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Extent (Conversations)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Hayagrīva: This no longer...they no longer do this.

Prabhupāda: No, not in that way, but kīrtana goes on in the temple still.

Hayagrīva: Not to such an extent.

Prabhupāda: Sometimes to such an extent. But He was different personality. In His presence, that was a different thing. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu's, I mean to say, Deity, is within the temple. That Deity is worshiped and kīrtana takes place, Bhāgavata...(?)

Hayagrīva: In Jagannātha.

Prabhupāda: In Jagannātha Purī, yes.

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: I wonder if you could explain how it would be impossible, to what extent. I mean whether...

Prabhupāda: The same example as I have already given, that if you want to reside in ocean water, is it possible? If you want to construct a city like New York in the ocean, is it possible?

Reporter: No, but what if they had resided in the ocean or on the ocean for a short period...

Prabhupāda: Anywhere. Any, in the ocean or on the ocean, you cannot build up a city like Los Angeles or New York. That is impossible. So even in your presence, in different atmosphere, you cannot go and live. So similarly, the moon planet is completely different atmosphere. How you can live and go?

Reporter: But, of course, they're not going there to build a city, but they're only going there to take some rock samples, do some experiments, and then leave.

Prabhupāda: That may be possible. Just like you go in the ocean and live for some time and come back, but you cannot make any permanent settlement there. Yes. But that also I am doubtful whether you can land and take some, I mean to say, earth or water from there. That is also very difficult. So far our literature goes, our information goes, it is not possible.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Advaita: Kids broke the window?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Māyā is always striking. Why do you take only a window? Why do you compact māyā in the window? He is without window, within the window. Māyā is not only, I mean to say, limited to a certain extent. The whole world is māyā. Jagan mithyā. The whole universe is māyā. Only that part is not māyā where the chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa is there.

Lord Caitanya Play Told to Tamala Krsna -- August 4, 1969, Los Angeles:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They will pay nice money to hear us?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (reading letter:) "This can be made extensive by your team of followers from America arriving in..." They are greater. So Indian and American combined kīrtana, oh, it will be very nice. Big kīrtana, and every city will receive. And we shall preach that "Here is the common platform for everyone. There is no distinction of nation or religion or anything. Come to the platform." So the Mohammedans also will join. The government will appreciate that here is something secular, real secular; at the same time, God is there. Actually, it is that. All religious people, so-called religious, come here. And religion means this, to love, I mean to say, develop love of God. That is religion.

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: They are sincere, sincerely seeking after. Their material business is finished because they have enjoyed enough of material things. Now there is spiritual inquiry. That is natural. When our material necessities are complete, we enjoy, then next stage is spiritual hankering. And that is explained in the Vedānta-sūtra, athāto brahma jijñāsā. After finishing karma-kāṇḍīya life... Karma-kāṇḍīya life means you do pious activities and enjoy life. That is called karma-kāṇḍīya. So... But the fact is that even you get your birth in a very rich family, you cannot avoid the sufferings of this material nature. Just like yesterday we had an interview with Holkar(?), His Highness Holkar, the old gentleman. So he was a king. He has got very beautiful wife, very beautiful family, very palatial building, but he is not happy, we saw. So the foolish people, they do not know that in this material life there is no happiness. They hanker after these palatial buildings, the motor cars, the bank balance, and so on, so on. Therefore those who have enjoyed all these things but have not become happy, there is another inquiry: "How to become happy?" (break) ...say America, they have enjoyed material life. Their children have enjoyed material life to the fullest extent but they are not happy. Therefore they have come to this spiritual life.

Room Conversation -- December 13, 1970, Indore:

Guest (1): Very correct. To understand Him is a lot.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is liberation. Janma karma me divyam yo janati tattvataḥ (BG 4.9). To understand Kṛṣṇa... Nobody can understand Kṛṣṇa, but still, to such an extent, if one can understand Him, then he immediately becomes liberated. Immediately. And not to speak of developing his love of Kṛṣṇa, simply by knowledge, by real knowledge, if one understands Kṛṣṇa, that is sufficient to make him liberated. And those who are devotees, for them liberation is very insignificant. Muktir mukulitāñjaliḥ sevate 'sman.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prof. Kotovsky: Generally it seems to me that this old varṇāśrama system to some extent practiced the nature of division of labor in ancient society. So now division of labor among people in any society is much more complicated and sophisticated. So it would be very...

Prabhupāda: Not complicated.

Prof. Kotovsky: ...conditionally(?) to group them in four classes because...

Prabhupāda: The, the confusion, confusion has come into existence because in India in later days the son of a brāhmaṇa, without having the brahminical qualification, claimed to be brāhmaṇa, and others, out of superstition or traditional way, they were accepted as brāhmaṇa. Therefore the Indian social order has disrupted. But our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, we are picking up from everywhere brāhmaṇas, everywhere, because the world needs the brain of a brāhmaṇa.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prof. Kotovsky: To some extent you surrender.

Prabhupāda: Yes, to, to the full extent. Just like you...

Prof. Kotovsky: You are required to surrender to the society, for instance, to the whole people.

Prabhupāda: Yes, just... Whole people or the state or the king or the government, whatever you say—this surrender must be there. It may be different.

Prof. Kotovsky: I'm sorry. Only there's a difficulty. We can't agree that you have surrender to government or surrender to a king. There's a principle difference of surrender to a king, to a person, or surrender to a society.

Prabhupāda: No, that is... That is a change of color only. But the surrender is there. The principle of surrender is there. Either you surrender to monarchy, either you surrender to democracy or aristocracy or, what is called, dictatorship, you have to surrender. That's a fact. That's a fact. Without surrendering, our life is... There is no life. That is not possible.

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Mohsin Hassan: My master, what's your opinion on the Ramakrishna Mission? We have a Ramakrishna Mission in Chicago.

Prabhupāda: Ramakrishna Mission, if I say it frankly, they distorted the Bhagavad-gītā to the greatest extent. Because they presented somebody, Ramakrishna, as God. Ramakrishna said that "I am the same Kṛṣṇa, I am the same Rāma," and they accepted it. But one thing is, anybody can say that "I am the same Rāma, I am the same Kṛṣṇa." First of all we have to see the proof. So many, there are many ways of to understand. So Ramakrishna Mission is pushing on this wrong idea. And another thing is that, supposing this Ramakrishna is the same Kṛṣṇa, then the philosophy is different.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London:
Prabhupāda: So another test is, bhaktiḥ pareśānubhava-viraktir anyatra syāt. If one has become lover of God, naturally he will be detached to material enjoyment. Love of God and love of material world cannot go together. Either this or that. Just like Lord Jesus Christ. He never advised to, for economic development, for industrial development, or this and that. So many things. He sacrificed everything for God. That is one test, that "Here is a lover of God." He was punished that "You, you stop this preaching," but he did not. So that is love of God. He sacrificed everything. That is love of God. So the ideal is Lord Jesus Christ, and the follower must be, at least to some extent, to that point. That is test. So we say that you follow any religious path. That doesn't matter. We want to see whether you are lover of God. That is our propaganda. And if one is serious about loving God, it doesn't matter in which way he'll develop that dormant love. It doesn't matter. Just like one, a person wants to be a very nice student of mathematics. It doesn't matter from which university he takes the degree. It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter.
Room Conversation -- August 17, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: They think that they have become liberated, but śāstra says "No, it is not yet liberated." Aviśuddha-buddhayaḥ. Still there is contamination.

Revatīnandana: I see. It was just making my head spin to think of so many fallen souls. If there they also, to some extent they also fall. Here there are so many fallen souls. Then...

Prabhupāda: Ananta. You cannot say how many. Ananta. Anantāya kalpate. Ananta means unlimited number. There is no question of counting.

Śyāmasundara: Our brain is so tiny.

Revatīnandana: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Therefore acintya. Therefore acintya, inconceivable. (pause) Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. Don't try to understand Kṛṣṇa. Simply try to love Him. That is perfection. That's all. You cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. Nobody can understand. Kṛṣṇa Himself cannot understand Himself. Yes. (laughter) He's so acintya. And what to speak of us. Therefore our only business: how to love Kṛṣṇa, how to serve Kṛṣṇa. That's all. That is perfection. You cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. Nobody can. Kṛṣṇa Himself cannot understand.

Conversation with Journalists -- August 18, 1971, London:

Journalist (2):. But what is the extent of your purity?

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Journalist (2): What do you mean by being pure? Does it mean that you have seen Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Yes. I am seeing every moment. And if you want to see, I can show you.

Journalist (2): Please do.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But it is not so easy. It is not so cheap that you want to see immediately, I can show you. You have to become student like him. Then you can see.

Room Conversation -- December 11, 1971, New Delhi:

Vivekananda was actually rascal. He, he had no knowledge. But the Karpatri is actually very learned man. He has studied all the Vedas, great Sanskrit scholar, but still, because he did not worship the lotus feet of the Lord, he is also proving rascal. He is now in politics. He has got a political party, Rama-Rajya Party, and nobody cares for him. He is insulted so many place, but still, but he's so learned, if, if anyone, anybody goes and reads scriptures and Vedas, he can give very good reference and very nicely explain, but the conclusion is dull. Conclusion is dull means again he has come to this philanthropy work. So therefore Bhāgavata says, āruhya kṛcchreṇa: "Although they have undergone great austerities, penances," āruhya kṛcchreṇa paraṁ padam (SB 10.2.32), "realized to some extent the Supreme Absolute Truth," but patanty adhaḥ, "falls down."

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 15, 1972, Madras:

Prabhupāda: Only point is, "Make it zero. And so long you are living, enjoy as you like, because afterwards you are going to be zero. There is no responsibility. So you gratify your senses to the fullest extent." That's all. Just like, I do not know, I have never hanged, but anyone who is going to be hanged, he is offered that "Whatever you want, you can enjoy." Is that...

Śyāmasundara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: ...fact?

Śyāmasundara: Yes.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: Kṛṣṇites.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Our knowledge is perfect. You cannot say... If I say that "Heat is energy of Kṛṣṇa," you cannot defy it. Because it is not your energy. Just like in your body there is some certain extent of heat. Similarly... Heat is somebody's body's energy. And who is that body? That is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, "Yes, it is My energy." So my knowledge is perfect. Therefore I am the greatest scientist. Because I take the version of the greatest scientist, therefore I am greatest scientist. I may be fool personally, but because I take the knowledge from the greatest scientist, I am greatest scientist. I have no difficulty.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa means God.

Bob: Oh, yeah. Are not very, are just slightly God conscious, but still these people are honest to the extent they don't take, they don't take from other people at all and they try to be honest with other people. Will these...

Prabhupāda: But he does not take from other people, but he takes from God.

Bob: So these people are half good?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Bob: These people then are half good?

Prabhupāda: Not half God.

Room Conversation -- March 12, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Kapoor: You have more extensive buildings on it than Dalmia's.

Guru dāsa: What about the adjoining land, it is also available?

Dr. Kapoor: Which one?

Guru dāsa: There is some adjoining land behind...

Dr. Kapoor: Adjoining which...

Guru dāsa: That sixty thousand...

Prabhupāda: Bon Maharaja bought this land very cheap.

Conversation with the GBC -- May 25, 1972, Los Angeles:

Devotee: It's really a difficult problem.

Prabhupāda: Ah, no problem. GBC means now they should tour very extensive. That is the first principle, the GBC. Not sit down (in) one place and pass resolution. No, they must be active. They must act like me. As I am old man, I am traveling all over the world. Now to give me relief, the GBC members... I shall expand into twelve more so that they can exactly work like me. Gradually they will be initiators. At least first initiation. You must make advance. That is my motive. So, in that way I want to divide it in twelve zones. And we have to make more propaganda throughout the whole world. Now if you think that the world is so big, twelve members are insufficient, then you can increase more than that and make the zone similarly divided. It is world affair after all.

Conversation with the GBC -- May 25, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: First point is the GBC member must be extensively traveling.

Devotee: What about my position, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Now, everyone's position will be considered. This is the first thing, extensively traveling.

Devotee: So, the positions of Bali-mardana and Karandhara, they have to remain stationary so much. We have to consider that...

Prabhupāda: No, stationary one thing is that the Bali-mardana, especially Karandhara, he has got already extensive field locally.

Devotee: Yes.

Prabhupāda: He has to manage so many things. So extensively touring means for the mission expanding, that is the point. Simply touring is not required, but doing something substantial to increase the interest of the society. That is the point. So, Karandhara has got many department supervisors(?), so he can be given to work, and sometimes go away (indistinct). So, his position is like that. And similarly Bali-mardana's position is there. He can be also if he has got many engagements, many departments managed there. So he may not tour but our only aim is that one must take multi-responsibilities.

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: That, not only in India. Kṛṣṇa consciousness is not meant for India or America. Of course, I am deputed by my Guru Mahārāja to spread this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement in the Western world. That is his grace. He wanted that Western people, who are intelligent, they should learn what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So my mission is for the Western country, but it is not meant for any particular country, nation. It is meant for every living entity. Now, there are many unfortunate living entities and there are many fortunate living entities. So we are preaching this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement in America or Western country, only the fortunate persons they are coming. But if few of them come and understand, then by their example and behavior, the whole population will be benefited. It is not expected that cent percent population will be able to understand this philosophy of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but by the examples of the few, yad yad ācarati śreṣṭhas lokas tad anuvartate (BG 3.21). Just like you'll find in our temple it is always crowded to the fullest extent.

