Calculation (Conversations)

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1967 Conversations and Morning Walks

Discourse on Lord Caitanya Play Between Srila Prabhupada and Hayagriva -- April 5-6, 1967, San Francisco:

Hayagrīva: Or are they older brāhmaṇas?

Prabhupāda: Older, only these...

Hayagrīva: Only the three, yes.

Prabhupāda: Haridāsa, Śrīnivāsa, and Advaita. They were taking part. Otherwise, all, they were young friends, yes. Young boys. No girls. That is not the system in India. (laughs) Yes. Now when the second scene, mainly their movement was going on and it was becoming popular. Now Caitanya Mahāprabhu preached that simply by the saṅkīrtana movement everything will be fulfilled. You need not do anything. So the priest class brāhmaṇas they became very much dissatisfied that "He is inviting Muhammadans and all others..." Because according to Hindu society, except the brāhmaṇas... Especially in those days, only the brāhmaṇas were considered the highest in the society, and even the kṣatriyas, vaiśyas, they all calculated to, in the group of śūdras.

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- March 9, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: The standard of living, comforts, are many, many thousands times better than this planet. But in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is, we get information that within this material universe, wherever you go, either you remain in this planet or you go to the moon planet or to the sun planet, or there are millions and trillions of planets... The highest planetary system is called Brahmaloka. There the duration of life is very, very great. You cannot calculate even twelve hours of their days. These are described in this book, Bhagavad-gītā As It Is. Sahasra-yuga-paryantam arhad yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). Four hundred... Three thousand years is the duration... Four hundred and, yes, four hundred and three thousands of years, solar years, is the one unit of yuga. Such thousand yugas makes twelve hours of the Brahmaloka planet. Similarly, they live there for a hundred years.

Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 23, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: First thing is that calculation of Candra, moon planet, there are different views. Different scientists, they have different views. It is not a standard. They have not agreed to the... Somebody says something, somebody says another thing. Speculation. That's all. But that idea, that it is very low in temperature, that is mentioned in Bhāgavata. You cannot live in the water. You have to qualify yourself. (Sound of ducks). Just see. Their body is made just suitable for the water. So you have to qualify yourself. That is... Just like, in the spiritual sky they can live only spiritual body, and material body cannot live there. Material body is not allowed there. Hare Kṛṣṇa. Ūrdhvaṁ gacchanti sattva-sthā madhye tiṣṭhanti rājasāḥ (BG 14.18). Those who are too much passionate, they are meant to live in this planet. This planetary system, status. There are many other planets like this world.

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:

Prabhupāda: Gaurakiśora dasa... Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura was his father, and Gaurakiśora dasa Bābājī was treating Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura... Although he was householder and Gaurakiśora dāsa Bābājī was renounced order, still he used to offer great respect to Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura, and Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura saw him a pure devotee; therefore he recommended his son, Bimala Prasāda. His former name was Bimala Prasāda, and he got this title Siddhānta Sarasvatī by writing one thesis on astronomy, astrology, astrological calculation according to solar system. So he got this title Siddhānta Sarasvatī. So this Siddhānta Sarasvatī, Sarasvatī title also accepted by sannyāsa. Sarasvatī, Bhāratī, Puri, Araṇya, Bon, Parvat—there are ten names of sannyāsa according to Māyāvādī school, and according to Vaiṣṇava school there are 108 names. So this "svāmī" and "gosvāmī," they're also included within that 108 names. So he accepted Gaurakiśora dasa Bābājī Maharaja his spiritual master.

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:

Prabhupāda: That you cannot calculate. Nārada Muni is one of the sons of Brahma, so he's present since the time of creation. And many great sages and saintly devotees are all devotees of Nārada Muni. Prahlāda Maharaja is disciple of Nārada Muni, Dhruva Maharaja is the disciple of Nārada Muni, Vyāsadeva is disciple of Nārada Muni, Vālmīki is disciple of Nārada Muni. So Nārada Muni was very expert in getting disciples. He had so many disciples. Unlimited.

Questions and Answers -- September 6, 1968, New York:

Candanacarya: ...to know something about Kṛṣṇa. (indistinct) I think you have to know something about Kṛṣṇa before you know Him to love Him.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That I explained. For ordinary neophyte devotees... This is the highest stage. The stage of the gopīs or the cowherd boys playing with Kṛṣṇa, oh, they are kṛta-punya-puñjāḥ. Many, many lives they have undergone many types of sacrifices, austerities, penances, and then they have come to that stage. That stage is not ordinary stage. In the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam Śukadeva Gosvāmī says, itthaṁ satāṁ brahma-sukhānubhūtya dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ para-daivatena, māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa sākaṁ vijahruḥ kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ (SB 10.12.11). He is describing when Kṛṣṇa was playing with His cowherds boy. So he is describing that "These cowherds boy—who are they? They are living entities who have amassed volumes and volumes of pious activities." Kṛta-puṇya-puñjāḥ. "After many, many lives Just like bank balance increases, similarly, one who has increased the balance of pious activities for many, many thousands of lives, oh, such persons are now playing with Kṛṣṇa. They have taken the body of His cowherds boy, transcendental spiritual body, and just they are playing with Kṛṣṇa. And who is Kṛṣṇa?" Itthaṁ satāṁ brahma-sukhānubhūtya: "The great saints and sages who are trying to understand the Supreme Brahman, here is Kṛṣṇa. That Supreme Brahman is here, playing." Itthaṁ satāṁ brahma-sukhanubhutya dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ para-daivatena: "The impersonalist Brahman is... Because Kṛṣṇa's effulgence is impersonal Brahman, so here is He." And dāsyaṁ gatānāṁ: "Those who are devotees, those who have accepted Kṛṣṇa as the master, for them here is Kṛṣṇa." And māyāśritānāṁ nara-dārakeṇa: "And those who are materialistic—they simply think Kṛṣṇa is ordinary boy or man—He is also there. But who are these boys? They are playing with the same person who is Brahman, who is Bhagavān, or who is ordinary man, according to different calculation.

Interview with LA Times Reporter About Moon Trip -- December 26, 1968, Los Angeles:

Reporter: In other words, you don't... How do you yourself feel? Do you feel that if the United States or the Soviet Union were to attempt a landing and their spacecraft went down, what do you yourself expect...

Prabhupāda: No, so far our calculation goes, from the books, nobody can do so. That is impossible.

Reporter: Well, does the book say that it would be impossible for anyone to even approach it? At what point would it be impossible...

Prabhupāda: Impossible means the process by which you are trying to reach there.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Prabhupāda: As soon as we say that this is a tree, the root of which is up, that means it is reflection. The Māyāvādī philosopher, they do not take account of the mathematical calculation, 380 degree. They are taking account of... 360 degree, the whole circle. They are taking account only 180 degree. And other 180 degree they're making void. But actually, the whole point is 360 degree. That is geomatrical calculation. If you simply know 180 degree, then the other 180 degree is unknown to you. So real life, real variety, real beauty, real knowledge, everything in reality is there in the spiritual world. It is only reflection. Therefore Bhāgavata explains that janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataś ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ (SB 1.1.1). The Supreme Absolute Truth is cognizant, abhijñaḥ. Cognizant and svarāṭ. Svarāṭ means independent. In this way, the explanation of Brahma-sūtra is given in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Therefore Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is vaiṣṇavānāṁ priyam. Yad vaiṣṇavānāṁ priyam. Yasmin paramahaṁsam ekaṁ paraṁ jñānam jñeyate. The knowledge of Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is to be understood by the paramahaṁsa, the highest perfected man, paramahaṁsa. It is not ordinary thing.

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Prabhupāda: We cannot manufacture anything. It is not possible. But this is shadow and that is reality. And in the shadow... Just like photograph. You find that everything in detail of your beautiful face in the photograph, but that is not reality. That's all. So you'll find everything in details, all... Or you can understand actual photograph, actual idea, actual notion of the spiritual world by scrutinizingly studying this material world. The impersonalists, they think that in the material varieties there are so many abominable inebrieties, therefore in the spiritual world all these things should be minus, void. That is their material calculation. They cannot think that in the spiritual world also there is love. Because here, in this world, the so-called love or lust is frustrated and followed by so many calamities that therefore they cannot conceive that in the spiritual world also there is love. Their idea, in one sense, is right, that how these nonsensical things can exist in the spiritual world? Therefore they make it altogether minus. No variety. Impersonal. That is less intelligence.

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Hayagrīva: That's a materialistic calculation.

Kīrtanānanda: So if you want one cow for every person, it would only support eighteen cows.

Prabhupāda: Eighteen cows? The whole property?

Kīrtanānanda: If you want them to be self-sufficient, you have to grow grain for them for the winter.

Prabhupāda: All right. Let eighteen people first of all. Then we shall share, eighteen people. You see?

Hayagrīva: One cow per person. We're all going to end up with the gout.

Prabhupāda: No. They don't calculate one cow, one person. They calculate only cow. And that does not mean eighteen persons will only remain.

Hayagrīva: I think a cow can do four or five people nicely.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Why not? No... I calculated, one cow per one person means the milk products he can sell, he can get other necessities of life in that way. Yes. And otherwise, one cow's milk, it can be shared by ten people at least.

Lord Caitanya Play Told to Tamala Krsna -- August 4, 1969, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: The baby was on the lap of His mother, and they looked little far-off, just to glance over the baby, not touching. Because newly born baby. So they saw from little distant. That's all. And the baby was very beautiful. He was golden complexion. And His grandfather was a great astrologer, His mother's father, Nīlāmbara Cakravartī. He immediately calculated His horoscope, constellation of the stars under which He was born. He calculated that "This boy will be a great reformer."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What is the position of astrology in Kṛṣṇa consciousness?

Prabhupāda: Astrology is a science. Kṛṣṇa consciousness has nothing to do with astrology, but it is the general custom that as soon as a child is born the astrologers come. That is the Indian system, Vedic system.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lord Caitanya, He would cry so that He could hear them chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa to Him?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That was not on that day, but when He was little grown up. As soon as He would cry, so the neighboring friends of His mother, all young girls would come and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa and He'll stop. Sometimes they would tease Him so that He may cry, and they'll see that He's crying, and they'll chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and He'll stop. Again tease. (laughs) So that Caitanya Mahāprabhu was preaching Hare Kṛṣṇa chanting by His childhood activities.

Room Conversation With John Lennon, Yoko Ono, and George Harrison -- September 11, 1969, London, At Tittenhurst:

Prabhupāda: So Kṛṣṇa says that sarva-loka-maheśvaram: "I am the Supreme Lord of every place." And suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānāṁ (BG 5.29). And He is the real friend of every living entity. Īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe 'rjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61). As a friend, He is sitting within your heart. He's so nice friend. In this material world we make friendship. It breaks. Or the friend lives somewhere, and I live somewhere. But He's so nice friend that He's living within, with me and within my heart. He is so nice friend. Sarva-bhūtānāṁ. He's not only selected friend. No. Even the most insignificant creature, he is living there. Paramātmā. So if these three things are understood clearly, then he becomes peaceful. This is the peace formula. So everything is there in the Bhagavad-gītā and Vedic literature. Simply one has to learn. Just like in arithmetic. There is all mathematical calculation, addition, subtraction, multiplication, division, this or that, fraction. One has to learn. So Bhagavad-gītā is so nice book and it is accepted. Not that because we are preaching Kṛṣṇa consciousness, we are advocating for Bhagavad... No. It is accepted by scholarly section, religious section, not only in India, but all over the world. Perhaps you know. In every country there are thousands of Bhagavad-gītā translation, in every language, in English, in French, in German, all languages.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prabhupāda: So we have got evidences that his varṇāśrama system is current at least for the five thousand years, varṇāśrama system. And this varṇāśrama system is mentioned in the Viṣṇu Purāṇa also. Varnāśramācaravata puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān

(CC Madhya 8.58). Varnāśrama acaravata. So that is stated in the Viṣṇu Purāṇa. And so varṇāśrama-dharma is not a, within any historical period calculated in the modern age. It is natural. And in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam the comparison is given, just like in your body, in my body, there are four divisions, the face, facial, or the brain division, and the arms division, the belly division, and the leg division, similarly, by nature's way these four divisions are existing in the social body. You may take history wherever you begin, but this is existing. A class of men, they are considered to be brain. A class of men, they are considered to be the arms, administrators. And a class of men, they are called productive class. So there is no need of tracing the history. It is naturally existing from the day of creation.

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Mohsin Hassan: Could you recall the beginning of your first trip to USA and how you spread the message? I was told that you came here with six dollars, and then...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Because our government, India government would not allow to take money to go outside. So somehow or other I got the P-form sanction, and one big shipping company, they allowed me free passage. So I came here with great difficulty. Of course I was very comfortably situated on the sea, but still, because I am not accustomed, I got sea sickness. So the travel was very miserable. Still I came. Then for one year, I was going here and there, there was no fixed-up position, and then in 1...9, I came here in 1965, September, then 1966, July, I incorporated the society and started my preaching in a storefront, and... Second Avenue. And then gradually the students came and it developed, one branch after. Now we have got sixty branches, and our expenditure is very heavy. According to Indian calculation it is about 700,000's of rupees. We are paying every rent, we have got in each center not less than twenty-five devotees, up to hundred, hundred and fifty. So it is going on by Kṛṣṇa's grace.

Room Conversation -- August 14, 1971, London:

Prabhupāda: A simple thing, to chant the name. God has become so kind, "You simply chant My name." But I am so unfortunate, I have no attraction for that. Now, these people are being taught... They have got this bead bag. I have also got. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare, Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare. Now where is the loss? If I chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, where is the loss? And where is the want of time? They are walking on the street, Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare, Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare. I am sitting here, and now I'm talking with you. As soon as I finish talking, I shall chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So where is the difficulty? But ask people to chant the holy name of God, he won't accept. Unfortunate. And such simple thing. He hasn't got to go to church, to temple, or to go to hell or heaven. In whatever condition he is, he can chant holy name of God. But they're so unfortunate, they won't accept this theory. Etādṛśī tava kṛpā. "So God is so merciful, but I am so unfortunate that I cannot chant His holy name." There is no charges, there is no fee, there is no loss. If there is some gain, why not try for it? And the gain is there. That you practically see. Because these boys from Europe, America, and other places, they were... I do not wish to discuss. (laughter) But just see the process now. Not the process one has... Other has to calculate. Then calculate, then serve. Yes. There is so much profit.

Room Conversation -- December 11, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda:

(bhakti-yogena manasi)

samyak praṇihite 'male

apaśyat puruṣaṁ pūrṇaṁ

māyāṁ ca tad-apāśrayam

(SB 1.7.4)

The materialistic person, they have only one experience: this cosmic manifestation. Beyond this they have no other vision. Their senses are imperfect. Just like the astronomers, they have got big, big telescope, many other instruments. They want to see through the eyes how many stars are there, how the planets are moving, and whatever imperfect knowledge they receive, by that little knowledge they advertise themselves as great scientists. But they do not calculate that "We are trying to see the stars and planets with powerful binoculars. That means our eyes are imperfect." And what is the guarantee that the instruments which they're using, they are also perfect? Because that machine, that binocular, is also made by a person who is imperfect. So what is the guarantee that by seeing through binocular or microscope, the conclusion arrived, it is perfect? What is your answer? Your eyes are imperfect, that's a fact. Otherwise, why you are using binocular, microscope? Eyes are imperfect. Originally your eyes are imperfect. Now, eyes or other senses, it doesn't matter. Sense is sense. So you are manufacturing a machine, some instrument, by the same imperfect senses, then what is the guarantee that this machine, this binocular, if you see through the binocular, the knowledge is perfect? What is your answer?

Devotee: Can't be perfect.

Room Conversation -- December 11, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: The same example: just like so-called scientists, Russian and American, for so many years they're trying to go to the moon planet, nearest planet. But here is no shelter. Actually, I do not know whether they have gone, but why they are coming back? Let them remain there, construct house there, there is everything. If there is no such possibility, why these rascals are going there? Practically, if it is full of dust only, why these rascals are going to see the dust every time? (laughter) Ask these rascals that "What benefit? You're spending so much money and going to the moon planet and touching, 'Now my flag is on the dust,' (laughter) and go back with little pebbles, 'Oh, we have gone.' " No. Moon-reaching day, holiday. Nixon, another rascal. Great rascal. Holiday. And what do you want there? Patanty adhaḥ. After so much endeavor, trying to go to the moon planet, they are failing. And what to speak of other planets? What to speak of the Brahmaloka, Tapaloka, Jana...? They are there. We are seeing every day, at night, there are so many. Who is going there? The nearest planet, which is about 200,000 miles, I think it is so, from here, the moon planet, and they cannot go. And what to speak of other planets? There are many. They do not..., cannot calculate how far they are, but we see every night there. So how imperfect knowledge they are. That is my point. And still they are going as scientists. Lokasya ajānataḥ. They are so fools and rascal, still they are passing on as scientists, big men, learned men. No. None of them. This is our challenge. None of them. And who is learned? Learned is Vyāsadeva. Learned is Kṛṣṇa.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation Including Discussion on SB 4.13.48 to SB 4.14.11 -- January 18, 1972, Jaipur:

Prabhupāda: There was monarchy, the kings were very responsible. Therefore, the kings were known as rājarṣi. Rājarṣi, rāja ṛṣi, rājarṣi, this is compound word. (indistinct) king supervising the administration of the state, still his character was just like a ṛṣi, (indistinct) great sage. That was the qualification of the king. Therefore... Also Vedic civilization, even up to Maharaja Parīkṣit, the government was monarchy. At the present moment, practically all monarchical state is abolished. Even there is some monarchy... Formerly... (indistinct) just like in England, the Queen, she is powerless. Actually, the Queen has no power. People have taken away the power. Here also there is the (indistinct) Jaipur. Actually, they are the owner of the state, Jaipur state, the old state, at least five hundred years old, this state. (indistinct) It is the kingdom of Maharaja Mansingh, former Mansingh, who was commander-in-chief of emperor (indistinct).

But now they have no power. The people have taken away the power. But according to Vedic civilization, this people's government is not sanctioned. Democracy. Democracy is not sanctioned. But in the Kali-yuga, nobody will be a standard king. Anybody, by hook and crook, if he captures the royal throne, he becomes king. That is predicted in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. Formerly, only the kṣatriyas were the kings. But at the present moment, because the institution of varṇāśrama-dharma is topsy-turvy, practically no more existing, everyone in this age is calculated to the śūdras.

Room Conversation with John Griesser (later initiated as Yadubara Dasa) -- March 10, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Because India, the caste system is very strong. So a brāhmaṇa will never accept a girl born into a śūdra family, although in śāstra it says that you can accept. (Sanskrit) means family member is respectful. Your family consideration is very... During marriage ceremony, the family consideration is very strong. Now that is dwindling. Formerly, family traditions, then horoscope. The so-called love was not given any importance, the so-called love. As in other countries the boys select wife or girls selects... No. There is no importance on this. The father, mother will see the horoscope, whether this boy and girl will agree according to the horoscope. Rāja-yoga(?) There are some calculations, astronomical calculations, from his birth, from her birth, and the expert astrologer will select, "Yes, this boy and this girl will be happy." Then they are married. If there is any discrepancy, they will deny, "No." These were the considerations. Then family tradition. What is the tradition of the boy's father's family, mother's family, so many things they calculate, then the marriage settlement, "Yes." And the boy might not have seen the girl. There is no necessity of the boy seeing the girl or the girl seeing the boy. There is no necessity. After marriage, when the marriage ceremony is performed, then the boy and girl can see one another: "Oh, she is my wife." (laughter) "He is my husband." That. (aside) So. You can begin. Oh, this is another magazine, Earth.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1972, Sydney:

Prabhupāda: Computer. That is mechanical, the calculation. The calculating process is there; but by nice machine, it is shortened. That process is Kṛṣṇa's energy. He is so expert that it is just like computers—immediately comes. Not that the process is not there. Process is there.

Śyāmasundara: It seems like the more and more scientists try to investigate and imitate this process, they become more and more entangled in the complications. They can't understand it.

Prabhupāda: That process is crude. They are thinking that it is very fine, but it is still crude. Just like here, the... What I was speaking?

Śyāmasundara: The more scientists investigate the workings of nature, the more complicated it becomes. They can never understand it.

Prabhupāda: No.

Room Conversation -- April 2, 1972, Sydney:

Devotee (2): Māyāvādīs, are they thinking like that, Kṛṣṇa is...

Prabhupāda: Yes, "He is ordinary man. A little better than me, that's all." That Dr. Frog's philosophy. Atlantic was "That's all right, may be little one feet more than this well, that's all." He cannot imagine that millions of wells will be not compared. That he cannot begin. He says, "Yes, it may be bigger, say one foot bigger, two feet bigger. All right, ten feet bigger, make compromise." That's all. He will never think that beyond his estimation. Never think. He'll simply calculate, "All right, if not one, two feet, three feet. All right, ten feet." And the friend will say, "No, no, it is very, very great."

Room Conversation -- May 4, 1972, Mexico:

Prabhupāda: Jalajā nava-lakṣāni sthāvarā lakṣa-viṁśati. And 2,000,000 of leaves and plants, botany, botanical. Jalajā nava-lakṣāni sthāvarā lakṣa-viṁśati, kṛmayo rudra-saṅkhyakāḥ. Insects, there are 1,100,000 forms. (Sanskrit) Then (Sanskrit). From insect, they become flies and birds. (Sanskrit) One million. Then from birds, the beasts come, four-legged. (Sanskrit). Three million species of beasts. Then from beasts, the human form comes—either from monkey or from lion or from cows. Out of these three, sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. Those who are coming through rajo-guṇa, their last birth before human form of birth is lion. And those who are coming in the form ignorance, Darwin's father-in-law, (laughs) monkey, and ignorance. And those who are coming in goodness, their last form of birth is cow. So this is our scientific information from the Vedas. We haven't got to make research. Everything is there. That is Vedic knowledge. They have got already everything written there. The astronomy, everything is written there; simply you have to calculate. Astrology, we say simply mathematical calculation. If the moon is in this position and the other stars is in this position, the effect will be like this and the result will be like this. Like that. So you haven't got to make search or research. It is already there.

Interview -- July 5, 1972, New York:

Prabhupāda: The sun is very big, bigger, fourteen hundred thousand times bigger than this earth, but with our imperfect eyes we see just like a disk. If we remain satisfied with this imperfect knowledge, then we remain in darkness. We have to know the sun from the astronomer. They have calculated. They know. In this way knowledge, perfect knowledge, can be attained—when it is received through the perfect knower, not by speculation. That speculation means I shall speculate with limited mind and imperfect senses. So however carefully or expertly I manage with the instruments, they are themselves imperfect. Therefore Vedic sastra says that to understand the divine you must have divine mercy. You must possess. Athāpi te deva padāmbuja-dvaya-prasāda-leśānugṛhīta eva hi jānāti tattvaṁ (SB 10.14.29). One can understand the truth by the grace of... So searching after divine means we must search after the grace of the divine. Just like a very big man, just like President Nixon. So I am speculating that President Nixon is like that, like that, like this, his function is like that, he eats like this, he sleeps like this. That is speculation. But if I hear directly from President Nixon or his representative, very confidential representative, then it is perfect knowledge. I cannot speculate to know about President Nixon by my imperfect senses. I must know about President Nixon when he speaks personally about himself or his personal associate speaks about. That is the way.

Morning Walk Conversation -- September 28, 1972, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That's all. (indistinct) beyond the sky there is another sky (indistinct) and we are trying to go there according to the perfect knowledge (indistinct). (break) ...of knowledge is misunderstanding, so how they can get perfect knowledge? If you begin from mistake, misconception, then where is your perfect knowledge? The beginning is this body. Beyond this body, they have no knowledge. Their rascal knowledge..., this rascal knowledge, how they can help you? Anything, suppose any mathematical calculation, if the beginning is wrong, then how you will come to the right conclusion? What do you think?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, when the...

Jayatīrtha: In logic, if the hypothesis is wrong then the conclusion is wrong.

Prabhupāda: The hypothesis is always wrong.

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Now what is the translation?

Devotee: "By human calculations..."

Prabhupāda: No, no, I want to know this (indistinct).

Scholar: He who knows that the day of Brahmā is thousand yuga and that the night of Brahmā is also 5,000 yugas is he who knows the truth of day and night.

Prabhupāda: Now, what is the explanation?

Scholar: The explanation is that, according to the traditions that Brahmā, the day or the night of Brahmā's is one thousand yuga.

Prabhupāda: What is that yuga?

Scholar: It's mentioned in Chapter 4, 8. Four, verse eight. Yuga is eighths, one yuga is, it's written here a hundred years. One yuga is one eighths between the one incarnations to another incarnations.

Prabhupāda: But he has not given actual calculation of the years.

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Prabhupāda: Human calculation.

Scholar: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Then it is all right.

Indonesian Scholar: Four million three thous... four, three, two...

Prabhupāda: About forty-three. About forty-three hundred thousands of years.

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Scholar: Eight billion years one day of Brahmā.

Prabhupāda;: Yes. So that is the calculation.

Scholar: Yes.

