Prefer (Conversations)

Expressions researched:
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1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Prabhupāda: Difficulty is that... If the women get married, then there is no difficulty.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. But if they don't get married. When they are offered... Here is a woman. She was offered and... You see? It was suggested that she get married and because of her body she said no. She thinks she is, you know, she... That's the only reason she could say no, because material reason. Not spiritual reason. She said no because of her preference, material preference.

Prabhupāda: Of course, so long we have got this material body, some material consideration must be there. (chuckles) That is not possible to avoid completely.

Devotee (1): They shouldn't force her to get married, though. That was kind of a bad choice that they gave her, "Either get married or don't come on saṅkīrtana." You can't force somebody.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, that wasn't the situation. It was not that choice.

Devotee (1): What? You can't... I mean to say that you can't force somebody to get married. You know. That isn't proper.

Prabhupāda: There was no force. There was no force. Only proposal. That's all. When it was proposed before me, I also said, "It depends on the choice." So anyway, go on with your work, saṅkīrtana movement you have started. It is very nice. And it is being responded. So increase it. If simply brahmacārīs can do it, that is best.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Prabhupāda: There was no force. There was no force. Only proposal. That's all. When it was proposed before me, I also said, "It depends on the choice." So anyway, go on with your work, saṅkīrtana movement you have started. It is very nice. And it is being responded. So increase it. If simply brahmacārīs can do it, that is best.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We would all like it that way. We would prefer it that way.

Prabhupāda: Or married couple. If some girls want to go, then she may marry somebody. That will be nice. Of course, in your country there is no such restriction if unmarried girls go with you. But if she is married, that is better. So you make your choice in that way. So she is going? This girl?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīmatī?

Prabhupāda: Śrīmatī?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. She wishes to go. I asked her, I told her, "So you have to get married." And she just said, "Oh, I have been married. I just want to marry Kṛṣṇa now."

Prabhupāda: (laughs) That's nice. That is very nice. Yes. If one gets Kṛṣṇa actually, he or she forgets everything. That is sure. Yaṁ labdhvā cāparaṁ lābhaṁ nādhikaṁ manyate tataḥ. After getting Kṛṣṇa, nobody wants to get anything more. He is full. Svamin krtartho 'smi. "My dear Lord, I am now fully satisfied." That is the preaching we are making, that everyone is trying to love something. Either personally his body, senses, or then expanded; wife, children; then family, community, society, and country, humanity; extending. But there is no, I mean to say, satisfaction. Because the real lovable object is Kṛṣṇa. And when he goes to Kṛṣṇa, then, oh, svamin krtartho 'smi. The same example: just like you are feeling hunger. Now, somebody told you, "Give food." So you are trying to put food in the nose, in the ear, in the mouth, in the anus(?), in this and that. No satisfaction. You give it here, oh, fully satisfied. We do not know where to put our love. That we are teaching, best spot. Most valuable conclusion.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 27, 1969, Boston:

Haṁsadūta: Typing?

Prabhupāda: Yes. She is good typist.

Haṁsadūta: We have one boy in Montreal. He says that he wants to go to Florida the first of May. His father is a real estate man. So he wants to get a job and then get a temple, and he wants someone to come there. He said me preferably.

Prabhupāda: All right. This South, North Carolina, they are also doing... (laughs)

Haṁsadūta: He wants to go to Palm Beach. Palm Beach is the richest place in the country.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. That's all right. So chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and everything will be all right. And Buffalo is also doing nice. Oh, yes. The students are educated circle. They are taking interest, both the boys and girls. And three meetings I attended. Every meeting was full, two hundred boys and girls. They were dancing, chanting, asking very intelligent questions. And Rūpānuga is holding class. There will be some examination of the students. They accept papers. Yes. Some Indians are coming from long distance. One Indian gentleman, he came to see me from, what is that place? Ninety-two miles away from Buffalo.

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Hayagrīva: Well, what do you want to do, Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja? You have no preference at all.

Kīrtanānanda: No.

Hayagrīva: He says he has no preference at all.

Prabhupāda: So... But you require his assistance also.

Hayagrīva: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So I think... Then the difficulty is that you say that whatever you decide, he says no?

Hayagrīva: If I don't want this tree to be cut down and he says, "Cut down the tree," does the tree get cut down? That's what I want to know. I say, "I want this tree to stay here." He says, "We want to burn it for firewood." Now does the tree stay or does it go?

Prabhupāda: Well, if... This deposition is very difficult to solve. (laughing) You want to stay, and he wants to burn it. (laughing)

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Yoko Ono: Well, if Hare Kṛṣṇa is the best one, what is the reason why we have to bother to even say anything else other than this one?

Prabhupāda: You don't require to bother to say anything else. We say that Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra is sufficient for one's perfection.

George Harrison: Surely isn't it like flowers? If somebody may prefer roses and somebody may like carnations better... Isn't it really a matter for the devotee, that one person may find Hare Kṛṣṇa is more beneficial to his spiritual progress, and yet somebody else, some other mantra may be more beneficial? Isn't it like just a matter of taste? Like judging a flower. They're all flowers, but some people may like one better than the other.

Prabhupāda: But still, there is distinction. The rose flower is considered better than simply a flower without any flavor.

Yoko Ono: In that case I can't...

Prabhupāda: Just try to understand this flower example.

Yoko Ono: Yes.

Prabhupāda: It is all right. You are attracted by some flower, I am attracted by some flower, but amongst the flowers there are distinctions. There are many flowers which has no flavor and many flower has flavor.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna Mission, if I say it frankly, they distorted the Bhagavad-gītā to the greatest extent. Because they presented somebody, Ramakrishna, as God. Ramakrishna said that "I am the same Kṛṣṇa, I am the same Rāma," and they accepted it. But one thing is, anybody can say that "I am the same Rāma, I am the same Kṛṣṇa." First of all we have to see the proof. So many, there are many ways of to understand. So Ramakrishna Mission is pushing on this wrong idea. And another thing is that, supposing this Ramakrishna is the same Kṛṣṇa, then the philosophy is different. Ramakrishna's philosophy and Bhagavad-gītā's philosophy is different, because Ramakrishna says that you can accept any method, every method is all right. But Kṛṣṇa says only unto Him, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇam (BG 18.66). "Give up everything, simply surrender unto Me." Now Kṛṣṇa says one: "Simply surrender unto Me," and Ramakrishna says that we can accept anywhere. So which one we shall accept? Kṛṣṇa's or Ramakrishna's? What is your opinion? If something is spoken by Kṛṣṇa and something is spoken by Ramakrishna, so which one we shall prefer to accept?

Mohsin Hassan: Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation with Dr. Weir of the Mensa Society -- September 5, 1971, London:

Śyāmasundara: Inherently you'll find the rose is better than the daisy.

Dr. Weir: No. Some people might prefer the daisy.

Śyāmasundara: But the qualities are there, inherent in the rose, which are preferable to those of the daisy.

Dr. Weir: Why? Tell me why. I mean, you haven't given me any reason for saying it is better.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Śyāmasundara: The rose has nice scent. It appears...

Prabhupāda: ...beautiful.

Śyāmasundara: ...beautiful.

Mensa Member: (indistinct) be subjective (indistinct)

Dr. Weir: And you see, a lot of people would like a red rose because that has a symbolism to it. Why have a yellow rose? It must have a sort of subjective reaction. It has nothing to do with the fact that it's got a chromatic wave length.

Prabhupāda: So there is a cause. That means there is a cause. We have to accept the cause. So that cause, we go further till we find out the cause of all causes.

Interview with Reporters -- November 10, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa says, cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ: (BG 4.13) "These four varṇas—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra—it is created by Me." But you are trying to kill it. Why? If you try to kill Kṛṣṇa's program, then how you will be happy?

Reporter: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Huh? There is no question of preference. Kṛṣṇa's creation, it is there. You are creating (indistinct) caste, jana-saṅgaś caste. Caste is already given, in a different name. How you can make casteless? That is not possible. The whole world—"I am American," "I am Indian"—this is caste, bigger caste. Yasyātma-buddhi-kuṇa. So long you will be under the concept of this body, there must be caste division. So we have to come to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then there will be no caste. Just like these boys, Americans, Europeans, Africans, Canadians, they have no caste, they have no nationality. They are simply for Kṛṣṇa. That is casteless.

Reporter: So are they brāhmaṇas?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Reporter: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa conscious means brāhmaṇa. Brahma jānātīti brāhmaṇaḥ.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, in full.

Bob: ...taste for different things?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Bob: Does he keep his individual likes and dislikes?

Prabhupāda: Yes, everything he keeps, but he gives preference to Kṛṣṇa. Suppose I like this thing. Kṛṣṇa says, "No. You cannot use it." Then they are sacrificed. It is for Kṛṣṇa's sake. Nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe.

Bob: Let us say a devotee has a liking for one food over another food.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But if Kṛṣṇa does not like it, he won't take.

Bob: And how does he know which food Kṛṣṇa likes him to take?

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the śāstra. You have to know from Kṛṣṇa. When you... Just like, what kind of behavior government likes, how do you know it? From the lawbooks. Is it not? Similarly, what Kṛṣṇa likes and not likes, you get from the śāstra. You cannot manufacture the like and disliking of Kṛṣṇa. That is nonsense. Kṛṣṇa says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). He says definitely. Positively He says, that "I like these things." So we have to offer to Kṛṣṇa what He likes, and then we take prasādam. Kṛṣṇa likes Rādhārāṇī. Therefore all the gopīs, they're trying to push Rādhārāṇī to Kṛṣṇa. Nikuñja-yūno rati-keli-siddhyai yā yālibhir yuktir apekṣaṇīyā **. That is expert. "Oh, Kṛṣṇa likes this gopī. All right, push her." That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. To satisfy the senses of Kṛṣṇa. Not satisfy my senses. That is bhakti. That is called prema, love for Kṛṣṇa. "Oh, Kṛṣṇa likes this. I must give Him this."

Room Conversation -- April 20, 1972, Tokyo:

Trivikrama: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Ten thousand was transferred from my account. So that has been replaced or not?

Karandhara: I have it. I didn't put it in the account because I thought you wanted me to send it to Māyāpur. But I haven't sent it yet. I still have it in another account.

Śyāmasundara: You just informed Tamāla that from now on we would send only books, that we would prefer to send books from this side and let them sell them.

Prabhupāda: No. The thing is that you were collecting something for Māyāpur account?

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So how much it has come?

Karandhara: Thirty thousand.

Prabhupāda: Thirty thousand.

Śyāmasundara: Separate from books?

Karandhara: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: That's separate from books.

Prabhupāda: So this ten thousand was given from my account. So this has to be replaced. And then, whatever you have got for Māyāpur account, that is to be transferred. That was a trial business. So we took from bank ten thousand worth. So that is done. Now you transfer the ten thousand to my account, and balance you keep ready for transferring. That also I will advise you how to do. Besides that, out of the 33,000, you deposited eighteen thousand?

Room Conversation -- October 25, 1972, Vrndavana:

Devotee (1): He's the king there, right? The queen's husband.

Prabhupāda: He was to be the king, but he rejected for that one common girl. So the ministry asked him that "You have to give up this girl or you have to give up your throne." So he preferred to give up his throne. And the present queen's father, his second brother, he was made king, King George VI. Otherwise, this Duke of Windsor... When he refused to become the king, he became the Duke of Windsor and he was given this Berkshire Palace.

Gurudāsa: He also is the one who has the Windsor Palace?

Prabhupāda: No, Windsor Palace is the queen's. That is some seasonal residence. This Buckingham Palace is office. Actually for residential palace, the Windsor Palace. Windsor Palace?

Gurudāsa: Windsor, yes.

Prabhupāda: That Palace we see in passing.

Gurudāsa: Yes, large palace.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 28, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: What is your age now?

Guest (1): Seventy-two. I like the ship, so old man prefers cheaper trip than air, (indistinct) so I take air from Indonesia (indistinct) only and take ship to Alexandria. (indistinct) From Alexandria to Morocco I take (indistinct) bus, big bus like Union Pacific before from east side the west side America, we take big bus (indistinct) four days only I arrive at (indistinct) Morocco. And maybe I cross to Andalusia, Spain, not near Madrid, Castillian (indistinct) again take ship from (indistinct) railway from Manchester to (indistinct) So still seven years I loitering. And this only to see old friend in Edinburgh, and I see old, old man (indistinct) I am also old man, not so long time, within one year I down, I never been South America, only up to Mexico so I go to (indistinct). And stay, I contracted only one contract three years but I want to work, job, one year, highest salary there so and finish I go to Argentina from Santiago Chile I take the ship again to, Sydney, my younger brother, Sydney and go back from (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: In Sydney also we have got temple.

Guest (1): (indistinct) Where?

Devotee: I can show you.

Prabhupāda: Australia's, find Australia's...

Guest (1): Australia, never. Only my younger brother....

Prabhupāda: Australia, Sydney.

Morning Walk -- May 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Everything, logy means science. So theology is also science. Why they reject theology "Yes, you are talking..." What kind of scientist you are? It is a "logy," it is a science. Why you are giving preference to one "logy" to another? What kind of scientist you are? Even though I am talking of theology, why should you reject it? In Vedic knowledge, "logy" is the basic... Nyāya-prasthāna, śruti-prasthāna, smṛti-prasthāna. These are the three ways of understanding the Absolute Truth.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Logic and argument?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Nyāya-pra... Just like Vedānta-sūtra, it is logic and argument to approach the Absolute Truth. Athāto brahma jijñāsā: "Now it is the time for inquiring about Brahman." This is logic. Because other animals, they cannot inquire about the Absolute Truth, but human being can, therefore the first proposition is, atha ataḥ, "Now because you have got human form of life, therefore you should now inquire about the Absolute Truth." This is the beginning. It is logic. And actually we feel, "Who has created the ocean? Who has created the stars? How it is floating? Whether there are human beings?" So many questions. That should be solved now. And actually they are doing, the scientists. Scientists means they are also trying to solve so many problems. So that is, human being can be scientist. Not a dog can be scientist. So why not become the supreme scientist to know the Absolute Truth. That is Vedānta-sūtra. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Now you propose that "Why don't you accept that life begins from life?" What is their objection? This is also theory, and why not accept this theory? And now let us compare, which theory is feasible. Why you are afraid?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They are silent.

Morning Walk -- May 4, 1973, Los Angeles:

Devotee: The brick-layers get a hundred dollars a day.

Prabhupāda: Just see. So why don't you become a brick layer instead of scientist? (laughter) You get more money. Dr. Bose, he called me... I told you. He asked me, "What you are doing?" "Now, I am going to the share market." So he immediately said, "Then what is the value of your education if you are going to the share market like the Marwaris who are illiterate?" Share market means to have some tricks how to sell and purchase shares. That by practicing anyone can do. It is not very difficult. (break) ... life from life. Make vigorous propaganda. Let them come to argument, scientific discussion. (pause) The man and woman in your country, they have got equal rights. Why not here? (laughter) In the lavatory? Why this discrimination, "woman," "man," why? Equal rights, must be equal rights. (pause) What is the basic philosophy for contraceptive action? Why do they prefer contraceptive method?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Their point being to reduce the population, not to increase.

Prabhupāda: But population is reducing, it is increasing. You take the statistics, the world population is increasing, it is not decreasing.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Guest (8): Traitors. And what about the Vidura? Why he went away?

Prabhupāda: Vidura was neutral. He left home when he understood that "Fighting is now inevitable. They'll fight. Why shall I remain here?" He left home. And Kṛṣṇa also said that "I will not fight. I'll not fight because this is family quarrel. I am known to every one of you. We are related. So I cannot take this side or that side. I may be..." He divided... He, by tricks... His soldiers one side, and He Himself one side. So Duryodhana preferred, Duryodhana preferred His soldiers, that "Why shall I take this one man. I'll take His soldiers." And Arjuna said, "No, I want Kṛṣṇa." So Kṛṣṇa said, "Although I'm going to your side, but I'll not fight. Mind that." And, "Never mind, You don't fight." Mahābhārata is very nice. "Greater India." Mahābhārata means "The History of Greater India." Mahābhārata. Mahā means "greater."

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So about the next life, change of body, you can prepare yourself. Yānti deva-vratā devān. If you prepare your life to go to the higher planetary system, the Moon planet, the Venus planet, and other... There are thousands and millions of planets. You can go. Yānti deva-vratā devān... It is clearly stated. Yānti deva-vratā devān pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ. "You can go to the Pitṛloka planets." Or bhūtejyā yānti bhūtāni. "If you want to remain here, you can remain." Mad-yājino 'pi yānti mām. "And if you like, you can come to Me." Everything is there. So next life there is. I'll have to accept a body, and there are eight million... (break) ...you prefer. But Kṛṣṇa says that whichever body we accept, it is subjected to the four miserable conditions: birth, death, old age and disease. Even Brahmā. He has got millions and millions of years duration of life, but still, he has to die. So anywhere in the material world, you have to undergo the material tribulations: birth, death, old age and disease. Here an ant's life may be for few hours, and my life may be for few years. So it is a question of hours and years, but one has to die. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, ābrahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ punar āvartino 'rjuna (BG 8.16). "Even if you go to the Brahmaloka, the topmost planet, there also, you'll have to die and again accept another body." This will go on. Mad-dhāma gatvā punar janma na vidyate. "But if you come to Me, then you don't come back to accept a material body again." So why not try for that? If I have to endeavor for my next better life, so why not accept the supermost life, eternal life? That is intelligence, and that is our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, that you try in this life to get back your spiritual life and come back to Kṛṣṇa, the eternal home, and live there peacefully, eternally, without any disturbance of birth, death, old age, disease. This is our program. (Sound of guests coming or leaving) Jaya.

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: But he loved Nārāyaṇa, Catur-bhuja.

