Cats and dogs (Conversations 1976 - 1977)

Expressions researched:
"cat and dog" |"cats and dogs" |"dog and cat" |"dogs and cats"

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walks -- January 22-23, 1976, Mayapura:

Jayapatākā: Yesterday you mentioned to the secretary that the members of legislature should all be Vaiṣṇavas. They should all be brahminically qual...

Prabhupāda: Brāhmaṇa-vaiṣṇava.

Jayapatākā: Brāhmaṇa-vaiṣṇava. Then they could give true advice.

Prabhupāda: Yes. What is this nonsense asses and pigs and dogs and cats? What they will do?

Jayapatākā: One goal we could have is that they would pass a law that no one could be a member of a legislature who didn't follow the four regulative principles.

Prabhupāda: Who will do that? That can be possible if you spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement very widely and they become convinced that "We shall not vote anyone to these rascals. We must have a Vaiṣṇava." Then everything will be changed. That is the only opportunity, that if people become Vaiṣṇava and they decide that "We are not going to vote anyone who is not a Vaiṣṇava," then everything will be all right.

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is the first-class mūḍha. Mūḍho 'yaṁ nābhijānāti loko mām ajam avyayam (BG 7.25). Every... Dark, darkness. He keeps himself in darkness. This life was given to him by nature to become liberated by understanding God, but he does not take care of. He is making plan: "We shall be happy like this. We shall be happy like this. We shall be happy like this." Therefore they are mūḍhas. That will not help him. He does not know that. And if he simply tries to understand Kṛṣṇa, he becomes immediately liberated. Janma karma me divyaṁ yo jānāti tattvataḥ tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti.. (BG 4.9).. Everything is there. But he will do so many plans, and nothing will be successful. He'll avoid Kṛṣṇa. This is the first-class mūḍha. Athāto brahma jijñāsā, the Vedānta philosophy's first instruction: "Now you inquire about God. This is the only chance. As cats and dogs you cannot do that. Now, atha, ataḥ. You have enjoyed your senses so much as cats, dogs, tigers, so on, so on. Now you devote to understand, inquiry." Athāto brahma jijñāsā.

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Yes. So let us go. (break) ...says, uttiṣṭhata jāgrata prāpta-varān nibodhata.(?)Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura says, jīv jāgo, jīv jāgo. Still he will sleep in this human form of life and remain animal, cat and dog. A simple word, jīv jāgo, jīv jāgo. This is Vedic instruction. Uttiṣṭhata jāgrata: "Get up. Be awakened. You have got this body. Try to understand God." That they will not do. They'll come to fight: "Oh, you are playing mṛdaṅga at four o'clock and disturbing my sleeping?" This is going on. "Let me go to the police. You are trying to awaken me from my sleeping? You are trying to make me intelligent? Let me remain fool. Why you are disturbing me?" Māyā's influence. Kota nidrā jāo māyā-piśācīra kole. Simply wasting of time. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau **. The Gosvāmīs, they conquered over sleeping first, nidrā, then eating. Nidrāhāra-vihārakādi-vijitau. What is this?

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: The living entity is victimized, and in this life you can adventure to conquer over it. This is human life. The cats and dogs, they cannot fight with māyā, but a human being, he can fight. So if we don't fight, we don't take that adventure, then we remain cats and dogs. The cats and dogs, they fight amongst themselves but not with the māyā. So aborigines, although they have got features of human being, they are no more than the cats and dogs. So they also fight amongst themselves. They do not know that the fighting spirit should be utilized to declare war against māyā. That is possible in human life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This fighting is philosophy. "What is the ultimate cause? What is Brahman? What I am?" Fighting against darkness, sleeping. Kota nidrā jāo māyā-piśācīra kole.

Morning Walk -- February 26, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That means cheating themselves. What is the use of taking sannyāsa and cheat yourself? Material life means punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām (SB 7.5.30), repeatedly doing the same thing. Either as human being or as monkey or as a small ant or the demigods, but doing the business is the same, four things: eating, sleeping, mating and fearing. In different scale, doing the same business. Therefore it is called punaḥ punaḥ, "again and again," carvita-carvaṇānām, "chewing the chewed." If one is sober, he thinks that "These four business, I have done many, many lives, as sparrow, or as jackal, or as demigod, and I have got this human form. Again I am doing this? So what is benefit of this human form of life?" This is sense. "I got this valuable life, and I am still doing the same thing as dogs and cats and sparrows? Then what is the difference between me and the dogs?" That is sense. "What is my better engagement?" That better engagement is Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Morning Walk -- April 17, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Right, sir. But the scientist is not forced to do it. He freely does it.

Prabhupāda: No, anyone. Why scientist? Even cats and dogs, they are also doing for Kṛṣṇa. You cannot.... Nobody can say...

Dr. Patel: But scientist willingly does it to unearth the secret. Don't call him a rascal. The scientist does it.

Prabhupāda: No, I don't say. Kṛṣṇa says.

Dr. Patel: Kṛṣṇa says those people are rascal who does not believe in Him.

Prabhupāda: So anyway, that is the test. If you don't believe in Kṛṣṇa, you are rascal. That's all. We are simple child, and Kṛṣṇa has said that anyone who does not surrendered, he's a rascal. So we say, "Are you surrendered to Kṛṣṇa?" "No." "You are a rascal." (laughter) No. Our test is very simple.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Not developed. But you cannot say there is no soul. Sometimes they say foolishly that the animal, there is no soul. That is foolishness. Everywhere there is soul. It is not developed. So just like a child is as good as animal, but you cannot say in the child there is no soul. The consciousness is not developed. You can say like that. Similarly, there are 8,400,000 species of forms. They are different on account of different development of consciousness. A tree, there is consciousness, but it is very, very covered. If you cut the tree, it does not protest, because the consciousness is not developed. I have seen in children surgical operation. They do not require anesthetics. I remember. My eldest daughter, when she was child, she had some boil here. So the doctor wanted to operate. So I asked him that "Apply anesthetic or do something." "No, no, they don't require." And so the doctor cut the boil, and the child simply, "Ehhh, ehhh," no crying. I have seen it when they did.... No crying. Because the consciousness is not developed. Now, what do you mean by...? When you are unconscious, if your head is cut off, you do not understand. That is practical if by medicinal process you are made into unconsciousness, chloroform anesthetic, so that you don't feel. This is practical. So unless the consciousness is developed, one's soul's full-fledged function does not develop. So this is a chance in the human form of body that the consciousness should be developed. Therefore we are presenting these books. They can understand. We are not presenting the books to the cats and dogs.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: The child can understand, "Now, two finger and two finger, it becomes four finger." In this way we have to learn it. Therefore there are so many books. It is for the human being to learn. But if we simply remain civilized like cats and dog, then what is your advancement of civilization? There is no advancement. If you sit on this chair, and the others, they are sitting on the floor, sitting purpose is served. But if you say, "Sitting on the chair is civilized, and that is uncivilized," that is mental concoction. You have to serve your purpose. If by sitting on the floor you can understand what you are, that is civilization. And without understanding yourself, if you waste your time for manufacturing a chair, that is cats' and dogs' civilization. So that is going on. They are busy in manufacturing chairs, how to sit comfortably, without any knowledge that what is the value of life and what is life. This is going on. They are thinking that constructing big, big skyscraper building and motorcars and high roads and so many, so many, unnecessary things, that is advancement of civilization. No. Advancement of civilization is there when you know what you are. That is advancement of.... You can.... There is no prohibition. The materialistic way of civilization, constructing big, big house, there is no.... You don't stop it, but if you forget yourself—you do not know what you are—then it is wasting time because the human life is specially meant for understanding "What I am?" The cats and dogs, they cannot do.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: That is difference between God and you. So if you understand yourself, sample of God, then you understand the Supreme God. But first of all you do not understand yourself. I am misidentifying, "I am this body." And that is doing.... The cats and dogs, they are doing that. Then where is your human intelligence? Then how you can understand God if you have no human intelligence? These books are meant for the human being. If I give to the dogs that "Read this book; you'll understand God," who cares for it? All these school, college, institution, university, they are meant for human being, not for the cats and dogs. So if we do not take advantage of this human form of life and try to understand ourself and God, then we are simply cats and dogs. That is going on. We are fighting like cats and dogs. And before the Englishman came in Australia, Australia was property of somebody else. And now you have captured Australia, you are barking, "Why you have come, Indian, here?" What is this civilization? Hm? You have taken illegally from others, and now you have become proprietor.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: First World War, yes. That was futile. Again you have started United Nation. Where is the benefit? There cannot be benefit. If you keep the dogs as dog, you bring them, "You Australian dog, come here, and American dog, come here, and European dog, come here. Live peacefully," will they live peacefully? So if you keep the human society as cats and dogs, how can you expect peace? They must be human being. Then there will be peace. So this is the training how to make human being, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Now these boys, they are also Europeans, Americans. They are coming from respectable, very educated.... They'll never ask for a chair. "Sit down. That's all." The necessities of life, artificial necessities, reduced, and time is saved for understanding the value of life. Without motorcar your life will not be spoiled. You can walk. But without Kṛṣṇa consciousness your life is spoiled. So how.... We recommend that "First of all understand yourself." Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is your prime business.

Room Conversation -- April 22, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Then we discuss other things. This is the primary education of spiritual life. First of all you have to understand that you are not this body. You are living entity, different from the body. Just like you are different from the shirt-coat. But the difficulty is, the person who is in a different type of shirt-coat, he is identifying with the shirt-coat, and they are fighting. You have got black coat. You have got white coat. You have got yellow coat. But they do not understand, none of us belong to the coat. We are different from the coat. That is ignorance. The whole world is going on under this impression that "I am this body." So how there will be peace? That kind of thinking is there in the dogs, in the cats. So our point is that if you remain like cats and dogs, how you can attain peace? You are endeavoring for peace. It is not possible. First of all you understand yourself. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati (BG 18.54). These things are discussed there.

Room Conversation -- May 1, 1976, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Yes. They're eating meat. They have no even human sense. What is that religion? They have no even sense that "I am cutting throat of one poor animal under my protection. If somebody cuts my throat, how much I am unhappy. And I'm doing the same business and I'm human being? How can I call myself a human being? I have no sense even of compassion." Cats and dogs are passing on as religionists. Some hogs and pigs are going on as philosopher. And other animals is going as scientist, Darwin. They're animals only, cats and dogs. They are the leaders of the society. How you can expect any benefit from them? The leaders themselves are cats and dogs, pigs. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ (SB 2.3.19). These leaders, they are saṁstutaḥ, they are very much worshiped. By whom? Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ. By the dogs, by the pigs, by the.... śva-viḍ-varāha..., camel, and by the ass. Because these particular names, I have explained in the Bhāgavata...

Morning Walk -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Where is material necessity? Even for the cats and dogs, there is no material necessities. It is all supplied by Kṛṣṇa. It is simply māyā that "I am in material necessities." There are eight million lower species of life. Who is doing business for his...? We, simply civilized men, we are doing this. Otherwise Kṛṣṇa is supplying everyone. Eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān. He supplies everything. Even the ant within the hole of your room, are you giving any food?

Devotees: No.

Prabhupāda: Then how he's living? And the elephant in the forest of Africa. Who is going to give them food? How they're living? From the elephant to the ant, He's providing, and He cannot provide you. This is all mistaken idea. You haven't got to ask. Everything is there. Because in the.... (break) ...accustomed to sense gratification life after life, we are habituated to ask. That is a habit. "Habit is the second nature." Actually, we don't require. These dogs, they are not asking, going to the church for asking, "God, give us our daily bread." Where he is getting bread? (break) Dogs are enjoying, but they are not asking bread from God. And where they are getting? (bird chirping in background.) (break) ...how he's chirping so nicely. But he has no anxiety.