Prabhupāda: So things are very complicated, and people should understand very rightly. They are, they are frog philosophy. Frog philos... We say frog philosophy. Frog philosophy means that a frog who lives in the well, he has got experience of water, three cubic feet. And if he's given to understand that there is Atlantic Ocean, it is very difficult for him to understand. So on the whole, it is... But it is not very completely explained. And our point is this, or at least it will give some idea of the Bhagavad-gītā to the people.

Morning Walk -- May 1, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The sun is a product of Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes, energy. Yac cakṣur eṣa savitā sakala grahāṇām. Sun is working under the order of... Just like if you don't see the managing director or the proprietor of a firm, the immediate boss who is controlling you, you have to obey. In the office or in the factory. Similarly, you cannot see directly God, but God's agent is working. Why don't you obey? God's agent is working? How it is working? Yasyājñayā bhramati saṁbhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ, exactly in time by the order of Kṛṣṇa, rising exactly in the time, without any deviation even by 1/10,000th part of a second, astrological calculation. Is it not? So how it is working? Under whose order it is working? Śāstra says, "By the order of Kṛṣṇa." Yasya ājñayā. "Under whose order he is working," govindam ādi-puruṣam, "I worship that Govinda." The śāstra is giving you information, that he is working under, he must be working under... Otherwise why it is so accurate, so punctual, unless there is some direction? Unless there is order of God, why this big ocean is so obedient, it is not coming here? Why don't you study like this? Where is the difficulty? There must be some direction that "You Pacific Ocean, you are so big, that's all right, but you cannot come here. Remain up to this." Otherwise why you are feeling so safety although in the front of a big ocean. If the ocean likes, within a second, he can finish us immediately. But she will not do, because there is order.

Morning Walk -- May 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Life, yes. They are searching after the original source. That is life, Kṛṣṇa, sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam (Bs. 5.1), cause of all causes. So this is not theory; this is fact. Now we have to prove it. Then the whole program of these rascals' theory will be changed, and people will be happy. Because they are standing on a wrong theory, all their calculations are wrong, and people are suffering. The rascal Darwin's theory. So many, based on this foolish theory, wrong conception of life. So we have to challenge, protest. defeat. This will be our work. Our worshiping of Kṛṣṇa, that is our internal affair. The external affair—we need to establish this theory. Otherwise they'll be leading this society. Misleading. They are misleading, not leading, misleading. So we have to stop this misleading. Make program how to do it. Because it is truth, you will come triumphant. There is no doubt about it. It is truth. Now you have to know how to present the truth. That is your business. We are not presenting something theories, concocted by my brain. No. This is the fact. Rudimentarily we have got evidences, but it has to be presented by the modern ways. They are presenting some wrong principle by propaganda, and we cannot establish real principle by factual presentation? What is the difficulty?

Brahmānanda: Well, when we ask them, they say, "I do not know."

Morning Walk -- May 4, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: If they know that there is definitely a blissful world, spiritual world, they would not work this hard.

Prabhupāda: Yes, why? Just like Lomaśa Muni. Lomaśa Muni, his duration of life is that when one Brahmā dies, one hair from the body falls. So in this way, when all the hairs of his body will fall down, he will die. He has such a great length of... So he was standing on the side of a sea and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. So Nārada Muni approached him, "Why don't you make a small cottage here?" He said, "How long I shall live? (laughter) Ah, standing will do. Let me finish my bead...(?)" Just see. And here they'll live for twenty years and making skyscraper building, (makes sound:) "Doc, dong, doc, dong, doc, dong." (laughter) Does not calculate that "I shall live for twenty or thirty years."

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They will say, nature supplies the chemicals.

Prabhupāda: So therefore that nature's potency is acintya. That is beyond your calculation. That is our point. How nature is supplying, that you do not know. How there is very common thing. Just like from my body there are so many worms and germs will come out from the stool, there are so many worms. I am also producing life. I am not going to add some chemical. But the chemical is being supplied by me, by my potency. Otherwise, why so many worms are there in the stool? Hookworm and this worm and that worm? Sometimes from wood, what is called, termite? They come. And who is going to supply there chemical? And not from all wood. At a certain stage, it will come, without your adding chemicals.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So the varieties of living entities that we find in the material world, can we explain because of the desire of the living entities, to make..., to live in different houses?

Prabhupāda: Yes. He knows. Just like government constructs a prison house. Government knows there will be rascals, criminals. So already is there prison. Before the judgement the prison house is already there. Sarva-jña. God is sarva-jña. He knows everything. So He knows that some of them will come out criminal. Just like king knows that not that always everyone will be honest. There will be dishonest. So construct this prisonhouse. Like that. God knows, Kṛṣṇa knows that this material world, the varieties of desires according to the modes of material nature... So there are three modes of... You can calculate also. Just like there are three modes of material nature, sattva-guṇa, rajo-guṇa, tamo-guṇa. Now if you make variety, three into three, it becomes nine. And nine into nine, it becomes eighty-one. So there is eighty-four. What is the difficulty to understand? These three qualities, just like three colors, blue, red and yellow, you mix. Oh, thousands of different colors you will find. It is the expert color combination. That's all. Similarly this material world is made of three qualities and if you make varieties, mix them again eighty-one to eighty-one you can mix. So it requires expert handling. So that expert handling is there. Nature is there. Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi (BG 3.27). Guṇaiḥ. This very word is used, guṇaiḥ. By the qualities, prakṛti is manufacturing different types of body, varieties of body: plants, trees, aquatics, human beings, demigods, cats, dogs, so many things, 8,400,000.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: It is done. Just like sometimes I think that I came here alone without any expectation of success, and this movement has become so nice. Actually, by one man's effort it was not possible. But it has become so. This is acintya-śakti, Kṛṣṇa's, inconceivable. Even a modern businessman, he cannot organize such a worldwide organization in such short a time. We have talked with many businessmen in India. Some said, "We have got thirty branches," somebody says, "We have got forty," another twenty branches. Our students say "My Guru Mahārāja has 102 branches." So they say, "No, we cannot compare with your Guru Mahārāja." So this is acintya-śakti. You can see so many things, the acintya-śakti is working. So unless we accept acintya-śakti of God, it is not possible to understand what is God. Inconceivable potency. And that is actually a fact. We want to bring God to our level, that's frog philosophy. Atlantic Ocean to the level of well. That is foolishness. That is foolishness. We have to understand that this whole universe... Just like Arjuna saw the virāḍ-rūpa, universal form. So this whole universe is the form of the Lord. So if in my body there are so many chemicals, enzymes, and other things, so how much there must be, proportionately? Suppose if we find some portion of chemicals in my body, you will find less in the ant's body. Or you will find more in the elephant's body. So if I can create so many chemicals within my body, how much chemicals He can create? On that account... Your theory, that combination of hydrogen, oxygen makes water, that is a fact. But you are surprised, wherefrom such a big quantity of hydrogen, oxygen came so that the ocean is there. That you cannot calculate.

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: You are accepting millions of bodies and then die. That you do not know. I say that your body of yesterday is not of this body. So, similarly, if we live for one hundred years, how many bodies you are changing every moment? Just calculate.

Karandhara: Thirteen.

Prabhupāda: Ha? Thirteen? Why thirteen?

Karandhara: Every seven years.

Prabhupāda: No, no, every seven years. I say every second. Every second the blood corpuscles are changing. Is it not?

Devotees: Yes.

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Hare Kṛṣṇa. Water can be counteracted by fire or air. Everyone knows it. So you do it, suspension. So this is for you mystic power. You can talk all nonsense, but you cannot act against it. Therefore it is mystic power. So similarly, there are so many things. That is acintya-śakti. You cannot think of even. By nature's way, immediately the sun rises—no more mist. All finished. A little temperature increase of the sun, all finished. Nīhāram iva bhāskaraḥ. This example is given in the Bhāgavata. Nīhāra, this is called nīhāra. Just like nīhāra is immediately dissipated by bhāskara, by the sun, similarly, if one can awaken his dormant devotion, then all finished, all his reaction of sinful activities, finished. Nīhāram iva bhāskaraḥ. You just create... You calculate sun is composition of this chemical, that chemical. Just create one sun and throw it. Simply theoretical future, bluff and juggling of words, that's not good.

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Krishna Tiwari: Or ten thousand?

Prabhupāda: No. You cannot calculate.

Krishna Tiwari: How... Well, this is a different game then.

Prabhupāda: No. We have got... Because this, if we take on the strength of śāstra, we understand that after the birth of Brahmā... Brahmā created this universe.

Krishna Tiwari: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Lord Brahmā.

Krishna Tiwari: Right.

Prabhupāda: But, uh, Brahmā's one day you cannot calculate.

Krishna Tiwari: Yes. I agree with that.

Prabhupāda: So now, at the present moment, we are in one day's..., Brahmā's one day we have passed only half.

Room Conversation with Krishna Tiwari -- May 22, 1973, New York:

Prabhupāda: Because in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). So one yuga is calculated to be forty-three lakhs of years. Now...

Krishna Tiwari: That is also 4.3 million years.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Krishna Tiwari: That is 4.3 million.

Prabhupāda: Yes, and multiplied by 1000.

Krishna Tiwari: OK, we've got 4.3 billion.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is, that is the duration of daytime, one daytime of Brahmā, and similarly calculate night, similarly you calculate, that is twenty-four hours, one day and night. Similarly, you calculate one month.

Krishna Tiwari: Yeah, I understand that, Swamiji, but uh...

Prabhupāda: In this way he lives for one hundred years, according to these calculations.

Conversation with Sridhara Maharaja -- June 27, 1973, Navadvipa:

Prabhupāda: So I, I try to impress upon them this fact, that this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is a challenge for this deception. They're simply deceived.

Śrīdhara Mahārāja: All sorts of deception. Even Vaikuṇṭha. Paravyome (Bengali) And the calculation, even they, the self is, a sort of calculation comes between the, the servitor and the object of service, then also it throws us down. In Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that sort of calculation is also absurd. Where there is love, there cannot be any calculation. It is autonomous. Autonomous anurāga. Cultivate, do. No sort of calculation of any benefit. The calculation disturbs autonomy.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali) Goloka-nāmni nija-dhāmni tale ca tasya devī-maheśa-hari-dhāma... (Bs. 5.43). (Bengali) About our temple contemplation, it will be almost a skyscraper building.

Room Conversation With David Wynne -- July 9, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: That is our problem. Either you become rich man or poor man, but you have to undergo. (aside:) Make the light. There is switch. (pause) So our position is that we are in this material world. George has sung that "I am in the material world." Yes, very sensible song. (laughs) He's good boy, realizing, he also... So this material life is not good. Material life is not good in this sense, because you have to change your body. Sometimes good birth, sometimes not good birth. Sometimes Englishman, sometimes cats, dogs. Because after death you'll get a body that will be chosen not by you but by the material nature. You'll create your body by your present activities, and nature will simply award you that body. So, so long we have got this material body, the four kinds of miserable conditions, repetition of birth, death, old age and disease, you have to suffer. Therefore, this human life should be utilized in such a way that we do not become subject to these four tribulations, birth, death, old age and disease. That is perfection. But people are not given that chance, the modern education, modern civilization. They've no knowledge; they do not know that there is life after death, although it is a simple fact. Just like in our present existence we have got past, present and future. Just like you are young man, you have your past. You are a child, or a boy, now that is past. Present, you are young man, and in future you are expecting to become old man. So as you have got past, present and future, similarly, I'm old man, I've got my past life, why not future? What is the reason to deny it? Past, present, future, that is the time calculation. I had my past, I've now present, and why is my future? They do not care for the future. They're so blind. There must be future.

Room Conversation With Three College Students -- July 11, 1973, London:

Revatīnandana: In these Vedas. There's a difference between the arithmetic book you get in the first grade of school and the calculus book in terms of the amount of information. We can tell you more about God because the Vedas give more information than the Bible. But the basic principle—"God is there. God is a person"—is in both places.

Prabhupāda: Jesus Christ is son of God. Therefore God must be person. A person can beget a son.

Student (1): God exists now.

Prabhupāda: Yes, always exists.

Room Conversation With David Lawrence -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Hm. Western mind... I, I do not find any difference between western mind and eastern mind. Because so many western mind is changed. Yes. So there was no difficulty. Two, two plus two equal to four is to be understood by the western mind and the eastern mind. You cannot say, because you are western mind, you'll say, "No, two plus two equal to five." You cannot say that. So there may be some influence of the culture, but that is superficial. When you speak the real truth, science, that is equally applicable to the western mind and eastern mind. There is no difference. If you speak the real truth... Two plus two equal to four, mathematical calculation, nobody will deny, either western mind or eastern mind. Yes. So he must be reasonable. That's all.

Room Conversation with Sir Alistair Hardy -- July 21, 1973, London:

Pradyumna: "And, although He is the oldest person..." (continues reading to the end of the purport)

Prabhupāda: Hm. Yes. So you have got this Bhagavad-gītā now. Kindly take it. That will help you in your research work. And whenever you kindly ask us in some question, we are prepared to help you.

Revatīnandana: One thing I noticed, at one point you mentioned that you only have a few years to go and you're working on this particular subject of how religion is experienced today. Do you really think you only have a few years to go?

Sir Alistair Hardy: Well, I don't know, but I...

Prabhupāda: No, that is material calculation.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Because there are eight million, four hundred thousand forms of life. The trees are also life, the cats and dogs, they are also life. And there are higher, intelligent persons in the higher planetary systems. They are also life. The worm in the stool, that is also life. So, calculating all of them, there are 8,400,000 species of life. So if I am going to have next life... Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). We have to change this body to another body. So our concern should be "What kind of body I am going to get next?"

Mother: I agree for some people to, you especially, to think of this because you are a leader of your Vedic religion. But for everybody to do that, where would we be? We couldn't all sit down and think all the time.

Prabhupāda: But where is that education?

Mother: But we... You can also work and think.

Prabhupāda: No, I mean to say, where is that education in the university to prepare the student for the next life?

Mother: Oh, but he must fit it in.

Room Conversation -- London, August 24, 1973 :

Prabhupāda: This is a, this is a fact. That, that people are going to the higher planetary system, that is already known. Not this process, but there is another process, how you can graduate there. So, ā-brahma-bhuvanāl lokāḥ. And even if you go to the highest planetary system, Brahmā-loka, where people live for millions and millions of years... Brahmā's one day, twelve hours, you cannot calculate. It is so big number of years. So Kṛṣṇa says that if you do go to the Brahmā-loka, still you have to come. Simply your suffering will be stopped, mām upetya tu kaunteya, duḥkhālayam. What is that?

Devotee (2): Mām upetya tu kaunteya punar janma na vidyate.

Prabhupāda: Then mām upetya kaunteya duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam, where is that?

Devotee (2): Oh,

mām upetya punar janma

duḥkhālayam aśāśvatam

nāpnuvanti mahātmānaḥ

saṁsiddhiṁ paramāṁ gatāḥ

Prabhupāda: What is the meaning?

Devotee (2): "After attaining Me, the great souls, who are yogis in devotion, never return to this temporary world, which is full of miseries, because they have attained the highest perfection."

Prabhupāda: This is the highest perfection. We have to go to Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation with Cardinal Danielou -- August 9, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Similarly, two million kinds of dresses of the trees, plants, like that. In this way the Vedic literatures have calculated, there are eight million, four hundred thousand forms of living entity. But they're all living entities, part and parcel of God. Just like one man has got ten sons. Not all of them equally meritorious. Not all. One may be high-court judge. And one may be ordinary clerk in the office. But father, both the high-court judge and the clerk in the office, father claims both of them as son.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Bhagavān: Instead of an express to Goloka.

Prabhupāda: No. Yes. That is natural. Only the strong devotees, they don't like. "No, I don't want to see anything. I want to go immediately to Kṛṣṇa." That is strong devotion. Because they are after, mad after seeing Kṛṣṇa. Yugāyitaṁ nimeṣeṇa cakṣuṣā prāvṛṣāyitam, śūnyāyitaṁ jagat sarvam. For them, the whole universe is vacant for want of Kṛṣṇa. Just like if you love somebody, if he's not seen, you see, in spite of so many cars, you see the whole city of Paris, void, void. You don't give you any pleasure. A strong love for Kṛṣṇa. Śūnyāyitam. Śūnyāyitam means everything vacant. Without seeing Kṛṣṇa, everything is vacant. What is the value of this house or this city? He doesn't take. So higher planetary system means better standard of life. Just like if Indian comes here, materially, they see the higher standard of life in Paris, in London. But because we are interested in Kṛṣṇa, we do not take very much care of this higher standard of life. So higher planetary system means many, many thousand times better standard of life. Many, many thousand times. Just like Brahmaloka, the one day of Brahmā, described, you cannot even calculate mathematically. Just find out: sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). This is the topmost planetary system, Brahmaloka, and the duration of life in Brahmaloka is described in the Bhāgavata, Bhagavad-gītā. Sahasra... S-A-H. Sahasra-yuga-paryantam.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: For livelihood, one has to work. That is material world. So you work. And what is that work? If one, one works for three months on the field, he can get his whole years' food. That is economically fact. How many mounds of grains we can produce per acre? Do you know that? We know, in our Indian calculation, we can produce at least ten mounds of grain per bighā. So if one has got ten bighās of land, he can produce hundred mounds of grains. So how much you can eat daily. Just compute it. Utmost two pounds. Utmost. So if you eat two pounds grains per day. In a month, sixty pounds. And eighty-two pounds makes one mound. You are getting one thousand mounds. One thousand mounds. Then? Ten bighās of land...

Bhagavān: One hundred mounds.

Prabhupāda: One hundred.

Guru-gaurāṅga: Mounds.

Prabhupāda: So you get enough food by working three months. But they'll not work in the field. They'll work in the factory. The... Now the world situation is there that they have invented so many artificial work. So people are embarrassed with this kind of work. He doesn't find any time.

Room Conversation with Graham Hill Former World Champion Race Car Driver -- London, August 26, 1973:

Graham Hill: Can we?

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is... There is... Even astrology, Bṛghu-saṁhitā. Astrological calculation. You can know your past life, present life, and future life. There is system. Bṛghu-saṁhitā.

Graham Hill: So by our behavior (indistinct) will determine what sort of body we will get when we return?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like if you are educating your son for future life. So according to his education, according to his qualification, his future life will be fixed up. If he is properly educated he can become a very big man. And if he is not, he may not become. So this life is preparation for the next life. So this human form of life, if we are advanced in our consciousness then we should try to get our next life going back to home, back to Godhead.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Those who know Sanskrit, they know what is the meaning of Veda. Veda means knowledge. Vetti veda-vid jñāne. Jñāna means knowledge. That means the history of Veda means from the date of creation of this material world. Now find out the date of creation of the material world. Approximately, nobody can give what is the date of. We can, we cannot... Date of Brahmā, he got the, first of all, the Vedic knowledge. Now, one day of Brahmā you cannot calculate. One day of Brahmā. And the... When Brahmā's night is there, there is devastation up to some extent. So again in the daytime of Brahmā, that creation takes place. There are two kinds of devastation. One devastation is at the night of Brahmā and one final devastation is the whole cosmic manifestation finished. So these teeny people, they are after the dates of Vedas, and that is ludicrous, that is...(laughs) Just like there are many microbes, they grow in the evening and die just in the day beginning. So whole night is their span of life. So our life is like that. What history you can write? Therefore, we receive Vedic knowledge from the authorities.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: So one should transcend these, what is called, historical references. They calculate in Darwin's theory.

David Lawrence: Darwin's theory's out now isn't it? (laughs) It's sort of old fashioned now. They dispense with these theories as quickly as most people do their newspaper each day.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) Yes.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

David Lawrence: Yes, I must admit I was amazed at that reference, reading that yesterday.

Prabhupāda: That frog philosophy is going on. Dr. Frog. He's simply calculating the well, that's all. How there can be Atlantic Ocean? That is frog philosophy. You know frog philosophy? Yes?

David Lawrence: Yes.

Prabhupāda: You know? I don't think you know. Who can explain what is that frog philosophy?

Śyāmasundara: Frog philosophy is trying to imagine the size of the Atlantic Ocean never having left my well.

David Lawrence: Oh, I see, yes. Completely beyond one's experience.

Prabhupāda: Yes. No, especially of the Mr. Frog, Dr. Frog. He has never seen what is Atlantic Ocean and somebody informed him, "Oh I have seen such a vast mass of water." "Oh, is it bigger than this well?"

David Lawrence: Yes, beyond his conception.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: The same thing is there, but they are dragging this lusty affairs to Kṛṣṇa. Generally, the rascals, they paint Kṛṣṇa's picture with gopīs so that their lusty activities may be supported—Kṛṣṇa also had like that. This is misunderstanding. They do not take into calculation: Here, so-called love is lust and it breaks. But in the gopīs' love with Kṛṣṇa there is no breaking but increasing of love. So how they can compare Kṛṣṇa's love with gopīs with these lusty affairs?

David Lawrence: I must admit, yes, I've read far enough on to see that and I think this is...

Prabhupāda: When we make analogy, the points of similarity must be there. But these rascals are so dull-headed that they have not even logical arguments. Where are the points of similarity? That we are comparing these lusty affairs of this material world with the affairs of Kṛṣṇa and the gopīs? Where is the similarity?

David Lawrence: There's never mention of lust or of any animal desire at all is there?

Prabhupāda: No, no.

David Lawrence: It's just reverence and love.

Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa used to dance with so many gopīs, everything is described there, that they embraced, they kissed, but there is no such thing abortion or contraceptive. (laughter) So these things have to be studied. How we can compare gopīs' love with Kṛṣṇa with these lusty affairs of this material world?

Room Conversation -- September 1, 1973, London:

Guest: Yes. And how do you know whether you're using it for Kṛṣṇa or not?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That requires training from the Kṛṣṇa's representative, guru. Just like these boys are being trained up in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So it requires little training. Just like you are mathematician. To make another student mathematician, you have to train him. You have to teach him how to calculate two plus two equal to four. It will never be five. If somebody says, "No, my calculation is two plus two equal to five." Will it be accepted?

Guest: I'm afraid sometimes it can be true. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: How it can be true?

Guest: One plus one can equal three.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Guest: One plus one can equal three sometimes.

Prabhupāda: Is there mathematical calculation?

Guest: I know that it's ah... I mean things reproduce. Life is not so fixed, not so rigid. But one does have to be trained, it's true. Training is, some people can understand and some people cannot understand.

Prabhupāda: That is difference of understanding.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Heaven is in the material world. Heaven is in the material world. You can get greater standard of life, greater duration of life, that's all. Higher standard of life. Just like Brahmā. Brahmā's one day you cannot calculate. He's so powerful, how he's created this universe. But he is in the material world. He's also a living entity like us, but very exalted. So he cannot get the post of Brahmā. But he can get life in higher planetary system. That is certain. That is explained in the, find out that verse. That is explained in the...um. That verse, yoga-bhraṣṭo 'bhijāyate śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe (BG 6.41). But he did not understand Bhagavad-gītā, that's a fact.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Uṣitvā śāśvatīḥ samāḥ. For a very long time. Because to get life in the heavenly planets means at least ten thousands of years. In their calculation. Their one day is equal to six months. In that way ten thousand years. Uṣitvā śāśvatīḥ samāḥ. What is it? Uṣitvā śāśvatīḥ samāḥ?

Pradyumna: Uṣitvā śāśvatīḥ samāḥ, śucīnāṁ śrīmatāṁ gehe yoga-bhraṣṭo 'bhijāyate (BG 6.41).

Prabhupāda: Then, again they come down to this material world and he takes birth either in a very exalted brāhmaṇa family, śucīnām, or very rich, vaiśya family. After enjoying there, again he's given chance to become Kṛṣṇa conscious. And if he misses, then again he goes down. Therefore Narottama dāsa Ṭhākura says these are all false elevation. If I have to come again back, again I have to accept another lower grade life, then what is the profit? Kṛṣṇa gives His straight understanding, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti: (BG 4.9) You become Kṛṣṇa conscious. After the giving up this body, no more material body either in the heavenly planet or in the lower hellish planet. "You come direct to Me." That is perfection. You should not be attracted by somebody has gone to heavenly planet for ten thousands of years living. We should not be attracted by these things. Therefore Prabodhānanda Sarasvatī says, kaivalyaṁ narakāyate tridaśa-pur ākāśa-puṣpāyate. Tridaśa-pur means the heavenly planets. Ākāśa, it is just like will of the wisp. Something, just like, what do you say Hindi? There are many proverbs, which has no existence. Just like in Bengali we say ghoḍā-ḍima. Ghoḍa-ḍima. Ḍima means egg. The horse never lays down egg. But the word is running on: "the egg of horse." So it has no existence but the word is there. Similarly, what do you say in Hindi? Something which has no existence but it is current. I think there is.

Room Conversation with Indian Guest -- October 4, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Translation.

Śrutakīrti: "By human calculation, a thousand ages taken together is the duration of Brahmā's one day. And such also is the duration of his night."

Prabhupāda: Now, that, this forty-three lakhs of years, multiplied by one thousand, how many years it is?

Guest (1): Four hundred thirty crores.

Prabhupāda: Four hundred and thirty...?

Guest (1): Crores.

Prabhupāda: Crores. That is day. Similarly, four hundred thirty crores, night.

