Interpretation (Conversations 1977)

Expressions researched:
"interpret" |"interpretated" |"interpretation" |"interpretations" |"interpreted" |"interpreter" |"interpreters" |"interpreting" |"interpretive" |"interprets"

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Pālikā: Śrīla Prabhupāda? This morning you would like to take your breakfast after the program or after resting? Because I do not want to prepare the idli...

Prabhupāda: Later. All other dharmas are cheating.

Dr. Patel: Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja.

Prabhupāda: This is dharma.

Dr. Patel: Sarva-dharmān means all other vocations, I would say. Dharma means whatever vocation... Is one of the interpretations. "All vocations you leave and come to Me only and be My bhakta." That is... I would... Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66).

Prabhupāda: Yes. God is great. We are small. The small business is to serve the great. That is going on everywhere.

Dr. Patel: And mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja means "You do work according to My dictate. That is My śaraṇam."

Prabhupāda: This is śaraṇam, not that you remain independent from śaraṇam. No.

Dr. Patel: That means you obey the infallible laws of God.

Prabhupāda: God says man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī mām. This is dharma.

Room Conversation -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. He mentioned that, that "My Kṛṣṇa is different imagination. My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." That is his position. He imagines. He has... (Hindi) "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa..." This is... How he can believe Kṛṣṇa? Kṛṣṇa is preaching violence, and he's trying to draw nonviolence. The people will challenge, but he makes his own commentation, his own imagination. He said, "My imagination of Kṛṣṇa is different." This is his word. And actually... He is the student of Bhagavad-gītā and in his āśrama there is not a single picture of Kṛṣṇa. He does not believe in Kṛṣṇa. But believe or not believe, he was reading Bhagavad-gītā, had respect. That will give him some profit, there is no doubt. (break) Yeṣām anta-gataṁ pāpam. Everything is clearly said in the Bhagavad-gītā. I speak, therefore, to my disciples that "You simply repeat like parrot Bhagavad-gītā and follow by your life. Don't try to become very big scholar, do interpretation.

Room Conversation -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Nobody says, "Here is God." That is, perhaps... We Vaiṣṇavas say; I am preaching. Perhaps I am the first preacher to the world, that "Here is God."

Dr. Patel: Some of these great Vaiṣṇava ācāryas were doing interpretation of Bhagavad-gītā...

Prabhupāda: The who is ācārya except the Vaiṣṇava ācārya? All loafer class. All loafer class. They're not ācāryas. Except these Vaiṣṇava ācāryas, who is ācārya? They're not ācāryas. Ācāryaṁ māṁ vijānīyān (SB 11.17.27).

Dr. Patel: I read your Bhagavad-gītā, and after that, I read Rāmānuja's. They more or less the same...

Room Conversation -- January 4, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes, with a stick. (chuckles) They are so submissive. The cow is going this side, "Raa-raa!"—immediately. (Jagadīśa laughs) When in Bible they say, "The animal is given to the care of man," like that... There is. This is care of, not that "Because we care of, we shall kill them." What is this interpretation? How demonic this Western civilization. "Because Jesus Christ, the God, has given the animals to our care, therefore we shall kill and eat." Anyway, try to introduce a renovation of civilization. Therefore they are trying to oppose us. Now they are conscious about the movement, that "If it is allowed to increase, then our program will be finished. And young men are taking. They are not rejecting." That is their concern. They are concerned about their business and industry.

Letter to Russian -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Everywhere. Everywhere. If the men are kept as animals, you cannot expect them peaceful citizens. That is not possible. The fighting will go on on one plea or another. You cannot stop. (pause) Was it...? You give...? Pālikā?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Mahārāja got the income tax today. The income tax also... And our auditor... Their interpretation of the law is so rigid, Śrīla Prabhupāda. We have to say so many lies. For example...

Prabhupāda: That you may not bother about, for...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No.

Prabhupāda: So you can make idli? What is called? Is it called?

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The difference between other Gītās and our Gītā... We therefore said, "As It Is." No interpretation. That is the disaster. Authority, Kṛṣṇa, and to interpret on His word, this is very disastrous.

Mr. Gupta: Lord Kṛṣṇa has been good to me right from my childhood. I was brought up in a good religious family. I have always been able to have my way. I think that's what's wrong. I get very strong desires, likes, dislikes. I have been successful, very, very successful, in material sense, in work. I want to... Doesn't leave me with peace.

Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Indian (3): Well, I don't think you or I, any of us, knows what is the fact. It's what's conveyed and interpreted to us that we know.

Dr. Patel: That means you must have blind faith in guru. If a guru says that "You jump in the well," and you can jump in the well, then you get the goal. That is why that man went with ten cows and came back after twelve years making them thousand. Otherwise he becomes a cowherd. "What will I get knowledge by doing caros, gaus(?) in the jungle?" No. But if he has faith, faith...

Prabhupāda: How much progress is being made?