Morning Walk -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Oh, thank you very much. (break) ...Bhagavad-gītā. Dharmāviruddho kāmo 'smi, "Sex life which is not against religious principles, I am that." Not that sex life, as soon as you like, sex. That is not gṛhastha. That is gṛhamedhī. Dharmāviruddha. Dharma-aviruddha means simply for begetting nice child you can have..., not for enjoyment. Putrārthe kriyate bhāryā. This is Vedic principle. Putraḥ-piṇḍa-prayojanam. A bhāryā, wife, is accepted only for having son. Not for any other purpose. Putraḥ-piṇḍa-prayojanam. This is material side, but still, it is religious. First education is brahmacārī, how to train him to avoid sex life. And still if he's not able, then he is allowed to become a gṛhastha, a little concession. Otherwise, the whole Vedic civilization is: how to avoid sex life. Brahmacārī—no sex life. Vānaprastha—no sex life. Sannyāsa—no sex life. Only gṛhastha, under control. That is gṛhastha. Gṛhastha does not mean one who is doing everything whimsically on account of getting this concession. He's not gṛhastha, he's gṛhamedhī. Apaśyatām ātma-tattvaṁ gṛheṣu gṛha-medhinām (SB 2.1.2). Śrotavyādīni rājendra nṛṇāṁ santi sahasraśaḥ, apaśyatām ātma-tattvam... (SB 2.1.2). Gṛhamedhī means he does not know what is spiritual life. That is gṛhamedhī. And gṛhastha means he knows what is spiritual life, and he lives on that status. That is gṛhastha. Gṛhamedhī's definition is.... Everything is there in the śāstra. Apaśyatām ātma-tattvam. They do not know what is the aim of life. It is like something, something like cats and dogs. They do not know. Apaśyatām ātma-tattvam (SB 2.1.2). (break) So he'll speak to you. You know English, you can read books.

Room Conversation -- May 3, 1976, Fiji:

Prabhupāda: Our point is that we are going to live in the future. So if, becoming modern, we forget our future, then what is the use of becoming modernized? Better remain primitive. The business is that in future also we shall exist. If we do not know how we shall exist—either I shall exist as a cat, as a dog, or a tree, or a demigod, or as associate of Kṛṣṇa.... If I do not know.... On account of being modernized, if I remain in darkness about my future, so it is better to remain primitive. What is the use of becoming modernized and forget myself and my future? Becoming modernized, if I become dog in future, so what is the use of modernized? The real business is that I shall take care of my future. Especially in the human form of body. Cats and dogs, they do not know about future. If I know there is future, I have a future.... This is also said by Kṛṣṇa. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ: (BG 2.13) "In future." Not this body, another body.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...concerned with the material world, you remain.

Rādhāvallabha: (break) ...put out by the karmīs, and it is a book on how to become peaceful and happy, and it shows pictures of dogs and cats sleeping, and it says, "This is how you do it. You should lie down like this and everything will be all right."

Prabhupāda: The dog is lying peacefully because he has got sense that "I have got a good master." Therefore he is sleeping. They do not sleep peacefully without master.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: (break) ...Śrīla Prabhupāda, is that the scientists have been proven guilty. Now we have to decide what their punishment should be.

Morning Walk -- May 26, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Their policy is "High living and poor thinking." They live in skyscraper but don't care for where they are going to next life, as a cat and dog. Never mind. Now live in skyscraper. Poor thinking. High living, poor thinking (laughter). No, that "Now I am living in the skyscraper building on the twenty-fifth story, and next life I'm going to be cockroaches here." (everyone laughs) They don't know that. He doesn't inquire, "Wherefrom the cockroaches coming?" (everyone laughs) He has got attachment for this twenty-fourth story, so, but he's working so that he'll become a cockroach. So Kṛṣṇa has given chance, "All right. You live in the twenty-fourth story as cockroach." And then you'll be again killed by some.... What is called?

Morning Walk -- May 26, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be. Supposing it is good. But he does not think "How I shall live in this way and next time I may be cats and dogs and cockroaches. What I'm doing for them?" Therefore they will evade: "No, no. There is no next life." Because it is horrible for them.

Devotee (2): Most of the karmīs think that if you believe in the law of karma, it applies to you, but if you do not believe...

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Devotee (2): Most of them think that if you believe in the law of karma, it applies to you.

Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Simply faith, blind faith we do not endure. And therefore they are becoming godless. And gradually, if we do not understand factually what is God, then the whole human civilization will be godless. To become godless means again animal. That is the difference between animal and man. In the animal society there is no question of religion, faith, God. These things are not there. The human civilization, if it becomes like that, without any faith in God, without any understanding of God, then where is the difference between cats and dogs and human beings? They must know God scientifically. That is the actual aim of human life. Suppose the dog is sleeping on the street without any care whether a car is coming and smash it. He's also sleeping sound sleep. And we are sleeping in a very nice apartment. So after all, sleeping. And he is also enjoying sleeping, I am also enjoying sleeping.

Room Conversation with Reporter -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So, there must be father. This is conclusion. So who is sanctioning about the father? The answer is in the Bhagavad-gītā: ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā (BG 14.4), "I am father." You cannot denying father; that is not possible. If there is mother, if there is child, there must be father. This is human sense. And animal sense is: "I don't care for father. There may be father, may not be..." That is animal sense. So do you want to keep the human society in such ignorance just like cats and dogs? The dogs do not care who is father. This movement wants to give education to the human society: "Yes, there is father." And that is actual fact. Without father how there is child? Is it possible? Then? For at the present moment, the human society is child playing on the lap of mother, that's all. In big, big motorcars, that's all. Without any knowledge of father.

Morning Walk -- June 3, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: A big dream, that's all. Material existence means a big dream. How long you'll dream? So long you are in this body. And as long as the body is finished, your dream is finished. Your nation, your society, your friends, your money, your bank, everything finished. Is it not a dream? Then dream another—you become cats and dogs or demigods. You dream in a different way. You are now dreaming as American; next life you may dream something else.

Bharadvāja: So every man has his own world that he's living in?

Prabhupāda: Eh? He creates his own world. Nothing is own—temporary—he creates, and Kṛṣṇa gives him the opportunity, "All right, you enjoy." Hare nāma, hare nāma.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rāmeśvara: So Yamarāja does not direct the movements of the living entities as they are going automatically from animal body to higher body.

Prabhupāda: An animal is not jurisdiction of Yamarāja. The man is in the jurisdiction of.... Just like law is meant for man, not for the cats and dogs.

Rāmeśvara: So what determines the different varieties of dogs and cats if they are just automatically being...?

Prabhupāda: Not automatically. You are man. If you develop a dog's mentality, the Yamarāja puts you in the dog's body. And then you again develop, come to the man's body. That means your term of imprisonment finished. You become again man. Now again decide. And again if you become a dog's mentality, again go. This is going on.

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: So mother nature takes care to bring him again to the grown-up youthful life. Now you make your decision. So, if you don't make your decision, the knowledge is there, the books are there, if you don't make your decision, still you want to remain as cats and dogs, again begin.

Devotee: Do most humans go down to the animal species again after human life?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Do most human beings fall down into the animal species?

Prabhupāda: Not necessarily. He can become a stool worm. (laughter)

Rāmeśvara: Śrīla Prabhupāda, what is the value for the living entity to automatically pass through all these different species? Does he get any knowledge?

Prabhupāda: To, to finish his life of imprisonment.

Garden Conversation -- June 9, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: The guests, you may read aloud to them. (long pause; Śrīla Prabhupāda exchanges a few Hindi sentences with a woman)

Nalinīkaṇṭha: "The whole purpose of Vedic civilization and of reading the Vedas is to attain the perfect stage of devotional service in the human form of life. According to the Vedic system, therefore, from the very beginning of life the brahmacārya system is introduced so that from one's very childhood—from the age of five years—one can practice modifying one's human activities so as to engage perfectly in devotional service. As confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā, Chapter Two, verse 40, svalpam apy asya dharmasya trāyate mahato bhayāt: 'Even a little advancement on this path can protect one from the most dangerous type of fear.' Modern civilization, not referring to the verdicts of Vedic literature, is so cruel to the members of human society that instead of teaching children to become brahmacārīs, it teaches mothers to kill their children even in the womb, on the plea of curbing the increase of population. And if by chance a child is saved, he is educated only for sense gratification. Gradually, throughout the entire world, human society is losing interest in the perfection of life. Indeed, men are living like cats and dogs, spoiling the duration of their human lives by actually preparing to transmigrate again to the degraded species among the 8,400,000 forms of life.

Garden Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Nalinīkaṇṭha: "We see materialistic persons busily engaged in economic development all day and all night, trying to increase their material opulence, but even if we suppose that they get some benefit from such endeavors, that does not solve the real problem of their lives. Nor do they know what the real problem of life is. This is due to a lack of spiritual education. Especially in the present age, every man is in darkness, in the bodily conception of life, not knowing anything of the spirit soul and its needs. Misguided by the blind leaders of society, people consider the body to be everything, and they are engaged in trying to keep the body materially comfortable. Such a civilization is condemned because it does not lead humanity toward knowing the real goal of life. People are simply wasting time and the valuable gift of the human form, because a human being who does not cultivate spiritual life but dies like the cats and dogs is degraded in his next life. From human life, such a person is put into the cycle of continuous birth and death. Thus one loses the true benefit of human life, which is to become Kṛṣṇa conscious and solve life's problems."

Prabhupāda: Now discuss on this point amongst yourselves whether it is rightly said or wrong. If anyone has any objection. Yes?

Room Conversation -- June 10, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is wanted. Education means to understand that, what is the important thing within this body. Otherwise, cats and dogs, they are also working with the bodily concept of life. The dog is jumping, barking. He's thinking, "I'm dog, I'm this body."

Richard: Okay, as far as nurturing the body through knowledge, is the goal of what you teach to eliminate obstacles in...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Richard: That is the goal?

Prabhupāda: Everything is aimed at to eliminate obstacles. Now, so far the body is concerned, there are so many obstacles. Everyone is struggling hard, that is for struggle for existence, to get out of the obstacles. Whole struggle for existence is to save ourselves from the obstacles.

Interview with Jackie Vaughn (Black Congressman) -- July 12, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Everyone tries. That is not a particular job for you. Everyone is trying; the cats and dogs, they are also trying. The cat also very much anxious to give protection to the cubs, innocent, helpless. The dog also giving. The birds, they're bringing food for the offspring, and as soon as the mother comes, they become very much engladdened, "Oh, here is food, here is food." And they, with the mouth, they.... So this kind of sentiment is there even in the cats, dogs, animals, birds, beasts. That is natural. But we do not know how to do actual welfare activity. Somebody's engaged with his family. Somebody is engaged with his own body. Somebody.... This is only development of consciousness. The animals, they are interested with the body, himself. The human being, they are interested with the extension of the body. Just like I am alone now. Now when I become, you young men, then I have got my wife, then my interest is also for my wife. The wife's interest is for the husband. In this way, children, then interest extended, husband, wife, children. Then, this is family-wise. Then little advancement, of the society.

Garden Conversation -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Yad viditvā yaḥ prayāti sa brāhmaṇa, etad avidyāt yaḥ prayāti sa eva kṛpaṇaḥ. Read.

Jayādvaita: " 'He is a miserly man who does not solve the problems of life as a human and who thus quits this world like the cats and dogs, without understanding the science of self-realization.' This human form of life is a most valuable asset for the living entity, who can utilize it for solving the problems of life; therefore, one who does not utilize this opportunity properly is a miser. On the other hand, there is the brāhmaṇa..."

Prabhupāda: They do not know even what are the problems of life. People are so uneducated, they do not know even what are the problems of life. They do not know. What generally people think the problems of life?

Room Conversation with George Gullen, President of Wayne State University -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Everyone's body is temporary, either human body or cat's body, dog's body. But the human body is important because in the human body we have developed consciousness by which we can understand what is God. The cats and dogs, they cannot, they haven't got that developed consciousness. Therefore if we do not use this developed consciousness for understanding God and our relationship with Him, then we are no better than cats and dogs. Cats and dogs cannot be educated about God, but a human being can be educated. That is the distinction between animals and man. But modern education is keeping them in ignorance about God, so they are no better than cats and dogs. And how can you bring peace among cats and dogs? Can you bring in peace calling all the dogs of your city and sit down peacefully? No, that is not possible. So if we keep our citizens like cats and dogs, then how we can expect peace?

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: No, why deny the body? Just like you are putting some type of dress. So dress is not unimportant. But real importance is you, the person. So where is that education about the real person? They are simply engrossed with the dress. This is going on. Such kind of mentality is there even within the cats and dogs. He's also thinking "I am this body." If a human being does not understand this fact, that he is not this body, he is changing his body, but he is spirit soul, then he is no better than the cats and dogs. We do not want to keep the human society in the category of cats and dogs. We want to raise them to the real understanding of his identification. That is our mission. It is neither Hindu religion or Muslim religion or.... This is science.