Guest 2 (Indian man): Four thousand, three hundred crores.

Prabhupāda: Just see. So four thousand, three hundred crores, that is day. And similarly night. Now this becomes complete twenty-four hours. Similarly one month. Similarly one year. He lives for one thousand, one hundred years. Now calculate.

Room Conversation with Indian Guest -- October 4, 1973, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Ah.

Śrutakīrti: Says, "These hundred years, by earth calculations, total to three hundred and eleven trillion and forty million, and forty million earth years."

Prabhupāda: Yes. If you believe in Bhagavad-gītā, that is different thing. You cannot say all these things. But if you take this also, that also, that is another thing. We have to take a standard. Ācchā. (Hindi) I have got some important engagement with Mrs. Nair. She's the proprietor of the land. So...

Guest (2): (Hindi)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi ) So you can go and see the temple, ārati. (end)

Morning Walk -- December 3, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But scientifically it can be proved that there is a mistake.

Prabhupāda: Then that is your mistake. In the laws of nature there is no mistake. There is no mistake. Your mistake. Just like in the railway carriage there is first-class, second-class, third-class. So you have purchased third-class ticket. By mistake, you can go to the first-class and just give him, but you will not be allowed to stay there. So it is your mistake. But these first-class, second-class, third..., that is not a mistake. That is arrangement. Similarly, these varieties... God is so clever that He knows that so many mistakes can be done, and so many varieties are there. As you commit mistake, you enter... "You come here. It is ready." And it is very exact mathematically calculated. Because the nature is working in three modes, so you mix up these three modes, it becomes three into three equal nine, and again you multiply nine into nine, equal to eighty-one. Again eighty-one into eighty-one. So many varieties come. Therefore generally it is taken, 84 million varieties. 8, 400,000. That is already there. Just like government creates a prison house. Although the city is not constructed, but they construct a prison house. Why? The government knows that "There are so many rascals. They will be criminals, they must come here." So it is not government mistakes. Your mistake. You become criminal and come here. It is your mistake. Why should you be criminal? That is your mistake.

Morning Walk -- December 8, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So they have some intelligence to tell that...

Prabhupāda: No, no. That is calculation, calculation. This astrologer, this astrologer was a very big astrologer and when I was in service, Dr. Bose's laboratory, so Dr. Bose was treating one patient. He was vomiting blood. So he was treating as tuberculosis. Then he could not cure him after giving all medicine. Then he asked the astrologer, this astrologer who made my horoscope, "What is the matter? Panditji, can you tell?" So he calculated. He said, "You are making wrong treatment. He has got some sore in the throat. It is not heart." And he treated, he was cured.

Morning Walk -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Gap of understanding because the basic principle is wrong, because everyone is fool. And they are trying to understand things with their foolish background. There is the wrong. They are trying to be advanced in knowledge on the foolish background. They do not accept that, that they are foolish rascals. And they are trying to advance in knowledge, active-foolish, fourth class men. Their background is wrong. No scientist, no politician, no philosophers, at the present moment, believe in this, that there is soul, and the soul is transmigrating from one body... Nobody believes it. So their whole background is foolish. So their so-called advancement must be all foolish. They're all fools, rascals, animals. An animal does not know that there is soul and the soul is transmigrating from one body to another. This is animal conception. You cannot teach these pigeons that "You are spirit soul. Your body's different from you." They will, they have no power to understand. So if a human being cannot understand, what is the difference between these pigeons and cats and dogs and him? Then basic principle is wrong. Just like in mathematical calculation, if at one point you have mistaken, then will that be correct ever? It will go on, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking, mistaking. If the, if one point, while adding, you have made two plus two equal to five, then after that, everything wrong, everything wrong. Everything wrong. So that is their position.

Room Conversation with Latin Professor -- December 9, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Similarly, Dhanur-veda, military science. Similarly, Jyotir-veda, jyotis, the astronomical science. And those who are, mean, accustomed with Vedic knowledge, it is so nice and, I mean to say, perfect that... Take, for example, that Āyur-veda, medical science. Their process is that this body, the physiological condition, is depending on three things, tri-dhātu, kapha-pitta-vāyu: mucus, bile and air. And the air is felt by the pulse beating. So they learn how to examine the pulse beating, the heart beating. And they have got description. Just like the sparrow walks, the crow walks, so in this way they have given the example, "If the pulse is beating like the walking of the sparrow, walking of the crow, then his health, his condition, is like this, and the symptoms will be like this." So the physician first of all studies the pulses, and he remembers the symptoms, and he corroborates, asking the patient, "Do you feel like this? Do you feel like this? Do you do this, like this?" If it is corroborated, then his diagnosis is given: "He has got this disease." So similarly, in Jyotir-veda they have got similar symptoms: "If such and such stars are now nearer to this star"—they have got this calculation—"then the position is this." So they learn very quickly. Indian brāhmaṇas, they learned Jyotir-veda, Āyur-veda, very quickly. Because brāhmaṇas they are meant to go to every house to inform the date, the everything. So generally people are inquisitive about the health.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: No one equal to or greater than.

Prabhupāda: No, that you cannot find here in this material world. Anyone has relative position. Everyone will find somebody is greater than him, somebody is lower than him. He's not absolute, nobody. A rough estimate of supremacy: if one man has got, is very rich, he's considered great. If he has got influence, if he has got bodily strength, bodily beauty, wisdom, or renunciation... These are the six items for calculating a man's greatness. Therefore when you speak, "God, the Supreme," He must possess all these things. That is the definition given by Parāśara Muni. The other day we were discussing. Somebody said, "This is all imagination." Why imagination? Who was telling?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Scientist.

Prabhupāda: Scientist! (laughs) So how, why it is imagination? Your idea of supremacy, you must define. How do you accept here in this material world a person as supreme? Why? Why you accept Nixon as supreme person within your state? What is the cause?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Because he has some power.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Eh?

Karandhara: He's elected.

Prabhupāda: No, no, he's elected, that is same. But his position is supreme. Why he's supreme? As government servant, he gets the highest salary, he has the, all the best facilities, amenities, and his order is final.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Hrishikesh, yes, that is Haridvar. So one yogi friend was coming to my father. He said that, he said that "I went with my Guru Mahārāja." They simply sit down and touch guru and after few minutes, he's in Dvārakā. This is, this is yogic power. What your aeroplane will do? Just like Durvāsā Muni, he traveled all over the universe, up to the Vaikuṇṭhaloka within one year. But according to modern calculation, they say, with light year, in forty thousand light years we can approach to the highest planet. Is it not? If they want to go to the topmost planet, how much, how many years it will take? Is there an estimation? But, so far I know, I heard it that, someplace... They have estimated it will take forty thousand leap year. Now, leap year is beyond our calculation. What is called leap year? Light year.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Prabhupāda, what is the Caitanya Mahāprabhu's... Last night Śrīla Prabhupāda was mentioning about the (indistinct) explained by Caitanya Mahāprabhu?

Prabhupāda: Yes. He was giving the example that the, the jewel, gem, cintāmaṇi, it produces so many other jewels, but it remains as it is. That is pūrṇasya pūrṇam ādāya pūrṇam evāvaśiṣyate (Iso Invocation). God, by His... Here. Just like energy. The petrol energy is now being finished. Finished. But what is the petrol there in the sun? It is never finished. But this is also material. So find out what, what is that source of...? Now, after hundred years, your stock is finished now. There is problem now, how to drive your motor car. But here, the sun, aśeṣa-tejāḥ. Aśeṣa-tejāḥ. The moon is giving light. Nobody can calculate from where the moon is situated, created and it is spreading light, the sun is, light is there. It is material. You find out.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Everything is natural. What you have produced? Everything is natural production.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, based on these elements, they calculate, they can calculate, they say very exactly the, how old the earth is. How old is the...

Prabhupāda: That's all right. We know how old the earth is.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: How old it is?

Prabhupāda: Just like earth is at the beginning of Brahmā's life. Now Brahmā's life, you cannot calculate even one twelve hours. So how you'll calculate? He has to live for a hundred years. So now, at the present moment, if his one day's calculation is mid-day now, at the present moment...

Yaśomatīnandana: This is, is this the later half of his life?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Yaśomatīnandana: Is this the later half of Brahmā's life?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Everyone is advancing means he's going to die later on. Not only Brahmā, everyone one of us.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But they calculate that it's only 4.5 billion year old, the earth.

Prabhupāda: Let them calculate, but who cares for that? They cannot calculate even one day of Brahmā.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So we do not accept this?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We do not accept this.

Prabhupāda: How can I accept it? Because in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ: (BG 8.17) "The Brahmā's one day is equal to one thousand combination of yugas." The combination of yuga means forty-three-hundred thousands of years. So such thousand times makes Brahmā's one day of twelve hours. Similar period, his night. Then day and night, it becomes full twenty-four hours. Then such thirty twenty-four hours makes one month. Such twelve months makes one year, and such hundred years he will live. So how you can calculate? It is beyond your arithmetical calculation. We have to go through the śāstras. So this is in one universe. And there are millions of universes and millions of Brahmās. And all of them live, taking the advantage of one exhaling of Mahā-Viṣṇu. Yasyaika-niśvasita-kālam athāvalambya jīvanti loma-vilajā jagad-aṇḍa-nāthāḥ (Bs. 5.48). All these Brahmās. So just see. How you can calculate? That is inconceivable. That is inconceivable.

Morning Walk -- December 10, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Therefore the best education, scientific advancement, is to recognize God behind everything. That is perfection. We are canvassing, "Accept God, accept God." But if the modern scientist, philosopher, they present, "Yes, here is God," by calculation, then people will take it more seriously. "Oh, the scientist is saying." That is wanted. We are fighting with the scientists and others because they do not accept God. That is their fault. Otherwise, they are friends. They are giving more stress on the physical laws, nature, but they do not know under whose indication the physical laws are working, the nature is working. That they do not know. Yasyājñayā bhramati sambhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ. It is the... In Vedic literatures it is said, chāyeva yasya bhuvanāni vibharti durgā. The nature is working just like shadow, shadow of God. Just like master says, "Go there." Immediately the servant goes there. The servant is not independent. by the indication of the master, goes there. So that is nature. And because the arrangement is so perfect... Just like you said, "Out of season, the flowers came out." So they cannot explain. The arrangement is so perfect that God desired, "Now there, let be these flowers," and nature immediately produces. The arrangement is so perfect that these people, they cannot understand. They become amazed, "How it happened?"

Svarūpa Dāmodara: That is called acintya.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes, everything is acintya. No scientist can explain anything. Even a straw. What is the constitution of the straw. They cannot do.

Morning Walk -- December 16, 1973, Los Angeles:

Viśvareta: Scientists, they have their mental process, but what is our process to understand this knowledge?

Prabhupāda: Ascending. Ah, descending, not ascending. We have to take knowledge from superior. We should not try ourself to know. That will be imperfect. Avaroha-patha. Just like we're receiving knowledge from Kṛṣṇa. We are not researching. Those who are researching, they cannot understand Kṛṣṇa. They understand Kṛṣṇa as ordinary human being, maybe little learned. That's all. The Dr. Frog's calculation of Atlantic Ocean. That's all. Avajānanti māṁ mūḍhāḥ (BG 9.11). (break) ...automatically. You see? But he does not know that behind this automation there is brain. He'll see, "Oh, how nice." That's all. Similarly, child-like scientist, they will say, "Everything is going on automatically." (break) ...but there is brain behind that.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yesterday Rūpānuga Mahārāja was telling me that about the calculation of time through the atom.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Rūpānuga: Calculation of time from the atom, Śrīla Prabhupāda. He is talking about Bhāgavatam. By the light passing over the atom, you can calculate the time, the sunlight passing over the atomic particles.

Prabhupāda: So?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: How is it done?

Prabhupāda: I have written that?

Rūpānuga: Yes, you have written, Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: What is that?

Rūpānuga: Third Canto. How the sunlight, you can tell time, that the atom is a subtle form of time, that you can tell time as light passes over the surface of an atom. And the experiment is that you look for atoms in a screen. When the sun comes through the screen, you can see in the sunlight hexatoms or six atoms with your naked eye. That experiment is given in Bhāgavatam. It is very wonderful. Vedic science. We should present that as the real actual science, real atomic science.

Prabhupāda: No, in Bhāgavatam there is regular calculation, what is the distance from one planet to another. Everything is there.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: The calculation is given.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Every planet is described, what is the constitution, what are the forms of the living entities there. Everything is there. Bhāgavata never says that "These, all the other planets are vacant. Only this planet is full of living entities." Bhāgavata is not so rascal. These rascals may say. Their theory is that "All other planets, they are vacant. Only this planet is filled with..." This rascal theory is not in the Bhāgavata. We see that there is living entity in the water. There is living entity within the sand. How you can say there is no living entity in other planets?

Rūpānuga: They say that "Life as we know it here does not exist." Human life.

Prabhupāda: No, how you can say so? The condition is the same. Every planet is made of earth, water, air, fire, the five elements. So if under these condition there are living entities in this planet, why not in that condition living entities in other planets? That is their ignorance. That is their bluff. The different condition of the planets is that some planet is fiery, some planet is gaseous, some planet is watery. That may be, but after all, they are made of these five elements. And each element, we find there is living entity. So it may be mixture or pure, there must be living entities. And in Bhagavad-gītā it is said sarva-ga. Even in the fire there is living entities. And why not? If living entities can stay in water, why not in fire?

Rūpānuga: On the sun planet.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. There are also living entities. They are very glowing, fiery. Therefore the whole sun planet is glowing.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes, far different. It can be immediately on the...

Prabhupāda: Just like Kṛṣṇa says, tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti (BG 4.9), "Immediately comes to Me." So just see the velocity. Tyaktvā deham. As soon as he gives up this body, immediately goes to Kṛṣṇa. So see... Where is Kṛṣṇa? You cannot estimate even this material world. And then you enter the spiritual world. And then you go to the highest planet of the spiritual world, Goloka Vṛndāvana. So you cannot calculate how far it is, neither by driving your aeroplane of mind and vāyu, you can reach there. But the soul is so powerful that immediately goes there. Just like mind. You are here, many thousand miles away, 25,000 miles away in somewhere, immediately goes, mind goes.

Morning Walk -- December 29, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: To calculate the planetary...

Prabhupāda: Just see. The comet...

Sujit: It is from astronomy.

Prabhupāda: Astronomy, yes. Astrology is part of astronomy. Yes.

Sujit: It's part of the science. It has been accepted as part of the science.

Prabhupāda: No, it is...

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Astrological science is mostly speculative theory.

Prabhupāda: Astronomy also.

Sujit: They are proving a lot of things. They are calculating when a certain star can be in certain positions.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, that can be done.

Prabhupāda: So our astrology is calculated by the position of the stars. By astronomy you calculate the position of the star, and they know, "If the star is in such and such position, the result will be like this." That is astrology.

Morning Walk -- December 29, 1973, Los Angeles:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: This looks like collecting some facts from some experience.

Prabhupāda: No, no. It is calculated by the astral movement. It is a great science. People do not know it now.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So Wolfe Prabhu was telling me that "So we don't believe in astrology, but when Śrīla Prabhupāda says, then you believe."

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Wolfe, he was telling me that, because I was telling him that I did not believe in astrology. Then one day Śrīla Prabhupāda was talking on astrology. Then Wolfe said, "If Śrīla Prabhupāda said, then you believe. And if it is not said by Śrīla Prabhupāda, you don't believe."

Prabhupāda: No. We believe in astrology. But because it is a difficult science, people do not understand it properly. That is another thing. In my practical life I see. In my horoscope, everything is written, what I am doing. Everything is written.

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Morning Walk -- January 3, 1974, Los Angeles:

Gurukṛpā: About forty-five min..., we..., it was still going but the plane passed it and it stayed behind.

Prabhupāda: Uh, so, this is a bad sign. Constellation. According to astronomical calculations. Therefore we, we follow the astrology according to the constellation. The child born, everything has connection, the constellation of the star has influence on the child. So therefore the horoscope-maker takes the calculation of the constellation and then calculate what is his future. This dhūmaketu is described in Daśāvatāra-stotra, dhūmaketum iva kim api karālam. Dhūmaketum iva. Dhūmaketum iva kim api karālam. As soon as there is comet, there will be some disaster. Very great disaster. In our childhood we saw the comet, not this like. That was small comet. Still, the first world war was there declared. That we have seen in 1914.

Morning Walk -- January 3, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) He cannot say what happened yesterday, and he's speaking fifty thousand years. Is there a statement in any śāstra or his own statement?

Karandhara: No, that's by mathematical calculation of the trajectory and speed.

Prabhupāda: Oh, mathematics...

Karandhara: It's going at a certain speed in a certain orbit. So they calculate that it would complete that orbit once every fifty to two hundred thousand years.

Prabhupāda: That is there in astrology, astronomy. That is not discovery.

Morning Walk -- January 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: ...accepting a leader, one has to consider what is the position of the leader. They do not take such account. Now they calculate if the leader is very cunning, then he is qualified. They think that politics means cheating, cunning, bluffing. That is good qualification. Lloyd George, sometimes before he came, he said, "Consistency in politics is the qualification of an ass." He must be inconsistent. And here, this is defense. Tasya vartamānasya. How he is situated (break) ...as it was everywhere, especially in India, that if one is not God conscious, he is a third-class rascal. That standard is now gone. Now to become God conscious, to talk of God, is a business of primitive fools. They think like that. Is it not?

Prajāpati: Yes. They say they are realistic and we are not realistic.

Prabhupāda: Who is realistic? The rascals?

Prajāpati: They think that people who believe in God are not realistic.

Prabhupāda: Oh. And what is the realistic?

Satsvarūpa: To work in social reform or politics is realistic.

Prabhupāda: Reform means that continuously reform? Then where is perfection?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: They have no standard.

Room Conversation -- February 13, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (break) ... Kalau nasty eva nasty eva gatir anyathā. (Hindi). ...on this principle(?) I went, with determination. (Hindi) Yasya prasādad bhagavat prasādo **. (break) (Bengali) ...seventy dollars per month. Seventy dollars means seven hundred rupees. So expenditure was over 2,000 rupees according to our Indian calculation.

Dr. Kapoor: And uh...

Prabhupāda: The income was nil.

Dr. Kapoor: Nil. How much money did you carry with you?

Prabhupāda: Forty rupees.

Dr. Kapoor: Forty rupees?

Prabhupāda: Yes. But I could not spend because there was no exchange for Indian currency, no (laughter). So it was kept as it is. When I came back in 1967, that was spent as my taxi fare (laughter). At that time it was spent. From Palam airport to Delhi, that Chippiwada. So they charged me thirty-five rupees or forty rupees. So at that time it was spent, and 1967 there was heart attack.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Devotional activities, either he leaves from home or not leaves, that doesn't matter. It must continue from the very beginning. For the management of affairs, we require to divide. Because there are different classes of brain, so those who have very intellectual brain, they should become brāhmaṇas. Those who are fit for management and protection, they should be trained as kṣatriya. And those who are fit for producing food, taking care of the cows, they should be trained as vaiśya. And the balance, they're all śūdras. This is the division. You... Everywhere you'll find this division, natural. One class of men, very intelligent. One class of men, very strong, good brain for management, administration. (aside) Jaya. One class of men, fit for tilling the ground, field, and produce food, take care of the cows. And the balance, śūdra. That's all. So in our society, this division should be there. The most intelligent class of men, they should be engaged in preaching, reading books and instructing, taking care of Deity worship, temple, and another class should be strong managers, that things are going on nicely. Everyone is engaged, not that eating and sleeping. Everyone must be engaged, employed. So, so if one is very much adapted for eating and sleeping, he should be engaged with plows. You see. He must be activity. Otherwise, there must be dysentery, eating and sleeping. He cannot digest. Yes. So in this way, our society should be managed. Not that "Give me second initiation, a sacred thread." And after getting it, business finished: "Now I'm liberated. Let me eat and sleep." This should be stopped. We have got fifty bighās of land, and I have calculated in Māyāpur, setting aside twenty bighās for the temple and grazing ground for the cows, thirty bighās of land. The production should be three hundred mounds of grains. And three hundred mounds of grain, I have calculated.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1974, Vrndavana:

Bhagavān: Fifteen hundred.

Prabhupāda: No. According to our present calculated, about 180 mounds. So there should be 120 mounds excess of grain. Instead of excess, they want ten thousand rupees for maintenance. This is... This management is going on. These things were not discussed in GBC? So what kind of discussion was there? Simply talking? No practical? And the estimate of budget was presented for ten thousand rupees per month. And... And when it was scrutinizingly studied, immediately it came down to six thousand. So what kind of budget? So management should be in that way, that nobody is sitting idly. Automatically he'll fall sick. Sickness means idleness. Or excess eating, sleeping. No excess, no less. Yuktāhāra-vihārasya yogo bhavati duḥkha-hā. Yukta. Yukta means actually what you need. (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. So everywhere, in each center, this system should be introduced, and there must be practical application of the varṇāśrama. At the same time, this program of devotional service. Then it will go on very nicely.

Morning Walk -- March 27, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...our calculation is if the Muslims were...

Dr. Patel: So bad as that.

Prabhupāda: ...so bad, then how they could rule for eight hundred years?

Dr. Patel: That is right, but they were bad enough. They were...

Prabhupāda: Bad enough... Your, our so called Hindus are worst enough.

Dr. Patel: That's all right. But they were bad.

Guest (1): Because devotees of Kṛṣṇa...

Prabhupāda: If they were bad enough, we are now worst enough. We are now introducing meat-eating and drinking and... We are worst.

Morning Walk -- March 30, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He... He has got indriyas, indriya. Just like in the Vedas it is stated, apāṇi-pādo javano gṛhīta. "He has no hands and legs, but He takes whatever you offer." So now, that, as soon as this word is there, that "He accepts whatever you offer," that means He has got hand. Indriyābhāsa. Indriyābhāsa. But not this indriya, the three feet hand. Suppose if you offer me something. You are three feet away. I cannot take it. But Kṛṣṇa is in Vaikuṇṭha. If you offer Him, oh, He can accept. Otherwise... He says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati (BG 9.26). Now He is in Vaikuṇṭha and Goloka Vṛndāvana. We cannot calculate where He is. How He's taking? This is material calculation. But He has got such a hand that anywhere you live, He can accept. Otherwise, if He has no hand... Therefore "He has no hand" means He has no this little hand like me.

Morning Walk -- March 30, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Dūrasthaṁ antike ca. Dūrasthaṁ, nobody knows where is Goloka Vṛndāvana, how many miles away. Dūrastha. They cannot calculate. But antike ca, He's within. He can accept your service.

Dr. Patel: Avibhaktaṁ ca bhūteṣu vibhaktam iva ca sthitam.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Avibhakt... The Paramātmā, He is distributed. That does not mean He has become many. He's still one. Avibhaktam. Although, īśvaraḥ sarva-bhūtānāṁ hṛd-deśe 'rjuna tiṣṭhati (BG 18.61), you cannot calculate, "Now īśvara is now divided, so His original position is now gone."

Dr. Patel: Bhūta-bhartṛ ca taj jñeyaṁ grasiṣṇu prabhaviṣṇu ca.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Dr. Patel: Jyotiṣām api taj jyotis...

Prabhupāda: Here... Jyotiṣām api taj jyotiḥ.

Dr. Patel: Jñānam jñeyam jñāna-gamyaṁ...

Prabhupāda: This, this... We have got jyoti calculation of this sun. But the sun is only a reflection of the brahma-jyotir.

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Now He explaining what is Brahmaloka. That one day of Brahmā, you cannot calculate. And still, you have to die.

Dr. Patel: Twelve hundred yugas is called one Brahmā.

Chandobhai: So our hundred years is nothing for...

Prabhupāda: It is nothing.

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is material calculation.

Dr. Patel:

śukla-kṛṣṇe gatī hy ete

jagataḥ śāśvate mate

ekayā yāty anāvṛttim

anyayāvartate punaḥ

naite sṛtī pārtha jānan

yogī muhyati kaścana

That is... Now you come.

naite sṛtī pārtha jānan

yogī muhyati kaścana

tasmāt sarveṣu kāleṣu

yoga-yukto bhavārjuna

(BG 8.7)

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the position. Sarveṣu kāleṣu. Not that sometimes here and sometimes there. That will take long time, but unless one comes to sarveṣu kāleṣu, always thinking of Kṛṣṇa...

Dr. Patel: Vedeṣu yajñeṣu tapaḥsu caiva dāneṣu yat-puṇya-phalaṁ pradiṣṭam...

Prabhupāda: Satataṁ kīrtayanto māṁ yatantaś ca dṛḍha-vratāḥ (BG 9.14). That is required.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...the universe, Kṛṣṇa may have another devotee like them. If there is another universe, why not another couple? There is everything another. Because we are limited, we want to make Kṛṣṇa always limited. How it can be? We should always remember Kṛṣṇa's inconceivable omnipotency. (break) ...know how many thousands of couple are there because Kṛṣṇa's, that birth is going on every moment. Therefore it is called nitya-līlā, in this universe immediately born, that that birth, that pastime, is again immediately manifested in another universe. He has grown old two days; so the same form again in another universe. The same example. Just like 6:30 AM on the sun, solar calculation, immediately in another country, 6:30 AM. Is it not?