Interview -- July 20, 1972, Paris:

Prabhupāda: I have already explained what is our mission, what is this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. Already I have explained to some extent and if he wants some particular answer he can ask me.

Devotee: He would like to know who you are, Śrīla Prabhupāda, and how old you are.

Prabhupāda: I am now seventy-seven.

Frenchman: (translated) For how long are you at the head of this movement?

Prabhupāda: For the last five years.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Jayatīrtha: (indistinct) as man progresses, the mark of his progression is his ability to use tools to a greater extent. Like there was the Stone Age. In the Stone Age, they used stones for tools. Then there was the Bronze Age, so they made weapons out of bronze, knives and so on. Then they invented the wheel.

Prabhupāda: Modern age.

Jayatīrtha: So as their science progressed, then they progressed and were able to utilize nature.

Prabhupāda: So what is that progress? The caves are still there, somebody is living here. Then where is the progress? As the caves are still there and somebody is living here and skyscrapers, they are also, similarly, when you (indistinct) the cave (indistinct), there were palaces(?) but we could not see them. Both things are existing, but you studied only one side. Here is your history, see. Kṛṣṇa has sixteen thousand palaces and there was no need of light. Jewels, all jewels. Everything is existing side by side.

Room Conversation with Kenneth Keating, U.S. Ambassador to India -- October 14, 1972, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: This is the right... Another definition is God, God is all-attractive. Now, if you try to understand what is this attractiveness, just like your American country is very opulent, very attractive. If a man is very rich in the society, he is attractive. Then if a man is very strong, then he is attractive. If a man is very famous, he is attractive. If a man-man or woman—if a man is very beautiful, he is attractive. If a man is in the renounced order, he is attractive. If a man is very wise, he is attractive. These six features are attractive features. Now, these attractive features, every one of us have to some extent. Just like you are ambassador, representative of USA, so you are attractive. So this attractiveness you have got. Sometimes I have also got. Somebody comes to me, "Let me see this Swami speak," you see. So this attractiveness everyone possesses. But God means who has got all the attractiveness in full. That is God.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- April 28, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That's all. Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30). Chewing the chewed. One scientist explained to some extent. The matter remained the same. Another rascal comes. He explains again. And the matter remains the same. What advancement you have made? Nothing. Simply some volumes of books. That's all. Just like there is petrol problem. What your this explanation will help? You have created problem. Now you are dependent so much on petrol. If the petrol supply is stopped, then what these rascal scientists can do? They cannot do anything. It is stopped. Now there is scarcity of water in India. What the scientists can do? There is enough water. Why the scientists cannot throw this water where there is scarcity of water? It will require the help of cloud. That is God's manipulation. You cannot do anything. Water is here, so much water. Why don't you make this sand fertile by bringing this water? Fertilization made by supplying water in the desert.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Cutting their children?!

Guest (4): Cutting their own children, killing them and eat them. In some private places in Luton, where I am residing now. The history of Luton has been published by the County Borough of Luton. The non-vegetarian food leaved them to such an extent that they couldn't stay without the meat. And they had to cut their own children. Now we are vegetarian. I have never tasted any meat. I don't know the taste of it. Still. we all exist on vegetables, all sorts of vegetables.

Prabhupāda: The same thing happened in Kanpur in a hotel. One man was eating meat, and he found a little finger...

Guest (4): Finger of some...

Guest (2): That was in the Bombay, in the Villa Parle, in my place, where I was living.

Guest (4): Newspaper (Hindi)

Guest (2): This gentleman went to the hotel and found a small finger.

Prabhupāda: Small children cut up. And there was another case in Calcutta. The, one Chinaman, he was eating human being. And then... (break) ...some Kancawala (?) (beggar) him called, and then captured and killed him. This was going on.

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: You are free to some extent, because you are part and parcel of God. God is completely free. So because you are part and parcel of God, therefore you have got that minute freedom. That minute freedom, when you misuse for other purposes, then you fall down. But if you use that freedom for the service of the Lord... You have got freedom. You may serve the Lord, you may not serve. That is your freedom. But if you serve the Lord, then you become happy. If you do not serve the Lord, then you become unhappy.

Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So we expect every human being, rational... Eastern, western, there is no difference.

David Lawrence: As you see from my plans, really what we hoped to do was to, if there was any cultural difference, to some extent eliminate that cultural difference.

Prabhupāda: Then the first thing is therefore you have to understand that "I am not this body." The cultural difference is on account of this bodily conception of life.

David Lawrence: Yes. Yes.

Prabhupāda: But if we transcend the position of our bodily concept of life, we come to the spiritual platform. So there is no difference.

David Lawrence: The difference is irrelevant then.

Prabhupāda: No. There is no difference. Just like we are talking. You have got a coat. I have no coat. That does not make any difference. We are talking as gentlemen. That's all. The last time when I was in Calcutta I was invited by the Indo-American Cultural Society, and they gave me the subject matter: "East and West." So I talked, "We don't find any such distinction, 'East and West,' when we come to the spiritual platform. This is all material platform."

Room Conversation with Mister Popworth and E. F. Schumacher -- July 26, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: How? That you do not know. You'll have to realize when you give us the chance. But if you give us the chance, there is no loss on your part. But you'll practically see how it is rectified, how it is...

Vicitravīrya: Pollution is to some extent a result of materialistic activity?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Vicitravīrya: The pollution, is it to some extent the result of material activity, which will cease when the spiritual...

Prabhupāda: Yes, there are so many things. What is material activity, what spiritual activity is. These are to be understood. But we are sure, if simply this chance is given, anywhere, let us execute this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement by chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mahā-mantra and speaking something from this Bhagavad-gītā. We are getting practical result. Just like you were describing, that in communist country.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Those who know Sanskrit, they know what is the meaning of Veda. Veda means knowledge. Vetti veda-vid jñāne. Jñāna means knowledge. That means the history of Veda means from the date of creation of this material world. Now find out the date of creation of the material world. Approximately, nobody can give what is the date of. We can, we cannot... Date of Brahmā, he got the, first of all, the Vedic knowledge. Now, one day of Brahmā you cannot calculate. One day of Brahmā. And the... When Brahmā's night is there, there is devastation up to some extent. So again in the daytime of Brahmā, that creation takes place. There are two kinds of devastation. One devastation is at the night of Brahmā and one final devastation is the whole cosmic manifestation finished. So these teeny people, they are after the dates of Vedas, and that is ludicrous, that is...(laughs) Just like there are many microbes, they grow in the evening and die just in the day beginning. So whole night is their span of life. So our life is like that. What history you can write? Therefore, we receive Vedic knowledge from the authorities. And what is the value of these dates?

David Lawrence: (laughs) Indeed.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

David Lawrence: Once again, many thanks for your tremendous cooperation and as I say I hope it won't put you to too much work. Obviously some of these things have already been met. To a certain extent we've done some of the work already, haven't we?

Prabhupāda: Some of our students may read. If it is presented, if it is misrepresented then it is useless to publish.

David Lawrence: I don't want that to happen, you see. This is why I'm so anxious that at every stage it be seen.

Prabhupāda: So you read it and find out.

Room Conversation with British Man -- August 31, 1973, London:

eGuest (1): I have been seeking all my life, and I expect when I was about twenty-two I became a convert from Judaism to the Christian Church. And of recent years, as a result of a very serious illness, a heart attack, I began to get other experiences which took me right away from all this knowledge, but no wisdom. I gathered a lot of knowledge, to the extent that I was, well, I was getting nowhere. I knew all about God, but didn't know what He, who He was. I knew all about Him though. Then I was led to understand a lot of other things which did not come by reading. I couldn't tell you. They just came. Thoughts, from wherever they were, they came. So I am now currently at the stage where I acknowledge that the certainty of this world isn't worth knowing about.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (1): We've got to live here of course. It seems to me almost daily that the next processes in life are the much more interesting and exciting ones. But when I hear you speak of Bhagavad-gītā and so on, I know nothing about these people. So now where do I start?

Prabhupāda: You have to start from Bhagavad-gītā.

Guest (1): That's this one.

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all, we have to understand what is that force which is moving this body. Then we come to the spiritual platform. As you understand, the nature of the soul, that is very elaborately explained in different way, negative, positive way, what is the soul. This morning, every morning I speak on this Bhagavad-gītā, if you find time you can come. At quarter past seven, I'm beginning, for one hour.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Guest (2): I have taken quite a lot of your time, if you'll excuse me.

Prabhupāda: No, my time is for this purpose, provided you kindly take it. But if you don't take it, then of course, that is a different thing. My time is spent for... I have dedicated my life for this purpose. I am touring all over the world giving this knowledge. It is sound logic. If you don't accept, you must give better logic, what you know. Don't think we are going under sentiment. Don't think like that. We have got sound logic.

Guest (2): I won't say that, but I'm not mentally prepared to that extent.

Prabhupāda: That's all right, but if you are not prepared, then you learn how to become prepared. Then the same conclusion comes, that logic, you can give to the animals, but he cannot take it.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, Dr. Suneson -- September 5, 1973, Stockholm:

Professor: Well, well, to some extent it's possible.

Prabhupāda: No, every extent. Anyone, anyone calling... So many philosophy or ism, he has got leader. That you cannot avoid. The Buddhists, they are following Lord Buddha. Christians, they are following Lord Jesus Christ. Mohammedans, they are following Mohammed. Similarly the communists, they are following Lenin, or Max. What is?

Devotees: Marx.

Paramahaṁsa: Karl Marx.

Prabhupāda: Karl Marx.

Professor: But, of course, in Sweden, most people, they don't, they don't follow anybody. So it's... I mean...

Prabhupāda: No, they follow. At least, one follows himself. Is it not? "Don't follow anyone" means he follows himself. He has got a particular philosophy, and he's the leader.

Morning Walk -- December 8, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually Prabhupāda, I read in the Time Magazine that Indira Gandhi, she said to one reporter her birth control program has not become successful because in Kerala there are a lot of Catholics who are opposing this kind of process. In other words the Hindus are approving of it but the Catholics are rejecting it, it looks like, to some extent. She says that because the Catholics in Kerala, they are opposing the birth control program so she has got trouble like that. She is completely atheistic.

Prabhupāda: Unless she become atheist how you can stay in that post? She must be atheist. Or she may not be atheist, but for political reasons she must become atheist. Otherwise she cannot maintain her post. All these politicians, they are simply duplicity. Actually they are something else, but in political post they must show themselves as something else. This is politics.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: You cannot say, "Mr. President, I don't agree with you. Therefore I shall not accept your order." No. You have to. You agree or not agree. That is supremacy. So when we judge the supremacy from material standpoint of view, we find that these things are the symptoms of supremacy. So all these symptoms must be in full extent in God. That is Supreme Person. God is great, God is the supreme controller. How He's supreme controller? So these are the symptoms. Therefore the definition of God given by Parāśara Muni.

aiśvaryasya samagrasya
vīryasya yaśasaḥ śriyāḥ
jñāna-vairāgyayoś caiva
ṣaṇṇam bhāga itiṅgaṇa
(Viṣṇu Purāṇa 6.5.47)

From Bhagavān, the other word is bhāgyavān. Bhāgyavān means fortunate. One who has got the symptoms of supremacy, he's called fortunate. The supreme fortunate is God. Lakṣmī. Lakṣmī-sahasra-śata-sambhrama-sevyamānam (Bs. 5.29). Here we are begging little favour of goddess of fortune, but Kṛṣṇa is always worshiped by many thousands of goddess of fortune. That is Kṛṣṇa's position.

Morning Walk -- December 11, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: There's one Arab leader, he goes to the temple five times a day, he doesn't eat meat, er, doesn't drink liquor or smoke or go out with women...

Prabhupāda: Yes, these are, these are prohibited in Muhammadan villages.

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But still it is good. To some extent, he's advanced.

Karandhara: He doesn't allow any liquor shops or tobacco shops in this country.

Prabhupāda: Yeah, that's good.

Karandhara: Khadafi.

Hṛdayānanda: Which country is it?

Prabhupāda: All these things are sinful.

Morning Walk -- December 15, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: Several years ago you gave a series of lectures in New York on atonement, that are very famous, and devotees, they relish them very much. Prāyaścitta. And this is also in Christian theology to a large extent, plus another concept called feeling very sorry for one's sinful activities.

Prabhupāda: Repentant. Repentant?

Prajāpati: No so much repentance. It is called...

Karandhara: The classic idea is that one goes away and just lives in a state of remorse, solitude and remorse, thinking how sinful and wretched he is, and performing severe austerities.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Karandhara: Going away, living in a monastery, performing severe austerities, and always contemplating how sinful and wretched we are and how we must suffer.

Prabhupāda: Everyone is suffering. But one who knows that he is suffering, he is intelligent. (Aside): Good morning. Everyone is suffering. If you are not suffering, why you have covered? Why you have covered? Because you are suffering, is it not? Why you are not naked body? Because we are suffering, therefore we have covered. It is a fact. And if somebody says, "No, we are not suffering," then he's a madman. So everyone is suffering. One who knows it, he is intelligent man. That's all.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Well, influenced, to a certain extent. But as soon as you say, "prayer to God," they will laugh, "What is this God and prayer?"