Interview with Kathy Kerr Reporter from The Star -- June 17, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Yes. We must come to the correct position of our spiritual life, then it is perfection of life. Otherwise, they're ignorant. If the husband comes at home and the wife calls him by the name, "John, come here." "Oh, you are not addressing 'my lord,' " it will be ridiculous. He might be "my lord," in the court, but when he's in the family, the wife calls by the name. So our, with the change of dress we are changing our name, circumstances, thoughts, and everything. Therefore we find differentiation. American, Indian, Hindu, Muslim, black, white, this, these are all designation of the dress. And therefore we do not agree. As soon as I accept, identify myself with the dress, there will be disagreement. And as soon as we, everyone of us, we know that this is superficial, this is dress, I am spirit soul, then there will be agreement. Samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu, find out this verse. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu (BG 18.54). So without this understanding they have opened United Nations, keeping them cats and dogs.

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: I was talking of these cars. The dog is running on legs, and they are running on cars. So, (laughs) actually what is the difference? This is advancement of civilization, that the dog is running for nothing, here and there on legs, and human being is running on nice car. Does it mean there is advance in civilization? If we keep the human being like cats and dogs, without any advancement of knowledge, the cats and dogs, they cannot accept any advanced knowledge. That is not possible. Similarly, if human society is kept in darkness without any advanced knowledge, without any knowledge of the aim of life and without any knowledge what is the meaning of human life, they'll remain as cats and dogs. So as cats and dogs, if they are practiced to run here and there, either on legs or on cars, is that advancement of civilization?

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: No, that's not the fact. It is misunderstanding. We are actually struggling for achievement of the highest goal of life. Otherwise, why we are writing so many books? It is for the human beings. And they are being accepted. It is not for the cats and dog. This Bhāgavatam is not meant for the cats and dogs. So, vidyā bhāgavatāvadhi. In the beginning it is said, dharmaḥ projjhita-kaitavo 'tra paramo nirmatsarāṇāṁ satāṁ vedyaṁ vāstavam atra (SB 1.1.2). Atra śrīmad-bhāgavataṁ vāstava-vastu-vedyam, what is actual life. So we are struggling to give people what is actual life. Kṛṣṇa comes down to teach us what is actual life. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). When people become cats and dogs, dharmasya glāniḥ. Dharmasya glāniḥ means cats and dogs, because in the cats and dog society there is no question of dharma. They simply jump over and enjoy life. Eat, drink, be merry, enjoy eating, sleeping, sex and defense.

Interview with Professors O'Connell, Motilal and Shivaram -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: They simply jump over and enjoy life. Eat, drink, be merry, enjoy eating, sleeping, sex and defense. That's all. So if human life is also trained up in a polished way, the same principles, then where is the difference between cats and dogs? Dog is thinking, "I am this body, hound, greyhound," and barking, "gow, gow." Similarly, if we remain like that, in the bodily concept of life, that "I am this body," "I am Indian," "I am American," "I am Hindu," "I am Muslim," then where is the difference between dog and ourself? The human life is meant for understanding that I am neither Hindu nor Muslim nor American nor Indian. Ahaṁ brahmāsmi. That is beginning of life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. And what is Brahman? Then life begins. The cats and dogs, they cannot think that "I am not this body; I am spirit soul." That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. When Arjuna was thinking in the bodily concept of life, "My family, my brother," and so on, so on, so he declined to fight. So...

Morning Walk -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Prabhupāda: Machine. Yes. You pay and get cigarette and tin can. There are many boxes like that on the street, public street. And they pass urine on the road. There is no restriction, standing apart.

Hari-śauri: Like dogs and cats.

Prabhupāda: Every few steps, there is a shop, young girls, wine, and a man is sitting.

Hari-śauri: Germany is very famous for its beer festivals. Germany. It's very famous for it's beer festivals.

Prabhupāda: Beer. Yes. Sadānanda told me. He was drinking beer in barrels. (laughs) He told me.

Hari-śauri: They even have a mug so big that it takes one gallon of beer at a time.

Prabhupāda: And they drink.

Room Conversation -- June 18, 1976, Toronto:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: I remember in South Africa though, Prabhupāda, you called them, (laughs) at every meeting, dogs and cats. And afterward they were always applauding. (claps)

Hari-śauri: He did that, (laughing) you did that in South India as well.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: I think that...

Prabhupāda: No, no, when I come into emotion, I cannot check to speak the truth. But actually it is the fact. I cannot give any credit to these rascals (laughs) who are running at high speed, big, big car.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: What did we read? There was an article about Mars today.

Hari-śauri: Oh. Nonsense.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: The scientists, again...

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That is my question. Where is that full advantage? They are remaining in the darkness. Why do you trust, first of all. Why do you trust? So many questions there are. Why you are prepared to trust in God? If I ask, you must answer. If you cannot answer, then you are ass. It is good, even without knowing, but when the slogan comes from the government side, there must be full knowledge. Otherwise, the government is as good as common man. The government should be full of intelligent men. Why vote is there? You select an intelligent man. Otherwise, anyone can go. Cats and dogs, they also can go. Why the voting system? That you select some intelligent man. So if you cannot answer your slogan, then you are not intelligent, you are unfit.

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That means you are cats and dogs. The dog has no inquisitiveness. Therefore you are no better than the dog. The dog never comes to a spiritual master, "Give me some knowledge." Therefore you are as good as the dog. That is your qualification.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: So all different aspects of material knowledge...

Prabhupāda: You have to learn from a superior person.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But now there is distinction between two types of knowledge. If knowledge means understanding...

Garden Conversation -- June 22, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Difference is it is Kṛṣṇa's desire. He wants that "Don't remain like cats and dogs. Be intelligent and come back to Me." Kṛṣṇa says sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekam śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). So it is the duty of a devotee of Kṛṣṇa to spread this knowledge so that they may take to Kṛṣṇa. The cats and dogs, they cannot understand, but those who are two-legged cats and dogs, (laughs) they can understand. That is the advantage, because they have got two legs. So long they had four legs (laughing) they could not understand. So here is a chance, two-legged, so give them some opportunity. That's all. (long pause) You grow bitter melon also here?

Garden Conversation -- June 23, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: We are no more interested in unnecessary things. Illicit sex—one side they are encouraging contraceptive method, so why they'll not stop illicit sex, then automatically there is contraceptive method? So one side there is encouraged, contraceptive method, another, unlimited, unrestricted sex. This is their civilization. Why not teach him not to practice illicit sex? Then everything is done automatically. There's no need of contraceptive method. If one is trained up to indulge in sex only for begetting nice children, there is already contraceptive method. There is no necessity of unnecessarily producing cats and dogs children. So that requires training, determination. The śāstra says you should not become father if you cannot train up your children to save him from death. Who is the father who's training? To save him from the cycle of birth and death means to make him Kṛṣṇa conscious. So if you are not yourself Kṛṣṇa conscious, how you can train up your children to become Kṛṣṇa conscious?

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: They'll understand. I'm just pointing out the difficulties of your preaching. You'll have to face all these difficulties. They're like cats and dogs. They are not even human beings. Therefore the business is little hard job. You have to deal with cats and dogs. But still there is hope, because they have got this human form of life. There is hope. It is not hopeless. Don't be disappointed, but this is the job. You have to meet with cats and dogs. That is my point. When you go to preach you must know that "I've come to preach among cats and dogs, and I have to deal with them carefully; otherwise, they will bark." (laughter) Therefore I wrote that poetry in disappointment before entering in your country, that "What they will understand, this philosophy?" Hmm, go on.

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: "In this Sixteenth Chapter the Lord explains both the transcendental nature and its attendant qualities as well as the demoniac nature and its qualities. He also explains the advantages and disadvantages of these qualities. The word abhijātasya in reference to one born of transcendental qualities or godly tendencies is very significant. To beget a child in a godly atmosphere is known in the Vedic scriptures as garbhādhāna-saṁskāra. If the parents want a child in the godly qualities they should follow the ten principles of the human being. In Bhagavad-gītā we have studied also before that sex life for begetting a good child is Kṛṣṇa Himself. Sex life is not condemned provided the process is used in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Those who are in Kṛṣṇa consciousness at least should not beget children like cats and dogs but should beget them so they may become Kṛṣṇa conscious after birth. That should be the advantage of children born of a mother or father absorbed in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. The social institution known as varṇāśrama dharma, the institution dividing society into four divisions or castes, is not meant to divide human society according to birth. Such divisions are in terms of educational qualifications. They are to keep the society in a state of peace and prosperity. The qualities mentioned herein are explained as transcendental qualities meant for making a person progress in spiritual understanding so he can get liberated from the material world."

Prabhupāda: So where is that institution to train people to acquire these transcendental qualities? There is no such institution. We are attempting to qualify the man in transcendental qualities. This is the only institution. Otherwise, where it is? I don't think, throughout the whole world, there is any institution to train the students in transcendental qualities. Who cares for transcendental qualities? Go on.

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Naṣṭātmānaḥ, they have lost their self. Naṣṭātmāno alpa-buddhayaḥ. A rascal, no intelligence. Just like cats and dogs. If these four principles are available, bas, finished. Life is perfect success. Eating, sleeping, mating. Alpa-buddhayaḥ, animal. Then?

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Prabhavanty.

Prabhupāda: Prabhavanty.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: Ugra-karmāṇaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Ugra-karmāṇaḥ, the factory. This is ugra-karma. Pradyumna was describing ugra-karma, hellish. Little karma, just wheat is growing, a little tilling, that is sufficient. What is the use of opening big, big factory? Ugra-karma. What it has helped? You were talking on behalf of them. What it has helped? Keeping them. Innocent men, women, they are kept in that factory simply for livelihood. A little work will provide his needs. Nature has given so much facility. They can grow little food anywhere. The cows are there in the pasturing ground. Take milk and live peacefully. Why you open factories? What is the use? Keeping them in hellish condition of life. So this is the description. Now discuss these points.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That is going on. Ask any religious system what is the conception of God. Can anyone tell clearly? Nobody can say. We shall immediately say, veṇuṁ kvaṇantam aravinda-dalāyatākṣaṁ barhāvataṁsam asitāmbuda-sundarāṅgam (Bs. 5.30). Aṅgāni yasya sakalendriya-vṛttimanti... immediately description, "Here is God." Then there is religion. And if there is no God, where is religion? Bogus. Therefore declining. They have no conception of God, and therefore there is no understanding of religion. Therefore it is declining. So this is the cause of declining. And because it is declining, human being becoming more animals. Animal means there will be no memory. A dog comes... Here is some eatables. He comes. I say, "Hut!" He goes away. Again he comes. No memory. So when this memory is reducing that means human quality is reduced. So in the Kali-yuga these eight things will reduce. That means they are becoming like cats and dogs. This is the answer to the first question.

Answers to a Questionnaire from Bhavan's Journal -- June 28, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: You have to stop. You cannot say, "I have to leave by this time. I must go." No. You must. That is tapasya. So tapasya means to follow the regulative principles strictly by the higher order and that is human life. And animal life means you can do whatever you like. They keep to the right, keep to the left, it doesn't matter. But their offense is not taken because they are animals. But a human being, if he does not follow the regulative principles, it is sinful. He'll be punished. The same principle. Just like when there is red light, if you do not stop, you'll be punished. But a cat and dog, if he transgresses, "Never mind red light, I shall go," he's not punished. So tapasya is meant for the human being. He must do it if he wants at all progress of life. That is essential.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: In terms of diet, dietary regulations, eating...

Prabhupāda: That is also tapasya. That is also tapasya. Just like we are prohibiting meat-eating. So in your country this is little troublesome. From the very beginning of his life he is, I mean to say, habituated to eat meat. The mother purchases powdered meat and mix with... I have seen it. And by force. So he has been trained up eating meat, and I say, "Don't eat meat." So therefore that is troublesome. And if he's serious, he must accept the order. That is tapasya. Tapasya means in diet, in practice, in behavior, in dealing, and so on, so on. Everything there is tapasya. That is all described.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Dhana means money. So if you have got money, then everyone will respect you. Personally you may be less than a dog, but because you have got money, people will respect you. Is it not? (laughs) In England I was guest in John Lennon's house. He has taken a photograph, naked. And he's a big man. He gives opinion to the newspaper reporter. People go there to take his opinion about some serious subject, and he speaks, and the man is so shameless that he is standing naked, and he's important man—because he has got money. Especially in the Western countries this is very prominent. If you have got money, then you have got everything. Therefore they are after money only, that "If some way or other, if I get money, then I get everything. I get respect, I get honor. I get everything. Bring money somehow or other." This is the attempt. Therefore there is so much hard struggle. From early in the morning, four o'clock, they are going to the office to get money. To get more money, more money, that is the Western civilization. Now in India they have also learned. And our philosophy is "Don't try to get money." Tasyaiva hetoḥ prayeteta. "You should simply engage your life for advancing your Kṛṣṇa consciousness." So who will hear us? We say, "There is no need of working so hard for money." Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kaṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). This kind of working hard is done by the hogs and dogs, so why a human being should work so hard simply to get the necessities of life? (break) ...and dogs, they are getting necessities of life in that way. (break) This association, this meeting, this talking, is meant for the human body; it is not for the cats and dogs.