Mahāṁsa: Yes.

Girirāja: (break) ...the position of being Kṛṣṇa's parents or hearing Bhagavad-gītā or being a cowherd boyfriend, can be filled by different living entities qualified in the different universes.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- April 10, 1974, Bombay:

Indian man (2): Because he had some fight with... So kāma, krodha, moha, lobha, he had that also... (break)

Prabhupāda: He is not a devotee of the Lord. So anyone... That is our criterion. Anyone who is not a devotee, whatever he may be... He may be very, very big or so-called saintly, but according to the description of the śāstras, na māṁ duṣkṛtino mūḍhāḥ prapadyante narādhamāḥ (BG 7.15). We shall calculate in that way.

Room Conversation -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: So far I have studied... I am traveling all over the world. It is my calculation that we can produce food to give food ten times of the population if we properly utilize the whole planet according to this-produce food. Why because the milk is produced more, the cows should be slaughtered when there is a need of milk? It is so nice foodstuff. So on account of this false nationalism, "This is my land, this is my land, this is my land..." And why not take it as God's land and produce enough foodstuff. There will be no scarcity. There will be no skeleton. And distribute it. Where is that consciousness? There is so much land uncultivated all over the world, especially in America, in Australia, and in Africa, so much, huge land, no cultivation. They are keeping some cows and slaughtering them and exporting. What is this? Why don't you produce food?

Yogeśvara: (translates)

Swiss Man (1): (French)

Yogeśvara: He says all of these things, they are known. They know there's enough land and all these nonsense things are happening. He says simply to give this...

Prabhupāda: And therefore knowledge is required.

Room Conversation with Robert Gouiran, Nuclear Physicist from European Center for Nuclear Research -- June 5, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: Struggle. We cannot do anything because the bigger creative energy's there. And we are simply trying to combat with Him. So therefore, uselessly we are struggling. That's all. We cannot change. Because the bigger creative energy is different. Prakṛti, the material nature. Just like they are trying to create living being in the laboratory. So suppose you are trying to create living being by scientific, chemical combination, so what is the credit to you? Millions of living beings are created by the material energy. Where is your credit? You cannot even create a small ant up till now. So simply you are wasting your time. That's all. Therefore it is called, prakṛti-sthāni karṣati. Eh? Just like the children are playing. What is the value of this playing? They are making some howling noise. That's all. What they can do? But they are thinking they are creating so many things. "We are Ṭhākura (?)." (laughter) So you all scientists, you are doing that thing. That's all. You cannot do anything. That is not in your power. Daivī hy eṣā guṇamayī mama māyā duratyayā (BG 7.14). It is very, very difficult, physical energy, which is being conducted... Just like you you have created this nuclear bomb, and if you take it and throw on the sun planet, what is the effect? Nuclear bomb can destroy something here. But where the... Your nuclear bomb will be destroyed if you throw it on the sun. Is it not? What is your calculation? We know the sun...

Robert Gouiran: If we throw... I didn't understand every word. You mean if we throw a bomb on the sun?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Mr. Tran-van-Kha, and President & Members of the Society of Buddhists in France -- June 15, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: So, if you take the calculation of Manu, Manu lives for 72,000 of yugas. One yuga is 4,300,000 of years.

Pṛthu Putra: (French)

Prabhupāda: 4,300,000 years, one yuga.

Pṛthu Putra: (French)

Prabhupāda: Multiply by 72. So that is the age of Manu. So, at least so many years before, Bhagavad-gītā was spoken to Manu's father, Sūrya. Sūrya, the Sun-god.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Time is eternal. Time is eternal, but we calculate time, past and present and future, according to my temporary material existence. Just like a small ant. The ant's past and present is different from my past and present. I am a human being. I live for hundred years. So my past and present is different from the ant who lives for, say, a few hours.

Professor Durckheim: Is different from?

Prabhupāda: From the ant, a small living entity. And similarly, Brahmā, his past, present, is different because he has done millions and millions of years as one day. So the time is eternal, but according to our condition, occupying the time and space, we calculate past and present and future. Otherwise time itself is eternal.

Room Conversation with Professor Durckheim German Spiritual Writer -- June 19, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: Time is there, but because I have got this temporary body, I am thinking past, present, future. The temporary body will vanish. I shall get another temporary body. Then again my begins past and present. So therefore this is called illusion. Time is eternal. It has no beginning, no end, but we transmigrate from one body to another. We are calculating, miscalculating, past, present, future.

Professor Durckheim: Yes, time has no beginning and no end. But time in this second sense has nothing to do with beginning and end.

Prabhupāda: It has no end, beginning, no end. The beginning and end is of this body. And in relationship with this body, we are calculating past, present, future.

Room Conversation with Pater Emmanuel (A Benedictine Monk) -- June 22, 1974, Germany:

Prabhupāda: But if you miss one point, if you commit mistake in calculation in one point, the more you make calculation, add and subtract, it is all mistake. (German) Just like in the bank they daily make a trial balance, and if there is one mistake anywhere, the trial balance does not come.

Pater Emmanuel: I understand.

Prabhupāda: This is called ardha-kukkuṭī-nyāya (Cc. Ādi-līlā 5.176). If you... I will explain. Ardha-kukkuṭī-nyāya means there is a logic of accepting half of the chicken. The chicken or what is called, cock, that?

Haṁsadūta: Oh, the rooster, hens.

Prabhupāda: Hens, rooster, rooster. No, the female is called hen?

Haṁsadūta: Hen.

Prabhupāda: Hen. The hen is giving egg and, by the backside, by the rectum, and eating by the mouth. So one man is considering that "This mouthpiece is expensive because I have to give to eat. Better cut it." So if the mouth is cut, then there will be no egg because it's a dead body. So this is not good logic, (laughing) that the expensive portion may be cut and the profitable portion may be kept. This kind of interpretation will not be helpful. If you accept the whole, this side and that side, then business will go on.

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 12, 1974, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: All yugas, Satya, Treta, Dvapara, Kali, the total years are forty-three hundred thousands of years.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. The calculations by the biologists for the beginning of life, they say it is about four billion years.

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: About four billion years ago, the small species like unicellular species like the bacteria and these started about four billions years ago. And the human life started...

Prabhupāda: Well, where started? Bacteria?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes. In the earth.

Prabhupāda: Then the earth was there.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, other Guests and Disciples -- February 12, 1975, Mexico:

Guest (4): Recently I was reading article in a science magazine and a space scientist, he has calculated that after 67,000 million years the universe contracts. And then I started calculating in terms of the yugas and the division which is mentioned. With the help of an astronomer I reached the conclusion that both figures coincide. So do you mean to say that when it was mentioned that after four yugas they will collide. Then it was a kind of vision, or might have been calculated by this...

Prabhupāda: Means calculation. It is going on, regulated way. Just like everyone knows that this month is February. In the month of June the summer will begin. Everyone knows. It is not conclusion; it is experience. There is no need of calculating. So one who has got better experience, he can say like that. Calculation and experience. Just like if somebody says, "Two plus two plus two plus two," somebody says immediately, "Six." And another calculates, "Two plus two plus..., six." So experience and calculation. Lacks experience, he calculates. One who has better experience, he doesn't calculate. One who knows past, present, and future, he doesn't require to make calculation. He knows everything. So God knows past, present, and future, and others who are favored by God, he also knows by the grace of God. Because he hears from God. God knows past, present, and future. Then he simply reproduces God's words, that's all. He doesn't require to calculate. Just like in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said, sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). The Kṛṣṇa says. Now, we can say what is the age of Brahmā by Kṛṣṇa's words. I don't require to be a very expert astrologer or astronomer. I hear from Kṛṣṇa, and I reproduce. Just like child. Father said, "This is this;" I say, "This is this." That's all. The child is not perfect, but when he says, "Father said this is this," that is perfect. Therefore our process of gathering knowledge from the father—we don't calculate or don't concoct or put theories, no. We don't do that. This is called śruti, śruti-pramāṇa, evidence from śruti.

Morning Walk -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Hṛdayānanda: ...the movement who previously had been expert in mathematics, how could he use that for Kṛṣṇa's service if he's expert in mathematics?

Prabhupāda: Mathematics? So you can calculate, "After so many years the whole universe will be destroyed." (laughter) Not of the universe but everyone's life. This body will be destroyed. Bhūtvā bhūtvā pralīyate (BG 8.19). And again you get another body. It will stay for so many years. Again you annihilate. Again you get. In this way eternal time is being wasted.

Hṛdayānanda: In the modern world the engineers are designing everything. So how can an engineer use his talent for Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Design a temple, nice temple. There are wonderful temples, very expert engineering. And they were ordinary men but the engineer was so nice that nobody can manufacture such temple in the whole world, still.

Morning Walk -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: Because they will not get sufficient food, shelter, bodily necessities. Just like it is already declining, already declining. Just formerly in our childhood we saw the Western people very tall. Now they are not tall. They are decreasing already. (break) In the Western countries, still there are some but in other countries they are very lean, thin and drawn. Stature of the body will decrease. Memory will decrease. It is already taking place. So in this way, you just imagine, in 400,000 years after, what will be the condition. You take mathematical calculation. (laughter) (break)

Hṛdayānanda: He's asking again about geographically, what will it be like as far as temperatures and the different continents. That's what he's interested in.

Prabhupāda: Yes, gradually everything will be barren. At the end of annihilation everything will be barren and by scorching the sunlight will be twelve times higher. So everything will be barren and burned into ashes.

Room Conversation with Metaphysics Society -- February 21, 1975, Caracas:

Prabhupāda: Just like we are sitting, ladies and gentlemen here. So every one of us, we have got different dress. The dress is superficial, but as ladies and gentlemen, human being, we are one. Similarly, each one of us can have a different dress. So these living entities, they are in different dresses only, and the dresses are calculated-8,400,000 different forms. In the water there are 900,000 different dresses. Similarly, the trees and plants, the two million different types of vegetables. Jalaja-nava-lakṣāni sthavara-lakṣa-viṁśati. There are insects. There are 1,100,000 species. Similarly birds, there are one million. And Pakṣiṇāṁ daśalakṣanam. Daśa-lakṣa means one million, one million types of bird. And three million types of beasts. And 400,000 forms of human being. In this way the living entity is passing through different dresses. And the best dress is this human form because in this dress you can understand what is God, what you are, what is your relation with God, and then you can act and go back to home, back to Godhead. Therefore if this dress, in this dress... I am living being; you are living being. So we are in this human form of dress. We have got developed consciousness. If we miss the opportunity to understand God, then again we are put into the cycle of this evolutionary process. We should not therefore misuse this form like other forms. We should utilize it properly to understand the unlimited God and our relationship with God and act accordingly. That is perfection of life.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Guest (1): Swamiji, what actually I was coming to, most humbly, cannot spread to the (indistinct) science go together. It's not...

Prabhupāda: No, if science is really science, that is helpful. If science is based on wrong theory, then what is the use of that. Everything is wrong. So many mathematical calculation, if there is any item wrong, then whole thing is wrong.

Guest (1): So we are all moving in the darkness, ignorance, to begin with.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that if you admit then you will get knowledge. But that is not the position. You are falsely proud that you are very advanced in knowledge.

Morning Walk -- March 11, 1975, London:

Brahmānanda: We do not really understand how demoniac, how calculating, our leaders are.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Brahmānanda: We have the impression, because we are taught from the very beginning in the schools, that the leaders are to be worshiped, that their birthdays are to be celebrated...

Prabhupāda: Where you are going?

Śrutakīrti: He's going to pick up that lawyer.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Brahmānanda: It is difficult to come to that understanding, that actually, those who are the leaders are not to be trusted.

Prabhupāda: Yes, leaders means government men. That is described. They are all thieves and rogues, anywhere. Dasyu-dharmabhiḥ. Dasyu. Dasyu means plunderers, rogues. Unless you become a rogue you cannot go to the government. You cannot... Any honest man cannot stay with these government men. That is not possible at the present age. Any government. Unless... Just like first-class rogue, your Nixon, he became the president. Because he was a first-class rogue, he became the president. So unless you are first-class rogue, you cannot stay within the circle of government men.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Devotee: He's coming.

Prabhupāda: Yes. India... Formerly your country was part of India, and you belong to the same culture. So far I understand, Iran means Āryan? So Āryan culture was practically all over the world. Āryan culture is based on God consciousness. So amongst the Āryans there is some conception of religion, either Christian religion or Mohammedan religion, Buddhist religion, Vedic religion, based on conception of God. So according to time, country, the ways of understanding may be little different, but the aim is God consciousness. That is Āryan civilization. So God is one; God cannot be two. So the features of God or angle of vision of God may be different. So they have been summarized in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam. (Aside:) You can come forward. One feature of God is impersonal. Just like the sunshine. Sunshine is spreading all over the universe. It is impersonal. But the quality of the sunshine is heat and light. The heat and light means energy. So as in the material calculation, the heat and light is the cause of all creation. Just like at the present moment there is not sufficient heat; therefore the trees have no leaves. And as soon as there will be little more heat they will be all green.

Evening Discussion -- May 6, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: In this connection you have quoted Lord Brahmā, saying that... Lord Brahmā says that the great material scientists, they may be able to calculate the atomic structure of the material world and the planetary system, but even if Kṛṣṇa is standing right in front of them, they can't calculate His potencies.

Prabhupāda: Vivekananda liked to say, he challenged Ramakrishna, "Can you show me God?" He said, "Yes," and he showed him God and then he became disciple.

Paramahaṁsa: They're saying that this Bal Yogeshwara, people ask him "Can you show what is God," and he says, "Oh, yes," then he shows them.

Prabhupāda: Where he is now, this Bal Yogeshwara?

Paramahaṁsa: I don't know where he is. There was one article about him recently, but they didn't say where he was. I think he was rejected. Maybe he is trying to start his own movement. But as far as his Divine Light Mission, he is kicked out.

Prabhupāda: Kicked out by whom? By mother.

Morning Walk -- May 8, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: Well, we don't have any experience of such a machine.

Prabhupāda: Huh? What do you mean by machine. First of all define what is your idea of machine. Just like the other day we saw, we saw the Thompson place, being printed, being collected, and so many things are being done. It is like this. By machine the seasonal changes are going on, the sun is rising, the moon is rising, the water in the ocean, the waves are there. Everything, machine working. It is machine. Everything being systematically done. Such a big ocean, vast water, it is just on the brink, no more. It is so organized. The sun is rising exactly in time, astronomically. The astronomical watch is one ten-thousandth part of a second. It is so accurate. You'll find everything is going on. (break) Today is ekādaśī, eleventh day of the moon, the moon shall be like this. There one can see the moon and he can calculate. "Today is ekādaśī." This is not machine? It is exactly, machine.

Morning Walk -- May 9, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: We don't think anyone can see.

Prabhupāda: No. Nobody can see. Therefore Vedas say your seeing should be through the book of knowledge. That is seeing. Not with your these rascal eyes. What is the value of these rascal eyes? We know that there is, through books, through geography, we know that the other side is India. Not by seeing with these eyes, by touching it or by smelling it. These senses are useless. But these rascals depend on the senses-sense perception. Therefore they are rascals. Imperfect sense perception they believe too much. Therefore they are rascals. They do not know the value of the senses. Mūḍhā. Paśyati jñāna-cakṣuṣā. That is seeing, jñāna cakṣuṣa, by the eyes of knowledge, not by these imperfect senses. Paśyati jñāna cakṣuṣa. Everyone is anxious for the future. Why do they keep bank balance? Thinking of the future. Why they make insurance? Why they make hospital insurance? Everyone is thinking of the future. But because he is rascal, he is thinking simply for this span of life. Tathā dehāntara prāptir. Again you have to accept another body. That they do not know. So rascal. Simply calculating for this span of life.

Room Conversation with Carol Cameron -- May 9, 1975, Perth:

Carol: Is it possible to carry out that enquiry while you're engaged in activities?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the real enquiry. Wherefrom my life has begun? What is the ultimate goal of my life? Why I am put into these conditions which I do not like? Who is enforcing? These things should be asked. That is the proper enquiry of the human being. And we cannot solve the question of birth, death, old age and disease, and you are theorizing something utopian. What is the use of such advancement of knowledge? I live for fifty years and sixty years, and the Darwin's theory they are calculating gap of millions of years. There is a gap of millions of years, and we will live for fifty years. How we are taking calculation of millions of years? Speculation simply. And misleading people. An honest man should not mislead others. He should understand that his knowledge is limited. How can I say something theorizing? That is not very good business. And misleading people. I have no perfect knowledge. I am theorizing. What is the use? I have no actually accurate knowledge, and I am theorizing. I am misleading people. Big bluff. That is going on. An honest man should not take part in big bluffs. First of all you must have accurate knowledge, and I am theorizing. I am misleading people. Big bluffs. First of all you must have accurate knowledge. Then you bring knowledge to others. That is our proposition. First of all make your life perfect, then you try to give knowledge.

Morning Walk -- May 10, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: They also eat, according to their taste. The hogs, they eat stool and they enjoy it. So, according to our calculation you are eating stool—the meat. And you are thinking you are enjoying, as the hog's thinking, that's all. It is a question of standard of enjoyment. Otherwise, enjoyment is there in every living sphere. (In car)

Amogha: It sounds very nice. If we chant Hare Kṛṣṇa we can feel unlimited pleasure.

Paramahaṁsa: It sounds too simple to be true.

Amogha: But maybe we can in addition to this unlimited pleasure, just to make sure we don't lose out on anything, maybe we can also enjoy all these other pleasures.

Prabhupāda: Yes, you (indistinct) motorcar and chant. You are working hard like an ass to get these motorcars. You'll get these by chanting.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: Really?

Prabhupāda: Yes. It is far, far away. Their calculation is wrong. They are going to a wrong planet.

Paramahaṁsa: It must be the Rahu planet.

Prabhupāda: Yes, or something else. Not moon planet.

Paramahaṁsa: How many...

Prabhupāda: It is above the sun planet.

Paramahaṁsa: Moon planet is further?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Paramahaṁsa: Oh. Because they say that the moon planet is the closest planet to the earth. That is their calculation. And they say that it orbits around the earth, and then that the earth orbits the sun.

Prabhupāda: All wrong. What is the... According to them, what is the distance of sun planet?

Paramahaṁsa: Sun planet is 93,000,000 miles.

Gaṇeśa: They say the moon planet is only 250,000 miles.

Prabhupāda: It is wrong thing.

Morning Walk -- May 12, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: Is their calculation for the distance of the sun wrong also?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Paramahaṁsa: 93,000,000? It says in the Bhāgavatam exactly what the distance?

Prabhupāda: The whole universe, diameter, is pañcaśat-koṭi-yojana. One yojana equal to eight miles, and one koti is ten miles, er, ten million. So pañcaśata, fifty into 10,000,000 into eight.

Paramahaṁsa: Yeah. So it's fifty crores yojana. Fifty crores yojanas?

Prabhupāda: Yes, fifty crore yojanas, pañcaśat. So one yojana equal to eight miles, one crore equal to ten million.

Morning Walk -- May 14, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: Sixteen hundred thousand. And what is their calculation?

Devotee (1): 250,000.

Amogha: Miles from the earth.

Prabhupāda: 459,000?

Amogha: 250,000 miles from the earth. They say it is very near the earth and that the sun is very far away.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...circumstances, it is now doubtful whether they are going to the moon planet.

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: How, one after another, how one is born out of the... That is... How the brāhmaṇas were there, kṣatriyas were there—everything in Vedic... These Vedic mantra means the history of human society. And the origin is God, Kṛṣṇa, Nārāyaṇa. There are other mantras wherein it is stated, eko nārāyaṇa āsīt. "Only Nārāyaṇa was there." Neither Lord Śiva nor Brahmā. Later on, they came. When he first cites the mantra, vande mahā-puruṣa te caraṇāravindam, śiva-viriñci-nutam (SB 11.5.33). Śiva means Lord Śiva, and viriñci means Brahmā. All of them offer respect to Nārāyaṇa. Indian astrology was taken by the Arabians first. The one, two, three, four, five, six, these figures were taken from India, up to nine, then zero. Then you make all mathematical, arithmetical calculation.

Amogha: The Arabic numerals came from India?

Prabhupāda: Yes. First of all they took the one, two, three, four, five, six, seven...

Śrutakīrti: The Romans had a very complicated system.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) If you write 1975 it will become so big. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: This "Sunday, Monday," means first sun, then moon. Where they are going? They are going to hell, not in the moon. This Vedic description is right. Because first study, Sunday... That, we offer gāyatrī to the sun. So the moon is after the sun—this is the proof, first Sunday, then Monday. So if their calculation is 93,000,000 miles from here, and moon is (sic:) one million, six thousand still farther, then where they are going? If they simply follow strictly this moon expedition and they admit they have not gone, then the whole civilization will change. All wrong conclusion. But they will have to admit now. Now they are serious, and they will have to say that they've never gone to the moon. And they will have to continue this. Otherwise they will be farce before the world. They will have to continue it. Now they are in such a position.

Paramahaṁsa: They can't just stop and say, "OK, now we..."

Prabhupāda: If they stop, then they are failure.

Morning Walk -- May 17, 1975, Perth:

Prabhupāda: This is nonsense, this telescope. That is their defect. They do not admit the imperfection of the senses. What we calculated? How many billions?

Śrutakīrti: To the sun?

Prabhupāda: No, no, the length and breadth.

Śrutakīrti: Oh, it is four billion miles.

Prabhupāda: Four billion miles. So how much the telescope can see? Can you see four billion miles? Eh? Where is the telescope? If you cannot see perfectly even ten miles, with telescope you can see, say, a hundred miles or something more, something, but can you see four billion miles?

Śrutakīrti: No.

Prabhupāda: Then? What is the use of this telescope? (pause) Nothing will be finished. God's resources are unlimited, but they will be finished. Making research, research, they will be finished. God's resources will not be finished, but they will be finished. Unnecessarily they have created necessities of life. In this way, in blind capacity, they... After fifty years where this big geographist is going? He does not know. And he is thinking what will happen hundred years.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Hari-śauri: There was one newspaper article in the paper I was reading. They were advertising a new book about the evolution of man. And they were saying that there was approximately two million varieties of life on this planet. This was the calculation of the scientists.

Prabhupāda: Two millions? No, 8,400,000.

Śrutakīrti: You were saying the other day that all the species of life are mentioned in the Padma-Purāṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Hari-śauri: ...they made their calculation.

Prabhupāda: Why there are varieties?

Amogha: They say originally there was just a cell, and by adaptation in some circumstances, one kind would live and another would die. So all these varieties adapted to different conditions.

Prabhupāda: Who adapted this? Who managed?

Amogha: Well they just... accidentally.

Prabhupāda: Ah, that is nonsense. Nothing happens accidentally. That is nonsense. There must be some arrangement. What is happening accidentally? Why you are taking care of these trees? So many things. Nothing is done accidentally. You do not see the cause. If accidentally one can become rich, why you are struggling so hard to become rich? Why their motorcars are flying whole day and night, here and there? Why you are trying? Let accidentally money come, and sit down. Why do they not do that? "If accident is there, let accident come and I will become rich man." Why they try? Why they go to the college? Let accidentally you become M.A., Ph D. This is all rascaldom, simply poor thought. Poor thought. If things happen accidentally, why you are trying? What is the answer?

Amogha: Well, we try, but—we have to try—but we can't tell what's going to happen. So it's happening accidentally when we try. Just like in school we have to try, but maybe we will become promoted.

Prabhupāda: No, if you believe in accident, then you should not endeavor for anything. Nothing happens accidentally.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (break) ...and the water. (Hindi). (break) ...and one fourth land and we are puzzled with the increase of population. But there is no puzzle, three-fourths water population. Wherever you go, you get immediately many thousand fishes. So just imagine how many fishes are there. These rascals say "Overpopulation." Why not overpopulation there? Huh? The fishes, for want of food, they are dying and floating? Why overpopulation? All their calculation are simply bogus. There is no question of overpopulation. Even... Just like people simply can live on mango and coconut. Where is the question of over-population? It is chastisement. When one cannot get proper food, that is not due to overpopulation. It is due to godlessness. As soon as people will become godless, nature will chastise them—no food, no rain, suffer. This is law. (?) (break) ...signpost.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Devotee (2): Did they actually land on the moon, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: No, they cannot go there. What is the question of landing? They cannot go there. It is far, far away. What you calculated? 1,600,000 miles away, up the sun planet. 1,600,000 miles above the sun. According to your calculation, the sun is away from this planet by 93,000,000 miles. And above that, 1,600,000 miles. Then you go to the moon. How it is possible?

Guru kṛpā: How is the moon behind the sun?

Prabhupāda: Not behind, above.

Guru kṛpā: It is a bigger planet?

Prabhupāda: No.

Morning Walk -- May 27, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: That is God's wish. "You can go up on Me? What is this?" Their calculation is that moon is nearer, is it not?

Guru kṛpā:. Yes.

Prabhupāda: But not moon is nearer; sun is nearer. And above, in the proportion, 1,600,000 miles, above moon there is Mercury, Mars, in this way, Venus. It is not so easy.