Revatīnandana: Yes, that was his constitutional position. That's all right.

Prabhupāda: Just like sometimes mādhurya-rasa is the greatest humor...

Revatīnandana: Who?

Prabhupāda: Mādhurya-rasa, conjugal love. But still, there are devotees who prefer parental love, friendly love. That is liking. Everyone has got his own liking. But they are all the same, all the same. There is no difference between Kṛṣṇa devotee and Nārāyaṇa devotee. They are all the... But it is their liking, varieties of liking.

Revatīnandana: Another related question that also arose... These come in Bhāgavata class with the devotees because they think about the questions and sometimes they come up with nice ones. When Kṛṣṇa is incarnating in His plenary incarnations like Varāha, Nṛsiṁha, like that...

Prabhupāda: That is in this material world.

Revatīnandana: Yes. And sometimes devotees become devoted to those forms. Are there corresponding planets in Vaikuṇṭha for those forms of incarnation? Is there a planet of Nṛsiṁha or Nṛsiṁha-loka in the Vaikuṇṭha sphere?

Prabhupāda: So far (I) know, those planets are here within this material world.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So what is your philosophy? That you can take any life?

Jesuit Priest: But you said, "Thou shall not kill."

Prabhupāda: No, no. Yes. "Thou shall not kill." That's all right.

Jesuit Priest: But you kill the potato.

Prabhupāda: Now, suppose there is potato and there is your child. So would you like to kill your child in preference of potato?

Mother: No, no.

Jesuit Priest: You've not answered my question.

Prabhupāda: Why this discrimination?

Jesuit Priest: Why you've not answered my question?

Prabhupāda: Yes, I am answering you, that you are to kill, but you have to discriminate what kind of killing you shall do.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yogeśvara: In order to achieve our goals, do we intend doing like the Christians tried to do, making everyone convert to their side. Is that what we want to do, make everyone convert to Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why not? If Kṛṣṇa consciousness is good, why everyone should not take to it?

Yogeśvara: Ah. This is an important question. He says seeing the world as it is today, what is the most preferable social organization from the Kṛṣṇa conscious point of view?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Yogeśvara: How should society be organized in order to achieve these goals?

Prabhupāda: Yes. You organize that there should be division of different classes of men. The first class men, the second class men, the third class men, fourth class men. The first-class men means the most intelligent class of men. Second-class men means those who are dealing in politics. Third-class men means those who are dealing in economics, industry, trade. And fourth-class men means they have no intelligence to take up all these things, but they work only. But all of them should cooperate. For the general benefit of the whole human society. We have got engagement for the first-class men, second-class men, third-class men, fourth-class men. Just like we have got in our body the brain, the arms, the belly, and the legs. But all of them are cooperating for keeping the body fit. Similarly, the first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class men should cooperate for achieving the end, Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: And lots of land is lying in our Letchmore Heath. They won't work for producing food. That land is kept for keeping cows for killing them. And for their food, they are working underneath the ground, and whatever money they get, they import grains. Just see the māyā's influence, that: "We are working, getting money, and importing grains." Why not work and grow grains? Now he's thinking that: "I'll get more money underground, than by cultivating on the surface." This is māyā. He's working very hard. Still, he's thinking it is better happiness. "I haven't to work on the surface. I am working underground. Therefore I am happy." This is māyā. He'll prefer that kind of work. But he won't agree to grow food on the surface of the country.

Bhagavān: That's because in America, for example, the government will pay so much money. They will pay you more than if you grow so many fields of...

Prabhupāda: No, it is my experience. I have seen practically all parts of the world. If we grow food, all countries, especially America, both North and South, whole America, whole Canada, whole Africa, whole Australia... They are not producing food. There is so much land. So if you combine together on Kṛṣṇa consciousness, there is no scarcity of food anywhere, in any part of the world.

Room Conversation with Dr. Christian Hauser, Psychiatrist -- September 10, 1973, Stockholm:

Dr. Hauser: Yes. But I feel in the...

Prabhupāda: Just like this is an apartment. So from this apartment, you go to another apartment. So it does not mean that this apartment has evolved to that apartment. I, the person, I create that apartment, or I prefer that apartment. Not that this apartment has evolved into that apartment.

Dr. Hauser: Yes, I can see what you mean. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Darwin's nonsense is there. He is changing the apartment. Apartment is becoming a different apartment. That is not a fact. Just try to understand. This room cannot develop into another room. But I, the resident of this room, I can go from this apartment to another apartment. Or I can create another apartment. This is evolution.

Dr. Hauser: And I can create a bigger apartment.

Prabhupāda: Yes, bigger, smaller, as I like. Not necessarily bigger. That is also another nonsense.

Dr. Hauser: And my intelligence might grow also.

Prabhupāda: Intelligence, maybe. But there must be means. You may be very intelligent, but if you have no means to erect another nice apartment, how it will?

Dr. Hauser: Trial and error.

Room Conversation with Banker -- September 21, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Why?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: So now the libraries are complaining about the shortage of money.

Prabhupāda: (To Tamāla) Bring the other light. The second one, down. Yes. How is that. It is not in order? First one. (break)

Banker: I haven't found a common yardstick yet. I prefer my own, but that's measured by my yardstick.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think you also prefer this country's, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes, sincerely. Therefore I went to your country, to start this movement.

Banker: So many people in this country have argued with me and have told me that... They haven't been out of India, but they have told me that their country is better.

Prabhupāda: Indians?

Banker: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They say their country is better, but I don't think...

Banker: And they never left India. I don't know how they make this comparison. They say they have happiness here and we have wealth, and because of our wealth we are unhappy people.

Prabhupāda: The Americans say?

Banker: No, no, that is what they say here. Especially in my bank. Our clerks are the top five per cent of the nation's income earners, five thousand rupees or more a year, near the top five percent. But they still say that they're poor and happy. But then once a year they forget that when they ask us for more money. I don't understand it. Contradictory philosophy.

Prabhupāda: There are two things. One material, one spiritual. Spiritually, India is happy, those who are actually spiritualists. But materially, India is unhappy. Spiritually, even if you still go in the interior of village, poor man, living in a cottage, he is taking bath three times and doing his professional work, a cultivator, having little food, and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. They are happy actually. They have got their family, husband, wife, some children. If one lives spiritual life, he is actually happy. Materially, nobody can be happy. In your country, although there is enough facility for material enjoyment, actually they are not happy. Otherwise why in your country the hippies are coming out? They are coming from respectable, rich parents, nation, but they have given up their home, their father's opulence, mother's opulence. That I have seen practically. Practically all my students... Here, Brahmānanda, his father, at least he was a big industrialist, mother. But he did not like. He joined this movement. Similarly, Girirāja, his father is a big lawyer, rich man. But he did not like that. There are many, many students, their father's are... Śyāmasundara's father is big lawyer, rich man, businessman. He is the only son. But he did not like his father. So there are many... Even though he is not our student, still, I do not know. I have seen in Los Angeles, Beverly Hills. You know? That is a rich quarter. Very nice house. And one boy is coming, he is hippie, and riding on his car and going. Then I saw, although it is such a nice rich quarter, there are also hippies. That I could study. Why these boys are becoming hippies? And New York you know, the hippies are lying here and there in Fifth Avenue, Central Park, and they are worshiping pig. (laughs) You know that?

Banker: Yes, I know.

Morning Walk -- December 7, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Iron filings. But who has given this power to this magnetic stone? You cannot give.

Karandhara: They say, "It's just there by nature's arrangement."

Prabhupāda: That is answered: "Nature is controlled by God."

Karandhara: Well, they prefer to leave nature as nondescript. When they say or designate as "nature," they prefer to leave that nondescript, nonspecific.

Prabhupāda: Why? That means insufficient knowledge. They do not wish to describe it because your foolishness will be discovered.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They will say that "I can do that. That is done by nature."

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In the case of a magnet, suppose if I take a piece of iron and if I magnetize it by electrical current, it will act as a magnet. So they say...,

Prabhupāda: Yes, but the iron is not manufactured by you. Neither the magnetic stone is manufactured by you. You take nature's product and utilize it. That is not your original creation. So what is credit to you? You can transform. That is in your hand. Yayedaṁ dhāryate jagat (BG 7.5). There are two things: material and spiritual, inferior energy and superior energy. Jīva-bhūtāṁ mahā-bāho. The living entities, they are superior energy. Why superior? They can take the materials and handle. Yayedaṁ dhāryate jagat. That is your superior energy. You can take the matters and combine it and make something else. That is the world, going on, matter and spirit. You have created your own body by your desire. So that you can do, but the materials, the body, you cannot create. That is not in your power.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Indian man (1): Why do we prefer pāda and not the head or the hands? What is the rationale?

Prabhupāda: That is impudency. That is impudency. The worship of the Deity should begin from the leg, from the feet. That is respect. Just like my disciples offer respect and touches my feet, not my head. That is impudency. You cannot touch head. Head is touched when I give him, "All right, be blessed." I shall touch his head, and he shall touch my feet. This is the process. You cannot touch the superior head. That is impudency. You cannot jump over like that.

Indian man (1): It's a part of the body. It is only a...

Prabhupāda: That's all right. But that is the system. That is the system. You should begin. That... That is described in the Bhāgavatam. The First and Second Canto of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam are the two legs of Kṛṣṇa. That is the beginning. Janmādy asya yataḥ (SB 1.1.1). These professional reciters, they read Bhāgavata. They jump over immediately to the face. The Tenth Canto is described as the face of Kṛṣṇa. So you cannot go immediately to the head. You must begin from the feet. First Canto, Second Canto. Therefore there are nine cantos, and then Tenth Canto. And the Kṛṣṇa's rasa dance, that is the smiling of Kṛṣṇa. So you cannot ask the superior to take the facility of his smiling. Smiling will be when he is pleased. The difficulty is that the Māyāvādī philosophy, they do not accept the form of the Lord. And they do not know how to behave with the form. Of course, there is no difference between Kṛṣṇa's face and Kṛṣṇa's feet. There is no difference. But still, the system must be followed. Pāda-sevanam. It is very important verse. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ (SB 7.5.23). When one has heard, when one has properly chanted, he has little experience of the transcendental form of the Lord, then his service beginning. Just like I engage one servant. So gradually he is given service. "First of all this, first of all that, then..." Again and again, again, again. The same example can be given, that the husband and wife. Formerly, when I was married, my wife was eleven years old. So (laughing) an eleven years old girl and I was at the same time twenty-one, twenty-two. One day I captured her hand. She began to cry. A little girl, you see? So gradually, gradually. I know... When my brother-in-law, sister's husband, used to come... In the beginning, the girls were very... My sisters were same age. So they would meet the husband, offering a little pan or little sandeśa. (break) ...after this. Then niṣṭhā. Then he has got a firm conviction that "Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and my duty is to serve Kṛṣṇa." That is called niṣṭhā. Then ruci. Then he increases taste. He cannot go out. He cannot go out of this jurisdiction. Just like these boys, they have come from Europe, America. They are attached. Otherwise I am not giving them bribe. I have no money. Why they are attached to serve me any way? If I say that "You die," he will die. Why this attachment? This is development of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, development of Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Ruci, aśakti, tato bhāva. Then bhāva. Bhāva means Kṛṣṇa consciousness fully developed. Then love. Then love. Love is actually exhibited. Then "Let me serve Kṛṣṇa in this way, in that way, that way, that way." You see? Fully engaged. This is the process. You cannot say that "Let my love be stagnant in my heart. There is no exhibition." No. There must be exhibition. That is the symptom of love.

Morning Walk -- April 12, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Here is description of Pūtanā, twelve miles. Big gigantic body. And nobody has seen such gigantic body. But it is described in the Bhāgavatam. (break) ...Mahārāja was so simple, village man, that he accepted Vasudeva, a great mystic. Hare Kṛṣṇa. A devotee says that "I prefer to become a dog in the house of a devotee."

vaiṣṇava ṭhākura, tomāra kukkura,

bhuliyā janaha mora

He is praying, "My dear Vaiṣṇava Ṭhākura, you kindly accept me as your dog. But you accept me." You see? "And I shall do this, I shall do this. I shall sit down on your door. I shall not allow any nondevotee to disturb you." He has sung like...

vaiṣṇava ṭhākura, tomāra kukkura,

bhuliyā janaha mora

"And I shall not ask you for any food. Whatever you like, you can give me a little eaten food. I will be satisfied. But keep me as your dog." That is the prayer, that Vaiṣṇava is prepared to become a dog even at the house of a Vaiṣṇava. That is Vaiṣṇava. He doesn't want anything more. He wants simply to be associated with Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is Vaiṣṇava.

Room Conversation with Irish Poet, Desmond O'Grady -- May 23, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: Just Like if you come in front of the sunlight, the sun consciousness is there, which includes your personal conscious... you also see. In the darkness you cannot see. At night you do not see even your hands and legs. But if you come in front of the sun, or light, then you see the sun and see yourself. So without the sunlight, without God consciousness, self consciousness is incomplete. But God consciousness makes self consciousness very clear.

O'Grady: Well, a lot of young people that we meet in our teaching profession, we don't try to teach them any kind of didactic salvation. But we do try to direct them towards an awareness of what is best and what is most good for them and what is most spiritually nourishing in the world about them, in so far as the system allows us. And I speak of my friend Michael and we here. And the one condition or emotional state—because very frequently the students are not mature enough to be in a spiritual condition, they are in a emotional condition rather than a spiritual one—what we are faced with, is the basic question of "Who am I?" "What is it all about?" "Why am I here?" "Why should I be here"? "Who are you, and who the hell are you to tell me what to think or what to read or what not to read? Why should I read Shakespeare? Or why should I read Saint Augustine? Or why should I listen to Mozart? I prefer Bob Dylan," and these kind of questions which seem to emanate from a very disillusioned state of mind, an insecurity, an uncertainty, and a lack of credibility in the total structure of things as they are. And so we're frequently faced with not just directly having to answer these questions, as I said didactically answering them by saying in a catechismic sort of way: "Who am I?" "You are..." "What am I doing here?" "You are doing this here," which one can do, of course, also.

Prabhupāda: So...

O'Grady: And so, rather than present the kind of answers that one could present if one was trained in oneself originally... And one who is first of all trained, then one has to untrain oneself, and then one trains oneself from that experience basically. This is my way of seeing it. And then one tries to help others through this course with the same process. Do you think that we should tell them more directly, or... Well, the basic question is how to handle the problem of modern education.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Our Vedic process is... There are so many questions, as you have already explained. Somebody thinks, "Why I have come here? And what is the purpose? What you are?" So many questions. Questions should be answered by the perfect. Therefore the Vedic injunction is tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet: (MU 1.2.12) "In order to take answers of all these questions one must approach the bona fide spiritual master."

Room Conversation with Catholic Cardinal and Secretary to the Pope -- May 24, 1974, Rome:

Prabhupāda: For all.

Cardinal Pignedoli: For all. Well, also we are for all. But I mean, you have not so many people. You have some thousand people. Do you prefer for this your people? Do you prefer they go to a place where God is not known, where spiritual values are not estimated? Or they go also to places where God is loved and God is present.

Prabhupāda: No, we go everywhere.

Cardinal Pignedoli: Everywhere.

Prabhupāda: Just like you go in the villages of Africa. They are almost aborigines, with their...

Cardinal Pignedoli: Local people. Local citizens.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So our process is so nice, that is recommended process in this age—the chanting the holy name of God. So we chant this holy name of God, perhaps you have seen. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa, we dance.

Monsignor Verrozano: Yes, Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Then anyone, even children, they join. Even the children, they join. Man, woman...

Cardinal Pignedoli: It is very similar to the Christian masses. We bring it everywhere.

Prabhupāda: We have no such distinction. So to the mass of people, we chant this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. But when there are learned scholars, elevated person, then we present about our philosophy. And we have got so many writings. Both ways: the mass and the class, or the scholars. We are prepared to meet everyone. Our mission is to make everyone, no distinction, that "This class should be given preference, and that should be neglected." No. We have got instrument to awaken everyone. By chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra, we can enthuse thousands and thousands of men to join us. And those who are advanced in philosophy and religious system, we have got these books. So we do not neglect anyone. We approach everyone.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1974, Rome:

Haihaya: Because they think that capitalists, they don't give the same possibilities to earn...

Prabhupāda: They think, but we see practically: Why there is difference between this manager and the laborer class? Will the dictator, the manager will take the same salary as the sweeper is taking? Why there is difference? Why the manager is given more preference for living condition? Where is equality? First of all show me. Simply talking will not do.

Dhanañjaya: Actually, the only difference is that in the communist countries, religion is not allowed.

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. But their philosophy that everyone is equal... Where is equality? There is no equality. Why you are talking nonsense? And in Moscow I have seen. So many people are walking, and others are going on motorcar. Why? why this difference? Why not everyone motorcar? Then what improvement you have made? You are simply talking. Why this difference? Nobody wants to walk. Why thousands of people walking on the street, and some of them are going on motorcar? Why? Where is the equality?

Haihaya: Śrīla Prabhupāda, they said that equality came by... No, it's not equal, but they must give the same possibilities to everyone.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Naturally it follows, but if somebody wants to cheat, that is another thing. Naturally it follows.

Yogeśvara: (translates)

Swiss Man (1): (French)

Yogeśvara: This gentleman suggests that he prefers someone who may be committing all four of these sinful activities but who helps his fellow man.

Prabhupāda: The fellow man helping, what does he gain?

Yogeśvara: (translates) He says, "Even if someone is committing all kinds of sinful activities..."

Prabhupāda: No, no. What you gain by helping your fellow man? First of all that is the question.

Yogeśvara: He says, "The purpose of helping other people is not to gain something for yourself."

Prabhupāda: But I say that you help your fellow man. So do you know how to help him?

Swiss Man (1): Certain circumstances.