Room Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: I was surprised that "How Ṛṣi Kumāra can fall down like this?" I had so confidence of this boy from the very beginning. He was so nice, so pure. And māyā is so strong. But could not do very well, māyā, very long. Thank Kṛṣṇa and... So stay with us. Kaunteya pratijānīhi na me bhaktaḥ praṇaśyati (BG 9.31). This is Kṛṣṇa's mercy, special mercy. So always be calm and chant and pray to Kṛṣṇa. Don't spoil this life. It is so valuable. Viṣayaḥ khalu sarvataḥ syāt. The sense gratification can be available in every life, cats and dogs also. Why should we sacrifice the greatest boon of human life? Hare Kṛṣṇa. So how are you?

Rādhāvallabha: Very good, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: What news?

Rādhāvallabha: Seven-three was sent to the printer.

Morning Walk -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Hari-śauri: They have hospitals for animals, if your animal gets sick.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Mostly dogs and cats, birds.

Hari-śauri: The animal that was making the noise was the man on the porch. (laughs)

Vipina: Many people have horses in the neighborhood. They have horse shows, Śrīla Prabhupāda. They spend lots of money on fancy horses, and in this way, one becomes greater than another by showing his horses. (break)

Prabhupāda: ...slam the door. The door is secure or not? (break) ...trying to find out that happiness from this body, that is mistake. That happiness is there in the spirit soul, not this body. Happiness is our right. Ānandamayo 'bhyāsāt (Vedānta-sūtra 1.1.12). By nature, we want happiness. Mistaking, where is the happiness. The living being, he is to enjoy happiness. But they are trying to give happiness to the body, which is dead. Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ (BG 2.11). The body is dead from the very beginning, but they are trying to draw happiness from the dead matter.

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that petrol. But what was the purpose? The purpose was little sense gratification, "I shall see something illuminating." What was other purpose? No purpose. Simply to satisfy the eyes, to see something illuminating. That is one sense, eyes. Then there are other senses. They also want satisfaction. There are hands, there are legs, there are tongue, eyes, ears, nose. So every one, every one of these senses, they are engaged for sense satisfaction. So this is the life. But that sense satisfaction is differently exhibited for different bodies. Just like this firework, it was interesting to the human being. Human being has got a particular type of body, so it is interested to see the firework. But the cats and dogs, they are not interested. They do not know what is fireworks. They, while we are interested to see the firework, a hog may be interested to eat stool.

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Sometimes the human body machine, sometimes dog machine, sometimes cat machine, sometimes demigod machine. We are desiring all these things. American machine, Indian machine. When you are in Indian machine you are thinking "I am Indian. My business is to satisfy Indian interests." You Americans are thinking "This is American machine; it should be used for America's benefit." These are upādhi. Upādhi means designation. Neither I am Indian nor American nor cat nor dog. But as soon as I get a particular type of body, I think that I am cat, I am dog, I am Indian, I am America, I am black, I am white, this. This is our position. And people are struggling on this understanding, "I am this body." So long we think like that, "I am this body," we are no better than cats and dogs. He is also thinking "I am this body." Is it not? What do you think, Mr. Sukla? If I think I am this body, the dog is also thinking "I am this body," then where is the difference between the dog and me? What do you think, Mr... How shall I address you?

Conversation with Prof. Saligram and Dr. Sukla -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: We take bitter medicine just to cure our existence. Similarly, at the present moment, our existence is impure. Therefore we have to accept birth, death, old age and disease on account of impure existence. Otherwise, we are spirit soul, we are eternal, na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). So we are not in eternal existence, we are temporary existence. We have got this body, it will be finished. Then we have to accept another body, tatha dehāntara praptir. Then again you live in that body for some time, and again the body is finished. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). So this is going on. This is impure stage of our existence. So we have to purify it. Therefore to purify it tapasya required. Tapo divyaṁ yena śuddhyed sattvam (SB 5.5.1). The tapasya required. That tapasya has to be given lesson, trained up. Kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha (SB 7.6.1). That is brahmacārī system, to understand the value of life. These things are lacking in the present civilization, but it is essential. Without this, there is no meaning of human life. Then it is cats' and dogs' life. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13).

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Everyone is engaged in his occupational duties. Everyone is engaged. Generally according to Vedic civilization, the society is divided into eight divisions. Varṇāśrama-dharma it is called-four varṇas and four āśramas. Materially, four varṇas: brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. And spiritually, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa. These eight divisions. So according to these eight divisions, everyone has an occupational duty. So what is the duty and how the duty is perfected? That is hari-toṣaṇam, to satisfy the Supreme Personality of Godhead. That people do not know. Especially at the present moment, they do not know who is Hari and they do not know how to please Him. That is the defect of the modern civilization, that they do not care to know who is God and how to satisfy Him. That is the defect. The life is meant for, human life, for satisfying God. That is going on under religious system, and the Vedic civilization is called varṇāśrama-dharma. Dharma is not a kind of faith, religion is not a kind of faith, but it is a duty, varṇāśrama-dharma. So that duty we are forgetting. And therefore we are coming to the level of animals. Because the cats and dogs, they have no duty-animal. But human being has an obligation, a duty to understand God and to satisfy Him. That is human life. Without this knowledge, without this performance of duty, human life is on the level of animals. There are many other verses in this connection. Where are others? They are not present here?

Evening Darsana -- July 7, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: So this human life, you can make your selection. After all, you have to change your body, that is compulsory. Nobody can remain here with this body, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi (BG 13.9). And we have to change our body. So we can make our selection, where we shall go next, either in the higher planetary system or the Pitṛloka or we shall remain here or we can go even back to home, back to Godhead. So we must prepare ourselves for that purpose. Then next life we can go wherever we like. But anywhere within this material world, there are four principles, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. There is birth, there is death, there is old age and disease. But if you go to the spiritual kingdom, there is no more such things, no birth, no death, no disease, no old age. Now we can make our selection. And if we do not make our selection, if we live like cats and dogs, without any responsibility, then again we become in the category of cats and dogs. Mūḍha, janmani janmani (BG 16.20), life after life, they remain like animals, without any knowledge.

Evening Darsana -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: All intelligent persons, they should join this movement and reform the present social, political, religious. All field of activities, they should reform. Then people will be happy. Not only happy in this life, but also next life. Unfortunately, the present education does not provide knowledge of next life. There is no such education. They are kept in darkness like cats and dogs. They do not know that there is life after death, and we get our next life according to our present activities—karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa (SB 3.31.1). These things are unknown. Very risky life. If I am prime minister in this life or president, and if I am going to become a dog next life, then what is the benefit of becoming prime minister or president? And nature's law is that you get your next life according to the mentality at the time of death. So if I have acted like cats and dogs throughout whole life, naturally I shall think like cats and dogs at the time of death. Then next life is cats and dogs.

Interview and Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: No. Materially they may be doing some improvement, but that is not spiritually important. Just like I give sometimes this example: just like a dog, animal, is jumping with four legs on the street, and we are going fast with four wheels, so that does not make any difference. The difference is the dog cannot understand about his spiritual identity. A man can understand if he's properly trained up. If the man is denied that facility, then he remains in the ignorance of an animal like cats and dogs.

Janice Johnson: I'd like to know, this is your first visit to Washington? Is that right?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Interview and Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: No, we can live on the street, but you cannot come and see on the street. For you we have arranged. That is the... We can live underneath a tree. That is a... But that does not make any difference. Our point is that you may live materially comfortably—there is no harm—but if you forget your spiritual identity, then you'll remain like animal. Just like sometimes a cat or dog is also allowed to sit on the couch, but that does not mean he has become a human being. He remains a cat and dog because the consciousness is lacking of a human being. In this seat there may be some bugs. So the bug is also living on this couch, but he has no understanding.

Interviewer: What is your opinion of what this movement should be doing in terms of world activities and world affairs that it isn't doing now? Are there some new areas that you may try to influence?

Evening Darsana -- July 11, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Therefore we shall keep it dusty. If our heart is full of dust, cleanse it. That is intelligence. What is this, "My heart is dirty, let it be kept as dirty"? No, if it is dirty, cleanse it. It is the duty of every Indian to understand Kṛṣṇa and preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement to others. That is real Indian business. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission, that every one of you become Kṛṣṇa conscious and preach this Kṛṣṇa consciousness to others who are unaware of Kṛṣṇa. That is the injunction; that is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's mission. He said bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra (CC Adi 9.41). Anyone who has taken birth in India as a human being—not as dogs manuṣya, manuṣya means human—his duty is to become Kṛṣṇa conscious and preach to the other people for welfare activities. Bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra (CC Adi 9.41). We should mark this point, manuṣya-janma. He's not requesting the cats and dogs.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: They will say that is... Whatever they... Foolishly whatever they may say, then let them say. Actually he doesn't like to die. Otherwise let there be fire, why you called fire brigade? Let me die peacefully in the fire. (laughter) Nonsense he's suffering, but still he says there is no suffering. That is nonsense. That is ignorance. He's suffering every moment, but he does not know why he's suffering. That is ignorance. Just like an animal, you are taking into the slaughterhouse. He's suffering, he's screaming, but he does not know why you have taken to slaughterhouse (indistinct). And that is animal life. And when there will be question of why I am suffering? I did not want this fire, why there is fire? That is perfection (indistinct). Is there any solution? Then there is human life. And if he remains like animal, and simply try to make some remedial measures... He's suffering undoubtedly, but because he does not take it seriously, therefore he's animal. Animal does not take seriously why he's suffering. That is the distinction between human life and animal life. Suffering is there, but the animal does not take it seriously. But human life must take it seriously otherwise he's an animal. There are so many sufferings. This is adhibhau... adhidaivika. Adhidaivika: by—you say accident—by nature, by superior power. Some miserable condition is enforced upon us. Suppose if there is an earthquake, that is not in your hand, but it may cause some havoc. This is adhidaivika. Similar, adhibhautika: Suffering caused by other living entities. And adhyātmika, suffering caused by this body and mind. So suffering is always there, but we are suffering, we have been accustomed to suffer. But when the question is that why I am suffering, whether there is any remedy? That is human life. Otherwise, the animal life. That is the distinction between animal and human life. If there is fire, and there are animals only, dogs and cats, they cannot call fire brigade.

Morning Walk -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: "If I could produce Kṛṣṇa conscious children, I am prepared to produce hundreds of children." What is the use of producing children like cats and dogs? Produce children like Prahlāda Mahārāja. The whole world will be benefited. Ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca. (break) Progeny, that is not condemned. Why it should be condemned? Let there be pregnancy, but Kṛṣṇa conscious. That, our Pradyumna's son, these, all children.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Aniruddha.

Prabhupāda: Very nice. They should be trained up properly. Special care should be taken. That is the idea of my Guru Mahārāja, a Gurukula. Gurukula, we are not going to make some big, big scholars. We don't require scholars. We require ideal men by character, by behavior, by Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Not by studying grammar. There are many grammarians. Let them study our books nicely, English, little Sanskrit, that's all. Gurukula organize like that. We don't want big, big scholars. Unnecessarily.

Conversation After Interview with Religious Editor, Associated Press -- July 16, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: There is no need of hundreds of rascal child, children. One is sufficient. Varam eka. Varaṁ guṇī-putra, he must be qualified. And who is guṇī, who is a devotee and learned scholar. Ko'ta putreṇa jātena, yo na vidyā na bhaktimān(?). What is the use of such rascal child if he's not a devotee, neither learned? Khanena cakṣuṣā kiṁ cakṣuḥ pīḍaiva kevalam.(?) What is the use of blind eyes? It is simply troublesome. So let there be one child, but he must be like Prahlāda, like Dhruva Mahārāja, and then child production is beneficial. Otherwise, if we beget children like cats and dogs, what is the use? That is Cāṇakya Paṇḍita's instruction. Another example is given: ekaś candras tamo hanti na ca tārā-sahasrasaḥ. If there is one moon in the sky, it is sufficient to give light to the whole sky. What is the use of millions of stars? So, it is very good that you can take care of one child and make him a great devotee and learned scholar. Then it is successful. So Dr. Bhagat, I get some pain.

