires only for living comfortably. You try to make the economic development, that is all right. But they have taken simply for sense gratification. "I have got one car, and there must be another three cars for my children and wife." This is going on, kāma, increasing. Economic development... You require some occupational duty for earning your livelihood... That is allowed. But why more and more, more, more, more? For that, they are making scientific research how to satisfy senses. So kāmasya na indriya-prītiḥ. You require some sense gratification not for the senses, but because you have got a bad bargain, this body, just to maintain it, not more than. That is varṇāśrama-dharma. So there are so many problems we have created. They do not understand. And this civilization are simply gratifying senses, so dangerous. And dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). And they create a position by very, very hard labor, and the body is changed. Then śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8). What benefit you get? This life, you make a skyscraper building, three dozen cars, and next life, you become a dog. Then what is your profit? What do you gain? They do not gain anything. So that change of body is in nature's hand. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). That is not in your hand. When the body will change, you cannot say, "No, no, I'll not change," because that is not under your dictation. So is not simply waste of time?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. Bhāgavata says so clearly, śrama eva hi kevalam.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That's all right, but when you become a dog next life, then what is your gain? You are not going to use this airplane. You have to make a rest in this car, in this seat. What you are going to do that about? Dehāntara-prāptiḥ. Kṛṣṇa says most authoritative statement and giving the example, dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāram... (BG 2.13). So how you can check this dehāntara?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They argue that "We are getting people to live longer now than they used to live."

Prabhupāda: After all, you'll have to change. In a false platform, to live longer, is that very great profit?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, as we improve material life...

Prabhupāda: No, where is improved? You are going to be a dog, suppose. Where is your improvement?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: It's an illusion.

Prabhupāda: They lose.

Conversation: 'How to Secure Brahmacaris' -- June 24, 1977, Vrndavana:
Prabhupāda: So why they should spend, waste their time in going to school and college? From the very be... As soon as he's ten years old only, let him learn practically how to weave cloth, how to become carpenter, how become other craftsman. And in due course of time he can earn his... How to cultivate land... Why so many big, big universities for inviting everyone? There is no need. Educated means brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya. Brāhmaṇa will give real knowledge, and kṣatriyas will govern. For vaiśyas and śūdras, there is no... It is waste of time. Formerly it was done so. The vaiśyas, they have got a son, goes to a shopkeeper: "Please here let my son work with you. He doesn't want any salary." So he gets engagement. Then, by seeing, seeing, he becomes little important. And the proprietor gives him some hand expense. And then, one day, he becomes very expert. He starts his own business. That was the system. Why he should go and waste time for education? A boy is given to a carpenter. He learns very easily. A weaver, he learns very easily. A shopkeeper, grocer, he learns very easily. That is education. Why he should waste time for academic education and create unemployment? So long he's not educated, he has got enough employment. Still they take in the morning, say, half a mound of ḍāl and goes home to home: (Hindi) So by saying, after mound of ḍāl, he makes up these two, three rupees' profit. That's all. Where is unemployment?
Conversation with Bhakti-caitanya Swami-New GBC -- June 30, 1977, Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: No, we do not expect any very gorgeous help from these autocrats. That is not possible. Therefore it is...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I was wondering whether you thought that when Gopāla went to see Mr. Rajpa, perhaps Mr. Gupta could also accompany them. Do you think it would be profitable?

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. Not possible.

Trivikrama: I was also with Gopāla when we saw Mr. Rajpa in Jhansi(?).

Prabhupāda: That Surendra Kumar is going. Not to disturb them. Yes. That is our...

Bhakti-caitanya: Slowly, slowly, they will be convinced if they will see our activities.

Prabhupāda: And even they are convinced of the importance of this movement...

Bhakti-caitanya: Right.

Prabhupāda: ...still, they are politicians. You do not expect wonderful thing.

Bhakti-caitanya: No, they are always sly. Today they are (indistinct). Tomorrow they will be...