Umāpati: Well, some people won't. Some people still have at least a sentimental attachment to God, and they would like to see at least a semblance of prayer in school.

Prabhupāda: Do something practical. "Prayer means to chant the holy name of the Lord. If you have no holy name of the Lord, we are giving you. So you have no expenditure, neither you have any loss. So why don't you try this? Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa." This will be reasonable. Is it not? And if they actually chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, then automatically the prayer and everything will be done.

Room Conversation -- February 6, 1974, Vrndavana:

Guest (1): Court matters, some, some law suits, etc. which I have filed which aggregate to the extent of about crore rupees or so.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Guest (1): Oh, I mean I'll get that much. That could be as good amount as you (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Where? Where? Your claim?

Guest (1): Yes, yes.

Prabhupāda: You have to, you have to pay so much stamping fee.

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: These are very old questions. These are not very intelligent questions. God is not creating. God is giving you chance. The conditioned souls who are not with Kṛṣṇa, they wanted to enjoy this material world. Therefore God is giving them chance. "All right enjoy (indistinct)," and giving instruction also that you enjoy in this way, so that you may come back again. Just like a father. Children wants to play in the (indistinct). "All right, you play." Then, as soon as he asks, "Please come back. (indistinct), they come back. Similarly this material world, we wanted to enjoy, so Kṛṣṇa has given us freedom, "All right enjoy". And now Kṛṣṇa gives instruction that "now you give up all this (indistinct) come back, then you (indistinct)." He created for you. Same example I always give. Just like the government, when there is formation of the city, jail construction is also there. You cannot say that, "Why government is creating, it is unnecessary, it's premature, construction of jail work(?). But the government knows that there are some criminals who has to be put into the jail. Therefore the jail created. So because there are criminals, therefore government creates. Similarly, there are many conditioned souls who, instead of serving Kṛṣṇa, they want to enjoy. "All right, for you, you enjoy to your fullest extent."

Morning Walk -- March 9, 1974, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Adulterated?

Guest (2): Yeah, they say so many things have been added to it. Sometimes some rascals come to criticize to that extent.

Prabhupāda: What is that addition?

Guest (2): Well, when you come to, when you come to ask a specific answer, they say, "If you bring Bhagavad-gītā, we'll show it to you."

Prabhupāda: So bring Bhagavad-gītā. What is the addition?

Guest (2): This was, this was pointed out by quite a few in the train.

Guest (4): No, you can ask them at that time, "Please place one book like that which is adulterated, and it is somehow or another added in it."

Guest (2): But what is their source of knowledge?

Guest (4): They have no, no source of... They like to

Guest (2): Speculate...

Guest (4): They like to convey...

Prabhupāda: They do not know what is Bhagavad-gītā, but they can say it is added and subtracted. They're... But they do not know what is Bhagavad-gītā.

Morning Walk -- March 24, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But that stage you must reach.

Prabhupāda: No, somehow or other, they have gone to some extent. Never mind the mosquito. Let bite. I am not this body."

Dr. Patel: (laughs) You have hypnotized them.

Prabhupāda: No, actually they are doing. Although we see that from bodily point of view they have become weak, but they don't care for it. They... You see. If they had been weak how they are chanting and dancing saṅkīrtana? They are not weak at all. (Hindi) (break) "Now let me dance." Then I shall jump over your head." (Patel laughs) This is philosophy. "Now I am dāsa, then I become your master."

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1974, Bombay:

Mahāṁsa: This is also a siddhi, that they can invent a plane...?

Prabhupāda: Yes. To some extent. By material arrangement... The yogis can do still more. Without any material machine, they can float. They can walk on the water, becomes light. (break) ...man-manā bhava mad-bhakto mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru (BG 18.65). This is the process. (break) ...colleges, the students are being educated that there is no God. And they expect good behavior from them. And when they set fire in the bus, that is... "The students are so dangerous now." But you have made them dangerous. The educational system. They are protesting against the existence of God. (break) ...so-called swamis. And they are also accelerating, "yes, no more. There is no God. Why you are searching God anywhere? There are so many gods loitering in the street. They are God." That is the statement of Vivekananda. "Why you are finding out, trying to find out God elsewhere. These are Gods." (break) ...if required, one may come, very easily, one may take some time. But we should go on preaching.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

C. Hennis: My organization is in fact concerned with the well being of all four classes. It is not only with the laboring man. It's also primarily with the producers, but also with the managers, leaders, and to a certain extent also with the protective classes in that we are interested in the well-being of policemen, hospital personnel, doctors, nurses, that kind of social security workers, and that kind of person. We are interested in the intelligentsia in that they are professional workers, often independent, whose professional rights and obligations need to be safeguarded and codified. That's a standard laid down in the form of international labor standards. One of our activities, not perhaps now the most important, but one of the first.

Prabhupāda: No. My point was, point is that... Because one is fourth-class, therefore we are not interested in that—it is not my point. My point is that there are four classes of men: first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class. And our point of view, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, is meant for taking care of all classes of men. Although by natural division there are four classes of men, first-class, second-class, third-class, fourth-class, but the example we generally give, just like in your body there are four divisions: the head division, the arm division, the belly division and the leg division, but all of them meant for keeping the body fit. And body is meant for giving supply to everyone of them. But if you comparatively make division, the head comes the first division, the arms comes the second division, the belly comes the third division, and the legs comes the fourth division.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: No. Do work intelligently. Not that to be very hard-working like ass, without any intelligence. Just like ass is the most hard-working animal, but it has no intelligence. You see? So we don't want that. We want working with intelligence. That is difference.

C. Hennis: Well, as I said, to that extent we do try to improve a man's understanding, a man's understanding of the world, and I agree it's the developed world, the industrialized world, and the...

Prabhupāda: But if he has no brain, if he is not guided by the brain, or if he has no brain, so what is the understanding? Understanding is "I have got money. Now let me drink," that's all. There must be...

C. Hennis: First of all, you can't force a man to be governed by his brain either. You can't force a man to use his brains.

Prabhupāda: Therefore brain is... The United Nation, how the world society should keep a class of men who act as brain and guide everyone so that everyone becomes happy.

Room Conversation with Mr. C. Hennis of the International Labor Organization of the U.N. -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Let them understand. At least, let them understand what they should do, what they should not do. This much...

C. Hennis: This we do try to do to the extent that it is possible for the secretariat to shape and evolve a philosophy. We do try to do it. But of course we can't adopt a completely radical approach. We do what we can in the manner of a good servant and the manner of a good steward to try and help the leaders along the right path and right direction. Your Divine Grace, I thank you very much indeed for this audience. It's been very kind of you.

Prabhupāda: I may be a madman. I have talked so many things and you say all right.

C. Hennis: It's been very splendid, and I thank you very much indeed for giving me...

Prabhupāda: (laughing) But I am very much, I mean, strict on this point, that if the society does not know what is sinful and what is pious, it is all useless.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1974, Geneva:

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: The Bhagavad-gītā says that the world is made up of eight energies: earth, air, water, fire, ether...

Prabhupāda: No, no. That Bhagavad-gītā says. I am talking you, you are scientist. Wherefrom the watermelon water comes, and they are grown in the desert?

Karandhara: Well, they say the watermelon has an extensive root system which extracts the water from the...

Prabhupāda: So that means there is water.

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So how you can say there is no water in the moon planet?

Karandhara: Well, they can take samples in the desert and find out if there is certain degree of moisture in the soil. They have taken the same samples on the moon and say that there is no moisture.

Prabhupāda: So why the moon planet is bereft of? Material, anything material, it is combination of earth, water, fire, air, ether. Anything material. It is a combination.

Room Conversation with Christian Priest -- June 9, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa is God. Kṛṣṇa is God. God is the idea of greatness. That is Brahman. Or you can say also person, but not the particular person. God means, the Sanskrit word is īśvara, the controller. So everyone is controller to some extent. In his own atmosphere he is a controller, as I am controller of my disciples. So the conception of God is there, but I am not the Supreme God. Therefore, there are two words. We use the word "Godhead," "the Supreme God." That is explained in the Brahma-saṁhitā, īśvara, God. Everyone is God; that is another thing. But īśvaraḥ paramaḥ, the Supreme God, is Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: They have been cheated by some cheaters that this practice, gymnastic practice, is yoga. That's all. They do not know what is yoga. Yoga-indriya-saṁyama. Even... All yoga systems, Patañjali's system. So indriya... Where is indriya-saṁyama? They are gratifying their senses to the fullest extent. And what is their yoga? That is described... You do not read the Sixth Chapter of Bhagavad-gītā. Why don't you explain them that, that "You are yogi... You not yogi. You only making some farce. Where is your yogi? Are you going to a solitary place? Are you practicing alone, sitting on your seat like as they are described, and looking on the point of the nose? Are you doing that? You are not yogi. You are simply a caricature. You are not yogi." Don't accept them as yogis. If one is yogi... That, that, that gentleman, that yogi came there. He appreciated very much.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Thank you. (some guests leave) So now we have come to Germany. You cooperate and make it a great success for the general benefit of the whole humanity. We have got arts, music, literature, culture, food, everything.

Prof. Pater Porsch: I think it will also help to quite a considerable extent for the removing of prejudices and for a better understanding of...

Prabhupāda: No, this is the only platform where all people, all religion, all culture, can unite. This is the only place, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. We practically see how they are becoming successful. In Africa also, within the villages they are responding. (break) ...distinction.

Devotee: (showing Śrīla Prabhupāda's books) This is Spanish, Chinese.

Prof. Pater Porsch: (indistinct) Chinese.

Prabhupāda: Japanese also. And Hindi.

Room Conversation with Scientists -- July 2, 1974, Melbourne:

Dr. Harrap: Your knowledge of Sanskrit, this is one of your basic interests.

Prabhupāda: No, not Sanskrit, but knowledge we have received by disciplic succession from my Guru Mahārāja, from my spiritual master. Sanskrit is the language but mostly we derive knowledge from Vedic revealed scriptures. And this is also one of them, Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. This is the ripened fruit of Vedic knowledge.

Dr. Harrap: And you're interpreting this in terms of modern day living to a large extent in some of your writings, and, of course, some of your disciples writings, as in this book.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Guest (2): Could I borrow this for a moment? Thanks.

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā, yes.

Room Conversations -- September 11, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: To the qualified physician, not to the storekeeper. Similarly, first thing is, when you want to solve the problem, you must go to the right person. First of all you have to select. So we understand that Kṛṣṇa is the right person. So therefore, it is guaranteed. He knows everything. Others, they do not know. May know to some extent, not perfect. The first thing is that we have to select from whom. Tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In Vedas it is stated in order to solve the problem or to understand the situation, you should go to the guru. So who can be better than Kṛṣṇa as guru? He taught, He gave lessons to Brahmā, the original living creature in this universe. Tene brahma hṛdā. He gave lessons to Brahmā how to create.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, other Guests and Disciples -- February 12, 1975, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Varṇa-saṅkara. There is no varṇāśrama; therefore all the children, they are varṇa-saṅkara. And as soon as there is varṇa-saṅkara population, the world becomes hell. Therefore we are trying to check—"No illicit sex"—to stop this varṇa-saṅkara. Now the varṇa-saṅkara has come to such an extent that they are killing child, and that is legal. They have come down to such a extreme position.

Guest (4): But surely there is a practical point of view also. There is nothing to eat. What will happen?

Prabhupāda: Who says nothing to eat? That is also their manufacture.

Guest (4): I mean the figures which are published that half of humanity will starve.

Prabhupāda: It's... Especially, we are Indian. It is advertised that we are poverty-stricken. All over the world this is advertised. Wherever I go, they say, "Oh, you are coming from India?" (laughter) Because they are simply begging, the government. But who is dying? There is... Dying is going on, but that death is going on in other countries also. They are dying, committing suicide.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:
Prabhupāda: So has he understood himself?

Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He said that to a certain extent he feels he has achieved this, but that the reality is unlimited, it cannot be described and that it's more a certain consciousness or appreciation of life that is beyond words. Prabhupāda: Not clear understanding. Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He said that they try to have a clear understanding, but he must confess that he is limited. Prabhupāda: He is limited. Then what is unlimited? Guest (Hṛdayānanda): He says that the unlimited is that which always was, is and always will be, and the limited is that which is in this material phenomenal world. Prabhupāda: That means that limited is material, he says? And unlimited is spiritual? Guest: i, pero... (Spanish) Prabhupāda: So what is the conception of the spiritual? Guest (Hṛdayānanda): That which is, has been and will be and which is not limited to form. Prabhupāda: Yes. Limited to form.

Room Conversation with Psychiatrist -- February 22, 1975, Caracas:

Psychiatrist (Hṛdayānanda): He says that nowadays psychiatry is not so much concerned just with crazy people, but it's just concerned with the human problems.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is very good. So what is the human problem in their understanding?

Psychiatrist (Hṛdayānanda): To some extent they see that when there's something wrong with the physical body, it causes a manifestation of a mental disease.

Prabhupāda: When there is something wrong in the physical body, there is mental disease. That we accept also. But that mental disease is there basically, that he is thinking that he is body.

Psychiatrist (Hṛdayānanda): He says that he was speaking about an organic... For example, if someone has a tumor in their brain, it causes irritability, anxiety, suffering and so many things. They are seeing more, there's some physical defect.