Morning Walk -- July 20, 1976, New York:

Hari-śauri: He's bringing it. He's bringing it up to this road here, Śrīla Prabhupāda. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: ...dogs and cats.

Prabhupāda: Not cows.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No, no, cows are meant for eating, for food. It's all about dogs.

Rāmeśvara: So no woman who is married should work with the Deities unless her husband is right there? What if the husband is a book distributor? (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That walking place?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Conversation at House of Ksirodakasayi dasa -- July 25, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: That is the only business. Other business, they are subsidiary. They are not very important business. Why Kṛṣṇa understanding is important business? Because it will give you liberation from this material condition life. We are foolishly thinking we are very independent, we can do whatever we like, but that is not the fact. The fact is we are completely dependent on the laws of material nature. Even if you defy a little bit, immediately you'll be punished. That is the strict laws of nature. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). So we do not understand. There is no education throughout the whole world how we are being controlled by the material nature and why we are being controlled. Why we are put into this position of being controlled? These questions should be raised. That is human life. Otherwise it is animal life. The cats and dogs, they cannot inquire, "Why I am being controlled?" But they agree to be controlled. But human life there is struggle. They are called struggle for existence.

Conversation at House of Ksirodakasayi dasa -- July 25, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). This is our conditional life, but we are kept in such dense darkness of knowledge that we are thinking that "We are free. We can do whatever we like." This is very dangerous civilization—no knowledge of the spiritual life, no knowledge how the soul is transmigrating from one body to another, no knowledge what is the future, no knowledge what is the goal of life. Simply like cats and dogs, you dance, eat, drink, be merry and die, that's all. This is not good life. You must be very serious, especially those who are Indians. They should take it very seriously. Because this Kṛṣṇa culture, Bhagavad-gītā, was spoken in the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra in India, and we Indians, we do not take full advantage of this great transcendental knowledge, then you are committing suicide. So my request is, all the Indians who are here in this foreign country, keep your own original culture. Don't forget. Don't be bewildered. Be in your position. Try to under... It is very easy. Bhagavad-gītā is not at all difficult to understand, and we have tried to explain as easy as possible, not that we have deviated from the original verse, just like others do it. We do not do that; there is no need.

Radio Interview -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Misunderstanding. The whole civilization, the modern civilization, is going on misunderstanding. Dehātma-buddhiḥ —just like cats and dogs. Suppose if you become very proud, "I am Englishman. Why you have come here?" As the dogs bark, "Row! Row! Why you have come?" So where is the difference? What is the difference? He's thinking "I am dog," you are thinking "Englishman," I am thinking "Indian." There is no difference. So if we keep people in darkness of dog's mentality, and declare we are advanced in civilization, most misguiding.

Mike Robinson: I see. And so when people are taught, they will then understand. But what I'd also like to know, how would it affect the way they live? In sort of purely..., the way they go about their life.

Room Conversation -- July 27, 1976, London:

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Bhagavān: "He's going to die one day. So you wait. Now, in the meantime, you can eat cats and dogs."

Jayatīrtha: While waiting for the cows to die.

Prabhupāda: Yes, cats and dogs they are eating. Yes. Hong Kong. they are eating. Who said that one gentleman came to Hong Kong hotel? Eh?

Hari-śauri: One of the devotees in America. Some man came with his pet dog. So in America they tie up the dogs outside the restaurant, so he did that and he went in. And then he pointed, he showed the doorman his dog, meaning that he was liable to look after him. So after he'd eaten his meal he went out and his dog was gone. So after some inquiry they found out that when he showed the doorman the dog, he misunderstood and thought that he wanted to eat it, that he was bringing his lunch with him, so he took the dog and killed it and served him. He ate his dog.

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Berkeley. Very horrible condition. Let them do whatever they like, you live apart from them. Live peacefully in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Be happy. Let these cats and dogs go to hell; what can be done? We are trying to educate them as far as possible, but if they do not take it, that is their business. We are doing our duty, going door to door, "Read these books. If you like, you can come and live with us." What we can do more? We do not make any condition, that if you live with us you have to fulfill. Of course, the condition is that you should not act sinfully. That is the first condition. But we never say that you have to pay so many dollars. Come. Whatever little food we have got, we shall share. So try to understand the importance of this movement. Kṛṣṇa is giving us. This is a first-class place. You can develop it into a Vaikuṇṭha.

Room Conversation -- August 2, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: Oh, give them this garland. (break) ...he begins with surrender. Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). So anyone who voluntarily offers obeisances, immediately he becomes fifty percent advanced. Because.... Who is talking? This material world means nobody wants to surrender. Everyone wants to become master: "I am the monarch of all I survey." Everyone is planning how to become a master. Therefore the struggle for existence. Nobody wants to become a servant. You know very well in European history, Napoleon wanted to become the master of all Europe. Hitler wanted also. Similarly, there were so many leaders, sometimes Roman leaders, sometimes Greek leaders, sometimes French leaders, sometimes German leaders, English leader. The whole European history is full of fighting, war. The basic idea is that everyone wanted to become master. That is the material disease. We are now discussing Bali Mahārāja. He also wanted to become master of the whole universe. So that is the material disease. Actually, master is one, Kṛṣṇa. There cannot be two masters. There is only one master, that is Kṛṣṇa, or God. But in the material world, because we have forgotten the real master, every one of us is trying to become master. This is material disease. Not only in one life, but life after life. The cats and dogs, they also want to be master.

Room Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: But we do not deprecate. We simply say that do whatever you like, but do not forget your real business, self-realization, ātma-tattvam. Self-realization, that is required. And if we live like cats and dogs and again become cats and dogs and pigs, that is not success. But there is chance if one does not know ātma-tattva. Nature's law will work. Kāraṇaṁ guṇa-saṅgo 'sya sad-asad-yoni-janmasu (BG 13.22). Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, your son is sleeping?

Ātreya Ṛṣi: No, this is not my son.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Ātreya Ṛṣi: This is salt, Śrīla Prabhupāda. This is watermelon, this is a different kind of melon. You prefer it here?

Evening Conversation -- August 8, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: Goal is there, because spirit is important. Without spirit, matter has no value. This is a material box, but because it has no spirit, it has no value. It has value, comparatively, but not as valuable as a human being because there is no spirit. You can move, if you like, you can go immediately, but this, for many thousands of years it will lie down here. It cannot move. Because there is no spirit. Therefore spirit is important. So this distinction is possible to understand in the human form of body. What is the distinction between a human being or a living man and this box? The distinction is that the living being has the spirit soul within and the box has no spirit soul within. Now if we take care of this box outwardly, that we should take; similarly if you take care of the body only, then where is spiritual culture? If you take care of the four principles of bodily necessities, eating, sleeping and sex and defense, then where is spiritual culture? The aim should be spiritual culture, at least for human beings. The cats and dogs, they cannot understand what is the distinction between spirit and soul, er, spirit and matter, but a human being can understand.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: No, we do not say about religion. We are talking of science. It will take three millions of years to understand religion for these rascals. They are now animals. Religion is not so easy thing to be understood by the cats and dogs. Religion is meant for the human being. In the human society there is religion, not in the dog society or the cats and dogs. They do not understand religion means they are cats and dogs, they are not human beings. Human being is that: athāto brahma jijñāsā, to inquire about the nature of God. That is human being. Otherwise cats and dogs.

Morning Walk -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: One becomes qualified by one stroke of bhakti to Vāsudeva. Just like the sunrise immediately dissipates the fog. Aghaṁ dhunvanti kārtsnyena nīhāram iva bhāskaraḥ. In the Kali-yuga, this one item of bhakti can make one perfectly fit candidate to pass the examination. Aghaṁ dhunvanti kārtsnyena nīhāram iva bhāskaraḥ. What is this nonsense life? There is no tapasya, no spiritual culture, simply like cats and dogs. Last night I was reading. Vāmanadeva created a planet, Sutala, in which Viśvakarmā was ordered to construct big, big houses, palaces, better than in the heavenly planet. And these rascals are going and seeing simply rocks and sand. And what about these palaces and...?

Garden Conversation -- October 14, 1976, Chandigarh:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is ajñāna. So long you are identifying with the body, you are no better than the animal. So we are doing that. We are fighting. "I am Indian. You are Englishman. You are this. You are that. You are..." Simply we are fighting, like cats and dogs, they fight. So that is ajñāna. How you can be prasannātmā? So when one becomes actually situated in spiritual life, brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā (BG 18.54). That is the... In this way when you make further progress, when you actually understand that you are eternal servant of God, then you surrender. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate (BG 7.19). This situation takes many, many births to cultivate. And when he actually understands, jñānavān—not fools, rascals—then māṁ prapadyate, vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ (BG 7.19). That mahātmā is very rare to be found.

Garden Conversation -- October 14, 1976, Chandigarh:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So if we do not take advantage of the opportunity of understanding my identification, then we are committing suicide, jumping like cats and dogs, that's all. Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). Such persons have been described as go-kharaḥ. Go means cows, and khara means ass.

Indian man (3): Khara means?

Prabhupāda: Ass. I think this khara is word is used by Urdu. Phir vamusthi vrsti kharaḥ. (little discussion in Urdu or Hindi)

Prabhupāda: Sa eva go-kharaḥ (SB 10.84.13). One who identifies his body.

Indian man (5): Mūḍha, you explained last night.

Press Interview -- October 16, 1976, Chandigarh:

Prabhupāda: That Supersoul is—the distinction between soul and the Supersoul is this, that we are individual soul.... I know about the pains and pleasure of my body, you know the pains and pleasure of your body, but I do not know the pains and pleasure of your body, you do not know the pains or pleasure of my body. The Supersoul, He knows the pains and pleasure of all bodies. That is the distinction. Ātmā, Paramātmā. So these things can be understood in the human form of life. The cats and dogs, they cannot understand. If we want to educate the cats and dogs that "My dear dog, you are not this body. You are different from this body. You are spirit soul, Brahman," he has no capacity to understand. And a human being, however fallen he may be, if he is educated, he can understand about the position of spirit soul and how to become free from this material bondage.

Press Interview -- October 16, 1976, Chandigarh:

Prabhupāda: It is not religion. I have already explained. Did you not mark that this is spiritual knowledge? You are combination of spirit and matter. The spirit I have already explained. And if you don't take care of the spirit portion then you are making suicide. You are losing the opportunity of your human life. It is essential. One should be cognizant of the spiritual necessity of life. Otherwise, you are losing the opportunity of this human form of life. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. Then you remain as cats and dogs and there is risk, very risky life. Tathā dehāntara-prāptir. You do not know what kind of body you are going to get next life. It is essential. You must be prepared... (break) ...body, but you do not know what kind of body you are going to accept. That knowledge is lacking.

Room Conversation on New York court case -- November 2, 1976, Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: How they can defeat us? We have got so solid ground. How they can defeat, these rascals? We consider them simply rascals and fools. And we call them rascals and fools. What do they know of religion? What do they know of God? They know slaughterhouse and killing and illicit sex, and killing the fetus. That's all. What do they know? They are not even civilized. We have come to make them civilized. They should understand. They are not civilized. They do not (know) how to eat even. The first principle of life is eating. They do not know how to eat. We are teaching them how to eat. They simply challenge, that's... When men are uncivilized, they do not how to grow food, they kill animals in the jungle and eat. When they are civilized, they know how to grow food now and the nice food grains, fruit, flowers, now why should say, "You eat the meat." The meat-eating is meant for the most uncivilized persons. That means they do not know even how to eat. They do not know how to eat. How to eat, how to sleep, how to have sex. Nothing. They're having sex like cats and dogs.

Room Conversation -- November 11, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, always think of Kṛṣṇa. That's all.

Manīṣā: Yes, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: This is our business. The cats and dogs cannot do this. That is the advantage of human form of body.