Yogeśvara: He says, "In certain circumstances."

Prabhupāda: In certain circumstances, but if you do not know how to... Suppose a man is diseased and you think... The doctor says that he should not eat anything. But if you think that "Let me give some food. The doctor is very cruel. He is not giving food," is it, that, helping or fully pushing him towards death? First of all you must know how to help. If I do not know—I help in the opposite way—that is not helping. That is degrading. These are all manufactured things. They are not... Helping means, real helping is, that a man or anyone... Everyone is suffering for want of knowledge. So if you can give knowledge, that is real help.

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Robert Gouiran: You don't think that people could have a gift for healing?

Prabhupāda: There is no healing in the material world. There is disease always. There is no question of healing. Their healing is temporary. I am suffering from some disease. You give me some medicine. Does it mean that there will be no more disease? You heal that temporary disease. Again another disease. So where is the healing? So this is to be thought, that... Healing, that is the problem. There is no healing. There is always disease, this disease or that disease. If you prefer this disease heal, you are cured, and there will be no more disease, then you are profited. Another disease. You heal this, another disease. You heal this, another disease.

Robert Gouiran: So you think we can't help people?

Prabhupāda: Eh? You cannot! Can you help people to stop death? Or to stop disease? Or to stop old age? I am becoming old, can you stop?

Robert Gouiran: I think so.

Prabhupāda: That is foolishness. If you think that you can stop my old age growing, then that is foolishness. It is not possible.

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Yogeśvara: Seventy, eighty.

Prabhupāda: So we are not sorry that minority. Where is the...? Insignificant. Don't talk of minority. But we are not sorry. Minority, majority, all these are foolishness. The whole platform is mistaken. (pause) Rūpa Gosvāmī was a minister. He was in the majority. But voluntarily, he accepted minority. He went to Vṛndāvana and living alone, underneath a tree. He was enjoying so much honor. Tyaktvā tūrṇam aśeṣa-maṇḍala-pati-śreṇīm. His associates were big, big zamindars, big businessmen, politicians. Because he's minister. But he preferred to resign that post and become a minority, to live alone in Vṛndāvana underneath a tree. Why he preferred this? And remaining there alone, he has given you the Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu. So we have to see how much service we are going to give Kṛṣṇa. This minority, majority, these are all material conception of life. If you can give major service to Kṛṣṇa, that is your success of life. I started this movement alone, minority. Is it not?

Room Conversation with Roger Maria leading writer of communist literature -- June 12, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Then let him learn that. If silence is best, then don't talk.

Yogeśvara: Well, he says, still, we can give it some form for discussion purposes.

Prabhupāda: Then what is his silence? Silence means don't talk. If you prefer silence, then don't talk. (French)

Yogeśvara: He suggests, "Well, In that case, if we're going to discuss the Absolute Truth, then you can say that the ultimate is..."

Prabhupāda: But he raised that Absolute Truth is non-dual.

Yogeśvara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Non-dual.

Yogeśvara: Tat tvam asi. He's saying, "We are that."

Prabhupāda: So then, then why he raised the question of Absolute Truth, non-dualism, neti neti? This is the discussion of Absolute Truth. So why he says, "For the time being, let us become silent"?

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: He did not raise any question. And he is simply translator. He has no philosophy. I asked him "Which philosophy you are...?" "So I make comparative study." I think he did not like to enter into philosophical... Is it not?

Devotee: Most of these gentlemen who come here, when they see you and begin talking with you, like you said, they show their ignorance when they begin to speak. So they prefer not to speak. They always make some excuse that they have an appointment because they know that if they speak, they will be in real trouble.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Tāvac ca śobhate mūrkhaḥ yāvat kiñcin na bhāṣate (?): "A foolish man is very nice as long as he does not speak. As soon as he will speak, his foolishness will be captured." So therefore, sometimes they do not like to talk. Remain as a nice man, (laughs) without being discovered.

Devotee: I think maybe the first gentleman who was here, who said... He was talking about experiencing God... He says, "Actually I experienced God, but actually God is beyond my experience." You gave him such a hard time that I think he must have made phone calls to all these other men, "Be careful of Bhaktivedanta Swami. He is very dangerous." (laughter)

Prabhupāda: I told him that you have no experience.

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 14, 1974, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He's benefited from the consciousness of the master.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So... If the master is devotee, then he's benefited. Kīṭa janma hau yathā tuwā dāsa. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura sings that "Let me become a worm in the house of a devotee. If I have to take birth, I don't want a life, nondevotional life, even it is like Brahmā. I'll prefer to become a worm in the house of a devotee." This is the prayer of Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Harer nāma harer nāma... (CC Adi 17.21).

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Similarly, when we associate with a spiritual master who has Kṛṣṇa consciousness, automatically we also have some taste.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Students.

Prabhupāda: Bhakti means enhancing spiritual taste. That is bhakti. Bhaktiḥ pareśānubhavo viraktir anyatra syāt (SB 11.2.42). And as he increases his spiritual taste, he becomes (sic:) detestful to this material enjoyment. This is the taste.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 3, 1975, Hawaii:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Otherwise why you are opening so many centers and making arrangement that "We shall provide you with shelter, with food. These are the facilities. You live here, do whatever is your capacity. Don't sleep, but work." This is our teaching. Satāṁ prasaṅgāt, this is also, and Rūpa Gosvāmī says, sato vṛtteḥ sādhu-saṅge sadbhir bhaktiḥ prasidhyati: "If you live with the association of sādhu, devotee, then it will be quickly fruitful." And if you live with these ordinary men, then whatever you have got will be finished very soon. There is another verse. It is said there that it is preferred to live within the cage surrounded by fire than to live with the nondevotees. It is preferred.

Bali Mardana: Or with those who are too much attached to women also.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Nondevotee means too much attached to woman. That is the plain fact.

Yaśodānandana: Also one time in Bombay you told this verse from Caitanya-caritāmṛta, sādhu-saṅga (CC Madhya 22.83), sādhu-saṅga...

Prabhupāda: Sarva-śāstre kaya, lava-mātra sādhu-saṅge sarva-siddhi haya (CC Madhya 22.54). For me, personally, I had the opportunity to talk with my spiritual master not more than ten times in my whole life, not more. It may be less than that. But I tried to follow his instruction, that's all, although I was a gṛhastha.

Morning Walk -- February 3, 1975, Hawaii:

Jayatīrtha: So that means that whole activity during the day, working, that means I am not following the instruction of the guru. It's unauthorized activity.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If you don't follow the instruction of guru, then you are fallen down immediately. That is the way. Otherwise why you sing, yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādo **. It is my duty to satisfy guru. Otherwise I am nowhere. So if you prefer to be nowhere, then you disobey as you like. But if you want to be steady in your position, then you have to follow strictly the instruction of guru.

Devotee (1): We can understand all of your instructions simply by reading your books.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Anyway, follow the instruction. That is required. Follow the instruction. Wherever you remain, it doesn't matter. You are secure. Follow the instruction. Then you are secure anywhere. It doesn't matter. Just like I told you that I saw my Guru Mahārāja not more than ten days in my life, but I followed his instruction. I was a gṛhastha, I never lived with the Maṭha, in the temple. It is practical. So many Godbrothers recommended that "He should be in charge in this Bombay temple, this, that, that..." Guru Mahārāja said, "Yes, better he lives outside. That is good, and he will do what is needed in due course of time."

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Dr. Movebhed: I prefer to listen to you.

Prabhupāda: But we are speaking the same thing, Bhagavad-gītā. We are not manufacturing anything. Clear conception of God you can take from Arjuna. Arjuna associated with Kṛṣṇa personally. What he says about Kṛṣṇa and what he understands about God, that you read from the Tenth Chapter. Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān, puruṣaṁ śāśvataṁ divyam (BG 10.12).

Nitāi: "Arjuna said: You are the Supreme Brahmān, the ultimate, the supreme abode and purifier, the Absolute Truth and the eternal divine person. You are the primal God, transcendental and original. You are the unborn and the all-pervading beauty. All the great sages such as Nārada, Asita, Devala, and Vyāsa proclaim this of You, and now You Yourself are declaring it to me."

Prabhupāda: Then? Purport? (break) Next verse?

Nitāi: "O Kṛṣṇa, I totally accept as truth all that You have told me. Neither the gods nor the demons, O Lord, know Thy personality."

Prabhupāda: Now here is the Arjuna's understanding, that "I accept You in total." Now some rascals are proclaiming that all the Bhagavad-gītās, they are, most of them are interpretation. But Arjuna says that "I accept everything what You have said." So whom you will accept, Arjuna or some rascal who is speaking that "There are so many interpolation. They can be rejected"? Whom you will accept as authority? Arjuna says that "I accept whatever You have said in toto." If you accept Arjuna because he has heard from Kṛṣṇa, then you accept Kṛṣṇa or you understand Kṛṣṇa.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Governor: But also not come in the way of a Muslim.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no need. Secular means government's duty is that "You call yourself a Hindu. Whether you are acting as Hindu? You call yourself as Muslim. Whether you are acting as Muslim?" This is government's duty. Government does not say or prefer that "You are Christian. It is not good. You become Hindu." No, that is not government's... You remain your Christian, but government's duty is that whether he is acting as Christian. This is government's duty. Not that you are acting like a something else, and you are calling yourself Christian. You are acting like a śūdra, and you are advertising yourself as a brāhmaṇa. So just like a, what is called, quack. If he writes, "Dr. something," that is punishable. But you are quack. That's all right. You can take a certificate that you have got some experience. The registered medical practitioner, I think that is... But what is this, that you are proclaiming yourself as a... (chuckles) So character means a class of men there must be, maybe very few, but they are actually men of character. Just like I am teaching them no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no gambling, no intoxication. This is basic principle. Otherwise, where is his character? You are doing all nonsense, and still, you are proclaiming yourself as brāhmaṇa. This should be stopped. And a training college should be there how to make a real brāhmaṇa.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Bhāratīya samskriti. It will be very respectfully accepted. Why should we imitate them? That is... Western civilization is not brahminical culture. There is no brahminical culture. And brahminical culture is needed. That is the head. That is the brain. And a little bit of this brahminical culture, because I am distributing and they are accepting it so nicely... So in our India, in a place like Vṛndāvana, Naimisaranya, like that, many people will come, if varṇāśrama college is established. Of course, we, in India, so far I know, nobody will come to be trained up as a brāhmaṇa. They will prefer to be trained up as an electrician and not as a brāhmaṇa. Our Bon Mahārāja, he also tried for a Vaiṣṇava University. He was unsuccessful.

Governor: No, we take this electrician or engineer or an...

Prabhupāda: No, that is already being taken. There are institution where electricians are trained up and motorist, they are... They have enough.

Governor: No, what is... What is the... An electrician we get him. He is an electrician and also becoming a brāhmaṇa. An engineer...

Prabhupāda: No, no, that cannot be.

Morning Walk -- May 21, 1975, Melbourne:

Madhudviṣa: Yes. They remain celibate. He was saying that it is a personal preference.

Devotee: They have no general rule. It's just that if you want to be celibate, then that's very nice, but if you want to have sex life...

Prabhupāda: Then why they have recommended this, unless there is some benefit?

Śrutakīrti: Well, that knowledge has been lost through the years. A few hundred years ago, many of the celibates were also vegetarian, but all that has changed.

Prabhupāda: That means they are gliding down towards hell, that's all. Yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam. Now they are coming to the platform of homosex. This is their advancement, spiritual advancement. Yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam. This is Coca-cola, everywhere. (break) ... mukti, liberation, and the word salvation is the same? Then what is the meaning of salvation?

Devotee: Salvation means to be saved, liberation.

Prabhupāda: Then what do they mean by that liberation?

Madhudviṣa: Salvation means to be saved by Jesus. Saved by Jesus means to...

Prabhupāda: So what is the platform of that saving?

Madhudviṣa: To go to heaven, spiritual world.

Prabhupāda: There is idea of spiritual world?

Madhudviṣa: Well, there is kingdom of God, but they have vague idea. They say no man has seen God, nor has he seen His kingdom.

Radio Interview -- May 25, 1975, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Because Indian people, being subjugated for at least one thousand years, they have lost their original culture. And, being poverty-stricken, they are simply after money, by hook and crook. So in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said that bhogaiśvarya-prasaktānāṁ tayā apahṛta-cetasām (BG 2.44). Persons who have lost their consciousness on account of being too much attached to material enjoyment, they cannot understand Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So I thought that America, they have enjoyed enough of this material happiness, money and women, and they are now becoming disappointed. So they are at least on the platform of renunciation. They don't want any more like their fathers and grandfathers. Of course, they are not guided. Therefore I preferred to go there to guide them. So almost fifty percent of my devotees are, they are collected from these disappointed persons, young men. They are going astray. So they appreciate that I have saved them. Therefore they are after me, this younger generation, and they are helping me in broadcasting this Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Morning Walk -- June 21, 1975, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: There will be many professors coming over to see you while you are here.

Prabhupāda: Yes...

Jayatīrtha: Ph.D.'s, and psychologists,...

Prabhupāda: Ask them to see me. What time we should fix up?

Brahmānanda: I think afternoon? You prefer afternoon? Or early time?

Prabhupāda: Afternoon is a nice...

Brahmānanda: Yes. (break)

Jayatīrtha: ...men from the University of Southern California wants to come and see you, the chairman and many of the members.

Prabhupāda: Oh. Then invite them and give them nice feast, yes. Make arrangement. Time, whatever suitable time you will fix up, I...

Jayatīrtha: We'll discuss it with Upendra when is the best time. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...hīna paśubhiḥ samānaḥ. "As soon as one become bereft of religion, he's animal." That's all. That is the difference between animals and man. They think to become polished animal is advancement of civilization. To become lion is advancement of civilization. "Because I am stronger than the dog therefore I am civilized." Americans think like that. "Because we are stronger than the Chinese dog or Russian cat, therefore I am civilized." (laughs) This is going on. "Because I am tiger, I am lion..." He doesn't think that after, "You be tiger or lion; You are animal." Just see. (break) ...puruṣaḥ paśuḥ. Śva-viḍ-varāha uṣṭra-kharaiḥ. I think we were discussing this verse? Saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ.

Room Conversation after Press Conference -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: But still... Therefore I say. Still, she remained dependent on their son. That is is my proposition. Just like the sons, they lost the game and they were to be banished. Kuntī was not banished. So when the sons went to forest, Kuntī also followed because she thought that "I am widow. I am dependent on my sons. So wherever my sons will remain, I shall remain." She was not... She did not lose the game; neither she was ordered to go to the forest. Similarly, Sītā, Sītā, wife of Lord Rāmacandra. Lord Rāmacandra was requested by His father to go to the forest, not Sītā. Sītā was also a king's daughter. So she could go to her father that "My husband is going to the forest. Let me go to my father's house." She did not go. She preferred that "I shall go with my husband." So when husband said that "You are not banished. You stay at home," she said, "No. I am dependent on You. Wherever You shall go, I must go." This is Vedic culture.

Morning Walk -- July 26, 1975, Laguna Beach:

Rāmeśvara: In Japan, it is very popular.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Brahmānanda: They have farms, they call them sea farms and they specially grow the seaweed for cultivation.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is very kind. If you want this kind of food, he'll give you facility.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But the Vedic culture, I don't think they like this. They'll prefer this... Do you think Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Vedic culture means Kṛṣṇa prasāda.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Kṛṣṇa, you cannot offer this to Kṛṣṇa, can you?

Prabhupāda: No. (break)

Devotee (1): ...seaweed they eat. It grows out further. This isn't edible, they say.

Prabhupāda: Everything is edible but meant for different living entities. Stool is also edible, meant for the hogs. In the last war, stool was also eaten by human beings, you know that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, the Germans.

Morning Walk -- October 6, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: So England has got money to invest still?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes. They do much investment here in South Africa. (break) Śrīla Prabhupāda, there's a sidewalk here. Would you prefer walking on the sidewalk or the sands?

Prabhupāda: Yes, sidewalk is better.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Okay. A little bit hard on the...

Harikeśa: Did we pass by a park when we were coming?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: We will check out some places today. (break) ...cold spell now.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: A cold spell. It's been cold the last few days. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...keepers are mostly Indians?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Indian. All here are Indian. And just the other side of the bridge, all is Indian. This building here, Prabhupāda, this big building is built by one of our life members. All of our life members, they are competing who can build bigger building.

Prabhupāda: Ācchā. (laughing)

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Radio, and things like this.

Prabhupāda: Yes, if you want to make mass communication, you can do anything. (break) Due to industrialization, all intelligent men, they came in the city. In the village it was deserted. So there was no improvement in the village, and people preferred to come to the city, means industry, business. So India's basic principle was village life. Now that is lost. The intelligent class men, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, they left villages for earning more money in the cities, and only the śūdras, less intelligent class of men, less than śūdras, they remained. So what they will do? So village became deserted. Still you’ll go and see in Indian villages, especially in Bengal, so many big, big palatial buildings, they are lying vacant.

Morning Walk -- Durban, October 13, 1975 :

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (entering car) Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Over the Muslims.

Prabhupāda: No, Britishers. The Muslims interfered. They wanted to propagate Islamism. Not all, some of them. But Britishers, although they were spreading Christianism, still, outwardly they were neutral about religious affairs. So Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura preferred that "Britishers are good. They do not interfere with our religious affair." So the idea is that India—you may say primitive or whatever you want—they wanted to make progress of the soul. They did not care who is ruling. So "Whatever tax is due we shall pay. Let us do our own business." That was India's attitude. They never thought in terms of nationalism. That was never educated. They were never educated.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (to driver) Go down this street, Prabhu.

Prabhupāda: Nationalism was unknown to India. They never thought.