Prabhupāda: The physical defect... Just like a driver of the car, and when his car is damaged, the driver becomes very sorry that "My car is now broken, damaged," but is the driver the carriage? Sometimes a valuable car is damaged and the proprietor or the driver, he becomes very sorry, almost half-dead, "Oh, my car is lost." So this is due to his too much attraction for the car. When the machine car stops (it) does not mean the driver is damaged. But he thinks, "Now, I am finished. My car is damaged." But although he is not the car, he thinks that he is damaged. So that is mental disease.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:
Prabhupāda: Then you will understand. Upadekṣyanti tad jñānaṁ jñāninaḥ tattva-darśinaḥ. Tattva-darśi, one who has seen the truth, he can enlighten you. This is the process. Otherwise, even Gandhi, Dr. Rādhākrishnan, Vivekānanda, all they have committed mistake. Aurobindo. Aurobindo has understood little to some extent, but not fully. But if we are fortunate enough, then we can understand Kṛṣṇa very easily. What is that? Kṛṣṇa says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya (BG 7.7). "My dear Dhanañjaya, Arjuna, there is no more superior truth than Me." So if we accept that, either you say blindly or conscientiously, then that is perfection. Kṛṣṇa says, bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate: (BG 7.19) "After many, many births of philosophical speculation, when one actually becomes wise, jñānī, jñānavān, full of knowledge, then the result is māṁ prapadyate: he surrenders unto Me." Why surrender? Now, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19)—he understands that Kṛṣṇa is everything. Sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ: "Such mahātmā is very rare." That I was... we were discussing that there are so many religious system in the world, but hardly they have got any clear conception of God.
Morning Walk -- April 19, 1975, Vrndavana:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Prabhupāda, you say that Kṛṣṇa is pūrṇam, the complete whole. So in the material world, if something is very great, even though we may not like it, like people may not like the United States, but still, they have to admit that it is a very great country in comparison to theirs. So in the material world, things which are great, at least we have to admit that to some extent they are great. But Kṛṣṇa is everything. So how is it that people are saying that He's so tiny that He may even be an ordinary man? How can they be so illusioned to think like that? Kṛṣṇa is everything. How can they ignore Him?

Prabhupāda: Illusioned because you do not know what Kṛṣṇa says. That is your fault. Kṛṣṇa says, "You do this," but you do not do that. Kṛṣṇa says, man-manā bhava mad-bhaktaḥ. Who is doing that? Just take a census, who is thinking of Kṛṣṇa. Hardly you will find one in million. So who is carrying out the order of Kṛṣṇa? Nobody is doing.

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So therefore this varṇāśrama college is very essential.

Governor: Both intensive and extensive training.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Proper training. It may be extensive and intensive... Doesn't matter.

Governor: You said 5 percent and 95 percent.

Prabhupāda: Ninety-five percent may remain non-brāhmaṇa. But this 5 percent, if they are strongly brahminical, then others will follow. Ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca tārāḥ-sahasraśaḥ. You have got millions of stars. Nobody cares for them. But people are looking after "When the moon will rise? When the moon will rise?" That one moon is sufficient than millions of stars. So this is the suggestion.

Morning Walk -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Madhudviṣa: 1885, and at that time it was the only house in the whole area for miles around. And it was built by one judge called Moritt(?), Judge Moritt(?). And it was the only house in... They called it "Moritt's folly," "Moritt's folly," because it was built on the sand, and no one thought it could stand for so long. It was built... Because this whole area here was sand, it was all beach, and it was the only house there, and he had stables and very extensive holdings there.

Prabhupāda: Judge, he was judge.

Madhudviṣa: He was a judge, yes. He went to great extent to build the house. It was during this boom area when...

Prabhupāda: Englishmen were coming.

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Actually, that plan to have a tour is a very good plan if it can be arranged. Because if they get convinced here by seeing this, then, when they go there, they'll speak so highly to so many people.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think that they think that we're bluffing to some extent, but when they come here, they see actually it's not just the pictures that we are showing, but there's something substantial behind the picture.

Morning Walk -- July 1, 1975, Denver:

Prabhupāda: So what do you think? Shall I write? Hm? I have made a draft of letter this night. So you come and see. Let us take a chance. We want actually good for everyone. And this is the only medicine, Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. For any problem. Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī. People are suffering. If her guru has opined like that, then she may take some attention. Then it appears that guru is to some extent nice.

Brahmānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: She gave interview to our men.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I saw her twice.

Prabhupāda: Oh, you saw? How did (s)he talk with you?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: She was very respectful. And she wished our movement well.

Prabhupāda: Ācchā?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: She said that she had difficulty to take an active part, because then she would have to take an active part in all such movements.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. That's it. That is the difficulty. She said frankly.

Morning Walk -- July 1, 1975, Denver:

Satsvarūpa: And yet he composed the Brahma-saṁhitā.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he is devotee, not to the topmost extent.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes we hear that Lord Brahmā incarnated as Ṭhākura Haridāsa.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Satsvarūpa: Sometimes devotees say, "Then how come he's the head of our sampradāya if he's not a pure devotee?"

Prabhupāda: It doesn't require. He is a devotee. That's all right. There are grades of devotee, but on the whole, a devotee is very exalted person. Just like gopīs. Nobody can be compared with the gopīs. There are so many grades of devotees, but they are ultimate. And amongst the gopīs, Rādhārāṇī. So there is no comparison, no more... Even Kṛṣṇa is defeated there. Kṛṣṇa became Caitanya Mahāprabhu to understand the devotion of Rādhārāṇī. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu.

Morning Walk -- July 1, 1975, Denver:

Brahmānanda: He's asking about is there any benefit to the karmīs that he deals with because he engages in business activity with them? Do the karmīs get benefit?

Prabhupāda: Yes. To some extent they are helping Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.

Yadubara: They also have this program in Pittsburg, the same thing. They come to the temple and manufacture jewelry.

Prabhupāda: Svakarmaṇā tam abhyarcya. It is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā. You can see there. Everyone can work, but the result of the work should go to Kṛṣṇa. (break)

Devotee (1): ...lakṣmī from them so we can engage them more in Kṛṣṇa's service.

Prabhupāda: Provided you engage them for Kṛṣṇa's service. Otherwise the lakṣmī will kill you. Just like Sītā, Sītā is Lakṣmī. When Sītā was taken by Rāvaṇa, the result was the whole family was killed because they did not use Sītā for Rāma's service. (break) ...householders can be engaged, not anyone else.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Guest (Indian man): How do you advise Indians who are here and who have fallen to some extent in the materialistic world? They did not leave... Basically, they left their homes, most of them, to educate themselves. When they came here, they educated themselves, and they don't want to go back. Basically, they have fallen into the materialistic world. What advice you render them so that they get out of these clutches and go back and serve here or in the country but they should be devotional to the Almighty God?

Prabhupāda: So there is no question of here and there. You can become advanced in spiritual life anywhere if you follow the principles. That we are teaching. We are opening centers all over the world. You take the advantage of our teaching, our books, our center. Then it will be all right. They are following, these Europeans and American boys. They are young boys. They are giving up meat-eating. Do you give up meat-eating? Why Indians, you should learn meat-eating? They are giving up, and you are learning to eat meat. This is the lesson, that these foreigners, they were accustomed to eat meat from the childhood, they are giving up, and you are eating meat. This is the instruction.

Morning Walk -- July 8, 1975, Chicago:

Sudāmā: And they even indicate, Prabhupāda, on the advertisements that smoking is hazardous for the health.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...for money, the money which will push them to hell. This is their intelligence. We have to give them intelligence, open their eyes. (break) ...angry first of all because mūrkhāyo 'padeśo hi prakopāya na śāntaye: "If you give good intelligence to the fools and rascals, they will be angry." But still, you have to do it. Just like when Nityānanda Prabhu went to Jagāi-Mādhāi to deliver them, they became angry and injured. So that is preacher. These rascals will be angry, will sometimes do harm to you, and still, you have to do it. That is preaching. Are you understanding what is preaching? Yes. You have to prepare like that. At all risk you have to preach. (break) ...world is full of rascals, and you have to educate them. So according to one's capacity let them preach, prāṇair arthair dhiyā vācā. But everyone can preach to some extent. There is no hindrance.

Morning Walk -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Otherwise, what is the reason? They know there are so many troubles. To avoid the troubles, "Kill this." That's all. So to save trouble, people are prepared to kill child even.

Brahmānanda: And that's considered advancement, in modern life, to remove trouble. The whole life is conveniences, remove trouble. That shows they will go to any extent.

Prabhupāda: So trouble that is, atyantika-duḥkha-nivṛtti, how to mitigate or finish all trouble, that they do not know. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma (BG 4.9). So long you will get this body, you will have trouble. But that they do not know, how to stop getting another body. So trouble is not mitigated in that way. You increase your entanglement, become sinful. You again take another body to suffer this sinful reaction. (end)

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1975, Philadelphia:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But science finds out these laws and so many things. So to some extent it's working.

Prabhupāda: No, they can extend... Just like inductive knowledge is like this: you study man. You see, first man dies, second man dies, third man dies. In this way, you can go to hundred or thousand man. But I can say that "You might not have seen that man who does not die." I can challenge that. You cannot say... Simply by studying hundred thousand man, you cannot say that all men die. I can challenge that "You have not seen the..., beyond that. So how you can conclude like that?" There may be somebody. As you say, "May be," we can say, "may be somebody who does not die." (laughter) What is the answer?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That argument is different though from the way the science does. For example, they work so hard...

Prabhupāda: The science does... They conclude something, and next man changes. So that is your science. So how you can make a conclusion?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But how so many things are working under the laws...?

Prabhupāda: Working, that's all right. You have seen that so many people are dying. That's all right. But I am challenging that you have not seen the next man who does not die. That you cannot answer.

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: Certain extent, that's all. It is not conclusion.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But to a devotee, though, there is nothing like inductive knowledge because knowledge gives by Kṛṣṇa. So it must be deductive.

Prabhupāda: Deductive always. And that is easier. Kṛṣṇa says that "I come as death and take away everything." So we know that nobody can be immortal; everyone must die. Simple conclusion.

Brahmānanda: We don't have to test it because Kṛṣṇa says it.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You take that...

Ravīndra-svarūpa: We could never know ourselves unless we knew all cases.

Prabhupāda: No, we do not require to know. We hear from Kṛṣṇa, the Supreme Person.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Jayatīrtha: ...they're both doing extensive articles for different magazines on Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And they've already done a lot of preliminary study from what I understand. So they have a few questions to ask. I think they'll write very respectful articles. So this is the girl that interviewed you at the airport.

Ravīndra-svarūpa: Mrs. Anne Jones(?), she's with the Philadelphia Inquirer.

Jayatīrtha: And this girl's name is...

Ravīndra-svarūpa: Sandy Nixon.

Jayatīrtha: Sandy Nixon.

Prabhupāda: She is a devotee, she was chanting.

Morning Walk -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: The same logic, "Cheerfully be hanged." That's all. As soon as there is some difficult subject, they give up. And they speculate on some nonsense thing. That's all. This is their education. Education means atyantika-duḥkha-nivṛtti, the ultimate solution of all unhappiness. That is education, not that after coming to some extent, "No, you can die happily." And what is duhkha, unhappiness? That is presented by Kṛṣṇa: janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi duḥkha-doṣānu... (BG 13.9). These are your unhappiness. Try to solve it. And that they are carefully avoiding. They cannot stop death, neither birth, nor old age, nor disease. And during the short period of life, birth and death, they are making big, big buildings, and next time he is becoming one rat within the buildings. (laughter) Nature. You cannot avoid the nature's law. As you cannot avoid death, similarly, nature will give you another body. Become a tree in this university. Stand up for five thousand years. You wanted to be naked. Now nobody will object. You stand here naked.

Morning Walk -- September 18, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Of Indian. Indology.

Brahmānanda: Yes. And his reviews are published extensively in various journals. So they are going to try to get this review published also. (break)

Prabhupāda: Charity box daily counted?

Dhanañjaya: Yes. Daily counted.

Prabhupāda: So how much it is?

Dhanañjaya: Pūrṇa-candra, how much was collected?

Pūrṇa-candra: 120 rupees.

Prabhupāda: So you write separately.

Pūrṇa-candra: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Morning Walk -- October 9, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: Do you follow these restrictions?

Indian man: Well, up to a certain extent I do.

Prabhupāda: What is that extent?

Indian man: Well, I don't eat meat, I don't gamble, I don't take any kind of intoxicants, but I drink tea, you know.

Prabhupāda: So that divine life is generally for all the Hindus. That is custom. They may learn here something else, but generally, Hindus, they do not take meat. So, anything else? No. Simply this restriction.

Room Conversation with Professor Olivier -- October 10, 1975, Durban:

Prof. Olivier: And especially the youth at university, as I have always indicated and I tell them every year that they’ve got to experiment with the spirit to the same extent that they experiment in their laboratories with pieces of animal tissues or grass or what it is that they’ve got to analyze. But the real tragedy is that we have wandered away so far from the spirit and from the spiritual laboratory...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Prof. Olivier: ...that we don’t know where to start. I was telling them the other day that when the Americans sent their first man to the moon, they had a laboratory of about four thousand men at the controls. The one was doing this and the other one was doing that, but this was a huge human laboratory. That is only while they experiment, and then by that... (break)

Prabhupāda: He is my student. He practices like him.