Antardhyāna: Jaya, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Manīṣā: Jaya, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Manīṣā: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (end)

Press Conference -- December 16, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is desirable in human. Otherwise the animals are in darkness. They do not know what is God. But a human being, because he has got this human form of body, he can come to the light. So all the śāstras are for the human being, not for the cats and dogs. So if you do not take advantage of the śāstras, then you remain in the darkness. This is our position. The light is here. Just like apart from all other śāstras, if you take Bhagavad-gītā, it is the very brilliant light. It is not that changing. Five thousand years ago Kṛṣṇa said, what, that is still the same thing. Just like light. Millions of years ago, what was sun, the same sun is there. In the light there is no change. In the darkness there is change. If we do not accept the standard knowledge of Bhagavad-gītā, then we shall continue to remain in darkness and there will be no solution of the problems of life.

Room Conversation with Indian Man -- December 22, 1976, Poona:

Indian man: It is negation of sex.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Otherwise sex life is there in the cats and dogs. If you are going to be a dog? You must act as a human being. This is to act as human being, that "I shall not become a father, my dear wife, you should not become a mother, if both of us are not expert how to save the death of our child." This is good sex life. If you are not expert to execute this scientific method, that is bad sex life. It is the dog's sex life.

Indian man: Has anybody practiced this type of sex?

Prabhupāda: Yes, there are so many. That is the Vedic civilization.

Room Conversation with Indian Man -- December 22, 1976, Poona:

Indian man: Such a supreme knowledge is there from our superior authorities. This knowledge is, we are not even able to follow.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That's a fact. Therefore people are coming out like cats and dogs. But here is Bhagavad-gītā. If you are guided by Bhagavad-gītā, then it is all right. But this question, next question you'll say that "How I can save?" That is answered in Bhagavad-gītā. How you can save? Now you say. You tell me what is that verse. How you can save your child from death?

Indian man: By realizing, by giving an education.

Prabhupāda: No, you try to quote the verse, what is the way.

Indian man: (laughing) I am a small fly before yourself. You are the ocean.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then let them come first of all. (laughter) There is no "if." There is sufficient place. Come. But nobody's coming. They want to see, "Let these white men come and we see." That's all. "We see the fun." This is going on. They are coming. They are disgusted. But we are not disgusted. That is the difficulty. Therefore I was speaking to this boy, "You are Englishman, you have come." It's a problem now in Māyāpur, here. And the government is after them as soon as three months pass. "Get out, get out, get out, get out." Then how shall I conduct my business? A big, big establishment. This is another problem. But Kṛṣṇa is doing His own business. But practically seeing. This is India's business. Bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra (CC Adi 9.41). Manuṣya-janma, not the cats and dogs, but those who have taken the human form. It is their business.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: When Kṛṣṇa was playing with His cowherd boys friend, so Śukadeva Gosvāmī said, "Who are these boys who are playing with Kṛṣṇa who is the source of brahma-sukha?" Brahma-sukhānubhūtyā. These boys are playing with another boy known as Kṛṣṇa. He is the source of brahma-sukhānubhūti. And dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ para-daivatena. Those who are devotees, for them He is the Supreme Lord. And māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa. And those who are under the influence of māyā, they are seeing He's an ordinary boy. But whatever He may be, these boys who are playing with him, sākaṁ vijahruḥ kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ (SB 10.12.11). After many, many lives acquisition of pious activities, now he has got this opportunity to play with this boy, the source of brahma-sukha. Itthaṁ brahma-sukhānubhūtyā. They are not playing with ordinary child. He is the source of brahma-sukha. This is the statement of Śukadeva Gosvāmī. So if we come to Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa is personally presenting Himself, that is Vedānta. Otherwise, bahūnāṁ janmanām... We have come to that point, but if we neglect, then it will take many, many births to come to that point. Because that is the ultimate. Unless we come to that point, to understand Kṛṣṇa, there is still scarcity of knowledge. And Kṛṣṇa says that "When there is scarcity of knowledge, then I appear." Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glānir bhavati bhārata (BG 4.7). When the scarcity of knowledge is polluted... Not only scarcity, but it is polluted. Glāniḥ. Yadā yadā hi dharmasya glāniḥ. This is dharma, to come to the perfect knowledge. Human being must come to the perfect knowledge, because this is a boon. Not the cats and dogs can understand. Human being.

Press Interview -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He is not a scholar. He's a rascal. We have to follow the ācāryas. The ācāryas never said. There are so many ācāryas. They never say. So, we have to follow, ācāryopāsanam, not the rascals. We cannot worship the rascals. Worship ācāryas. They are guide. So śāstra says... Find out sa evāyaṁ mayā te 'dya yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Purātanaḥ, Kṛṣṇa says that imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1), "I spoke this science to Vivasvān, the sun-god." So if you calculate sun, this sun, Vivasvān, is the father of Manu, Vaivasvata Manu. And if you take, calculate, it becomes forty millions of years. So this Bhagavad-gītā is spoken, according to the Bhagavad-gītā, according to the version of Kṛṣṇa, forty millions of years ago. Now He says that science was known to the people by paramparā. And that paramparā is lost somehow or other. Therefore as... (break) Suppose you are born in Bombay, but you do not know how the state is being managed, then what is my jñāna? If you do not know how the state is being managed then what is your jñāna? That jñāna is, dogs and cats, they have also jñāna. How to eat, how to sleep, how to use sex life, how to defend. This is not jñāna. Everyone knows it. If you know God, who is conducting the whole, that is jñāna. So if you do not know who is the supreme controller...

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That's all. He's a political leader.

Dr. Patel: But then he had a great burning desire to see that India be free of British purpose. He was a real nationalist...

Prabhupāda: That even cats and dogs, they also want that my cats be well fed and strong. That is not a very good position. And Bhagavad-gītā says aratiḥ putra-dāra-gṛhādiṣu. This is philosophy. And if one is attached to his homely happiness he's not even a man of knowledge.

Dr. Patel: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: When Vivekananda came back from foreign tours, he brought three women and one woman was intimately connected with him.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 3, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They have no time to waste time in that way. They must be inclined that "I must prepare something nice so that my husband, my children or my, all friends will be very pleased." That is their policy. I wanted that all our girls, they should be expert. And in America they are doing that. They should learn the art of cooking and prepare very nice foodstuffs, daily change of menu. And the children should be so trained up that no more birth. And that is life. They can produce hundreds of children, it doesn't matter, but must be responsible that "The children should be saved. This is the last birth, no more birth. I'll train the child in such a way that next life he's going to Kṛṣṇa, back to home, back to Godhead." That is parent's duty. Otherwise they should not become parent. That is contraceptive: "I am not fit to train my children in that way, so I shall not produce cats and dogs." This is life. Why shall I produce cats and dogs? And Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura was gṛhastha, he produced Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī.

Morning Walk -- January 6, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). But it is very difficult for the modern man to understand. They have been so poorly educated that it is very difficult. But this is the first beginning of knowledge and if we are in the conception that "I am this body and the body is everything," then we are no better that the cats and dogs. So this is a movement to raise people from the platform of cats' and dogs' life. It is little difficult but we have to do it. That is our mission, Caitanya Mahāprabhu, para-upakāra. They're living like cats and dogs, do something good for them so that they may live like actual human beings. This is our... So you kindly stay here for some days, read our books and if there is any question, doubt, I shall be very glad to enlighten you. But this is the fact, the whole world is misguided by the rascal leaders, I must say that. Andhā, andhā is the last word of rascaldom, andhā yathāndair upanīyamānā. If I say (to) somebody, "You are rascal." There is maybe, partially he may be intelligent.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is cure. This is cure. In the Vedas it is said, nityo nityānāṁ cetanaś cetānām eko yo bahūnāṁ vidadhāti kāmān. God is giving food to the cats and dogs. Nobody is starving. If you are starving, that is your blessing.

Guest (3): But then, Guruji, suppose you see somebody...

Prabhupāda: We do not suppose. We get the reference to the śāstra. That is our disease. We don't manufacture. We don't manufacture anything. Our point of view is if there is starvation, then we take it: mercy of Kṛṣṇa. Tat te nukampāṁ su-samīkṣamāṇo bhuñjāna evātma-kṛtaṁ vipākam (SB 10.14.8). When we are put into starvation, we take it: blessings of God. We don't complain, that "I did something wrong or there is something wrong, so God has put me into this position. It is His blessing." This is our view.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Night means ignorance, when one sleeps. Yes. And day is awakening. So what is day for the materialistic person, so that is night for the spiritualistic person. And what is day for the spiritualistic person, that is night for the... Just like a spiritualist person, he has sacrificed everything and he is after God, and they are thinking, "These rascals, unnecessarily, empty stomach, wasting, 'Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa,' chant." They are deriding. And he is thinking that "This rascal got this human form of body. Instead of spiritual culture, he's spoiling his life, cats and dogs." That means in the subject matter where the spiritualists were not interested, he is interested. And in the subject matter, the spiritual person, interested, he is not interested. This is day and night.

Room Conversation -- January 8, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No, it is literally, that yā niśā sarva-bhūtānāṁ tasyāṁ jāgarti saṁyamī. He, spiritualist person, he knows, that "What is the use of the sense gratification? The sense gratification is there in the cats and dogs. Why I am wasting in this way?" That is awakened. What is the difference? A man is having sex life in a very nice apartment, very decorated and nice cot. He is enjoying sex life, that "I am advanced civili..." And the dog is enjoying sex life on the street in presence of everyone. But the enjoyment of sex life is the same. There is no difference either for the dog or the man. So the spiritualistic man, he says that "Why shall I waste my time in sex enjoyment? This is enjoyed by the dogs and cats. I have got this human form of life for spiritual advancement." So saṁyamī: "Stop this nonsense. Let me cultivate spiritual life."

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: By nature's way, by evolutionary process, we get this human form of life. Bahūnāṁ janmanām ante (BG 7.19). Manuṣya, arthadam. Prahlāda Mahārāja says durlabhaṁ mānuṣaṁ janma. Such life, important life, they are wasting like cats and dogs. So this is education; this is advancement. People are not given the opportunity to utilize this valuable life for understanding higher things. This is plight of this civilization. They are growing like cats and dogs and dying like cats and dogs. And yathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13), and according to his work, he has to accept another body. That is nature's law. So in this life I am very big man, but by work, karmaṇā daiva netreṇa (SB 3.31.1), by superior administration, I have to accept a body of dog. Then what is the value of your being great now? That technology is unknown, although it is stated there in the Bhagavad-gītā. Everything is. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So Kṛṣṇa never says that "You'll get such and such body." Dehāntara. "You'll have to change the body." Now, suppose... There are 8,400,000 types of bodies. Suppose next time I become a tree. Then just see horrible position. Here is a tree. I am within this room, sitting so comfortably, and the tree is standing there. I can get that life also, karmaṇā, by my work. So this technology is unknown. And we are very much proud of advancement of knowledge. Boliye. Am I right or wrong?

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: Why? If he can produce many big men, he can have hundreds of women. But you cannot do that. Therefore you are restrained. You are bad. You better restrain. Don't have sex, because you'll produce cats and dogs. But one who is able to produce great brain, great philosophers, he should produce hundreds. You do not know how to produce good brain. Therefore you stop! Don't produce cats and dogs. For you it is "Stop." You do not know how to use sex. Therefore you should stop. (break) You should not any more use sex. But one who can produce better brains should have hundreds of times. You must know how to produce. That is Vedic civilization, dharmaḥ saṁskāra idam...(?) It is not a secrecy, how to produce brain. And because brain is not produced, therefore there is agitation, that they have no brain. They do not know the value of this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement. You have been produced like cats and dogs; therefore you cannot appreciate.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: That picture is in his sitting room. I was talking with him in his sitting room, and fireplace and... Of course, that Chandler Place(?), a very big and glorious picture.

Hari-śauri: Cats and dogs.

Rāmeśvara: That's changed. America has given that up a little bit. They do not have these big gatherings anymore. The hippie movement in America is stopped.

Prabhupāda: What is the next movement?

Hari-śauri: Hare Kṛṣṇa. (laughs)

Rāmeśvara: Hare Kṛṣṇa. They're just waiting now. They are waiting for something to happen.

Conversation on Train to Allahabad -- January 11, 1977, India:

Prabhupāda: No, it is... They are saved from becoming like you or hippies. You'll become hippie after going to the college, so they are saved. You'll become naked and you'll have, like cats and dogs, sex on the street. But these children are saved.

Rāmeśvara: But what if they change later on in their life?