Prabhupāda: Viśvāso naiva kartavyaḥ strīṣu rāja-kuleṣu: "Never trust politicians and woman." That is the instruction of Cāṇakya.

Letter from Yugoslavia--'Books!' -- June 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: All philosophical.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "He gladly bought the Śrīmad..." (break)

Prabhupāda: ...supposed to be intelligent or scholar and does not read my books, his knowledge has no profit. That's a fact. Asampūrṇa. He remains still in darkness. That is a fact.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: His learning is imperfect.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If such a person doesn't read your books, his learning is not complete-imperfect. Asampūrṇam?

Prabhupāda: Sampūrṇam is perfect, when he completes reading my books.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Asampūrṇam means incomplete.

Prabhupāda: Imperfect.

Room Conversation with Devotees -- July 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: ...allowing permanent residence, to suffer for that, that will help us. That will help us. But if they do not do anything, then what is the use of them? What we can expect from them, profit? What we expect? Our real problem is here, that every time, our men has to go out, they kicked out, trained-up men... So if we can at least, as he has asked, submit the names, let us test what they will do. Otherwise what help you expect from them?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Only that, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: What help you expect from them? For money's concerned, we are selling our books, publication, everything. They are also profiting. We cannot expect any money from government.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: So what help we expect?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Simply some allowing our men to be there like that. Simply allowing our men to remain in the country...

Prabhupāda: That is our request for them.

Bhakti-caitanya: That is why if people appreciate us, then automatically...

Prabhupāda: They are appreciating all over the world.

Room Conversation with Vrindavan De -- July 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Today? Dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra nirmatsarāṇām (SB 1.1.2).

Prabhupāda: No, no. Munayaḥ sādhu pṛṣṭo 'haṁ bhavadbhir loka-maṅgalam, kṛṣṇa-sampraśno yenātmā suprasīdati (SB 1.2.5). Happiness is there. Unless you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, there is no question of... This is a false happiness, that "If I get money, I'll be happy." That is false. So many men, they have got money. We see practically. The whole European civilization, American civilization, is based on this fundamental idea that "Let us have money and we shall be happy." And nobody is happy. Nobody is happy, a single man. Very big, big buildings, very nice car, very nice road, but there is no question of happiness. Always restlessness. Is it not? They are practically proved. And becoming implicated, karma-bandha, loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9), one after another, one after another. Because he is not independent, he is under karma-bandhana. If you touch fire, it must burn you. You cannot avoid it. That is not possible. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sar... (BG 3.27), ahaṅkāra-vimūḍha. Are you independent? Suppose if you touch fire, are you independent that your finger will not burn? It must burn. So you'll search after so much so-called happiness—they're simply burning their finger, that's all. Karma-bandhanaḥ. Yajñārthe karmaṇo 'nyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). So I'm insisting you about this distribution of the book. That is a service. If you can do some pushing on these books some way or other, you get material profit; at the same time, it is service.

Room Conversation with Vrindavan De -- July 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. Not just a business.

Prabhupāda: No. That is not my proposal. Why shall I engage you in business, karma-bandhana? That is not. If you can give little service, that is benefit. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt. They are doing without any personal profit. You are gṛhastha. You can take some profit. That's all. But it is service. Anyone who will give some service to Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, he'll make progress. Therefore I'm trying to engage everyone in this movement some way or other. A little help, svalpam api. It is such a nice thing. With that spirit you do and live comfortably. There is no question of unnecessarily taking a life of poverty-stricken. There is no necessity. But there is no necessity of luxurious life. And luxurious will already come for devotees. That I have already example. Who can live more luxuriously than ourself? Where is that? It is practical. All over the world we are living like princes. Princes even cannot live like that. All our devotees, and what to speak of myself? Six crores of rupees one house, who can possess? How many men there are in the world who has got many houses, each six crores of rupees? Hm? Bolo.

