Go to Vanipedia | Go to Vanisource | Go to Vanimedia


Vaniquotes - the compiled essence of Vedic knowledge


Brahmacari (Conversations 1968 - 1975)

Conversations and Morning Walks

1968 Conversations and Morning Walks

Interview -- February 1, 1968, Los Angeles:

Interviewer: What is the purpose of the robes and having your head shaved?

Prabhupāda: That is not very difficult to understand. Just like you dress in a certain way, I dress in certain way. So we have got this dressing system in our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, and this is taken from Vedic literature. A brahmacārī should dress like that. And that is very economical. Our dress is saffron dress. It does not become dirty very quickly, and we... (break) This dress is not very important thing, but when one is initiated, he accepts the regulations which I give them. So it is not that if you do not come in that dress in our temple you will not understand our philosophy. That is not... We don't mean that. But it is convenient. But anyone who does not want to change this dress, that does not matter. We don't insist. These brahmacārīs, they voluntarily change. Otherwise there are many students, just like we have got two, three students, they are working. They come just like ordinary American gentlemen. So there is no objection in that way. Dress is not very important thing.

Interviewer: Do you have a name that you call... are they called students? Like, would he be called a student or a...?

Devotee: Brahmacārī.

Prabhupāda: Brahmacārī. We have got four divisions. Those who are not married, they are called brahmacārīs. And those who are married, they are called gṛhasthas. And those who are retired, they are called vānaprasthas. And those who are renounced, they have no connection with anything worldly, they are called sannyāsa. Just like I am a sannyāsī. Sannyāsī mean I have got my family, I have got my wife, children, grandchildren in India, but I have no connection with them. I live alone.

Interviewer: Could I ask for a spelling on those?

Prabhupāda: Sannyā... Yes, brahmacārī: b-r-a-h-m-a-c-h-a-r-y, this is brahmacārī. Then gṛhastha: g-r-i-h-a-s-t-h-a, gṛhastha. H-a-s-t-h-a, gṛhastha. G-r-i-h-a-s-t-h-a. Is that clear? Gṛhastha. Then vānaprastha: v-a-n-a-p-r-a-s-t-h-a, vānaprastha. Then sannyāsī: s-n-n-y-a-s-i, sannyāsī. Four divisions. These four divisions, and there are other four orders of social system. That is according to work, division according to work and quality. Just like the brāhmaṇas, b-r-a-h-m-a-i-n-s, brāhmaṇas. Brāhmaṇas means the most intelligent class of the society. The kṣatriyas, k-s-h-a-t-r-y-a-s, kṣatriyas. Kṣatriyas means persons who are interested in politics, in the management of the country, political affairs. They are called kṣatriyas. Similarly, there is the vaiśyas, v-a-i-s-y-a-s. Vaiśyas means the mercantile, productive class. Those who are engaged in producing grains or trade, milk, and in industry. Of course, industry, artisans, they are called, artists, śūdras. Anyway, any person engaged in producing for the needs of the society, they are called vaiśyas. And the worker class is called śūdra. So according to Vedic system, these are eight divisions. Unless the human society is divided into these eight divisions in terms of material and spiritual progress of life, that is not accepted as human society.

Radio Interview -- March 12, 1968, San Francisco:

Interviewer: No, about the way your clothes, the way you're dressed today. Uh, the robes.

Prabhupāda: Oh, the robe? Yes, I am a sannyāsī. The sannyāsī is the highest status of human social division. According to Vedic culture there are four divisions of human society. Brahmacārī, student life; then householder, gṛhastha; and then vānaprastha, retired life; and then sannyāsa life, means preaching transcendental knowledge to the society from door to door. So this dress... In Vedic culture, there are different dresses for different persons. So this saffron colored dress means that he is admitted without any introduction anywhere because he's understood to be a man of transcendental knowledge. And the householders receive them and take knowledge from them. That is the system of Vedic culture.

Radio Interview -- March 12, 1968, San Francisco:

Interviewer: The swami... Now did I understand you to say the swami has no sex life?

Prabhupāda: No, certainly not.

Interviewer: Certainly not. All right, now when you...

Prabhupāda: Well, actually sex life is allowed only to the householders. According to Vedic culture, sex life is restricted. There are four divisions of society. The brahmacārī is strictly forbidden for sex life. The vānaprastha, they are also forbidden for sex life, and the sannyāsī, they are also forbidden for sex life. So out of four divisions, three divisions are strictly forbidden for sex life. Only the householders they can have restricted sex life with married wife simply for begetting children. That is the Vedic culture.

Morning Walk at Stow Lake -- March 23, 1968, San Francisco:

Devotee (1): Sometimes, well, if you (we) slept less, we could do more for Kṛṣṇa, but at the same time you (we) would be very tired. I mean, you could be... Well, you could regulate that.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Practically everything depends on practice. Abhyāsa-yoga-yuktena cetasā nānya-gāminā (BG 8.8). Abhyāsa-yoga. Abhyāsa-yoga means yoga practice... Practice it. So this whole Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is to practice transferring from one kind of consciousness to another. So we require practice. Just like one man can run few miles. I cannot run even one mile. He has practiced. We see some boys, they run, run on. They practice. Practice it. Strength of the heart increasing by practice. And if I run, my heart will be palpitating. Because I have no practice. So by practice, everything can be attained. Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma Rāma Hare Hare. (break) ...determination. And this determination is increased by celibacy. Brahmacārya is recommended to keep oneself determined. A brahmacārī, if he determines something, he executes. He has got that strength of mind. Those who are too much addicted to sex life, they cannot be determined. They cannot be fixed-up. They are fluctuating, changing. People are, in modern day, they cannot sit down in a place for a long time. Therefore so much traveling. The traveling business is very prosperous. Everyone wants to travel. They cannot fix, fix up. So the processes recommended, they're very valuable, but it is not possible to follow them all in the present age because everything is reducing. So our method is to pray to Kṛṣṇa to give us the necessary strength. That's all.

Room Conversation -- March 25, 1968, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Praṣṭhipāta, it is called in Bengali. They test gold. By rubbing on the stone, they can understand what is the value of the gold. In India they are simply keeping a stone like this, and you take something golden, and they will at once test by simply rubbing on it. So experienced. By the glazing of the gold they will understand what is the value of this. It is experience. But this stone is used.

Śyāmasundara: Marble?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Now, as soon as you get that church, all the gṛhasthas and brahmacārīs, they will have to bring money. (Laughter) Is that not right?

Devotees: Yes, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: There was one clergyman lecturing in a Sheffield coal-mine that, "If you don't worship Jesus Christ, then you will go to hell." So first of all one man asked him... First of all, the clergyman inquired, "Do you know Jesus Christ?" So they were silent. So one of them inquired, "What is his number?" They thought that "Jesus Christ must be one of us," I mean to say, workers in the mine. So he must have got a number. "So what is his number?" Then the clergyman could understand that "To whom I am speaking." So then he explained, "Oh, Jesus Christ is not one of you. He is son of God. He has come to deliver you. If you don't worship Him, then you will go to hell." Then one of them said, "What is hell?" Then he described, "It is very dark, moist, and so on." So they were silent, because they work in the mine. (laughter) They were silent. "What is this hell? It is all right." Then the clergyman thought how to impress them. Then, after a few minutes, he said, "No. The hell is very dangerous." "How?" "There is no newspaper." "Oh, horrible." (Laughter) Because in your western countries everyone is fond of newspaper. So he stressed, he hit the point, that "There is no newspaper." So we have to hit to the point that there is no tax-man. So what is your question?

Room Conversation -- July 16, 1968, Montreal:

Prabhupāda: Bhagavad-gītā: cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). "I have created the four divisions of caste." It is not exactly caste; section, varṇa. So how you can stop? It is natural. So Bhāgavata recommends, Suta Gosvāmī is addressing, ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ. This system of sectional division, this is... "He is brāhmaṇa, he is kṣatriya, he is vaiśya, he is śūdra, he is brahmacārī, he is householder, he is vānaprastha, he is sannyāsī." Or sub-section. "He is potter, he is washerman, he is this and that." You may divide it or not, this section will be there in every society. So Bhāgavata says that "You may be situated in any section. It doesn't matter." Either you be a kṣatriya or a brāhmaṇa or a potter or a washerman or whatever you may be, it doesn't matter. Everyone should be satisfied by his occupation. But how one gets successful by his occupation? He hasn't got to change the occupation. In the material world one has to change his occupation for certain kind of success. Suppose if you are a potter. Now, if you want to become engineer, so you have to change your occupation as potter. But in the spiritual world you haven't got to change your position, and still, you get success, spiritual life. That is the beauty. You haven't got to change. If somebody says that "Sir, I am potter. How can I be Kṛṣṇa conscious? It requires that one should be a brāhmaṇa, one should be very learned man, Vedānta philosophy, and one must have the sacred thread, and this and that. So I am a potter. I am a cobbler. I am a washerman." No. Kṛṣṇa says, "No." You do not require to change. Caitanya Mahaprabhu also says, "You do not require to change." Kṛṣṇa says that svakarmaṇā tam abhyarcya. You just try to worship the Supreme Lord by the result of your occupation. Because Kṛṣṇa requires everything.