Prabhupāda: They have become Kṛṣṇa conscious from the very beginning. That is the perfection of life. They are perfect from the very beginning of their life. And you are going to school, college; you are becoming most uncivilized, cats and dogs. So what is the value of this education? Phalena means result. Result is hippie. So what is the use of Western... Stop all these colleges and universities. The sooner they are stopped, it is better for the human beings. We want to stop it.

Room Conversation -- January 21, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: No... Vedic process is that unless you create nice children or you can give them protection from death, don't create children. Brahmacārī. Remain brahmacārī. That is sensible, that "Why shall I beget children like cats and dogs if I cannot take care of them properly?" That is very gentlemanly. What is this? I create and kill? Most uncivilized. Don't create. That is civilized man. "If I cannot take care of them properly, I'll not create children."

Gargamuni: They're not educating the population in brahmācārya.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Gargamuni: Therefore these beggars are there.

Morning Walk -- February 2, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: The learned scholars, they used to live in the forest. Vyāsadeva was writing in śāmyaprāśa cottage. (chuckling) That is university. And no university can produce such scholar or student, not imperfect. They're all rascals. What are the values of these MA, Ph.D? (break) It is humbug. Māyā-sukhāya bharam udvahato vimūḍhān (SB 7.9.43). Actually they're vimūḍhān. Mūḍha means rascal and vimūḍhān means special rascals. (laughs) Māyā-sukhāya, for some sense gratification-big, big arrangement. And next life he's going to be a dog. That's all. So Prahlāda Mahārāja said, "I am thinking of these rascals, vimūḍhān, especially rascals, that they are arranging so gorgeous thing for material happiness and forgetting their spiritual identity." Śoce: "I am simply thinking of these rascals. For me there is no problem." Tato vimukha-cetasaḥ. "Because they are bereft of God consciousness, Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they are doing, engaged in these big, big projects, although (they) live for twenty years or fifty years utmost, perhaps. And eternal life? They do not know." Vimūḍhān: "specially rascal." The cats and dogs are rascals, but they are animals.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So we have to prove that "You have no brain at all. Your brain is like cats and dogs. That is not brain. Even if you are scientist, philosopher, the position of your brain is the same. You do not know what is that thing missing that a living being is dead. You do not know. For centuries in the history you could not answer this. So where is your brain?" On this point discuss you amongst yourselves. Write one article and send, signing your name. Is it not a fact, that "brain-giving" movement? There is no brain. Dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). "If you had brain, then you could understand. But you have no brain. Where is the question of washing? It is brain-giving movement." Am I right or wrong?

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That means you are not intelligent. That is the proof. "Beyond your intelligence"—that means your intelligence is not yet perfect. You're lacking in brain. (aside:) I see so many workers simply loitering. They are doing nothing. What can be done? So many. Simply they are taking money. Doing nothing. I see. There is nobody to see. They take advantage. Seventy-five percent of the workers, they are doing nothing. But the Gītā explains that within this body there is something. Not body itself is moving, but dehinaḥ asmin dehe. Within this body there is the real power, dehī, who has got this body. That is there. And because he is there, the body is changing. They cannot understand. No brain, exactly like the dogs and cats. The dog cannot understand that "Within my body, I am." They cannot. Therefore you are no better than dogs. And actual fact is you are not this body. You are within this body. It is a dress. In so many ways Bhagavad-gītā teaches, but you have no brain. Then where is brainwashing? You have no brain to understand your real position.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: In your calculation it may be that we are eating very small particle. But that is not the fact. We are eating sufficiently. That means you have no brain. Because you are eating raw meat, flesh, and you see that we are eating fruits, you say, "This is not sufficient." It is your calculation. Actually the fruits are meant for high-class, intelligent men. It is not meant for cats and dogs or elephant. Elephant may be very good eater. Does it mean he is human being? So you are just like elephant. You are calculating your other friends like you. (pause)

Ādi-keśava: Sometimes, when they are making their statements, we wonder how they can be so unintelligent, how they can be so mistaken as to what is the goal of this movement.

Prabhupāda: So you explain. Then Kṛṣṇa can do.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: That is another thing, rascal. A dog will not hear, that does not mean he has brain or he has intelligence.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That's the proof he's a dog. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: That he's a dog. We are not going to give any credit to the dogs and cats. So you have to fight like this. Think over. There are different brain. Just like in Chicago I said...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Woman's brain.

Prabhupāda: Woman's brain and man's brain.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Half the size.

Prabhupāda: That is the... That difference is intelligence.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Why he said dhīra, sober, cool-headed? These rascals are cats and dogs. They are not civilized, even big, big professors, they say, "Swami, after finishing this body, everything is finished." Has he got brain? And they're Communist leader. Identifying with this body. This is the actual platform of that body, dehātma-buddhiḥ. And they're described in the śāstra as no better than the asses. So next point will be that where you think beyond your capacity, we begin our education from there, seeing the... Our education begins from that. First of all try to understand what is spirit. Then it will... And our whole process is how to transfer one person from the material platform to the spiritual. Therefore they are thinking "brainwash." The fools, they cannot understand where our education begins. Where they have failed, we begin from there. Where they are disappointed, that "This cannot be answered," so on, we begin from there. So who is intelligent? We are intelligent or they are?

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: This is the actual... Now, apart from the scriptural injunction, if one comes to the argument, then such kind of father is there in the animal society also. Cats and dogs, they also beget children, but they cannot relieve the child from the cycle of birth and death. And Bhagavad-gītā says, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). First of all you have to see what is the actual distress in this material life. Janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). So in this life you are my father, and next time I become a cat or dog, so who cares for this father? I get another father. So who knows this law? Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā (BG 3.27). The laws of nature is going on, and everything is happening. Karmaṇā daiva-netreṇa jantur dehopapattaye (SB 3.31.1).

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Hari-śauri: But, you say, by presenting this to the court, then they'll have to prove or they'll have to try and disprove or establish that they have a brain, and then the whole thing come out, what is actual intelligence and what is simply cat-and-dog intelligence.

Pradyumna: Then we say also ceto-darpaṇa-mārjanam (CC Antya 20.12). We say "washing."

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is brainwashing, yes. It is required. But at the present moment you have no brain. You have got stool in your head. So it has to be washed. What is the wrong there? If you give, "machine." You say "machine," we say it, "machine," this body. This body is a machine. You also accept; I also accept. But you, can you produce a machine like that? If the person who has made the machine, He has got brain, you have no brain. And that is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says, mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). This is cara, moving machine, and there is standing machine. Just like tree, that is also a machine.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Animal civilization—eating, sleeping...

Pradyumna: Eating, sleeping, mating.

Prabhupāda: That's all. This civilization is there in the cats and dogs. Civilization is that when there is something more than the cats and dogs. What you have got? That is brain. How to eat, how to sleep, how to enjoy sex life—the dog has got such brain. Even that... You cannot produce a machine like the dog also. Can you make a machine like the dog? Then where is your brain?

Hari-śauri: They can't even produce the simplest single-celled living entity...

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Hari-śauri: ...what to speak of anything else.

Evening Darsana -- February 26, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Yes, because you have got qualification-dhīra. What I say, you hear with patience. And those who are adhīra, they cannot. Sometimes... Aye. (someone enters) You can come this side. (break) Two words is very important. One is, that in the beginning one must be dhīra, not restless. Restlessness is for the animal, or a child. He is restless. He cannot understand. An animal, a cat and dog... Sometimes they remain very silent before the master, but not always. Their habit is not silent. So this understanding, that "I am not this body," is not possible for, say, restless person, that "I am not this body." It is specially mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā, dhīra. He must not be a restless animal, always busy. Just like monkey. Monkey is always busy. But as soon as the monkey comes, everyone knows he is very busy. He can jump very nicely. And immediately they take a stick, "Get out! Get out! Get out!" Busy fool. Fool, if he remains little silent, so he does less harm. But if he is busy, he is more harmful.

Room Conversation -- March 27, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Great loss. He will get again good birth to become Vaiṣṇava. There is no doubt. He was initiated. Again he will get chance. Anyone who has joined this movement and given little service, his human life next birth guaranteed. There is no doubt. And then he will get again chance to develop. He is not going to be cats and dogs.

Hari-śauri: I remember once in Vṛndāvana, though, that you said that if someone deliberately breaks the principles even after initiation, he can become a dog in his next life because of that.

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Do the needful. Go. At least, in India, there must be this spiritual institution. The whole world may take advantage of it. What is this cats' and dogs' race civilization? Is that civilization? Here is civilization, Bhagavad-gītā. Basic principles of civilization. So India should maintain this. People may... There are so many big universities. A student may go or may not go, but the university must be maintained. Because there is no student, therefore university closed. No. This Kṛṣṇa consciousness institution must be maintained for the benefit of the whole world. Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani (BG 9.3). They do not know how nature's law is working.

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is a wrong type of civilization. A civilization of ignorance. Animal civilization. Just like animals: the cat, the dog, the cow, he does not know what is the working principle in the body. So he is jumping and running as a dog, as a cat, and he appears to be very busy. Similarly, the modern civilization, they are jumping and running like cats and dogs, but does not know what is the principle which is helping him to jump and run. That is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā. Asmin dehe dehinaḥ. The active principle is there within this body. So who knows it? Ask big, big leaders, big, big scholars of Bhagavad-gītā. They are concerned with this body. Nobody is interested with the active principle within the body. So what do they know about Bhagavad-gītā? The basic principle is wrong. Kṛṣṇa is speaking on the subject matter within the body, the active principle. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe (BG 2.13). Asmin dehe. The dehī, the owner of the body, is there. Who knows it? Tell me. This is the beginning of Bhagavad-gītā lesson.

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That is brahma-jñāna. Athāto brahma jijñāsā. So these things are here in India. Instead of distributing, understanding these things, we are jumping like cats and dogs, like the Western civilization. Anthill and four-wheel dog race. These big, big buildings, they are like anthill. You know anthill? The ant also can make a big stack of earth. Does it mean it is civilization to compete with the ant? Or run with the dog? Sometimes if a car is driving, and dog is running, it is a competition and the dog running. Is that civilization? Without understanding, the whole thing is going on, running on like that. Why India should imitate? India has got so much great exalted knowledge given by Kṛṣṇa. India should learn it and teach it to the whole world. That is India's business. Paropakāra. And that is being done in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Very important movement, very scientific movement. So do not neglect it. Come and join, learn it and give it to the whole world. This is the perfect knowledge, paropakāra. Not to imitate there and jump like monkeys and cats and dogs. This is not good.

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: All sorts may go, but you must know the real message, that within this machine the owner of the machine, the driver of the machine... All sorts of... There are three thousand parts in a motorcar. You have all sorts of knowledge about the parts of the car, and you do not know who is driving, then what is this knowledge? Every paper, every learned man, every..., every should take it seriously and implement it. It is not meant for everyone. Still, there must be an institution to teach this, I mean, the highest standard of knowledge to the human being. Why they should simply jump like cats and dogs? This is our mission. So don't try to imitate cats and dogs, but be human being. Understand what is your position and cultivate that knowledge. That is nature's way. The evolutionary process, after 8,400,000 species of life, it is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā that if you don't understand this opportunity, then nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani (BG 9.3).

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. That "You are this body, jump like cats and dogs," that's all. What is nationalism? This is, that "You are this body. Jump like cats and dogs." A group, as a group of crows gather together, caw caw caw caw. That has been taught. Make group and crow.

Mr. Koshi: Something is wrong.

Prabhupāda: Yes. You don't find this word "nationalism" in the Bhagavad-gītā. You don't find it. Can you find out this word? These are all borrowed words.

Mr. Koshi: And what is your alternative?

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Then let them, they will go to hell. What can be done? If you want to cut your own throat, you can do it, who can save you? But our duty is don't make suicide. We must be all sane and tactful. But if you commit suicide, that is your business. What can I do? We shall go on. This is suicidal condition, to live like cats and dogs and jump like monkeys. Losing the opportunity of human being, where you can understand? Athāto brahma jijñāsā. This is Vedānta-sūtra. They are neglecting it. They are neglecting it. You will go to hell. Kṛṣṇa says mām aprāpya. Everything is there.

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So what kind of people?

Mr. Koshi: Cats and dogs.

Prabhupāda: That's all. Śva-viḍ-varāha. They have been described in the Bhāgavata as dogs, camels, asses and hogs. Śva-viḍ-varāha-uṣṭra-kharaiḥ saṁstutaḥ puruṣaḥ paśuḥ. (break) The leader of hogs, dogs, camels and asses. Our civilization is brahminical, brāhmaṇa. That is wanted.