Room Conversation about Mayapura Attack Talk with Vrindavan De -- July 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrī Hiraṇyagarbha and Śrī Sudarśana in jeweled thrones. This is making the top of the domes. On your Palace there's... The top domes have lotus petals coming under them. So over that will go the domes. This is very big. The devotees are making the whole thing themselves. This shows devotees. See, this is a form, and into this form they'll pour concrete and other things and make shapes like these lotus petals. It's all hand done. "The Hare Kṛṣṇa Movement." This is pictures of saṅkīrtana in Pittsburgh and Wheeling, West Virginia. "Iṣṭagoṣṭhi: Questions and answers discussed between His Holiness Kīrtanānanda Swami and members and guests of New Vrindaban." "Cow-Kathā." (laughter) Like kṛṣṇa-kathā, cow-kathā. "Seeking Refuge from the Kali-yuga." This is from your old Back to Godheads. I remember in the first printings in America this appeared-Nārada-Bhakti-Sūtra. This boy writes an article every week—"Deep in the Woods." He's the woodman there, wood cutter. He tells about different... He relates it to the śāstra. "Color photographs available of Rādhā-Vṛndāvana-candra." They send it in the mail, "Non-profit organization, US Postage Paid." So it goes in the mail just like this. Very nice. I think it's time for your massage, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: I'll take.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Mr. Myer: Yes. Biggest problem with him is, see, that he has some sort of a charm over people. Mainly people who go to him, they want some miracles. People who want some...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Mr. Myer: They want some quick profits. That's why they go to him. But if anybody is interested in spiritual advancement, he cannot help. Somebody wants to get a son, somebody's son is sick, he wants to get cured, such things...

Prabhupāda: Material.

Mr. Myer: All material things. He is not not able to guide people. He does some different things, but basically he's not able to take people for any spiritual advancement.

Prabhupāda: Neither he has any philosophy.

Room Conversation-Recent Mail -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, that's all right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I haven't seen what this is yet. It's from Gargamuni Mahārāja. It's "To all India GBC and temple presidents: Dear Mahārājas and Prabhus, please accept my humble obeisances. Enclosed please find our newly established Encyclopedia of Vedic Knowledge program. This is the beginning of the major big book distribution program in India. Our library party has already received tremendous success in this program, and Śrīla Prabhupāda has greatly encouraged us to sell these all over India. The profit only amounts to Rs. 10 per book, but it will allow everyone to regularly read our books and refer to it as an authentic encyclopedia. Our aim is to replace this encyclopedia against all other encyclopedias, which are meant to take the people to the hellish planets. When our representatives come to your area, please be good enough to assist them in making possible that Śrīla Prabhupāda's books be distributed to leading educational, intellectual persons all over India." Here's what he's published, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It's called "The Bhaktivedanta Book Trust Library Encyclopedia of Vedic Knowledge." I think I should read it to you, because it's got mostly words in it.

Prabhupāda: Read the covering.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's pretty much the whole thing.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Pamphlet.

Room Conversation -- July 27-28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That I want.

Yaśomatīnandana: It's fifteen minutes away from the...

Prabhupāda: We don't want any profit. We don't want any profit. You produce. You eat. You chant. Organize. Don't go outside.

Yaśomatīnandana: Don't go to the cities.

Prabhupāda: No. Be man of character. No illicit sex, no intoxication. Vaiṣṇava. Eat sufficiently, dress sufficiently. Live very comfortably. Whatever profit is there, it should be invested again for books. That's... Because we are investing money, our land... Therefore we are not profited. Beneficiary, you. It is a cooperative society. You produce your needs, live comfortably, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Our only interest is that you are taking interest in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, working. Otherwise we don't want to exploit you. That is not... If there is no sufficient, you can... We help you manage it. You manage your own affair. We give you direction. Live happily, chant. This should be... Will not they agree?

Yaśomatīnandana: Yes, they will very much agree.

Room Conversation -- July 27-28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I want to see, whatever manuscript is ready, they should be printed.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Also, Śrīla Prabhupāda, we've come out with Diwali cards this year. These are going to be very, very big. Inside is a message. We are selling hundreds of these. On this BBT will make a very big profit plus the temples will make a profit. We are selling these exclusively to our life members. And on the back is the mahā-mantra. I brought you a package with me. This is another sample.