Questions and Answers -- Montreal, August 26, 1968:

Prabhupāda: So Caitanya Mahāprabhu had all these facilities. He was learned, very honored young man in His country; He had many followings. In one incidence we can understand how beloved leader He was. The Kazi challenged His saṅkīrtana movement and first times warned Him not to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa, and when He did not care for it, then he ordered that, er, that mṛdaṅga should be broken. So the constables came and broke the mṛdaṅgas. This information was given to Lord Caitanya, and He ordered civil disobedience. He was the first man in the history of India who started this civil disobedience movement. It is not Gandhi who is the originator of civil disobedience; it was Caitanya Mahāprabhu. He said that "Defy the order of the Kazi." Kazi means magistrate. So "This evening we shall go at the Kazi's house in hundreds of thousands, with mṛdaṅga and kīrtana." So simply by His order many hundreds of thousands young men—not young men; young, old, all kind of men-gathered, and... The point is just how popular leader He was. Even in His young age, when He was only twenty years old, how popular He was. So..., and because He was a learned brāhmaṇa, people would send Him many presentation. A brāhmaṇa is not expected to work. That is dhana pratigraha. Pratigraha means accept offerings from others. Just like you offered so many things to me-money, clothing, food—so a sannyāsī, a brāhmaṇa, can accept. Not others. A gṛhastha cannot. There are restriction. A brahmacārī can, but he can accept on behalf of his spiritual master, not personally. These are the rules. So He was learned brāhmaṇa, and people used to present Him profusely, so He had no economics problem. Not that He renounced the world on account of poverty or some strain. He had no poverty, He was opulent.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: I told her, I said, if she wished to come with us, (break) that only married women could come with us. I told her that. Because it was not good for men, unmarried men, brahmacārīs and brahmacārīṇis, to constantly be mixing, and so I felt that it would be better for married people than brahmacārīs. And she... (someone moves microphone) ...did she wish to come?

Prabhupāda: She likes this... (microphone noise) But also marriage problem, one must have a choice. So if we force something, that is not (chuckling) good. At least, in your country it is not... Of course, in your country, the husband...the boys and girls are, I mean to say, not major, whatever the parents force, that is another thing. When the boys and girls are grown up, it is not possible. Just like in India, there was svayaṁvara. Svayaṁvara means the girl will select her own bridegroom. That was allowed to princess. Princess, highly qualified princess. So the father would make a challenge, that "This is the condition. One who can fulfill this condition, I'll offer my daughter to him." So this was generally amongst the princes. So there was great fight. (laughs) Just like Arjuna. Arjuna married Draupadī. You know the condition? Her father made condition: there was a fish on the ceiling and one wheel was circling. So one has to pierce the eyes of the fish through the hole of the circle. And he cannot see directly. He has to see down. There is a reflection in waterpot. In this way, he had to pierce. (laughs) "In this way, he has to fix, and in one stroke the eye will be pierced. One who is successful, my daughter is for him." So nobody could, except only Arjuna. He was such expert bowman that he... Similarly, Lord Rāmacandra also made... In the palace there was a big bow. It was all hardened, made of iron. So long standing it was there. So one day, Sītā was sweeping the floor, and with her left hand she pushed the bow. It was very heavy.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. So I was thinking that... And I was thinking the next best thing to that is just married people and brahmacārī. If you can't have just married people, then married people and brahmacārīs.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is nice. That is nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So that's what I told her. It's very difficult to have brahmacārī and brahmacārīṇis all the time together.

Prabhupāda: No. This is not possible. Because brahmacārīs, they are young men, and they are young girls. Naturally, there is dis-turbance to the mind. Yes. It is just like putting butter pot on fire. That is stated in the Bhāgavata. Nanv agni, pramadāgni ghṛta-kumbha-pāyaḥ pumān. Just like fire. (chuckles) Fire is a woman, and man is just like butterpot. It is said. Therefore they should not keep together. (laughs) Just like there are some labels in medicine and some..., "Keep away from fire." Huh? (chuckles) "Keep away from fire." So brahmacārīnī and brahmacārī is not a very good combination. But married couple and some brahmacārīs, that is nice. So this girl is married, but she is separated.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. I'm not worried so much how it looks in this country. What I'm worried about is the mixing. But people don't care. The public does not mind.

Prabhupāda: No, if you think her presence essential, you can take.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Uh, it is not essential. We have never tried to have all brahmacārī kīrtana outside, saṅkīrtana. We have always had some women, so I've always felt that we need women. But maybe we don't need them on saṅkīrtana.

Madhudviṣa: Did Lord Caitanya have women, householders traveling with Him when He went on saṅkīrtana?

Prabhupāda: Yes. They were following. Still, saṅkīrtana, they follow. But they have got their husband. Saṅkīrtana, everyone can...

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Children too.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Everyone. Saṅkīrtana means assembly. Bahubhir militva kirtayatiti saṅkīrtanaḥ. That is the derivation. When many people assemble together and chant, that is called saṅkīrtana. If you alone chant, that is called kīrtana. And when you chant in assembly that is called saṅkīrtana.

Room Conversation about Marriage -- September 24, 1968, Seattle:

Devotee (1): What? You can't... I mean to say that you can't force somebody to get married. You know. That isn't proper.

Prabhupāda: There was no force. There was no force. Only proposal. That's all. When it was proposed before me, I also said, "It depends on the choice." So anyway, go on with your work, saṅkīrtana movement you have started. It is very nice. And it is being responded. So increase it. If simply brahmacārīs can do it, that is best.

Room Conversation -- October 27, 1968, Montreal, With First Devotees Going to London On Evening of Their Departure:

Yamunā: Oh, Karṇapura is beautiful! He's the best little boy you could ever imagine.

Mālatī: He's already brahmacārī.

Yamunā: He's just fantastic. Upendra really loves that kid. Upendra picks up Karṇapura and Upendra doesn't know about children. And he'll take Karṇapura and he'll make him kiss every picture in the temple, (laughter) especially at the feet of Lord Caitanya he'll go, "Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa." Karṇapura will go, "bang, bang." (laughter)

Prabhupāda: (laughing) Very nice. So Murāri(?), you have got to say anything?

Murāri: I have got to say anything? No. I was just visiting.

Prabhupāda: Thank you. (end)

Talk After Lecture (on Brahma-samhita, verse 29) -- November 8, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Who has seen that house? Dayānanda? You saw?

Dayānanda: No.

Prabhupāda: Any of the brahmacārīs?

Dayānanda: No. Maṇḍalī.

Prabhupāda: Oh, Maṇḍalī? You have seen?

Maṇḍalī: (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Oh, you have seen very nice house.

Maṇḍalī: Mm. I thought it was nice.

Prabhupāda: Very good. You have been in... We shall take that house. Very nice. You have seen inside also?

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: I ask all my disciples to get married. I don't allow these boys living with boyfriend, girlfriend. No. You must get yourself married, life like gentlemen, treat your wife as assistant, treat your husband as your provider. In this way, I am teaching them. This boy was married just four days before. He is professor. So I have got so many of my disciples married, and they are living very happily. This girl is married. Formerly, they were living with girlfriend, boyfriend. I don't allow that. I don't allow that.

Journalist: Well, let's... Let me get a little more basic. How about when someone is fourteen, fifteen, sixteen years old?

Prabhupāda: The same thing. Of course, another thing is that we teach our boys to become brahmacārī. Brahmacārī. Brahmacārī means how to lead the life of celibacy.

Journalist: Hm?

Prabhupāda: Just Howard explain brahmacārī life.

Journalist: Yes, I understand.

Hayagrīva: Well, it's control of the senses, and he teaches us how to control the senses. Generally, marriage doesn't take place until a boy is about 22, 23, 25.

Journalist: You mean in his culture.

Prabhupāda: Yes. We select girl, say, about 16, 17 years old, and boys not more than 24 years old. I get them married. You see? And because their attention is diverted to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, they have very little interest simply for sex life. You see? They have got better engagement. Paraṁ dṛṣṭvā nivartate (BG 2.59). You see? We give substitute. We simply don't say that "You don't do it," but we give something better. You see? Then automatically the "don't" automatically comes. You see?

Press Interview -- December 30, 1968, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is the Vedic regulation. Everyone should give up family connection at a certain age, after the age of 50. One should not remain in family life. That is Vedic culture. Not that up to death, one is in family-wise, no. That is not good.

Journalist: Can you explain that.

Prabhupāda: First of all, a boy is trained as brahmacārī, spiritual life. Then he is advised not to enter family life. But if he is unable to control his sex life, he is allowed, "All right. You get yourself married." Then he remains in family life. So he marries at the age of 24 or 25. 25 years, let him enjoy sex life. In the meantime, he gets some elderly children. So at the age of 50, the husband and wife goes away from the home and they travel in all places of pilgrimage just to detach them from family affection. In this way, when the man is a little more advanced, he asks his wife that "You go and take care of the family and your sons, grown-up, they'll take care of you. Let me take sannyāsa." So he becomes alone and preaches the knowledge which he has acquired. This is Vedic civilization. Not that a man should remain in family life from birth to death. No. In Buddhism also there is compulsory regulative principle that a Buddhist must become a sannyāsī at least for ten years. Yes. Because the whole idea is how to attain spiritual perfection. So if one remains in his family life, encumbered, he cannot make any spiritual advancement. But if the family also, whole family is Kṛṣṇa conscious, then it is helpful. But that is very rare. Because the husband may be Kṛṣṇa conscious, the wife may not be. But the culture was so nice that everyone remained Kṛṣṇa conscious.