Bhargava: … allow the Muslims to enter and do so much damage to the Vedic culture?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bhargava: Why did Kṛṣṇa allow the Muslims to enter and do so much damage to the…

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is your father's servant that you do something wrong and Kṛṣṇa has to check it? Is your Kṛṣṇa your father's servant? Then why do you ask this question? If you allow somebody to cut your head, has Kṛṣṇa to come to save you? Why do you ask this nonsense question? You are Kṛṣṇa conscious. Samo ’haṁ sarva-bhūteṣu. If you cut your own head, what Kṛṣṇa will do? In the same term, nationalism, as Vedic culture is Kṛṣṇa's national affair, your disease is there. Why Kṛṣṇa will come to save the Vedic culture? What business He has got? If you are spoiling it, then why Kṛṣṇa will come? Spoil, and suffer. (break) … the same question in a different way, "Why India? Why Kṛṣṇa?" as if Kṛṣṇa is Indian. Kṛṣṇa is Indian? Then why do you ask this question, that “Kṛṣṇa will come to save India's culture?”

Morning Walk -- October 17, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: You don't like the sunshine so much.

Prabhupāda: Only at the time of massage. (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...Vedic statement or is it just preference?

Prabhupāda: No, that is my personal. During winter it is pleasing, of course, sunshine.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...walk this way. There's a ravine here. (break) Śrīla Prabhupāda, it always seems that there is some kind of inspiration for spiritual life there. Is that simply mental concoction, or is it actually a fact, the land itself?

Prabhupāda: Land. It is the influence of the land. Just like Vṛndāvana. Whatever you may be, you stay here, you become spiritualized. Simply you stay there. (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Is it possible to reform a person against their will?

Prabhupāda: No, not possible. (break)

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: ...sign, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that someone is actually having change in heart?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: What is the sign that someone is actually having change in heart?

Prabhupāda: By his action. (break) ...kasipu tried to make Prahlāda atheist. He failed. And Prahlāda tried to make his father theist. He failed. Don't you see?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Morning Walk -- October 19, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. You have to work to become lazy. (laughter) That is another thing. But the goal is to become lazy. You work five days very hard just to become lazy for two days. That's all. So if you have got means to become seven days lazy, you'll prefer it.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But I think people would... Most people would go crazy if they didn't have any work.

Prabhupāda: No, that means their life is not properly conducted. And therefore the word laziness has come. Laziness is not actually the word. Laziness means minimizing the bodily labor and engaged in spiritual work. If you ask people, "Please come to our temple," who is coming? Because he says, "I have no time." But we are not working hard. So real aim of life is to... In German, I think, or somewhere there is classification: "Lazy intelligent, busy intelligent, lazy fool, and busy fool." So at the present moment (laughs) the whole world is full of busy fools. But the first-class man, he is lazy intelligent. Lazy and intelligent, that is first-class man. And second-class man, busy intelligent. And third class means lazy fool and fourth class means busy fool. When the fools are busy... Just like nowadays they are busy but they are fools. Like monkey, he is very busy. You see? And they prefer to be generation of monkey, busy fool. That's all. Fools, when he is busy, he is simply creating havoc. That's all. Better... Lazy fool is better than him because he will not create so much harm, but this busy fool will simply create harm. And first class-man is lazy intelligent. He knows the value of life, and soberly he is thinking. Just like all our great saintly persons. They were living in the forest, meditation, tapasya, and writing books. All, you will find, lazy intelligent. They are first-class men.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: Hm? What is that?

Brahmānanda: That because in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam the knowledge there contradicts the mundane scientific knowledge, people who had some faith in Kṛṣṇa become discouraged and turn away from Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Let him go away. Don't care for him. Let all the fools go away. There is Bengali proverb, "Instead of maintaining some bad cows, let the cowshed be vacant." We shall prefer the cowshed vacant, no cow, than keeping all bad cows who does not give any milk, create disturbance.

Devotee (8): In our temple...

Prabhupāda: We are giving chance, but we don't want bad cows. We haven't got to agree with their views. They must agree with our views, then they can live. Otherwise let them go away. This is position.

Indian man (9): Your Divine Grace, are we all equal in sight of God?

Brahmānanda: Are we all equal in the eyes of God?

Prabhupāda: But if you become unequal, you must go away. No. His question was they are disturbed. So that means they are unequal. Why they should be disturbed?

Cyavana: Kṛṣṇa says, "All of them, as they surrender, I reward accordingly." So that means they are surrendering in different...

Prabhupāda: Yes. He has not surrendered. He keeps himself separate from Kṛṣṇa, and he is, artificially he shows surrender. Surrender does not mean that you reserve something for you. That is not surrender. Surrender means without reservation. That is surrender.

Morning Walk -- November 1, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: You are part and parcel then? What is that?

Brahmānanda: If we are part and parcels of God does it mean that we were with God before coming to the...

Prabhupāda: You are always with God, even your rebellious condition, you are with God. Just like a prisoner. A prisoner is always with the government, (laughter) but in one department he is kicked, and in one department he is patted. That's all. So if you prefer to be kicked, you remain in māyā. But you are always in connection with God.

Indian man (11): Lord Kṛṣṇa says, "I am in everything."

Prabhupāda: Yes. Your, this punishment condition is also God's creation, external energy. You cannot live for a second without God. But one who knows, he is blessed, and who does not know, he is condemned. But you know or not know, you are always with God. That is your position.

Devotee (12): Śrīla Prabhupāda, how best can we present the teachings of...

Prabhupāda: Just abide by the orders of God and His representative. Then you be happy. Otherwise not.

Harikeśa: This side, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Sarva dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). That is the verse.

Morning Walk -- November 8, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Avarana. He is in the most abominable condition, and he is thinking he is very happy. This is avaranatmika, covering him to see in the real position. Otherwise we are asking everyone that "You come here. I am giving you room. Take prasādam. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Read these books." "No. Why shall I come?" What is the difficulty here? But nobody will come. He will rot in the home-anxiety—how to maintain, how to... This is going on. This is called prakṣepatmika, avaranātmika. He will prefer rotting as hog and dog, but he will never prefer to live as Kṛṣṇa conscious. This is māyā. So many people are there on the beach. You invite them, "Please come to our place. Live nicely. We shall give you nice room, nice prasādam. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." Nobody will come.

Dr. Patel: It is good that they are not coming. Otherwise you won't have this place...

Prabhupāda: No, no. We have enough place. We are not depending on Dr. Patel, but Kṛṣṇa. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...infection and disinfection also, but you don't take to disinfection. That is our... Here is disinfection, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Who is going to take it? They will prefer to be infected. (break) ...respectable person will send their children to gurukula. They don't want. I tried in the beginning. It was a failure. They don't want. Just like Prahlāda and Hiraṇyakaśipu. What is the trouble? The Prahlāda was devotee, and his father did not like him, that "Why you should be devotee? You become politician, diplomat." That is the difficulty, that nowadays everyone is Hiraṇyakaśipu, and he wants that his son should be diplomat, politician, black market and... What is the use of this Prahlāda? That is going on, especially in India. (break) Hiraṇyakaśipu, he'll never like to see his son Prahlāda. And our system is to make Prahlāda. So nobody will like it.

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1975, Vrndavana:

Harikeśa: A really wise person could understand that there's no choice but to surrender.

Prabhupāda: Yes. He must. He is already under the control.

Harikeśa: He's always controlled at every moment.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But he's... He prefers to be controlled by the laws of nature instead of by Kṛṣṇa. That is his misfortune. He is controlled, but he thinks, "I am free." That is ignorance. Mūḍha. Just like I am the state citizen. I am not free. I must work according to the state laws. But he (thinks), "I shall... I don't care for government." That is my foolishness. You have to care. At home I can say to my wife, "I don't care for government, I don't care for the police." But when there is crime, when the police comes, then he says "Ohh." (pulls a sad face-laughter) He can be very much proud before his wife, "I don't care for anything." But when the police comes, "What can I do?" (Hindi) There is an example that the, what is called, mūrgī? What you call? Toast? No. Host? No. What is called? Mūrgī, mūrgī? Chicken? The male, male?

Akṣayānanda: Rooster.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 17, 1976, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That will be very much appreciated by everyone.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's not too cold in Vṛndāvana? I don't think so. End of February is not cold.

Harikeṣa: For Westerners it's not cold.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, Westerners are accustomed to that. They'll like it. They'll prefer it. They won't mind. They can't take the heat. Vṛndāvana is very cold in mid-February, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Not. Vṛndāvana is very cold December-January.

Harikeṣa: At night. At night.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They are accustomed to it. They can tolerate it. The hot part is more intolerable for Americans. It's really a good idea.

Harikeṣa: It's colder than sixty degrees.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The college preaching in the month of April is the very best. (break) Do you think something could be written on this wall?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, advertisement.

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Dayānanda: Except through Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Mām eva ye prapadyante. You surrender to Kṛṣṇa and everything will be clear, just like as soon as the sun rises, everything is clear, no covering. That is our propaganda, that you become Kṛṣṇa conscious; then you become fully aware of everything. Otherwise you remain rascal, fools, gādhā, asses. If you prefer to remain asses, you can do so, but we are servant of Kṛṣṇa. We must preach real, reality.

Dayānanda: Even the jñānīs and yogis become...

Prabhupāda: What is these jñānīs? They are also another rascal, another edition of rascals. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). Therefore so-called jñānīs, after many, many births' practical realization, they surrender to Kṛṣṇa. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā (BG 7.19). Then he understands that Kṛṣṇa is everything. But such great person is very, very rare. Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ, very, very rare.

Dayānanda: But what about the persons who may be a little bit devoted but who have not achieved that unalloyed devotion?

Prabhupāda: Kaniṣṭha-adhikārī. They are not devotees, but they are called bhaktābhāsa. There is some signs of bhakti. Actually they are not bhakta. Bhaktābhāsa. Ābhāsa. Ābhāsa means a simple, a little light.

Morning Walk -- February 10, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Hm hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You mentioned once that most of the parikrama devotees, they wanted to go on parikrama but he was speaking?

Prabhupāda: Yes. So I did not go to parikrama, so he very much appreciated. There was announcement that "Now parikrama will start in the evening at five, and Prabhupāda also will speak. So anyone who wants to hear Prabhupāda, he can stay. Otherwise be ready for going." So about a dozen men remained, and all went to parikrama. So I was at that time new man—not exactly new man, but not recognized disciple. I did not go. So he saw that I am sitting, I did not go to parikrama. He very much appreciated. I preferred to hear him than go to parikrama. That he appreciated.

Hari-śauri: That was the same time that you took initiation?

Prabhupāda: Yes. After that, I took initiation.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Where was the initiation ceremony?

Prabhupāda: That Allahabad.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Allahabad.

Prabhupāda: 1933.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So from Mathurā everyone went to Allahabad?

Prabhupāda: Yes, or they went to somewhere. But I came back. From Allahabad I went to Mathurā, and I came back to Allahabad at my own place.

Morning Walk -- February 11, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Samosa?

Hṛdayānanda: Samosa.

Prabhupāda: What is that samosā? Our samosā?

Hṛdayānanda: No. (break) ...two British planes came with medicine and they wouldn't let the planes land because they have some diplomatic quarrel with England. So they preferred their own people die to save the diplomatic purpose. Also another country sent supplies to help, and they said that it was stolen. They don't know where it went.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Hṛdayānanda: Another plane from another country came, and when they delivered all their supplies they said that everything was stolen. They don't know where it went.

Prabhupāda: Stolen?

Hṛdayānanda: Yes. The medicine was all stolen. Also the government was making many people work hard due to the disaster, and when the people...

Prabhupāda: So they are suffering from disaster. Again work hard. Just see how benefit.

Hṛdayānanda: Yes. And when the people said to the government, "You should pay us," they said, "No, we cannot pay you, and if you don't work, we will cut off your food."

Prabhupāda: This is Kali-yuga. Durbhikṣa-kārāpīḍita. One side, government disturbance, one side, no food, and they let them live very happily. That's all. This is their conception of happiness. Tactation(?), taxation, and no food, and natural disturbance.

Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is the example in the Bhagavad-gītā. When Arjuna saw that "Kṛṣṇa wants it positively. Never mind my..."

Dr. Patel: Then the kariṣye vacanam...

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is bhakti. "Never mind, I do not agree with Kṛṣṇa, but I see that He wants it, I must do." This is bhakti. Kṛṣṇa should be given preference. That is bhakti, not my whimsical way. That is not bhakti. And because we cannot understand Kṛṣṇa, therefore Kṛṣṇa is giving direction.

tad viddhi praṇipātena

paripraśnena sevayā

upadekṣyanti te jñānaṁ

jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ

(BG 4.34)

Go to the person who has seen actually and take information. Simply by reading you will be misleaded. Even persons like Gandhi or Dr. Radhakrishna, Aurobindo, they were misled because they wanted to manufacture their own meaning. They did not like to act as Kṛṣṇa says.

Passerby: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Hm. You are very good devotee. Jaya. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). So if one offers his namaskāra, that is also taken into account, asset. Svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt.

Room Conversation with Siddha-svarupa -- May 3, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Public may disturb, but we are following our own course of action. It is not obligatory. We are requesting you, "Take this book." That is not obligatory. "If you like, you can take. If you don't like, don't take."

Siddha-svarūpa: I think that...

Hari-śauri: So what their idea was that we shall build some public relations, like you said with this store. They prefer to try to spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness by public relations, give good impression, and then people will come.

Prabhupāda: Then you are dictated by the public, not by the dictation of your spiritual master. Spiritual master has ordered to distribute books; you shall do that. That is obedience. Now the public may take or not take, that is public's option. But my duty is—because spiritual master has said—I must try my best. Spiritual master has not said that "You must sell so many books daily, otherwise I will reject you." He has not said that. So everyone may try his best, that's all. The public may take or not take, it doesn't matter. And if you are, want to please the public, public says that "You dance naked, I will be very happy with you, I'll give you (indistinct)." So I'll have to do that. Then what is the use of making a spiritual master? Public, they have got their whims, how to become pleased. So we are to follow all these things? We have to follow our instruction of the spiritual master. That is... (indistinct) Why to manufacture "The public will be pleased like this"? Public may or may not give you, what you can do?

Hari-śauri: Our success is in the spiritual master's pleasure, not the public's pleasure.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is bhakti. Otherwise why Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66)? "You haven't got to please so many religious instructions. You simply please Me."

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: I did not study so much. Yes, there is no gorgeousness.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In China they all wear the same clothes. Whatever you saw in Russia, China is ten times more oppressive. It is much more oppressive. They say that Russia is a complete failure, because they are allowing so much looseness. The Chinese are accusing the Russians of being very loose and very capitalistic inclined. China is very dissatisfied that Russians have given up the principles of Marx and they have taken after the western ways. Preferring one group above another group.

Prabhupāda: Because Russia was afraid of another revolution. People were preparing. So much pressure, intolerance, after all they are Europeans, so there was a chance of revolution.

Hari-śauri: Especially after Stalin. So many people were killed and sent to prison camps. That was the way that they enforced...

Prabhupāda: Stalin is calculated to be greatest criminal in the world. He has killed so many men. All rogues. We were taken through the neighborhood of all aristocratic men who were killed in the revolution.

Morning Walk -- June 7, 1976, Los Angeles:

Devotee: So by his dreaming he, he...

Prabhupāda: Yes, first of all be rich man, then do all things, how you shall kick your wife. This is going on. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said that "My Guru Mahārāja found Me rascal number one; therefore he ordered, 'You cannot study Vedānta. You chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.' " They will not read this portion. That Caitanya Mahāprabhu, He posed Himself as a rascal.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But they prefer to read about all the ecstatic symptoms on Caitanya Mahāprabhu's body

Prabhupāda: That's all right. That.... Be, first of all bona fide. That is good ambition. But how this good ambition can fulfill when you are a potter, poor man? Actually be rich, and then kick your wife. And without being rich, if you think all this nonsense, you're spoiling time. (japa)

Rāmeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, some devotees, sometimes they feel that in ISKCON we're talking so much about the business of how to spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but we're not talking enough about Kṛṣṇa's pastimes, kṛṣṇa-kathā, they say. So that's another reason why they want to read all these pastimes.

Prabhupāda: Then let them read. What kind of kṛṣṇa-kathā? The kṛṣṇa-kathā test is as soon as he'll get the taste, he'll lose this taste. That is the.... What is this nonsense?

Morning Walk -- June 7, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rāmeśvara: What is the use of preaching?

Prabhupāda: Preaching. They advised me like that.

Rāmeśvara: They don't believe in Lord Caitanya, these sahajiyās in Vṛndāvana?

Prabhupāda: Mostly. They have no knowledge. Material. Prākṛta-sahajiyā. Their real name is prākṛta. Their thoughts are on this material platform. Just as they are preferring this conjugal love because here the sex is prominent. They are thinking that is the highest stage. What is the lowest stage here, they're taking that as the highest stage. In the.... Of course, in the spiritual world there is such thing, but as Kṛṣṇa has many other līlās, why they are not attracted to other līlās?

Rāmeśvara: They don't want to be limited. They think that Kṛṣṇa is the kṛṣṇas tu bhagavān svayam (SB 1.3.28). So why...

Prabhupāda: That is good. That is always true, but Kṛṣṇa says,

manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu

kaścid yatati siddhaye

yatatām api siddhānāṁ

kaścin māṁ vetti tattvataḥ

(BG 7.3)

How you have understood Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa says, "Out of many millions of people, one becomes siddha, and out of many millions of siddhas, hardly one can understand Me." So how you have understood Kṛṣṇa so easily, within two years? What you have understood Kṛṣṇa, that is materially understood. You do not know what is Kṛṣṇa. That is prākṛta-sahajiyā. "Oh, we have understood. Kṛṣṇa was a playboy, dancing with His girls. Bas, we have understood. Now we shall..."