Girirāja: Tremendous.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, why you bring religion at all? It is science. Religion is a kind of faith. But science is not faith. You may have faith or may not have faith. Science, "Two plus two equal to four," everywhere. Why they forget this? This is a science, vijñāna. Jñānaṁ te 'haṁ sa-vijñānaṁ idaṁ vakṣyāmy aśeṣataḥ (BG 7.2). It is vijñāna. And they are interpreting in different way, "Two plus two equal five." Big, big men, they are doing that. Two plus two equal five because somebody, some big man has said? This is going on. Somebody said, "Two plus two equal to three"; somebody says "Two plus two equal five." "In my opinion it is five." And somebody: "In my opinion it is three." What is this nonsense? This is going on. And they are big men. They are leaders, mūḍha. This is the position of India.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam: (BG 4.2) "First of all I said to Vivasvān." The predominating deity in the sun planet is called Vivasvān. His name is Vivasvān. So he spoke to his son Manu. Manu spoke to his son Ikṣvāku. In this way He describes, sa kāleneha mahatā yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa: "That paramparā system is now lost. Therefore I am speaking you the old truth." Yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. That is nothing new; the same thing. And if we give up this paramparā system, then yogo naṣṭaḥ. So nobody is taking this Bhagavad-gītā in the paramparā system. He is interpreting in his own way. Therefore it is already naṣṭaḥ; it has no value. So this is going on. Yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa. So because... Why we have to take from the authority? Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). Because guru means he presents the truth as it is. And as soon as you interpret, it is naṣṭaḥ; it is spoiled. They are reading Bhagavad-gītā, but they do not take this instruction, that "I am presenting Bhagavad-gītā in a way which is spoiled." And they're insisting.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You arrange, I will advise her. I am not proud, but I am the authority at the present moment. It is not pride. It is the fact! So let her take! Let her understand. The authority is there. And what is understanding? It is simple truth. Everyone can understand. Any child can understand. There is no difficulty. We make it difficult by our rascal interpretation. And that is very simple thing. Kṛṣṇa says, aham ādir hi devānām (Bg 10.2). So there must be somebody, original person. You are existing, you are coming from your father. Your father coming from his father, his father, his father... Now, who is the original father? There must be somebody. You may or may not know. So here is the answer: aham ādir hi devānām. So why don't you take? Where is the difficulty?

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They won't believe that. And still, they'll declare, "I am student of Bhagavad-gītā." They won't believe a word of Kṛṣṇa, and they'll say, "I am student of Bhagavad-gītā." This is going on. This is our position. In India everyone says, "I have read Bhagavad-gītā three hundred times," but he does not know even a word. So this should be stopped. If we want to advance actually, you take every word of Bhagavad-gītā and try to apply in life. Then everyone will be happy. That is a fact. The instruction is there. There is no difficulty to understand. There is no question of interpretation. Simply take it as it is and try to apply it in life—you'll be happy. And your human life will be successful. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). Up to this human form of life, we have passed through so many evolutionary process, but if you understand Kṛṣṇa, then, after leaving this body, no more material body.

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Grace means he'll willingly give you mercy, and mercy means you ask for mercy. Kṛpa-siddha. Sādhana-siddha and kṛpa-siddha. You are trying to earn one lakh of rupees—that is sādhana. But if somebody is gracious he can give you: "Take one lakh of rupees. Don't work hard." That is grace. That is kṛpa. You are ambitious for one lakh of rupees or somebody graciously give you: "All right, take." There are many persons. So that is grace. Otherwise, you earn by your hard labor. That is sādhana. Similarly, by association, by sādhana-bhakti, you attain perfection, and by grace also, you can attain perfection. Two ways. So those who are kṛpa-siddha, they are more fortunate. (Hindi) Preach this Bhagavad-gītā as it is. People will be benefited. You'll be benefited. Don't make unnecessary interpretation, misguide others and spoil your own life. That is very unfortunate. What is the difficulty to accept Bhagavad-gītā? There is no difficulty. Unfortunately we interpret in different way and take it other way.

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) But why do you take Bhagavad-gītā? You are free to do whatever you like. That freedom is given. Kṛṣṇa has given. Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante (BG 4.11). That you have got. But when you speak of Bhagavad-gītā, then you speak what Kṛṣṇa wants.

Guest (7): You should take Bhagavad-gītā as it is. You explain it but not interpret it.

Prabhupāda: There is no need of interpretation.

Indian man: You can explain it in the language which people can understand.

Prabhupāda: Explanation also not very much required because the explanation is already there, and we are not so intelligent that we can explain. But we take it, the words of the Bhagavad-gītā, that Kṛṣṇa says, na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15).

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So, paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitram (BG 10.12). So sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye (BG 10.14). If we accept sarvam etad ṛtam, as it is, then we benefited, and if we do not accept in that way, then it is naṣṭaḥ. Sa kāleneha mahatā yogo naṣṭaḥ parantapa. Then it is being spoiled. And what benefit you will get with spoiled thing? As soon as you interpret it is spoiled, immediately spoiled. So what benefit will be derived from the spoiled things? And that is being done. Don't believe in Kṛṣṇa, don't believe in the words of Kṛṣṇa, and if I am preaching Bhagavad-gītā, what is the benefit? It is spoiled? So if you distribute some spoiled food, it will increase food poison. That is going on. Instead of taking benefit from a first-class food, if you distribute a spoiled, then there will be food poisoning. That is being done. In India every home knows Bhagavad-gītā. And because it is spoiled now there will be food poisoning.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: Yes. "You are swine; so therefore he did not say." You quote this: "But you are swine; therefore he did not say."

