Fixed (Conv. 1977)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But these coconuts, there would be more coconuts if they are looked after, all these, putting fertilizer on and watering them. All these houses behind here, they should be very planned out. This is all filthy. Behind it is very filthy. All these tenants will be segregated on one side, this side. And those living, they will be taking possession and...

Prabhupāda: No, instead of taking one building, we are in possession of the all the buildings. Then that is my policy, that we must remain on the head of every building. Therefore I constructed. They cannot say absolutely it is tenant, no. Mixed. We are therefore occupying the head of every building, fixed building.

Dr. Patel: There are some grand courts again (?) behind...

Prabhupāda: That is one story. Otherwise we are on the head. They cannot monopolize the whole building.

Morning Discussion about Kumbhamela -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Devotee (1): Twenty-five thousand rupees.

Prabhupāda: But I heard, it was thirty-five?

Devotee (1): There was originally three fixed deposits. One of them was broken six months ago. We used it, BBT. So there was two remaining left for twenty-five. Originally there was thirty-six, and then one was broken. That's already been accounted for.

Prabhupāda: And our Madras center is now closed?

Devotee (1): Yes. There's no center there now. Mahamsa Swami, he's sending two men there regularly to help set...

Prabhupāda: Collect.

Devotee (1): ... members..., collect.

Prabhupāda: Kata catur anana, mari mari yāvata, nā tuyā ari avasana. You have seen Russian publication? Easy Journey to Other Planets. They have printed.

Morning Walk -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Faith means extreme faith. Not reserved. Faith does not mean any reservation. What is that? Bhajate mām ananya-bhāk. This is... Ananya-bhāk. No reservation. That is... Sādhur eva. He is sādhu. Whatever he does, it doesn't matter. Bhajate mām ananya-bhāk. Sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). He sādhu. Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ, bhajanty ananya-manaso (BG 9.13). These are the words. Require staunch faithful devotion. Then you are perfect. Then doesn't matter what you are, what you are doing. Whether the real point is fixed up. Bhajate mām ananya-bhāk. Fifty percent, ten percent devotion...

Dr. Patel: Not even .001 percent reservation. I mean so far the bhakti's concerned. Bhaktya avyabhicareṇa.

Prabhupāda: That is. Sa guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhuyaya (BG 14.26). Even in the Brahman platform. Not in the material platform. Sa guṇān samatītya. Sama-prakarena utītya(?). Cent percent utītya(?).

Dr. Patel: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is credit.

Dr. Patel: This is credit, and this is also, I mean, that this should happen also...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Here is the right movement. This is the test.

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

rabhupāda: That's it. Sthito 'smi gata-sandehaḥ. Kariṣye vacanam. This is liberation: "Now I am fixed up," sthito 'smi, "All doubts gone." This is real study of Bhagavad-gītā. And promises, kariṣye vacanam: "All right, I shall fight. I shall kill Bhiṣmadeva. Never mind he's my grandfather. No question of nonviolence. I shall commit violence." This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Because naṣṭo mohaḥ... "It was my mohaḥ. I was thinking in that way, that 'He's my grandfather. He's my brother. He's my nephew.' These are all nonsense. I have to satisfy You." Kariṣye vacanaṁ tava (BG 18.73). That is ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānu-śīlanam (CC Madhya 19.167). Bhakti means to act to satisfy to Kṛṣṇa. That is bhakti. Without any argument, what Kṛṣṇa says, that's all right.

Guest (10): Unconditional.

Prabhupāda: Unconditional. That is surrender. If we read Bhagavad-gītā in that way, then sthito 'smi, then sthita prajñā. And if you make cut short... Arjuna said, sarvam etad ṛtaṁ manye yan māṁ vadasi keśava (BG 10.14). "Keśava, whatever You have said, I accept it in total." That is surrender. No cut short.

Room Conversation -- January 19, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: So she's Parliament. Maybe for her also.

Rāmeśvara: It'll be fixed.

Gargamuni: So, Prabhupāda, I'll have to leave on the 25th from here 'cause I could only get a 28-day visa from Kathmandu. So I have to leave the country by the 30th. So I'll go to Dacca and check everything out and then return and give report, and we can decide what we should do.

Prabhupāda: If we can get, we shall take it.

Gargamuni: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And you can start a center there. That will be very good. And when they see that Americans are taking, the Muhammadans will be attracted.

Gargamuni: Yes. No, I found them... They weren't so fanatic. The Bengali Mussulmans are not like the others. They're very nice.

Prabhupāda: Educated.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: Spiritual potency.

Prabhupāda: Technical books... (chuckles) Now that, my nephew Govinda, he's a watch repair.

Gargamuni: Oh, yes. He fixes our watches.

Prabhupāda: Ah, ah.

Gargamuni: We go to him.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughing) So he has written one book about his experience, and it is selling like anything, because it is technical. Yes, he gets for every edition three thousand, five thousand, like that. That is his extra income. But because it is technical, people purchase it.

Gargamuni: Yes. Especially in India now, that's all they want to read, is anything on technology, any field.

Rāmeśvara: They have been brainwashed.

Prabhupāda: No, in the Western country also. Western country, now this higher English, higher mathematics, higher philosophy is no student admission. Nobody's going. They're going to close.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Hari-śauri: Yes. If they do get money, they just buy it.

Prabhupāda: Money they get. But they can live. But there is no culture. They want liquor. So these rascals do not know how we are making human civilization. They do not see it, that without any fixed income we are maintaining such a huge establishment all over the world, without any fixed income. How we are doing? We are not thieves, we are not rogues. We are all gentlemen.

Gargamuni: In India they say the CIA is funding you.

Prabhupāda: Yes. They may say anything, but actually what we are?

Rāmeśvara: In America they are supporting the unemployed through federal and state welfare, which is paid for by tax money. So the more the unemployment increases, the more the taxes...

Prabhupāda: Taxes increase.

Rāmeśvara: ...have to increase. Otherwise these people will starve.

Gargamuni: And thousands of people live off the welfare checks.

Rāmeśvara: There is big scandals in America about cheating on the welfare roles to get free money from the government.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: This is the next, I think. Śraddhā is the beginning-faith. That faith means firm faith. Just like Kavirāja Gosvāmī says, śraddhā-śabde viśvāsa kahe sudṛḍha niścaya (Cc. Madhya 22.62). That is faith, fixed-up, firm faith. Kṛṣṇe bhakti kaile sarva-karma kṛta haya. Kṛṣṇa says, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). When you have got firm faith in this—"Yes! If I surrender to Kṛṣṇa, all other dharmas will be performed automatically"—then that is called faith. In the beginning, if you have no faith, where is the beginning? Then what is?

Pradyumna:

ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-

saṅgo 'tha bhajana-kriyā

tato 'nartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt

tato niṣṭhā rucis tataḥ

athāsaktis tato bhāvas

tataḥ premābhyudañcati

sādhakānām ayaṁ premṇaḥ

prādurbhāve bhavet kramaḥ

(Cc. Madhya 23.14-15)

Prabhupāda: Prādurbhāve bhavet kramaḥ. This is everything, description. So everything is there. We should take advantage and become perfect. And this is the chance of becoming perfect, the human form of life. If we miss it—finished. Nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra... Again go to the cycle of birth. Where is guarantee I am not going to be a dog? Who can check it? Nobody can. Nature's law is very strong. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-janma-yoniṣu.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: So we can go.

Satsvarūpa: You're already going tomorrow.

Prabhupāda: Where?

Satsvarūpa: That man who came, who you were supposed to go on the 26th, and he was changed.

Prabhupāda: Oh. The same program?

Guest (9): Yes. The same program also.

Satsvarūpa: You were recently initiated?

Guest (9): Yes.

Satsvarūpa: Oh. That's the same program. So that is already fixed with Gaura-Govinda. You spoke with him, Gaura-Govinda Mahārāja?

Prabhupāda: I take my lunch at half past one. So by that time... (end)

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: You are not getting new devotees to join?

Yogeśvara: In Paris.

Prabhupāda: Yes. From Paris or here... In Paris... From Paris you can bring in the farm.

Yogeśvara: Well, at the farm there is not as much of a new bhakta program as in Paris. So the new men are encouraged to stay in Paris to get fixed up first.

Prabhupāda: So new... When they are trained up, they can come, live, especially gṛhasthas. My point is whether the farm is attractive. Not very much.

Yogeśvara: The potential is wonderful.

Prabhupāda: And therefore I'm asking. Potential is wonderful, so why they are not attracted to live in the farm and be self-independent and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa? That is our farm project. Our farm project is they should be satisfied with simple living. That is nice living. If you get milk, if you get fruit, if you get grain and open air, it is very healthy life. Why they should not be attracted?

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: At least they are trying to understand.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That lecture that I gave, we made... Sadāpūta made that design so it's very attractive to science. That's from our Back to Godhead photograph. Fixed it up.

Prabhupāda: If they simply understand that all these laws of nature is going on under the direction of God... They are studying the laws of nature, how things are happening. But simply they have to understand that it is under the direction of Kṛṣṇa.

Yogeśvara: Mayādhyakṣeṇa...

Prabhupāda: Mayādhyakṣeṇa (BG 9.10). They are lacking that intelligence. They are finding out that "Things are moving so, mean, accurate. There must be somebody behind it." Do you think like that?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: When you see the nature's law is working so accurately, so don't you think that there is some brain behind it?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: There must be.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: With determination. Otherwise, satataṁ kīrtayanto mām (BG 9.14). Satatam means twenty-four hours. Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, kīrtanīyaḥ sadā hariḥ (CC Adi 17.31). Harer nāma harer nāma harer nāma eva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21). But that we cannot do. Therefore to keep dṛḍha-vrata, we have fixed up a certain quantity. Chant that. Saṅkhyā-pūrvaka-nāma-gāna-natibhiḥ kālāvasānī-kṛtau. About the Gosvāmīs-saṅkhyā-pūrvaka: "So many times." Not only chanting, also offering obeisances. Saṅkhyā-pūrvaka-nāma-gāna-natibhiḥ. Nati means praṇati. "I shall offer obeisances hundred times." Gosvāmīs, they used to do that. Still in Rādhā-kuṇḍa, Vṛndāvana, you'll see many devotees. They offer, counting, flat, so many times. So we have to take some labor. It is not so easy thing that you realize (chuckling) God so easily. Saṅkhyā-pūrvaka-nāma-gāna-natibhiḥ kālāvasānī-kṛtau. The valuable time of human life should be utilized only for cultivating Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That is perfect. No other business. Sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). That is sarva-dharmān. But if you cannot do that, all right, make

minimum: "So many times I shall chant. So many times I shall offer obeisances." Make some dṛḍha-vrata. Then gradually it will be successful.

Room Conversation -- February 2, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And now they're getting two vans for book distribution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And now Gargamuni is asking to purchase this van and with that money they will purchase Indian van. That will solve the problem. Those who are coming... (break) Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī (BG 6.1). Kṛṣṇa says. Anāśritaḥ, now you are working so hard not for your benefit, personal, and that is sannyāsī. That is sannyāsī. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryam. "Oh it is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa." And he is sannyāsī. Anyone who has got this consciousness that "It is my duty to serve Kṛṣṇa. I must serve Him with my life and soul and everything," he's a sannyāsī. Not the dress. So you are doing that. Now fix up. Go on doing this. Life is successful. That's all. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalaṁ kāryaṁ karma karoti yaḥ, sa sannyāsī. Find out this verse. Anāśritaḥ karma-phalam. It is so nice to work for Kṛṣṇa without any personal profit. This is Vṛndāvana. The gopīs, they sacrificed everything for Kṛṣṇa, their position, their honor, their prestige. So do like that. I am very glad to see when you work so hard for Kṛṣṇa. That gives me much pleasure.

Room Conversation Varnasrama System Must Be Introduced -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Vaiṣṇavism.

śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ

puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ

hṛdy antaḥ-stho hy abhadrāṇi

vidhunoti suhṛt satām

(SB 1.2.17)

By becoming a brāhmaṇa, hearing, hearing, hearing... Or by hearing, hearing, hearing, he becomes a brāhmaṇa. The other qualities, śūdra quality, kṣatriya, vaiśya, means finished. So then next stage is, śṛṇvatāṁ sva-kathāḥ kṛṣṇaḥ puṇya-śravaṇa-kīrtanaḥ, hṛdy antaḥ... Naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu. By this process, hearing... Without becoming a brāhmaṇa nobody is interested to hear. Then, by hearing, naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu, then abhadra, means the base qualities, means ignorance and passion... These are the base qualities. So naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu. When these base qualities are finished almost, not complete, nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā, by hearing from Bhāgavata or by serving the spiritual master and Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement-

naṣṭa-prāyeṣv abhadreṣu

nityaṁ bhāgavata-sevayā

bhagavaty uttama-śloke

bhaktir bhavati naiṣṭhikī

(SB 1.2.18)

Then he becomes fixed up in devotional... This devotional service is the first-grade quality of sattva-guṇa.