1969 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation Including Srimad-Bhagavatam 1.2.1-34 Recitation & Explanation -- April 1, 1969, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: This is second chapter, First Canto. Sūta Gosvāmī, before speaking to the audience, he is offering his respect to the spiritual master. To offer respect to anyone means to remember his qualification. Just like we sing... Just like you offer respect to your spiritual master. What is the meaning?

nama oṁ viṣṇu-pādāya kṛṣṇa-preṣṭhāya bhū-tale
śrīmad-bhaktivedānta-svāmin iti nāmine

Yes. "I offer my respectful obeisances to Swami Bhaktivedanta, who is very dear to Kṛṣṇa, and has come before us to deliver." This is the meaning. So his qualification is described. Similarly, here also Sūta Gosvāmī is offering respect to his spiritual master, Śukadeva Gosvāmī. And he is repeating the history of Śukadeva Gosvāmī. Śukadeva Gosvāmī, just after taking birth from the mother's womb, immediately he started, without staying for a moment. Just see the brahmacārī. The... Father, they are naturally affectionate. So father saw that "This man, child, immediately after birth is going away? How is that? My dear boy, where you are going? Where you are going?" (laughter) So that is being ex... Yaṁ pravrajantam anupetam apeta-kṛtyaṁ (SB 1.2.2). The Śukadeva Gosvāmī, who was going without any ceremonial function... Because after birth there is ceremony, there is nāma-karaṇa, so many things to be done. But he didn't care for anything, any rituals. He immediately started. So it is specifically mentioned that he began to start without observing any formality any rituals. Immediately started. Yaṁ pravrajantam anupetam apeta-kṛtyaṁ (SB 1.2.2). Kṛtyaṁ means things which have to be done. Just like you are initiated, there are so many things to be done. So he didn't care for anything. Dvaipāyano ciraha-kātara ājuhāva. Dvaipayana is father's name, Dvaipayāna Vyāsa. Kṛṣṇa Dvaipāyana Vyāsa, his father's name. So viraha-kātara, too much affected. "The son born and immediately he's going?" Just see how much he is... "My dear boy, where you are going?" Ājuhāva. He didn't care whether father or mother is cut. Putreti tan-māyātayā taravo 'bhinedus. And there was vibration. He was passing through the jungle, and the trees as he vibrated... He was asking, "My dear son, my dear son," and the vibration "My dear son, my dear son." Like that. Taṁ sarva-bhūta-hṛdayaṁ munim ānato 'smi (SB 1.2.2). So "I am offering my respect to that saintly person." That means his qualification described and offered respect. And then next qualification, what is that? Yaḥ svānubhāvam akhila-śruti-sāram ekam ākhyātma-dīpam atititīrṣataṁ tamo 'ndham (SB 1.2.3). And his other qualification is that he presented the gist, essence, substance, of Vedic knowledge for the persons who are eager to get out of the darkness of this material existence. Atititīrṣataṁ tamo 'ndham saṁsariṇaṁ karuṇayāha (SB 1.2.3). And purāṇa guhyam. This Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is called the mahā-purāṇa, I mean to say, "the greatest history." Purāṇa means history, old history. Guhyam, very confidential. He explained this great, confidential history for the people who are suffering the repeated birth and death. For their purpose, he is so kind that he explained. Saṁsariṇaṁ karuṇayā. Karuṇayā means out of compassionate, compassion for the persons who are suffering continually birth and death. Taṁ vyāsa-sūnam upayāmi guruṁ munīnām. So "I offer my respect to that son of Vyasa who is spiritual master of many other saintly persons."

Room Conversation -- April 11, 1969, New York:

Haṁsadūta: Someone has said that the dhotī, the dhotī that the brahmacārīs wear, is the dress that's worn in Vaikuṇṭha. Is that correct?

Prabhupāda: Just see Viṣṇu. He has no coat-pant. Here is Viṣṇu. Or Kṛṣṇa, He has no dress. He is also bare body. Only Rādhārāṇī is covered. In India also, still, the covering of the body is only for woman, but men, this, practically one dhotī is sufficient. Sometimes laṅgota, the underwear. Laṅgota, underwear. What is that?

Nanda-kiśora: Swami? What does Nanda-kiśora mean?

Prabhupāda: Nanda-kiśora, kiśora means a boy.

Nanda-kiśora: Boy?

Prabhupāda: The transcendental boy of Nanda Mahārāja.

Devotees: Oh!

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Dośa. In Sanskrit word it is called dvir-ukti-dośa. Dvi means two. Rukti means utterance. And dośa means fault.

Allen Ginsberg: Fault. Yes.

Prabhupāda: Fault. Yes. So dvir-ukti-dośa. So he was conscious. Then he said, "Well, I understand that you are a student of grammar. How do you detect this, this literary discrepancies?" "No. I am student. I am your student. I do not pose. I am not scholar, but I have heard this is told like that. From other scholars I have heard." "How could You remember? I cited one hundred verses and how do You remember the sixty-fourth verses?" "Oh, I can repeat the whole verses."

Allen Ginsberg: (laughs) Uh huh.

Prabhupāda: "How is that, that you can repeat? How is that?" "Oh, that is grace of mother Sarasvatī. Just like you can compose a hundred verses within a few minutes, I can, whatever you say, I can remember immediately." Formerly that was the system of understanding Vedas, śruti, simply by hearing. Once they hear from the spiritual master, they will remember. The memory was so sharp. Therefore this brahmacārī system is so nice. They can enhance their memorizing power, brahmacārī.

Room Conversation with Allen Ginsberg -- May 14, 1969, Columbus, Ohio:

Prabhupāda: Śaṁbhu is another name of Lord Śiva, Śaṁbhu. Svayaṁbhur nāradaḥ śaṁbhuḥ (SB 6.3.20). He is called Svayaṁbhuḥ, and Śiva is called Śaṁbhu. Vaiṣṇavānām yathā śaṁbhuḥ. Svayaṁbhur nāradaḥ śaṁbhuḥ kumārāḥ kapilo manuḥ (SB 6.3.20). Kumārāḥ. There is a sampradāya from Kumāra, four Kumāras, brahmacārīs. They were sons of Brahmā. When they were born, Lord Brahmā said that "You now make, marry and produce. We want population." In the creation, in the beginning. So they refused. "Oh, we are not going to marry. We shall remain brahmacārī, devotee." Then Lord Brahmā was angry. "Oh, you are refusing your father's order?" So from when he was angry, his eyes became red. From that, Śiva was born. Therefore his name is Rudra. Rudra means anger. So when Lord Śiva becomes angry, the whole thing is finished.

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Hayagrīva: Well, I mean I don't care that much. If you want to put him in charge...

Prabhupāda: That is... No. So far, if you ask my advice, he should do that work, outside propaganda, preaching. But as you say that his presence is required, therefore I say he may remain here. Otherwise, to remain here is not his duty as a sannyāsī. That is actually your duty, to organize the local management and everything. And his duty is outside work, preaching. He may have one assistant, and he can travel. He can educate your countrymen that "Here is a nice thing we are developing. Please come and cooperate." Invite him, and when he comes you receive him and give him good reception. In this way you have to make propaganda, outside and inside. Just like Kṛṣṇa is making outside and inside propaganda. Inside He is Supersoul; outside He is spiritual master to reclaim these fallen souls. Similarly, we should also work outside-inside. And for making outside propaganda, I think he will be the best man. Suppose if he goes to New York, stays for some time, sees respectable foundation and presidents and just to attract their attention this side... Similarly, if he goes Los Angeles, San Francisco, all other cities, Boston, and sees important men, makes propaganda that "We are doing this. Please come and help," that will be very nice. Arrange lectures from... Our local temples may arrange lectures, and he can impress people about the importance of this movement. Not only one, I require several such preachers now. Now we are improving. We are increasing our propaganda. We require several such assistants. So those who have decided to remain brahmacārī, some of them, those who are experienced, they can accept this sannyāsa order and preach. Outside propaganda is also required. Don't you think? Outside propaganda?