Rāmeśvara: New interpretation.

Prabhupāda: Yes. "You are swine." Yes, they are swine. Suar ka baccha. In India they say. Tell them like that, "You are swine. You cannot understand things. Therefore he did not say." That's a fact. If you are not swine, then God said, "Thou shall not kill," you killed him, so what you'll understand about God? You did not allow him to live. You are such a great swine. And his disciple...

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...changing. The prescription is there, but I am trying my humble way to present it. That's all. I have no power. But the, the order is there. Anarthopaśamaṁ sākṣād. And people do not know it. Therefore this Bhāgavata is presented. Now give it to the people. Our credit should be that we are giving the statement of Bhāgavatam, Bhagavad-gītā, as it is. That's all. No adulteration, interpretation. It has been medicine. Medicine is there already. It is not that I have manufactured the medicine. But we are administering in the proper way. Therefore it is becoming... We cannot make any medicine. Medicine is already there. But we don't make any adulteration. As it is, we are administering, and therefore it is coming out nice. (break—kīrtana background)

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Satsvarūpa: This is a very good one, from the University of Helsinki. That's right near the Russian border, in Finland. He's a professor of Indian studies, the Department of Asian and African Studies, Professor extraordinarious, Penti Alto. "The Bhagavad-gītā is no doubt the most important and the best known work in the whole of Indian literature. The magnificence of its spiritual concepts and the sublimity of its thinking have secured a great popularity everywhere. It has been edited and commented countless times. The meaning of the text, at least in its main lines, is obvious and clear. The justification of a new interpretation is there, for in my opinion, dependent on the message conveyed by the commentary. The translator and commentator, Swami Bhaktivedanta, represents the Gauḍīya-Vaiṣṇava school, and thus interprets the message of the Gītā 'from the inside.' For example, Shankara in Canto Two"—he means Chapter Two—"verse twelve, interprets the plurality of the being enumerated to be only conventional. And according to the Māyāvādīns, the individuals after liberation merge into the impersonal Brahman. Swami Bhaktivedanta states that Kṛṣṇa here authoritatively emphasizes the eternity of the individuality."

Prabhupāda: Hmm.

Evening Darsana -- January 23, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Mr. Pandiya: That is the Bhagavad-gītā As It Is.

Guest (2): That is interpretation.

Prabhupāda: That is interpretation. Interpretation... Here is a person in the legal way. Interpretation is required when you cannot understand. Is it not?

Guest (2): Interpretation...

Prabhupāda: But when the things are understood very clearly, why interpretation?

Guest (2): It will, rather, confuse.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Evening Darsana -- January 23, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: This was protested by Caitanya Mahāprabhu vigorously. Why should you interpret?

Guest (4) (Indian man): Yes. He told, the Śrīmad Bhāgavatam is the ultimate bhāṣya of prasthāna code, Vedānta-sūtra.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, anything, if you can understand very clearly, where is the question of interpretation? But it has become a fashion that "If I can interpret in my own way, I become a big scholar." This is going on. If you have got your philosophy, you can speak. Everyone is free. Why you should take Bhagavad-gītā and distort it? Kṛṣṇa never meant that "In future Gandhi will come," or "Dr. Radhakrishnan will come, and he will explain My ideas." What is this nonsense? Kṛṣṇa was a foolish person that he left it for Gandhi for distortion? He could not explain Himself that Kurukṣetra means this body? Gandhi has to interpret? Do you think it is right?

Evening Darsana -- January 23, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, anything, if you can understand very clearly, where is the question of interpretation? But it has become a fashion that "If I can interpret in my own way, I become a big scholar." This is going on. If you have got your philosophy, you can speak. Everyone is free. Why you should take Bhagavad-gītā and distort it? Kṛṣṇa never meant that "In future Gandhi will come," or "Dr. Radhakrishnan will come, and he will explain My ideas." What is this nonsense? Kṛṣṇa was a foolish person that he left it for Gandhi for distortion? He could not explain Himself that Kurukṣetra means this body? Gandhi has to interpret? Do you think it is right?

Guest (5) (Indian man): Not at all.

Prabhupāda: But this is going on. What right you have got to interpret? If Kurukṣetra means body, Kṛṣṇa would have explained that. Was He not learned? He left it for Gandhi. Just see. He left it for Tilak. How harmful these interpretations are. That is going on.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Intelligence is developed by association, by hearing, by experiencing. Otherwise very big intelligence, he's also dull. Don't you see the big, big leaders, Gandhi and Radhakrishnan, they have no intelligence? They are misinterpreting the whole..., although they're passing as very big men, intelligent. And if you say to them that "You are not intelligent; you are wrongly interpreting Bhagavad-gītā," they will be offended. So intelligence is so dull even to such big, big men, what to speak of ordinary men? Big, big demigods, their intelligence also lacking. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, kona: "Somebody very fortunate, he can understand." Kona bhāgyavān. And another place, brahmāra durlabha prema: "Even Brahmā cannot understand what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness." Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu (BG 7.3).