Garden Conversation -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Very bad way?

Trivikrama: The bad way is also the mercy of the Lord to help us realize that...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Bad way, good way, man proposes, God disposes. You want something, bad or good.... Actually, everything is bad. This body or the fish's body or the dog's body, that is all material body. So everything is bad. But I prefer to get the body of a human being or a dog or a fish or a bird. That is my choice. So God gives you that body. Everywhere God's mercy is there, because whatever you want, ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). In the material world, you have come to enjoy. You cannot enjoy. You are thinking.... Just like child. He's playing with something for sometime, again taking another thing, again taking another thing, childish. So similarly we want to enjoy this material world. Sometimes I am thinking it will be convenient if I get a man's body, it will be convenient if I get a tiger's body, it will be convenient if I get a fish's body. So God is supplying you: "All right, you take this body." So what is God's fault? He is very kind. You wanted to do something. Do it. Not only that, if he forgets that "I wanted the fish body, now how I have got it?" No, he forgets that he wanted it. So God reminds him that "You wanted this body; you have got this body." Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). So God is very kind in all circumstances. Now we proposing to enjoy this material world under different situations, and God is helping us. Bhrāmayan sarva-bhūtāni yantrārūḍhāni māyayā (BG 18.61). You want to wander within this material world. That is your proposal. So, in order to enjoy this material world, you require different types of body. Just like they are trying to go to the moon planet. It requires a different body. So yānti deva-vratā devān: (BG 9.25) this life, you aspire of going to the moon planet; next life, automatically you will go there. Why you are trying unnecessarily to go to the moon planet by sputnik? You'll go there. You just always think of the moon and you'll go to the moon. It is simple process. And by this way, you cannot go. Now, exactly in the same way that you get the body of a fish and you very easily, whole day and night, for so many years, you jump over in the sea. So moon planet is one of the heavenly planets. There is process how to go to moon planet. In the Bhāgavata it is stated. Those who are karma-kāṇḍīya, very, discharging the Vedic ritualistic ceremony, karma-kāṇḍa, they can go to the moon planet or sun planet. There are millions and trillions of planets they can go. Yānti deva-vratā devān pitṟn yānti pitṛ-vratāḥ (BG 9.25). The same thing. Suppose if you want to go to India, you prepare yourself, take the visa, the permit, the passport and necessary money and permission, so many things. You go there. Yes.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: This is especially meant for the brāhmaṇas, intelligent. Go on.

Hṛdayānanda:

ko gṛheṣu pumān saktam

ātmānam ajitendriyaḥ

sneha-pāśair dṛḍhair baddham

utsaheta vimocitum

"What person too attached to household life due to being unable to control his senses can liberate himself? An attached householder is bound very strongly by ropes of affection for his family—wife, children and other relatives." Purport: "Prahlāda Mahārāja's first proposal was kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha: (SB 7.6.1) 'One who is sufficiently intelligent should use the human form of body from the very beginning of life—in other words, from the tender age of childhood—to practice the activities of devotional service, giving up all other engagements.' Dharmān bhāgavatān means the religious principle of reviving our relationship with the Supreme Personality of Godhead. For this purpose Kṛṣṇa personally advises, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja: (BG 18.66) 'Give up all other duties and surrender unto Me.' While in the material world we manufacture so many duties in the name of so many isms, but our actual duty is to free ourselves from the cycle of birth, death, old age and disease. For this purpose, one must first be liberated from material bondage, and especially from household life. Household life is actually a kind of license for a materially attached person by which to enjoy sense gratification under regulative principles. Otherwise there is no need of entering household life. Before entering household life, one should be trained as a brahmacārī, living under the care of the guru, whose place is known as the guru-kula. Brahmacārī guru-kule vasan dānto guror hitam (SB 7.12.1). From the very beginning, a brahmacārī is trained to sacrifice everything for the benefit of the guru. A brahmacārī is advised to go begging alms door to door, addressing all women as mother, and whatever he collects goes to the benefit of the guru. In this way he learns how to control his senses and sacrifice everything for the guru. When he is fully trained, if he likes he is allowed to marry. Thus he is not an ordinary gṛhastha who has learned only how to satisfy his senses. A trained gṛhastha can gradually give up household life and go to the forest to become increasingly enlightened in spiritual life and at last take sannyāsa. Prahlāda Mahārāja explained to his father that to be freed from all material anxieties one should go to the forest. Hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpam. One should give up his household, which is a place for going further and further down into the darkest regions of material existence. The first advice, therefore, is that one must give up household life (gṛham andha-kūpam). However, if one prefers to remain in the dark well of household life because of uncontrolled senses, he becomes increasingly entangled by ropes of affection for his wife, children, servants, house, money and so on. Such a person cannot attain liberation from material bondage. Therefore children should be taught from the very beginning of life to be first-class brahmacārīs. Then it will be possible for them to give up household life in the future. To return home, back to Godhead, one must be completely free from material attachment. Therefore, bhakti-yoga means vairāgya-vidyā, the art that can help one develop a distaste for material enjoyment.

vāsudeve bhagavati

bhakti-yogaḥ prayojitaḥ

janayaty āśu vairāgyaṁ

jñānaṁ ca yad ahaitukam

(SB 1.2.7)

'By rendering devotional service unto the Personality of Godhead, Śrī Kṛṣṇa, one immediately acquires causeless knowledge and detachment from the world.' If one engages in devotional service from the beginning of life, he easily attains vairāgya-vidyā, or asakti, detachment, and becomes jitendriya, the controller of his senses. One who perfectly engages in devotional service is therefore called gosvāmī or svāmī, master of the senses. Unless one is master of the senses, he should not accept the renounced order of life, sannyāsa. A strong inclination for sense enjoyment is the cause of the material body. Without full knowledge one cannot be unattached to material enjoyment, but as long as one is not in that position one is not fit to return home, back to Godhead."

Prabhupāda: Now discuss on this point.

Room Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: That is Kṛṣṇa's trick. Everyone talks of the "We Eastern, we believe in this," and "We Western, we believe in this." You remain peaceful, everyone. Everyone is thinking like this. We have no such thing, Eastern, Western. It is fact. For everyone, it is good. Eastern, Western, we don't take. Several times, this question.... I talk, I spoke in the American Embassy in Calcutta. They gave me the subject matter, "East and West." So I, in the beginning, I began to speak that we have no such dual..., East and West.

Hari-śauri: Hm. It's a higher consciousness.

Prabhupāda: If she can make samosā...

Hari-śauri: With the chewra.

Prabhupāda: No, chewra may be avoided. Samosā. One will do.

Hari-śauri: Either chewra or samosā, or both?

Prabhupāda: No. Either of them.

Hari-śauri: One or the other.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But I shall prefer samosā.

Hari-śauri: Oh, I'd better go down before she starts, then. (end)

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Kathy Kerr: Umm, I was wondering what brings you to Canada right now. Is it some particular occasion you're...

Prabhupāda: You can answer all these questions.

Jayādvaita: I can.... Why Śrīla Prabhupāda is coming, he's visiting different centers around the world. I can fill you in on most of the details about the society and dates and times and so on. You might prefer to ask Śrīla Prabhupāda a little more about the philosophy of our movement.

Kathy Kerr: Ah. Very well. Okay, I understand that this is an extension of Hindu religion. Is that not correct? No, it's not. Does it have any basic tenets of the Hindu religion?

Prabhupāda: There is no such word as Hindu religion. You do not know. There is no such word as Hindu religion, at least in the Vedas. The religion is translated into Sanskrit as "characteristic." Religion is not a kind of faith. Just like chemical composition. Sugar is sweet—that is religion. Sugar must be sweet. Sugar cannot be pungent. Or chili must be pungent. If chili is sweet, we reject it, and sugar is pungent, you reject it. Similarly, our Vedic system is to train the human being to the ultimate goal of his life. That system is called varṇāśrama-dharma, gradually training the person how to become perfect human being and understand the goal of his life. That is our activity. It is not meant for any particular sect or particular nation. No. It is meant for the whole human society, how to make them perfect in the goal of his life.

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: There are many Christian church we have converted temple. They sell for want of customer. And we purchase, we increase customers. But customer of the same place. That is the beauty. These customers, they are not brought from India. But formerly they were not coming here, now they are coming in crowd. In Los Angeles we purchased.... You have been in Los Angeles? Now we have got a regular colony. About one dozen big, big houses. So that was a church. Nobody was coming, they sold it to us. Now it is always crowded. This church, they were not going to sell us. But (laughs) under circumstances it came to us. We wanted to purchase it, but the proprietor would not sell to us. They were charging very big price. So we are prepared. Still he'll not agree. Now we have purchased less price. (to devotee:) What is the history?

Devotee: Well, the previous owner didn't want to sell it to the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. They said they'd prefer to burn it down. (Prabhupāda laughs) One Indian gentleman who is a prominent businessman in Toronto purchased it in trust, saying that he was representing some Indian social group. So he purchased it in trust. Then the chairman of the committee of trustees who were in charge of selling the church noticed some tilaka on Viśvakarmā's face. He had a hat on so his śikhā wouldn't show. When he saw it was Hare Kṛṣṇa, he became very disturbed.

Viśvakarmā: He said, "Oh, no, the Hare Kṛṣṇas."

Prabhupāda: So they are not very favorable to the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement. (laughs)

Indian man: How long did it take for Swamiji to write the seventeen volumes, translation of Caitanya-caritāmṛta?

Prabhupāda: It can be finished, but I have to look after this management, that is the difficulty.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Even in the stool, the worms in the stool, he's also thinking "I have got so much stool to eat." This same mastership. "I am the monarch of all I survey. I have got so much stool." And you just take the worm from the stool, put it here: "No, no, no, here is my enjoyment." This mastership mentality is there in Brahma, and the mastership mentality is there in the worm of the stool. This mentality you have to give up. Then you become liberated. That is liberation. The bondage is that mastership mentality. He's servant, but he's thinking falsely that he's master. Just like your President Nixon. He thought that "Now I have become master of America, I'm president." He forgot that he's servant. As soon as the people wanted, dragged him down. That he forgot, that "I'm servant of the people." So everyone is servant, but falsely thinking "I'm master." That is material disease. The best thing is that if I have to remain servant, why not become servant of Kṛṣṇa? That's all. That is perfection. That is perfect life. Even by becoming a false master of the whole American country, I was not happy, I am now dragged down as a common man, Mr. Nixon, then what is the use of becoming master? It is all false. Let me become servant of Kṛṣṇa; then it is perfect. Instead of becoming a false master of the American country, let me be a real servant of Kṛṣṇa. That is liberty, liberated. Because any stage of my life, to become master is false. That is not possible. He has to be convinced that he cannot be master. Your constitution is to remain servant. If you prefer to remain servant of a big populace in America... But you are servant; don't think you are master. That is sane. And soon as you commit mistake as master, immediately he's in trouble. Is it not? That's it. You give up this false notion that "I am master." Then your all welfare is there. We teach that ask a Godbrother, "Prabhu." Don't become master, but become servant. Prabhu means "my lord." So everyone, if you address each other "prabhu," that mastership mentality will be less. If you remember that "I am not master. I am servant." Then?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: "How he is put into such different bodies is explained here. It is due to association with the different modes of nature. One has to..."

Prabhupāda: Just like to eat anything and everything. It is different association. You go to the restaurant, you eat the intestine of pig. I've seen it. Is that anything eatable? But you have learned it on account of association. Karaṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgos 'sya. And if he remains with the Kṛṣṇa conscious, he eats kachorīs, samosā, prepared by Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja. (laughter) It is due to association. By bad association he'll have to eat up to the stool. Then?

Room Conversation -- June 24, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Buttermilk, yes, and in this way after drinking and eating so many things, whatever balance is there, churn it and they get ghee, and that ghee is kept in stock. On the market day, they go to the city and sell it. You'll find in Vṛndāvana, so many cultivators, they have brought ghee. So the inhabitants of the city, town, they require ghee, they purchase, and with that money they get some necessities, just like some oil or some spices, salt, like this, which is not available. In this way...

Hari-śauri: How is it they are so keen on buffalo milk in India?

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Hari-śauri: The Indians, they seem to prefer buffalo milk to cow milk.

Prabhupāda: No, cow milk is not available, therefore buffalo milk contains more fat. But milk means cow's milk. What is the daily milk?

Kīrtanānanda: About a thousand pounds.

Prabhupāda: Those who are meat-eaters, why don't you inform them, when a cow dies, that "You can take it."

Kīrtanānanda: That would be illegal.

Prabhupāda: Why? Legal, illegal, that is their whim.

Room Conversation -- July 7, 1976, Baltimore:

Prabhupāda: We have got our authority, I have got my authority, Bhāgavatam, Vedic literatures. Why shall I give you better preference, your authority? I have got my authority.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So we'll explain there are two types of acquiring knowledge. Two different techniques. Now the scientists are believing their own...

Prabhupāda: That is imperfect. Inductive knowledge is always imperfect. Deductive knowledge is perfect if it is taken from the authority. Suppose man is mortal. So inductive process is that you examine every man whether he's mortal or immortal. So suppose you have seen millions of men, and they are all mortal, they die. Then your conclusion is man is mortal. But I can say you have not seen a man who does not die. I can say that. So this inductive knowledge will remain always imperfect. It will never be perfect, because your examination is limited. So I can that say you have not seen the person, man... Suppose if I say you have not seen Vyāsadeva, he's immortal. You have not seen Aśvatthāmā, he's immortal. So how this scientific research can be perfect, inductive? It is never perfect. Because you may be missing somebody who is immortal. Then your conclusion is wrong. There is no scope of studying all the living beings. There is no such scope. You have limited scope. So your seeing power is limited. How you can decide from the limited seeing power?

Rūpānuga: They will say, "Well, we have done so many good things, we have produced so many nice things."

Prabhupāda: You have done nothing good, I say. You have simply wasted time and taken public money, that's all.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Dr. Sharma: Sarva-bhūtānām.

Prabhupāda: No, I have no, I mean to say, grudge against. If Kṛṣṇa wants... In old age I was living a retired life in Vṛndāvana. He asked me "Get out, go to America." So I came. At the age of seventy years, actually nobody goes out of home. But Kṛṣṇa asked me, "Get out and go." So I came. And although I have got the best temple in Vṛndāvana, I cannot live there. But a fighting soldier is honored by the government. He maybe dies, he is recognized by the government, "Here is a soldier, laid down his life by fighting." So we prefer that life. We shall die fighting with māyā.

Devotees: Jaya.

Dr. Sharma: It is said in śāstra that it is better to go out and find salvation for others than to find salvation for yourself.

Prabhupāda: One who seeks salvation for others, he's already salvation.

Devotees: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise, how he can arrange salvation for others? So he hasn't got to seek for salvation.

Dr. Sharma: How these devotees are finding salvation for others?

Prabhupāda: That means they are already in the platform of salvation.

Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Hari-śauri: He said he can understand meat-eating is sin, but when we are doing our ordinary work and normal functions, aren't we killing so many other things? So is that sin or not?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is also sin. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, that whatever you eat, bhuñjate te tv aghaṁ pāpā ye pacanty ātma-kāraṇāt (BG 3.13). Anyone is cooking something, meat or vegetables, for his own eating, he is eating only sin. It is not that the vegetarians are not sinful and the meat-eaters are sinful. Everyone is sinful if it is not cooked for Kṛṣṇa. It is not that we are propagating that you become vegetarian. We are propagating that you become Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is our propaganda. But because we are trying to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, we offer something to Kṛṣṇa. Patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). So not patraṁ puṣpam, whatever within this group available, fruits, flowers, grains, milk, so we offer to Kṛṣṇa. Yajña. Yajñārthāt karmaṇo 'nyatra loko 'yaṁ karma-bandhanaḥ (BG 3.9). If you do not perform yajña, then you will be bound up by the resultant action. So this is yajña, to offer to Kṛṣṇa. Yajña means to satisfy Viṣṇu. Viṣṇu-ārādhyate. Yajña means satisfy Kṛṣṇa. But if you don't Kṛṣṇa's prasādam, then you are sinful. Not that if you become vegetarian, then you are not sinful. Not that. Because you have to eat something. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. Either you eat vegetable or meat, you have to eat something. So somebody prefers eating animals, and somebody prefers eating vegetables, but all of them have got life. Therefore you cannot kill any life. So if you eat for yourself, then you are simply eating sin. Bhuñjate te tv aghaṁ pāpā ye pacanty ātma-kāraṇāt. But if you take Kṛṣṇa prasādam, then if there is any sin, it goes to Kṛṣṇa, you take pure prasādam. And Kṛṣṇa is apāpa-vidham. So our duty is to worship Kṛṣṇa and offer Him so many nice things—fruits, flowers, grains, milk, milk preparation. We are doing that. You are taking prasādam. So that is our business. Is it clear, your answer?

Indian man (5): Yes.

Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: To delude them. Read the purport.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "Lord Buddha, a powerful incarnation of the Personality of Godhead, appeared in the province of Gayā (Bihar) as the son of Añjanā, and he preached his own conception of nonviolence and deprecated even the animal sacrifices sanctioned in the Vedas. At the time when Lord Buddha appeared, the people in general were atheistic and preferred animal flesh to anything else. On the plea of Vedic sacrifice, every place was practically turned into a slaughterhouse, and animal killing was indulged in unrestrictedly. Lord Buddha preached nonviolence, taking pity on the poor animals. He preached that he did not believe in the tenets of the Vedas and stressed the adverse psychological effects incurred by animal killing. Less intelligent men of the age of Kali, who had no faith in God, followed his principle, and for the time being they were trained in moral discipline and nonviolence, the preliminary steps for proceeding further on the path of God realization. He deluded the atheists because such atheists who followed his principles did not believe in God, but they kept their absolute faith in Lord Buddha, who himself was the incarnation of God. Thus the faithless people were made to believe in God in the form of Lord Buddha. That was the mercy of Lord Buddha: he made the faithless faithful to him. Killing of animals before the advent of Lord Buddha was the most prominent feature of the society. They claimed that these were Vedic sacrifices. When the Vedas were not accepted through the authoritative disciplic succession, the casual readers of the Vedas are misled by the flowery language of that system of knowledge. In the Bhagavad-gītā a comment has been made on such foolish scholars. The foolish scholars of Vedic literature who do not care to receive the transcendental message through the transcendental realized sources of disciplic succession are sure to be bewildered. To them, the ritualistic ceremonies are considered to be all in all. They have no depth of knowledge. According to the Bhagavad-gītā, the whole system of the Vedas is to lead one gradually to the path of the Supreme Lord. The whole theme of Vedic literature is to know the Supreme Lord, the individual soul, the cosmic situation and the relations between all these items. When the relation is known, the relative function begins, and as a result of such a function the ultimate goal of life of going back to Godhead takes place in the easiest manner. Unfortunately, unauthorized scholars of the Vedas become captivated by the purificatory ceremonies only, and natural progress is checked thereby. To such bewildered persons of atheistic propensity, Lord Buddha is the emblem of theism. He therefore first of all wanted to check the habit of animal killing. The animal killers are dangerous elements on the path of going back to Godhead. There are two types of animal killers. The soul is also sometimes called the animal, or the living being. Therefore both the slaughterers of animals as well as those who have lost their identity as the soul are animal killers. Mahārāja Parīkṣit said that only the animal killer cannot relish the transcendental message of the Supreme Lord. Therefore if people are to be educated on the path of Godhead, they must be taught first and foremost to stop the process of animal killing as above mentioned. It is nonsensical to say that animal killing has nothing to do with spiritual realization. By this dangerous theory many so-called sannyāsīs have sprung up by the grace of Kali-yuga to preach animal killing under the garb of the Vedas."

Prabhupāda: Now there are so many rascals in this dress of sannyāsī, they are eating meat. That is going on. They say, "What is the wrong of eating meat? Can eat." They eat meat. Then?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "The subject matter has already been discussed in the conversation between Lord Caitanya and Maulana Chand Kazi Shaheb. The animal sacrifice as stated in the Vedas is different from the unrestricted animal killing in the slaughterhouse."

Prabhupāda: There, your question.

Conversation After Interview with Religious Editor, Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Oh, your business.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's nice.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: They always decide on perfect timing.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. I shall prefer to see the Trans-India first, because they will give some publicity to our movement.

Rādhāvallabha: So we'll tell the doctor to please wait?

Prabhupāda: Yes. All right, he has gone to where?

Rādhāvallabha: He may bring the doctor up first.

Prabhupāda: All right, let him come. So who is the chief man dealing with this, who is the chief secretary, all these visitors?

Rādhāvallabha: Bali-mardana has been greeting them, because Rāmeśvara is involved in the GBC meeting.

Prabhupāda: So you have been in the GBC meeting?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes, I was earlier.

Prabhupāda: What is the subject matter?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: We discussed Jagadīśa Prabhu's request to primarily attend his engagement with Gurukula, and we also discussed Satsvarūpa Gosvāmī's desire to attend primarily Library Party.

Prabhupāda: It is good proposal.

Conversation with George Harrison -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Six years, yes. So we are inviting everyone, "Come here. Such a nice house given by George (laughs). You live here comfortably, eat nicely, and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." We don't want any factory work.

George Harrison: No.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Simply kartal and mṛdaṅga. Still, people do not come. They'll prefer to go the factory, whole day work in the hell. (laughs) They prefer.

George Harrison: I suppose some day the whole of the world will just be chanting in the country.

Prabhupāda: That is not possible, but if some of the leading men, they take it seriously, then others will follow. Just like in our book, your signature is there, "Oh, George Harrison. Yes." They take it without any consideration. Kṛṣṇa book. Yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas tad tad evetaro janaḥ (BG 3.21). If the leading man does something, then his followers also do. This is the way. So if some of the leading men of the world, they take this movement seriously, then people will be happy. There's no doubt about it. You have come alone, without any associate?

George Harrison: Just on my own.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: You can tell these things. These ordinary things you can say.

Jayatīrtha: It's being recorded now. It's being recorded directly for the radio program now.

Mukunda: Śrīla Prabhupāda was a student of a great spiritual teacher in India, Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī.

Mike Robinson: There's a problem with me asking him questions, is it?

Mukunda: Well, these are, just these preliminary questions. He prefers to discuss mostly the philosophical side. This is like background.

Mike Robinson: So perhaps I'd like an interview with you as well.

Jayatīrtha: That would be good.

Mukunda: You want to do it now or later?

Mike Robinson: It would perhaps be easier if I could do that one first. You could answer the ones that.... So which questions would he be happier answering? What you believe, that sort of?

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Mike Robinson: And develop from that. I'm sorry about that. If I ask you a few questions about what you believe and that sort of, along those lines, and then get some of the background material from some of your other members of the movement. Can you tell me what you believe, what is the philosophy of the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement?

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is not a question of belief, it is a science, a spiritual movement. Just like a man is living and he's dead, what is the difference? The difference is that the spirit soul or the living force is out of the body. Therefore he's called dead body. So there are two things, anyone can appreciate. One, this body, and other, the living force of the body. So we are speaking of the living force of the body. That is the difference between material and spiritual. As such, in the beginning, it is very difficult for ordinary man to understand what is our movement, but our movement begins when one understands that he is soul or something other than this body. Then this movement begins.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: But we do not deprecate. We simply say that do whatever you like, but do not forget your real business, self-realization, ātma-tattvam. Self-realization, that is required. And if we live like cats and dogs and again become cats and dogs and pigs, that is not success. But there is chance if one does not know ātma-tattva. Nature's law will work. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, your son is sleeping?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: No, this is not my son.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: This is salt, Śrīla Prabhupāda. This is watermelon, this is a different kind of melon. You prefer it here?

Prabhupāda: This is local product?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Take some?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes, please, please, Śrīla Prabhupāda. If you like little salt on it?

Harikeśa: Can I have the key? To lock up the passports and...

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: This is a drink, Śrīla Prabhupāda, made of some melon, different melon.

Prabhupāda: This is also local?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Yes, that is very local. Is that sweet, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, it is nice.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- August 9, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: We are afraid of these two classes of rascals. "Afraid of" means we don't want their association. It is very dangerous.

Pradyumna: You said in the Bhāgavatam just that, that we are afraid of the materialistic men.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Personally I feel, I have several times told. For a devotee to live with nondevotees is so obnoxious and troublesome, it is sometimes mentioned, better to remain within a cage surrounded by fire, and still, don't remain with nondevotees. You prefer to live within a cage surrounded by fire. That living is preferable than to live with this nondevotee class.

Hari-śauri: A lot of the devotees had that experience living with their parents before they joined the movement. It was so hellish they had to get out. Then they, some way or other, met...

Prabhupāda:

tāṅdera caraṇa-sebi-bhakta-sane bās

janame janame hoy ei abhilāṣ

Bhakta-sane bās, that is the essential part of progressing. Dayānanda's daughter came today, in my lavatory.

Hari-śauri: When you were in?

Prabhupāda: Yes, I was going... (break) Generally, this baḍā are made with paṭola(?) leaves, paṭola leaves mashed and mixed with this dahi.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Jñānagamya: It's the worst place in the country. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: But I did not know. Mukunda suggested this is good place, all right, live here. And actually happened to be good place. Gradually, all my disciples came. So I had no disturbance. I was living in the Bowery Street, and on my door these bums were lying with urine and wine bottles and everything. Still, they were so respectful. When I'll come, "Yes, you can enter. Please." (laughter) I had no quarrel with them. They were very kind. They welcomed me, they opened the door, "Please go." They also knew that "He's a harmless..." So, platform, if you remain on the spiritual platform, this material condition cannot hamper you. Ahaituky apratihatā. Then yenātmā suprasīdati, in that condition you can execute. First of all, we have to ascertain on which platform we shall stand. And if you want to stand on the spiritual platform, nothing can check it. That is not conditioned. So why not stand directly to the spiritual platform and make you life successful? That is our preaching. People in general, they do not know the importance of the spiritual platform. Therefore they prefer to stay in the material platform. They have no sufficient education.

Evening Darsan -- August 10, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That tendency is here. Because we are very small fragment of spiritual identity, that tendency is there. The example is given, just like fire and spark of the fire. The fire and the spark, the spark is very small, but it is fire. And the big fire, together they look very beautiful. With the fire, when the sparks come-sput sput—so many sparks, it looks very beautiful. But the sparks sometimes fall down from the original fire. Then it is no more fire. It is fire, but it's extinguished. The illumination is over. So we are small particles of God. God is big fire; we are small particles of God. So we are playing with the big fire very nice, but there is chance of falling down. That chance is there. The big fire does not fall. The big fire is always blazing. But the small fire, although it is possessing the same quality of fire, it may fall down. So we are small particle, very, very small, atomic portion God. Therefore we have got the tendency to be separated from the big fire, and then we begin our material body. Just like another crude example, just like a very rich man's son, he's enjoying life. Sometimes he thinks, "Why not independently live? Why dependent of father?" He goes out and he becomes a hippie. There are many examples. He was living very comfortably, rich man's son, but he left the house of his father and became a hippie. There are many practical examples. Why does he do so? I have seen in Allahabad one big lawyer, very famous lawyer, Ferolal Bannerji. He had two sons. One son became a good barrister like him, and another son became a car-wala, driving a car. The reason was that this son, a car-wala, he fell in love with a low-class woman, and he preferred to remain a car-wala.

Hari-śauri: What is that?

Prabhupāda: Low-class woman. So she was living in a cottage, hut, cottage. So out of love he also preferred that "I shall live with her, and I shall drive a car." So that is independence. He preferred. So that discrimination preference is there always. You can prefer a low-grade life out of your discretion. Nobody can check you. And by cultivation of knowledge, you can become a big man. The two tendencies are there. There is no stereotyped idea. Otherwise, he has no independence. Who was speaking of that owl? There is an animal, owl. He doesn't like to remain in the sunlight. So that is also an animal. He is also eating, sleeping, mating, but he doesn't like the sunlight. What can you do? So God has given him all facility to remain as an owl, in darkness. That is God's kindness.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Harikeśa: Well, it's better to take that check than no check.

Prabhupāda: A foolish rascal will accept. (laughter) You are rascal number one. You can accept that check, we are not going to. He's proved that you are rascal number one. It is better to have a check. It is better to have a post-check. Just see, these rascals are there. They prefer to be cheated. This is the, going on. Therefore these rascals get drunk. Because there are so many poor drunkards there, they will accept this check and they go on cheating, postdated check.

Jñānagamya: The scientists are saying, "We are going to find out."

Prabhupāda: That's all right. That is postdated check, that I am explaining. Why don't you understand it?

Jñānagamya: But the religionists, they say "We don't know."

Prabhupāda: No, we do not say about religion. We are talking of science. It will take three millions of years to understand religion for these rascals. They are now animals. Religion is not so easy thing to be understood by the cats and dogs. Religion is meant for the human being. In the human society there is religion, not in the dog society or the cats and dogs. They do not understand religion means they are cats and dogs, they are not human beings. Human being is that: athāto brahma jijñāsā, to inquire about the nature of God. That is human being. Otherwise cats and dogs.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That I am speaking, that this is the only chance of Kṛṣṇa, guru, and if he neglects this chance, then tanwan sthito hi ga(?). What is the loss more than that? We are simply calculating loss and gain. Just imagine what is the loss by misusing this human form of body. If you want to spoil this life under the influence of misleaders, you can do it. But if you prefer to take the sense of following leadership of Kṛṣṇa, then our life... Mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. That comes mām ekam, ekam—then your life is successful. Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ: (BG 18.66) "I'll give you protection in all respects." So if we don't take this opportunity, then we are cutting our own throat. Do it, you can do it. Who can save you?

Jñānagamya: You have said it's like two airplanes. If an airplane is in trouble, no other airplane can help.

Prabhupāda: God can help. Other airplane cannot. If God likes, He can save you.

Hari-śauri: You were saying that if one is intelligent he can just accept the father's instruction, and he knows it will be good. But most people have such bad experience that every time they've accepted instruction they've just been cheated, that they're a little slow to...

Prabhupāda: What is it? No, you said, cheated or...?

Hari-śauri: You were saying that by intelligence one can just accept what the father says will be good for him and he'll do it, but most people have such a bad experience in the material world, they get cheated so often...

Prabhupāda: That is his misfortune, if the father is cheating him. So that means he's most unfortunate. Father is not expected to cheat the son, but if he's cheated by the father, then he must accept himself as most unfortunate cheated in the world. Then there is no help. Because he's so unfortunate that he's under the care of a cheater father, then what can be done? Nobody expects that father will cheat. And nowadays it is coming. Mother is cheating, mother is killing, father is cheated. Yes. It is Kali-yuga.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Dayānanda: But I mean rebelliousness. Everyone should...

Prabhupāda: So whatever you like, you can do. Kṛṣṇa says that you have got intelligence. "You consider, I have spoken to you. Now you use your intelligence and do whatever you like." Kṛṣṇa does not deny your intelligence. There is no meaning. You have got your intelligence. That is your... Training, you take Kṛṣṇa's training. If you don't take, then you remain in your own training. Kṛṣṇa is training you, He says sarva-dharmān parityajya mām (BG 18.66), but if you don't take His training, then you remain in your own training. Who objects? Remain a rascal. Who objects? Continue to become a rascal. What can be done? That yathecchasi tathā kuru is already said. You use your intelligence. If you prefer to remain rascal, you remain. Kṛṣṇa does not say that "Don't use your intelligence." What does He say? But if you are actually intelligent, then you'll think that, "Who can be more intelligent than Kṛṣṇa? Let me take His advice." That is real intelligence. Why shall I use my tiny intelligence? That is real intelligence.

Morning Walk, House Visit, Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: For restaurant, very nice. (some conversing as lady shows them through)

Dayānanda: Very nice kitchen, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It's a good size kitchen.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: That kitchen can be extended.

Prabhupāda: Thank you.

Dayānanda: An adjoining room for storage.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Would you like one of these peaches, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Yes, that's right, that's right. Would you prefer an orange? Can I skin this?

Hari-śauri: I can cut an orange.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Orange?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Cut into pieces, give me. Give me little.

Pradyumna: Bitter skin. Sometimes there are amoebas on the outside.

Nava-yauvana: The location is very central. In the city it's very central. (end)

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Jayapatākā: Even if people give, a life, patron member, 2,222, if they are not so big, they want to give in installment and even though they'll give at one time with postdated... They want different receipt because if they give one lump sum, then it makes it seem that they are very rich. Although they'll give you at one time, they want small, small receipt so that the income tax won't think, "Oh, they are are giving so much donation? They must be very rich. They must have hidden wealth which we can capture from them by investigation." So in this way they are very much pressurized. Sometimes they prefer to give money without receipt.

Prabhupāda: Soon the whole, our program is going on.

Gargamuni: Oh, yes. No, it's going on more. The book distribution is going on more. More people are joining. There's no hindrance.

Prabhupāda: That I want.

Jayapatākā: These are simply minor obstacles.

Hari-śauri: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Pālikā was just wondering if you wanted anything tonight.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If she can... She can make little vegetable, potato, tomato.

Hari-śauri: Puris?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Or one paraṭā. One paraṭā.

Hari-śauri: Just potatoes and tomato?

Prabhupāda: Yes, tomato, potato, one vegetable.

Room Conversation -- August 22, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Keep your health nice, because Indian climate sometimes does not suit. Eat simple things. Fruits, vegetables. Don't be miser in the matter of... But don't eat voraciously. Eat sufficiently, nutritious.

Gargamuni: Yes. I have also told they should eat nice fruits and vegetable so they will keep healthy.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Vegetable, fruits, very innocent, little milk. That's all. Even if you don't eat these foodgrains, that is preferred. Better. Vegetable and fruits and milk, that is sufficient nutritious. There is no question of disease. But for our tongue taste we eat so many cooked food, but if we eat vegetables, boiled vegetables and fruits and milk, ah, it is sufficient. Ekādaśī. (laughter) Daily ekādaśī.

And these peanuts, a few grains. Not much. That is also nice. Cashew, peanut. Yes. So thank you very much. You are working so much for Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission. Yāre dekha tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). Bas. You become a guru. Actually you are doing the guru's work. "Here is a message from Kṛṣṇa. Please take it." Bas. Simple. Yāre dekha. And whomever you meet, tāre kaha kṛṣṇa-upadeśa. Either you speak personally or give him a book.

Maṇihāra: This is the noon paper published...

Prabhupāda: "Explosion." Mahāṁśa Swami is continuing this.

Prabhā Viṣṇu: Yes.

Prabhupāda: It looks nice.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The Ceylon is educated and if they are receiving, why not open a branch?

Hari-śauri: (continues reading) "He recently returned home after almost 3 years in India. My husband and I could see the awareness and maturity in him gained from his experiences in working with the Indian people. He learned first-hand about a different culture and it certainly has enriched his life. In our minds we can compare our son's life to the life of a Catholic monk or a religious Jew of the Hasidic sect. Do I think that my son is brainwashed? I can best answer this by answering the question, is our whole society not being brainwashed daily by the advertisement media? Liquor, smoking, pornographic movies and literature and which is worse? And what about the children who are being educated by the violence and killing on T.V.? I prefer that my son is devoting his life to the love of God and the service of humanity, a rare endeavor in this age. Since I know that my son has voluntarily chosen the Hare Kṛṣṇa Movement to exercise these rights and that he can leave it whenever he wishes I cannot see how the term 'brainwashing' can be applicable to this movement. I sincerely believe from my contacts with many devotees that they are happy and have found fulfillment by loving and serving Lord Kṛṣṇa, God. This may not be my wish for my life but my son has chosen it for his, and I whole heartedly respect it."