Śrutakīrti: The planets are not orbiting the sun.

Prabhupāda: No, no. They have got their different orbits.

Guru kṛpā:. This is real science, to know these facts.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: That is their foolishness. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ (BG 9.10). They are observing this nature, very powerful, but the powerful nature is working under the order of Kṛṣṇa. Mayādhyakṣeṇa. It is being informed, but they are so poor brain, they cannot understand it. Mūḍhā. Our position is just like these foams. By one little wave, millions of foams are coming out and again finished. It is like that, our position. So our position is like foam; we are taking estimate of the ocean. This is our position. Our position is like one of the drop of the foam, and we are calculating the strength of the ocean. And when you cannot calculate, it is accident. That's all. Finished business. It is accident. Everything is being done accident. We will never admit that we cannot calculate. Accident, that's all. Dismiss.

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the meaning. But they will give a different way. They will never say, "No, we cannot calculate. We do not know. It is beyond our..." They say, "Oh, it is accident." And boys are going to understand science. They understand this, that everything is accident. So why do you go there to understand the accident, spending so much money?

Bali-mardana: (break) ...ask the scientists about the soul, they say, "We are not fit to say anything about the soul. We do not want to comment about the soul. So we will just not discuss it."

Prabhupāda: What they will discuss?

Bali-mardana: They like to discuss their own speculation, matter, material things.

Prabhupāda: And what is the use?

Bali-mardana: They say that "We should discuss only the things that we can see and the things that we can know with our science. Anything we do not know is not fit for us to discuss."

Prabhupāda: Why? You cannot see your death? So why you are making medical science to stop death? You do not see death, but it is sure that you will die. So why don't you wish to die? (dog barking in background) There, the scientists' barking. (laughter) So many cars, all our? No.

Morning Walk -- June 2, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Four billion. So how they can calculate?

Paramahaṁsa: If they took a photograph of the earth planet from up in space, they would probably also say there is no life.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Devotee (3): They say because the atmosphere is not like this planet, others cannot live there.

Prabhupāda: Why not atmosphere? The moon planet, there is a planet. There is space. There is surface. There is dust. So why not atmosphere the same? It is made of the same ingredients, earth, water, fire. Why do you say that is not same atmosphere?

Devotee (3): They are saying that it's too cold or too hot.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. That is here also. There are many cold places. Do they think that in the cold places there is no life? All nonsense. And only nonsense will believe them. I never believed it. Why? Here we see under this sand there is life. The crabs, what is called? They live within, so many hundreds of thousands. We have seen on the sand.

Morning Walk -- June 10, 1975, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: It is not that if we prove scientifically there is soul, if there is scientific proof, not that all the people of the world will become Kṛṣṇa conscious, even if you do that. So it is useless. You simply understand what is stated by Kṛṣṇa.

Harikeśa: Can a material calculation prove a spiritual fact?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Harikeśa: Can a material calculation prove...

Prabhupāda: No. Materialists cannot understand spiritual subject matter. It is not for them.

Harikeśa: So there is a project in Los Angeles where some psychologists are examining all the devotees.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Harikeśa: Some psychologists are there. They are doing a laboratory test on all the devotees.

Prabhupāda: Yes, he may study in his own way, but he will not profit.

Morning Walk -- June 27, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Na satyaṁ teṣu vidyate. This is the whole population. They do not know... There are big, big nation, big, big philosopher, big, big scientists and all very big, but what kind of life they should live, they do not know. What is the accurate destination of our life, that they do not know. And all humbug, big, big scientist, philosopher, theologist, and so on, so on, politician, sociologist, welfare. But real thing, they are rascal. They do not know which way we have to go. So what is the use of these big, big words? They do not know which way to go. Suppose we are walking. If we go to the this side without knowing that "This is water; we should not go," then what is the use? That is their defect. Pravṛttiṁ ca nivṛttiṁ ca na vidur āsurāḥ janā. Na śaucaṁ nāpi cācāro (BG 16.7). (chuckles) Śaucam, cleanliness, they do not know, neither behavior. Nāpi cācāro. Jagad āhur anīśvaram; (BG 16.8) "Oh, there is no God. It has come out out of the sand." This is the whole population. Jagad ahur anīśvaram (BG 16.8). Which way we shall go? (break) Therefore we require vigorous propaganda to make these fools to understand what is the real aim of life. That should be our propaganda. Idam adya mayā labdham imaṁ prāpsye punar dhanam. They have simply calculated, "Now today the bank balance is now three millions dollars, and tomorrow it will be four million."

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: So far Kṛṣṇa consciousness is concerned, you can take it: since five thousand years, when Kṛṣṇa was present, He gave this instruction. But it existed before Kṛṣṇa's instruction. About forty millions of years ago He gave this instruction to the sun-god. That is mentioned in the Bhagavad-gītā:

imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ

proktavān aham avyayam

vivasvān manave prāha

manur ikṣvākave 'bravīt

(BG 4.1)

So if we take up the statement of Bhagavad-gītā, then five thousand years ago this was spoken for the second time, and first time it was spoken forty millions of years ago. Therefore it is permanent, not that something new. It is existing eternally. Sometimes we are missing, and sometimes we are accepting, but it is existing eternally. You cannot trace out the history. Our calculation of history means we are trying to make the eternal time relatively limited with our life. But the time is eternal. We are changing our forms of life many, many million times, but the time is there. So the calculation of past, present, future is relative according to the duration of my life. An ant's past, present, future is not the same past, present, future as of human being. The past, present, future is relative according to the duration of life and body. So Brahma's past, present, future and our past and present, future is not the same. So time is eternal, and past, present, future is calculation of relative knowledge. That is not correct.

Room Conversation with Mr. & Mrs. Wax, Writer and Editing Manager of Playboy Magazine -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Jayatīrtha: Like the frog in the well.

Prabhupāda: Yes. A frog in the well is thinking, "This is the limit of water." (laughter) And if you say there is Atlantic Ocean, he cannot understand it. He will think, "What is that?" "Oh, it is very big." "How much? Is it three feet? It is four feet?" "No, no, very big." "Five feet?" "No, no, still..." "Six feet?" So he is calculating in that way, "Four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten," but Atlantic ocean is beyond his conception. So these are all Dr. Frog's philosophy. Yes. And the so-called philosophers, they are Dr. Frog. (laughter) We consider them as Dr. Frog. Some of my students who are doctors, they are now trying to give up their job because they are understanding this is all false knowledge.

Television Interview -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: It is not the question of inferior or superior. Different. Now you take one inferior or superior. That is your calculation. But the bodily features are different. That is material. But spiritually, they are all one. Materially... Just like your bodily feature and a man's bodily feature is different. Now, so far question of inferior, superior, that is your calculation. But we say that by nature, a woman and man is different.

Television Interview -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Then if you not saying that, then they are different in their physiological condition. So now this physiological condition, you may calculate, "This is better, this is better." That is your calculation. Our calculation is the man and woman are different in their physiological condition.

Woman reporter: But you say women are subordinate to men.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is also natural. Because when the husband and wife are there or the father and daughter is there, so the daughter is subordinate to the father and the wife is subordinate to the husband.

Woman reporter: What happens when women are not subordinate to men?

Prabhupāda: Then there is disruption. There is disruption, social disruption. If the woman does not become subordinate to man, then there is social disruption. Therefore, in the western countries there are so many divorce cases because the woman does not agree to become subordinate to man. That is the cause.

Room Conversation after Press Conference -- July 9, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: Then where is the proof? From 1920 to 1975, where is a woman who is extraordinarily bigger than man?

Brahmānanda: Well, they might be able to bring some scientist who would say in 1975 that according to their calculations, there is no difference between the brain of a woman and the brain of a man.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Prabhupāda: One universe. This is the smallest. Four-headed Brahma. (break) ...all universes taken together, that is one-fourth energy. And three-fourth energy is spiritual world. Ekāṁśena sthito jagat (BG 10.42), one part. (break) ...asat koṭi-yojana, one yojana equal to eight mile. And one koti means ten million. So fifty into eight, two hundred, into..., ten into ten million..., it comes. I have calculated four billion. How many millions make a billion?

Harikeśa: A thousand. (break)

Prabhupāda: Sun is situated in the middle from this circumference, two billion up and down. And the moon is situated above the sun, 1,600,000 miles. How they can go to the moon?

Devotee: They think the moon is closer than the sun.

Prabhupāda: They may think, but we are thinking in this way. Who is right?

Devotee: We are right, the Vedas.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) ...thinking is right because they could not go to the moon. They say they went, but actually they could not. Now they are disappointed.

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Brahmānanda: Actually they are finding bones now, they claim, that challenge his theory. They are much older than what he ever thought. So they have to change all the calculations.

Lakṣmī-nārāyaṇa: Even their method for dating the bones is defective also.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Lakṣmī-nārāyaṇa: They have a scientific, not scientific, but they have a process how they date the bones. It's called the carbon 14 dating process, and it's been proved defective. (break)

Jayatīrtha: ...so many bones, they should draw the conclusion that the big problem is death.

Prabhupāda: (chuckles) That is impossible, sir. You lick up your bones, but you have to die. You have to lay down your bone now.

Room Conversation with writer, Sandy Nixon -- July 13, 1975, Philadelphia:

Prabhupāda: (laughing) But your mother is very good. Yes, son inherits the quality of mother. And the daughter inherits the quality of father. Yes. So if the mother is good, naturally the son is good. That is Vedic calculation.

Woman: I'm sorry you said that.

Prabhupāda: (laughs) This is all physiological. And we have seen, studied, that any big man of the world, behind that big man is either a strong mother or a strong wife. That is the general statistics. And Cāṇakya Paṇḍita says, mātā yasya gṛhe nāsti bharyā cāpriya-vādinī. If there is no mother at home and the wife is not very suitable, does not speak very nicely with husband, disrespectful, then he is recommended to leave home and go to the forest. Araṇyam tena gantavyaṁ yathāraṇyam tathā gṛham. Such person should immediately leave home and live in the forest because for him the forest and home is the same. Mātā yasya gṛhe nāsti bharyā cāpriya-vādinī. So women should be trained up to be very faithful and chaste. Then the life will be very happy. That is the only education for woman. And man should be educated how to become first-class man, a brāhmaṇa. Then the whole atmosphere will be very happy. The man, first-class man, brāhmaṇa, śamo damaḥ titikṣa, and woman, very faithful to such husband and chaste. Then the home is happy.

Press Conference -- July 16, 1975, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: I was born in 1896, now you can calculate.

Reporter (2): What will happen to the movement in the United States when you die?

Prabhupāda: I will never die.

Devotees: Jaya! Hari bol! (laughter)

Prabhupāda: I shall live for my books, and you will utilize.

Reporter (2): Are you training a successor?

Prabhupāda: Yes, my Guru Mahārāja is there. Where is my photo of Guru Mahārāja? I think... Here is.

Reporter (2): Why does the Hare Kṛṣṇa movement not engage in social protest?

Prabhupāda: We are the best social worker. People are fools and rascals. We are teaching them nice idea of God consciousness. We are the best social worker. We will stop all crimes. What is your social work? Producing hippies and criminals. That is not social work. Social work means the population must be very peaceful, wise, intelligent, God conscious, first-class man. That is social work. If you produce some fourth-class, fifth-class, tenth-class of men what is social work? We are producing that. Just see. Here is first-class man. They do not have any bad habit, illicit sex, intoxication, meat eating, or gambling. They are all young men. They are not addicted to all these things. This is social work.

Room Conversation -- August 21, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Yes. Find out. First of all He spoke that... If you take history of Bhagavad-gītā, then it comes to forty millions of years ago, at least, He spoke Bhagavad-gītā. How do you calculate? The calculation is there. Any intelligent man can calculate because Brahmā's duration of life is mentioned there. Sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brāhmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). So one yuga means forty-three lakhs of years and multiply it one thousand. That is Brahmā's duration of one day. Now, in one day there are seven Manus. So Vivasvān Manu's age can be calculated—at least forty millions of years ago. So the Bhagavad-gītā is not a new thing. It was spoken five thousand years ago to Arjuna. That was not the first speaking. He says, "I first spoke to Vivasvān, the sun-god." Yes, show him. (Bengali) ...I am manufacturing something. Everything is there. "If you simply follow, a great, wonderful thing will be done." She is now in a position. Simply she has to take the instruction of Bhagavad-gītā and apply it practically. And that is not very difficult. Just like the Bhagavad-gītā says, annād bhavanti... Parjanyād bhavanti bhūtāni. Make this program, immediately.

Morning Walk -- August 26, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Then why do you say all right? Money is not there; then how it is all right? Why do you say all right? Say not all right. Money is not there. So this is the position. Guesthouse, if it is organized, yesterday we calculated we can get five hundred, six hundred rupees daily. So why it should not be done? That is also incomplete. Everything is incomplete. Source of income incomplete, and whole thing is incomplete.

Dhanañjaya: Guṇārṇava Prabhu has estimated that it will cost at least another five thousand rupees...

Guṇārṇava: 75,000.

Prabhupāda: So I know that even if it is given, 75,000, you'll never finish it. That I know.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: What we are doing is...

Prabhupāda: Then you will say, "Our estimate was wrong. We were mistaken." This is going on. Several times, "This is estimate," money paid—"No, it was wrong. Pay more." This is going on. What is the estimate, what is the right estimate, nobody knows.

Morning Walk -- September 13, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Oh, that's nice. So you are going to the magistrate? You have calculated?

Saurabha: Ten thousand bags.

Prabhupāda: Ten thousand bags. No, I wanted to construct this building with bricks.

Saurabha: Yes, but we have to make some slabs and some...

Prabhupāda: Slabs? So still you will require ten thousand?

Saurabha: No. If we do with mud, then it will be much less.

Prabhupāda: Not mud. The mortar means sand and cement.

Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: From historical point of view it is copied because Vedas are created by Brahmā long, long, many millions, millions of years, and Bible is created two thousand years. So we have to take the original. All religious system of the world, they are taken from Vedas, from different parts. Therefore they are not complete. The age of Bible is not more than two thousand years. The age of Veda you cannot calculate, millions and millions of years.

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: Why is it, Prabhupāda, that in earlier parts of the Kali-yuga no one like yourself came throughout the rest of the world and preached Kṛṣṇa consciousness?

Prabhupāda: Huh? Preached? Caitanya Mahāprabhu preached. His descendant preached. Why do you say no one preached?

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: But throughout the rest of the world, places like Japan and Australia...

Prabhupāda: Your calculation of the world. If it is preached anywhere, that is preached on the world. It was not spread, you can say, but it was preached.

Morning Walk -- October 5, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: A three-feet well, and a frog is there and he is thinking, "This is everything." And some friend comes and informs, "Oh, I have seen very big water, Atlantic." He simply imagines, "Oh? It's big? How much big? One feet more? All right, two feet. All right, three feet," like that. So the frogs in the well, they cannot understand. You should be not a frog in the well; you should be liberal to hear from the authorities, Vedas. Then you will understand. And if you remain a frog in the well... All these rascal scientists, they are all frog in the well. They have got little calculation of this planet, and they have no information of... There are so many millions of planets. What do they know? They cannot, could not study even this moon planet. Wrongly study. The moon planet is above the sun planet, 1,000,600,000 miles above. What do they know? They are thinking the moon planet is in between the earth and the... So the all wrong calculation.

Morning Walk -- October 12, 1975, Durban:

Prabhupāda: Hospitals, there are many, but real hospitals... to cure the material disease, there is no hospital. They are... There are hundreds and thousands of hospitals for curing the disease of the body, but there is no hospital to cure the disease of the soul. That is the defect. So we are opening hospital for curing the disease of the soul. They have no information about the soul throughout the whole world. Even so-called religious organizations, they have no information about the soul. They go to religious ceremonies for material profit. They do not know what is the necessity of the soul and what is the disease of the soul. They do not know. (break) ...nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ param avyayam. What is the goal of life, these people, they do not know, mūḍhas. Mūḍha means rascals, gadha. They do not know what is the goal of life. They take calculation of the duration of life, that fifty, sixty, or hundred years. That's all. Beyond this, after this, they do not know. Yes. That is the defect. (break) Now, in the Bhagavad-gītā it is said that this temporary attempt to become happy-antavanta phalaṁ teṣām—it will end with the end of the body. But they do not know beyond this. Therefore alpam-medhasām, they are less intelligent. Just like a child playing. He likes to play and does not go to school. So do you think that is all right?

Indian man (3): No.

Prabhupāda: So therefore we are doing like that. We are concerned that "I have got this body. Let me enjoy to the fullest extent and don't mind what I am going to have in future. It doesn't matter."

Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Possess, you can possess. Tena tyaktena bhuñjithā (ISO 1). The real proposal is that everything belongs to God. Then God's representative, king, he gives you land. But you require for ten men's foodstuff. You calculate the ten men's foodstuff, for producing, you require so much land, so the king gives you land. You work and grow your food. And because it is God's property, you give some tax. Whatever you produce, twenty-five percent give to God or king, and balance, you enjoy. If there is no production—no tax. This is peaceful life. You work. You take land, God's land. You cannot... Why you have occupied so much land? Others, they are not allowed to enter; where there is overpopulation? How you can expect peace? Just like in China and India and other places they're overpopulation. Why don't you allow them, that "In Africa there is no sufficient population. Please come and toil and grow your food and live peacefully"? Where is that formula? Rascals, they are wanting peace. All rascal, rogues. And why they have become rascal, rogues? For want of God consciousness. They do not know that it is God's property, falsely thinking, "My property." And today I am thinking, "My property," and next day I become a dog on the same property. Hm? This dog loitering, who can say he was not formerly a Mr. Smuts? Who can say? Maybe he was Smuts; now he is dog. How can you take him? This is nature's process. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13). After death you'll have to accept another body. Now who can guarantee that General Smuts did not accept a dog's body? Who can guarantee? Where is the science? You think that he is dead and gone, but Kṛṣṇa does not say like that. Tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. Now what kind of body he has got? Where is the scientist to ascertain that "Mr., General Smuts has got now this body. He is living here"? Where is the science? You simply see like a fool and rascal, "My father is gone." Where your father gone? Where did he live so long? Why did you not see him? Where is the science? He is simply crying like a child, "My father is gone." Where he has gone? Find him out. And what he was? Why did you not see so long? This is their knowledge.

Morning Walk -- November 4, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: We are talking of this verse, that if this is the composition of the body, these things are available anywhere. Why don't you create life? Therefore he is no better than the dogs. He has no intelligence that "How this combination of blood, urine, stool, and bone, and muscle can create life?" They are thinking that a combination of matter can bring life force. That is the so-called scientists' theory. So these things are available in large quantity, so why don't you create life? Therefore go-kharaḥ. Their intelligence is not better than the cows and the asses from the very beginning. If they are not cows and asses, how they can think of that combination of these material things can bring in life? When a man dies, find out if there is scarcity of stool or scarcity of urine or scarcity of blood. Bring it and inject it. These rascals, they cannot do it, and still they are calculating urine examination, blood examination and this examination. (laughter) No, I am not saying. It is śāstra. (laughter) Take this dead man's body, and whatever urine and stool is there, examine, and then inject, and come him, let him back, come to life. Then I will understand that your examination of the stool, urine is perfect. This is common question. So long the soul was there, you are very expert to examine stool, urine and this and that. But when the soul is gone... Now the stool is there; urine is there. Why don't you examine and give life? This is our challenge.

Morning Walk -- November 7, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: They have got a big planetarium in Calcutta.

Prabhupāda: Yes, they have got, but we have also got. So it is little difference. Just like we are calculating that the sun is the beginning of the planets, sun, then moon. Therefore we say "Sunday, Monday." This is very quite reasonable. Tuesday.

Dr. Patel: And Tuesday is next word because Maṅgala.

Prabhupāda: Yes. And planet is 1,006,000 miles above, above. And Saturday, Saturn is the last. So now sun is calculated to be 93,000,000's miles from earth, and if the moon is still further 1,600,000, then it becomes about fifteen hundred thousand miles. No. Fifteen million miles. So how they are going, in four days, fifteen million?

Dr. Patel: You ask me?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (laughter)

Morning Walk -- November 19, 1975, Bombay:

Brahmānanda: Yes. The sun is larger in the sky, so that means it is nearer to the earth?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Should be. Because you calculate about the stars, very, very far away. Is it not?

Brahmānanda: Oh, yes.

Prabhupāda: Then which is smaller is far away. (break)

Yaśomat-nandana: ...systems are bigger than the smaller ones?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Yaśomatī-nandana: The upper planetary systems, are they bigger than the lower ones? In other words, sun is bigger than the earth, the moon is bigger...

Prabhupāda: Yes, there is measurement.

Morning Walk -- November 21, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But they are Aryans originally.

Prabhupāda: No, no. This you are calculating from the skin.

Dr. Patel: No, no skin. From the blood group. (laughter)

Prabhupāda: Blood or skin, the same thing. The same thing. The same thing.

Dr. Patel: All the Aryans have got B blood group in majority of them.

Prabhupāda: Skin comes from the blood. You know better than..., medical practitioner.

Dr. Patel: Skin is nourished by blood. It comes from something else.

Prabhupāda: So that is not the way. When there is symptoms... The symptom is... First symptom is that he must know that he is not body, and he must know what is God. Then it is Aryan civilization.

Morning Walk -- November 29, 1975, Delhi:

Haṁsadūta: Marx, he studied history from a given point and then he just calculated the consequences.

Prabhupāda: No, that point is not new point. It is already stated five thousand years ago. So what credit he has got? If I say, "Now you are thirty-four years. At the end of hundred years you will die," is that discovery?

Haṁsadūta: No. But that was...

Prabhupāda: Everyone knows it. Everyone knows it.

Haṁsadūta: But for this he's got so much credit because he said this.

Prabhupāda: So he gets credit from the rascals and fools. That's all.

Morning Walk -- November 30, 1975, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Means children are born by others. He feeds them. That's all. This is going on. (break) It is easily calculated that government will collapse very soon. They have made changes because they cannot manage.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Also they try to change their image. They'll always...

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Tejās: Every six months they've been changing the ministers.

Prabhupāda: That means mismanagement.

1976 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 19, 1976, Mayapur:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: You said that when you were very young you always used to calculate what was the cost of a ticket to Purī.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Every day I was seeing how to go to Jagannātha Purī and how to go to Vṛndāvana. At that time a fare was, for Vṛndāvana, four or five rupees, and similarly for Jagannātha Purī. So I was thinking, "When I shall go?" That's all. I took first opportunity to go to Jagannātha Purī after my examination, and in business connection when I went to Agra, then I first of all took the opportunity to go to Vṛndāvana from Agra. This was in 1925, and I visited Jagannātha Purī sometime in 1920. And '25 I went to Vṛndāvana. I remember, in those days I was sitting within the car, and there was some prasādam. One monkey entered and took away everything.

Morning Walk -- February 4, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: So how earth has gone so quickly round that it is seen, the different position of the sun? This means sun is not fixed. Sun is moving. And in the Bhāgavata it is said that it is moving at the rate of sixteen thousand miles per second. I think I have calculated that. Sixteen thousand miles.

Hṛdayānanda: Prabhupāda? Does that mean that the sun is going around the earth?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Hṛdayānanda: Is the sun going around the earth?

Prabhupāda: Sun is going around the whole planetary system.

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So the scientists say the same thing except they say that the earth is moving, not the sun. Same explanation you have given for the colors, they give, except that they say that the earth that is moving, not the sun. They wouldn't accept that point as a proof that the sun is moving.

Prabhupāda: No, sun is moving because the earth and the sun... The distance is the same, but you can calculate the distance from the rising up to the... It is millions, millions of miles. So unless the sun is moving, the earth cannot move so swiftly.

Jagadīśa: They are always the same distance apart?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Jagadīśa: The earth and the sun are always the same distance apart?

Prabhupāda: Same distance is to be supposed according to your theory, because sun is fixed.

Jagadīśa: According to our theory.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The same distance. But you calculate that how quickly it comes. You calculate the distance.

Morning Walk -- February 6, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Higher means it is higher for you because you are so dwarf. You are so dwarfed, you'll find that this tree is very big tree. You see? A small dwarf man, a pigmy, he'll say, "Oh, it is a big tree." So it is all relative. What is called? Relative world? Higher and lower, this is all relativity. You are so low that you see a tiny thing very high. It is due to your lowerness. Where there is no tree, these trees will be considered: "Oh, very high tree." So your scientists and your appreciator, all, they are like tiny dwarfs. What do they know about the universal affair? That is their fault. They are so small... That, the same example, Dr. Frog, calculating Atlantic Ocean. This is the fault. They do not consider their position. Just like there are thousands of ants. We can immediately kill them. And they are thinking they are very big, the ants, that "We are very busy. We are very big." So these rascals' position is like that. If the devatās in higher planets like, all the population of this material, this earth, they can kill like this-finish. Just like we can kill the ants.