Room Conversation with Professor Olivier -- October 10, 1975, Durban:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Even the young girls who join our movement, they cover their heads. And the Hindu ladies are so impressed that they practice such chastity, even to the extent always covering their head as a sign of chastity. They very much appreciate.

Prof. Olivier: Perhaps I can give you one or a couple of application forms that you could post to one or two people if they’re interested to apply. But this would be...

Prabhupāda: The Hindu community, I think they will accept us. I don’t think they will deny.

Prof. Olivier: But this would be a wonderful opportunity to bring the essence of Hinduism because from what I gather here from what you have said, this is not only the essence of religion from here but it is also the essence of Hinduism.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The essence of Hinduism is Bhagavad-gītā As It Is.

Morning Walk -- October 12, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: So therefore we are doing like that. We are concerned that "I have got this body. Let me enjoy to the fullest extent and don't mind what I am going to have in future. It doesn't matter."

Indian man (3): You get attracted by a lot of side attractions.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And the education is so defective that even university students, if I say that "You are going to be a dog," they say, "What is the harm if I become?" They say like that. The education is so defective, they don't mind to become a dog. They think, "It is a facility to become a dog because I can have sex on the street without any restrictions."

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Now, no "but." First of all, they have got medicine for making money, but have they stopped disease?

Indian man: To some extent.

Prabhupāda: "To some extent," that is another bluff. That is another bluff. "To future," "some extent." Why some extent? Stop it.

Indian man: There were many people dying in Africa.

Prabhupāda: Everyone is dying. How you will live?

Indian man: Malaria...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Will you live forever?

Indian man: No, sir.

Prabhupāda: Then why do you speak that many are living? You cannot live. That is nature's law. You must die-today or tomorrow. It doesn't matter.

Morning Walk -- November 18, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya.

Dr. Patel: But you must be benevolent to these people, at least to an extent, to the scientists, that all scientists are wrong, are they? All scientists are not gadhas. Some of them are good (Hindi) and some of them evolve into man even.

Prabhupāda: But we say... If somebody says that "I have got my own way to understand," he is not scientist.

Dr. Patel: Their own way, a section of humanity's way. Not one man's. Science...

Prabhupāda: There cannot be many ways.

Morning Walk -- November 21, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: They say, sir, that the Aryan civilization, cradle of Aryan civilization near the North Pole, is somewhere in Russia. From there they started transmigrating. People went to Europe, from there to America, then south down to Iran, and then to India and all that. When they have such extreme cold they were able to civilize themselves to that extent.

Prabhupāda: Hm? We don't say.

Dr. Patel: The Eskimos are not able to do it.

Prabhupāda: No. Civilization means they must live in a nice place like India. That is civilization. The America in those days, they were neglecting. Nobody was living there. Gradually they advanced. Otherwise these tracts of land were rejected.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: It is correct to some extent but... Just like you can see to some extent, but that does not mean you can see everything. You have got limited potency. This is called unlimited and limited. We are limited.

Harikeśa: Actually I think it makes much more sense, because when the scientists say that the earth spins around this way very quickly, then his point is valid. Why we don't fall off or why we don't feel good?

Prabhupāda: It is not quickly. It is only...

Harikeśa: But when the Bhāgavata says the whole thing moves, then there is no friction.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: With the help of the telescope, then their eyes become perfect to an extent.

Prabhupāda: To ext... That is not perfect. As soon as you say, "to extent," that means imperfect. Perfect to the point, that is perfect.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Limitedly perfect.

Prabhupāda: That is not perfect.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Your philosophy will be very unpopular with the general masses, Prabhupāda, because you are condemning everyone.

Prabhupāda: Yes, because they are fools and rascals.

Morning Walk -- March 2, 1976, Mayapur:

Hṛdayānanda: There is a... There is a problem to some extent, but I don't think it should be exaggerated.

Prabhupāda: Hm.

Hṛdayānanda: ...that you should be disturbed. It's not that everything is collapsing like that.

Prabhupāda: No, no, they should be engaged in some...

Devotee: How can you say the situation...?

Prabhupāda: ...cottage industry. Cottage industry.

Hṛdayānanda: Yes.

Prabhupāda: And we can manufacture so many things.

Hṛdayānanda:: Yes.

Morning Walk -- March 10, 1976, Mayapur:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: For example, there is, as we have been discussing, there is between the brahmacārīs and the gṛhasthas... The brahmacārīs have this tendency—at least, this is the attitude—towards renunciation. And so far we can see, a brahmacārī who gives up his brahmacārī life means he's more inclined towards the enjoying spirit, at least to some extent. So how do we deal with this situation?

Prabhupāda: You can... If you want to enjoy, who can stop you?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But we cannot..., we cannot support it. We cannot support his enjoyment. That he should take on his own self to do.

Prabhupāda: They... According to different position and attitude, the four āśramas are there: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. This means that everyone is not on the equal platform. Different platform. But the whole idea is how to give up the propensity of enjoyment. That is wanted.

Morning Walk -- March 26, 1976, Delhi:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Sometimes the question is raised that Lord Caitanya predicted the holy name will be preached in every town and village throughout the world, so to what extent will it be preached?

Prabhupāda: That will depend on the preacher.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: In other words, will there be preaching centers in every town and village, or will it just be a question of traveling through and preaching to the people and ticking off that we've been there?

Prabhupāda: No.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: I don't think so.

Prabhupāda: Traveling is essential. If possible there may be centers.

Morning Walk -- April 15, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That. Then there is perfection, if you take Kṛṣṇa prasādam. Prasāde sarva-duḥkhānāṁ hānir asyopajāyate. So this vegetarianism is no good position.

Dr. Patel: No, no, the Jains have, I mean, pushed the vegetarians to a very, I mean, to an extent which is...

Prabhupāda: No, no. What is the benefit? The benefit? The goats are vegetarian. Eh? There are so many animals. They are vegetarian. The monkeys are vegetarian.

Dr. Patel: They are perfect vegetarian. Perfect.

Prabhupāda: And they live in the forest.

Room Conversation -- May 2, 1976, Fiji:

Guru-kṛpā: So what is the exact meaning of that verse, śraddhā-śabde. That verse...

Prabhupāda: Yes, śraddhā. That faith increase, and when it is increased so much that he fully understands, "By worshiping Kṛṣṇa, everything is done," that is first-class faith. Śraddhā-śabde viśvāsa kahe sudṛḍha niścaya (Cc. Madhya 22.62). If he becomes fixed up, "Yes, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality," that is first-class, means fulfillment of faith. In the beginning it might be doubtful, neophyte. But when that is, that faith is fixed up, "Yes, Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality," that is the fulfillment of faith. Faith also there are different stages, improvement. Devotional service means different grades of faith. Today I am in one stage of faith, next day another stage, next day another stage, next day another stage. And when you come to the stage that vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti (BG 7.19), oh, that is final. Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ. That takes time. And quickly also, if one is fortunate. If one is intelligent—"The śāstra says, 'Vāsudeva is everything,' so why not take Vāsudeva everything?"—then he gains the result immediately. And if he thinks, "All right, let me see for some time," so he may waste his time, but the point is the same. Point is the same, but he has not developed his faith to such extent.

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1976, Honolulu:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He has the same name. It's just "Junior" at the end, so they know him.

Prabhupāda: No, intelligence also. Father's intelligence he must inherit. There is an Indian proverb, bāpakā beṭā sepāikā ghoḍā, kucha nehi to thoḍā thoḍā (indistinct), mean "The father's son and the soldier's horse, they acquire the quality, if not all, some, must." If one is good soldier, his horse is also trained up. There is a history in India. The horse has played heroic. The Queen of Jhansi's horse and this, our, what is called, Shivaji's horse, they have played unique part in the history. Sepāikā ghoḍā. It is animal, but because it is the horse of a famous hero, it has played. Similarly, the son of father must be as good as father. If not, to some extent. Yes. So you are the.... Your father is the leader of so many big, big businessmen. You also become leader.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Devotee (4): I was thinking earlier how a farmer can put the seed in the ground, but he cannot actually make the seed grow if it is not the will of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The situation is not favorable. That is the proof that everything is a living entity. If you put the seed... The seed is not the tree, but when you put the seed on the ground, if the situation is favorable, the particular living entity who has to take the form of that tree, he comes, and then it grows. That is the proof. Just like sex. It is not the secretion of the man and the woman. It creates a situation so that the soul may come and live there, and then there is pregnancy. It is not the matter. This is the proof.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Does that mean to some extent that the soul is dependent on a material condition?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Puruṣaḥ prakṛti-stho hi (BG 13.22). Find out this verse, puruṣaḥ prakṛti-stho hi.

Hari-śauri: Just like when the body is no good, the soul has to leave.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the proof there is soul.

Garden Conversation -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: You do not know expert. So if we remain under the guidance of Kṛṣṇa, then we also become expert to some extent. And Kṛṣṇa's expertly service or intelligence we can see in the flower, so many flowers. So why shall I not take shelter of Kṛṣṇa? Sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66). That is intelligence. That is intelligence. We see Kṛṣṇa's expertly manipulation. So if we take Kṛṣṇa's shelter, at least we shall get little intelligence. Dadāmi buddhi-yogaṁ tam. "He gets the intelligence directly from Me." And that is wanted. Why it is foolishly dealing with this rice, dahl and make spoil everything? Be little expert from Kṛṣṇa's instructions and make everything nice. Kṛṣṇa personally teaches how to deal with cows. He never showed the example of killing the cows. He maintained the cows, the calf. He was distributing butter even to the monkeys. And the pasturing ground became muddy on account of milk dropping from the bags. This is Kṛṣṇa. And He is personally taking care. So why the Kṛṣṇa's devotees should not do it? Give protection to the cows and utilize the milk. That is one of the items of Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is explained in the Bhagavad-gītā.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Then in the second point, under the heading of matter, it is describable to some extent by physical and chemical laws. But on the other hand, life is nonphysical and nonchemical; it is beyond matter; it is transcendental. That is the basic difference.

Prabhupāda: That is explained indirectly. What are those verses? Na chindanti, na dahati. Definition by negation. It is never dried up, it is never cut into pieces, it is never moistened. Why don't you find that verse? Negative way. Physical means this can be cut into particle, pieces, but here, it cannot be cut into pieces. Your physical and chemical, you have got idea. Any physical thing can be cut into pieces. But here the negative description is given. It cannot be cut into pieces. Now we have to see what is that thing which cannot be cut into pieces.

Morning Walk -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: India, Vedic civilization never cared for anything which is searched out by imperfect human beings. They never cared for it. Because he knows the man who is searching after, he's imperfect. Whatever he'll do, that is imperfect. Therefore neglect it. That is Vedic civilization. Śruti-pramāṇa: whether it is evident from the śrutis, from the Vedas. Otherwise, they reject it.

Vipina: Prabhupāda, if spiritual life and Kṛṣṇa are stronger than māyā, then how is it that religion was ever overcome to the extent it is now? In Kali-yuga it's so much neglected, whereas in past ages we learn that it wasn't neglected. How is it that māyā got such a stronghold?

Prabhupāda: There is a time, just like young man and old man. Old man is dwindling, young man is growing. It is a question of time. Kali-yuga is bad time. Therefore māyā has got chance to flourish.

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Sense gratification is never helpful. That is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, that kāmasya nendriya-prītir (SB 1.2.10). Sense gratification is required as far as..., as little as possible. Otherwise, not for sense gratification. Just like sleeping. Sleeping is required because this material body requires some rest. But not that we shall sleep twenty-four hours or twenty hours and enjoy, as in this country sometimes they enjoy sleeping. But sleeping is wasting time. So long we shall sleep we cannot do anything good work. Therefore it should be minimized. You cannot avoid sleeping altogether. That is not possible. But it should be accepted to the minimum extent. That is not possible. But it should be accepted to the minimum extent. That is called tapasya, or advancement of spiritual life.

Evening Darsana -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Yes, the prophet can speak. Prophet is representative of God.

Guest (2): Yes, it is just like that, sir, just you said it is like a small pond and big pond. No doubt, He is a big light. You cannot that thing. But what my confusion is, is this thing, that we have to, and a bhakta will also, with a limited sense, will never be able to go to that extent unless he has to surrender to some bigger power than him. And what I think...

Prabhupāda: That we, we take Kṛṣṇa as the bigger power.

Guest (2): Sure, we have to take. This is my... We have to take a bigger power. Otherwise...

Prabhupāda: So if we take Kṛṣṇa as bigger power, there is no controversy. Whatever He says you have to accept.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That machine means, their machine. Again you are bringing the same argument. What is value of machine? The machine is made by a cheater. Imperfect senses, how it is perfect?

Devotee (1): But some machines work, though, like the radio, the TV...

Prabhupāda: Work to some extent, that much credit you can take.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, to some extent that is also you're saying...

Prabhupāda: To some extent is, everyone accepts.

Hari-śauri: Just amplifies the cheating.

Prabhupāda: Yes. To some extent they are correct, that's all. So far they say, "I can see 2 feet or 10 feet." That's all. So how can I say I can see the whole sky? That is cheating.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Actually that is also the fundamental mistake.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- July 7, 1976, Baltimore:

Prabhupāda: But still you cannot do in the final. That is not possible. Because you are finite. You are not infinite. Your knowledge is limited. You can do something up to some extent.