Yaśomatīnandana: This is going to be very profitable business.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: In the shop it sells for four rupees, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Yaśomatīnandana: We'll sell it for two rupees to our men.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: One-fifty. I've sent you a newsletter to all the temples.

Yaśomatīnandana: We'll sell for two rupees.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We want bulk orders.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How much do they cost?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: The BBT cost I'll tell you later.

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much.

Room Conversation -- July 27-28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I think the Diwali greeting card dealers also will accept.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, but we are keeping it... Śrīla Prabhupāda, I studied the whole market. It is to our advantage to restrict the sale, because when we deal with dealers or distributors we have to sell them at half the price and allow them to keep their profit. But we want to make this exclusive for life members. Otherwise, if anyone can buy it in a market, it's not such a great prestige.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. You keep...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: So this we are showing, as if we are doing the life members a favor. These are just some advanced samples that are printed just to get orders. And plus, anyone who orders more than hundred cards, we will print their name and message inside. And plus, there's a mahā-mantra on the back of every... Hundred cards is the minimum order.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: A hundred's nothing. They'll all do that.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So both consulting, you can see.

Room Conversation -- July 27-28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So far the printing is concerned, there is no question. First class. Very nice.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, this is costing the BBT only...

Prabhupāda: Whatever it costs, I don't mind. You make some profit. That's all.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, and actually, all these books that I'm now printing in Hindi, I'm all printing these from the profit of this export order. Even though I have...

Prabhupāda: So you have sent the export books?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I shipped 26,000 books this month. That's why I got delayed. We shipped 21,000 books to Australia and 11,000 to England.

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā is...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: They've all gone. Plus, we shipped a big order to Africa, to Fiji...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Africa said they never got theirs.

Room Conversations Bangladesh Preaching/Prabhavisnu Articles by Hamsaduta -- August 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Invest again!

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They may want him to continue bringing foreign exchange in. That's the point I'm making.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So to continue sending...

Prabhupāda: Make more capital by making profit out of.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But they may want him to continue sending foreign money in, not just...

Prabhupāda: Yes! Beginning will be foreign money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But they may want him to continue indef...

Prabhupāda: Yes. If required, we shall send.

Prabhaviṣṇu: Yes, they want that. They want that. When they see foreigner, they just think how they can make some profit from them.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Foreign exchange.

Prabhaviṣṇu: Our lawyer told us that you can do anything in Bangladesh if you have money. You can accomplish anything.

Room Conversation With Madhudvisa and others -- August 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Beautiful.

Śrutakīrti: There's a little science. They dip in all different color wax.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It actually costs two dollars to make, though.

Śrutakīrti: The wax. The wax is about two dollars' worth of wax. So it's very profitable. Especially in Hawaii and Waikiki it will be very lucrative business.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How much you can make in one day, profit?

Śrutakīrti: Last year in Toronto they made seventy thousand dollars in two months, profit, during the Christmas season.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Where is the scarcity of money? (laughter)

Śrutakīrti: Also it is a very excellent business for householders in our movement.

Prabhupāda: You American boys, you know how to earn money. Now you have learned how to spend it for Kṛṣṇa. It is wonderful.

Room Conversation -- October 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Govinda.

Prabhupāda: So you make good profit.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: It's your mercy, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (Prabhupāda chuckles) They respect you a lot in Tehran. The royalty respects you. The businessmen respect you. They really respect Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Persian civilization, very high, Aryan civilization.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: There was this Persian boy who was translating Bhagavad-gītā. He had come with me last month to Vṛndāvana to have your darśana. Then you had gone to London.

Prabhupāda: Anyway, things are going nice-slow but sure. You have got this Persian civilization and he has got the African civilization. (laughter) Black and white.

Room Conversation -- October 12, 1977, Vrndavana:

Jayapatākā: In Bengal, because the people are so poor, so there we are giving the book and just taking five or ten percent profit margin...