Morning Walk -- February 9, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Sil Mullik and De Mullik. There are two Mulliks. Their gotra is also different. So in the marriage, before marriage taking place, one has to calculate whether they belong to the same family, same disciplic... Then, if it is the same, the marriage will not... Same blood will not be accepted. Same family means same blood. So throughout the whole world same blood is not allowed, marriage.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, that's going on other places in the world too.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- March 12, 1976, Mayapur:

Bhavānanda: ...maṭha, and then we went to Mādhava Mahārāja's maṭha. So Acyutānanda gave a very strong lecture at Mādhava Mahārāja's maṭha that in order to make devotees who are chanting the holy name, it takes more than any material calculation or business sense, that you have be infused with the potency of the Supreme Lord. All of the sannyāsīs and brahmacārīs were standing out on the balcony and hearing Acyutānanda glorify Your Divine Grace. All the devotees went in.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...small card. So one card is put into the shoes, and one card is in his hand. That's all. Number. Suppose twenty shoes duplicate, so one twenty card is put into the shoe and one number twenty in his hand. So a man can see that it is his shoe.

Morning Walk -- March 17, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: How many visitors, according to your calculations?

Jayapatākā: So that's about between 9,000 to 25,000 an hour.

Hṛdayānanda: They averaged fifteen or twenty thousand an hour.

Jayapatākā: Per hour. Then they, all day they're coming...

Hṛdayānanda: So yes, well over a lakh.

Pañca-draviḍa: Two lakhs. Last night was big. Last night...

Prabhupāda: No, the police officer said that "From all different parts of Bengal, they are coming to see your temple."

Morning Walk -- March 18, 1976, Mayapura:

Nanda-kumāra: By the scientist's calculation of what's happening with the revolving, they can predict an eclipse.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Nanda-kumāra: They can say in advance when an eclipse will come.

Prabhupāda: Well we can also predict.

Morning Walk -- March 21, 1976, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: You cannot explain. You, you rascal scientists, from so much distant, you have calculated, "This is thi..." This is all wrong. Yasyājñayā bhramati sambhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ. They are carrying order of Kṛṣṇa, not your order. Yasyājñayā. "By the order of Govinda," not your order. Yasyājñayā bhramati sambhṛta-kāla-cakraḥ.

Pañca-draviḍa: (break) "There may be a God, but all these stories..."

Prabhupāda: "There may be." That is rascaldom.

Pañca-draviḍa: All these stories about Him...

Prabhupāda: Anyone who says "maybe," he's not scientist. He's a rascal. Then why shall I hear him? Rascal. Why shall I waste my time? I am not going to waste my time to hear a rascal. How can I? I have got value of my time. As soon as he says "Maybe there is God," he's a rascal.

Room Conversation -- April 23, 1976, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Majority is not the calculation. Minority. If one person carries out the order of Christ, then he is Christian.

Guest (3): Exactly.

Prabhupāda: Otherwise they are not Christians.

Guest (3): That's right. But I just wanted to say one thing...

Prabhupāda: Our principle is that if one person carries out the order of God, he is actually the prophet. If he does not carry out—simply by dress he is prophet—it is useless.

Room Conversation -- May 7, 1976, Honolulu:

Prabhupāda: Stalin is calculated to be greatest criminal in the world. He has killed so many men. All rogues. We were taken through the neighborhood of all aristocratic men who were killed in the revolution.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: While reading about China, one of the books I was reading also described Cambodia, Vietnam and Korea. And the recent histories of these countries are so horrible, that the... Mostly in that part of the world now they have become totally anti-American. They are very, very anti-American because of what the Ameri... The Americans have simply gone there and...

Guru-kṛpā: Not Korea.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Huh?

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: North Koreans don't love Americans.

Guru-kṛpā: No, not north Koreans, South Koreans.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: But now Korea is united.

Guru-kṛpā: No.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes, I've been reading, they hate the Americans in North Korea.

Guru-kṛpā: Trivikrama has left Korea now, he went to... He's left. He's in Japan.

Prabhupāda: Oh. He could not do anything?

Guru-kṛpā: I don't know, he has left there. He went for 3 weeks and left. Now he's in Japan. I don't know where. He's doing something.

Prabhupāda: If he could not do anything, he can come back to America.

Morning Walk -- May 25, 1976, Honolulu:

Hari-śauri: But they don't calculate the moon to be so far away.

Prabhupāda: That is their foolishness.

Hari-śauri: We did that calculation on the basis of 95,000,000 miles, which is about 2,000,000 miles from what the distance we get from the Bhāgavatam, combined with 93,000,000 miles...

Prabhupāda: But they say (sic:) ninety-three miles. Sun is (sic:) ninety-three miles away.

Hari-śauri: But we don't say that.

Prabhupāda: No, no. We say also.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: And the sun planet is ninety-three million miles, and according to Bhāgavata, the moon is 1,600,000 miles away from sun. So I have calculated the other day that it takes ninety days, no?

Hari-śauri: No, six or seven months.

Prabhupāda: Six or seven months it takes to go to the moon planet. How they have gone in four days? They have never gone.

Devotees: Oh, jaya!

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How did you get that calculation, Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: How did you make that calculation?

Prabhupāda: Calculation, they have calculation that sun planet is ninety-three million miles from, that is, they have accepted. I also accept it. I say the moon planet is 1,600,000 miles still further. So you cannot go to the sun planet, how can go to the moon planet?

Devotees: Jaya.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Ask them. If they say moon planet is first, why not Monday first? Why Sunday first? That's a fact. Sun planet first, then moon, then Mars. Ravi, Soma, Maṅgala, Bhū. That is the calculation.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That means that all the countries are cooperating together to cheat the people, because they're all...

Prabhupāda: No, no. They have taken from the Vedic literature.

Bali-mardana: No, they are right, Sunday, Monday.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rādhāvallabha: They bounce sound vibration off a planet, and depending on how long it takes the vibration to come back, that's how far away the planet is. So they've calculated the sun to be further in that way.

Prabhupāda: First of all, answer why Sunday first. Then talk of all nonsense.

Candanācārya: Mars is after the moon?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Candanācārya: Mars is after the moon?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Rādhāvallabha: Śrīla Prabhupāda, by calculating the movements of the moon, scientists can predict years in advance when the solar eclipse will be.

Prabhupāda: That is not their invention. That is already there. (pause) (walking) We shall go further? No? (japa)

Hari-śauri: One thing is, Śrīla Prabhupāda, if they've wrongly calculated the distance of the moon, then how is it that they're able to calculate these eclipses and whatever?

Prabhupāda: That I do not know. First of all, answer this. Yes. Yes. They say the moon planet first. I say, no, sun planet.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, all over the world, they accept Sunday first.

Mahendra: All of their successes are accidental. Just like they discovered the planet called Pluto. The way it was discovered was one man recognized that there was a fluctuation in the orbit of the planet Neptune, and so he made some calculations and figured that the fluctuations were caused by another planet that must be further away than Neptune that no one has discovered yet. So he made many calculations and figured out where the planet should be, how big it should be, how much it should weigh, how far away it was. So then he told other scientists about it, and they looked in their telescopes, and sure enough, there it was. But it wasn't as big as he said, nor was it as heavy as he said, nor was it as far away as he said, and when they rechecked the data they found that the orbit of the original planet wasn't really wrong either. So all of his calculations were wrong, but still the planet was there. So somehow or other he stumbled upon it, but all of his calculations to find it were absolutely wrong. That's the planet called Pluto.

Prabhupāda: Recently there was an propaganda. That comet?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, it would come and destroy,

Prabhupāda: There was no comet.

Morning Walk -- June 4, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: That is movement. Now, according to their calculation, sun is fixed up, but according to our calculation it is moving. That is the difference.

Rāmeśvara: And it is actually being pulled by a chariot and horses.

Prabhupāda: Whatever it may be, it is moving. Either chariot or on leg. That does not.... It is moving. Moving is the point. Either on chariot or on leg, that doesn't matter. Sun is moving. But they say sun is fixed up.

Trivikrama: They say it's moving, but not the way we say, around the earth.

Prabhupāda: No, they do not say.

Morning Walk -- June 11, 1976, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Supreme mystic.... "If You like, it is possible; otherwise not possible. From calculation it is impossible." That is the subject matter.

Kīrtanānanda: But nobody before you even tried.

Prabhupāda: They came for some money or some reputation or "England-returned." The Bon Mahārāja, this Vivekananda, and all, all these rascals who are coming, that's all. They come for some money and woman, some prestigious position, the material things. For prestigious position, for money, for women, means it is all material. They have no spiritual idea.

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: This material calculation is not made by a devotee. When one is devotee, he'll chant more and more. He'll aspire, "If I could get millions of tongues and trillions of ear, then I could finish. That is devotee. And one is thinking how to finish it by chanting once, he's not devotee. That is neophyte stage. Therefore the regulation is you must chant sixteen rounds at least. Because he'll simply try to avoid it by his so-called intelligence.

Makhanlāl: It's possible for even a neophyte to chant offenselessly?

Prabhupāda: Not possible, but he has to do it. This is offense, to think that "I have chanted once; my all sinful activities are now neutralized." This is offense. Nāmno balād yasya hi pāpa-buddhiḥ. This is the offense. (break)

Makhanlāl: Chanting, following the orders of the spiritual master...

Prabhupāda: That's all right. No calculation.

Morning Walk -- June 14, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: There may be offense. You should go on chanting. That will be adjusted as you advance in chanting. Harer nāma harer nāma, harer nāma eva kevalam (CC Adi 17.21). Simply go on chanting. We shall see later on what is offense and not offense. (laughter) Chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, not for any profit. But go on serving Him. That's all. Material calculation, "Now, this much I have profited..." (break) .... there is no animal?

Devotee (1): This jungle?

Prabhupāda: There are some deers.

Ambarīṣa: Yes. Yes. I just saw a raccoon just now when I was getting the car. There are some in there.

Prabhupāda: There is no monkey?

Ambarīṣa: (laughter) No.

Morning Walk -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Prabhupāda: Today, there was description, there is description, the fight was so severe that the blood sprinkled up to the sun planet. So why not moon planet? Why they say sun planet? The sun is the nearest planet from the earth. So this calculation.... They say the sun planet is 93,000,000 miles away from earth? And if you add further 1,600,000 miles, it comes to about fifteen (50?) million miles. Fifteen (50?) million miles, they have calculated, go there by the sputnik at the rate of 13,000 miles per hour. (indistinct)

Ambarīṣa: They said they went fifteen million?

Hari-śauri: No, according to our calculation.... We agree with the figure 93,000,000, as approximate to the sun, but then our figure is 1,600,000 beyond it to the moon.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) Ambarīṣa does not agree. (laughs)

Morning Walk -- June 15, 1976, Detroit:

Satsvarūpa: Sun, moon.

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Sun planet, moon planet, Mars, Jupiter, like this, last, Saturn. So if this is systematic, then this calculation also means sun planet first. Why Sunday first?

Hari-śauri: You've defeated everyone, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Any one of these boys can answer? Why Sunday first? Ambarīṣa Mahārāja?

Ambarīṣa: Why Sunday first? Because the sun is closer to the earth. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: That is my version.

Room Conversation and Reading from Srimad-Bhagavatam Canto 1 and 12 -- June 25, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Abhirucir, yes. Now formerly marriage was a religious ceremony. Marriage was, this boy and this girl should be married, it is a religious function where the father and mother will see their horoscope and see if they are compatible, they will agree, they will live peacefully, so many things are there. Still, in India such things are calculated by the parents of the boy and the girl. But in this Kali-yuga, dāmpatye abhirucir. Abhirucir means the boy and the girl, if he likes, if he says, that's all. No other calculation. And the, after three days after marriage, there is divorce. (laughter) Because abhirucir, "I like, I don't like," that's all. Now I like, and after three days I don't like, finished, business. In Chicago I saw a newspaper. One girl, within three weeks she has divorced two husbands. (laughter) Yes, I saw it in the newspaper. So this, formerly the father, mother used to see that this boy and this girl are going to be married. So by horoscope, by other circumstances, by family, cultural, by education, so many things, whether they will live peacefully. That was the understanding. Husband-wife means, a man requires a woman, a woman requires a man. They should be combined in such a way that they can live peacefully. If there is no disturbance of the mind, then they can make further progress in spiritual life. Therefore marriage is also necessary, and that must be properly done. This was the... Now there is no such consideration.

Garden Discussion on Bhagavad-gita Sixteenth Chapter -- June 26, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Hari-śauri: This description is perfect, actually, because most of his fortunes they calculate he amassed by many illegal methods, like paying off police and fixing so many things up. With his money, he was always able to buy government officials and like this and get so many contracts to further the development of his aircraft companies and this and that.

Prabhupāda: He has manufactured airplanes?

Hari-śauri: Yes, he had something to do with airplanes. And also he had a lot of land in Las Vegas, this gambling city. So many... He was involved in many mysterious maneuvers. It's open in the newspapers, they said that he got most of his money from illegal methods.

Dhṛṣṭadyumna: In his old age he was very afraid of germs. He didn't want to catch any disease. So he would wear..., he would live in perfectly sealed rooms with all artificial air and light, so no germs could exist, and he would wear these...

Prabhupāda: He did not know that he's creating germs within his body.

Morning Walk -- June 27, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Śyāmakunda: The people should eat their..., the people, then, according to that philosophy, right?

Prabhupāda: No, when man is dead, why the economic calculation is not taken? Hm?

Devotee (2): Because they think it is animallike.

Prabhupāda: Animal or a man, when it is dead, then it is the same value. Is there any difference of value between the animal body and man's body?

Devotee (2): They think it is barbaric.

Prabhupāda: "They think," but you think like human being.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Maybe. So first of all let them go. They cannot go. According to our calculation, Vedic calculation, the moon is above sun planet, and the Mars is above moon planet.

Rādhāvallabha: Oh. Then they would have to go past the sun.

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Rādhāvallabha: Then they would have to go past the sun.

Prabhupāda: No, no. First of all, according to their calculation, 93,000,000's miles... So the moon is above 1,600,000 miles. And again 1,600,000. So another three million miles above the sun, it becomes sixteen million miles. So if they cannot go to the sun planet, how they can go to the Mars? All bogus.

Garden Conversation -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: That's a fact. Sunday is first, and Monday-moon is beyond sun. If they accept that nobody can approach sun, then how they can approach moon? In calculation, eighteen thousand miles per hour, and if the moon is situated 95,000,000 miles, then how they can go in four days? These are my questions. They have not been answered. It takes at least seven months. And they went in four days, and the man's mother... His photograph was there. She said, "At last my son has gone there." You have seen that photograph? I have seen it. Mother was satisfied. This is going on.

Room Conversation After Film -- June 28, 1976, New Vrindaban:

a few photographs, supposedly of Mars, then that's considered a success.

Prabhupāda: Photograph you can take anywhere.

Hari-śauri: Yes. Could they actually...? Are they actually sending these spaceships to another planet, or...

Prabhupāda: That they know. According to our calculations, they have not gone. Therefore false propaganda. They cannot go. (end)

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Life from egg, chicken. It gives life within week. So why shall I wait for millions of billions of years? You show, you make some combination of chemical and show that life is coming within a week.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We want to defeat this. So in the next slide, in subsequent slides, Sadāpūta will show some mathematical calculation showing that this is completely wrong.

Prabhupāda: Yes, it is wrong. We can see, even a layman can see. No question of mathematician, a layman can see, here within a week we see life, why shall I wait for millions of billions of years?

Rūpānuga: Śrīla Prabhupāda, it is described in the Vedas that life begins as a pea size. In the body, the womb of the mother, the human life is only pea size, emulsification, and then in nine months it develops into this very small series of chemicals and everything, into a full body.

Prabhupāda: No, no. In the Bhāgavata it is stated that life symptoms begins after five days.

'Life Comes From Life' Slideshow Discussions -- July 3, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Sadāpūta: We were trying to see how we could explain these fossils that geologists speak of, and it seems like one way of looking at them.

Prabhupāda: But their calculating mind, in whatever you explain you have to give reference to the śāstra, and they will say it is, what is called? Myth, mythology. They'll refuse immediately that thing. But you have no other source to explain. And they will take it immediately, "It is all mythology."

Rūpānuga: (to Sadāpūta:) What about that chart you were working on comparing the ages, the Vedic ages and the scientists ages? Do you have that? Can we talk about that now? We should ask Śrīla Prabhupāda if there's any real parallel there. One thing we were thinking, the way they talk about time in past ages, Sadāpūta put the Vedic ages side by side with their idea and saw some comparison there, it looks like there may be some...

Prabhupāda: That is the... They will take our idea as mythology, and we shall take their idea as most imperfect.

Morning Walk -- July 4, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: No, nonphysical, that doesn't mean it has no measurement. It has measurement.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: So measurement... Actually, Sadāputa calculated from how much the size is. Now from electron microscope, actually we can get an idea about the tip of the hair, how much it is. Now you divide it by one ten-thousandth part, so it (will) come out the size of the soul is about two angstroms, by calculation like that.

Prabhupāda: Two atoms?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, angstroms. Angstrom is the smallest scale that science can imagine. It is smaller even than the hydrogen atom. So actually it is atomic, it is very small in size.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Morning Walk -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: ...Western scientists, philosophers, they are all Dr. Frogs. They simply calculating three feet water, that's all. As soon as you speak to them about Atlantic Ocean, they say, "Oh, it is impossible." Froggish brain. (break) ...word has come, kūpa-māṇḍūkya-nyāya, the frog in the well.

Hari-śauri: Prabhupāda, is that example also given in the Bhāgavatam? Frog in the well? Sometimes you use all these different examples, and they are all there in the Bhāgavatam. I was just wondering if this frog in the well was also there.

Prabhupāda: No.

Hari-śauri: You use very graphic examples; they're very perfect.

Prabhupāda: No, my Guru Mahārāja used to use to place so many examples, (laughs) I do not know all of them. No, there is a book, Nyāya-śāstra, logic. You'll find all these things.

Room Conversation -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: First try to point out as many as you can. And our view is they are wholesale mistaken. They are imperfect, speculating.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: There's one strange point here about calculating this that dawn of Brahmā about two billion years old. Now strangely these geological calculations, they also claim that at that time the first free oxygen in the air appeared, first time. The beginning there was no free oxygen. We can accept that? (laughter) Now from here, anyway, this is the basic point, that once this oxygen appeared, free oxygen, then the living entities began to appear slowly. That is the whole theory of this chemical evolution. The results for the chronology is just put it that dawn of Brahmā is two billion years old?

Prabhupāda: You can carefully read the Second Canto, Bhāgavatam, Third Canto. You'll get all the knowledge, how things develop. It is a question of development. So maybe there was something missing, but after development it is manifested there. That is possible.

Room Conversation -- July 5, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: What Manus? There is seventy-two into 432,000 years. So they are calculating five thousand years... What is this nonsense?

Rūpānuga: No, the Christians calculate, but the others, they go back more than that time. The scientists... These Christians are not accepted so much as.... They're not included in scientific knowledge; they are considered something else.

Prabhupāda: My point is that the Christian theory is also imperfect and the scientists also imperfect.

Rūpānuga: We can show both.

Prabhupāda: If you can show that, that is all right.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: According to Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, the moon is situated 1,600,000 miles away up to the sun. Upper. So according to their calculation, 93,000,000 miles, sun is situated from the earth. And if the moon is plus 1,600,000 then it becomes 15,000,000 miles. So 15,000,000 miles it takes about...

Hari-śauri: Ninety-five million.

Prabhupāda: Ah?

Hari-śauri: Ninety-five million.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That. Ninety five millions.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Svarūpa Dāmodara: For analysis. Little portion of the rock that they have brought from different stratas(?), they have distributed all over the world. And the report is coming that a portion of the elements (indistinct), so from there they calculate how old the moon is. It's about the same age as the earth, about 4.5 million years.

Prabhupāda: They say similar rocks are available here.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yes.

Prabhupāda: Then why they bother about bringing rock from there?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: To investigate more.

Prabhupāda: What is investigation? Simply bluff.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: So their Astronomical calculation, the sun is fixed up, that is also wrong. The sun is not fixed up.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yeah, Your Divine Grace, you wrote me a letter saying about the universe is just like an inverted tree.

Prabhupāda: Yes, ūrdhva-mūlam adhah-śākham (BG 15.1), Bhagavad-gītā.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: And the tree, and the leaves, and the fruits and flowers are the planets.

Prabhupāda: Ūrdhva-mūlam, Gītā says, ūrdhva-mūlam adhah-śākham. The pole-star in the... And we see at night everything is moving. As a bunch it is moving.

Hari-śauri: Does that means all the planets are fixed in relationship to each other as well?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. Just like a tree. Tree is fixed up, as a whole tree is moving.

Room Conversation -- July 6, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: That we already admitted. That I can see ten feet, let me credit, take credit for that. But why shall I say, "I can see the whole universe." What is this nonsense? Speak the truth. "Now we have manufactured machine, and this, I have calculation that..." All talking nonsense. I say it is not possible for you to see beyond ten feet. Why you are claiming that you can see the whole sky? That is our protest. You can see ten feet, take that credit, that much. If somebody manufactures the electric lamp, all right. Take this. But if he says, "I can manufacture the sun." Then he is to be beaten with shoes. Talking nonsense. You take this credit, that you have manufactured light in electric bulb, that's all right. But why you claim that, "I can manufacture the sun"? That is their claim, defying God. Because we are explaining God consciousness, therefore we have protest. Otherwise let them move(?), all nonsense (indistinct). But we cannot tolerate when they challenge God.

Interview and Conversation -- July 8, 1976, Washington, D.C.:

Prabhupāda: How did you get the information?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: In the card catalogue. I think Pradyumna found it. Pradyumna, three, four, five of us went there to see the library. Actually we went to discuss that Sūrya-siddhānta and some of the astronomical calculations. We wanted to check in the library, but they didn't have anything. We found some.

Prabhupāda: Found?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: I found one Bhāgavata-purāṇa, it was printed in sometime 1901. Their summary of Bhāgavatam, they also described the planetary system, earth first, then... No. Yes, earth, then sun, then moon, like that, in circles.

Prabhupāda: They are... Just see. Their all activities are in Arizona. That's all. That is disclosed yesterday.

Morning Walk -- July 9, 1976, Washington D.C.:

Prabhupāda: Everything speculation. The down portion is older, no?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, the.... In these rocks the upper one is older according to their calculation by dating method, geological dating method and the younger one is at the bottom. First I wanted to contact our Prabhu at the, Bob.

Hari-ṣauri: Bob Cohen.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Yeah, Bob Cohen our geology.... Sometime Prabhupāda had trouble with this boy?

Devotee: In a Back to Godhead article.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct)

Svarūpa Dāmodara: We are going to contact him. So how do we explain these things?

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: How do we explain from our point of view? The upside down of the rocks.

Prabhupāda: I cannot. First of all, we do not bother for all these things.

Room Conversation -- July 10, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: Nobody could answer, a simple question. (Hari-śauri explains "Sunday, Monday" question to Svarūpa Dāmodara in background(?)) According to Vedic astronomical calculations, sun is first.

Svarūpa Dāmodara: But does it have to do anything with distance, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Hmm?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Does it have to do anything with the distance? As the sun is recorded first?

Prabhupāda: No, according to them if sun is first, then it will be ninety-three million miles. And if the moon is still away, one million six hundred thousand miles, it becomes ninety-five million miles. How they are going ninety-five millions of miles in four days?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: No, on that ground it is reasonable to know that they couldn't go there, but...

Prabhupāda: Therefore I say they couldn't go there. Their asset is Arizona, that's all. All this propaganda is gone, and at last they wanted to satisfy by delivering some sand and rock, that's all. Actually the business was not done.

Morning Walk -- July 12, 1976, New York:

Bali-mardana: In Arizona there is much government land. I passed through there recently. So there is good facility for them to make secretly.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The moon business was done there.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This means it's definitely a very calculated plot to cheat the public.

Prabhupāda: That's all.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And the whole, all of the nations...

Prabhupāda: Just to convince people that our, this rascal civilization is advanced.

Evening Darsana -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Mr. Kallman: Very small profit.

Prabhupāda: Yes. The Marwari business man, they want to sell, for suppose, one lakh of worth goods, if there is customer to pay him immediately one lakh ten rupees, he'll sell, immediately sell. He thinks "I've got that ten rupees," that's all. Again person. That is their way of doing it. They are not calculating that I have invested one lakh of rupees, I must get at least ten percent profit. No. Not at loss. A little profit. "Never mind, give me cash." That is Marwari business. And he, when he goes to purchase from his supplier, he sees that this man is purchasing at the time one lakh, two lakh. So he gives him all credit.

Morning Walk -- July 13, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: The chicken is bringing from the egg life within five days, and they are calculating millions of years. Such rascals are passing as scientists. If chemical is the basis of life, just make some experiment, take the chemical and make a small egg and put into the incubator and bring life. Why they do not, hmm? It will take millions of years, and the chicken is bringing within five days?

Bali-mardana: They say in a few years they will do it.

Prabhupāda: Why few years? Rascaldom. Dr. Chicken is doing in five days, so why you enjoy this title? You give up. You be ashamed. You are shameless, therefore you are talking all this nonsense. You have no human sense also.

Interview with Newsday Newspaper -- July 14, 1976, New York:

Hari-śauri: Are we surprised at the way the movement has expanded and prospered in just a few short years.