Room Conversation -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He'll be coming here in about three days, he and Tripurāri Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: So who will come by the 747?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, there's still about three hundred devotees coming on that flight.

Prabhupāda: Oh. It is already fixed?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: When they are coming?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're coming on the 24th morning.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's three hundred devotees from America, England and South America. And then, of course, there's still Australia devotees and some devotees from Africa. There are more. So I think at least between three and four hundred devotees.

Prabhupāda: And here we can accommodate. How many rooms?

Satsvarūpa: 165 on one floor and 135 on another.

Prabhupāda: Two persons very comfortably can live in one room.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Supplied by māyā, the machine, this, that. He has nothing to do. Karaṇ... This is also Vedic mantra. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. Just like I am an ordinary man. If I want to do something, I ask one or two, "Do this." I ask somebody, "Bring some money." I ask somebody that "You do this." So if an ordinary man can do, why God should do anything? Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. He has nothing to do. Na tat-samaś cābhyadhikaś ca dṛśyate. He can do everything, because nobody is equal to Him, but still does not do anything. Why? Parāsya śaktir vividhaiva śrūyate (Cc. Madhya 13.65, purport). His energy are so mighty millions that simply by indicating the energy, it will do. This is God. This is God. Just like big man, big industrialist, he simply pushes his button, and the secretary comes: "I want this." Immediately. This is... Ordinary human being can do. So why God has to do? He'll simply dance with the gopīs. That's all. That is God. He'll enjoy. Ānanda-cinmaya-rasa-pratibhāvitā... That is God. Therefore everything is done by God's agent or His expansion. Otherwise God has nothing to do. Na tasya kāryaṁ karaṇaṁ ca vidyate. Simply indication. Here it is said that Īśvara, the Lord, is situated everyone's heart. He can understand "What this rascal wants." He's so kind, He's living as friend. "My dear son, please come back. Why you are desiring so many nonsense things?" But the child will not hear. He wants. Kṛṣṇa-bahirmukha hañā bhoga vāñchā kare. He wants sense gratification this way, that way, that way, that way. So He gives him facility: "All right." And all facility. He wants to become a tiger, "All fixed." Nails, jaws, fangs—"Become a tiger." Yantra. The body is yantra, perfect yantra. That is supplied by māyā. Māyā. Daiva-netreṇa. He wants this, to give up this body. This machine is dead. Now you simply think of a tiger, and you are carried to the womb of the tiger. And the mother gives the body of a tiger. He comes out, enjoys. This is transmigration. The art is so fine.

Room Conversation with Adi-kesava Swami -- February 19, 1977, Mayapura:

Ādi-keśava: Sometimes in their propaganda these deprogrammers they complain about our sannyāsīs the most. They say, "Because they are saying everything in the material world is evil, so therefore they are the worst."

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is worst. Because I am spirit soul, I am now imprisoned with this material body. It is my unnatural state, and I am eternal, and because I have accepted this material body I have to undergo birth, death, old age and disease. So that is my effort, how to get out of this material body and remain in my original spiritual identity. That is our whole propaganda. We think material atmosphere is our imprisonment, suffering. Material body means suffering. Otherwise I am eternal, blissful, full with knowledge. That is my position. But because I have been impact... (aside:) Again you have the same disease. Attention, you attend, draw there. Don't do that. Very bad habit. Immediately you sit down, you do it. You cannot check it. So actually this is our punishment. This is māyā. That example I have explained this morning, very nice verse, that the moon in the sky is reflected in the water, in hundreds of pots of water, and the wind is agitating the water, and the moon is also agitated—sometimes round, sometimes long, sometimes... The moon is fixed up, but the reflection in the pot making him different. Similarly, I am spirit soul, and I have been captured or I have voluntarily surrendered to this material world, and it is being agitated by the mind, so I am taking this shape, that shape, that shape, this shape, eight million four hundred... That is my trouble. My nature is to be fixed up, always illuminating, but circumstantially I am being agitated by mind, and working with my mind, I am accepting this body, that body, this body, that. So this is very troublesome. Those who have no knowledge, no brain, they are satisfied with this material condition, agitated condition, and driven by the thinking, feeling, willing of the mind. This is very dangerous. We want to get out. This is psychology.

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a painting that one boy has done here which is not perfectly done, and he wants to get your advice on it.

Prabhupāda: No, no. I cannot give him advice on painting. I have no experience. He should go to the painter.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's the boy who did that painting of Rādhā and Kṛṣṇa that's outside where your vyāsāsana is. He wants to know how to fix it.

Prabhupāda: Don't waste time like that. If he wants to paint, he should join the painters.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In L.A.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Now he's working on painting the walls, front walls.

Prabhupāda: That is all right.

Evening Darsana -- February 24, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: On whole, they like it?

Jayatīrtha: Yes, especially our kīrtana parties on Oxford Street and Picadilly Circus. They like that very much. Sometimes we get a thousand people standing around our kīrtana party, Picadilly Circus and Leicester Square, places like that.

Prabhupāda: So what about that house?

Jayatīrtha: That house? We've purchased now and we're fixing it up.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jayatīrtha: We're fixing it up just now for using. We should be using it within about two months.

Prabhupāda: What is the name of that place?

Jayatīrtha: Soho Square.

Prabhupāda: The same house which you showed me?

Jayatīrtha: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So you have taken money from my account? No.

Jayatīrtha: No, Śrīla Prabhupāda. We didn't need to.

Prabhupāda: So there we shall have restaurant?

Evening Darsana -- February 25, 1977, Mayapura:

Rāmeśvara: Jayādvaita is editing the Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Rāmeśvara: So after that, he'll have to get some other occupation.

Bali-mardana: Prabhupāda, there is a house on the property just for you. There is a house that is fixed up for you on the property.

Prabhupāda: Why this light does not work?

Hari-śauri: Bulb's blown.

Prabhupāda: Change it.

Bali-mardana: So when you come there the house is waiting. It is very peaceful place for translation, and there's no winter. There is no winter. Seventy-five degrees, wintertime.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Bali-mardana: Very nice.

Room Conversation -- February 27, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: They are taking it from national point of view. That is... Anyway, there is some defense from government side, their representative attending every court case. Yes?

Hari-śauri: Yes. Every hearing.

Prabhupāda: Ādi-keśava told me.

Harikeśa: In Germany the court case is fixed in November now. They have made a date.

Prabhupāda: In the meantime you overflood with books.

Harikeśa: (laughs) Yes. An amazing thing is happening now. Used to be...

Prabhupāda: They are delaying.

Harikeśa: No. I mean when we distribute books, it used to be that people would say, "Oh, this is Hare Kṛṣṇa. I want nothing to do with it." Now they say, "Hare Kṛṣṇa. Hm. Let me see what is in this book."

Prabhupāda: Ah. Now they are... They'll, "Hm." That's all right. (laughter) No, if there is substance they will take it. They're intelligent persons. Yes. Simply by propaganda you cannot make them fool. I know German nation. They're intelligent.

Room Conversation 'GBC Resolutions' -- March 1, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: All right.

Rāmeśvara: So we can fix a time, because of the meetings, there's no chance.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There'll be time.

Hari-śauri: We can fix a time.

Prabhupāda: During massaging.

Rāmeśvara: After the GBC meetings.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Śrīla Prabhupāda, this, the account that you have, I am keeping for you, the second, third month interest is due. Shall I give exactly like before? A check to him?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: To be deposited...

Prabhupāda: You deposit in the Māyāpur.

Room Conversation -- March 26, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Instead of going on Monday, we shall go on Wednesday.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that is fixed up now. I think Saurabha will be quite relieved. Śrīla Prabhupāda, the turn-out at the pandal has been quite good. Many good class of people have been coming. So Girirāja Prabhu and Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Prabhu are thinking to extend the pandal on about another week, because there is not any extra costs more than about a thousand rupees, since the main cost is in actually building it. So Bhavānanda Mahārāja and myself felt that they could continue the pandal, and you wouldn't have to attend. Perhaps on the last day, which would be very big again, next Sunday, you could come. But they could, the devotees themselves could speak as they....

Prabhupāda: I know that very nice. I want it may be possible for you.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda (Member of Parliament) -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, I am..., my life is dedicated for this purpose. I am... It is convenient for me at any time. Otherwise, I am not keeping good health at the moment. Still, I have come. I am just trying even up to the last moment of my life, if I can deliver some good to these people. That is my determination. What is this life? Life will end today or tomorrow or day after. But if you live just to the point, that is the idea. Otherwise trees are also living thousands of years. What is the benefit?

Mr. Rajda: Morarji Desai meeting we can arrange any time. Will it be possible, suppose I go there and fix up time and telephone over there?

Indian (2): Yes. You can give my card and telephone number

Mr. Rajda: All right, all right. That will be arranged.

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā is not a sectarian. It is full of... Manuṣyāṇāṁ sahasreṣu kaścid yatati siddhaye (BG 7.3). So it is practically proved, how they are taking Bhagavad-gītā. So it is science. It is actually life. So why not practice in India? It is not that everyone will be able, but there must be an exemplary sect. People may see that there is ideal. That we can do. India it is easier, because those who are born in India, constitutionally they have got that tendency. Simply we have to channelize. Then everything will be... So there is a good chance. Now the government has changed. They are after something very good, and the direction is there. If you take it seriously, there will be no difficulty.

Room Conversation First Day in Juhu Quarters -- March 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then so many servants will come? (laughter)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, according to the number of rings you give us.

Prabhupāda: That is a botheration. (pause) Just close the doors. I want to see how the doors are fixed up.

Gargamuni: These also?

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Gargamuni: These doors in the back.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (devotees go around closing the doors) All the greeting room? Hm?

Gargamuni: It is quiet.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Close that door, Gopāla.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: There's no door here.

Bhavānanda: There's no doors on this side.

Prabhupāda: One door is lacking.

Room Conversation -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Guru-pūjā.

Prabhupāda: Those who are visitors, they can see me. And for lecturing, on Sunday I shall lecture. You can fix up time, which time. But Sunday I shall speak from Bhāgavatam. This is general program. And if it is required some special, that is another thing. So what is the use of inviting visitors here?

Girirāja: I agree with that policy.

Prabhupāda: What do you think, Dr. Sharma?

Dr. Sharma: I agree. Very urgent or some special thing, then it can be done. Otherwise not, I don't think.

Prabhupāda: Generally, people come to visit: "How are you, how you are feeling?" And he takes half an hour even. So what is the use of wasting time like that, "How are you?" Everyone knows that I am not feeling well.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: For that they can come in the morning.

Prabhupāda: Yes. If they actually want to see me, I am going there. They can see me. For half an hour, more than half an hour. And for talking... There is no need of talking "How are you? How you are feeling?" This is not talking.

Room Conversation with Scientists, Svarupa Damodara, and Dr. Sharma -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Bring in the āsana. (Hindi with guest) (break) If you like, you can make this bed this size, not my size.

Hari-śauri: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (devotees are fixing something for Śrīla Prabhupāda) (pause)

Prabhupāda: Now you combine together and present this Kṛṣṇa consciousness throughout the whole world. (Hindi) You have been acquainted with the other scientists?

Dr. Sharma: Yes, I have met Swami Mādhava dāsa and his colleague, and I've gone through that article recently that they sent me about creation coming out of chaos. It is a very wonderful written article. They will be a real eye-opener for the scientists really. And I understand that you have a big plan to start a research institute with the help of the scientists. This will be really something that...

Prabhupāda: All Indian scientists should join.

Dr. Sharma: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That I want. To keep people in darkness is not science. They are keeping people in darkness. They do not know how nature is working, how they are subjugated to the laws of nature and trying to be independent.

Room Conversation -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: She seems to have been one of the worst leaders so far.

Prabhupāda: She is not leader, she is a prostitute. Woman given freedom means prostitute. Free woman means prostitute. What is this prostitute? She has no fixed-up husband. And free woman means this, daily, new friend.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who is Indira's husband, a congressman?