Meeting with Devotees -- June 9, 1969, New Vrindaban:

Prabhupāda: Caitanya Mahaprabhu was adored by Rūpa Gosvāmī, "Oh, You are the most munificent incarnation. You are distributing Kṛṣṇa-prema." So we have taken that job. So people must know our importance. So outside propaganda is required. Don't you think it is required? Yes. So make literature. Make nice literature with picture, we get it printed, and then, in the meantime, you try to see things, how it can be managed. And let him move outside. As I am moving, he will move. And if some other boys who are determined to remain brahmacārī, not to marry...They can also take up. Brahmācari and sannyāsī is meant for moving. Yes. Gṛhastha cannot move because they have to earn. They have to maintain. But the brahmacārīs, they will go and beg contribution. A sannyāsī will make the situation favorable. Just like if now a little more, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement is known, if some brahmacārī goes, that "We come from the..." Just like in San Francisco it happened. One of our brahmacārīs was arrested. So when he was taken into police custody, the officer said, "Oh, he is Swami's man. Let him go. Let him go out." Yes. Actually happened so. Similarly, in New York also happened. They were arrested in the subways, and when they were taken in the police custody, he also, "Oh, they are doing nice work. Let them go." (chuckling) So we must make the situation—people will know that they are doing some good work. And when the brahmacārīs go there to beg some contribution, they will be glad: "Oh, yes, they are doing nice work." So we have to do outside propaganda. First of all you make this literature, as I suggested. That you have got. You consult, both together. You do it, and I shall get it printed, at least a few thousand, five thousand or ten thousand. And then Kīrtanānanda Mahārāja will go to stay in every center for some days and make, see the important men and convince. That is necessary.

Lord Caitanya Play Told to Tamala Krsna -- August 4, 1969, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: No, when singing is there, all the players and all the audience and everyone will sing. That will be very nice.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Yes. Even maybe Lord Caitanya says to Nityānanda Prabhu, "Go to all the people and tell them about Kṛṣṇa." So at that moment, we all, all the brahmacārīs, we go into the people and we talk. Then we come back and tell Lord Caitanya. We can preach too.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Yes.

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: So it's, it's fifteen.

Prabhupāda: All right.

Govinda dāsī: Stop now? (break)

1970 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Everyone is born a śūdra, a foolish. Sudra means a foolish man who simply laments. That is the real meaning of śūdra. Anyone who has no intelligence, he is śūdra. We also generally say, gadāh, less intelligent. So brāhmaṇas, kṣatriyas, vaiśyas, they are called higher caste. According to their... Brāhmaṇa, first-class because his intelligence is first-class. Kṣatriya, his intelligence is second-class. Vaiśya, his intelligence is third-class. And śūdra means fourth-class. And less than śūdra, they are called pañcama, caṇḍāla. They are accepted as animals, those who are less than śūdras. This is the Vedic system. Now, here it is said that this Ajamila, dvija... Dvija means he was properly initiated, second birth. First birth by father, mother, is śūdra. Anyone, even if he is born in a brāhmaṇa family, the natural birth is considered as śūdra. But if there is garbhādhāna-saṁskāra, then he's accepted as born brāhmaṇa, born brāhmaṇa. Still, one is born brāhmaṇa, he has to undergo the saṁskāras. So our, this... Now it is known as Hindu society although the "Hindu" word is given by the Mohammedans. It is called sanātana-dharma or varṇāśrama society, who very strictly follow the four divisions, social divisions of varṇa—brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra—and four divisions of spiritual life—brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. So our, the Vedic system is called varṇāśrama. Varṇa means the social order. Āśrama means spiritual division. Therefore those who are following strictly the Vedic principle, that family life is called gṛhastha āśrama. Āśrama. Whenever you add this word āśrama there is spiritual significance. So all the division-brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa—they are known as āśrama. Anyone can understand āśrama. As soon as there is āśrama that means "Here some men, saintly persons, spiritually advanced persons, lives." That is āśrama. So that āśrama, when a student follows the regulative principles, he is supposed to be situated in brahmacārī āśrama. A householder living with family, husband, wife, children, if they are following strictly the regulative principles—gṛhastha āśrama. Similarly, retired life, if he is following the regulative principles—the vānaprastha āśrama. Similarly, a renounced life, sannyāsa, if he is following the regulative principles, that is sannyāsa āśrama. Not that imitating somebody, I put on a saffron dress and I become a sannyāsī and by begging I live. This has killed the whole Hindu society or the sanātana-dharma society. Unqualified persons, they do not know the regulative principles but for solution of economic problem they dress themselves. This is Kali-yuga. They will pass on simply by the dress without any knowledge. So here also, although Ajamila was born of a brāhmaṇa father and he was strictly following the regulative principles of a brāhmaṇa—that will be stated—but he fell. He fell in love with a prostitute And therefore his characters were lost. Naṣṭa-sadācāraḥ. The reason is why? Dāsyāḥ saṁsarga-dūṣitaḥ. Because he associated with a prostitute, therefore his all regulative principles became lost. And as soon as you are lost of regulative principles then you take to all kinds of sinful activities. The regulative principles will keep you on the standard of life. If you give it up, then immediately you fall down, māyā. So this man Ajamila, because he was durācāra, naṣṭa-sadācāra, lost of all regulative principles on account of associating with a prostitute, then, although he was born of a brāhmaṇa family, he became... His livelihood was juha(?), bandy-akṣaiḥ, cheating and stealing. Bandy-akṣaiḥ kaitavaiś cauryaiḥ. Cauryaiḥ means stealing. Garhitāṁ vṛttim āsthitaḥ. This kind of profession is garhitā. Garhitāṁ means... Hitā means beneficial. But this profession is garhitā because it is not beneficial. Ultimately he will be punished either by the king's law or by the God's law. I can escape the king's law by doing something which is abominable but I cannot escape God's law. That is not possible. Therefore, although he is thinking that "Now I am cheating this person," or "I am stealing and getting some profit," that is not good for him. Just like a man is killing some man, another man. So that is not good for him because as soon as he will be arrested he'll be hanged. So they think that "I am cheating the state, I am cheating God, and I can go on gratifying my senses by all these activities," but that is stated in the śāstra as garhitā. Garhitā means it is not beneficial for you." Na sādhu mānye yato ātmano 'yam. In another place it is said, "These kinds of activities, vikarma, is not good ultimately." Na sādhu mānye yato ātmano 'yam asann api kleśada āsa dehaḥ (SB 5.5.4).

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Prabhupāda: Although ātmā, the self, is different from this body—that is the first lesson in spiritual life—still, this body, although temporary, but as soon as you accept this material body you will have to suffer according to the body. If you get a dog's body you suffer according to that. If you get a man's body... Suffering will be there more or less as soon as you get this material body. Therefore Ṛṣabhadeva said, na sādhu mānye: "You are acting abominable. It is not good because you are already suffering in this body." Otherwise why you are stealing? You are in want of money. You are suffering. Therefore necessity is now law. Therefore you are accepting. Even you know that stealing is bad, still, you are accepting it because that is a suffering. So for some of your activities in the past life you are now suffering, and if you go on, continuing committing this nonsense, then you will again, you will have to again accept a body and you'll suffer. Therefore garhitāṁ. There are so many things to know but these things are not discussed nowadays. Very cheap thing: "You can do whatever you like. You simply meditate and become God, that's all." So much cheating is going on everywhere, all over the world. So-called yogis, they go, "Oh, you meditate. You are... And as soon as you realize, you are God, within six months." No. Therefore in this age the only method... It is a concession to the fallen people of this world, this Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra. They 'll not be able to follow all the regulative principles; therefore they must commit all kinds of abominable activities. Under the circumstances the śāstra or God has given a concession that you simply chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra and gradually you will be elevated to the highest position of spiritual life. Other things you cannot follow. You are already fallen. So you take to this process of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra without any offense. And in order to save yourself from the offenses, a little austerity that you cannot have illicit sex life. Why should you have illicit sex life? Everyone's need is sex life. Āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunam. These are the bodily needs. So śāstra has sanctioned, "All right. You can live peacefully by married life and have sex life for children, good children." That is allowed. But why should you have illicit sex life? What is this? Irresponsible life. "I shall not take responsibility of family life, and I shall go on as so-called bachelor and have illicit life." But that is not good. That is garhitāṁ. Na sādhu mānye: "This is not good." This is the advice of Vedic literature. Ultimately you'll suffer. You are thinking at the present moment that you are avoiding suffering because family life is very responsible life. So if you think that family life is responsible, yes, it is responsible life. If you don't take, if you cannot take the responsibility, then remain as a brahmacārī. Why should you marry? Yes. If you practice brahmācārya, then you become free, seventy-five percent freedom immediately. But you do not want to undergo the austerities of a brahmacārī, and still, you want to remain as an unmarried man. Everywhere in the world it is going on. This is increasing. That is stated here, sadācāra. Naṣṭa-sadācāro dāsyāḥ saṁsarga-dūṣitaḥ. The illicit connection with man and woman will certainly make him abominable, fallen down to this abominable life. I... When I was... In my younger days, when I was in business, so I was to take agency one of big company, Smith's Transit Company. So they had to... I had to give some guarantee of my honesty. So in that program the question was whether married or unmarried. Because unmarried man mostly become dishonest. So that inquiry was there, "Whether he is married?" Married man cannot be dishonest because he has got responsibility. If he is arrested he will be insulted in his family. His family members will be in difficulty. Therefore he does not commit dishonesty very easily unless it is absolutely... But that should not be done. But unmarried man, because he has got no responsibility, he commits all kinds of sinful activity. That's a fact. Therefore in our Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement we do not allow such illicit sex life, no. You must get yourself married. And practically, we are seeing, that is very effective and that is going on nicely. All right. (Hindi)

Room Conversation -- December 12, 1970, Indore:

Guest (4): But you preach the Vedic mārga. Don't you think that instead of building a temple, āśramas in this brahmacārī model would be...