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Jayapatākā: ...for the small books, for propaganda purpose, so that we can reach many people.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Whatever propaganda require you spend, but print books and distribute. Whatever English book we have got, if we translate into Bengali, we have got enough stock.

Jayapatākā: Yes. We have a treasure house.

Prabhupāda: In this way, in all languages, distribute. Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Jayapatākā: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Regarding this loan, you were to make twelve percent out of it. Right? You were going to make twelve thousand rupees' profit.

Vrindavan De: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On the investment.

Vrindavan De: One lakh.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But you're not making one lakh profit.

Vrindavan De: No. Profit is twelve thousand, yes, twelve to fifteen thousand.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But now by these postal receipts, you're making 27,000, apart from your brother's amount. Yours, your mother's and your sister's will give you 27,000.

Vrindavan De: No. I want that loan for the time being. I shall pay it back.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But that loan... You have to understand something. The Society cannot loan...

Prabhupāda: All the money he can take, loan.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because, Śrīla Prabhupāda, our Society cannot loan money for a business like this. This is not our Society's business at all. You're not... Of the one lakh of rupees' worth of books, only six thousand rupees is from ISKCON's books. So how can we loan one lakh of rupees? We can't start loaning money for these kind of businesses. It's against the Society's memorandum and rules that money can be given to individuals for their personal businesses. This is a charitable society. It's bounded by the Society's charity laws. So, Prabhupāda, whatever money he has, he has got as a binamida of the Society. He may donate the money in the sense of giving a stipend to family members. That's different. But as far as giving loans for business purposes to an individual private business... I mean we would lose our charitable status, because the accounts are audited every year. So it will look very... In fact, if we do that, then they may raise objection to the stipend also. Now they can't raise objection, because it's given as a stipend to the family, former family of this ācārya. They won't say anything. But if we start taking Society money and loaning it to a private business, which is the way they'll see it, then they'll raise objection. Furthermore, then we'll have to charge interest, and if we charge interest, that gets us into a lot of trouble also. As a Society, we're not supposed to be doing business, profit-making business.

Prabhupāda: So when the certificates matures, what is the amount?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The amount, I believe, is about 43,200 rupees.

Prabhupāda: So this much can be given to him. You can...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: That amount can be given to him, and he may pay back the loan.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So this much you can do.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I fully agree. And I have no objection to giving one lakh. But I'm speaking from a legal point of view. It will injure us, and I don't want to be injured.

Vrindavan De: No, I can spare some little amount of interest. I can pay.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's more jeopardizing. We can't charge interest. We cannot make profit on money loaned out, as a society. It goes against the laws of India. That's the whole point. Even if we gave it in any way, it's jeopardizing.

Vrindavan De: But you can put it easily on donation account, that charge interest.

Prabhupāda: No, Overseas Bank they can give.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Overseas Bank, they can give?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On what basis?

Prabhupāda: Against their money. (break) You are depositing some money with the...

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We met. Svarūpa Dāmodara and I spent an hour at Bhagatji's house. Bhagatji brought him. So he's going to do that Trust. He says in three or four days time he can finish it, Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust, with the aims and objects we have given. Then I talked about that squandering amendment. So he explained that the best way to do it is that we amend it to say that they always get 250 rupees for their maintenance, and the other 750 rupees, instead of fixing it in their names, fix it in the name of ISKCON, and ISKCON executors of the will shall see that they give them the money at the time of seven years for the purposes of three: purchasing property, business, and for buying government stocks. And the profits from those, they can do anything they want with. He said don't let them put the 750 rupees in their name, because then they can do anything they want with it, squander it. But if you put the money in fixed deposit in ISKCON's name, then ISKCON can give them the money after seven years, for those three purposes. So if you approve, then he can make an amendment clause, and then you can sign it, and then it can be done. He understood everything very perfectly. He said actually... He understood it perfectly. Actually, because everything belongs to ISKCON, the whole will is more or less a moral, spiritual guidance, because legally everything is already ISKCON's. So I said, "But we want it to be morally and guided spiritually. To us, this is the will. Whatever this will says, we must follow as Prabhupāda's disciples." He said, "Then I can make an amendment, which would be like that, that every month they'll get 250 rupees for their whole lifetime, and the 750 rupees will be put in fixed deposit for seven years in the name of ISKCON, and at the end of that, the ISKCON executors of the will, will give them each the money each month, fifteen hundred rupees, for the purpose of..., in those three ways, and that the money should not be squandered." He said that way, if ISKCON sees that the money is being squandered, then they stop giving them that money and they'll just give 250 rupees. Two hundred fifty rupees they must get. And Radharani De, she may get always one thousand rupees. She is older. Let her have that. Whatever she does is her business with the money. And, I think, it is a very good way. And we'll all make sure that they get the money, but they must use it properly. It's Kṛṣṇa's money.