Ravīndra-svarūpa: They agree, they all agree,

Prabhupāda: They are giving bluff: "Yes we shall produce life. Wait for millions of years, wait for millions." This is nonsense. Who will wait for millions of years and see your scientific discovery?

Rūpānuga: They say "Yes, we are finite, but we can work together, combinedly together, and make great progress, scientific progress. All working together, every nation."

Prabhupāda: You cannot do anything which is beyond your power. But you are limited, your power is limited, that you must agree. Your power is not unlimited. You are finite. That you must admit.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That is have already explained, that you serve God in any position, but if you want to know about God more, then you have to come here. Now ask any Christian what is God, who is God, what is His form, what He is doing. Can he answer? Nobody can answer. He knows God is great. How great He is, who is that God, they cannot answer. To some extent it is all right, but if you want to know full extent, then you have come to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. "Two plus two is equal to four" is mathematics, but if you want to know higher mathematics, you have to go some higher college. "Two plus two" is also mathematics, is it not? Everyone knows two plus two equal to four. So when you go to higher university, that "two plus two" does not change, but you know more about it. Because one has gone to higher university, the previous education, "two plus two," has changed, it is not that. But as a Christian you understand God is great, "two plus two," but how He is great, that you have to learn in the Vedas. That is real education. Because you do not know how He is great, therefore you do so many sinful activities. Otherwise, how it is possible to maintain slaughterhouse? Christian doctrine says "Thou shall not kill." But he does not understand; therefore his business has become to kill only. This is the defect. Why you are disobeying the orders of Christ, "Thou shall not kill"? Because you do not understand him properly.

Interview with Newsweek -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: I am training each one of them as leader so that they can spread extensively. That is my idea.

Interviewer: So, in other words, you started this whole movement here in the United States ten years ago. Would you say that the United States had the most active, financially, group of followers.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Rāmeśvara: She wants to know, seeing you chose the United States to begin this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement ten years ago, now do you find that in the United States there is the most active membership financially speaking. In terms of contributing to this movement, supporting the movement, is the best field America?

Prabhupāda: No, without finance we can go on.

Interview with Trans-India Magazine -- July 17, 1976, New York:
Prabhupāda: So actually this varṇāśrama system is meant for bringing the man in the lower status of life to the higher status of life. It doesn't matter one is born in a low-grade family. That is also said by Kṛṣṇa: māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). Pāpa-yoni, lower grade. Striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrāḥ (BG 9.32). In the human society, woman, the vaiśya and the śūdra, they are considered in the lower status, not very intelligent. Te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim. They can also become... So in the Western countries, according to Vedic calculation, they are mlecchas, yavanas, low grade. But Kṛṣṇa says ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ, "He can also be elevated, to that extent as he can go back to home, back to Godhead." So this movement is directly giving the opportunity of Kṛṣṇa's service so that they can become immediately bona fide to the position in the highest grade of life, Vaiṣṇava, so that he can go back to home, back to Godhead.
Conversation at House of Ksirodakasayi dasa -- July 25, 1976, London:
Prabhupāda: We do not do that; there is no need. That is another blunder. We keep Bhagavad-gītā as it is, and we still try to explain it. So I am very glad that you are all coming regularly, but take it. At least one day, this Sunday, you devote, seriously studying Bhagavad-gītā, and discuss amongst you whenever there is any doubt. There cannot be any doubt. The Bhagavad-gītā verses are so plainly explained, and... Just like here is one verse. We are trying to read. Kṣetra-jñaṁ cāpi māṁ viddhi sarva-kṣetreṣu bhārata: "My dear Arjuna..." Arjuna is addressed as Bhārata. Because he belongs to the dynasty of Bharata, sometimes he's addressed as Bhārata. So, very easy, that "I am also one of the souls. There are two souls. One, you are, and another, I am. So what is the difference between you and me?" That you know simply everything, not everything, but to some extent, about your body, but I know everything of everyone's body. That is the difference. I know the pleasure and pains of my body, you know the pleasure and pains of your body, but Kṛṣṇa knows the pleasure and pains of your body and pleasure and pains of my body. That is the difference between Kṛṣṇa and ourself.
Room Conversation -- July 26, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: May be true to some extent, but they do not know the ultimate truth. That they do not know. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān (BG 7.19). He understands, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That requires many, many births, to come to that conclusion. Vedaiś ca sarvair aham eva vedyaḥ (BG 15.15). This Kṛṣṇa says. Mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat kiñcid asti dhanañjaya: (BG 7.7) "There is no more superior than Me." Ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate (BG 10.8). He explains to everyone, sarva-dharman parityajya mām ekam (BG 18.66). That is the.... There is the ultimate person. You call Him Kṛṣṇa or something, but you must know Him. Īśvaraḥ paramaḥ, there must be. Father's father's father's father's father's.... Who is the original father? There must be. Where is the wrong in this statement? So you find out the supreme father, but He has no father; He is the Absolute. Sarva-kāraṇa.... Anādir ādiḥ: "He has no beginning, but He is the beginning." Anādir ādir govindaḥ sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam (Bs. 5.1). So, Bhagavān may carry one letter that "I am very sorry. On account of my health failure, I could not go to see you, that professor and all devotees, and I am very, very sorry for this, but, I humbly invite you, come to India, and we shall be very glad to sit together," like that.

Room Conversation -- August 3, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Ah. In East Germany also, they have placed order. So this is joining. Just like for us, if you bring any other literature, we throw it away immediately. We take it as useless. Actually it is. We have nothing to learn from them, anything. All bogus. Either he's scientist or astronomer, or..., we know they are talking all bogus things. There may be some truth. Even that truth is there when a child speaks, there is some truth. When a child speaks to his parents, there is some truth, otherwise where is the question of talking? So little portion truth is there, everywhere. But when they talk of big, big things—they are going to Mars and scratching sand there—that we don't believe. That we don't believe. When they talk of this tape recorder, some electronic machine, joining together and it is working, that much care you can take. But when you speak of so many things, that millions of years there were germs and germination, now they are trying to come out, and it is all vacant—these are all bogus, we don't accept. Talking too much. In Bengal it is called yatap(?) When the same child speaks something too much, "Ah, stop." To the extent of his capacity, that's all right.

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: If you do not come to the point of fulfillment of your appetite—you are eating, but if you have not sufficiently eaten, then you want more to eat. But if you have sufficiently eaten, then you will say, "No, no, no, no more I want." Even if you are offered, "Take more food." You'll say "No, I have enough." It is a question of sufficiency and insufficiency. If you are insufficiently spiritually advanced, you'll feel vacancy so much. But if you are sufficiently advanced, then you'll say, "It is all right now." It is a question of sufficiency and insufficiency. So other method, jñāna, yoga, they are insufficient. And bhakti-yoga is sufficient. Therefore you'll find in the Bhagavad-gītā the Lord says, bhaktyā mām abhijānāti (BG 18.55). Find out this verse. He never recommends jñāna, yoga, karma. Bhakti. So if you take the path of bhakti, then you'll feel sufficiency. Otherwise you'll feel insufficient. To some extent, although it is perfect, but it is not completely perfect.

Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:
Prabhupāda: So far prayer is concerned, God is great, accepted, either by the Christian or the Muhammadan or the Hindus or the followers of Vedic principles. Now "God is great, glorify Him, and that is the business of human life," that they are not taking. Practically. That is the defect. And that is to be done. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Brahmā means the great. Brhavad brhanantvad iti brahma.(?) Brahmā means the greatest. Now here we get the information God is great. So naturally one should be inquisitive to know how He is great. That is human life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Just like if I introduce, "Here is a gentleman, very rich." So naturally next inquiry will be, "How he is rich? What is the position that he is very rich?" These inquiries are natural. If I simply remain satisfied by hearing that he is rich, that is also good. You have got some respect. But if you know how he is rich, to what extent he is rich, then your respect will be increased.
Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Ātreya Ṛṣi: Your love also.

Prabhupāda: Yes, if I understand that he is rich, I may consider, "Well, I have got one thousand dollars, so he may have one hundred thousand dollars," that's all. But if you understand that he has got millions and millions of dollars, then you'll appreciate, "Oh, so rich!" Then your regard for him will increase. That is not being done. Stereotyped, "God is great." How He is great, to what extent He is great, what is His greatness activities, if you know more and more, then your regard for God will increase. But that they are not doing. Simply officially, "God is great, God is great," finished. No jijñāsā, no inquiry. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. One should be inquisitive. Jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsuḥ śreya uttamam (SB 11.3.21). One who has become inquisitive of the uttamam, the most exalted subject matter, he requires a guru.

Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: In America we have got the facility for selling books. Contribution there is, but our main source of income by selling books. We are selling books to the extent of sixty...?

Harikeśa: Sixty thousand dollars.

Prabhupāda: Sixty thousand dollars daily. Sixty thousand dollars daily. America and Europe. Europe we have got other language publication. Have you got the German?

Jñānagamya: We had French books, Bhagavad-gītā, Prabhupāda, it was sold. We had one German Bhagavad-gītā too.

Prabhupāda: We have published Chinese Bhagavad-gītā. Bring it. It is translated by one Chinese student. Give it to Mr....

Mrs. Patel: I can read Japanese, but not Chinese.

Prabhupāda: You know Japanese?

Mrs. Patel: I was brought up there.

Evening Darsana -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So to some extent they have got some affection for Kṛṣṇa but not to that extent. They, there maybe one man may seeing Kṛṣṇa's pastimes.

Yaśomatīnandana: I think generally people are more attracted to our society by the behavior of devotees rather than philosophy, Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa's pastimes. Philosophy is there but generally when they see the devotees, and by association, purification comes. As you say, there are so many books about... If the movie is made, just like our Hare Kṛṣṇa People movie, this is showing the practical example of how one can live Kṛṣṇa consciously and solve all the problems of the day-to-day life. Such a movie can attract people to become devotees.

Guest (1): For the students it is good idea.

Yaśomatīnandana: For everyone. I mean...

Prabhupāda: Those who cannot read the book, they are still better. Those who can read the book, they are still more dangerous.

Evening Darsana (on night of arrival) -- August 16, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Let them inquire. Our... Everything is open secret. We are selling books throughout the whole world to the extent of six lakhs rupees per day. So money is coming from Kṛṣṇa.

Indian man (1): Here only Swamiji, Prabhupāda, just now this...

Prabhupāda: If you don't like this, you can close India, we can go all over the world.

Indian man (2): Yes, there is a very big scope there.

Indian man (3): No, but here even it would declare it. Minister of State. Only Communist have put those questions.

Prabhupāda: Communists are seeing this movement as a great danger.

Room Conversation -- August 17, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Why people are accepting our books? You'll be surprised we are selling book to the extent of six lakhs of rupees per day. Daily. Daily we are selling six lakhs of rupees' worth all over the world. So people think philosophy, religion is dry subject matter. If it was dry subject matter, how they could purchase so many books? It is ānanda-cinmaya-rasa. They are getting for the first time. Here is real ānanda. Therefore they are appreciating. Everyone, learned circle, they are appreciation. In (indistinct) foreign circles. So, there was no such literature. It is the first time. Śrīmad-bhāgavatam amalaṁ purāṇaṁ vaiṣṇavānām... So unless, they're really relishing some rasa, how they are purchasing? This is the first distribution of ānanda-cinmaya-rasa throughout the whole world, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. So I am very happy that you are also joining. Let us join together.

Room Conversation About Mayapura Construction -- August 19, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: If you deposit five lakhs now, it will decrease value in five, ten months. The purchasing power of money is decreasing. Now what you can purchase with five lakhs of rupees, after five years you'll require ten lakhs. So your money will decrease. And if you invest that money in land, after five years it will increase to its full extent (?). So why should we waste our money? What is the benefit?

Gargamuni: The farmers don't keep their money in the banks. The government is trying to force the farmers to keep their money in the bank. The farmers don't want to do it.

Prabhupāda: Farmers' policy is if they have got money, they purchase land. Therefore they are making ceiling. The whole policy is not so good (?). Farmers, as soon as they get some money, they want to invest the land but the ceiling..., so they cannot invest money in the land; they give to the bank. And as soon as you keep money in the bank it will decrease the value. This is... Money is decreased, value of all over the world. Because it is not money actually; it is paper, cheating. Real money is gold.

Evening Darsana -- September 1, 1976, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: The one encouraging thing in this movement is that our books are being very much appreciated. In all universities, foreign and Indian, libraries, professors, learned scholars.

Indian man (3): Yes, they'll branch out and... It's a great service.

Prabhupāda: We are selling books to the extent of sixty thousand dollars daily. That is our only hope, that we shall not be financially in difficulty. People are taking our books very nicely. People are accepting our literature.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Christianity is to some extent, but you have got different edition of Christianity. So far I know, as soon as they say, "Christian," immediately the question is, "To which Christian party you belong?" What is that?

Hari-śauri: Christians, yeah, Protestants, Methodists, Catholics...

Prabhupāda: So which is correct Christianity we do not know. But we have no such thing. There is no party. Bhagavad-gītā, there cannot be any party. If anyone makes any party, he is immediately cancelled. But at least we believe in the Ten Commandments. Now, Lord Jesus Christ said, "Thou shall not kill." But why all the Christians are simply busy in killing? That is my first question.