Guest: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes. (Bengali conversation) (end)

Evening Darsana -- December 3, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: "They say." Therefore they are nonsense, mūḍha, rascals. They do not know what is God, what is demigod, what is Lord Śiva, what is Lord Viṣṇu or Brahmā. They do not know. If a woman says, "Oh, everyone is my husband," then she is a prostitute. That's all. A chaste woman will say, "No, there is one, my husband. That's all." That is chaste woman. And if she is liberal, if she says, "No, no, everyone is my husband," that means she is prostitute. She does not know what is value of husband. In Bhagavad-gītā Kṛṣṇa says, kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ prapadyante anya devatāḥ: (BG 7.20) "Those who have adhered to other demigods, they have lost their intelligence," hṛta-jñānāḥ, "rascals." They'll go. Kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ prapadyante anya devatāḥ, antavat tu phalaṁ teṣāṁ tad bhavaty alpa-medhasām (BG 7.23). Because they are rascals, they prefer like that. The public opinion will be taken out; Kṛṣṇa's opinion will be... Public is rascals. They can say all nonsense. That is not to be taken. You have to take—that is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement—what Kṛṣṇa says. What do you think? Kṛṣṇa says, kāmais tais tair hṛta-jñānāḥ prapadyante anya devatāḥ (BG 7.20).

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So we have to get the train from Dadar.

Mr. Gupta: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Dadar is nearer.

Dr. Patel: It must be stopping at Thana also. No?

Mr. Gupta: We had the option of going either on 10th night or 11th morning. But we preferred 11th morning for the same reason.

Prabhupāda: 10th night means?

Mr. Gupta: By Calcutta Mail, or there's a special leaving for Allahabad. There's a special train. We are running Kumbhamela specials.

Prabhupāda: This one.

Mr. Gupta: This one is a regular train. This is Varanasi Express.

Dr. Patel: A special must not have first-class. Has it?

Mr. Gupta: Special has first-class.

Dr. Patel: That special will be better than.

Mr. Gupta: No, it won't be because it leaves on 10th night and it will only go to Naini. It won't go to Allahabad.

Dr. Patel: Isn't it faster...

Prabhupāda: And it changes. You have to change again. From Naini you have to change.

Discussion on Deprogrammers -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is better. That is better. To write some letters here, that is not so important. But if he can preach and he... At least, we are expecting... He's old sannyāsī. He knows how to preach. Let him do that.

Jagadīśa: So I'll suggest that he goes straight to America instead of coming here.

Prabhupāda: If he's coming here, let him come. We shall talk together. There is no secrecy.

Jagadīśa: I'll leave it up to him, as he prefers.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If he's coming, don't stop him. That is...

Rāmeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, I've got a letter here from Jayādvaita and from Jagannātha dāsa regarding some corrections. These are two books that are in production right now. So would it be all right to ask you them?

Prabhupāda: What is that book? (break) Sarvātmana yaḥ śaraṇaṁ śaraṇyam. Factually Kṛṣṇa is the ultimate shelter. If he has taken that shelter, he's free, immune. And that Kṛṣṇa has confirmed here. Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo... (BG 18.66). If he's not Kṛṣṇa conscious, then if he gives such a duty, he's liable to fall down. Therefore Kṛṣṇa says ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣ... "Because you are giving up all other duties, don't think that you'll be liable to punishment. I'll give you protection." So the conclusion is: if one is not fully Kṛṣṇa conscious, then he's obliged to do his duty. This is the easiest way to become free from all obligation—to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. That, I think, duśyanta-rāja?

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Trivikrama: We invite them to come and join us.

Prabhupāda: That they will not. Why there? Here also. They are envious for this Hare Kṛṣṇa, but when you call, "You come and live here," that they will avoid. They're envious of my opulence, and when I say, invite, "You come also and join," "No. I'll rot as hog. That's all. I prefer this hoggish life."

Trivikrama: And the she-hog.

Dr. Patel: This will create a sort of a turmoil...

Prabhupāda: It has already created.

Dr. Patel: ...America at this particular judgment.

Prabhupāda: Everywhere.

Dr. Patel: It will create much more turmoil.

Trivikrama: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: The more they create turmoil, the more we become famous.

Haṁsadūta: They say mind control and brainwashing, Śrīla Prabhupāda, but actually that is what you are doing. You are cleaning our brain and teaching us how to control our minds.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Our method is ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). Yes, actually it is washing.

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Faith. Yes. Faith means firm faith. Faith does not mean... Anyway, ādau śraddhā. This śraddhā, if we increase this śraddhā, you have to associate with sādhu.. And who is sādhu? Bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva samantavyaḥ. He is sādhu, who is simply engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service. He is sādhu. Api cet sudurācāraḥ: "Even though you find there is some discrepancies in his character, because he is fully engaged in My service, he is sādhu." Sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ samyag vyavasito hi saḥ (BG 9.30). If he has got other engagement, he is not sādhu. Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam: (Brs. 1.1.11) "Other engagement zero." That is sādhu. The sādhu-saṅga (CC Madhya 22.83). You have to associate with such sādhus who are cent percent engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service. Ādau śraddhā tato sādhu-saṅgaḥ tato bhajana-kriyā. If you mix with the sādhu, then you'll learn the activities. Sādhu-mārgānugamanam. The sādhus are rising early in the morning; they are attending maṅgala ārati, they are reading Bhagavad-gītā, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, then dressing the Deity and having ārati and so on, so on, so on. This is called bhajana-kriyā. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgo 'tha bhajana (Cc. Madhya 23.14-15). Then anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt: then all these material activities will stop. Because if you are engaged in spiritual act..., where is your time for material activities, for drinking wine and eating meat and going to the restaurant and...? No time. These boys, although they are trained up from childhood how to eat meat, how to drink, but now they have no time. They never ask me, "Swamiji, give me one rupee. I shall go to the cinema." Never. They have no time. Anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt, all anarthas finished. These are the stages. Then his life becomes of devotion. Athāsaktiḥ niṣṭhā: "Yes, I shall stick to Kṛṣṇa consciousness." Tato niṣṭhā ruciḥ. Ruciḥ means taste. Unless they have got taste, why they should remain with me? They are not coming from poor family. His father is a big lawyer. You know? Yes. So why he is living with me? He has got taste, rucis. Tato niṣṭhā tato ruciḥ, athāsaktiḥ. Asaktiḥ, attachment. Whenever I am there, they are coming. Asaktiḥ. Tato bhāvaḥ. "Oh, I am servant of Kṛṣṇa. I have to do this." These are the different stages. Sādhakānām ayaṁ premṇaḥ prādurbhāve bhavet kramaḥ. These are the different stages, kramaḥ. Kramaḥ means gradual evolution. So you have to take that gradual evolution. But it will be done if you remain with the associate. Saṅgāt sañjāyate kāmaḥ. They are giving this opportunity. Come here in our association and learn the art. I have seen in Bombay. The other day I went to a gentleman's apartment. He is.... The gentleman is earning two thousand, and the wife is earning seven hundred. But they are living in an apartment of this size. Within this, there is bedroom, and there is kitchen, and there is toilet, and everything is there. And if we say people, "Please come here. Take a room like this and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa," they'll not come. They'll prefer to remain in that tiny apartment. Am I right or not? Manda-bhāgyā. Mandāḥ sumanda-matayo manda-bhāgyā hy upadrutāḥ (SB 1.1.10). Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu has declared, ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa bhramite kono bhāgyavān jīva. They are rotting or rotating within this universe in different species of life. But if by chance he becomes fortunate, then take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I don't think India can make such quality.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: But the Gītā we did came very close, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: It may come to close, but not to... Then that's all right. If it is possible, we can...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Like Jayatīrtha wrote to me. He prefers the Indian Gītā to the American because it is economical.

Rāmeśvara: Because it is... Yes, because of the price.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. We all have to be realistic. The price...

Prabhupāda: Now Jayatīrtha is going first in selling, more than anyone.

Rāmeśvara: During the... During one week of Christmas he defeated Los Angeles. (Prabhupāda chuckles)

Jagadīśa: He's taking (indistinct).

Rāmeśvara: Oh, yes, he did.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: He was third on that list.

Rāmeśvara: His one temple defeated any other temple. His one temple was the number one temple, but as a whole zone...

Prabhupāda: Jayatīrtha is also good business. (chuckles) He has got good business brain. So do it nicely and Kṛṣṇa...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: This will be very good.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: We say... We say that, that we simply say, that "You change your consciousness."

Rāmeśvara: Not change your dress, but change your consciousness.

Prabhupāda: No, we never said. If you prefer that kind of dress, costly, you prefer it, but we are simplified.

Rāmeśvara: It's our choice.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: As a person becomes more purified, then he'll simplify himself anyway. And if he really cultivates a desire to...

Prabhupāda: Now, nowadays coat-pant is very costly. If you can spend your money, costly dress, we have no objection. Then you have to earn more; you have to work more. Therefore we are simplified.

Rāmeśvara: Ultimately, it is the best thing.

Prabhupāda: If they want to come in that dress, come in. If you want, come in.

Rāmeśvara: I have been studying this record business in the last month or two.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Rāmeśvara: I've been studying the record business in America. People spend more money on records than they do on books. In general people are buying more records than books.

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Give them some seat. Is there any carpet? Bring something.

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: That is... That is some...

Hari-śauri: But we have to show them that it's good.

Prabhupāda: And "You do not know what is good. It is good. We have given up these bad habits, sinful life. It is not... But you have no idea that these are good. You have idea, but out of your definite malice you cannot appreciate. You are spending millions of dollars for giving up this LSD, and our power is so strong, as soon as one comes, he gives up. But you are so rascal, you do not appreciate. That means you are rascal. Our power is there; our reaction is there for good. That's a fact. But you cannot understand. You are so rascal; you are so fallen down. The same, like the hog. He does not know what is the..., how nice is halavā. You give him halavā; he'll not take it. He will take stool. That is his misfortune. It cannot say that halavā is bad, but he cannot appreciate because he's hog. He'll prefer to eat stool. We are giving up these nonsense, nasty things. You cannot appreciate. 'Oh, they are giving up meat-eating? It is brainwashing.' You are so low, hog life." Tell them like that. "As the hog cannot appreciate what is the value of nice halavā, similarly you cannot appreciate. Your brain has to be washed. Please come inside. We shall wash it." Is it not?

Rāmeśvara: Yes.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Rāmeśvara: That's what I'm saying. To find the proper engagement, the best utilization of every man's...

Prabhupāda: This is very good engagement, very good engagement. Go door to door. I don't mind if you no sell. But you have gone. That's all. I don't mind. It is not business, that "Because you could not sell anything, your salary will be dismissed." No. There is no such question.

Rāmeśvara: But then they feel dissatisfied. Then they would prefer to do something else where they can perform better. They can accomplish something more.

Prabhupāda: No, no. No, no, no.

Hari-śauri: Our devotees tend to work on a fruitive basis.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Hari-śauri: If they don't get some result from their activity, they become discouraged.

Rāmeśvara: In other words, sometimes...

Prabhupāda: Now, who said that "You don't bring money"? But I am not discouraging you, even if you don't bring money.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: But for a hog, halavā...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: A hog would rather eat stool.

Prabhupāda: And bring that also: "Before the hog, you give him stool and halavā; he will prefer to take the stool." So let it be extremely exposed. We are fighting. Let them be exposed. What is the wrong there?

Gargamuni: We should, in our attack...

Hari-śauri: They're criticizing us. We should point out their defects.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: That attack is the best form of defense.

Gargamuni: "You're a drunkard, you're a smoker, and you're doing all these things." We should turn the tide and expose them.

Prabhupāda: There are many opinion that "This movement is... Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam will save the human society." There are many opinions like that. That's a fact.

Conversation During Massage -- January 23, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Why not?

Rāmeśvara: Say, at Ratha-yātrā time.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Rāmeśvara: Big parades.

Prabhupāda: But America has money. Here they have no money. So preference should be given in India. They're poor.

Rāmeśvara: We can take a little bit out for these festivals in America.

Prabhupāda: Yes, if required, if required.

Rāmeśvara: If required.

Prabhupāda: Just see. One family came, and I gave them little prasādam, dahl bhatta only. How nicely they took. Yes.

Hari-śauri: Yes. Dahl and rice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And they were fully satisfied. So in all our temple at least for ten men, twenty men.

Rāmeśvara: That the temple can support.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Āsuram. This is the defect. "Why shall I hear Kṛṣṇa? Oh, here is a big politician. He is commenting." Just see. What is this? For the big politicians, you sacrifice Kṛṣṇa? In the beginning you are finished. Then how you'll make progress?

Guest (2): Politician is wrong.

Prabhupāda: They'll prefer, because to hear Kṛṣṇa is difficult. They'll accept some rascal who will make meaning here and there. That is...

Guest (7) (Indian man): Can anything be called religion without devotion? Can anything be called religion...

Prabhupāda: First of all we must understand what do you mean by religion. First of all let me know. What do you mean by religion? Hm? Religion means, according to Vedic śāstra, dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam (SB 6.3.19). "Religion means the law given by God." It is very simple. But is you do not know what is God and if you do not know what law He has given, then where is religion? This is cheating. Just like law means the principle or the regulation given by the state, by the government. That is law, not that you manufacture some law at your home, as it is going on—yato mata tato patha. You manufacture something, rascal law, and that becomes a religion. That is not religion. Religion means the law given by God, simple law. So if you do not know what is God and if you do not know what law he has given, then where is your religion? There is no religion. Without understanding of God and without understanding of the law as given by God, then there is no religion. That is cheating in the name of religion.

Train Conversation -- February 4, 1977, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: "...prefer that I do not see the face of nondevotee."

Hari-śauri: You quote that in the Nectar of Devotion.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Actually yes. This society, modern, it is very painful to see even their face. They have fallen so much down that by seeing their face you become polluted. Last night they disturbed so much. And they are happy.

Hari-śauri: Actually they're not happy, but they make a show of happiness.

Prabhupāda: No, they think they're happy. They think they are very happy. They're enjoying life.

Satsvarūpa: But we have to take the risk to go and see their face, to preach to them.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But if you are engaged in preaching, you are not affected. (break) ...Himalaya just to avoid seeing the face of the vicious.

Satsvarūpa: In Bhagavad-gītā one of the items of knowledge is to go to a solitary place...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Only vaiśya community.

Prabhupāda: Some were, not all. And the Muhammadans, the could not convert any gentleman to Muhammadanism. Maybe one or two, say. Very... And similarly, Christian also. No high-class man became Christian. One or two. That is for some other purpose. Just like in Scottish Churches College, the Christian Indians were given more preference. There was one Mr. Raya. He would not speak in Bengali. Even if some Bengali student would like to talk with him Bengali, he would answer in English. (laughs) He was so sharp. (Bengali) (Hindi) You understand Hindi any of you? There is a song in the Howrah Bridge, pontoon bridge. So when this Howrah Bridge..., not this bridge. Up to 1900... When my daughter was married, in 1941, up to that time there was a bridge connecting Howrah and Calcutta, pontoon bridge. That we were seeing from childhood, from our birth. So this was an astonishment in India. They wrote song, (Hindi), that "How wonderful bridge this sāheb company...," because India was being governed by East Indian Company... After mutiny, Queen Victoria took charge. Otherwise the British government was known as Company Raja Sahib, East India Company. So the East India Company, they constructed this temple, er, bridge. So there is a song, (Hindi), like that. So this East India Company... Therefore this railway was known, "East India Railway." That is the first beginning of railway, from Calcutta to Burdwan, beginning of Ind... There was no railway in India.

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Brahmānanda: Now they have stopped. No more Indian doctors in America.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They won't give any more doctor degrees to Indians, because they're taking over the whole medical profession.

Prabhupāda: In England also, they prefer Indian medical men.

Hari-śauri: They've done that already. The whole medical profession runs on Indians.

Prabhupāda: They prefer. Public likes Indian medical men because they take more care.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're more intelligent 'cause they know about the soul. They care about the person more.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I know. In England they like Indian doctors. And last time, when I was in London, the Civil Surgeon, he was a Bengali. This Aurobindo's father, he was a medical practitioner. Aurobindo was born in London. He was English-born, yes. His father, Dr. Monmohan Ghosh, he was medical man there. So although he was British-born, he became enemy of the British. (drinks medicine?) Very bad medicine. (laughs)

Room Conversation -- February 16, 1977, Mayapura:

Jayapatākā: They could have chanted Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: No... Even Hare Kṛṣṇa people. Nāviviktāsano bhavet, mātrā svasrā duhitrā vā (SB 9.19.17). It is strictly forbidden: "You should not sit alone even with your mother, sister or daughter, what to speak of wife." Balavān indriya-grāmo vidvāṁsam api karṣati: "The senses are so strong, even learned persons, advanced, they also become victimized." Balavān indriya-grāmaḥ. Balavān means very strong. When the... It is forbidden even with mother, sister or..., and daughter. That is the only capturing instrument in the material world. Maithunyam agāra, prison house of sex, this material world. It is a prison house, but locked up by sex. The ordinary prison house, they are locked up by guards, and here the locking process is sex. Maithunyam agāra. The words are selected in Bhāgavata. They are thinking free. (laughs) They are imprisoned, locked up. And everyone falsely thinking, "I am free. Our nation is free. I am free." What nonsense free? You are locked up already. That he does not... Now this word is used, maithunyam agāram ajñaḥ. He has preferred to remain in this prison locked up by sex because he is rascal. Maithunyam agāram ajñaḥ.