Prabhupāda: Yes. And without temple the brahmacārīs will be vyabhicāris. (laughter)

Guest (4): That āśrama becomes a temple.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that we... Wherever we have got a center we have got a temple and at the same time teaching. These two things must go parallel. If simply dry teachings go on and there is no temple worship, then gradually he will glide down to vyabhicāri instead of brahmacārī.

1971 Conversations and Morning Walks

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prabhupāda: These Mohammedans, they pronounce "S" as "H." "Hindus," "Hindus." Instead of "Sindus," they made it "Hindus." So Hindu is a term which is not found in the Sanskrit dictionary.

Prof. Kotovsky: Yes.

Prabhupāda: But it has come into use. Real, I mean to say, cultural institution is called varṇāśrama, four varṇas and four āśramas: brāhmaṇa, kṣatri, vaiśya, śūdra—these four varṇas—and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. So according to Vedic concept of life, unless people take to this system or institution, institute of varṇa and āśrama, four varṇas and four āśramas, actually he does not become a civilized human being. This... One has to take this process, four divisions of varṇas and four..., four divisions of social order and four divisions of spiritual order. That is called varṇāśrama. So India's culture is based on these four, eight system, varṇa and āśrama.

Conversation with Prof. Kotovsky -- June 22, 1971, Moscow:

Prof. Kotovsky: Would he be paid to stay in that center?

Prabhupāda: Yes, I am answering. As I told you that this propaganda is meant for creating some brāhmaṇas all over the world because the brāhmaṇa element is lacking, so one who seriously comes to us, he has to become a brāhmaṇa. So he has to adopt the occupation of a brāhmaṇa, and he has to give up the occupation of a kṣatriya or a śūdra. But if one wants to keep his profession, at the same time wants to understand also, that is allowed. Just like we have many professors. There is Howard Wheeler, professor of Ohio University. He's my disciple. So he is continuing his professorship. But whatever money he's getting, almost he's spending for our, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness. For gṛhasthas, those who are householders living outside, they are expected to contribute fifty per cent of the income for the society, twenty-five per cent for the family, and twenty-five per cent for his personal emergency. After all, in this world, if we live... So far we are concerned, we are sannyāsī, but you are a professor. If there is some emergency, you cannot go to beg. But I am a sannyāsī. I can tell you that I am in difficulty. That is the system. So we have got four orders. Just like he's brahmacārī, and he's gṛhastha. He has got his wife, children. So he's a gṛhastha. He's a brahmacārī. Similarly, there is sannyāsī. So that is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's teaching. It doesn't matter whether one is a gṛhastha, householder, or renounced order or a brahmacārī or a brāhmaṇa or śūdra. It doesn't matter. If anyone understands the science of Kṛṣṇa, he becomes the spiritual master.

Darsana -- June 28, 1971, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: The spiritual life means reduction of these things. When it is nil, no more sleeping, no more eating, that is spiritual..., perfection of spiritual life. So we cannot make it nil so long this body is there, but our policy should be like that. Policy should be like that. We shall not eat more, we shall not sleep more, we shall not mate more. Those who are gṛhasthas, they can have sex life only for producing children, that's all, no more. And those who are sannyāsī, brahmacārī, they have no sex life, there is no question of sex life. Sex life is prohibited. But it is a concession for them who cannot live without sex life. That is married life. Otherwise, sex life is not very important thing. Just like there are brahmacārīs, sannyāsīs, they have no sex life. Therefore, this sannyāsa, to go out of home by force, that means to avoid sex life, sannyāsa. You see? I think those who have got children, they should take sannyāsa now and preach. That is my idea.

Darsana -- June 28, 1971, San Francisco:

Devotee (1): So do you want to give (indistinct) authorization to take sannyāsa as soon as possible?

Prabhupāda: That I tell you, not immediately. But our main business is preaching. Either do it as a gṛhastha or as sannyāsī, it does not matter. This is only formality. The real work is preaching. Just like Rāmānanda Rāya was a gṛhastha and Lord Caitanya was a sannyāsī, but He was taking lesson from Rāmānanda Rāya. This is Caitanya-līlā. He is a sannyāsī and He is God Himself, He is taking lesson from a grhastha who is His disciple. So the real thing is preaching must go on sincerely. This gṛhastha, vānaprastha, these are material regulative principles. Real life is Kṛṣṇa's service. That we have to do, that's all. So whatever position is suitable for you, you accept. You remain as a gṛhastha, remain as sannyāsī, remain as brahmacārī as it becomes suitable for you, but preach. That is the main business. If you lacking in preaching and become a sannyāsī, what is the use of sannyāsa? Better... A gṛhastha is better.

Darsana -- June 28, 1971, San Francisco:

Prabhupāda: Preaching work is for the guru. So Kṛṣṇa... Caitanya Mahāprabhu says it doesn't matter whether he is a gṛhastha or vānaprastha or a brāhmaṇa or śūdra. It doesn't matter. If he knows what is Kṛṣṇa consciousness and preaches, then he is guru. That's all. So we have to become like that. It doesn't matter what we are, but whether I am preaching nicely. That is required. But still there is some regulative principles like sannyāsī and brahmacārī will be like this, gṛhastha will be like this. That is the external. But the main business is preaching. So you have got good opportunity, you have got good name, Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, it is being appreciated. So live very cautiously and preach very cautiously and seriously, then in this one life you will become successful, go back to home, back to Godhead. One life. You haven't got to wait for another life. If this life we work sincerely, then our business is finished. Tyaktvā dehaṁ punar janma naiti (BG 4.9).

Room Conversation -- July 18, 1971, Detroit:

Mohsin Hassan: You have ten swamis. And outside of swamis, what's the lower...

Prabhupāda: Now, they're competent. They can, not only the swamis, even the gṛhasthas, they are called dāsa adhikārī, and brahmacārīs, everyone can, whoever is initiated, he is competent to make disciples. But as a matter of etiquette they do not do so in the presence of their spiritual master. This is the etiquette. Otherwise, they are competent. They can make disciples and spread. They can recruit more members in this. They do, but they are being trained up. Just like here in this meeting, one of my disciples, he is acting as priest. It is not myself; he is acting. So some of my students, they are acting as priests, some of them are swamis, so they are competent to make disciples.

Room Conversation with Dr. Karan Singh, -- November 25, 1971, Delhi:

Dr. Singh: (indistinct) Śrīman George Harrison, Śyāmasundara dāsa Adhikārī, Śrīman Brahmānanda dāsa Brahmacārī, Hayagrīva dāsa Adhikārī, (Hindi), Śrīmate Devahūti devī, Śrīmate Jadurāṇī dāsī. You are Devahūti? Śrīman Muralīdhara dāsa and Bharadrāja dāsa. Bharadrāja dāsa, Pradyumna dāsa Adhikārī.

Prabhupāda: (indistinct) All of them work for this movement.

Room Conversation -- December 11, 1971, New Delhi:

Prabhupāda: Our test is there. "I am liberated. I am Nārāyaṇa." Why? "How you call me rascal?" Yes, we have got a test: ye 'nye 'ravindākṣa vimukta-māninas tvayy asta-bhāvād aviśuddha-buddhayaḥ. Tvayy asta-bhāvād. Still they have not reached the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Simply impersonal idea, and self-complacent that "I have become now Nārāyaṇa." So this kind of knowledge is aviśuddha, impure, impure knowledge, because the test is, unless one comes to the point of understanding the Personality of Godhead, the knowledge is imperfect. So they are impersonalists, and falsely thinking themselves as Nārāyaṇa. Therefore we can immediately test that "Here is a rascal." Vimukta-māninas tvayy asta-bhāvād aviśuddha-buddhayaḥ. "No. We have undergone so much austerities, penances. Whole life I remain brahmacārī, then I took sannyāsa. I have followed the rules and regulations very strictly, and still I am rascal?" Yes, you are rascal.

1972 Conversations and Morning Walks

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: The attachment between man and woman.