Room Conversation -- January 28, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: No, you say, but he is such a learned, overlearned, he's asking somebody blessing who is not bona fide to find out bona fide. Just see his position. If you are seeking a bona fide spiritual master, why you asking the blessing of non-bona fide? (laughs) I could simply laugh, that's all, that such a rascal... He was doing some tangible service, editing work. He left everything. Now he's going to find out bona fide spiritual..., for bhajanānanda. Therefore, asat-saṅga-tyāgī ei vaiṣṇava. The first thing is... It is enunciated by... Whether this man is attached to woman? Then finish, all bona fide finish. As soon as one is attached to woman, either legal or illegal, his all qualification finished. Asat eka strī-saṅgī. And these rascals have derived meaning that "One who has one strī only, he's asat. One who has more than one strī, he's sat." They have interpreted like that.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We saw some translations in English, Sūrya-siddhānta. That was in Library of Congress in Washington. But the translation there was very... Was not good. It was all wrong interpretations.

Prabhupāda: Who translated?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Some English authors, outsiders.

Prabhupāda: He was also astronomer?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I think he was from Germany. He knew something about Sanskrit, but translation was just like to criticize those Indian, old Indian astronomers. Something like, very..., not even using even respectful words, but offensive sometimes, so we didn't bother to go through those books.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Guru's business is on behalf of Kṛṣṇa. As Kṛṣṇa comes, causeless mercy, the guru is engaged in Kṛṣṇa's business. Ya idaṁ paramaṁ guhyaṁ mad-bhakteṣv abhidhāsyati (Bg 18.68). Faithful servant of Kṛṣṇa. And guru means faithful servant of the Lord. That is guru. Yāre dekha tāre kaha 'kṛṣṇa'-upadeśa (CC Madhya 7.128). Bas. You become guru, faithful servant. Don't make any change. That is guru. Guru..., to become guru is not difficult thing. But the rascals will not do. He'll manufacture his own words. He is more intelligent than Kṛṣṇa. He'll give another interpretation, another: "Take this." Take photograph with Bhagavad-gītā and talk all nonsense.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: To know about Kṛṣṇa. It is not also difficult. Science of Kṛṣṇa is there, Bhagavad-gītā. Kṛṣṇa speaks Himself. So to know the science of Kṛṣṇa is also not difficult. But because we are unfortunate, we go to rascal, and they interpret Bhagavad-gītā in a rascaldom way, and we are missing. So you should be very careful not to go to a rascal. Then your mission will be successful. If you want to purchase gold, you must go to a shop where actually gold is purchased, gold. If you do not know, then you'll be cheated. That is not also very difficult. That I have repeatedly said. Those who are interpreting in their own way, Bhagavad-gītā, he's a rascal; he's not guru. (loud kīrtana in background) As soon as he says an interpretation, "I think like this," you reject that. Why should we think like that? You should preach what Kṛṣṇa says. Then you are right.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda (Member of Parliament) -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: It can deteriorate at any moment.

Mr. Rajda: That interpretation is there, that is there.

Prabhupāda: You cannot say...

Mr. Rajda: If the rulers, they have got faith in dharma...

Prabhupāda: They have no faith. That is the difficulty. They talk of God, talk of religion, but they do not know what is God, what is religion. That is going on. You may be or I may be. We do not know what is the identity of the living entity. Then where is the question of religion?

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Mr. Koshi: Interpretation.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Spoil their own life and spoil others. This is going on. The meaning is clear, but these rascals are thinking that "Meaning is not clear. Kṛṣṇa left for me to clear the meaning." That's all. Such rascals, they are touching Bhagavad-gītā. As if Kṛṣṇa left for him to clear the meaning. These rubbish things we want to stop. Of course, it is not possible. Many others are. But we are trying little, that's all. We cannot make any compromise. Therefore Kṛṣṇa consciousness. What Kṛṣṇa says, that is a fact. They are completely under the grip of material nature. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi (BG 3.27).

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Mr. Koshi: Is interpretation necessary or not?

Prabhupāda: Why interpretation?

Mr. Koshi: Some passages, they do not know to understand it.

Prabhupāda: Just like if they do not know this is a tape recorder. What is interpreting? Everyone knows that this is a tape recorder. So what is interpretation? Interpretation required when you do not understand.

Mr. Koshi: Is it that simple and clear for everybody?

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, that is the way of interpretation. Amongst the learned circle, interpretation required when the things are not clear. If the things are clear, why nonsense interpretation? There is no need of interpretation. Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre (BG 1.1). Kurukṣetra is still there, and people go there for pilgrimage. And in the Vedas it is stated kuru-kṣetre dharmān ācaret. "Go to Kurukṣetra and perform ritualistic ceremonies." What is the difficulty? Why should I interpret, "Kurukṣetra means this, and means this, that"? Why? To mislead others and mislead himself. This is not required. But they are doing it. That is misleading. If you can interpret Bhagavad-gītā by your own interpretation, then what is the authority of Bhagavad-gītā? Everyone can do like that. Everyone can say "It is my interpretation." Then where is the authority of Bhagavad-gītā? These things should be stopped. Real Bhagavad-gītā should be studied. People should make life Bhagavad-gītā and preach all over the world.