Girirāja: He died at an early age.

Prabhupāda: Hm? Who?

Girirāja: He was asking what happened to her husband. I said he died. He was a Parsee. As Your Divine Grace had said, that due to the saṅkīrtana movement an auspicious atmosphere is being created all over the world. So is it not possible that at least for the time being things will improve?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes. Improve. Not for the time being. For ten thousand years.

Morning Talk -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Just like Sarvabhauma Bhaṭṭācārya and Caitanya Mahāprabhu was talking. Caitanya said, "When the meaning is clear, why you are giving us this, nonsense?"

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sarvabhauma asked Him, "You have sat here hearing vedānta for seven, eight days, but You have not said anything. Are You not understanding?" Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, "I understand the vedānta, but I cannot understand your interpretation."

Indian man: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If you give me the key to the almirah, then I can fix the tacks (tax?).

Prabhupāda: Take.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I'll keep these here for now. First I'll do those.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi conversation) (takes prasādam) (end)

Room Conversation about Harijanas -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hm. Not that... Letter written to Calcutta, that copy should be enclosed to the...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, that's what I meant. Actually, that's good because he'll be eager to follow through to see that the money comes, because he is going to get the benefit of fixing it in his bank. (pause)

Prabhupāda: If possible we can start a center in Srinagar. If there is opportunity. Many foreigners come?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Many foreigners come.

Prabhupāda: If we start a center there, it will be very nice. That will be also one of the items of tourist program.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We can get Dr. Karan Singh's help very easily in Srinagar.

Prabhupāda: And Raja Sheik Abdullah has taken our Bhagavad-gītā, so we can invite him to talk.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Who?

Prabhupāda: Sheik Abdullah, the prime minister there, Kashmir.

Room Conversation about Harijanas -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: From Bombay to Kashmir direct.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Either direct or through Delhi. The Punjab Mail. I think there is a Punjab Mail.

Prabhupāda: Punjab Mail goes up to border of Kashmir.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So something like that. I mean we could fix that up.

Prabhupāda: No, as many books you can carry without any difficulty, you can take.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On the plane. Okay. Maybe Guru dāsa should wait there for awhile. If Guru dāsa and I go together as a preaching team, we can conquer anywhere.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I mean we will bring everyone that you want to see.

Prabhupāda: If you send a report, tell him that "You stay; we are coming."

Room Conversation -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In your apartment.

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You don't need...

Prabhupāda: Hm. The Deity is there, fixed-up. That's all right. I was keeping Deity with me, but a constant change of this servant.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's not nice for the Deities.

Prabhupāda: It is inconvenience.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Especially now, anyway, if we do this tīrtha traveling, then it will be difficult. That will be very nice. I think that I can start to make up an itinerary, that... There is a couple of devotees who have traveled a lot.

Prabhupāda: Now you try to manage the whole world organization and all GBC men. Suppose I am not there. Manage very nicely. Independently. Not to create havoc. But really to manage. I am still present; I will give you direction. Don't spoil it. We are in very good, prestigious position. That is sure. Don't spoil it. So much hard labor. I started with very humble condition. Now it has come to this, such exalted position. You don't spoil it. That is my request. Increase. That will depend on your character, behavior, preaching. Everyone knows. Everyone is astonished. Without any help, I started. Only asset was sincere... Everyone knows it. Otherwise how it is possible?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It is our duty as your disciples to preserve everything that you've done. (someone brings in some prasādam—some Hindi conversation)

Prabhupāda: Nim is good.

Room Conversation -- April 13, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually a letter came yesterday, I think, from the chief minister. I haven't opened it yet. Shall I bring it?

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Fan.

Upendra: (bringing garlands) This one was made by a little girl. The boy who fixed the buzzers, his little daughter made.

Prabhupāda: This is our flower? Hm? Get all round, flower, the first land vacant. You should plant them. Puṇyo gandhaḥ pṛthivyāṁ ca.

Upendra: Paramparā mālās. There's five mālās here for the paramparā.

Prabhupāda: First of all hear. Then tomorrow they... Kṛṣṇa is helping. He'll help more, more. We are not going to be misled by their leadership.

Girirāja: No. They have nothing to say. Actually, the way you've trained us is very good, that you always present their arguments and then how to defeat them or what is the defect, so when we go out for preaching, we're not baffled by their arguments.

Prabhupāda: That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's policy. Let the rascal Sarvabhauma speak first of all. Let his talk be finished. Hear silently. And then reply. He'll hear.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So arrange for the State Bank coming as soon as possible. That will facilitate our business.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda wanted to know, Girirāja, whether you thought Bank of America would give interest on a savings account weekly. We know they're giving it on the fixed deposits.

Girirāja: I'll ask the manager.

Prabhupāda: It is a charitable institution, so you'll... Why not give weekly?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That Kun... If he says no for any reason ... (break) Here they come. (guests enter)

Prabhupāda: Aiye. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Thank you very ... Aiye.

Mr. Rajda: I have brought my Phalis, Mohendralal Phalis(?)

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Mr. Rajda: Here is Mr. Raj(?) also.

Prabhupāda: Betiye.

Mr. Rajda: My wife, Mrs. Rajda, my daughter, Mitsu. This is my nephew, younger brother's son.

Mrs. Rajda: (Hindi)

Mr. Rajda: How is your health now, Swamiji?

Prabhupāda: Not very good, but as Kṛṣṇa's mercy going on. These are some of our latest publications.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You can study whether we are genuine or bogus, pariks.(?) Thank you. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya.

Devotees: Haribol!

Prabhupāda: Jaya. (Hindi) (guests leave) What is that?

Devotee (2): I'm just fixing the bedspread.

Prabhupāda: We have got these chairs. Why you should use apara(?)...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah. No more of these...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...for guests.

Prabhupāda: This may be... Make it comfortable.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: From now on, I'll... (break)

Prabhupāda: That is not possible in the dog. A human being can do. So this opportunity is there, and people are not giving them this opportunity. This is the greatest harmful civilization. They are keeping them in ignorance for that. Anyway, if people agree to take our guidance, we can change the face of the world. That is a fact. Whole world will be peaceful immediately.

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What is that? The idea is cheating. The cheating business begins from the government. And why people will not learn to cheat? This is cheating. I am giving you one paper, one hundred rupees, dollars, and you are happy: "I have got so many ..." I am giving you check, ten thousand dollars. You got ten thousand dollars. Now I give you a paper. But it is going on. We have made machinery in such a way that it will go on in hundred rupees or ten thousand rupees. Just like this fixed deposit. I am giving actual money; they are giving a receipt. And it will increase. What increase? The same paper. And gradually inflation is going on. They'll pay at the inflation rate.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, they say they're paying at the investment rate.

Prabhupāda: That is, mean, their plea. Really, today... Just like in our childhood my father had three hundred rupees, and that three hundred rupees is now ten thousand. So if my father would have deposited three hundred rupees at that time, automatically he has become ten thousand... So if you pay me instead of three hundred, say, six hundred or eight hundred, what is your loss? It has already become ten thousand.

Morning Talk -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

rabhupāda: Is that civilization? Human being should be calm and quiet, peaceful and advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. There must be four divisions, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, everything. Everything is lost. From the very morning, "Where is bread? Where is bread?" We have no fixed income, but we are so pure(?). We are maintaining big establishment. Who has got so big establishment? And what is our asset? Asset is only Kṛṣṇa. For ordinary karmīs to maintain such house and such big establishment...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not possible. No one can do it.

Prabhupāda: He'll have insomnia, cannot sleep at night. What would have been the cost of the establishment? So many men are working.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What to speak of worldwide.

Prabhupāda: This is one only.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One of one hundred.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 23, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: All right. So...

Mr. Dwivedi: Either you might keep this way, that... Just fix up some date so I shall also get myself ready accordingly, fixed up, finish up my other...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How many days you are intending to stay now in Bombay?

Mr. Dwivedi: I am leaving on the 25th night. Then, on... I am reaching there 26th night. On the 27th I have to attend the marriage of my younger brother's son. That will take about two days, to 27th and 28th. And then, then, till about the 3rd I am busy in the sense that our president of Abhesivasana(?), he expired recently. So he left two sons. They... They just need my little guidances in such matters, the young boys. Not young. Pretty old, but yet, because they, being the sons of a yajnirdatta(?), did not much look up to the work, now suddenly the responsibility has fallen over their heads. So... But after the 3rd or 4th, I am free.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's good, gives a little time for preparing.

Mr. Dwivedi: The weather at our headquarters is always pleasant. Summer, very pleasant. You'll gain in weight.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Mr. Dwivedi: And strange enough, you gain in color also in summer.

Prabhupāda: Attractive.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You read it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "To Shree Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Goswami, Hare Krishna Land, Juhu. Dear friend, I am extremely grateful to His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda Guru Mahārāja for giving me his precious few minutes yesterday and your good self for arranging the interview. I request that His Divine Grace be graciously pleased to fix a date for His Divine Grace's visit to Pauri to inaugurate International Krishna Society branch of Madhya Pradesh at Pauri and to revitalize and modernize the rural uplift activities of the Adarsh Seva Sanga. With profound regards, yours fraternally, H. S. Dwivedi."

Prabhupāda: So?

Mr. Dwivedi: So if I get the letter from you... In fact, I drafted this letter for you also. You can make necessary changes in it, so if I get it, even a tentative day, that will be convenient for me. I'll be able to approach the press people over here, and they will just spread out the news.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "As per your request and as per interview you had with His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupāda on 23/4/77, His Divine Grace with his entourage will..." (break) ...is a Thursday. Fifth: the program was to be from 5th to 8th, meant Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday. Now whether these days will be easier for people to attend? Just like your idea is that some people from Gwalior will come and others. My feeling is that they'll have an easier time to come on a Sunday or on a Saturday evening.

Mr. Dwivedi: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But if we arrive on 7th, which is Sunday night, and the program begins on Monday night, then I think it will be all weekdays, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, which is...

Prabhupāda: There is... In the village there is no such consideration.

Second Meeting with Mr. Dwivedi -- April 24, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (more Hindi conversation) So give him photograph, my photograph. Bring some photograph.

Mr. Dwivedi: All right. (Hindi) There are tentative date... (Hindi) So that can be fixed, that Your Holiness will be reaching there about the 6th.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That letter...

Mr. Dwivedi: (Hindi) In that letter, whatever changes you want to make, make changes. Kindly put the date 6th, that His Grace should be reaching Gwalior on the 6th.

Prabhupāda: Do... Otherwise call him.

Mr. Dwivedi: Or Pauri otherwise, Pauri on the 7th.

Prabhupāda: Call him.

Mr. Dwivedi: Pauri on the 7th, morning.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. (Hindi) So that letter...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is it required to give letter like that, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation: Vairagya, Salaries, and Political Etiquette -- April 28, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Girirāja: Going to try to phone Mr. Rajda. And considering that the Prime Minister may not have that much time... We had discussed that he should come here to meet you, but suppose if we fix up, say, a minimum time if he can't come here, say at least a half hour undisturbed, something like that, is it possible to fix in the city or we should just insist that...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's suggesting that if the Prime Minister can't give that much time, whether you would go to see him? Actually, if you give the idea that Prabhupāda wants to see him in the morning hours...

Girirāja: Yeah, I'm going to.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I mean, if he says that that's not possible...

Prabhupāda: That is not respectful.

Girirāja: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not at all respectful.

Prabhupāda: Then he does not know how to honor a saintly person. It is useless to meet him. If he has no respect for saintly person, if he thinks greater than saintly person, then he's useless.

Conversation with Vedic Astronomer -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Pañcama-skandha, yes.

Indian Astronomer: There we find there about the Priyavrata. Priyavrata's sons, they divided the world...

Prabhupāda: No, persons we are not very much concerned. We are... Immediately we want the diagram how to fix it up so that people can see, "This is the situation." So you make this diagram.

Indian Astronomer: It is first attempt to give in picture the ideas of Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So we... We are... We have got very good scheme so that people from the world will come to see the Vedic idea of planetary system. This is the ambition. So you kindly help us.

Indian Astronomer: As far as possible, as our Lord moves, I am prepared to serve.

Prabhupāda: So you sit down and take paper and make it and..., so that he can understand. You have already studied that.

Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I have given the idea. Now how to put it into shape, that I... That I do not know.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: There's a man coming that Patita Uddhāraṇa invited?