Room Conversation with Life Member, Mr. Malhotra -- December 22, 1976, Poona:

Mr. Malhotra: Without any ākāṅkṣā.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Ākāṅkṣā is also there. That ākāṅkṣā is different. That ākāṅkṣā, how to please Kṛṣṇa, that ākāṅkṣā. In the material stage, the ākāṅkṣā is how to please my senses. In the liberated stage; how to please Kṛṣṇa.

Mr. Malhotra: By pleasing Lord, one does not please one's own ego also to some extent?

Prabhupāda: It is just like if you put water on the root of the tree, so all the parts of the tree may become satisfied, automatically. Or if you put food in the stomach, all the parts of your body becomes satisfied that is automatic. You don't require to make a separate endeavor. That is not required.

Mr. Malhotra: Is there any difference between the ego of a person who is collecting money, or material things, all his life, or a person who is giving all the material things for the service of humanity at large? Is there any difference between the two?

Prabhupāda: To give your fruits of, result of your fruitive activities, either you give to yourself or to your brothers and sisters, it is the same thing. Expanded. Just like a child eats, but when he is little grown up, he gives to his brother also. But the principle is the same. But when you give everything to God, that is liberated stage. Yat karoṣi yaj juhoṣi dadāsi yat kuruṣva tad mad-arpaṇam. "Whatever you do, you give me Me, whatever you eat, you give to Me." Yad aśnāsi dadāsi yat (BG 9.27). "You want to give in charity, you give to Me."

Morning Walk -- December 25, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: In Europe, America, the Indian students, they say, "Oh, we have seen all this Hare Kṛṣṇa. We now want technology."

Guest (1): Sir, I got into conversation this young man in Colombo for the simple reason that I have got five sons, and those sons are trying to be Westernized or Americanized to the extent that I couldn't believe that my own children would go to this extent. So I told Girirāja when he came to see me and introduced my children to them, and it has now little impact. Because now that...

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Don't sit down there. Don't sit down there. (Hindi) No, sitting on the...

Guest (1): You move it.

Prabhupāda: She is the daughter of jñānī.

Guest (3) (Indian man): They have come with me.

Prabhupāda: So why not ask him. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- December 25, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I have tried convinced them. Janmaiśvarya-śruta-śrīḥ (SB 1.8.26), to become moneyed, that also requires background. Pūrva-janmārjitaṁ dhanam. So they are born in rich country; that is due to their past pious deeds. Yes. There is no doubt. Yes. Now I request them that "You have got everything. You take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Then you are perfect."

Guest (1): We have degraded ourself to such an extent...

Prabhupāda: No, we can rise immediately.

Guest (1): Yes yes, but foundation stone is there. City is there...

Prabhupāda: Foundation or no foundation, but we'll not agree. That is the difficulty. We'll not agree.

Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa says... You are taking Bhagavad-gītā, the leader is taking Bhagavad-gītā, and he's speaking nonsense. So we are human beings, we should know what Kṛṣṇa says. Kṛṣṇa says, evaṁ paramparā prāptam imaṁ rājarṣayo viduḥ (BG 4.2). The paramparā, whether he's speaking paramparā or he's speaking whimsically. That much sense we must have. Otherwise, I am the same sheep. Then why you are speaking which is not in the paramparā? at least, you should be... Now this movement is started, because on this principle, That why these rascals are speaking not in the paramparā? That is my seed of starting this movement. I must start the movement. That is the impetus of this movement, that they must speak according to the paramparā. And someone allowed them to speak otherwise. Therefore I wrote this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is. Don't make interpretations. And by the grace of Kṛṣṇa it has become to some extent successful. That is the impetus. Why they should talk nonsense? It is clear that evaṁ paramparā prāptam (BG 4.2). Paramparā means... That is also explained.

Morning Walk -- December 27, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: You can describe like this. Just like if a man is diseased, so the physician imposes upon him some restriction, do and do not. So if by mistake we give up the do not's, then it is useless. He should observe the do not's. Then he'll be cured. And if he does not observe the do not's—whatever he likes, he does—that means his disease is increasing. Therefore it is useless. The real aim of life is how to get out of the clutches of māyā which is forcing me to accept the cycle of birth and death. That is my disease. Therefore tapasya. Tapasya means restricted life, not unrestricted life. So if we do not follow the restricted life, that means I shall continue my disease or increase my disease. The modern civilization, we are teaching how to enjoy this material world to the fullest extent, bhogaiśvarya, sense gratification and for sense gratification, material opulence. But he does not know that he is killing himself. He is aggravating the disease. He has to accept another body. But that he does not know, that he'll have to take birth and die, again the same business. That he does not know. Therefore this civilization is misguided. Yesterday we were reading, tapo divyaṁ yena śuddhyet sattvam (SB 5.5.1). We have to purify our existence. So this aim is missing—how to purify it. Sattva, I am eternal. Now I am existing in a condition, birth and death. That they do not know. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum (SB 7.5.31). He does not know his interest. He's thinking, "This is life. Let me enjoy and there is no life after death, and even there is, who cares for it?" This is going on.

Morning Walk -- December 27, 1976, Bombay:

Guest (1): That bhakti is a tapa itself. That bhakti is amongst the tapas.

Prabhupāda: Yes, bhakti means tapasya. Just like they are in the bhakti line. They are doing tapasya. They are rising early in the morning, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, observing maṅgala-ārati, no meat-eating, no illicit sex, no intoxication, so many things. It is tapasya. Whole thing is tapasya, tapaḥ, because by this tapasya the contamination of the soul will be cured. Then, if he understands Kṛṣṇa, then he is transferred to the spiritual world. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9). He does not come again to accept the material body, and he permanently lives in the spiritual world. That is perfection. The modern civilization, they do not know all these things. They are misguiding that "You earn to your best extent. Work very hard like hogs." And there is advertisement "Work hard. The next (?)." They are pulling one trailer, rickshaw, still, their leaders are advising, "Work hard. Work still more hard." A human being is pulling on trailer and rickshaw, and still hard work. And that rascal does not know that this hard work like hogs and dogs will not make the solution. But they are enthusing, "Yes, work hard. Be stout and strong, as if becoming stout and strong will save him. That's not possible.

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: All right. No, no, why you (indistinct). Young man... (break) ...the world... (break) (laughs) So similarly, if one is giving very important service, then even if there is some faulty thing, excuse. Service is so important. So in the Western country the woman can give very good service. Api cet sudarācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ (BG 9.30). This, our book distribution is the most important task in our society. Therefore I am giving so much stress and I am working so hard on this. Because this is my life and soul according to the order of my Guru Mahārāja. And by his grace it is to some extent successful. And I took it seriously. I take it seriously still now. That is my life and soul. I never tried in India to construct big temples or even in your country we didn't. I never tried. But I was selling personally books. That is the history. Sometimes they are criticizing, "What kind of sannyāsī? He is doing book business." (laughs) The other day that, what is his name? Bachu Hai came. Bachu Hai Dresswalla. You know him?

Girirāja: I know one Madanlal Dresswalla.

Prabhupāda: I think this is... There are two, three Dresswalla in Bhuvaneśvara.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: It is natural to serve God, to remain faithful to Him. This is natural. Artificially you are trying to be independent. This is the Māyāvāda... Still, they are trying to become God himself.

Dr. Patel: Sir, after first I met you, some previous time, I made an extensive study of both the sides of Vaiṣṇavism as well as the (indistinct). I think they are falling short of the final (indistinct). Once they say that they are in Brahman, but there is Para-brahman also. That Brahman is nothing but a jyoti of Para-brahman. That they forget.

Prabhupāda: That means knowledge.

Dr. Patel: And I think, sir, even Śaṅkarācārya has not meant that we must be short of that. He was also worshiping, was he not? He was worshiping Para-brahman.

Prabhupāda: He has given a commentary on the Bhagavad-gītā. In the beginning he says nārāyaṇaḥ paraḥ, "Nārāyaṇa is transcendental."

Conversation with Yogi Amrit Desai of Kripalu Ashram (PA USA) -- January 2, 1977, Bombay:
Prabhupāda: On the whole the whole human civilization is..., and all the directors, they are not giving chance to know the value of life and how to conduct life. It is the first time, that we are giving the real idea of life. Otherwise whole world is in darkness. Na te viduḥ svārtha-gatim. They do not know what is the end of life. Adānta... Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Vyāsadeva's real contribution... Ajānataḥ, lokasyājānato vidvāṁś cakre sātvata-saṁhitām (SB 1.7.6). He has given the right direction. And they are not taking advantage of it. If they come to sense some day, they'll read all these books, and they will come to know how to live life. That is our contribution, Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The whole world plunged into darkness. They do not know what is life and what is the aim of life. That's a fact. Periodically, they manufacture some ideas, and people will follow, and then it is failure, and again another revolution. They are..., the Russian philosophy, that periodically revolution required. That is also to some extent. But why revolution? Take the standard. They do not know what is the standard.
Roof Conversation -- January 5, 1977, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: In these two years I have made an extensive study of the Vaiṣṇava cult, all the three branches of main Vaiṣṇavas, and I think, I think, sir, that... I have studied Śaṅkara also extensively, and I think Śaṅkara is misunderstood very much. That is our opinion.

Prabhupāda: No, no, not misunderstood. He made himself misunderstood.

Dr. Patel: But they all misunderstand the real purport of his...

Prabhupāda: Māyāvādam asac... He has to preach this Māyāvāda. He has to present himself in that way. Otherwise he is Vaiṣṇava. Māyāvādam asac-chāstraṁ pracchannaṁ bauddham ucyate.

Evening Darsana -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

D. D. Desai: She herself is highly... The amount of respect she has got for Indian culture is terrific, to an extent of almost aggression if somebody puts a foot down or something about these things. Even Panditji, with all said and done, he had a feeling, and he was one with Mahatma Gandhi, that a day will come when India, by solving its problems, will take away the existing world from the present Western culture to a new culture, which will be of a superior level. That day would be the day when India has made good its ultimate destiny. Something like that they had feeling. So Panditji also was dreaming, but he was not an executive type of person. So Panditji had left his thing, all the dreams, but Mrs. Gandhi seems to be translating some of the dreams, or at least she feels she's translating some of the dreams into reality. The difficulty with her is that she has not proper guidance at times, and to that extent she feels she falls into certain pits of difficulties. Basically a good soul, but a soul with certain waywardness could become at times little...

Prabhupāda: So if you think that Mrs. Gandhi is religious and is for Indian culture, why not ask her to take the guidance of Kṛṣṇa? Who can give better guidance than Kṛṣṇa?

Indian lady (2): Mahatma Gandhi took guidance... Of course, he also made lots of mistakes, but he did take guidance...

Prabhupāda: Everyone must make mistake because a conditioned soul are liable to four defects. One of them is to commit mistake. One of them is to become illusioned. One of them, he is a cheater. And one of them, his senses are imperfect. So every conditioned soul who has got this material body, he is defective in these four things.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: But you said that there is unemployment also.

Rāmeśvara: To a certain extent. But there are still 250,000,000 people. So most of them...

Prabhupāda: So those who are unemployed, let them come to us. We shall give them employment.

Rāmeśvara: Yes. But for the mass population...

Prabhupāda: Well, gradually you will increase and...

Rāmeśvara: We have to give them something that they can do in their home.

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes.

Rāmeśvara: Because it is impractical to think that they will give up everything and move into the temple.

Prabhupāda: No, those who are unemployed, let them come. We shall give them employment.

Room Conversation -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Pṛthu-putra: Because I went to some universities. They have big, big universities in Cairo and in every places in North Africa, because now they try to be educated. The white Africans, they have some intelligence to understand to a certain extent philosophy, because when I was talking about the Bhagavad-gītā, when I showed the table of contents, they more or less agreed to take interest in it because they didn't see anything specific about another religion, another God. They were seeing the titles like "Confidential Knowledge," "Transcendental Knowledge," "Karma-yoga," "Jñāna-yoga." They are very interested about knowing these things.

Prabhupāda: That is good the first, beginning, let them come. Let them sit down, chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and take prasāda. In Iran we are doing that. Gradually it is becoming interesting. You had been in our Iran, Tehran?

Pṛthu-putra: I went there also some time, long time ago.

Room Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- January 30, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: "Make me sick." What does he mean by this?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: He says... See, his theory of evolution cannot explain how these eyes are evolved, our eyes. So he felt very uncomfortable just seeing in the beginning these eyes, our eyes. But he says that stage he has overcome to some extent. But still, one particular phenomenon is bothering him very much. That is the eye in the peacock's tail. It is the delicate, nice design with is colorful structure.

Prabhupāda: How it evolved.

Room Conversation -- February 12, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So our point is the devotees shall work. So there is no program to pay wages.

Jayapatākā: Gradually, more and more, we're getting more devotees who can work in the agriculture. But to date, most of the people that join are either the handloomers or... We're getting mostly handloomers and to some extent some more learned, more educated boys.

Prabhupāda: Not labor class.

Jayapatākā: Not labor class. But we need them also for translation and other things. So to make up the gap them we had to hire. But that's lessened... Now we're getting also. Some labor class are joining.

Prabhupāda: So hire. That also he can become devotee. He can spare fifty percent of his income. Then he becomes a devotee. Hiring men and working, I don't think that will be very profitable. Then we can purchase from the market.