Room Conversation about BTG the Moon -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Same position.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is the traditional system. After you win the case, then you turn around and sue them. We may not get, because we're suing the city. Anyway, then we can get more opportunity for furthering our propaganda if we file another suit. Tomorrow will you go on a walk, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: I can go.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Will you be walking on the roof or down below? Which do you prefer?

Prabhupāda: I can go down very well.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You like it down.

Prabhupāda: On the pond side

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Would you like us to bring that chair over to the pond to carry you up to the pond?

Prabhupāda: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don't mind those steps going up?

Prabhupāda: No. They say they have gone from the paper. We say from the paper they have not gone. Then where is the difference? We have got our paper; they have got their paper. They say they have gone. Nobody has gone with them. I have not gone. They have not gone. They say from the paper.

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes. You can get this light on.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Washington, March 18th. The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement was called a 'bona fide religion' yesterday by the New York high-court justice who threw out two charges against the officials of the movement of 'illegal imprisonment' and 'attempted extortion.' A charge had been preferred by an angry parent that his son, as well as another disciple, had been held by the movement illegally and that they had been brainwashed. 'The entire and basic issue before the court,' said the Justice in dismissing the charges, 'is whether or not the two alleged victims in this case and the defendants will be allowed to practice the religion of their choice, and this must be answered with a resounding affirmative.' Said Mr. Justice John J. Lee, 'The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement is a bona fide religion with roots in India that go back thousands of years. It behooved Merrilee Kreshower and Edward Shapiro to follow the tenets of that faith, and their inalienable right to do so will not be trampled upon.' " This is all quote. " 'The separation of Church and State must be maintained. We are and must remain a nation of laws, not of men. The presentment and indictment by the Grand Jury was in direct and blatant violation of the defendants' Constitutional rights.' The Justice said that it appeared to the court that 'The people rest their case on an erroneous minor premise to arrive at a fallacious conclusion. The record is devoid of one specific allegation of a misrepresentation or any act of deception on the part of any defendant.' The Justice said, 'The freedom of religion is not to be abridged because it is unconventional in its beliefs and practices or because it is approved or disapproved by the mainstream of society or more conventional religions. Without this proliferation and freedom to follow the dictates of one's own conscience in this search for the approach to God, the freedom of religion will be a meaningless right as provided for in the Constitution. Any attempt, be it circuitous, direct, well-intentioned or not, presents a clear and present danger to this most fundamental basis and eternally needed right of our citizens-freedom of religion.' "

Prabhupāda: Hm. That is...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "The Hare Kṛṣṇa movement has been under pressure from various groups, and this judgment is expected to stop some of the harassment to which it has been subjected in recent months."

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Very good.

Prabhupāda: So you purchase some copies.

Room Conversation 'GBC Resolutions' -- March 1, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Then why the sannyāsīs meeting again?

Satsvarūpa: For the particular service of each sannyāsī, so he will say, "I want to preach in Africa" or "I want to go to the colleges." Each man write down...

Prabhupāda: That is another thing. That is preference how he wants to work. That's nice.

Satsvarūpa: That's the purpose of that meeting. And then we also scheduled the holding of the bhakti-śāstra exam for being on Gaura Pūrṇimā, the fifth.

Prabhupāda: Next.

Satsvarūpa: Yes, the next day.

Prabhupāda: That's good.

Satsvarūpa: Then our next business was the division of the zones.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Where is our Bhagavān dāsa?

Satsvarūpa: Starting with South America... South America's responsibilities would be divided between Pañcadraviḍa Swami and Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja like this: Pañcadraviḍa would be responsible for the temples in Mexico and Central America, Guyana, Santo Domingo and Trinidad. And he will also work as required in the Los Angeles Spanish BBT office. And Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja will retain direct responsibility for Brazil, Venezuela, Colombia, Peru, Chile and Ecuador, and also he was going to take on co-GBC responsibilities in Spain and Portugal, which are the same language as the books he's printing in, along with Bhagavān, in whose zone that is, Spain and Portugal in Europe, for spreading Spanish book distribution. And as for the BBT duties that Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja has, he will have Pañcadraviḍa Mahārāja assist him in that also. We passed a resolution about...

Prabhupāda: What about the French printing and translation? That is stopped now?

Hṛdayānanda: No, it is not... It is not altogether stopped, but some members have left.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Some members have left, but...

Prabhupāda: Why?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hṛdayānanda Mahārāja was just there in France. He just paid a visit, so he'd be... What is your report, Hṛdayānanda, about the French BBT?

Hṛdayānanda: Well, some of the important members have left.

Prabhupāda: Why they have left?

Hṛdayānanda: Well, they were dissatisfied with Bhagavān.

Prabhupāda: That should be rectified. They are important members. They are translating.

Conversation with Yadubara (after seeing film) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Origin? There is no origin. It is always there. Origin is Kṛṣṇa. He has always been. Aham evāsam agre. The Bhāgavata śloka. Where is that śloka, aham eva āsam agre? First part? Where is that Gītā-bhāṣya.(?) You are doing nice. Go on doing like that. Try your best to convince. Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu (BG 7.3). Out of many millions of men, one can understand Kṛṣṇa. So what the lawyer says? What is his name?

Girirāja: Mr. Jethmalani. I said I would come and meet him. I also wanted to show him the movie. So he said that "I would prefer to come back here, because it is so nice." Actually, when he was... After he washed his hands, he looked out of the balcony, and he said that just from this atmosphere, one can feel a sense of ecstasy.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Those baṛā, would you like them, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, I have taken two, more than two. I could have taken...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: More. You had a good taste for them.

Prabhupāda: But I did not try it. Very nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: As a result of your restricting yourself to only two or three, we each got to taste one. Very palatable.

Prabhupāda: And the nim is very, very good.

Conversation with Patita-pavana -- April 20, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Same building.

Girirāja: ...exchange. We come from the second floor to the ground, and he takes what we've constructed on the top.

Prabhupāda: "Same space you can... Everything, that will be..."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We prefer to have the ground.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And he can utilize the roof also.

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: To get the... Yes. That is another advantage. If it is possible, do. So they can understand the description in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam?

Patita-pāvana: They have assured me that they can.

Prabhupāda: Then it will be all right.

Conversation with Vedic Astronomer -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So that you can do immediately. You do. Can you make a rough sketch immediately?

Indian Astronomer: First (indistinct). Because after he came there I told him that we must prepare a diagram which is acceptable to all, acceptable to all.

Prabhupāda: No, acceptable, the, I mean to say, Western astronomers, they...

Indian Astronomer: No, we... If you prefer Bhāgavatam and if you give only Bhāgavatam...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Indian Astronomer: ...whether Western accepts or not, that is not worthwhile.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Indian Astronomer: Whether Westerners or modern scientists accept or not, that is not worthwhile.

Prabhupāda: No, we want do it according to Bhāgavatam.

Indian Astronomer: That is what I mean.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So when you'll do it?

Indian Astronomer: When the order is, I will start.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Indian Astronomer: On your order, holy order, I will start on work immediately.

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) "I don't care for you." (Hindi) Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, mama māyā. That means he's engaged, she's engaged for beating with shoes. But he cannot understand, although Kṛṣṇa is coming personally to make him understand, paritrāṇāya sādhūnām (BG 4.8). (Hindi) Mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te. You surrender to Kṛṣṇa; everything is finished. So it is up to you, whether you prefer to be beaten by shoes continually or you surrender to Kṛṣṇa. That depends on you. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Don't manufacture nonsense things. (Hindi) Rascaldom. "Simply surrender to Me." (Hindi) ...manufacture... (Hindi) ...ism, this ism, that ism, that ism. (Hindi) The Bhagavad-gītā is spoken in the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra. (Hindi) ...nonviolence... (Hindi) Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ (BG 1.1). The first word is (Hindi). And you want to prove it, nonviolence. (Hindi) ...rascaldom... (Hindi) The first word is used, yuyutsavaḥ. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) Violence required to keep the society in order. (Hindi) Who will give protection? Sab scientific. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) "So don't trust woman and politician." This is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita. And she is both politician and woman. We have got Mahābhārata, there is not a single instance... We had very, very great, qualified women. But they were in charge of state...? Very, very qualified women. You know. Na svatantratām arhati, striyaḥ. For woman there is no independence. The Manu-saṁhitā. They must stay under father, under husband, or under elderly sons. Three stages.

Arrival Speech -- May 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So I cannot speak. I am feeling very weak. I was to go to other places like Chandigarh program, but I cancelled the program because the condition of my health is very deteriorating. So I preferred to come to Vṛndāvana. If death takes place, let it take here. So there is nothing to be said new. Whatever I have to speak, I have spoken in my books. Now you try to understand it and continue your endeavor. Whether I am present or not present, it doesn't matter. As Kṛṣṇa is living eternally, similarly, living being also lives eternally. But kīrtir yasya sa jīvati: "One who has done service to the Lord lives forever." So you have been taught to serve Kṛṣṇa, and with Kṛṣṇa we'll live eternally. Our life is eternal. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). A temporary disappearance of this body, it doesn't matter. Body is meant for disappearance. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So live forever by serving Kṛṣṇa. Thank you very much.

Devotees: Jaya! (offer obeisances) (break)

Prabhupāda: Now you can discuss. (Hindi) (end)

Srila Prabhupada Vigil -- May 28-29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Little improvement there is.

Jayatīrtha: Good medicine.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, I am very much confident of this medicine because nobody is prepared to die, but I am prepared to die. That much strength I have got. Generally people do not like to die. But I will be very glad to die if Kṛṣṇa wants. This is... And I shall stay with you. I have no objection either way. But I am not afraid of death. That much strength I have got. Why shall I be afraid? There is no cause of...

Jayatīrtha: Jaya.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Bhakta-sane bās. Such a great opportunity. You are all pure devotees. To live with you and to die while you are chanting, such a great opportunity. So there is no question of being afraid of death. (break) Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, of course, we have our preference.

Prabhupāda: I have no objection. I have no... (break) Whatever His desire is, I... (end)

Room Conversation -- June 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You have dining place here(?).

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You said that a high-class person should be served where he's...

Prabhupāda: No, who is high class, low class? Everyone...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If they can bring the prasāda from the cooking arrangement there to over here, it's all right if they serve them here? 'Cause I think the guests prefer that they can eat in this guesthouse.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that plates can be brought.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. So we'll see to that first of all.

Prabhupāda: One store, one kitchen, one dining room. Bas. Not separate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not separate dining room.

Prabhupāda: That is not management. Such a big hall, such a big kitchen, sufficient. If some special per..., it can be done in that kitchen.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In that big kitchen.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Room Conversation -- October 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Besides that, whenever you require money, you can ask. He'll give.

Kīrtanānanda: Thank you, Prabhupāda. I prefer to give it. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: No. Give and take. (break) You are fulfilling my dream, New Vrindaban. I dreamt all these things. Wonderful things have been done. He is the first student, from the very beginning. When I was in the storefront he was bringing carpet, bench, some gong, some lamp. In this way...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's still bringing gifts.

Prabhupāda: Sevā-vṛtti, service attitude. Jaya. (pause) Live long, serve long.

Kīrtanānanda: Thank you. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...are also so nice, and whatever little prasādam they get, they are satisfied, New Vrindaban. New Vrindaban.

Room Conversation With Dr. Ghosh -- October 16, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) ...cough.

Bhakti-caru: Dudhkhile mucus haya. Kal ke ami...(?)

Dr. Ghosh: We'll see to that. I am here.

Bhakti-caru: Sixty cc. Only sixty cc milk he took, and he started coughing the whole night.

Dr. Ghosh: (Bengali) ...chānā, solid chānā... (Bengali) Massage upwards towards the heart. (Bengali) ...preferably on the left side, like this. This is an ideal position for him. I would like to go and see the doctor who will examine his urine tomorrow. (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Dr. Ghosh: (Bengali) Don't worry about me. He asked me whether I have brought my wife with me or not. (laughs) I have come running, leaving everything.

Prabhupāda: Gāḍi? Car?

Bhavānanda: Car. Yes, car is here for him.

Prabhupāda: So, car is reserved for his use?

Bhavānanda: Is going for the urinalysis.

Room Conversation -- October 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And as I will remain in Māyāpur or Vṛndāvana—the same. Yes. Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi, jebā jāne cintāmaṇi, tāra hoy braja-bhūmi bās. There is no difference. Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi. And if there is any danger, Bhavānanda has got his gun. (laughter—Tamāla Kṛṣṇa repeats to others—laughter)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Every moment with you, Śrīla Prabhupāda, is so wonderful.

Prabhupāda: So I shall prefer.

Devotees: What?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "So I shall prefer." Maybe Svarūpa Dāmodara Prabhu can arrange some conferences for himself in Calcutta. Then he can visit you regularly in Māyāpur.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, we'll do that in Calcutta. Calcutta is a big place for us.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That way he can come regularly and give you report on how the science conferences are going. That will be very enlivening. (to Svarūpa Dāmodara:) That's part of your plan.

Bhavānanda: I'm already thinking, Śrīla Prabhupāda, what preparations we have to make.

Prabhupāda: Simply fresh vegetable. And mung ḍāl also.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Where is the harm?

Trivikrama: What about the vegetable juice in preference to the fruit juice?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The real thing is that Prabhupāda is passing urine, and he is passing stool. So there's... What is the harm for taking vegetable juice? The main thing is that Prabhupāda has to swallow it. If he can swallow it, it's being digested to some extent, because urine is coming and stool is passing.

Prabhupāda: When stool comes, urine does not come.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. No, there's something definitely... Something is amiss, that instead of coming out as urine, it comes out as stool. (break)

Bhavānanda: But you did say Kṛṣṇa advised you through this dream to take that medicine.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bhavānanda: You said that Kṛṣṇa directed you through that dream to take that makara-dhvaja medicine. So there are six different types of makara-dhvaja.

Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa directed-Rāmānuja Vaiṣṇava.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Gopāla Kṛṣṇa told me that Jayapatākā Mahārāja had called him and said that they have arranged for one Rāmānujī kavirāja there in Bengal side, and everything was ready if you can come there. Can you bring him here?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. He's not going to come.

Bhavānanda: They have their medicines and everything there.

Prabhupāda: He has?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's arranged for Rāmānuja kavirāja, Jayapatākā Mahārāja.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Mādhava: This is very true.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So the proposal that he continues to take some fruit juice has certain merit, because at least we've seen that that's one thing that he will take in large quantity. If nothing else... Every single kavirāja and doctor we've consulted, they all insist that one of the most important things is that there be sufficient liquid taken so that the body can be cleansed properly. So although you may be right that by taking one thing in particular and not taking fruit juice may be preferable, if he can't take it, then there's no use in that point.

Mādhava: That's true. If Śrīla Prabhupāda would take nothing but fruit juice, it is much better that he have the fruit juice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So therefore Svarūpa Dāmodara Prabhu's suggestion was not unbased, because we see that in the past Prabhupāda has rejected... I've seen him reject vegetable broths. I saw him reject it at least three or four times. I've never seen him reject fruit juice. So how much vegetable broth will Prabhupāda take? He won't take 500, 600, 800 cc's. He may, but I've never seen such a thing.

Bhavānanda: He'll take one glass.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So you have to consider that, although he should take sufficient liquid. So you have to augment... (break) ...Śatadhanya, when we called Calcutta, and then I could not fall asleep properly because I was very... My mind was active last night. For three hours I was not sleeping.

Prabhupāda: On the back side.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Hm. Little scratching, should I do? (break)

Prabhupāda: ...krama on the palanquin, practically it is very pleasant.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: For fifty years they could not construct a maṇḍapa in Gauḍa-maṇḍala.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust, or Charitable Trust? Which do you prefer, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: That I do not know. You...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Śrīla Prabhupāda said... (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He stays in the governor's room. Room number 31. We gave him nice prasādam. Is the kavirāja here right now, Śatadhanya Mahārāja? Is he?

Śatadhanya: He was mixing medicines a little while ago.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Would you like to see him, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, not necessary.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Quarter to nine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In any case, you're not at any loss. You're laying here. Just I think now I'll turn off the light. Do you like some little kīrtana? Singing? You haven't been having kīrtana lately in your room very much, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Anyway, if you like, we'll just keep it quiet here and turn off the light. Would you prefer that?

Prabhupāda: Light you can keep. Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I have to give the key to the door. I keep the door locked when I'm not in the room.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: (whispering) I made two members today for the Institute.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you stay longer on this planet, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that will make this movement stronger. That is the real reason for living longer. 'Cause you are a pure devotee of Lord Kṛṣṇa, you have no personal desire. This is Kṛṣṇa's movement. If you stay longer, then this movement will become stronger and stronger. Simply by your presence the devotees become inspired and they work much better. We can understand that there's nothing to lament if you were to depart, because you're always going to be with Kṛṣṇa. But we would have to lament from our own point of view that we would lose you, at least in the way that we have you now. And the whole world would lament because this movement might not be as strong if you were not present.

Prabhupāda: Then make this arrangement, one week or ten days.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I don't think. It is past nine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don't think they'll come now. No, I also don't think. I mean it's not good etiquette to come at this hour for business. It's nearly nine-thirty, Śrīla Prabhupāda. I mean I don't think that... If you'll permit me to request them, even if they do come now, that we do it on another day, then I would prefer to do that. Oh, I hear Bhagatji. (goes and returns) So they're all here, Śrīla Prabhupāda. So we can go to Māyāpur now. (laughs) So I better... First I'll have to go through all the documents and see that they're in order. Then I'll bring them in here and we'll finish this business.

Prabhupāda: Then let us go.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (laughs) You want to go to Māyāpur?

Prabhupāda: As you are saying, I'll go.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, Śrīla Prabhupāda, I mean you guide us. As you say, we will do. There's no... The doctor advises, "Better to remain." His medical opinion is that you should wait here for another ten days.

Prabhupāda: So do that.