Surabhīr Abhipālayantam: Yes. Tomorrow this man from Bangalore is coming.

Prabhupāda: So where his place has been fixed up?

Surabhīr Abhipālayantam: He can stay in one of the life membership rooms because he's alone. He doesn't have wife and that.

Prabhupāda: It doesn't matter.

Surabhīr Abhipālayantam: No, he is...

Prabhupāda: Give him nice, comfortable room.

Surabhīr Abhipālayantam: Nice room. That we have arranged. And these people from Germany, they will stay two days in Bombay.

Prabhupāda: No, anyone, newcomer, give him very nice place, nice food. Food and shelter is the first consideration.

Evening Darsana -- May 13, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: So without this faith, nobody can achieve the association of Kṛṣṇa. There are two things. You become associate of Kṛṣṇa, or you become associate of this material world. So if you do not become associate of Kṛṣṇa, then the next step is this association of material world. And association of material world means accepting one type of body and enjoy or suffer for some time; then you get another body. Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani (BG 9.3). Now we have to make our choice, whether you want to stop this material way of life and attain the eternal spiritual life...

mām upetya punar janma

duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam

nāpnuvanti mahātmānaḥ

saṁsiddhiṁ paramāṁ gatāḥ

(BG 8.15)

If you get the association of Kṛṣṇa, then you haven't got to come here, this material world. Duḥkhālayam. Kṛṣṇa says it is duḥkhālayam. Either you take birth in a very rich, aristocratic family, born in the upper planetary system as demigods-Brahmā, Indra, Candra, like that—or you take your birth, an insignificant ant; wherever you are in material body, it is duḥkhālayam. That you cannot avoid. Duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam (BG 8.15). And you cannot make any compromise that "Never mind it is very much miserable. I shall enjoy." So that also will not be allowed. Aśāśvatam. Your tendency is to live forever. So that will not be allowed. Aśāśvata. So this requires knowledge, intelligence, that "If I am eternal," na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20), "I am not destroyed even this body is destroyed," then you should seek after eternal happiness. Why temporary? That is not in your interest. That happiness is there when you go back to Kṛṣṇa; otherwise not. These are the statement in the Bhagavad-gītā. So if we do not try to understand the real purpose of Bhagavad-gītā, and if we theorize, "Bhagavad-gītā means nonviolence. Bhagavad-gītā means to become patriot," these are materialism. We should avoid this wrong interpretation, misguiding direction of blind leaders. We'll not get any benefit out of it. So we are trying to rectify this. That's all. Everything is there. Any question is solved by Kṛṣṇa. Politics, economics, religion, culture, philosophy—everything is discussed very thoroughly. Simply one has to understand. Then he becomes fixed up in Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Evening Darsana -- May 14, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: In order to come to the position of that mahātmā, one has to render service to Vāsudeva. Vāsudeve bhagavati bhakti-yogaḥ prayojitaḥ. Then jñāna-vairāgya automatically will be manifested. Janayaty āśu vairāgyam. Real life means vairāgya. Just like these boys known as hippies. They are trying for vairāgya. They are coming from countries, very opulent, rich father, mother, but they do not like, inclined to vairāgya, renunciation. But renunciation must be based on knowledge, jñāna-vairāgya. So that they are lacking. They are not fixed up. But there is a tendency of vairāgya. Is it not? That is also good. (Hindi) Therefore, according to Vedic civilization, there is compulsory vairāgya. As soon as one is fifty years old, he must give up family life. Pañcāśordhvaṁ vanaṁ vrajet. Aiye. (Hindi) Jawaharlal Nehru, up to the end of his life he wanted to remain prime minister. (Hindi with scattered English words) Practical application there are. (Hindi) (pause) (Hindi) (Hindi conversation with scattered English) Without bhakti, jñāna is never sufficient, but bhakti does not depend... Ahaituky apratihatā. It cannot be checked. (Hindi) Bhagavān is within. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe 'rjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). And He assures... (Hindi) The so-called jñānī, he wants to become liberated and become one with the Supreme-kāṅkṣati. When actually one is self-realized, na kāṅkṣati. Yogī kāṅkṣati. (Hindi) Bhagavān is the Supreme. We are part and parcel. So I have already given you the example, these fingers, part and parcel of the body. The only desire should be how to serve the body. That is selfishness. (Hindi) Then where is that picture? The gopīs are pushing Rādhārāṇī to Kṛṣṇa.

Evening Darsana -- May 15, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Pradyumna: "The group of transcendentalists who follow the path of the inconceivable, unmanifested, impersonal feature of the Supreme Lord engaged in devotional service of the Lord are called (sic:) bhakta-yogīs. Now, here the difference between jñāna-yoga and bhakti-yoga is definitely expressed. The process of jñāna-yoga, although ultimately bringing one to the same goal, is very troublesome, whereas the path of bhakti-yoga, the process of being in direct service to the Supreme Personality of Godhead, is easier and is natural for the embodied soul. The individual soul is embodied since time immemorial. It is very difficult for him to simply theoretically understand that he is not the body. Therefore the bhakti-yogī accepts the Deity of Kṛṣṇa as worshipable because there is some bodily conception fixed in the mind which can thus be applied. Of course, worship of the Supreme Personality of Godhead in His form within the temple is not idol worship. There is evidence in the Vedic literature that worship may be saguṇa or nirguṇa, of the Supreme possessing or not possessing attributes. Worship of the Deity in the temple is saguṇa worship, for the Lord is represented by material qualities. But the form of the Lord, though represented by material qualities such as stone, wood, or oil paint, is not actually material. That is the absolute nature of the Supreme Lord. A crude example may be given here. We may find some mail boxes on the street, and if we post our letters in those boxes, they will naturally will go to their destination without difficulty. But any old box or an imitation which we may find somewhere, which is not authorized by the post office, will not do the work. Similarly, God has an authorized representation in the Deity form, which is called arcā-vigraha. This arcā-vigraha is an incarnation of the Supreme Lord. God will accept service through that form. The Lord is omnipotent and all-powerful. Therefore, by His incarnation as arcā-vigraha, He can accept the service of the devotee just to make it convenient for the man in conditioned life. So for a devotee, there is no difficulty in approaching the Supreme immediately and directly, but for those who are following the impersonal way to spiritual realization, the path is difficult. They have to understand the unmanifested representation of the Supreme through such Vedic literatures as the Upaniṣads, and they have to learn the language, understand the nonperceptual feeling, and they have to realize all these processes..."

Prabhupāda: Just like in the Upaniṣads it is said, paśyaty acakṣuḥ: "He sees, but He has no eyes." So what is that? How we can think of, one is seeing without eye? Aiye. There are so many. Śṛṇoty akarṇaḥ: "He has no ears..." So both things are there. When it is said, paśyaty acakṣuḥ... Mean cakṣuḥ, eyes, as soon we think of eyes, we think of our eyes, own eyes, and therefore it is forbidden, "Not like your eyes." Paśyati. He can see everywhere. Therefore we have to discuss śāstra. In the Brahma-saṁhitā it is said, aṅgāni yasya sakalendriya-vṛttimanti paśyanti pānti kalayanti ciraṁ jaganti (Bs. 5.32). The aṅga, the different parts of the body of Kṛṣṇa, has got all the qualities of other aṅga. Just like we can see with eyes, but Kṛṣṇa can speak also with eyes. He can eat also with eyes. That is difference.

Discussions -- May 20-22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Other than that, you already formed the Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust. Everything is there.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: BBT is there.

Prabhupāda: These are the points.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And I have the numbers of your fixed deposits, so when you mention the former family members, we can specify which deposits they are.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So they'll be no misunderstanding.

Prabhupāda: That is also lifetime.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In their lifetime, not beyond.

Prabhupāda: And after the demise the money belong to the society.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Society. That means the deposits will remain intact, and simply the interest will be given as a monthly stipend.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What about Bury Place?

Jayatīrtha: Bury Place we're keeping. They're still trying to get us out, but we are keeping. I don't think that Kṛṣṇa will leave until He wants to leave. (Prabhupāda laughs) We just fixed up His Deity house and generally repaired the place. Now...

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is smiling. They are trying to drive Him. Kṛṣṇa's smiling. That's all. Go on with your business.

Jayatīrtha: Therefore you called Him Rādhā-London-Īśvara.

Prabhupāda: Our London, Bury Place, Deity is very beautiful, smiling.

Kīrtanānanda: There's a picture there, Prabhupāda, on your altar.

Prabhupāda: Hm. That is the first installed...

Jayatīrtha: Yes. And the new place also, we're...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jayatīrtha: The new place we bought on Soho Street, we're making it into reading room and restaurant.

Prabhupāda: New place?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: On Soho Street off Oxford Street they have purchased one pub, a restaurant.

Prabhupāda: That I saw?

Jayatīrtha: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

GBC Meets with Srila Prabhupada -- May 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Girirāja: And also for Māyāpur add him as a trustee.

Prabhupāda: Very good. So do it. His condition will take some time. He has agreed. Then he's gone to London.

Girirāja: Then for the bank accounts, the main fund is the ISKCON Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana fixed deposits and savings account. So we thought that the best thing would be to have a committee to oversee the spending of this money in terms of your desire. So we propose that the committee consist of Gurukṛpā Mahārāja, Rāmeśvara Mahārāja, Jayapatākā Mahārāja, Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Goswami, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa and myself.

Prabhupāda: Very good. Approved.

Girirāja: This would represent Gurukṛpā, who's collecting also the money, and Rāmeśvara.

Prabhupāda: I think you are all competent. Very good selection. Do it.

Girirāja: Then the persons who sign the checks, they would do so according to the decision made by the...

Prabhupāda: Of this committee.

Girirāja: Yes.

GBC Meets with Srila Prabhupada -- May 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Girirāja: Then the accounts in your personal name... We thought that those funds could be transferred to the Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Fund, just as you suggested, and just keep our own account, how it is spent in terms of your desire.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You can transfer at any moment.

Girirāja: And then for the fixed deposits, the interest for your family members, that we would just leave them in your name, as it's mentioned in the will, and throughout their life they will get the income.

Prabhupāda: That we shall do. I shall... How to do it... For the time being you haven't got to bother.

Girirāja: No.

Prabhupāda: So that I shall pay.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We also felt that. We wouldn't bother with that.

Prabhupāda: That's nice. Very good.

Girirāja: So we are...

Prabhupāda: Do it very nicely, cool-headed. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). We shall be always prepared to take instruction from Kṛṣṇa. That is best.

Discussions -- June 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And that declaration should be taken. That you are already taking.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I am in the process of getting them all, oaths of allegiance.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Oath of allegiance. That should be maintained.

Rāmeśvara: So we've already fixed it up for the American temples, with three GBC men assigned to each building, but it hasn't been mentioned in the will.

Prabhupāda: No, why not?

Rāmeśvara: It should be. So we'll have to add a clause...

Prabhupāda: Add it.

Rāmeśvara: ...to deal with the other properties.

Prabhupāda: Add it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Add it right now, Prabhupāda says. "Temples outside of India..." That's how it should be worded. "Centers" or "Temples outside of..."

Rāmeśvara: "Properties outside of India."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "Properties outside of India may only be..." I think we can say, "in principle should not be..."

Prabhupāda: There should be inventory of all the properties in this will.

Discussions -- June 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: All right, don't make if it cannot be so worded(?).

Girirāja: "This direction is irrevocable. 5. I declare, say and confirm that all the properties, both movable and immovable, which stand in my name, including current accounts, saving accounts and fixed deposits in various banks, are the properties and assets of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, and the heirs and successors of my previous family or anyone claiming through them have no right, claim or interest in these properties whatsoever save and except as provided hereinafter. Although the money which is in my personal name in every bank is being spent for ISKCON and it will belong to ISKCON, I have kept a few deposits specifically named for allocating a monthly allowance of Rs. 1,000 to the members of my former family—two sons, two daughters, and wife. After the deaths of the members of my former family these specific deposits, or this interest and savings, will become the property of ISKCON for the purpose of the trust, and the descendants of my former family or anyone claiming to be them shall not be allowed any further allowance."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It says that the deposits are "mentioned therein."

Girirāja: No.

Rāmeśvara: It just says that they are specifically named somewhere.