Evening Darsana -- February 15, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: You shall combine a few Ph.D., D.H.C., to challenge these so-called scientists all over the world. Amongst the scientists, if you speak of God, they will deride. He'll reject you. Is it not?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: To some extent, yes. But...

Prabhupāda: No. It is prohibited to speak of God among the scientists.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But in India, if he speaks in India to the scientists, they will receive it much more readily.

Prabhupāda: Hm. In Western countries they have no brain.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, cow dung.

Prabhupāda: Cow dung. Cow dung, no. Man's dung. (laughter) Cow dung is pure. Man's dung. In our youthful ages we used to say, dadang dang.(?) Our one professor, Mr. Cameron, English professor, he was Scotsman. In our I.A. class or B.A. class he was... So that time Patel's Bin(?), intercaste marriage... We were young man. We were supporting. So before the professor's coming in the blackboard we wrote, "Dadang dang Patel's Bin dang," (?)and like that, in Bengali. So Professor Cameron came. He saw, "The boys, they have written something." So he simply read it, remained silent. Then he began his teaching.

Room Conversations -- February 20, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Directly I do not want to spend money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What I'm saying is that that selling is determined by the number of distributors, and so far, we have very few of them here in India. That's the point I'm trying to make. Until we make more devotees here, the distribution is going to be to some extent limited.

Prabhupāda: No. If you have sufficient nice stock, anywhere you go, you'll take up.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But you have to have men who can offer the books.

Jayapatākā: We'll have four traveling parties.

Prabhupāda: Just like this Gītār Gān. Wherever we are going, selling.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Imagine... All I'm trying to say is if we had more men, the distribution would increase tenfold, hundredfold.

Prabhupāda: Men will come by distribution.

Room Conversation -- March 31, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Our Tamāla Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja, he refused to take charge, Madhudviṣa. I was little hopeless. And Brahmānanda encouraged me. "I will do." And then silent. "Give him fifty dollars. Give him fifty dollars." And his policy was that where he will get this money? He is beggar. Fourteen lakhs? Whatever one, two lakhs he gives, that's all. I told him friendly that "I have no so much money. Immediately I can collect four lakhs. I shall give you two lakhs against your money, and two lakhs I shall spend for construction. Of course, within three years I shall fill up." He thought that whatever two lakh, one lakh comes, he will not be able to... That was his... I knew that I had no money, but I never thought that "I shall not be able to do." That I was confident. So it's a great history. So many things happened. It is all Rādhā-Rāsavihārī's līlā. Otherwise it is... Now next program, your: make a strong party and you travel extensively all over the world, amongst the scientists, and whatever amount is required, I shall spend.

Morning Conversation -- April 11, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: (reading:) "Hoxar pleads for healthy land-man relationship. Mr. P. N. Hoxar, deputy chairman of the Planning Commission, yesterday pleaded for developing a healthy and rational land-man relationship as the foundation to build the socio-economic superstructure. Unless such relationship is developed through proper land reforms, it is useless to talk about science and technology in employment-oriented planning, he added. Eighty percent of the people live in the villages and till the land which they do not own. The holdings were fragmented and the tenant was uncertain. They were burdened with debt to such an extent that they could not pay them back and fell into bondage of one sort or another."

Prabhupāda: Another rascal.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "He said that industry must rest on a secure foundation and a healthy land-man relationship. It cannot rest where man owns thousands of acres of land and villages, but stays in Calcutta or Patna and is only interested in collecting money."

Prabhupāda: That I say always. Hm.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: We have already seen the defect.

Room Conversation with Ram Jethmalani (Parliament Member) -- April 16, 1977, Bombay:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "In accordance with your desire I went to Karachi and spent two days there. I first visited the marble factory of Mr. Azis Pir Mohammed. This man belongs to the Ismaili sect of Islam, the followers of Aga Khan. His factory is very small, and he and his three brothers manage it. Their primary business is cutting alabaster into vases, tiles, plates, cups, etc., and they sell their products mainly to foreign countries. I made two visits to their factory and preached extensively to Azis, his brother, his friends and workers. They all liked Kṛṣṇa consciousness. They are intelligent enough to understand and in due time will be able to follow your instructions seriously. However, they need more association and a devotee to constantly engage them. I did not see fit to ask them for the use of their house as a center yet, but I told them that I would be opening a center in Karachi, and they were happy to hear this. They promised to help in whatever way they could as soon as our men appear on the scene."

Ram Jethmalani: Sir, I will take leave of you, and with your blessings, I hope we shall soon be...

Prabhupāda: No, we are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness without any sectarian... That is our... Unity on spiritual platform. Try to understand.

Ram Jethmalani: I hope we can be of some use sometime to your...

Prabhupāda: Yes. That position... That is required, that you want to cooperate.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- April 18, 1977, Bombay:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I found very interesting in the villages. I thought... I was planning to make programs very extensively in the week, but because of rain, it was...

Prabhupāda: In Manipur also there is rain.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Oh, rained so much. But anyway, the rain stopped in the last few days, so I made a few shows in the village. So they didn't even have electricity, so they hired this generator, and then I showed the white screen, and all the villages, nineteen villages, they came in no time. So I had about nine hundred, nine hundred in two shows. And they wanted to see more, the movies. And then they very appreciated. They wanted to join.

Prabhupāda: So let them join.

Room Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No Indira Gandhi's news?

Bhakti-caru: (continues to read news articles) No... Indira Gandhi... "Infighting with Civic Congress Party leads to more powers for laborers." "Civil judge regrets motives against magistrates." (reads more headings and newspaper articles) " 'The revolutionary work of eliminating poverty and unemployment in the rural areas can be accomplished by a considerable extent through the khādi and village industries. To achieve these objectives modern technology must be used to rise to the extent possible.' He hopes the new commission would take steps in this direction." (continues reading news articles; Prabhupāda is silent)

Prabhupāda: Hm. Hm. That's all.

Morning Conversation -- April 19, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Six thousand dollars, but we are ready to spend fifteen to twenty thousand dollars. Make it nicely, everything. We shall spend. Make worldwide propaganda. And there will be no scarcity of money. Tour. Make extensive tour, especially in Russia. In Russia send this film group, the scientific group, and if the Doctor is seriously our friend, let him translate. And that translation, it shall be good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He said it's very good.

Prabhupāda: And the person who is translating, encourage him. Do this.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, Harikeśa, we have to reply his letters, so I have noted down to tell him that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Let him translate as many as possible. And make this program. And that twenty thousand dollars should not be touched. It will be simply spent for this propaganda.

Short Dissertations -- May 24-25, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: They don't mind. "We must have mangoes." Money is very insignificant thing. Gold is the... And as soon as there is enough money, there is debauch, debauchery. Still there are Oriental moral principles. Girls who have become modernized... Otherwise they do not mix with any man. Their husband, that's all. And covered body, they are, very beautiful girl. And those who have become modernized, they are just like European girls. There is no difficulty to become modernized. They have got money. And they tour from one country to another extensively. Formerly for Muhammadans, drinking was the greatest sin. Now it has become... Drinking is strictly prohibited amongst the Muhammadans, according to their religious system. And sex? Before Muhammadan religion was introduced, they used to have sex even with mother. And woman could be purchased as slaves. Marketplace, women were standing for being sold. They would like to be sold.

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Mahāṁśa: And this is a very nice thing he said, Prabhupāda. He said that "We want to improve things in the countryside to an extent that people from the cities start running to the villages."

Prabhupāda: Yes. That I want. I... Everywhere I go and say, how these rascals...? So much land is lying, and these rascals are not developing. And they are making... What is that? Coal stone. Coal. They are interested with these bricks and stones, not green vegetables. Such a rascal government. Give them facility. We know how to do it. Annād bhavanti bhūtāni parjanyād anna-sambhavaḥ, yajñād bhavati parjanyaḥ (BG 3.14). Let them engage in kīrtana. There will be more water for gardening, and it will be moist, and then produce fodder for the animals and food for you. And animal gives you milk. That is Vṛndāvana life.

Talk with Svarupa Damodara -- June 20, 1977, Vrndavana:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the point was that there is life within the atom. But that life is not... The consciousness is not developing to the extent that...

Prabhupāda: That is very natural. Just like in a child there is life. But it is not... Consciousness is not developed. That does not mean there is no life. That you can see, daily affair. The same child, when he's grown up or changed body, his activities will change. So where is the difference? Difference—when he was a childish body, the consciousness was not developed, and when he's transferred in another body, his consciousness will develop. This is the point. The ant, there is life.

Conversation with Svarupa Damodara -- June 21, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You are God—limited. Limited God. You cannot maintain. Therefore you are limited. You can become God within your family, within your office, within your kingdom. You are not Supreme God. To a limited extent you are God. Because you have got the quality of God, so according to your capacity, within limited jurisdiction, you may be God. So dictionary is there. Vedic assertion is there. Logic is there. Science is there. Prove. Then your education will be successful. Avicyutaḥ arthaḥ kavibhir nirūpitaḥ. When you can prove this, then the meaning of your education will become... Avicyutaḥ arthaḥ kavibhir nirūpito yad-uttama-śloka-guṇānuvarṇanam (SB 1.5.22). To glorify the exalted position of God, that is... Is it clear?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā says, mattaḥ parataraṁ nānyat (BG 7.7). That is Kṛṣṇa. That Supreme Being is Kṛṣṇa.

Conversation, 'Rascal Editors,' and Morning Talk -- June 22, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the nature. But they are still pious because they have come to God. And those who are very, very miscreant, they, at any circumstance, they'll never. Dog's obstinacy. Na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). They are last class.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Few years ago there was a German physicist Schroedinger(?). He wrote a book called What is Life? And he said life could be understood just like physics. Then this Freeman Dyson(?)... He's a very renowned scientist in Princeton University. He gave a lecture in our university at Emory about few months ago. He was speaking about cosmic manifestations of the universe. And I asked a question about this Schroedinger's(?) approach, saying that Schroedinger is a very well known and Nobel Prize-winning physicist. He stated that life could be understood in terms of physics and chemistry. I asked him, "What do you think about this approach?" His answer was "Schroedinger did not know at that time that the physics of modern science, especially quantum physics, cannot be explained without invoking consciousness." That means life is a different entity than normal physics and chemistry. So they are starting to realize, at least to some extent, that life could be completely different process than was planned about few years ago.

Prabhupāda: So on the whole, they have not come to the platform to know about life. That's all right.

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: How they can? Scientist is rascal. That is proved. They are insisting that chemical can produce life. He's a rascal. They have gone to moon planet. That's a rascal. So what is the value of so-called scientist. Why should we give any importance? I'm not giving any importance. If you become scientist, that so much ghee and so much āṭā makes puri, and we can eat very nicely, all right, you are a scientist. But so much chemicals, make it life—prove that. The confectioner is also scientist. He knows very well how to do his business. A carpenter is also scientist. Here is some work nice done by the carpenter. I cannot do it. You may be a great scientist, but me? It is not possible for me to do a carpentry work. In this way it is going on. (Bengali) You have learned something, you can do it very nicely. But I cannot do it. For me it will be beating by the rod if I am given this work. I can translate, my work. So everyone is scientist, his own field of activities, to some extent. You cannot make everyone agree. That is not... Vox populi you cannot. That is not possible. What is that vox populi?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: General population.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: The real thing is that Prabhupāda is passing urine, and he is passing stool. So there's... What is the harm for taking vegetable juice? The main thing is that Prabhupāda has to swallow it. If he can swallow it, it's being digested to some extent, because urine is coming and stool is passing.

Prabhupāda: When stool comes, urine does not come.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Right. No, there's something definitely... Something is amiss, that instead of coming out as urine, it comes out as stool. (break)

Bhavānanda: But you did say Kṛṣṇa advised you through this dream to take that medicine.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Bhavānanda: You said that Kṛṣṇa directed you through that dream to take that makara-dhvaja medicine. So there are six different types of makara-dhvaja.

Prabhupāda: But Kṛṣṇa directed-Rāmānuja Vaiṣṇava.

Prabhupada Vigil -- November 1, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bhakti-caru: Actually the kavirāja has left it up to you, Śrīla Prabhupāda. He said that the way you have cured your cough and cold in just a day, in just a few hours' time, the same way you can cure all your disease if you want, just yourself, without any medicine. At the same time, you dreamt this Rāmānuja kavirāja giving you the medicine, and ever since you started taking the medicines there has been some good effect, like you started passing more urine, you started getting a little appetite, little taste, your swelling has gone down, to some extent.

Prabhupāda: Swelling has not... (long silence)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Śrīla Prabhupāda? About two days ago you said that either the kavirāja should stay here or we should go with him. So why should we change that idea?

Prabhupāda: Because in this morning I was fainting. So there was no strength. How long I (sic:) circumbulate?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: About a half hour.

Prabhupāda: Even half hour, if I am fainting... So if I die without medicine, without kavirāja, what is the harm? Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: According to the kavirāja, his treatment is that first of all he has to take care of your liver and kidneys before giving you strength. He said there's no question of you getting any strength until your liver and kidneys are healed.

Prabhupāda: So take the medicine.

Page Title:Extent (Conversations)
Compiler:SunitaS, Mayapur
Created:26 of Aug, 2011
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=141, Let=0
No. of Quotes:141