Morning Talk -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, your point yesterday was very nice that some things which are difficult, they may need explanations, but when Kṛṣṇa says, "Give it to Me," what is the question of a need of interpretation? That Radhakrishnan, immediately he gives his explanation: "It doesn't mean to Kṛṣṇa the person."

Prabhupāda: Just see. How rascal he is, and he is commenting. No, no, this is the rule, grammatical rule, that when things are clear, there is no interpretation.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's an actual rule.

Prabhupāda: Just like Sarvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya and Caitanya Mahāprabhu was talking. Caitanya said, "When the meaning is clear, why you are giving us this, nonsense?"

Morning Talk -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sarvabhauma asked Him, "You have sat here hearing vedānta for seven, eight days, but You have not said anything. Are You not understanding?" Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "I understand the vedānta, but I cannot understand your interpretation."

Indian man: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you give me the key to the almirah, then I can fix the tacks (tax?).

Prabhupāda: Take.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I'll keep these here for now. First I'll do those.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi conversation) (takes prasādam) (end)

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...the planes. It was kept checked by these rascal leaders. Dr. Radhakrishnan, Aurobindo, this, that, nonsense, interpreting in a different way, Gandhi. It could not distribute its brilliance. Now it is being distributed to show the brilliance and the knowledge first of all. Is it not?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's very much being distributed now, and everyone is appreciating.

Prabhupāda: I am confident this will go on, provided our men are following the process which I have given to them, following the rules and regulations, chanting. Books they have got sufficient already. Simply have to repeat. You haven't got to manufacture. Any fool you are. Nobody can...

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They cannot sit comfortably. There is pad. Give him. Pads. Yes. No, no. Oh. (Hindi) Sukham asinaḥ.(?) First of all one must... Give her. So we have got, at least in Bombay, the most important place in India, this institution. So come here. Try to understand the philosophy. There is no difficulty. But we neglect it. We are simply ne..., and distorting. Everyone is giving his own interpretation. Eh? Then when, where is the importance of Kṛṣṇa? If Bhagavad-gītā is a book who is authority, and if you interpret and give your own interpretation, then where is the authority? Suppose Parliament passes one law, and if I interpret in my own way, then where is the authority of the law? This is the idea. If you want to give some idea of your own, give it separately. Why do you take Bhagavad-gītā and distort it? This is not gentlemanly, this. We are presenting, therefore, Bhagavad-gītā as it is, and it is being accepted. And before me so many swamis, yogis went there. They also tried to explain Bhagavad-gītā, but nobody accepted.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That means rascals. They do not accept "Two plus two equal to four."

Mr. Rajda: Yeah, correct. Intelligent...

Prabhupāda: If we do not take mathematics as it is, and if we interpret "Two plus two equal to three," that is rascaldom. "Two plus two equal to four," that is everywhere.

Mr. Rajda: Quite right. Everything is right. Now only put some concrete proposals, how do we want to proceed in this...

Room Conversation with Ram Jethmalani (Parliament Member) -- April 16, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They very much appreciated. Because they saw that I have got full respect for Christ and his real disciples. And actually we have. Why not? He said, "Thou shalt not kill," and they are interpreting killing. This is going on. And they are Christians. Just see how much cheating. It is clearly written, "Thou shalt not kill." And their only business is killing, and still, they are Christians. How much cheating it is. Whatever little success is in our movement, the cause is I have not tried to cheat. Honestly, what I knew, I heard it from Guru Mahārāja and scripture, I took it. There was no cheating.

Room Conversation with Ram Jethmalani (Parliament Member) -- April 16, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, you pointed that out yesterday when you talked with Mr. Rajda, that it's an open secret. You are not introducing anything new. You are simply giving the instructions of Bhagavad-gītā, but you are not introducing anything on top of those instructions. No interpretation. As it is. That's the whole problem. They are all reading Bhagavad-gītā, these politicians, but none of them as it is.

Prabhupāda: Therefore I said "Who understands this meaning of one line?"

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They really think that Morarji is a big religious man. They are very happy to think that their prime minister now is very, very religious. They are very pleased to think like that.

Conversation with Yadubara (after seeing film) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Battlefield of the mind," he said.

Prabhupāda: Everyone takes Bhagavad-gītā as fictitious, and you can interpret it in any way you like. That is the... This Swami Cinmayananda is also that class. He is a sādhu.

Girirāja: The lawyer asked me had I read the books of Swami Cinmayananda.

Prabhupāda: What did you reply?

Girirāja: Well, I said that we knew what his philosophy was, and that we were not impressed by it.

Room Conversation Meeting with Dr. Sharma (from Russia) -- April 17, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They may deny so many things foolishly, but that is not the fact.

Guest (1): We understand. But even to such peoples, Communism, the word itself shows it is not accepting God. Then why we should interpret that Bhāgavatam or Bhagavad-gītā, whatever we have, is....

Prabhupāda: They may not accept God, but they are sons of God. You may become a madman—you don't accept your father. That does not mean that you have no father.