Girirāja: It's except for these, it's all the deposits of ISKCON. It says. We weren't sure about this, but since Mr. Sharma mentioned it, we put: "I hereby appoint..."—and then we've kept some blank space—"...to act as executors of this will. I have made this will this-blank-day of June, 1977, in possession of full sense and sound mind, without any persuasion, force or compulsion from anybody. Witnesses, 1., 2., 3."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dr. Ghosh should be one of the witnesses. According to Mr. Sharma, if a doctor witnesses, it's very good, attending physician.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Discussions -- June 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Rāmeśvara: There's one other item that has been recommended by several persons, Prabhupāda, and that is the will is only a legal document after the maker of the will has departed, so in the interim period, they have suggested an affidavit for any properties or, say, fixed deposits that are in your personal name, and this affidavit would simply state that the purpose of these fixed deposits and properties is for ISKCON. In that way the government will never be able to exact any taxes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is there some wording there?

Rāmeśvara: Do you want me to read it?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: If Prabhupāda likes.

Rāmeśvara: So we have prepared an affidavit. Shall we read it?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So that change takes place according to your mentality. You are subtle thing, psychological. One man is thief. By change, he can become a saintly person. One man is saintly person; he becomes a thief. So that change, according to three qualities... Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthāḥ (BG 14.18). You cannot ascertain immediately because you are changing from sattva-guṇa to rajo-guṇa, rajo-guṇa to tamo-guṇa. So how you can be ascertained? But there will be change. That is fixed. So we have to take this word change. So you cannot expect what changes. Are you going to be dog or hog or god? That will depend on your work. How you can expect to see, that "I do not see"? But that is not certain. There are 8,400,000's of different types of change of body. But you have to change. Not that you have to become a dog. You can become a demigod. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti... But change is certain. So if change takes place, then where is your position? Whatever you have done-śrama eva hi kevalam (SB 1.2.8).

Letter from Yugoslavia--'Books!' -- June 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm, you can go now. You can all go. You can sit down here for some time and begin work.

Devotee: Jaya Śrīla Prabhupāda. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: In Dhruvaloka.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dhruvaloka's fixed. We have some nice reports for you. First, little book distribution from the saṅkīrtana newsletter for the week. This gives a report of the week of June 6th to June 12th. Now, one thing you should know, whenever these reports are read, only thirty-five temples reported, not all of them. (break)

Prabhupāda: That should not be his business. It may be inferior. If not inferior, not with the... Then it is mentioned in the... (break) Still more. (break) And that is all written, Hindi, English. They can go home to home and distribute Hindi books to the ladies. They can be engaged in that way. (break) Therefore any so-called yogi (indistinct).

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: On the whole, the sun is not fixed up.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, not at all. It's moving. As a matter of fact, it describes sometimes it moves in one way with Meru at its right side, and then sometimes it moves the other way with Meru at its left side.

Prabhupāda: That is dakṣiṇāyana-mārga, dakṣiṇāyanam, uttarāyaṇa.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's very much moving and at very high speed.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I calculated sixteen thousand miles per second, so far I remember.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I think that's right.

Prabhupāda: And it is Sūryaloka. It has population.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All of the personalities there have very dazzling bodies.

Prabhupāda: Fiery body.

Meeting With Governor of Tamil Nadu -- July 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Think over. His Excellency is inviting. It is a good opportunity.

Governor: We'll keep Mahārāja in our Raj Bhavan in very comfortable place to stay. It's like āśrama, because in our lands in my garden we have got 1,300 deers of various type. We feel as if we are in Vālmīki-āśrama. They are all coming to us, and we give them some food also, 1,300 deer in our compound.

Prabhupāda: So accept his invitation and fix up.

Governor: Very good trees. Mango trees. There are more than two hundred mango trees in our compound. Various fruit trees. Beautiful everything. Nearly 200 acres of land is in our compound, very fine, and very cool. The sea ... There is our one small bungalow on the sea also.

Prabhupāda: So when you think it will be suitable?

Governor: I am going tomorrow to Ahmedabad with our chief minister. He has come here. Ahmedabad I stay for four days. I go to Bombay. And from Bombay I'll be in Madras on 8th back. Then I am there.

Prabhupāda: Eighth, August. So we can if you think. So kindly submit my application to the Prime Minister.

Governor: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: That's it.

Room Conversation -- October 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, their letter...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not only one copy. I have two copies.

Prabhupāda: Where is that letter?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I have them... It's attached in that file with the fixed deposit receipts.

Prabhupāda: What it is written there?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It gives them specific instruction to immediately transfer these two fixed deposits on the date of maturity to the Central Bank of India, Gwalior Bank, north branch, to the account of Bhaktivedanta Book Trust.

Prabhupāda: No. What do they say?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And they also acknowledge having received it, having received the two fixed deposit receipts. The bank manager stamped it, dated it, signature. We gave them the receipts signed, so they acknowledged having received it.

Prabhupāda: But they have not issued any letter, "Yes, it will be done"?

Room Conversation -- October 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, their acknowledgement of the letter should constitute that. I got them to acknowledge that they received the original. The fact that they would take the receipt of the fixed deposits indicates that they have to do the needful, as we have instructed them. And I have no doubt that they will do that. When they came to see you, they accepted that they would have to do that, because the money was sent to them, the four lakhs.

Prabhupāda: So other banking business going on? Huh?

Akṣayānanda: Generally everything is all right, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bank is giving good service?

Akṣayānanda: Yes. It's all right.

Prabhupāda: Go on. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...no greater honor than to be called your son, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Where is that Dr. Sharma?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Dr. Sharma. Oh, yes. Where is he? He's here. Did that milk give you any mucus, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's good.

Room Conversation -- October 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: ...keeping money in the bank. Means so long I think that the bank keeping money is my pocket. And as soon as I've got the sentiment that these men are interested to keep our money in their pocket, I'll be very careful not to deposit.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, he said that to me today. He said, "Now your fixed deposits are decreasing, and your bank balances in all accounts are very minimal." The manager said this to me today.

Prabhupāda: Because they are harassing.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Because... The reason... We are afraid of their psychology that they think that our money is now theirs. And that is giving us fear.

Prabhupāda: They're thinking like that. We cannot freely have our money.

Room Conversation -- October 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually it's only with the greatest difficulty that you were able to transfer this fixed deposits. Four times they came to you, and for even a half hour to one hour at a time went on and on, explaining to Prabhupāda why he should not do this. Really the best thing is that, I mean, if I can give this humble advice, is that someone like Girirāja should deal with them instead of... Because I feel, Śrīla Prabhupāda, they take advantage of you when they talk with you, and that makes me feel very bad to see.

Prabhupāda: Then tell Girirāja. Ask Girirāja to take...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Because they see that you're not that well, and they also know that you're so merciful. And you're also a local Brajabāsī in a way. Therefore they're always against any of us taking any participation. It's the funniest thing. I explained something to Girirāja. He's been dealing with so many legal things for so long that he's become like a lawyer, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Central Bank is very straightforward.

Room Conversation -- October 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: If Girirāja can deal with these men, then let him do it immediately.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. Very good. He can, because he thinks legally, and that's how you have to deal with these men. They're actually small time, and they're just harassing us because we're acting in a very gentlemanly way and they're acting in a very ungentlemanly way. Anyway, we're not going to take out our fixed deposits. The ones that are there should be matured. But when they're matured, if we want to transfer them to somewhere else, we should have the freedom to do that and not be bound to have to keep the money there. That's the only point. And we'll be bringing so much money. Your Divine Grace has plans for making Vṛndāvana very much developed. So they should not worry like that. None of our other bankers are worried. They see sometimes we take the money, sometimes we bring money. But because of the way they're dealing, we don't want to bring any money. I'll tell Girirāja to..., if he can deal with this matter, that he should take it up. He wanted to meet them. He said he wanted to see what...

Prabhupāda: Let him meet.

Room Conversation -- October 4, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Make it clear. Organize gradually. Shift the money to other banks so they may not know. And that is the best policy.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's the best policy, Prabhupāda said.

Prabhupāda: No, immediately there is no more fixed deposit?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Not immediately. Now the next ones will be in 1979 and 1981.

Prabhupāda: What is the advice?

Girirāja: Should we read it?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- October 6, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: And now we have got..., sent four lakhs.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Sent four lakhs?

Hari-śauri: Prabhupāda just transferred four lakhs from matured fixed deposits.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: To?

Hari-śauri: To Bombay, was it, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Tamāla knows better...

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Should we use that four lakhs for printing?

Hari-śauri: For that go-down.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: We can use it for the go-down, for building that go-down.

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, there is no need of keeping in the bank.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The villagers will like it very much. You smash it by that ḍheṅki. You know that machine?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The ladies jump on it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So as much as it is powdered, make it ruṭi, and the hard portion make rice. The kṛṣāṇas will like, and it is very nutritious.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Actually, Śrīla Prabhupāda, you gave your word to Kṛṣṇa in Bombay that you would see Him sitting in His new big temple. So you have yet to keep your word fully to Him.

Brahmānanda: We have fixed a date for the opening of the Bombay temple-January 1st.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Brahmānanda: So we would like to invite you to come, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It is your temple. You have asked Kṛṣṇa to come there, and when we all gave up, you carried on the fight.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everything I do is(?) fighting. Out of (indistinct), fighting, survival and construct such a big temple is a great triumph.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Girirāja? Did not go to the bank?

Girirāja: The bank? Well, yesterday we delivered a letter signed by Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Goswami and myself officially instructing them to transfer the fixed deposits from here to Delhi. So there are a couple of formalities. And so the Delhi manager gave us a note what we have to do. And Tejiyas says that the former chairman of the Punjab Bank is a life member.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Girirāja: So he said that he could even come with us and meet them. So the new chairman, I mean the present chairman, is coming on Tuesday. So I think we'll get all the formalities ready, and then we can go on Tuesday. Today is Sunday, so we couldn't do anything today.

Prabhupāda: So these people have agreed?

Girirāja: The local people? Well, they have not agreed. That's why we felt that we have to meet the chairman. Legally we have every right to transfer the fixed deposit wherever we like, and if the former chairman is with us, then they can't give any false excuses because he knows all the rules. Actually we're not asking for anything special. Otherwise we're... Probably the local people will try to avoid giving it up. But this is our right, and the chairman has to uphold our right as customers of the bank.

Prabhupāda: What is their plea here?

Girirāja: Local people? Well, they will say that there's no reason to transfer the fixed deposits.

Prabhupāda: We have reason.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So what is that copy? What you have written?

Girirāja: Well, we wrote two letters, because the fixed deposits are in the name of ISKCON Kṛṣṇa-Balarāma Temple Maintenance. So we said that "We are holding the following fixed deposits in your Vṛndāvana branch," and then we gave the list of the numbers and the amount and when it is due, and we said, "Please arrange to transfer these to your main branch in New Delhi." And then another letter for those in the name of ISKCON Vṛndāvana-Māyāpur Trust. Same contents. So then they wrote back that we should write the same letter addressed to the Vṛndāvana branch and with a copy to them, and we should give the original and the copy to them, and they will present the original to the Vṛndāvana branch and get them to transfer the money. And the second point is that they wanted us to give them the fixed deposit receipts, and they said they would give us a receipt. But we are hesitating to do that, because we are afraid if they give those receipts to the Vṛndāvana branch, then they may keep them. So we want to propose that the Vṛndāvana people should transfer the money and they should prepare a new receipt for the Delhi branch. And when the new receipt is prepared, they can give us the new receipts and we will give them the old receipts.

Prabhupāda: Very good. (break) They should give in writing.

Room Conversation -- October 9, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Well, why don't you do that?

Girirāja: Yes, we're doing that. And the second point is the Delhi office wrote that we should give them the fixed deposit receipts and they will give us a receipt for that. Then they will get those fixed deposit receipts changed over to the New Delhi office, and then they will give us back the certificates and we will give them back the receipt.

Prabhupāda: So there is no problem. Huh?

Girirāja: Well... The only problem is if the Vṛndāvana people try to hold on to the receipts and make difficulty. In ordinary course of business there is no difficulty. This is the ordinary procedure. So we will try to arrange that the endorsement of the certificates to New Delhi could be done in our presence instead of our giving them the certificates.

Prabhupāda: What is that endorsement?

Girirāja: That this money, instead of being payable from Vṛndāvana, now we can take that money from the New Delhi office.

Prabhupāda: The money is due after some years.