Mr. Koshi: Is that good or bad?

Prabhupāda: That is good. Unless you become brāhmaṇa, real brāhmaṇa, śama, dama, titikṣā, how you will understand? We are not for the hogs, dogs, cats. Therefore it is sometimes said that without becoming brāhmaṇa, nobody should try to understand Vedas. What he will understand? Paraṁ satyaṁ dhīmahi. Dhīmahi. This word is used because it is meant for the brāhmaṇas. Oṁ bhūr bhuvaḥ svaḥ... dhīmahi. Dhīmahi. Dhīmahi is gāyatrī-mantra. It is chanted by the brāhmaṇas. That word is used in Bhāgavatam also.

Morning Talk -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Para-duḥkha-duḥkhī, kṛpāmbudhi. My Guru Mahārāja used to say prāṇa āche yāṅra se'retu(?) pracāra. One who is living being, he can preach. Dead body cannot. One who is actually a living being, he can preach. And Caitanya Mahāprabhu said bhārata-bhūmite haila manuṣya-janma yāra (CC Adi 9.41). One who is a man, he will be interested in this. Cats and dogs, it is not possible. Bhārata-bhūmite haila kukkura-janma yāra, eka... Manuṣya. To give knowledge of Bhagavad-gītā, this is India's prerogative. And India can distribute this knowledge. And the government has to consent. And they are misinterpreting this. I wanted to fight them, but...

Room Conversation -- April 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: They are already dogs; otherwise how he is becoming dog? They have been already described. Śva-viḍ-varāhoṣṭra-kharaiḥ. They are already... Therefore they are going to change it, the body. They are already cats and dogs. Yaṁ yaṁ vāpi smaran bhāvaṁ tyajaty ante (BG 8.6). A doggish mentality, you will get a dog's body, infections. It is clear, nature's law.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This vision no one else has except... I mean no one else has it, Śrīla Prabhupāda except for you. It is there in the śāstra, but I don't think anyone else has realized it. There may be many other Vaiṣṇava ācāryas or something in India, but they are not... By the fact that they are not preaching, it means they have not realized it.

Room Conversation -- April 13, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But first of all we must know also what is the position. If we also become enamored by the so-called scientists, politicians, philosophers, then we cannot preach. We must definitely be convinced that they're all rascals. As a gentleman, I can give him some respect. That is another thing. But he's a rascal. You must know that "I am talking with a rascal number one." So I... He cannot deviate me from my position. But I can talk in a nice way, gentlemanly. That is another thing. That is courtesy. But I know that these rascals, number fools, number one fools, they have no idea. Caitanya Mahāprabhu therefore said, ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa bhramite kona bhāgyavān jīva (CC Madhya 19.151). In this way they are rotting within this universe. Kabhu svarge kabhu martye narake ḍubāya. Sometimes by puṇya they are in the higher planetary system, some powerful lokas(?). Sometimes fish, sometimes demigod, sometimes dog and cat. This is going on. Kṛṣṇa says. Nivartante mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani (BG 9.3). Mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartmani, botheration. Then there is... We have got this... Any intelligent person gets the Bhagavad-gītā. The rascals are reading Bhagavad-gītā, do not understand a line even. Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20).

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So He declares that bhārata-bhūmite manuṣya-janma haila yāra: (CC Adi 9.41) "Anyone who has taken birth as human being, not cats and dogs..." Cats and dogs, they simply jump whole night: "Gow! Gow! Gow!" That is another... We find so many dogs, whole night busy, watching. Whose property he is watching? But he... He has got this business, very busy. As soon as some motorcycle or some..., "Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow! Gow!" watching, watching, watching. So therefore this is business of cats and dogs. But human being's business is different. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, bhārata-bhūmite haila manuṣya-janma yāra: (CC Adi 9.41) "Anyone who has taken birth as a human being in India, bhārata-bhūmi..." Janma sārthaka kari' kara para-upakāra: "First of all make your life perfect"—you have got the opportunity, Vedic culture—"and then distribute the knowledge all over the world for doing good to the whole human society."

Room Conversation with Ratan Singh Rajda M.P. 'Nationalism and Cheating' -- April 15, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: "Always think of Me," man-manāḥ, "just become My devotee," mad-bhaktaḥ, "worship me," mad-yājī māṁ namaskuru, "simply offer your obeisances unto Me." One, two, three, four-four items. If you do one item at least, your life becomes successful. Even this child can do this. So to understand Bhagavad-gītā and follow the principle—not at all difficult. It is not reserved for any particular class of men or country or society, such a nice thing, and the human body is meant for understanding this knowledge, not to imitate the cats and dogs, jumping. This is being done by the cats and dogs. By evolutionary process, when we come to the human form of life, it is meant for understanding this science. So this opportunity there is, but we are blocking them not to take this knowledge and try to understand how to jump like cats and dogs. Greatest disservice to the human society. We have got such chance, so instead of helping you to get the chance, if I mislead you another way, is it not greatest disservice?

Conversation with disciples of Chinmayananda and Shivananda Ashram -- April 22, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: There is difference. Cat and dog, there is difference. An intelligent man and a rascal is difference. There must be difference. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). How you say there is no difference? A brāhmaṇa is brāhmaṇa. A kṣatriya is kṣatriya. Vaiśya is vaiśya. That is real understanding. If you say, "Everyone is brāhmaṇa," that's not good.

Indian man (3): But we have been told to see only one consciousness, one life, between indi...

Prabhupāda: That oneness is on the spiritual platform. Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā na śocati na kāṅkṣati, samaḥ sarveṣu (BG 18.54). That is another thing. But so long you have got a bodily concept of life, you must divide: cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). That is wanted. Just like in my body there is division. There is head. There is hand. There is leg. There is belly. So they have got different activities. The head is important. If you cut the head, then whole thing is finished.

Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That means ignorance, rascals. They are busy with something which is not his business. Then next question will be: then what is his business? If they actually read Bhagavad-gītā, his business is that to find out: "If I am going to change my body, what I am going to be?" Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). The body, after being finished, this body, I am not dead. I am going to change another body. So is it not my duty? Just like if I go somewhere, you see how that place, how it will be suitable for me, how I shall live there. Is it not duty? Na hanyate hanyamāne śarīre (BG 2.20). I am not going to die. That, if I leave this compartment, I'm not going to die. I'll accept another compartment. But shall I not see what kind of compartment will be, whether it is better than this or inferior than this? Is it not my duty? That is my real problem. Or the actual problem is that if I am eternal, why I shall change body now and then? This is my problem. And Kṛṣṇa says that "If anyone does not take up My instruction in the Bhagavad-gītā, then he does not get Me, and the result is that he'll again turn to this change of body, mṛtyu-saṁsāra-vartma..." So they are not careful about these things, so what do they understand about Bhagavad-gītā? The real problem they do not touch. And the body will change, and he'll live in India or in America, say, for fifty years. He's busy. That is cats, just like these cats and dogs at night.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: Dog is also doing that. Is he householder? Taking care of children, the dog is also doing that. So is he householder? First of all, you do not know what is meant by householder. Taking care of children, that is done by the birds. In the nest the small kiddies are there, and they are bringing food and pushing in the mouth, (makes bird noise:) "Tee, tee, tee, tee, tee." Are they householder? And if you think they are householder, you are also householder like the dogs and birds. You do not know what is householder. Therefore you have to consult śāstra, who is a householder. Śāstra says, pitā na sa syāj jananī na sā syāt, na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum: "You should not become a father and mother unless you take the responsibility for children that no more birth." Because this is the problem, janma-mṛtyu-jarā-vyādhi-duḥkha-doṣānudarśanam (BG 13.9). If you are so able father and mother that you can stop this miserable condition of your children, then you become householder. That is householder. Otherwise what is the use of becoming a householder like dogs and cats? There is no use. There are so many cats and dogs. What is use of increasing? Now government is forcing: "Do not produce cats and dogs. Take these inhibitions(?)." Because the whole world is fed up with these cats and dogs householders.

Room Conversation -- May 8, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: All bogus. Householder is allowed, as brahmacārī-āśrama, gṛhastha-āśrama. It is not meant that... Big, big personality were householder. Lord Rāmacandra was householder. Arjuna was householder. Prahlāda Mahārāja was a householder. Janaka Mahārāja was householder. But they were not cats and dogs. So be householder. You do the duty of real householder. Don't become cats and dogs. Then where is human civili...? What is the distinct between cats and dogs and human civilization if you do the same thing? Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithuna. Then you are huma..., not even human being. What is the question of householder? Be householder as it is in the civilized codes, human history, they are... Otherwise refrain. Householder does not mean to satisfy, what is called, itching sensation of the genitals. That is not householder. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). To satisfy the itching sensation, that is not householder. Here is householder. Protect your children from death. Can you do that? That kind of householder, at least, the trees on the street, everywhere... There is no question of becoming householder. The whole Bhagavad-gītā... Arjuna, he was householder. He was politician. So he did not give up anything.

Evening Darsana -- May 14, 1977, Hrishikesh:

Prabhupāda: You are hankering after happiness, but if you purify your existence, then you get unlimited happiness of Brahman. Anantam: "There is no end." Here, whatever happiness you are getting, that is not unlimited. Limited. That limited happiness is available in the life of cats and dogs also. So the human life is meant for tapasya. Tapo divyaṁ putrakā yena śuddhyet sattvaṁ yasmād brahma-saukhyam anantam (SB 5.5.1). So this tapasya can be practiced... Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ (SB 5.5.2). You have to render your service to mahat, mahat, mahātmā. And who is mahātmā? Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ, bhajanty ananya-manasaḥ (BG 9.13). This is mahātmā. Kṛṣṇa says. Sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ.

Conversation: 'How to Secure Brahmacaris' -- June 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (indistinct-bad tape) (break) So now our next business is to bring students, brahmacārī. So easy process is to approach wealthy(?) gentleman. In their family there are many children, one, two, three, like that. So approach them and plead them that "Children from your family are expected to be very respectable boys, character and devotee, educated. From your family, people expect like that. According to Cāṇakya Paṇḍita's instruction, he says, ko 'rthaḥ putreṇa jātena yo na vidvān na bhaktimān. 'What is the use of begetting children like cats and dogs?' The children must be vidvān, that is, learned, and bhaktimān, devotee. This is the ideal. And what is the use of begetting cats and dogs? Ko 'rthaḥ putreṇa jātena yo na vidvān na bhaktimān. Either he should be bhaktimān or vidvān. This vidvān and bhaktimān, that is ideal. So we are going to teach your son to become vidvān and bhaktimān. So don't you like to bring your son?" You have to tell them like that.

Conversation: 'How to Secure Brahmacaris' -- June 24, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Anywhere. There are lots and hundreds and thousands, but you have to collect them and give them proper education, vidvān, bhaktimān. Kāṇena cakṣuṣā kiṁvā cakṣuḥ pīḍaiva kevalam. So if you don't educate them as vidvān and bhaktimān, it is just like blind eye, kāṇa, with some disease, simply giving trouble. That's all. Pluck it out. The medical treatment is pluck it out. So what is the use of begetting cats and dogs? According to our Bhāgavata philosophy, if one is not able to beget nice children, then he should not become father-mother. That is real contraceptive. Gurur na sa syāt jananī na sā syāt, na mocayed yaḥ samupeta-mṛtyum. The father-mother's duty is to stop repetition of birth and death. That is real father-mother. Otherwise dog is also doing that. Dog is also begetting children. Man is also begetting. What is the difference?

Room Conversation With Bharadvaja -- October 16, 1977, Vrndavana:

Bharadvāja: We're also showing that human life means responsibility. Even on an ordinary level we are showing that a man may break a law and he's punished, but a dog, he's not punished for breaking man's law. He may cross the street in the wrong place, he is not punished by the law, but the man is. Animals are walking without clothes, but if a man goes out in the street without clothes, he's arrested. So we are making the point here that man is held responsible for his actions, whereas animal is not. And then we show... The conclusion of this is "Therefore human life has responsibility to engage in the pursuit of knowledge and advancing, not degrading himself." Then we want to show that misuse of this human form of life, or giving up that responsibility, has created a chaos in the world, that the world has become full of madness and fear and pain, and the whole civilization is misguided. We want to show on film, side by side, U.N. politicians barking in U.N. and cats and dogs barking in the street.

Prabhupāda: That is explained by Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Māyār bośe, jāccho bese.