Guest (1): But he is a madman.

Prabhupāda: Yes, so madman, that should be treated. That is humanity. A madman, he has become mad, and "Get him out." No. Human society's duty is to treat him, to become a sane man.

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, flesh you can take if you are carnivorous, but not this cow's flesh. That is particularly instructed in Bhagavad-gītā, kṛṣi-go-rakṣya. Kṛṣṇa did not say that "You be non-meat-eater." That is not possible. Jīvo jīvasya jīvanam. Every living entity is living by eating another living entity. That is the laws of nature. But there are different types, so in the human society, if there are persons who want to eat flesh, so they can eat that nonimportant, small animal. But don't touch cow. That is Gītā's instruction. Go-rakṣya, He has particularly said. If you are so mean that you have to eat some flesh, there are hogs, dogs, and... And you can eat. But don't touch cow. Gandhi posed himself as a great student of Bhagavad-gītā, but he did not understand a single line. That is the defect. Gandhi took it, Bhagavad-gītā, as a childish play. Dangerous... Therefore country is ruined. You must take Bhagavad-gītā as it is. Then there is authority. You cannot change it. If you change it, where is the authority? Can you change the simple law, "Keep to the right; keep to the left"? No. It is authority. If the direction is "Keep to the right," you must keep to the right. You cannot say that "What is the wrong if I keep to the left?" Then there is no authority. So Gandhi, Tilak, and Aurobindo and so on, so on, they took Bhagavad-gītā as a childish play. Whatever they want, they interpret that.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: So (Hindi).

Indian man (3): My interpretation...

Prabhupāda: Then why interpretation? (Hindi) Na jāyate na mriyate vā. (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) (pause)

British devotee: Should we stop now, Śrīla Prabhupāda? It's quarter to seven.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

British devotee: So the people how have been staying here...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You can make an announcement.

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So He's the owner, and if you follow Kṛṣṇa, then you become trustee. You do not follow Kṛṣṇa; you are unworthy of trusteeship. You interpret in a different way Kṛṣṇa. Even sometimes you say that "Kṛṣṇa is fictitious." Do you not do? Don't you say like that?

Indian man (1): No, not...

Indian man (2): Very passing reference he made once.

Prabhupāda: Why? That means he does not know what is Kṛṣṇa.

Indian man (3): Who made this reference? Who made this passing reference, where Kṛṣṇa is...?

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) ...that why we shall misinterpret Bhagavad-gītā? Kṛṣṇa was less intelligent, that He left Bhagavad-gītā to be interpreted by some rascal philosopher or politician? He was not intelligent enough to clear the idea? If Kurukṣetra is meant "body," why you should bring in the name of Kurukṣetra the bodily conception of life? What is this? Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre samavetā yuyutsavaḥ, māmakāḥ pāṇḍavāḥ (BG 1.1). Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre is still there. Why Kurukṣetra should be interpreted as something else?

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yudhya ca. (Hindi conversation) There is some word; the meaning is not clear. Then you can suggest that "Meaning may be like this." But when it is clear, there is no, I mean to say, chance of interpreting.

Indian man (1): As, for example, vicāra, those such words which requires some clarification or..., these can be interpreted...

Prabhupāda: No, no, when it is clear, why it should be interpreted?

Indian man (1): No, for other words...

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: Other words... (Hindi) ...that when it is clear-yudhya ca—then why should you interpret? The example is there in the Sanskrit grammar. Just like... The example is given, where interpretation required. It is said, example is given like, gaṅgāyāṁ ghoṣa-pāli, that "There is a neighborhood called Ghosha-pali on the Ganges." So then you can ask that "Gaṅgā is water. How there is a neighborhood?" Then the interpretation: "Not on the Ganges water but on the bank." Then interpretation. But when it is clear that "On the bank of the Ganges there is a neighborhood called Ghosha-pali," then where is interpretation? Interpretation will be required when the meaning is not clear. Otherwise, if the meaning is clear, that is (Hindi), to interpret.

Evening Darsana -- May 9, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: So desiring to fight, they assembled; they must fight. So where is the question of interpretation? So prasādam ready or not?

Trivikrama(?): Yeah.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Every day there'll be darśana, five to six. Every day.

Indian man (8): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Hm? What is that?

Indian man (9): There is a big hall here.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a hall over here.

Evening Darsana -- May 12, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: So we should not be jñāna-khala. In India there is storehouse of spiritual knowledge, and every one of us should make our life successful by assimilating this knowledge and distribute all over the world. There is customer; there is appreciation. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. (Hindi) Why you should be jñāna-khala? Na sādhu manye. Jñāna should be distributed. The modern scientists also, they have... If they have discovered something new, they go and distribute for the benefit of the whole human society. Unfortunately we are distorting the knowledge in Bhagavad-gītā, interpreting in a different way according to my whims, and spoiling my life and others'. This process should be stopped. Present Bhagavad-gītā as it is. You'll be benefited; others... Don't distort. That is our duty.