Room Conversation -- October 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Girirāja: I had a very wonderful meeting with the chairman of the bank. And he's ready to do anything to satisfy us and keep our business. So he said that he was going to get rid of the man who is on this counter, Mr. Gupta, and give us some more young, dynamic, cooperative person to be in charge over here. And we completed the formalities for transferring the fixed deposits to the main branch, and he assured me that it was a completely routine transaction and that if the local people tried to do anything to stop it, that he would himself personally see that it went through smoothly. So I gave them the certificates. It was not necessary to sign them. We just gave the certificates, and they gave us a receipt. And they're going to endorse the certificates. So they are payable from New Delhi instead of from Vṛndāvana, and then we can go and collect them. And the chairman also called the assistant general manager. He was also very nice and very sympathetic. So he's going to come on Saturday, and he's going to look into everything, all the difficulties here. And I said that he could bring his family and they could take prasādam. So they're all going to be coming on Saturday at about eleven o'clock. I had submitted a letter with eleven things that we wanted. You know, we want the hours to be regular, we wanted a new person here, we wanted our interest on time—just a list of different things. And he said that there's no problem, and they're just ready to do whatever we want. They gave the impression that they would dismiss any number of people here that were giving us trouble. But I said that I thought that the main person was this Mr. Gupta, and so they said they would replace him. It was very good. But still, even if there are improvements here, I think it's better to keep the fixed deposits in New Delhi.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Room Conversation -- October 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So certificate must be transferred there.

Girirāja: Yes. We've given them the certificates and the letter, and they've taken the responsibility. They're sending the certificates by registered post to the Vṛndāvana people with their instructions to transfer the money to New Delhi. So those will definitely reach here by Saturday when the assistant general manager comes. And if there's any hesitation, the assistant general manager will take care of it when he's here on Saturday. And I would think that by Monday or Tuesday we could get the certificates changed officially. And then, I think, we should have a least one account in their main branch in New Delhi. It would probably be easier to get inward remittances there. And if we want the interest from the fixed deposits to be kept there, we can have an account there for that. And that will keep us in good contact with the head office.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. Hm.

Room Conversation -- October 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: According to our śāstra, mind is meant for speculation. It does not give us any definite knowledge. My mind is working in one way; your mind is working another way. There is no conclu... Manorathenāsati dhāvato bahiḥ (SB 5.18.12). This is the result of mental speculation. And Gītā also says that manaḥ ṣaṣṭhānīndriyāṇi prakṛti-sthāni karṣati (BG 15.7). This spiritual spark, being bound up by the mind and the senses, is struggling hard on the material nature. And he's simply struggling. No fixed up condition. Everyone will say, "I think this is right." What is right, he does not know. That is struggle. Is it not?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. There are a group of physicists in the world today that... They think that the phenomena and the relationship between life and matter is some sort of a complementary. Just like they took this idea from a physicist called Niels Bohr. He tried to explain the quality of a particle called electron that has two properties. Sometimes is behaves like a wave, and sometimes it behaves like a particle. So he proposed an idea called "complementarity." Taking from that idea, some of the present-day physicists think that life and matter are some sort of a complementary. But we are saying that that is wrong, saying that life is completely different from matter, inanimate matter. We're going to make that stand strong and also make it quite clear in the conference.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda, Bhavānanda Mahārāja is here.

Prabhupāda: Hm. Bhavānanda Mahārāja?

Bhavānanda: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I have trying to pass urine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Have you tried? You feel like it now? You want to try? I'll fix up the bottle. Okay. (break) (kīrtana) Yes, Prabhupāda? It's Tamāla Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: That sweet lemon juice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You want some? Okay. (aside:) Tell Bhakti-caru. It's coming in one second, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (break)

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He liked that, those lemons, sweet lemons. Here's Bhakti-caru.

Bhakti-caru: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm. Today I like to take ḍāl-ruṭi.

Room Conversation -- October 14, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: How you have accepted invitation today?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The time it was fixed for was the lunch time of the conference. Another reason Bhagatji wanted to have it was that he just wanted to have it while everyone was here. But the main thing is that the lunch was supposed to coincide with the lunchtime of the conference. That's the main point. In other words, there was no conflict of the two.

Prabhupāda: Why did you not go there?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: See, the scientists did not come on time. They did not come on time. They came late. The conference was to begin at ten, but it began at noon. I mean I don't think it's... The main point is that the devotees will start to attend probably the afternoon session, because it will be on a more regular schedule again. This was just a very irregular... Even the scientists... There was only thirty of them in the conference, because although more than that have arrived, they haven't yet settled into their quarters. This first... The first lecture is a little like that. Everybody's getting settled in.

Prabhupāda: I do not know what to say.

Room Conversation -- October 15, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So, the bank business?

Girirāja: The manager came, I mean, not the manager, the assistant general manager from the head office. He came, and he brought the letter with our eleven-points program which we want to have, and he agreed with all of the points. And he said that probably Tuesday I can go to Delhi and collect the fixed deposit certificates, and they will be endorsed on the New Delhi branch. And he said that after ten days... Within ten days there will be a new manager for the extension counter, and we'll never have to deal with Mr. Gupta again. So many different small points, he instructed the people to comply. And he's going to have the whole extension counter refurnished with carpets and nice chairs and sofas, so that there's a nice atmosphere. So, I mean, I think from now on everything should be very straightforward.

Prabhupāda: So things are satisfactory now?

Girirāja: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Also another thing, that four thousand, er, four lakhs has reached Bombay?

Girirāja: Well, I sent a photocopy of that advice which they gave us here to the CBI, and I told them that they should be sure to get the money from Punjab Bank and put it in our account, BBT. But I didn't get any confirmation, because usually they give the advice to Bombay.

Room Conversation -- October 15, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Mr. Dugal...?

Girirāja: Mr. Dugal?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Girirāja: Well, he was a little bit upset that we were taking away all the fixed deposits. So the man from the head office told him that he has to win our confidence. Then, when he wins our confidence, we may make new fixed deposit. But right now... I mean, whatever we say, he has to accept.

Prabhupāda: So how much transferred?

Girirāja: Ten lakhs, sixty thousand.

Prabhupāda: To?

Girirāja: To the Parliament Street Main Branch in New Delhi.

Prabhupāda: And before that, four lakhs?

Girirāja: Yes, four lakhs to Central Bank in Bombay.

Prabhupāda: So Dugal is very unhappy, eh?

Girirāja: Well, I mean he feels that he's losing everything. But the man from the head office tried to explain that, you know, "This is the reaction to your activities," and that "If you change your activities in the future, we may bring in more money." Actually we're going to expand and develop our activities more and more. So if they win our confidence, we don't mind giving them any amount of money.

Room Conversation -- October 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The mosquitoes, they are warning.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Don't worry. They won't get you while we're near. The mass... The professional massage man, he massages with oil, and we are massaging with love.

Prabhupāda: That oil creates some ant.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. The ants are attracted by its sweetness. But we are only hoping to attract you by the sweetness of our massage. No ants will come.

Bhagavān: Your juice is here, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Would you like to sit up? (pause) (break)

Prabhupāda: ...softly and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (break) ...mind, niveśaya, fix up in Kṛṣṇa. This is Rūpa Gosvāmī method. Yena tena prakāreṇa manaḥ kṛṣṇe niveśayet. So you are already attached to Kṛṣṇa. You'll see the picture and enjoy. So you can give this picture to him, his own.

Haṁsadūta: We'll put it in his room. (end)

Room Conversation -- October 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What news?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We're trying to fix a debate in Delhi on October 27th among different scientists and ourselves.

Prabhupāda: 27th October?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: This month, yes, October 27th. It was Indian National Science Academy. There are some very well known scientists, including Kothari, D. S. Kothari and other... They told me there is a group of scientists in Delhi, actually from all over India. It's called "Mind Group." They like to do research on nature of consciousness. And they told me that it would be very good if we have a debate between our group and their group. So I agreed to that. And the Mishra, actually, the one who came last time, he also belongs to that group, and Kothari is the chairman of that group, and there's one Bengali called Lankadas(?) Gupta. He's the secretary. They all belong to that group. So they're going to invite us for a, they call, round-table debate. It will be about twenty people from their side and five from our side. So we're going to have a confrontation. And also Dr. Krana told me that when I come I can fix a television program in Delhi to appear us, and they're going to interview us in the Indian television.

Room Conversation -- October 18, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That round table?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. There will be a round-table conference debate in Delhi. So all five will be there. Brahma-tīrtha, our geologist from Houston, he's going back, he told me, on 28th. So I decided to do on 27th. Also before that... Krishnamurti is the director general of television in New Delhi, and he's a good friend of our Dr. Khorana. Dr. Khorana is our life member in Delhi. So he also came to the conference on the last day. In fact, he brought the head of the All-India Medical Association also. So he told me that any day I come, any day we want, we can fix a date for a television appearance also. And since we are here, I also don't want to go far away from Vṛndāvana at this time. So in this process I'd like to go to Agra and Delhi and also possible Punjab areas, and I'd like to do some program and come back in Vṛndāvana. I don't want to go far away from Vṛndāvana at this stage. And in the process also we'd like to do some engagements. And then in about one or two months we'll work for Bombay. Bombay, I was told that three rooms are provided for the Institute. But we are at least four, and also we need a secretary for typing. So it seems to me that three rooms that are allotted for us will be not sufficient.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Room Conversation -- October 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I think from Śrī Raṅgam temple. I haven't talked with him yet. He left very quickly. Śrīla Prabhupāda? One good news, the fixed deposit receipts have been transferred finally. We got them back now endorsed from the head office, so they are officially now with the Parliament Street office. That was Girirāja's very good work. He said he would do this, I remember, and he did it.

Prabhupāda: What is the amount?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Total amount? Total amount is ten lakhs, sixty thousand. It's now transferred. I have the receipts locked as before. And they're duly endorsed.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're endorsed to the head office, Parliament Street, Delhi.

Prabhupāda: Now what you have got?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The fixed deposit slips. The actual receipts. See, but they've been stamped now. They've been handed over. We handed them over to this office here. We did everything according to letters and everything, and this office here in Vṛndāvana sent them by registered post to the head office. The head office got them, stamped them, and Girirāja went today to Delhi, collected them with Hari-śauri, and then Girirāja went to Bombay and Hari-śauri brought the receipts back. I took them and locked them away. Same receipts, simply stamped now with the head office stamp, entered in their accounts. So now the fixed deposits are officially held. We have them, but I mean to say they are with the Parliament Street Punjab Bank. Not Vṛndāvana branch.

Prabhupāda: So, they have issued any covering letter?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: More or less a covering letter.

Room Conversation -- October 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They were planning, in my... I talked with Girirāja about this. They were thinking "Here is an old sannyāsī, Prabhupāda. He has many foreign disciples, he has money. Let us get the money in fixed deposit. Then if he should pass away, then somehow by trick the money will be kept here and we'll never let them take it out." That was their plan. Therefore whenever Prabhupāda suggested that Gurukṛpā would sign, co-sign, "No, no," they would never allow. Their plan is that Prabhupāda would pass away, and all the foreigners would be there, and they'd never let them take it. When I showed them this power of attorney, they had a great shock. They were shocked how this had happened to them. I think this was their plan. Very deceiving type of people. Because they are here in Vṛndāvana. All their money is from fixed deposits from āśramas. So they know how to do this business of keeping the money. Now everything is clear. The money is there in Delhi. The Delhi office is not like that. They're businesslike. And we can keep dealing them, but on regular accounts. None of these fixed deposits. Not now. They "Now you must gain their confidence again." We told them, "We have nothing against you. But you deal properly, then again we'll deposit. But deal properly in a businesslike way." We have nothing against them. Punjab Bank is a good bank. Anyway, it's settled now, Śrīla Prabhupāda. It's finished. I wanted you to know that it's been successfully completed due to Girirāja's good efforts. Girirāja went to Bombay. His parents went with him.

Prabhupāda: You said this Trivedi is worse than him?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Doctor Visit and Conversation -- October 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You have got any (indistinct). Where is Girirāja?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He went into the city today for picking up the fixed deposit receipts. That was the main thing.

Prabhupāda: City?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Delhi. Because the receipts are being turned over to the head office, so they have to be endorsed there. So he went for that purpose. There's not much more to do now with this Panchashil flat, because we're going to give it. So simply it will be up to Vrindavan to make up the necessary document for transferring it. I think it doesn't even require a big document. Simply a letter on behalf of Your Divine Grace saying that "We give this apartment to you."

Prabhupāda: But one thing, if they can dispose?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, they may try and sell it.