Prabhupāda: And they'll remain in that house lifetime.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So about that traveling?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Travel exp... I talked to him, and I explained to him that he's taken ten thousand rupees for traveling expenses and twenty-five thousand rupees books, thirty-five thousand rupees, and he's paid six thousand rupees in two years. I said, "This is not good business." So he said, "Then stop the traveling money." I said, "I'll stop it temporarily. You start paying some money. Then again we can give you the money." I said, "We want to give you the money, but do some business first." So he said, "All right." No, he's pretty pleased to get this big amount now for making this contract. This is a big amount that he got, half a lakh nearly. From this, he can make more profit, and then he'll pay it back by April, and then we'll give him nine thousand rupees free donation. Each of them gets nine thousand rupees as per your original scheme. So they are being looked to nicely. Actually there's no difficulty. They have very few expenses.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda? (kavirāja chants viṣṇu-mantra) (Bengali) (Prabhupāda drinks something) Śrīla Prabhupāda? (Hindi—Prabhupāda, Bhakti-caru, and kavirāja) (break)

Prabhupāda: I think whatever money you give Vrindavan for business, he'll spoil. He has already spoiled. They are getting, altogether, about two thousand rupees even without any business—his mother, one thousand, and they four, 250 each. So let them chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and eat and sleep. That's all. He has already spoiled.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Tamāla Kṛṣṇa?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Well, the point is that we have not built these temples for profit-making basis. We have built these temples to demonstrate to the world an ideal, perfect Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So if we are going to allow these people to come here, that means we're compromising. Then we should have gone into business...

Prabhupāda: Just like to take advertisement in the magazine. Eh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. It's the same thing. We're trying to make something ideal. We don't care if anybody does join or doesn't join, but our business is to show the perfect ideal.

Prabhupāda: Jayādvaita?

Jayādvaita: I agree. This...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Just like our Back to Godhead magazine.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. To be popular and profitable, they're approaching it on a very businesslike basis. And also the other point is that they're afraid that... In Bombay they've made this hall, such a beautiful hall. So they don't want it to lie vacant or empty, and they just can't think of what can be done inside that hall every single day of the year. It's a fact that hall should be used every day of the year.

Bhavānanda: By us.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: By us. But since they feel that there's not going to be any constant use from our side, they're thinking that it doesn't make sense to have built and spent so much money on such a good hall and not utilize it daily, which from the business point of view is a fact. But that means that you're going to have to invite all kinds of semi... It's not even Kṛṣṇa conscious. I wanted to say semi-Kṛṣṇa conscious, but they're going to have to invite different theater people, entertaining people.

Bhavānanda: So the Kṛṣṇa conscious solution is to utilize the hall every night for our own purposes. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is unlimited. There's so many dramas, so many lectures, so many symposiums.

Prabhupāda: No, suppose you construct some house and rent out. Then they can do as they like. So similarly, if that hall is made, constructed for making some money, then the money will not come if we don't rent out to the cinema actors, actresses. It is just like... What is called? Village house. Hm? The hall is called? When one pays, marriage ceremony... For making some money you have made.

Page Title:Profit (Conversations 1976 - 1977)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:08 of Mar, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=148, Let=0
No. of Quotes:148