Evening Darsana -- May 13, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: These are the statement in the Bhagavad-gītā. So if we do not try to understand the real purpose of Bhagavad-gītā, and if we theorize, "Bhagavad-gītā means nonviolence. Bhagavad-gītā means to become patriot," these are materialism. We should avoid this wrong interpretation, misguiding direction of blind leaders. We'll not get any benefit out of it. So we are trying to rectify this. That's all. Everything is there. Any question is solved by Kṛṣṇa. Politics, economics, religion, culture, philosophy—everything is discussed very thoroughly. Simply one has to understand. Then he becomes fixed up in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. People are generally after yoga, especially the Westerners. I think they have come here for perfection of yoga. But here it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, mayy āsakta-manāḥ pārtha yogaṁ yuñjan mad-āśrayaḥ. That is first class, to increase your attachment for Kṛṣṇa.

Conversation with M.P., Shri Sita Ram Singh -- May 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) "I will explain." And "Who cares for you?" (Hindi conversation) Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27). (Hindi) Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate. He is a rascal who is thinking, "I am independent," rascal number one. Everyone is thinking, "Ah! I am independent." What is their independence? Hm? (Hindi) (Hindi conversation) (break) (Hindi conversation) We are preaching Bhagavad-gītā as it is. (Hindi) ...compromise and interpretation... (Hindi) (Hindi conversation)

Sita Ram Singh: So all, all over world...

Prabhupāda: All over the world.

Showing of Planetary Sketches -- June 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Common sense. Sunday, Monday. Sunday. Sun must be first. Then... This is my commonsense interpretation.

Yaśodānandana: You have written in Bhāgavatam like that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And these rascals say moon first.

Devotee (2): Śrīla Prabhupāda, previously we painted in the art department... Just like Varāha lifted the earth, and the earth was a globe, and we showed also a globe of the earth. How does that relate to this? Previously, when we painted, we showed the earth a ball. So now the artists will be very confused. How it fell in the Garbha Ocean as a ball?

Room Conversation with Mr. Myer -- July 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That can be done very easily. It can be done very easily, provided government wants. And we can help. We have to follow simply the Bhagavad-gītā. That's all. They are reading Bhagavad-gītā, but they do not follow. They manufacture their own interpretation. That is the difficulty. Otherwise the Bhagavad-gītā is the preliminary study of happy life and entrance, matriculation, and then Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, graduate, and then Caitanya-caritāmṛta, postgraduate. We are therefore presenting three books. So if we follow, our life is successful. But you don't follow. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). Māyā is so strong that untruthful things, we take it as truthful. Just like the modern scientists. These rascals, he could not, they cannot, they will never be able to produce life. Still, they are busy: "Yes, we will do. We shall do."

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This is their... Apauruṣeyam. Actually India's culture is going on that way. Mass of people, they are going to Prayāga for taking bath. What do they know? They have received it from authorities that if you take bath in such and such place... Ah, lakhs of people will go. That is India's culture. Without any advertisement, without any means, walking hundreds of miles they are coming, yes, that is their culture. And the government is perturbed that people are so prejudiced. So how to make them forget? This is going on. But they don't listen. They just, "If I take bath I'll..." That is the difference between Western and Eastern. And as soon as there is interpretation, it is Māyāvāda.

Room Conversation-Recent Mail -- July 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Next, from the Indian Institute of Technology in Bombay. This is from Dr. Ram Kanstanari(?) Chairman of the Department, Indian Institute of Technology, Department of Humanities and Social Sciences. " 'Sir: I am pleased to make the following comments concerning your beautiful and learned publications, Śrī Caitanya-caritāmṛta of Gosvāmī Kṛṣṇa Kavirāja and Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, both written by His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda. I feel that these works are the result of Swami Prabhupāda's extraordinary commitment to the bhakti cult in the Indian tradition. Swami Prabhupāda's style and language are full of the flashes of his intuition. They clearly represent his realization that love for God and for mankind should be the foundation of all interpersonal relations. Kṛṣṇa is the symbol of this love. He is the Absolute in an incarnate form. Love for Kṛṣṇa therefore sung in all forms of devotion-laden language asserts man's empathy towards His entire creation. The Central Library of the Indian Institute of Technology, Bombay, has already secured, on my recommendation, the above-mentioned works complete. These works are read by the faculty and students here, not only for their religious message but also for the unique interpretation they embody of the traditional cult of bhakti in India. The poetic and devotionalistic tenor of these works, I am sure, would make one realize the meaning of man's dependence on God. I have no hesitation to state that His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda has done an immortal service to the movement of devotionism and Hinduism in particular and in world religions in general, by so ably bringing out these works in beautiful English. Every library in the world that is engaged in promoting the welfare of the human self by turning it towards the supremacy of the divine spirit...' "

Prabhupāda: Everyone is recommending. All libraries.

Meeting With Governor of Tamil Nadu -- July 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Gītā propaganda, there are many persons. But if you don't mind, all these men, they do not understand what is real meaning of Gītā.

Governor: Once, three men that come here, back in Madras. So I arranged with our government libraries to have all your books in our libraries there.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. Gītā should be accepted as it is. It should not be interpreted. Then there will be no benefit. And that has become... (Hindi) Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). That is Gītā. It is not meant for the loafer class. It is meant for the rājarṣis. Rājarṣayo viduḥ.