Prabhupāda: No, no, I don't want that.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, but when you give them that, that's what they may do.

Prabhupāda: Then don't give him. Let them live there, but...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So then the question again comes up, which I mentioned to you, that if they're paying corporation taxes and other taxes, then they become the legal tenant, and a tenant does not lose the right of tenancy at his death. His children inherit it.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...tomorrow probably. (indistinct) ...loan... Actually we're not loaning him that money. That money is being given as a gift to him. He was willing to pay it back. I said, no, this is a gift from you to him for improving his business. I said actually it's meant for each of the family members. I told him, "You use it now for improving your business. Then if business increases, you can eventually pay each one of them the money that they should have gotten." He said, "Very nice." And I explained to him what squandering meant. Now it is very clear. I told him that "You can use the money each month that you get. And all of you can use it for three things: for purchasing property, increasing business or buying government stocks." I said, "Prabhupāda's point is that whatever he's given you, it should increase in its value. He wants to see that it increases." And now it's very definite, so... Again I explained to him how there should be no difficulty with this, getting this... He's a little lazy. He's lazy. I could see that when he thought that the money was a donation, I think it came in his mind that "Even if the business deal doesn't go through, I still get the money." He should be encouraged, but his tendency is to be a little lazy. They should not be given money easily, too easily. Otherwise they won't work hard. He's also getting some money, he told me, from a fixed deposit in Calcutta from the BBT which he uses for travel expenses. He says gradually he will be paying some of that money back. He said that's why he sent you sometimes... He recently sent 870 rupees. He says that he's using it for travel expenses, and he may pay it back. I didn't know if you had arranged anything regarding that. You expect him to pay that money back, or not necessarily? It should be.

Prabhupāda: No, I expect.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You mean generally to keep everything in order. Yes, I have a very good hold on it. Some things... You know, because formerly they never kept these things down. Now I'm finding out things. But whenever I get extra information, I note it. Pretty much I have all of the things in order. Just like now I just found out for the first time that he's getting a monthly interest from one of the fixed deposits in the name of BBT. That was never noted. So when I find out the amount, I'll just note it. Then I can deduct it each month from the account that I'm keeping. Like that, sometimes I get new information.

Prabhupāda: So you have to search out.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, but I've actually been doing that. And I've also been checking whenever they give interest that it's exactly the right amount. I make sure each year they credit the interest, keeping watch carefully of the fixed deposits to see when they come matured, like that.

Prabhupāda: Only thing is that M. M. De and Sulaksmana. They should not be given more than twelve...(?) (two hundred...?)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The only thing is about M. M. De? I've just dictated a letter to the Central Bank of India. I'm going to send this letter to Girirāja that...

Prabhupāda: He has become Communist.

Room Conversation -- October 28, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We're giving him no..., 250 now, but 750 is put in fixed deposit for him. The total is a thousand rupees he's getting. He only gets 250. But the other part is put into fixed deposit for seven years. I don't want to change that letter to the bank, because we've given it as a standing order now.

Prabhupāda: He can simply get...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Two-fifty.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's all that any of them get right now. And the rest goes into fixed deposit.

Prabhupāda: And they may remain, lifetime.

Room Conversation -- October 29, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We met. Svarūpa Dāmodara and I spent an hour at Bhagatji's house. Bhagatji brought him. So he's going to do that Trust. He says in three or four days time he can finish it, Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust, with the aims and objects we have given. Then I talked about that squandering amendment. So he explained that the best way to do it is that we amend it to say that they always get 250 rupees for their maintenance, and the other 750 rupees, instead of fixing it in their names, fix it in the name of ISKCON, and ISKCON executors of the will shall see that they give them the money at the time of seven years for the purposes of three: purchasing property, business, and for buying government stocks. And the profits from those, they can do anything they want with. He said don't let them put the 750 rupees in their name, because then they can do anything they want with it, squander it. But if you put the money in fixed deposit in ISKCON's name, then ISKCON can give them the money after seven years, for those three purposes. So if you approve, then he can make an amendment clause, and then you can sign it, and then it can be done. He understood everything very perfectly. He said actually... He understood it perfectly. Actually, because everything belongs to ISKCON, the whole will is more or less a moral, spiritual guidance, because legally everything is already ISKCON's. So I said, "But we want it to be morally and guided spiritually. To us, this is the will. Whatever this will says, we must follow as Prabhupāda's disciples." He said, "Then I can make an amendment, which would be like that, that every month they'll get 250 rupees for their whole lifetime, and the 750 rupees will be put in fixed deposit for seven years in the name of ISKCON, and at the end of that, the ISKCON executors of the will, will give them each the money each month, fifteen hundred rupees, for the purpose of..., in those three ways, and that the money should not be squandered." He said that way, if ISKCON sees that the money is being squandered, then they stop giving them that money and they'll just give 250 rupees. Two hundred fifty rupees they must get. And Radharani De, she may get always one thousand rupees. She is older. Let her have that. Whatever she does is her business with the money. And, I think, it is a very good way. And we'll all make sure that they get the money, but they must use it properly. It's Kṛṣṇa's money.

Prabhupāda: And they'll remain in that house lifetime.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Where is podda? (?)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Your sister. I'm just calling right now. (break) (long pause-Śrīla Prabhupāda is sleeping) ...of the different businesses of Vrindavan? Well, first of all he was getting money for traveling expenses. So I have written a letter to Mr. Bekkar, the manager of the Central Bank of India at Camac Street, informing him that henceforward the interest from the fixed deposits in the name of BBT should be stopped from giving it to Vrinda Book Company, and instead the money should be transferred by mail transfer to the Central Bank of India, Gwalior Tank Road, to BBT account. I gave all the details. That's one letter. Then furthermore, I also addressed a letter to the Punjab National Bank, Brabourn Road, informing them that the Rs. 500 should be stopped from being given to Shrimati Radharani De, because... I didn't mention this, but the reason is that she'll be getting one thousand rupees from Indian Overseas Bank. And I'm sending that letter...

Prabhupāda: Oh... Has Indian Overseas arranged?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Let me explain what I was going to say. The letter to Punjab Bank I have not sent to the bank. Rather, I have sent it to Girirāja and informed him that when the Indian Overseas Bank sends their first transfer of Rs. 1000, then he may send the letter to Punjab Bank regarding Radharani De. In other words, when we first get it confirmed...

Prabhupāda: Why not Punjab National Bank, as they are sending, let them send and ask Overseas five hundred?

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Why not Punjab National Bank, as they are sending, let them send and ask Overseas five hundred?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, because we've already given them a scheme which accounts for everybody. Better to have the whole thing done in a very organized way from one bank, rather than a little here, a little from there. That is simply confusing. Besides that, the... It's just a lot simpler, you know, if we do it this way. That is my opinion, because we've already given a scheme to Indian Overseas. We've put fixed deposits worth a certain amount which bring one thousand rupees interest. So now, if we have to tell them a whole new scheme, then it becomes confusion. It's easier simply to inform the Punjab Bank to discontinue sending the five hundred rupees.

Prabhupāda: And unless they send, Overseas...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, no. I am not sending a letter to Punjab Bank. The letter is being sent to Girirāja with the clear instruction on cover letter, "Only send this letter to Punjab Bank after you have it confirmed that they have begun to dispatch Rs. 1000 per month." The same way we did for Sulakshman De. When we stopped sending it from here and we began sending from Bombay, we only told them to stop when it had begun to be sent from another bank. In other words, she'll get the money first from Indian Overseas before the other payment's stopped.

Prabhupāda: So how she will get?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Rs. 1000 per month.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: What...? The... In the Punjab National Bank, fixed deposits in the name of?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Fixed deposits are in the name of... Five lakhs are in the name of Kṛṣṇa-Balarāma Temple Maintenance account, and five lakhs, sixty thousand in the name of Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust.

Prabhupāda: Oh. So where they will kept?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The interest or the fixed deposits? The fixed deposits are in Delhi, and the interest, for now, for the next few months, I am instructing the bank to continue to transfer to the accounts here in Vṛndāvana that it's always been given to. Then when the Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust account is opened, I will issue a fresh instruction to the Parliament Street bank that the interest money should be transferred to that account in Navadvīpa or wherever we open the account. My idea was simply that since the money is to be spent in Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi, then when we write checks out, etcetera, from that account, it's much easier to encash it rather than having to go to Delhi for encashment.

Prabhupāda: No, why Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi? Whenever needed...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, you said that the purpose of the Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust was for development of Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi. That was your original... At least that's what you initially told us.

Prabhupāda: Mm. Which is better? Which is better?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That it should be just for Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi or general?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, I think it's better for Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, I think it's better for Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi. Because for general, we have ISKCON. For general, we have the... I'll explain, Śrīla Prabhupāda. For general, the GBC has formed the Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Committee. That is more or less... Your original name of it was Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust. So we've formed a Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Committee made up of the following seven people: Jayapatākā Mahārāja, Gopāla Kṛṣṇa Prabhu, Girirāja, myself, Rāmeśvara, and Gurukṛpā Mahārāja and Ātreya Ṛṣi. so these seven meet, and they divide up the money that comes from all the interest of the fixed deposits in India, and they will recommend how that money should be spent. Once a year they will consider at Māyāpur all the different requests from Bhuvaneśvara, from Māyāpur, from Bombay, from Vṛndāvana, everywhere, and they will divide up the interest accordingly. So the Bhaktivedanta Charity Trust could be simply for the Gauḍa-maṇḍala-bhūmi area. That was my idea.

Prabhupāda: Whichever suitable.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Which is suitable.

Room Conversation -- October 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That we shall fix up, what to spend.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity trustees would fix that up?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I don't know if I'm understanding your desires about all of these points.

Prabhupāda: No. My point is that all this interest will go for charity.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "All of the interest" means from all of the different fixed deposits or from these ten lakhs, sixty thousand? Just like we have... I'll give you an example. In Bombay we have that Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust fixed deposits in Bank of America. So those are big amount. So those fixed deposits and other fixed deposits, that money, I was thinking, would be decided by that Māyāpur-Vṛndāvana Trust committee. Because those are all ISKCON men.

Prabhupāda: That's all right.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So use your best intelligence and if he has not given then stop everything, let them have 250 per month per head and live in that house. That's all. This is my final.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Two hundred fifty plus we have to fix seven hundred fifty.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: For seven years.

Prabhupāda: That is after.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Seven years.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is after.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Not now.

Room Conversation -- October 31, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No, that is already invested. I read government paper.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: OK. Those three things.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: OK. Good. When the seven hundred and fifty rupees is put in fixed deposit for them, it's put in their name so it belongs to them and you can just tell the bank...

Prabhupāda: Then let them...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Let them have it.

Prabhupāda: After seven years.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They can have it, even if they...

Prabhupāda: Squander, I don't mind.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All right.

Prabhupāda: Our money is not touched.

Room Conversation -- November 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Śrī Nārāyaṇa: Indian culture, Gītā culture. (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati (BG 4.7). (Hindi) Whenever there are discrepancies in the human society—tadātmānaṁ sṛjāmy aham—at that time He appears. Paritrāṇāya sādhūnāṁ vināśāya ca duṣkṛtām (BG 4.8). This is the program. And when He comes, the time is fixed. So unless one thoroughly studies, they cannot accept. Actually Kṛṣṇa... Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). This system, Bhagavad-gītā, it is yoga, bhakti-yoga. Bhakti-yoga is the topmost.

yoginām api sarveṣāṁ

mad-gatenāntar-ātmanā

śraddhāvān bhajate yo māṁ

sa me yuktatamo mataḥ

(BG 6.47)

There are many yogas. The aim is how to come to the topmost yoga. That is bhakti-yoga. And Kṛṣṇa says to Arjuna, bhakto 'si me. What is that verse? Eh? Evaṁ purātanaḥ yogaḥ.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: He doesn't expect this consciousness in this condition. Therefore he is astonished. Actually, physically—finished, everything. So wherefrom the voice coming and wherefrom intelligence coming? That he is astonished. (Bengali) (break) So fix up this program, kīrtana and whatever little I want to eat, that's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And you'll continue to take the kavirāja's medicines?

Prabhupāda: That I'll go on. What is that? If there is any improvement, welcome. Otherwise there is no question of moving me.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No. (break) There has to be some actual improvement before you should move. Otherwise you are already here in Vṛndāvana, so why move?

Prabhupāda: That is my point.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But if actually you can show signs of improving and recovering, then there is reason to move for health.

Prabhupāda: That is another thing.