Prabhupāda: No, it is not surprising, it is natural. If you do, just like if you do business in proper way there will be profit. Similarly, as it is enjoined in this book of knowledge, if you do like that it will expand, it will prosper. Two plus two equal to four. Mathematical calculation. If you make two plus two, it will become four. It will neither become three nor five. So here it is said, you have read the, that "One who is engaged twenty-four hours in My service, so I, yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham (BG 9.22), I supply whatever he requires and I protect whatever he has got." So if you actually serve Kṛṣṇa, then everything you want, it will come.

Interview with Trans-India Magazine -- July 17, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So actually this varṇāśrama system is meant for bringing the man in the lower status of life to the higher status of life. It doesn't matter one is born in a low-grade family. That is also said by Kṛṣṇa: māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ (BG 9.32). Pāpa-yoni, lower grade. Striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrāḥ (BG 9.32). In the human society, woman, the vaiśya and the śūdra, they are considered in the lower status, not very intelligent. Te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim. They can also become... So in the Western countries, according to Vedic calculation, they are mlecchas, yavanas, low grade. But Kṛṣṇa says ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ, "He can also be elevated, to that extent as he can go back to home, back to Godhead." So this movement is directly giving the opportunity of Kṛṣṇa's service so that they can become immediately bona fide to the position in the highest grade of life, Vaiṣṇava, so that he can go back to home, back to Godhead.

Morning Walk -- July 20, 1976, New York:

Prabhupāda: So how can I believe you? If you don't believe Kṛṣṇa, shall I have to believe you?

Rādhāvallabha: They have calculated that as soon as you come within a certain amount, a billion miles of the sun...

Prabhupāda: That is you. That is you, not Kṛṣṇa. That is the difference between you and Kṛṣṇa.

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Yogeśvara: Can the older boys be trained in a particular kind of devotional service? For example, press work?

Prabhupāda: Oh, yes, everything is devotional. Śravaṇaṁ kīrtanaṁ viṣṇoḥ smaraṇaṁ pāda-sevanam (SB 7.5.23), there are varieties. We are not Māyāvādī, impersonalists, finished, all business. It is not like that. So whatever business is going on in our movement, everything should be taught according to the capacity, boys or girls, it doesn't matter. Some department is suitable for the boys, some department are suitable for the girls. In this way, they should be trained up. But everyone should be trained up to give service. That is Gurukula. And brahmacārī, this sex impulse should be controlled. That ruins the whole character. Our big, big sannyāsīs are becoming victimized. So that is the danger. Woman is good, man is good; when they combine together, bad. This is the material world. Both of them are good, but when they combine together, they are bad. This is material world. In the spiritual world, there is no such combination of sense gratification. Therefore it is always good. Everyone is part and parcel of God. So they are good. In the spiritual world, they combine together, it becomes bad, in the material world. In the spiritual world there is no such combination of sense gratification. Therefore they are always good. So you have to train like that. In the spiritual world there are very, very beautiful women, thousand, thousands times. Here, in the heavenly planets, they are calculated the best perfectional body of the woman.

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1976, New Mayapur (French farm):

Prabhupāda: That is because you have to go from America to India. You must know. (laughter) You have to calculate two plus two equal to four, a little mathematics. But this biology and this "logy," they are useless. There is no necessity. What you'll gain by understanding biology? Even one who knows biology, the medical man, he gives a tablet, "Perhaps it may help you." "Perhaps." He's not sure. So what is the use? First of all, he'll take one ounce of blood from you, and they send, this station, that station, now making a chart, then he'll give you a tablet, "Perhaps it may help." This is going on. Even the biggest pathologist, medical man, cannot guarantee that whatever medicine... (break)

Yogeśvara: ...some group doctors? Some portion of the devotees medical knowledge?

Prabhupāda: There is no harm, but when medical men are available by paying something, why should you waste your time? There are so many things we purchase, you pay for them. Not that we have to learn everything. So many things we have to do. Does it mean that you have to learn everything?

Hari-śauri: There's lots of doctors, but there's no brāhmaṇas, devotees.

Prabhupāda: Yes. So the principle is, don't waste time. If one has already learned medical science, all right, bring him to some service. But not that our men have to go to the medical college to learn medical science. That is not the point.

Evening Darsana -- August 11, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: That I am speaking, that this is the only chance of Kṛṣṇa, guru, and if he neglects this chance, then tanwan sthito hi ga(?). What is the loss more than that? We are simply calculating loss and gain. Just imagine what is the loss by misusing this human form of body. If you want to spoil this life under the influence of misleaders, you can do it. But if you prefer to take the sense of following leadership of Kṛṣṇa, then our life... Mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. That comes mām ekam, ekam—then your life is successful. Ahaṁ tvāṁ sarva-pāpebhyo mokṣayiṣyāmi mā śucaḥ: (BG 18.66) "I'll give you protection in all respects." So if we don't take this opportunity, then we are cutting our own throat. Do it, you can do it. Who can save you?

Jñānagamya: You have said it's like two airplanes. If an airplane is in trouble, no other airplane can help.

Prabhupāda: God can help. Other airplane cannot. If God likes, He can save you.

Evening Darsana -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: We have got idea, breathing period. Within second we are having two, three breathing. So within the breathing period of Mahā-Viṣṇu innumerable universes are coming out. This is greatness. How great is God, it is same idea, that within the breathing period innumerable universes are coming. We cannot conceive of one universe, but we get the information that innumerable universes are coming out during the breathing period. Yasyaika-niśvasita-kālam athāvalambya jīvanti loma-vilajā jagad-aṇḍa-nāthāḥ (Bs. 5.48). That Mahā-Viṣṇu, yasya kalā-viśeṣa, part and plenary portion, govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi **. So when we speak all these things, they'll take it mythology. And a cheap god comes, we'll accept, "Here is God." This is the position. They do not try to understand that actually God is great, how great He is. That is called kūpa-maṇḍūka-nyāya, Dr. Frog's philosophy. Dr. Frog is within the well, three feet length and breadth. He's thinking, "This is the ultimate reservoir of water." And when he's informed there is Atlantic Ocean, he simply calculates, "All right, this is three feet. It may be six feet or it may be seven feet; all right, come on, ten feet." He's going like that. So God is not like that, within our calculation. In the Bhagavad-gītā when Kṛṣṇa was speaking about the vibhūti-yoga, He was speaking "I am this amongst this." Find out this vibhūti-yoga, Twelfth Chapter I think it is.

Morning Walk -- August 12, 1976, Tehran:

Prabhupāda: I don't go out. We do not go to the movies or to the restaurant. It is different taste. Therefore it is calculated three kinds of men-sāttvika, rājasika, tāmasika-their tendencies are different.

Nava-yauvana: Karmīs can't understand why a devotee doesn't want to go to the cinema.

Prabhupāda: So many things—they do not smoke, they do not drink, they do not go to cinema.

Hari-śauri: We're as good as dead. (laughs)

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Harikeśa: What happens with all these people who, like for example, myself, I can't live on a farm?

Prabhupāda: Eh?

Harikeśa: I can't live on a farm.

Prabhupāda: That does not make you, what is called, unfit. You can do something like that.

Morning Walk -- August 14, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: We are, some space is due to us on account of giving up the road?

Saurabha: That is already calculated. That is given to us already.

Prabhupāda: Given?

Saurabha: F.S.I. (effasai?)

Prabhupāda: F.S.I.

Saurabha: That we have already. We have used that in that building. We have used it in the building that is coming up here.

Prabhupāda: Oh. It is already. You have submitted the plan?

Saurabha: Yes.

Prabhupāda: They have sanctioned?

Saurabha: No.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: It will take about a month to endorse it.

Prabhupāda: (break) ...so nice walking this route.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: For washing cloth you require soap. But does not... You require everything, but because you are spending without any sense... So I calculated yesterday the whole thing, Deity worship, Deity pūjā, will require five hundred rupees per month.

Akṣayānanda: I had requested for the flowers, Viśvambhara said twelve rupees you had decided last night.

Prabhupāda: Twelve rupees, thirteen rupees...

Akṣayānanda: Twelve, thirteen. Actually today, I wanted for today but the flower man was not able to... We could not catch him in time. But from tomorrow it will start, definitely.

Prabhupāda: The thing is that one who is cheating you, he will cheat in twelve rupees, also he will cheat in fifty rupees.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Six plates. Six plates, eight puris means forty-eight puris. Forty-eight puris, Viśvambhara calculated the āṭā and ghee.

Akṣayānanda: Yes, you already made that estimate.

Prabhupāda: Two rupees. Āṭā and ghee, two rupees. Then other preparation, another two rupees.

Akṣayānanda: He'll tell me everything Prabhupāda. No need to...

Prabhupāda: No, no, why don't you hear? You are hearing now. Four rupees to prepare all the plates. Four rupees, say five rupees. So five rupees, monthly 150 rupees. So we are offering four times. So 150 rupees four times.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Akṣayānanda: I can't quite grasp it, Prabhupāda. But you say it can't go above five hundred, so that'll be it.

Prabhupāda: No, no. Five hundred, that is rough calculation. But we add another five hundred, if there is any mistake or any error and omission. Therefore I have added another five hundred.

Akṣayānanda: That means a thousand.

Prabhupāda: Thousand. That is sufficient.

Akṣayānanda: Maximum.

Prabhupāda: Maximum. And you were speaking 9,000.

Room Conversation -- September 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Everything. Everything calculated.

Akṣayānanda: I believe you, Prabhupāda. But to make it practical I want to see every item. The cost, the weight, and everything.

Prabhupāda: It is already calculated.

Akṣayānanda: Then I can do it. Then we can do it.

Prabhupāda: It is already calculated. I calculated not with a fool. With an experienced man.

Room Conversation with Dr. Theodore Kneupper -- November 6, 1976, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Well, now this age will... The duration of this age is calculated 432, 432 thousands of years. Out of that we have passed only 500,000..., no, five thousand years.

Dr. Kneupper: A long time to go.

Prabhupāda: Yes. But why should you wait for the long time? You can go back to home, back to..., immediately. That is our proposal, that "Why should you wait? This may be long time. But we... You give up the connection with the material world. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti mām eti kaunteya (BG 4.9). If you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then after giving up this body you go back to home, back to Godhead. Then you have no connection, this. But we are make, planning here, "We shall be comfortable." This is rascaldom.

Morning Walk -- December 5, 1976, Hyderabad:

Prabhupāda: The point is that... You can explain in this way, that goloka eva nivasaty akhilātma-bhūtaḥ (Bs. 5.37). Kṛṣṇa is in the Goloka planet which is far, far away from our planet, but still He is everywhere. That is the difference. That you cannot imagine. In our material knowledge you cannot imagine that. But that is the fact. Kṛṣṇa says, patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyaṁ yo me bhaktyā prayacchati, tad aham aśnāmi: (BG 9.26) "Anyone offering Me in devotion patraṁ puṣpaṁ phalaṁ toyam, I eat." Now, Kṛṣṇa is living far, far away in the Goloka planet. How He can eat? That is your imagining. But Kṛṣṇa says, "Yes, I do." That is Kṛṣṇa. Although He is far, far away, He is within your heart. That you cannot imagine, how it is possible. That is your material knowledge. But you have to accept from the statement of śāstra that although He is far, far away, within your heart. Aṇḍāntara-stha-para... He is within the atom also. So that you cannot imagine. That requires a different knowledge, Vedic knowledge. The material knowledge will not help you, but you cannot imagine. You have to accept Vedic knowledge. What is stated in the Vedas, that you have to accept. That's all. Otherwise there is no possibility. Therefore to understand Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's activities you have to learn from Kṛṣṇa. That is Bhagavad-gītā. You cannot manufacture your knowledge. That is not... Because you are defective—your senses are imperfect—so whatever knowledge you get through your senses, that is all imperfect. You cannot get perfect knowledge by your imperfect senses. That is not possible. Therefore the Vedic injunction is tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum eva abhigacchet (MU 1.2.12). In order to learn that transcendental science you have to approach a guru who knows it.

tad viddhi praṇipātena

paripraśnena sevayā

upadekṣyanti te jñānaṁ

jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ

(BG 4.34)

This is a different phase of knowledge. By your material calculation it will be difficult. The same thing, Kṛṣṇa says, aśnāmi: "I eat." So Kṛṣṇa is far, far away.

Room Conversation -- December 20, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1). "This science of Bhagavad-gītā, I spoke to the sun-god millions of years ago." By the calculation it is forty millions of years ago. Now who will believe that, that Kṛṣṇa spoke this Bhagavad-gītā forty millions of years ago to the sun-god? Hm? Who will believe that? They'll say mythology. So where is the faith in Bhagavad-gītā and faith in the words of Kṛṣṇa? Understanding Hamlet without Hamlet. (distortion) You cannot make your interpretation that whatever is written there, I take instead of..., I take... (coughing) That is not the way of understanding Bhagavad-gītā. Then from the very beginning you'll spoil it. Then what is the meaning of preaching Bhagavad-gītā? If you do not accept the direction of the author, then what right you have got to say that you have understood Bhagavad-gītā?

Guest (Indian man): Could it be that there may be different interpretations?

Prabhupāda: No, that is not possible. That is not the process. You cannot interpret Bhagavad-gītā. If you want to preach Bhagavad-gītā, you must preach what Kṛṣṇa has said. If you have got a different philosophy, you can say differently. You don't cheat people that you take Bhagavad-gītā and interpret in your own way and cheat others and be cheated yourself. You cannot do that.

Morning Walk and Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: But according to our śāstra, it is so.

Prabhupāda: No, no, this is according to bāniyā, the doctor is calculated...

Dr. Patel: Bāniyā is right in the way. Bāniyā is right.

Prabhupāda: (Bengali)

Dr. Patel: In Bengali.

Prabhupāda: In Bengali village there are many quacks. You know that. Everywhere. (laughter) So what their business? Nal jal yachuri tene dhaturi.(?)

Dr. Patel: In Mahābhārata in Vidura-nīti, Vidura has mentioned that a doctor should not be trusted and should not be allowed to come in the house. I am reading presently that part of Mahābhārata. Why? Because they must be right from the beginning all the times also they must be of the same type.

Prabhupāda: Another place, Vaiṣṇava says, either he is businessman, or doctor, anyone, they are all madmen.

Room Conversation -- December 26, 1976, Bombay:

Jagadīśa: There are some psychiatrists who are on our side though. So if we can rally their support... The whole thing is so emotional and based on this strong appeal by the scientists and leaders to avoid religion because of the distraction from sense gratification, that all of the charges against us are completely baseless. There's no foundation. And if we just carefully and with calculation expose all of their nonsense accusations, it will be a great victory. Especially now it has become such a national issue that the leaders of society have to become involved, otherwise they'll become implicated. They have to come out and say whether they support the Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement.

Prabhupāda: But they're supporting.

Jagadīśa: They must support it. Actually, I'm sure that they're astonished to find out how intelligent all the devotees are. The devotees are the most intelligent people.

Prabhupāda: Kṛṣṇa yei bhaje sei baḍa catura. Then, what other letters.

Room Conversation -- December 27, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: But you don't get customer even lesser than that. First of all see your position. You may calculate in the mind that "This is cheap, this is not," but cheap or no cheap, you are not getting any customers. (chuckling)

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: No, because we never went after the tourist traffic. We have just started going after this foreign traffic with these brochures, and now we have...

Prabhupāda: And now, in the Sixth Chapter there are forty-seven verses. So divide forty-seven with seven.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: That's seven.

Hari-śauri: Seven.

Jagadīśa: Almost seven.

Hari-śauri: You want to do like seven verses a day?

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Press Interview -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: He is not a scholar. He's a rascal. We have to follow the ācāryas. The ācāryas never said. There are so many ācāryas. They never say. So, we have to follow, ācāryopāsanam, not the rascals. We cannot worship the rascals. Worship ācāryas. They are guide. So śāstra says... Find out sa evāyaṁ mayā te 'dya yogaḥ proktaḥ purātanaḥ. Purātanaḥ, Kṛṣṇa says that imaṁ vivasvate yogaṁ proktavān aham avyayam (BG 4.1), "I spoke this science to Vivasvān, the sun-god." So if you calculate sun, this sun, Vivasvān, is the father of Manu, Vaivasvata Manu. And if you take, calculate, it becomes forty millions of years. So this Bhagavad-gītā is spoken, according to the Bhagavad-gītā, according to the version of Kṛṣṇa, forty millions of years ago. Now He says that science was known to the people by paramparā. And that paramparā is lost somehow or other. Therefore as... (break) Suppose you are born in Bombay, but you do not know how the state is being managed, then what is my jñāna? If you do not know how the state is being managed then what is your jñāna? That jñāna is, dogs and cats, they have also jñāna. How to eat, how to sleep, how to use sex life, how to defend. This is not jñāna. Everyone knows it. If you know God, who is conducting the whole, that is jñāna.

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: So Prabhupāda, I was just finalizing today this year's festival when the devotees come. I think instead of having a festival, a pandal in Delhi like we had last year. We had one in Ludhiana and Mathurā. In Ludhiana Caityaguru promises that he can raise money for the whole thing. Our devotees won't have to spend a penny. In Delhi if we do a pandal it will require an investment of at least twenty thousand rupees. If we do our festival in Ludhiana, book distribution I calculated will be as good and no money will be invested. We have a festival in Mathurā in Janma Bhumi. Every evening by buses devotees will go from Vṛndāvana to Mathurā. You wanted to have a big program there, you remember? When I was in Vṛndāvana. So we can invite different leaders also.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation -- December 31, 1976, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: That we round about way.

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Usually it takes by motorcycle fifteen minutes. In a car I think we could do it in fifteen minutes. So I calculated our Hindi distribution of books would be very strong because Mathurā we can generate big crowds.

Prabhupāda: You said that today we'll get another book?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Probably come by tomorrow.

Prabhupāda: What is that book?

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Easy Journey to Other Planets. They finished printing it yesterday and they're binding it together. One or two days, it always happens. When I give a date sometimes it gets delayed. So I figured the distribution of Hindi books will be very good. Ludhiana and Mathurā and also not much investment will be required. It's very common, devotees go every year and they are tired of it. So this year we should concentrate on book distribution. If we have a pandal in Mathurā every evening starting at six o'clock. If we can reach Mathurā at five for book distribution it will be nice. Actually I was also thinking of having a three day pandal in Agra.

Prabhupāda: Agra is very good.

1977 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- January 7, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: What can be done? Things have gone high, I was calculating the other day, twenty times.

Hari-śauri: Thirty times.

Dr. Patel: More than that. Thirty times, yes.

Prabhupāda: Thirty times, yes. My father's income was from 250 to 300, and we were living very comfortably.

Jagadīśa: A month?

Prabhupāda: Per month.

Dr. Patel: It was more than sufficient, those days.

Prabhupāda: No, no, that three hundred rupees means... What you calculated?

Hari-śauri: Well, at 250 rupees it came to seven and a half thousand rupees now.

Prabhupāda: That's right. Even low as 250 it comes to seven thousand rupees. So who has got seven thousand rupee income now?

Dr. Patel: In my house we spend monthly more than six thousand rupees. I studied for my graduation in the college at fifty rupees a term fee for six months. I'm paying for those small kids going to the family schools seven hundred rupees per month.

Prabhupāda: Our family was taking two kilos and a half milk daily. Two annas per kilo. Ghee was selling, first-class ghee, in Calcutta... Just in front of our house there was a grocer shop. We were purchasing in that tin, but if some required, I would go immediately.

Morning Darsana and Room Conversation Ramkrishna Bajaj and friends -- January 9, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: Believe or not believe, that is another thing. But if you want to live worthy, then you have to study Bhagavad-gītā. You believe... Just like somebody believes or not believes in dehāntara, but nature's course will go on. Young man thinks "I'll remain young. I shall not become old man." He may believe like that, but he has to become old man. That is nature's law. So there is no question of "believe" or "not believe." If you believe, then you are benefited; if you don't believe, you go to hell. It is not the question of belief. I was speaking in South Africa in a university. So one gentleman, Arya-samāji said... When I was explaining tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ, so he objected that "Why you bring Hindu belief?" "And, nonsense, it is Hindu belief?" It is said that kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā: one boy is becoming young man. Is this for Hindu? It is not for the Muslim? And he said "Hindu belief." Such a fool he is. He said, "It is Hindu belief." Kṛṣṇa is giving this example. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanam (BG 2.13). Kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā. So does it mean that Hindus only from kaumāra become yuvaka, and from yuvaka to old man, and the Muslims, they do not? It is science! You believe or not believe. If you don't take the fact, then your life is missing. What is the question? Two plus two equal to four—it is not Hindu calculation, Muslim calculation or Christian calculation. You cannot say that "No, according to our Muslim calculation, two plus two equal to five." Two plus two is always four, either for a Hindu or Muslim or Christian. So whatever is spoken in the Bhagavad-gītā, that is for understanding of the human society. Why do you take: "It is Hindu belief. It is Indian belief"? It is science. That is our misfortune, that a science we are accepting as a kind of belief, faith. And that we are neglecting. That is our misfortune.

Room Conversation -- January 10, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: I had one... When I was doing medical business I had one very nice customer. He was my patron also, one Muhammadan doctor, Sriraja Uttina.(?) He was very kind to me. He was just like a father to me. So his system was that in his pharmacy, patent medicine, drugs, medicine, surgical instruments, like that different headings. So suppose, at the sales time, sells some patent medicine. So he has got a box. So he puts the price in the patent medicine. And if he sells some surgical, he puts the price in the surgical pot. In this way, when they want to purchase again, so he would consult his pot, whether there is money. Then he'll allow to purchase. Otherwise not. So he told me, "This is my account. This is my account. When they want to purchase, they consign us something. I shall allow them to purchase so much as I have got in the box." This is... I have seen that gentleman. And in Calcutta there was... In our young time there was a cinema, Mr. Maddar, J.F. Maddar. He's a Parsee. So for some..., business, he was tenant of mine. One of my tenants. So in his room there were boxes. So I asked Mr. Maddar what is this box at home. And "This is the counter containing counter part of ticket in my cinema house. So these are sent to me. I count the counter part. Then I can calculate, 'This is the calculation.' I don't keep an account. Now let them do whatever they like. I understand that so many counter parts, so much money."

Conversation and Instruction On New Movie -- January 13, 1977, Allahabad:

Prabhupāda: Actually India is poor. When we give food, how voraciously they eat. They cannot eat. They have no resources to eat nicely at home. That's a fact. Half-fed. At least half-fed. In the villages they are not fully fed. They have no sufficient clothing, no food, that's all. The rascal politicians, realizing heavy tax, and that is divided amongst them. It is not going to the poor. They are imitating Western way of life. They have got huge expenditure. So whatever money is coming, they are spending for their luxury, and poor men... The Gandhi's movement, boycott British goods, but they took it: "Boycott British goods and take our goods." So the consumer goods were the same. Gandhi helped to stop the British capitalist in favor of the Indian capitalist. The consumer remained in the same position, rather, worse. The foreigners, they are thinking that "These people are poor. They cannot pay more to me." And these rascals, Indian capitalists, in the name of nationalism, Birlas and others, they exploit. And they give contribution to Gandhi, Gandhi's staff, Jawaharlal Nehru's staff. And they took the opportunity that "I shall pay this rascal one lakh, and I shall utilize the ten lakhs." That's it. So the object of exploitation remained the same. Rather, by artificial inflation of money market put common men in plight, because the other day I was calculating... The things have gone high priced, thirty times, but the income has not increased thirty times. The other day I was calculating. My father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees. So we had no scarcity. In our standard of life there was no scar... What standard of...? That standard of life is still... Now that three hundred rupees is... He calculated.

Room Conversation on 1976 Book Scores -- January 16, 1977, Calcutta:

Prabhupāda: So the first attempt was only 20,000. I calculated. Anyway, Kṛṣṇa is giving us all facility. Let us utilize it to the best of our capacity. We have no other ambition. We want to see that everyone may accept the Supreme Personality of Godhead and be happy. This is our mission. We have no other ambition, not to make any cost-profit. But when we see that so many people are reading Kṛṣṇa book, that gives us very good encouragement. Otherwise what...? Two capatis we can get anywhere.

Rāmeśvara: We wrote in the newsletter to the Society that even though our movement is being attacked is so many ways, the best counterattack is through book distribution.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is the best answer to this opposition. And when the case is there, put all the books before the judge: "Now you read and give your judgment. Don't... You are learned lordship. Please read these books and give your judgment. We have got already judgment from the scholars." Present like that. "But still, because in your court it is presented, so we pray that you give your judgment after understanding our method of brainwash." That will make him flat.

Room Conversation with Sannyasis -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Satsvarūpa: He wants that you... He said, "The translator frequently adds comments containing information from other Vedic scriptures, for instance, ancient astronomical calculations referred to by Śrīla Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura. It would be highly interesting to have a compilation of such astronomical texts translated into English. One can only hope that the Bhaktivedanta Book Trust endeavors to do this to the great benefit of the historians of science."

Prabhupāda: We shall do it. I am searching after some astronomer.

Rāmeśvara: There is also a review from one Indian professor, how this science...

Prabhupāda: Anyway, they have become interested in our literature.