Meeting With Governor of Tamil Nadu -- July 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Thank you. Gītā should be accepted as it is. It should not be interpreted. Then there will be no benefit. And that has become... (Hindi) Evaṁ paramparā-prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). That is Gītā. It is not meant for the loafer class. It is meant for the rājarṣis. Rājarṣayo viduḥ.

imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ

proktavān aham avyayam

vivasvān manave prāha

manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt

(BG 4.1)

evaṁ paramparā-prāptam

imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ

(BG 4.2)

So unless the high government officials, rājarṣis, they understand properly Bhagavad-gītā, we cannot derive any benefit from Gītā. It is not a question of interpretation.

Governor: We will do something there much better, because everything is under our control.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- October 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I'm inviting, requesting all the GBCs, and also the sannyāsīs, mahārājas, to kindly attend the conference unless they're engaged at that time.

Prabhupāda: According to horoscope, life is finished. Still, I am living. What should be the interpretation?

Kīrtanānanda: The interpretation?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: About the conference?

Prabhupāda: No, about... About me.

Hari-śauri: Life is different from matter.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Aṇḍāntara-stha-paramāṇu-cayāntara-stham (Bs. 5.35). That is the difficulty. They do not want to take śāstra as it is.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They want to interpret according to their whims.

Śatadhanya: And they want to adjust it according to the time.

Prabhupāda: And that is Māyāvāda. (break) ...superficially Caitanya Mahāprabhu also a Māyāvādī.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. That was confirmed when He was talking like that. Just like Carl Jung... He's a psychologist. He says that matter is a concept, some sort of imagination that one has in his mind, something like that idea that these Māyāvādīs... They think this is not real.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They want to avoid criticism.

Brahmānanda: I argued right back with them. I said, "You..." They were saying that we shouldn't interpret Bhagavad-gītā. I said, "Then why are you saying that Kṛṣṇa means 'divine consciousness'? Where does Kṛṣṇa say 'divine consciousness'? He says, mām, aham. He doesn't say 'divine consciousness.' He says 'to Me.' "

Prabhupāda: And all the ācāryas say. We have to follow the ācāryas. Very good. They do not answer. And they... Is it not?

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Śrī Nārāyaṇa: Sanātana-jñāna he. Paramparā se.

Prabhupāda: Paramparā... (Hindi)...purātanaḥ yogaḥ. They introduce their own interpretation. No... (Hindi) There is nothing required. What is that? Sa te 'haṁ yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Purātanaḥ. Find out.

Śrī Nārāyaṇa: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: People of the world, they're hankering after this civilization. Unfortunately we are miser. We are not giving them...

Śrī Nārāyaṇa: All that they should get.

Prabhupāda: This is not good.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says here, "It is clearly stated that the Gītā was especially meant for the saintly kings because they were to execute its purpose in ruling over the citizens. Certainly Bhagavad-gītā was never meant for the demoniac persons, who would dissipate its value for no one's benefit and would devise all types of interpretations according to personal whims. As soon as the original purpose was scattered by the motives of the unscrupulous commentators, there arose the need to reestablish the disciplic succession. Five thousand years ago it was detected by the Lord Himself that the disciplic succession was broken, and therefore He declared that the purpose of the Gītā appeared to be lost. In the same way, at the present moment also there are so many editions of the Gītā, but almost all of them are not according to the authorized disciplic succession. There are innumerable interpretations rendered by different mundane scholars, but almost all of them do not accept the Supreme Personality of Godhead Kṛṣṇa, although they make a good business on the words of Śrī Kṛṣṇa. This spirit is demonic because demons do not believe in God but simply enjoy the property of the Supreme. Since there is a great need of an edition of the Gītā in English as it is received by the paramparā disciplic succession system, an attempt is made herewith to fulfill this great want. Bhagavad-gītā, accepted as it is, is a great boon to humanity. But if it is accepted as a treatise of philosophical speculations, it is simply a waste of time."

Śrī Nārāyaṇa: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) And it is natural.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're not at all interested in the Bhagavad-gītā. And that purport I read was perfect. That purport that I read was all about doing some nonsense interpretation. That's exactly what they do. Unwilling to admit the Personality of Godhead Kṛṣṇa, but enjoying the property of Kṛṣṇa—that's their business.

Brahmānanda: They do not believe in God.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're atheists. So we'll deal with them very carefully, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) There is good demand all over the world. (Hindi) "Kṛṣṇa is not person; Kṛṣṇa is consciousness." (Hindi) Kṛṣṇa personally speaking, and "He is consciousness." He says, yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). "I come down." (Hindi) Māyāvādī. Caitanya Mahāprabhu has condemned, māyāvādi-bhāṣya śunile haya sarva-nāśa (CC Madhya 6.169). (Hindi) Yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Kṛṣṇa said that "I am speaking to you the old yoga system." (Hindi) ...not my interpretation. (Hindi) (break) Kṛṣṇa is person. Where is that verse in the Tenth Canto?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In the Bhagavad-gītā?

Prabhupāda: Paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān (BG 10.12).

Bhakti-caru: Tenth Chapter.