Prabhupāda: Man and woman. So if you want to get liberation from this material world, then that attachment should be reduced to nil. Otherwise, simply for that attachment, you'll have to take birth and rebirth, either as human being or as demigod or as an animal, as a serpent, as a bird, as a beast. You have to take birth. So this basic principle of attachment, increasing, is not our business. It is decreasing. Pravṛttir eṣā bhūtānāṁ nivṛttis tu mahā-phalam. This is the general tendency, but if one can reduce and stop it, that is first class. Therefore our Vedic system is that first of all a boy is trained as a brahmacārī, no sex life. Brahmacārī. He goes to the teacher's home. (pause—a devotee chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa over loudspeaker is very loud.) Who is this? Stop it. (break) The whole principle is, Vedic principle is, to reduce it, not to increase it. Therefore the whole system is varṇāśrama-dharma. Our, the Indian system is called varṇa and āśrama, four spiritual orders and four social orders. The social order is brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. Uh, this is spiritual order. And social order is brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, and śūdra. So under this system the regulative principles are so nice that even one has got the tendency for enjoy material life, he is so nicely molded that at last he gets liberation and goes back to home, back to Godhead. This is the process. So sex life is not required on principle, but because we are attached to that, therefore there are some regulative principles.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: To reduce it over the stages of your life?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Reduce it, just like a boy is trained up as a student up to twenty-five years, restricting sex life. Brahmacārī. So, some of the boys they remain naiṣṭhika-brahmacārī. He, because he's given education, so if he becomes fully conversant he doesn't like to marry. But one who has not such restraint, he's allowed to marry. That is also restricted, that he cannot have sex life without being married. Therefore in the human society there is marriage, not in the animal society. But we are reducing human society gradually to animal society. We are forgetting marriage. That is also written in the śāstras. Svīkāra eva codvāhe. In the Kali-yuga there will be no marriage performances, but the boy and the girl, they'll simply agree to live together. Dāmpatye 'bhirucir hetuḥ. And their relationship will exist on sexual power. If the man or the woman is deficient in sex life, then there is divorce. So on this philosophy... There are many western philosophers like Freud and others. They have written so many books. But according to Vedic culture, we are not interested. We are interested only for begetting children. That's all. Not to study the psychology of sex life. There is already psychology, pravṛtti, natural. Even if one does not read any philosophy, he'll be sexually inclined. There is no need of philosophizing sex life. Nobody is taught sex life in the school and the colleges, but everyone knows it, how to do it. (laughs) So pravṛttir eṣā bhūtānāṁ nivṛttis tu mahā-phalam. That is the general tendency. But education should be given to stop it. That is real education.

Talk with Bob Cohen -- February 27-29, 1972, Mayapura:

Bob: Now I still have my connections in home. Marriage is... I'm engaged and all this...

Prabhupāda: No, no. There are so many marriages. He is married. Marriage is no barrier. I told you, there are four different orders of social life: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, and sannyāsa. So after brahmacārī, one can marry. But that is not obligatory. He may remain naiṣṭhika-brahmacārī for whole life. But a brahmacārī can marry. So after marriage there is vānaprastha life. Means little aloof from family. Live—husband and wife—separately. That time there is no sex life. And then, when he's fully renounced, detached from the family life, he takes sannyāsa.

Room Conversation Vaisnava Calendar Description -- March 11, 1972, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: The next important day is on the 26th, no, 12th September, 12th September, 1970, the advent day of Śrī Jīva Gosvāmī Prabhu. (pause) On that day there are three functions. First of all, Ekādaśi, a special Ekādaśi called Pārśvaika Ekādaśi. Then on that day, actually, Ekādaśi according to calendar, Ekādaśi was to be observed on the 11th September, but because the next day is Vāmana Dvādaśī.... Vāmana Dvādaśī means the advent of Lord Vāmanadeva. Therefore we have fast., Ekādaśi fasting, and we observe two fastings in one day, Ekādaśi and Vāmanadeva, Vāmana Dvādaśī. The same process as we observe Ekādaśi, and the evening there should be a meeting discussing on the life and work of Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī. He is one of the very important ācāryas in our sampradāya, so especially his Sandarbhas should be discussed. If there is no such book, then the following discussion may be, take place. Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī was a brahmacārī, he left his home at the age of 10 to 12 years. His father and two elder uncles, they left home. His father was Vallabha, and his elder uncles, Sanātana and Rūpa, or Sākara Mallika and Dabira Khāsa. So, they were all government servants, but after meeting Caitanya Mahāprabhu they decided to retire from the service, and three of them retired. Out of that, Sanātana Gosvāmī was very important officer. The Nawab did not like his retirement so he interned him, not allowed him to go out of home. But Rūpa Gosvāmī and his younger brother, Vallabha, they left home, and they left instruction also to Sanātana Gosvāmī, that there is some money for his release, he could utilize that money.

Room Conversation -- April 18, 1972, Hong Kong:

Prabhupāda: So I think you should have a nice institution here to train the children in this country. And after their education, they may take to any line of livelihood. That doesn't matter. But the foundation... Just like in our Vedic system, first of all brahmacārī. That brahmacārī system is very nice. Even Kṛṣṇa, God Himself, He has nothing to learn. He is abhijñā. In the Vedas He is described as abhijñā: He knows everything. But just to teach us, He also became a brahmacārī in the Gurukula. Lord Rāmacandra, He also accepted a guru, Vasiṣṭha. So that is our Vedic system. Anybody may be anything, but the process is tad vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet (MU 1.2.12).

Conversation in car -- April 22, 1972, Tokyo:

Karandhara: Right now there are twelve brahmacārīs in Los Angeles who are getting ready to go to India.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Karandhara: They'll be going on about the 5th of May, the 6th of May. I think also the same number in New York are preparing to go.

Prabhupāda: Now we have got enough place. Yes. Very nice place, Vṛndāvana. And we are expected to get another place at Bhaktivinoda Ṭhākura's birth place. Oh, that is very nice place also. (end)

Room Conversation -- June 29, 1972, San Diego:

Prabhupāda: There are so many married families. So many married families. He is married family, he is married family, he is married family. They have got children, wife, everything. There is no problem. The children are getting nice education, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, dancing, eating nicely. Just now we are purchasing one house in front of our temple, seventy thousand dollars for providing gṛhasthas. Husband, wife, children will live there. So we have no problem. The gṛhasthas are there, the brahmacārīs are there, sannyāsīs are there—everyone is there. We maintain the Vedic culture, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, or brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. The eight orders of social structure we maintain. But they're all engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service. That is the distinction. Everyone is twenty-four hours engaged in Kṛṣṇa's service.

Room Conversation -- July 5, 1972, London:

Sumati Morarjee: Yes, yes, also Caitanya-caritāmṛta, Caitanya's life, and all that, it is written by (indistinct) brahmacārī.

Prabhupāda: Ah.

Sumati Morarjee: I have read that.

Prabhupāda: Ah, (Hindi)

Sumati Morarjee: (Hindi)

Devotee: We stayed in his āśrama in (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: Ah, so...

Devotee: ...brahmacārī's āśrama.

Sumati Morarjee: (Hindi exchanges with Śrīla Prabhupāda)

Prabhupāda: Teachings of Lord Caitanya, show him...

Devotee: Teachings of Lord Caitanya.

Prabhupāda: Our latest can be (indistinct). All the books. You have got this book?

Interview -- July 20, 1972, Paris:

Devotee: ...how a man such as yourself, in such a high position and such hierarchy was able to leave all this in order to bring this message to others?

Prabhupāda: No. It's not to be... Life is divided into four parts: brahmacārī, student, gṛhastha, householder, vānaprastha, retired life and sannyāsa. Everyone should follow this principle. First of all, as brahmacārī student he should learn sufficiently what is the value of life. Then, when he's a householder, he should live properly with husband, wife and children-properly. Then, after retired life, giving the responsibility of household life to grown-up children, he should take lessons from saintly persons. (indistinct) Then at the end he should take sannyāsa. Whatever knowledge he has gathered he must distribute by traveling from one place to another. This is Vedic civilization. Everyone should come out. Not that they should remain at home and drink and sleep for the whole life. This is Vedic civilization.

Interview with the New York Times -- September 2, 1972, New Vrindaban:

Where there is Godhead there is no nescience." This is also the Vedic injunction: Don't remain in darkness; come to the light. How is this possible? When I flew to London from Los Angeles, there was no darkness, for we did not allow the sun to set, you remain always in light. This means that if you don't forget Kṛṣṇa, your life will be successful. If you aim your plane westward and don't stop, you will remain in sunlight all the time. Similarly, if you remain in Kṛṣṇa consciousness by the simple method of chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare, Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare, you will never see the darkness. This is because Kṛṣṇa and Kṛṣṇa's name are absolute; Kṛṣṇa is not different from His name. Kṛṣṇa is light, and if we associate with the name of Kṛṣṇa, we remain in light. Remaining in light is a very simple method; therefore you see all these boys with their beads chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare. In this way māyā cannot touch them. No intoxication, no illicit sex, no meat-eating, no gambling. How can these boys, who have been trained to practice these four items from the beginning of their lives, give them all up? Everything is possible, provided we make the choice. Therefore according to Vedic civilization in the beginning of life you become a brahmacārī. Then you are allowed to marry and become a householder, and after a number of years you remain a husband but abandon sexuality, and that is called vānaprastha. Finally you take sannyāsa and leave your family to practice and preach Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This is Vedic civilization.

Room Conversation -- October 25, 1972, Vrndavana:

Devotee (3): By the upper echelon of his... He was... They found he was having sex with his secretary. So she...

Prabhupāda: They are all like that.

Devotee (3): She told her husband, and they told him either he would have to leave or he would have to renounce the title of swami or he would have to lessen the restrictions on brahmacārī. So he refused to do all three, then he joined together (indistinct). This was told to me by a friend of Bhaktijana's named Avery, who was one of... (break)

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) Vivekananda.