Room Conversation with Film Producer about Krsna Lila -- January 22, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: Now they have taken it as bhajana, to associate with other woman, and he becomes Kṛṣṇa, and (s)he's Rādhārāṇī, and they're making bhajana. This rascaldom is going on. Go on.

Hari-śauri: "In his statement, Mahārāja Parīkṣit has used several important words which require clarification. The first word, jugupsitam, means 'abominable.' The first doubt of Parīkṣit Mahārāja was as follows: Lord Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who has advented Himself to establish religious principles. Why then did He mix with others' wives in the dead of night and enjoy dancing, embracing, and kissing? According to Vedic injunctions this is not allowed. Also, when the gopīs first came to Him, He gave instructions for them to return to their homes. To call the wives of other persons or young girls and enjoy dancing with them is certainly abominable according to the Vedas. And why should Kṛṣṇa have done this? Another word used here is āptakāma. Some may take it for granted that Kṛṣṇa was very lusty amongst young girls, but Parīkṣit Mahārāja said that this was not possible. He could not be lusty. First of all, from the material calculation He was only eight years old. At that age a boy cannot be lusty. Aptakāma means that the Supreme Personality of Godhead is self-satisfied. Even if He were lusty, He does not need to take help from others to satisfy His lusty desires. The next point is that although not lusty Himself, He might have been induced by the lusty desires of the gopīs. But Mahārāja Parīkṣit then used another word, yadupati, which indicates that Kṛṣṇa is the most exalted personality in the dynasty of the Yadus. The kings in the dynasty of Yadu were considered to be the most pious, and their descendants were also like that."

Prabhupāda: This is described in the śāstra. If one hears of the Yadu-vaṁśa, he becomes purified. And Kṛṣṇa is addressed, Yadupati.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Puri:

Prabhupāda: Quarantine. Simply by thinking that "I shall not be allowed to go out of this room..." It is not a room; it is a big house, but still, I was feeling uncomfortable: "How is that? I shall not be free to go out." And that three days was actually suffering to me, "I cannot go out of the door." Simply by feeling this. I do not do practically. I sit down. But if I feel, "No, I cannot go out of this room," that's a great suffering. Whole day, I am sitting here. That's a fact. But I have got this intelligence that "I can go out as I like." But if you say that "You cannot go out," then it is a great suffering, psychologically. So creation or no creation, there is suffering. Rather, when there is creation it is less suffering, because he's mad, so he's engaged in some way. (laughs) He's thinking, "It is happiness." Eating, sleeping, sex is there. That is going on. That is māyā. Therefore this creation is another mercy of Kṛṣṇa. That I was reading this night. One creation, so many millions of years... There is calculation. One Brahmā's day, twelve hours, you cannot calculate. Sahasra-yuga-paryantam ahar yad brahmaṇo viduḥ (BG 8.17). One yuga—forty-three hundred thousand years—one yuga, thousand times. Forty-three hundred thousand years equal to one yuga. Such thousand times. That is Brahmā's twelve hours. Then another twelve hours, night. That is also another trouble, when Brahmā's night. Everything merge into water, pralaya-payodhi-jale **. Not all the planet. At least half the universe plunge into water. This earthly planet and up to Svargaloka everything is inundated.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Puri:

Satsvarūpa: We have instruments, calculations.

Prabhupāda: That is also imperfect, because you have prepared. You are rascal; your instrument is rascal. How a rascal can manufacture something perfect? How it is possible? Hm? Anything we attempt to get, knowledge, is imperfect. Only perfect knowledge is when you get it through the perfect person. The same example: you cannot make experiment or speculation who is your father. The only right information—from your mother, that's all. Finish. Otherwise, everything speculation. How you'll rightly understand your father? Except the mother's statement, what is the next alternative? Hm? Is there any?

Gurukṛpā: We're looking. You can ask everybody, every man on the street.

Prabhupāda: That is imperfect. It will never be perfect.

Room Conversation -- January 27, 1977, Puri:

Gurukṛpā: You know the story?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Your scientific knowledge, your car, means you are more dependent. Now, suppose you have to stay here. You had to, some very important business. Now whole thing is finished. But if you have calculated without having this car, then you would have done your duty. So the more material advancement means more you become dependent, more you become rascal. That is calculation by Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura. Jaḍa-vidyā jato, māyāra vaibhava, jīvake karaye gādhā, tomāra bhajane bādhā. Anitya saṁsāre, moha janamiyā, jīvake karaye gādhā. My business is that how to leave this material conditional life and become free. Now, with this so-called advancement of science I am becoming more and more attached. So I'll never get freedom. This is the result. Because I am trying in different way how to get, freedom. "Yes, wait millions of years. We shall do it. We shall do this." Gādhā, ass. You'll die trillions of times within millions of years, and he is expecting good result of his scientific... By the time, he'll become a banyan tree and stand there by nature's law, and he's expecting good result after millions of years. So gādhā, ass. Durāśaya. This has been described as durāśaya. He's expecting something, hoping something, will never be fulfilled. They calculate. "Millions of years we shall get how to make life." And the, an ordinary chicken, he is doing this within seven days. And these rascals will have to wait for millions of years and wait that a life is coming from the egg, and other rascals, set of rascals, they are accepting. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura's statement is jīvake karaye gādhā. He's already an ass. He becomes a more ass, big ass. Anitya saṁsāre... More than. He's destined to change everything, anitya, everything nonpermanent, but he is illusioned—"Yes, we shall make it permanent." This is moha. Which he will never be able to do, he is expecting... "We shall do it." This is also called another logic, nyāya, bakāṇḍa-nyāya. You have seen bakāṇḍa-nyāya? Baka and aṇḍa. One bull is going and his testicle hanging, and another duck, he is thinking, "It is a fish. It will drop, and I shall take it." This is practical. This is psych... You'll see a bull is going on and testicle hanging, and another duck is going after him. From this baka the word baka has come. Sometimes we say baka. This bakāṇḍa-nyāya.

Room Conversation -- January 31, 1977, Bhuvanesvara:

Prabhupāda: That is another difficulty. For general calculation a man can live up to a hundred years in this age. So in the middle, stop all rascaldom-compulsory. Now take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Because you are persistent to continue your rascaldom, all right, do it up to this point. And then stop all this. Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. This is a concession for continuing the rascaldom. But if he's so fool that he will continue the rascaldom as Jawaharlal Nehru did and Gandhi did and Hitler did and-up to the point of death—let him do. What can be done? They will continue their rascaldom. Mūḍhaḥ nābhijānāti mām ebhyaḥ param avyayam. Gandhi, unless he was killed by his own men, he did not retire. Jawaharlal Nehru, when he was just... There is no other way. He was in Dehra Dun, still Prime Minister, and he was brought very quickly from Dehra Dun to Delhi, and after one hour he died. All these politicians... And it is learned that he has become a dog in Scandinavia. You cannot say, "No," because you do not know what he has become. But tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ. He must have changed the body. So where is your science? Prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni (BG 3.27). The prakṛti will change your body. Kṛṣṇa says, tathā dehāntara-prāptir dhīras tatra na muhyati (BG 2.13). And He's giving vivid example. Dehino 'smin yathā dehe kaumāraṁ yauvanaṁ jarā (BG 2.13). And Kṛṣṇa is speaking. I shall not believe in Kṛṣṇa's word, and I shall go to some rascal? We are not so fool. Fools are bahir-artha-māninaḥ. "Oh, we are making this advancement. We will do in the future. We'll do." These are the business of the fools and rascals, not intelligent, which will never be successful. Durāśaya. But they'll stick to that false hope. Kṛṣṇa yei, bhaje sei baḍa catura: "One who takes to Kṛṣṇa consciousness is very intelligent." Actually that is the fact. Ei rūpe brahmāṇḍa bhramite kona bhāgyavān jīva (CC Madhya 19.151). All the... There are many rascals, and they are under the laws of nature wandering in this material world in different forms of life. So out of many such millions and millions, if one is fortunate, guru-kṛṣṇa-kṛpāya pāya bhakti-latā-bīja: (CC Madhya 19.151) he enters into Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Conversation on Roof -- February 14, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: Formerly they used to stock huge stock in Calcutta. Burma Sale. And new tin, if you exchange the container, then six annas less. Not very costly. Of course, in those days it was costly, taking consideration of the purchasing power of money. Four rupees, I remember, a few annas. My father did not like to purchase anything retail. For his daily necessity he'll purchase, he would purchase potato, one bag. So one bag means, maybe, one rupee, eight annas. (laughs) One anna per seer, kilo, I have purchased. Rice, fifteen mounds he will purchase. And what is the price? Three rupees, four annas. First-class rice. Coal, this coal, coke. Five annas per mound, purchase one cart load, fifteen mounds. The other day I was calculating. My father's income was, utmost, three hundred rupees per month in those days. And taking gold standard, my mother was purchasing gold from my cousin—he has gold shop-twenty rupees per tolā, first-class gold. Now it is six hundred rupees per tolā. (break) ...in those days thirty rupees per month. For thirty rupees, clerical staff, if you increase thirty times, how much it comes?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Nine hundred.

Room Conversation -- February 17, 1977, Mayapura:

Prabhupāda: In your calculation it may be that we are eating very small particle. But that is not the fact. We are eating sufficiently. That means you have no brain. Because you are eating raw meat, flesh, and you see that we are eating fruits, you say, "This is not sufficient." It is your calculation. Actually the fruits are meant for high-class, intelligent men. It is not meant for cats and dogs or elephant. Elephant may be very good eater. Does it mean he is human being? So you are just like elephant. You are calculating your other friends like you. (pause)

Ādi-keśava: Sometimes, when they are making their statements, we wonder how they can be so unintelligent, how they can be so mistaken as to what is the goal of this movement.

Prabhupāda: So you explain. Then Kṛṣṇa can do.

Room Conversation -- February 18, 1977, Mayapura:

Satsvarūpa: Even a calculator can immediately multiply some...

Prabhupāda: But calculator machine, another man is working, so where is brain, calculating? The machine is made by another man, and it is being worked by another man, so where is the brain in the calculator? That is... So you are misled immediately. Bluff.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Word jugglery. Simply a word jugglery.

Prabhupāda: That's all. Yes. What is the value of that? The machine is made by another brain, and it is being worked over by another brain. And who has made that brain who has made the machine? That is māyā. Then ultimately you have to come to māyā. And who is giving direction? Big brain, Kṛṣṇa. Mayādhyakṣeṇa prakṛtiḥ sūyate sa-carācaram (BG 9.10). He is making machine—carācaram. Yasyājñayā... Sṛṣṭi-sthiti-pralaya-sādhana-śaktir ekā chāyeva yasya bhuvanāni vibharti durgā (Bs. 5.44). Māyā is Durgā, the superintending deity of this whole, whole universe. And she is Durgā, therefore called. "Very difficult." Duḥ-gā. You can approach her very, with difficulty. Duḥ. Duḥ means duḥkha.. You cannot understand even Durgā, so what to speak of the Supreme Person who is giving directions to this...? Sṛṣṭi-sthiti-pralaya-sādhana-śaktir ekā chāyeva yasya... (Bs. 5.44), chāyeva yasya bhuvanāni vibharti durgā. She has no independent intelligence. She is working like chāya. Just like here, chāya. This is moving; this is moving.

Arrival of Devotees -- February 24, 1977, Mayapura:

Rādhā-vallabha: We also calculated how many hardbound Bhāgavatams are in print. That's one million. And there's almost three million Gītās in print too.

Prabhupāda: So this should be displayed here.

Rādhā-vallabha: That... We have one big framed stat showing the English. You have five or six books that have over one million copies in print.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is very good, putting the quantity on the cover. It's very impressive. (devotees talking among themselves about books) It's like McDonald's. They advertise...

Prabhupāda: This is the combination of American money and Indian culture. This is the result. In every field of our activities, this will prove wonderful, American money and Indian culture. Andha-paṅgu-nyāya. Therefore Kṛṣṇa sent me to America. "Go America." Generally people come to Western country means London. But I never thought of that. I thought, "I shall go to New York," from the very beginning.

Room Conversation with GBC members -- March 2-3, 1977, Mayapura:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: One lakh.

Prabhupāda: Very good.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What will it consist of?

Pañcadraviḍa: Gur, and... We calculated that we would need...

Prabhupāda: Ask everyone visiting, "Please take prasādam."

Interview with Mr. Koshi (Asst. Editor of The Current Weekly) -- April 5, 1977, Bombay:

Indian (1): No, he has come to pay respect to you.

Prabhupāda: That's all right. But wait. Let him come in. The point is that if you keep yourself in ignorance, then what is the use of advancing further? If your basic principle is calculated wrong, then whatever you construct on that wrong background, everything is wrong. One mistake done in the beginning, then plus minus, plus minus, ultimately it is wrong. So our Kṛṣṇa consciousness means that unless you take seriously what Kṛṣṇa says, you are simply jumping like animals. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. First of all, you understand your position, what Kṛṣṇa says. Then go ahead. You do not understand the basic principle what Kṛṣṇa says and you are declaring yourself, "I am reading Bhagavad-gītā and Bhagavad-gītā is my life," and so on.

Morning Conversation -- April 30, 1977, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: This is like that. So you have to, as far as possible... If you can you have to demonstrate, "This is planetary system." So at least we shall show what is going on within this universe. And above... And each universe is covered with seven material elements. Each covering is ten times more than the other covering, earth, water, air, fire. A wonderful creation. And how it will be shown? So I have decided, therefore, that let us show something about this planetary, er, this universe. And others, we give idea. How it will be done, you think over as far as possible. (laughs) It is not these rascals' calculation, that every planet is rock and sand, and God had no business to create so many planets of rocks and sands to be discovered scientifically by these rascals' attaining them. Just see the fun, how far the godless men can dare to speak and think. How great rascals they are! Simply to deny the existence of God, that's all. That is their business. And the creation has no brain, asatyam. Anīśvaram: "There is no God. It is all false."

Conversation Pieces -- May 27, 1977, Vrndavana:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: And they want us to give everything typewritten to them. (Hindi) So I calculated, it will take more time than just doing by hand.

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (Hindi conversation)

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: Allahabad is the only hope.

Prabhupāda: Dr. Ghosh... (Hindi) (Hindi conversation with Gopāla Kṛṣṇa) So you do not expect any good things from them. Otherwise you will not have any progress.

Morning Conversation -- June 23, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They were expert like that.

Prabhupāda: No, they were very good politician. (pause) I can say, in the British period there was no scarcity, and leniency. I recall the way. Didn't require... And when they like... With three hundred rupees they were so happy. Now you calculate that three hundred rupees means ten thousand. So where is that ten thousand rupees?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, only the wealthier...

Prabhupāda: For children one anna tiffin is sufficient. One anna. (looking at monkeys) You see?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yeah, a whole family of them. This is their feeding place, the garbage can here. They don't come when they see people, though. Around all the holy places I always see a lot of monkeys and cows in India. Is there some reason, special, about... I mean, cows, there's obvious reason, but what about the monkeys? Why are they around the holy places?

Prabhupāda: Because they are fed by the visitors.

Letter from Yugoslavia--'Books!' -- June 30, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Mahākṣa told me it was...

Prabhupāda: And how is that, he has not come back?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Well, I asked Mahākṣa, "How is it?" He calculated that it would take three hours, each way, to go. Far distant place. So they left about noon. So three hours, three hours. Then he may have taken some time to make it, three-four hours. So they might come back nine or ten tonight.

Prabhupāda: Find out the key.

Bhu-mandala Diagram Discussion -- July 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Yaśodā-nandana: Another unique feature of this map is that... Bhakti-prema Mahārāja found about... There is one space which is mentioned by Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura in his commentary. The complete diameter from west to east and north to south, it is calculated to be 500,000,000 yojanas. In order to be able to adjust that, we needed 250,000,000 on each side.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: That means 4,000,000,000 miles.

Prabhupāda: That I have given there.

Bhu-mandala Diagram Discussion -- July 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I think, Śrīla Prabhupāda, that you gave that right in the purport. You called them (indistinct). See, you gave this huge... It says here, "However , the technical terms used in the astronomical calculations given by the Jyotir Veda are difficult to translate into English. Therefore, to satisfy the reader, we may include the exact Sanskrit statement given by Śrīla Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura, which records exact calculations regarding universal affairs." And then you give this huge Sanskrit quotation. And from reading this, Bhakti-prema Mahārāja found out that there is space. Due to this purport we got that information. So it was perfectly put in here. It's very nice.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So I think that Svarūpa Dāmodara will be helped by these drawings when the men come. 'Cause he said that even though they are scientists, they could not understand this volume. It's been a mystery practically. These drawings, one by one, should be able to help in the creation of that planetarium.

Prabhupāda: Thank you very much. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Bhu-mandala Diagram Discussion -- July 2, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: That, the microscope... What is called? Telescope.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: This is the book of the rascal scientists. They describe the solar system according to their nonsense. The solar system... Gives all the calculations. They calculated how much it weighs on each planet. (laughs) They haven't even been there. They say that each planet has moons. Says here... This is how scientific they are. "Pluto was discovered only in 1930, and as yet, little is known about this remote planet. Pluto is much smaller than Neptune and has a diameter probably about..."

Prabhupāda: "Probably."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "...half the size..."

Prabhupāda: "Probably."

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: "The orbit of Pluto is extremely elliptical, and the day is some 6,109 hours long. There is probably no atmosphere, and there are no known humans."

Prabhupāda: "Probably." Their science is "probably." Probably it is science; otherwise it is nonsense. (laughter)

Bhu-mandala Discussion -- July 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Nothing is wrong. From their estimate it is all right. But there is superior power.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: They go due west and they hit India from Los Angeles, but according to our calculation, that's not possible.

Prabhupāda: You can go further, but you cannot go. That is condition. You are restricted. The same, that you are bound up. If an animal can go further... But he cannot, because he is bound up. Ahaṅkāra-vimūḍhātmā kartāham iti manyate (BG 3.27). He is thinking, "I am free." He is not free. So what is the value of his education? This is the real point.

Discussion about Bhu-mandala -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Yaśodā-nandana: Not accepting the authority. The problem is the Pacific Ocean, according to Jambūdvīpa, for us it is the salt ocean. So the first question that Mahārāja was raising, that they will ask, how do we go between the west coast of America, which is very tiny, and Japan, as this according to their calculation we go west and we arrive around. And you keep still going further and you arrive back in America. The point about the Himalayas, that we did not raise, because that we could well understood. The Himalayas is much broader and much bigger than they think. We can fully understand it. But that point, from common-sense point of view we couldn't exactly understand. We thought of it all afternoon, and we came up with a few ideas, but we wanted to hear what Your Divine Grace...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Our question was mostly coming out of how to draw what the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is saying. We're not supporting any kind of mundane argument, nor do we have any doubt in Bhāgavatam. We're simply trying to understand the Bhāgavatam.

Prabhupāda: And that is your credit.

Room Conversation With Son (Vrindavan De) -- July 5, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It's very much moving and at very high speed.

Prabhupāda: Yes. I calculated sixteen thousand miles per second, so far I remember.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I think that's right.

Prabhupāda: And it is Sūryaloka. It has population.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: All of the personalities there have very dazzling bodies.

Prabhupāda: Fiery body.

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Pranavdas Gupta: ...calculated is 1st September, 1896. The date is here. See the old calendar of..., that is Samvat 1953.

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Pranavdas Gupta: The Samvat comes... Because when the date is 1896 we have to add fifty-seven years, because when we want to get samvat, then we have to add fifty-seven years. So then we add fifty-seven years it comes 1953. Then he took out the very, very old man, (?) and I saw that, that he took out that calendar, and pañcama, and then he calculated. He saw this. And I told him that "We can look at the date. I don't know exactly what the date is, but just following Janmāṣṭamī." No. Day I did not disclose. Then he said... Then he saw after Janmāṣṭamī that's navamī. Then he said, "The day is Tuesday." I knew the day is Tuesday. "That's correct." Then what is the date? And he said, "First September." When we look here if it is 1st September then that must be adit-masa(?) also, because we are getting Janmāṣṭamī 6th September. That year also it must be adit-masa(?). He said yes. Then he saw there were Jyeṣṭha, at that time, Jyeṣṭha or Asadhar. That was adit-masa(?) He saw in your pañcama. Then he prepared all these things. Then he said according to rasi... "Do you know his name?" I said, "No, name I don't remember," because I am not to disclose anything...

Prabhupāda: I'll tell you, therefore, "Let him ask."

Room Conversation -- July 19, 1977, Vrndavana:

Pranavdas Gupta: He has given in this chart. Mahārāji, your Śukra is very nice. Venus. Śukra means Venus. And in the seventh place Śukra is very, very... To him this is very good place of Śukra. But on the eleventh house, Rahu, "That has rather forced him to take sannyāsa. That has rather forced him to take... But what was he doing before taking sannyāsa?" "I actually do not know what he..." Because I had to say like that. "He might be in some good post," he said. "He might be in good post. Then he has taken sannyāsa. Was he a married man?" "Yes, he was a married." "Has he got issues?" "Yes, he has got issues." Then all these calculations. "But his eleventh house, that Rahu, made him like that. But Śukra in the seventh house is very good for him. As regards the others, these are good, but this is the best, the Śukra, the Venus, in the seventh house." So he has given this Janma Lagna and he has also given this Chandra Lagna. These are almost the same as now. But he was impressed that way, seeing all the horoscope. I did not disclose anything. I'm coming from Vṛndāvana, so he hold that I'm...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So now we have one. That is one horoscope. Now we make comparison the next two that come in. They're both coming tonight to give reports. Bhakti-prema has returned, and Yaśodānandana Mahārāja has returned. So after we hear all three, then, if necessary, you can consult a kavirajā. Or everyone may say the same thing. Then we'll know if it's confirmed.

Pranavdas Gupta: You can ask in Bangalore also. They are very expert. Raman, there is one. Because by... (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: He says up to September 7th there's very... (break)

Prabhupāda: ...surrounded with Kṛṣṇa consciousness. That was my great fortune. My father, mother, my relatives, my neighborhood... I had the opportunity mixing with... (break) Everywhere there was Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And they were all well-to-do, rich. This was the opportunity. Then gradually it developed. My father was a great Vaiṣṇava. He was worshiping Rādhā-Kṛṣṇa. Our family Deity was Dāmodara. So hereditary we are Vaiṣṇavas, followers of Nitāi-Gaura.

Room Conversations Bangladesh Preaching/Prabhavisnu Articles by Hamsaduta -- August 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Abhirāma: I just now returned from Delhi, Śrīla Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Abhirāma: So I went to see the astrologer with Yaśodānandana Swami, and he did more calculations on your chart.

Prabhupāda: You can get on light.

Room Conversations Bangladesh Preaching/Prabhavisnu Articles by Hamsaduta -- August 11, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The chart is given. The calculation there is finished. That doesn't matter. Rather, if I am finished now, it will be glorious.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: It will be what, Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Glorious.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Living will also be glorious.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Let us see.... As Kṛṣṇa desires. All right. Thank you. Would you like to send to that Navadvīpa astrologer?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes, I'm going to write to Jayapatākā this evening. I'll give him the information.

Prabhupāda: You have got the janma?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Oh, yes. I'll have Abhirāma... What he has given, I'll have him write it up and add it to that other report. I have a file I'm keeping in case you want to hear again. Pradyumna is here, Śrīla Prabhupāda. Would you like to hear Caitanya-caritāmṛta?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break) Can you guarantee life? Then you are controller. Your so-called advanced medicine or advanced knowledge has no meaning. You have to die. Then where is the value of your empty voice?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: What, Prabhupāda? Empty voice.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation With Madhudvisa and others -- August 17, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Prasādam. And remain here for some time. Of course, according to my horoscope, these days are my last days. But if Kṛṣṇa saves, that is a different thing. They have calculated eighty-two years and two days?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Eighty-one years, five months, and twenty-eight days.

Prabhupāda: That is the..., according to calculation of my horoscope. Eighty-one years will be completed, and eighty-second year will begin. It doesn't matter I leave this body. Even in death I'll live. One year before or one year after... Now as far as possible, I have trained you. Try to follow the principles. And go ahead. Don't be set back by māyā's tricks. Go ahead, forward, at any cost. Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura said... So many obstacles are coming. Māyā is strong. And still, we are going forward. That's all right.

Room Conversation -- October 12, 1977, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: How much they can take?

Jayapatākā: Well, the government calculates that each person gets 80 grams of dalya and 7 grams of oil, and when that's cooked that comes to nearly about four, five hundred grams cooked per head. It's about three, four clay cups.

Kīrtanānanda: Śrīla Prabhupāda, if we could prop you up for a few minutes you could clear all that mucus out. It would come out much easier. Can we do that?

Prabhupāda: Yes. (break)

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Come over here, Pisimā.

Upendra: This side.

Prabhupāda: (converses with sister in Bengali) Somebody may be sent to Imlital Math to call her son.

Room Conversation -- November 3, 1977, Vrndavana:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Lay down? (pause) Then I calculated what it would mean for the whole year.

Prabhupāda: Now we have to open temple in every village.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Temples in every village?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Then spend money.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: And then spend the money.

Prabhupāda: Don't keep money. Spend it. The karmīs, they spend for sense gratification. You spend for Kṛṣṇa.