Room Conversation -- November 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Girirāja: Then, just after I left... Before that, I spoke to Gopāla Kṛṣṇa, and he was arranging for Mahāṁśa Swami and Mr. Polareddy to meet the President of India to invite him to be the chief guest because Mr. Polareddy of Hyderabad knows the present President. And then, so far as the publicity for the opening, we felt that we should actually fix up the chief guest first, because if some big person like the President comes, that will be an important part of the wording of the invitation and the other publicity.

Prabhupāda: So finishing?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Construction?

Girirāja: Well, the building was not finished. I think that... I mean the inside of the temple and the theater and the restaurant and lobby of the guesthouse and many of the guestrooms will be ready, but the marble work on the domes was very behind schedule. So when I was there only about ten or fifteen percent of the marble on the three big domes was up, and the... Of course, the three domes at the entrance were almost ready. So the three main domes could be finished by the time of the opening, but there will be marble work that has to go on after the opening.

Prabhupāda: It will never be finished. When the date is being fixed?

Girirāja: Well, we fixed it for January lst and begin the ceremonies on December 29th, which is Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī's Disappearance Day. And... The ceremonies begin a few days before the actual installation of the Deities. So those ceremonies, or yajñas, those will begin on Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta's Disappearance Day, which is December 29th, in about six or seven weeks. And then, a few days later, on January lst, which is the English New Year's Day and Sunday, that will be the actual installation ceremony, and thousands of people will be coming. And we also discussed that there should be very opulent prasādam distribution, and different arrangements for receiving the people and kīrtana and darśana and festival activities.

Prabhupāda: Still work is going on.

Room Conversation -- November 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Brāhmaṇas?

Girirāja: Well, before Yaśodānandana Swami left, he had written the brāhmaṇas that the new date was going to be January lst, and I spoke to Yaśodānandana Swami's assistant, Smara-hari, and he was not sure whether the brāhmaṇas had confirmed this. So he was going to write them today and ask them to confirm that January lst was all right. But he received a letter from Yaśodānandana Swami saying that Yaśodānandana Swami would be coming December 26th. So he's definitely planning to be there in time. And at the time that we postponed the last opening, the brāhmaṇas said that whenever we want to have the opening, they are always ready to come. So it seems that they should be able to come on December 28th or 29th to begin the ceremonies.

Prabhupāda: The brāhmaṇas must be fixed first of all.

Room Conversation -- November 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: This thing? What is that?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Your signatures were fairly good. Some of them were very good. They remarked that the signature was strong... (break) I tried to make it as quick as possible. Now I have the receipts, and I will keep them locked in the almirah just like we did last time. And after about one week we'll be able to get the original documents after they've been registered. In the meantime, on Monday we're going to open up a bank account in the name of Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust in Punjab National Bank, New Delhi. Girirāja, who is the secretary of the Trust, and Bhavānanda Mahārāja, who are the treasurers, will open the account. So the interest from the fixed deposits will go directly into that account. Is that nice? That was your idea. And the bank will be happy that we're keeping the money in their bank. All of your plans are perfect, Śrīla Prabhupāda. And our perfection is simply to carry them out without changing in any way. You have such complete plans that we don't have to do anything new. We have to work our whole lifetime simply to carry out what you've planned. Even then we won't be able to complete everything. We'll have to trust to those who come after us to finish everything. So I'll just finish everything now with them, Śrīla Prabhupāda, and lock everything away, and then I'll come back. I don't want to leave Girirāja alone. It's nice to do everything together, two. I'll come right back afterwards. (break)

Prabhupāda: The Trust deed somebody may read.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. I can bring it just now.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I can read it to you personally.

Prabhupāda: All right. (break) San Diego, we have got a temple.

Room Conversation -- November 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: I cannot.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's difficult. This means you will stop practically getting any nourishment at all now. So then we should call the Calcutta kavirāja. Prabhupāda's not being able to maintain his program. So we'll call the kavirāja from Calcutta, Śrīla Prabhupāda, because now you are not able to keep to the program which he fixed up. And this other kavirāja, he can't do anything this difficult. Usually by this time you've drank about 400 cc's of liquid or more. Today you haven't even drank 100 cc's yet. So in this way you will go back to about two or three weeks ago, when you were planning to depart. So that's a little premature, because we agreed that we will first go through with this program which the kavirāja has given. So now it seems like it's too difficult to do that, so we should call him so that he can...

Prabhupāda: What is the use of calling him?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The use of calling is that he... According to him... This is what I understood. The main problem you're feeling is that you have no strength. This is the sum and substance. There's no strength.

Prabhupāda: So how he can give strength?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How can he give strength? Just like makara-dhvaja is for giving strength.

Prabhupāda: Makara-dhvaja was not giving strength.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Photocopy of?

Girirāja: Of the trust deed forming the Bhaktivedanta Swami Charity Trust. And then I bought a copy of the income tax act, because there's some provision that if funds are used to restore some ancient place of worship or some place of worship which is famous in a particular state, then that is exempt from income tax. So I think that this fits in with the aims and objects of this new trust. So we should be able to get tax exemption for that. I spoke to Bombay to see how things were doing, and Gopāla Kṛṣṇa said that everything is going nice, and he's coming here on Friday, after two days. So I told him that your condition was very serious and that I wanted to stay here for a little longer. So he said that was okay. I confirmed with Yaśodānandana Swami's assistant that he sent the letter to the South Indian brāhmaṇas to confirm that they can come on the dates which we have fixed. So we're waiting to hear that reply. Prabhupāda: You can take some brāhmaṇa from here. Balaram... Girirāja: Yes. Prabhupāda: They'll chant Veda-mantra very nice.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Why they suppose?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, I personally don't feel at this point... Frankly speaking, I don't think that this reply on his part is very good. I don't think it's proper. He's speaking about a settlement. First of all there is no settlement. The whole legal way in which he's worded this letter indicates to me that he's not taking things in a very... Seems to me he has some motives. He has no reason to doubt this scheme. That's my point. And if he's thinking that he has some kind of rights... (break) ...offices. They're very pleased. And they were especially pleased to get these fixed deposits. Immediately we gave them this six lakhs' fixed deposits, they were very happy with this. They've got about something like 350 accounts already from outsiders within a month or two. They're very, very pleased. They feel that this will become a full branch very quickly, and they have a great amount of space, and they're not at all sorry about the price that they're paying. And it's a good income for our temple.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 8, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: No. It is... Plus interest of the money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Plus interest of the... Of which money?

Prabhupāda: The deposit money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Fixed deposit money. Well, of course, but that we would have gotten anywhere. But from the point of view of rent it is certainly very substantial rent. That was your scheme, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: No, Kṛṣṇa is giving us all facility. Utilize it.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I especially like that bank, because when you come in, in the center of the wall, instead of seeing some old grumpy-looking bank president, we see Your Divine Grace's effulgent picture, and it says, right under your picture-it's a very big picture—it says "I.O.B. Welcomes You." It's very nicely done. And in each of the teller's counters, each of the cashier's counters, there's a little picture of Rādhā-Rāsabihārī.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, it's very nicely done. People who go there bank with confidence.

Prabhupāda: And they are getting benefit.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hired or purchased?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, for now just hired, not purchased. Later on we can make a more permanent arrangement, and it can be fixed up as nicely as possible. At the same time while we were meeting, the kavirāja, he also was present. So we inquired from him what he thought about this program, from a medical point of view of course. Spiritually he is in complete agreement. So from a medical point of view, he said that you would not at all be able to withstand this kind of a trip. He said that in a bullock cart, moving around, bumping on the road, you might not be able to live more than a couple of hours. He's here now. He wanted to speak to you.

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Lokanātha?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Lokanātha has already gone, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Haṁsadūta: He has gone to Mathurā for renting.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He has gone out for renting the bullock cart.

Prabhupāda: Oh. (Hindi)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lokanātha says that the bullock cart could probably go around Vṛndāvana in about five to six hours, parikramming Vṛndāvana town.

Prabhupāda: Make an experiment. Then we shall decide.

Room Conversation -- November 10, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So let us make experiment. Don't hesitate.

Pañca-draviḍa: So we can fix up the cart tonight.

Haṁsadūta: Where's the cart? Outside?

Pañca-draviḍa: It's coming.

Lokanātha: It will reach at eleven o'clock here. So I suggest right after maṅgala-ārati we'll go, or we should start.

Prabhupāda: As far as possible, take me in a comfortable position. That's all. As far as possible.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Comfortable position.

Prabhupāda: That...

Pañca-draviḍa: Arrange one bed on the cart. This mattress can go in nice arrangement.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What would you like, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Pass urine.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Okay. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...properly fixed up?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Is it properly fixed up?

Bhavānanda: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hm. All right.

Bhavānanda: Finished, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: About 40 cc's, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: (Bengali) (Bengali conversation continues for some time)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Are you comfortable, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Yes. I want little...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Little?

Prabhupāda: My...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is that "my," Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Jayapatākā: "My" must mean massage.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Massage? Where, Śrīla Prabhupāda? On your leg?

Prabhupāda: On the corner of the waist.

Room Conversation -- November 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How we can give a fixed time? Actually it's better you get a little bit stronger before receiving guests, Śrīla Prabhupāda. If you see him you will be doing a lot of preaching and talking. He's still here in Vṛndāvana, Bon Mahārāja?

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: Yes.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: (Bengali)

Prabhupāda: Time?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What time is good, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Ten o'clock?

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: Tomorrow there is function.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, tomorrow's function. Day after tomorrow?

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: Ha, day after tomorrow.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Tomorrow is no good?

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: Day after tomorrow.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What time is convenient?

Kṛṣṇa dāsa Bābājī: Every time.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: For you, Śrīla Prabhupāda, any time is convenient.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Lokanātha: Yes, and they go, fix the place, and inform your party where they are and what kind of arrangement they have made. And when you are satisfied, you leave that place to join the first group, small group, advance party. Right?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And after Prabhupāda joins that group, then the advance party goes again.

Lokanātha: To the next place, to make further arrangements at the next place.

Prabhupāda: In this way.

Lokanātha: Ye. This kind of program we have done before also. Whenever we had big group traveling, we always send two devotees out, or sometimes four devotees.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: We also did that with our Rādhā-Dāmodara program. That is the way of traveling-advance booking.

Lokanātha: Yes, so the main party does not lose time in finding or looking for the place.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They're not inconvenienced in any way.

Lokanātha: Right. So that advance party could wait at the gate of the...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Wherever. But that's the idea.

Prabhupāda: And when you go in procession, have kīrtana.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think if we fix up vehicles very nicely, that will be nice. Will that be all right, Śrīla Prabhupāda? Is that all right?

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Lokanātha: And most of the holy places are connected with good roads. During our preaching we also visit holy places. When they're on the way, we pass through them. And if we travel not very fast, with good drivers, it won't be much...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Bhakti-caitanya Swami is the fit driver for your vehicles, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Is that all right? I know he would want to come. Is that all right, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He's expert, Bhakti-caitanya Swami. He knows how to arrange everything also.

Jayādvaita: These vehicles can supply electricity so that when you stop...

Prabhupāda: Purchase at least four vehicles.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Four what, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: At least four vehicles.

Room Conversation -- November 13, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhavānanda: It's fixed up, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (long pause) (Hindi—kavirāja attends Prabhupāda) Finished passing urine, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: I never passed.

Bhavānanda: Do you have to now? No. (break) Prabhupāda was saying he is heavy all over his body. Just before all this pain, he was feeling heavy.

Bhakti-caru: (Hindi)

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Indian devotee: Which side? The left side of the body?

Bhavānanda: He said all over.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi)

Bhavānanda: Also he called me. He was feeling very cold, and so many blankets and quilts.

Prabhupāda: Blood pressure is... Blood pressure...

Bhakti-caru: (Hindi)

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Bhakti-caru: He said that there are three things that cause disease: vāyu, pitta, and kapha. And due to weakness, the...

Kavirāja: (Hindi)

Bhakti-caru: Medicines might have caused some cold in the body. Milk also is quite cooling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? Are you feeling a little relief now? Try and take some rest now, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Bhavānanda: The swelling's gone down every day. It's not increasing. Have you noticed?

Kavirāja: (Hindi) (end)

Page Title:	Fixed (Conv. 1977)
Compiler:	Visnu Murti, Mayapur
Created:	23 of Nov, 2011
Totals by Section:	BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=108, Let=0
No. of Quotes:	108