Indian man: Huh?

Prabhupāda: (Hindi) (break) Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tucchaṁ (SB 7.9.45). (break)

1973 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Indonesian Scholar -- February 27, 1973, Jakarta:

Scholar: But by using threads, attributes of Hindu religion...

Prabhupāda: No, actually... Hindu, the word is not to be found in our Vedic scripture. It is the name given by the Mohammedans. So that is going on. Actually it is called varṇāśrama-dharma, four varṇas, four āśrama. The four varṇas, the brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. And four āśramas-brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. Combined together it is called varṇāśrama. So unless the human being follows this varṇāśrama principle he's not a human being. He's animal, because animal has no varṇa, no āśrama. The human society must be divided. Then, just like in this body there are four divisions—the head division, the arms division, the belly division, and the leg division—all these are required for complete body. Although, by comparative study, head is the most important department, but still the leg is not... that we don't require leg. Leg is also required. Similarly, the brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, they're required to function the society perfectly. That is varṇa. And similarly, for spiritual emancipation there must be the division: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. So unless you accept this institution perfectly you cannot develop your consciousness as perfect human being.

Room Conversation -- March 17, 1973, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: So 1928 there was a Kumbha-melā, I think. And during that Kumbha-melā, Tīrtha Mahārāja with a party came to my shop, Prayāg pharmacy, all of a sudden, and I thought, "Oh, these are the people I saw, Gauḍīya Maṭha. Yes." So, I was so glad. So Tīrtha Mahārāja asked me that "We are come new here. We are going to establish a temple in Allahabad. We have heard your name, so we have come to you. Please help us." "Yes, I will help you." So in this way I contributed, my attending physician contributed, and some other friends. In this way we became friends, and Tīrtha Mahārāja, old Tīrtha Mahārāja had first meeting in my house at Allahabad, with I think the Sarvesvara brahmacārī and Dhīra Kṛṣṇa brahmacārī...

Śrīdhara Mahārāja: (indistinct) Mahārāja and (indistinct) Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. So, my father was Vaiṣṇava, but when I invited these Gauḍīya Maṭha sādhus, my father thought that I have invited some sādhus of the Ramakrishna Mission. So he was not very interested. When Tīrtha Mahārāja is speaking, I call my... My father was that time invalid, I called him that "Please come down, there is a meeting of the Gauḍīya Maṭha sādhus." So, he could not resist my request, he came down, but he did not think that some devotees have come. They thought, these Ramakrishna Mission rascals have come. (laughter) So he was not very happy, but I told, he was sitting. He, so the meeting he just criticized. Then when he heard the speech of our old Tīrtha Mahārāja, our old Godbrother, he understood, "Oh, they are Vaiṣṇavas." Then immediately after the meeting, he came down on his feet. "I misunderstood you sir, that you are the Ramakrishna Mission sādhu. I am so glad to meet you. So that is the beginning of my intimate relationship with Gauḍīya Maṭha. And they are coming, and whenever somebody would come, I would invite them to lecture in my house. In that way Śrīdhara Mahārāja, at that time Rāmendra Sundara Bhaṭṭācārya, he was also invited at my house, and before (indistinct)... No, I think I invited Bhāratī Mahārāja, and you were with Bhāratī Mahārāja.

Room Conversation -- March 17, 1973, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: Yes. So in this way my connection became developed with Gauḍīya Maṭha. Then, gradually the process began, hariṣye tad-dhanaṁ śanaiḥ. (chuckles) I wanted to become very big businessman and there was good opportunity. I was very nicely associated with the chemical industry of India. Dr. Bose's laboratory, Bengal Chemical, V.K. Farr (?), and all of them, they liked my business organization. Then I started big laboratory in Lucknow. So that was golden days, but gradually everything becomes (indistinct). And at last, my Allahabad business was lost. It was not lost on account of some, my debts, I had to hand it over to Dr. Kartik Chandra Bose because I was his agent. So I had some debts, so I tell the, "All right, you take this business." In this way, that Prayāg Pharmacy was lost. So I was not going to, I was sitting at home, but this Jājābara Mahārāja, at that time Sarvesva (?) brahmacārī and Atulananda brahmacārī, they used to come to take their subscription, and they were requesting that "Why don't you come to our maṭha? Why don't you come to our maṭha? You are now free." So, I used to visit their temple. That was not far away from my house...

Morning Walk At Cheviot Hills Golf Course -- May 15, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: He is suffering, but he's thinking I am enjoying. So any conditioned soul, he doesn't enjoy anything. He simply suffers. But he thinks that he is enjoying. Therefore the camel, camel example is given. Camel example. Camel, he is eating his own blood, eating thorns, and the thorns cutting the tongue, and from the tongue, blood is oozing out. So when the blood is mixed up with the thorny twigs, it becomes little tasteful, and he is thinking "Oh, it is very nice." Similarly, all these gṛhasthas, enjoying sex life, he is discharging his own blood, he's becoming weaker and weaker, he is thinking, "I am enjoying." He is thinking, "I am enjoying." And if he uses more, then he becomes diseased, tuberculosis. He is dying by that process, but he's thinking, "I am enjoying." Therefore it is example for the camel. He is enjoying his own blood by discharging. One drop of semen is made out of so many drops of blood. Do you know?

Svarūpa Dāmodara: Forty drops.

Prabhupāda: Just see. And how many, how much drops of semen he is discharging... That means he's spoiling his blood. But he is thinking, "I am enjoying." Would you like to, by giving your blood to enjoy? Would you like?

Umāpati: No, I don't think I'd like.

Prabhupāda: But you are doing that, every night. And that is called māyā.

Umāpati: I'm a brahmacārī, Prabhupāda.

Prabhupāda: No, you are...(laughter) I am giving an example. This is going on. He is going to die. He has adopted a process by which he will die, and he thinks that he is enjoying. This is called māyā. Māyā means things which is not, māyā. Mā means not, yā means this. "What you are thinking, it is not that." That is called māyā. So they are in māyā means, they are thinking, these rascals, they are thinking, improving, becoming happy, advancing this māyā word will finish everything, mā, yā: "Not this." Bhāgavata says that "You are thinking you are becoming victorious, but you are being defeated." Parābhavas tāvad abodha-jātaḥ. These rascal, abodha-jātaḥ, born fools and rascal, they are becoming defeated in every step. Parābhavas tāvad abodha-jāto yāvan na jijñāsata ātma-tattvam. So long he does not inquire about his self, "What I am," he is simply being defeated. That's all. This is the verdict.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: You are all very first-class brāhmaṇas. So this is the verdict. Ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ. According to the division of varṇa and āśrama. Four varṇas: brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra. And four āśramas: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsa. This is Vedic civilization, varṇāśrama. Varṇāśramācāravatāṁ puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān... (CC Madhya 8.58). When a human being comes to these institutional activities, varṇa and āśrama, at that time he is recognized as human being. Varṇāśramācāravatāṁ puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān viṣṇur ārādhyate... But that is the beginning of Viṣṇu worship. So Sūta Gosvāmī said, varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ. You may be a brāhmaṇa. You may be a kṣatriya. You may be a vaiśya. You may be a śūdra. You may be a brahmacārī. You may be a gṛhastha. You may be a vānaprastha or sannyāsa. It doesn't matter. These divisions will go on. Ataḥ pumbhir dvija-śreṣṭhā varṇāśrama... Varṇāśrama-vibhāgaśaḥ must be there, division. Vibhāgaśaḥ svanuṣṭhitasya dharmasya saṁsiddhir hari-toṣaṇam (SB 1.2.13).

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: My wife was taking tea. So I asked her not to take tea, not to take tea. But she didn't care husband. Then I gave her final, that "Either you have to give up your tea or your husband." (laughter) So she agreed to give up husband, not tea. (laughter) So I left my home. That's all. (laughter)

Guest (8): Due to tea!

Guest (9): There won't be any place for me to go now.

Prabhupāda: We have got such a big house. We welcome all. Yes, bad habit is... Habit is second nature sometimes, but one should be determined. Therefore we have got four āśramas: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. Whichever is suitable. Just like here. He's gṛhastha. His wife, children, all are devotees. So he doesn't require to become a sannyāsī.

Room Conversation with Educationists -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: No. We don't hate to work. That is not our business. If we get work, we work for Kṛṣṇa. The income comes to Kṛṣṇa. But if we don't get work, we are not bothered, that "There is no work. Where shall I eat? Where shall I sleep? Where shall I go?" No, there is no such botheration. So all the members, I think, eighty, ninety percent, they do not go to work outside.

Haṁsadūta: Ninety-nine.

Prabhupāda: Eh? (laughter) But they get their food and shelter and everything. Even they live with a wife, children. So we,... Kṛṣṇa gives. Not only that we are simply sannyāsī, brahmacārī. There are gṛhasthas, householders, husband, wife, children. They are also living. So that is not our problem. How to eat, how to sleep, that is not our problem. Our only problem is how to satisfy Kṛṣṇa. That is...

Guest (1): Yes. That was the question that was puzzling me. What is...?

Prabhupāda: That you have to learn. Not in a moment you can understand. Then you have to come to the schooling process. Otherwise how you can learn? In a moment? Such a big subject matter?

Room Conversation with Indian Guests and Devotees -- July 11, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: (Hindi for some time, a few English words) (break) (Hindi for some time) (break) When the destiny of the people are to be controlled, there must be very, very intelligent man. That is Vedic civilization. There is standard aims and objects on which the people should be trained up. That is varṇāśrama-dharma. Viṣṇur ārādhanam. Worshiping Viṣṇu. This is the ultimate aim. So the whole society is divided into brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, and brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa—departmental—and they are trained up. But the aim is viṣṇur ārādhanam. But they have no idea at the present moment. Viṣṇur ārādhanam, he has no knowledge. But the civilization begins on this point. Human being means he's meant for viṣṇur ārādhanam. Otherwise what is the difference between dogs and human beings? The western people, they do not know. They simply think that dog lies down on the floor, on the road... "We have got nice, best apartment. Therefore we are civilized." So that is their defect. They are trying to improve the condition of sleeping, eating. That's all. That is advancement of civilization. But that is not advancement of civilization. Advancement of civilization means to understand Viṣṇu, how to please Him, how to go back to Him, go to the spiritual world. This is advancement of civilization. Yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ mama (BG 15.6).

Room Conversation with Father Tanner and other guests -- July 11, 1973, London:

Father Tanner: But in the West, you know, your priest is generally made a priest in his early twenties. Then he has thrust upon him the role of the wise man, which he doesn't always seek.

Prabhupāda: Just like these boys, they are very young, twenties, between twenty to thirty. So they are made here brahmacārī, and some of them are sannyāsī, but they are strictly following these principles. Because they are young men, there cannot be any concession that he can become intoxicants, he can indulge in meat-eating. No.

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Buddhist Monk (1): Because greed causes the rat-race. Greed causes these wars. But if we reduce this, and the reduction parallelly followed by simple living, high thinking and high practice. There is no other remedy, whatever religion a man follows. If they get involved in this rat-race of materialism, war is inevitable, whether for a stretch of water or of land. But if man lives a simple life, this Mother Earth can be made to produce everything that is necessary. Soya beans are a very fine substitute for meat. And if they do not damage the crust of the earth, and if they scientifically control birth, scientifically, not by drugs and pills, which are dangerous...

Prabhupāda: What is that scientifically?

Buddhist Monk (1): It's a control of the sex, sex.

Prabhupāda: That is brahmacārī.

Buddhist Monk (1): Brahmacārī. (Background talking, people entering.)

Prabhupāda: Let them come. They want to see me. Let them come.

Buddhist Monk (1): And (Sanskrit or Pali:) tan moha veda krati dhanacari. (?)

Prabhupāda: Come. (People coming in.) This greediness... That is a good suggestion, that you reduce your greediness, but unless they get a substitute, they cannot. That is the difficulty.

Room Conversation with Two Buddhist Monks -- July 12, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: Those who are taking according to the instruction, they're becoming happy. Practical. Without any consideration of time, country, people. Anyone is accepting, and he's becoming happy. And they are not expected to undergo very severe type of austerities. Neither prāṇāyāma or yoga. They are unable. Simply I have advised them, "With these beads chant Hare Kṛṣṇa sixteen rounds." They are chanting. It is very easy. Hare Kṛṣṇa Hare Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa Hare Hare, Hare Rāma Hare Rāma Rāma... Sixteen rounds. It takes about two hours. And they're refraining from four kinds of sinful activities: illicit sex, gambling, intoxication, meat-eating. This much they are following austerities, chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra, taking prasādam. They are happy. Anyone can take. It is not difficult at all. Anyone. They are gṛhasthas. It is not that one has to become a sannyāsī. No. All my, these disciples... Here is a gṛhastha. Here is a sannyāsī. Here is a brahmacārī. So all together, they are serving the same purport. And we are getting good result. You have seen our Ratha-yātrā?

Room Conversation with Malcolm -- July 18, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: The great mahājanas, out of the twelve, Janaka-rāja is one.

svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ
kumāraḥ kapilo manuḥ
prahlādo janako bhīṣmo
balir vaiyāsakir vayam
(SB 6.3.20)

These twelve. Brahmā, Svayambhūḥ; Nārada Muni; Śambhuḥ, Lord Śiva; svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ kapilaḥ (SB 6.3.20), Kapiladeva; kumāra, catuḥsana-kumāra; manuḥ, Manu; then Janaka, Bhīṣma, Prahlāda, then Śukadeva Gosvāmī, Bali Mahārāja, and Yamarāja, vayam. So these are eight mahājanas. Out of them, Nārada is brahmacārī, Brahmā is gṛhastha,... Svayambhūr nāradaḥ... Śambhu is gṛhastha. Then Kapila, brahmacārī, Kumāra, brahmacārī. Then Manu, gṛhastha; Janaka-rāja, gṛhastha, Bhīṣma, brahmacārī, then Śukadeva Gosvāmī, brahmacārī; then Bali Mahārāja, gṛhastha; Yamarāja, gṛhastha. So there are gṛhastha, brahmacārī. It doesn't matter. Everyone can become mahājana by his example of service to Kṛṣṇa. It doesn't matter. Caitanya Mahāprabhu also never said that a, one has to become brahmacārī. No. He Himself was gṛhastha. So there is no difficulty. Svayambhūr nāradaḥ śambhuḥ kapilaḥ kumāro manuḥ... (SB 6.3.20). (pause) (prasādam comes in) You take.

Garden Conversation with Mahadeva's Mother and Jesuit Priest -- July 25, 1973, London:

Mother: A temple. And are these married and...?

Prabhupāda: Yes, there are married, there are sannyāsīs, there are brahmacārī, all kinds of people. It is not restricted. You see. So many children. They're having children. We are taking care of them. Everything.

Room Conversation with French Journalist and UNESCO Worker -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: Śrama eva hi kevalam. That is described in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam as simply wasting time. That's all.

dharmaḥ svanuṣṭhithaḥ puṁsāṁ
viṣvaksena-kathāsu yaḥ
notpādayed ratiṁ yadi
śrama eva hi kevalam
(SB 1.2.8)

Śrama eva hi kevalam. Everyone is acting. Dharmaḥ svanuṣṭhithaḥ. According to Vedic civilization, there are four divisions of men. brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, and further, spiritual divisions, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. So everyone has got some duty according to his position. So Bhāgavata says that even a person executes his duty very perfectly, but if he does not awaken his Kṛṣṇa consciousness, then all that he has done is simply a waste of time. So our point is that the UNESCO, United Nations, UNO, they're simply wasting their time. From practical point of view, they're unable to do anything. Because the original idea was to stop war. But the war is going on, fighting is going on. They could not stop it.

Room Conversation with Anna Conan Doyle, daughter-in-law of famous author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle -- August 10, 1973, Paris:

Prabhupāda: You may be in any material condition. Still you can develop your spiritual consciousness. That is there. But sometimes we accept a certain position for our personal convenience. That is another thing. But spiritual consciousness is not dependent on any material condition. It is spontaneous. Either he's a householder or a sannyāsī or brahmacārī or business man, or... It doesn't matter. He can become fully Kṛṣṇa conscious if he accepts the principles. (break) ...we have got our regulative principles, no illicit sex. So is it very difficult thing? A householder has got his wife. Why he should indulge in illicit sex? It is simply self-control. (aside:) You can keep it here. If somebody comes, you shall give him.

Morning Walk -- August 30, 1973, London:

Śyāmasundara: In the Jewish tradition, they yearn for a life of living on farms, villages, small communities with cows and agriculture.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Śyāmasundara: Is this also expressed in the Vedas.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes.

David Lawrence: You feel that strongly.

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. That is real life. Real life means you have to minimize your bodily activities so that you can save time and devote for spiritual understanding. That is real life. And the present civilization based on bodily concept of life is animal life. It is not civilized life. Civilized life means athāto brahma jijñāsā. When one is advanced so much so that he inquires about the spirit soul. But there is no such inquiry. Like the cats and dogs, they cannot inquire what is spirit soul. So Vedic life means to become free as much as possible from the bodily disturbances. Therefore, the first education is to become brahmacārī, celibacy. You see? Now, at the present moment, they are trying to make the abortion as law. But these rascals cannot check their sex life. You see? Their philosophy is that you shall go on with sex life unrestrictedly and when there is pregnancy, kill the child.

Room Conversation -- September 2, 1973, London:

Prabhupāda: First of all, you must become graduate, then you should take entrance in the law college, then you must learn. So what is God, that is the inquiry, but it requires training. And that is Vedic dharma, varṇāśrama-dharma. Varṇāśrama-dharma. Varṇāśramācaravatā puruṣeṇa paraḥ pumān (CC Madhya 8.58). Anyone who has taken to this system of varṇāśrama-dharma, four varṇas: brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra; and four āśrama: brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. Unless one takes to this institutional education, he's no more than an animal. So to know God means he must become a brāhmaṇa, real, qualified brāhmaṇa. Therefore brāhmaṇa is respected. Because, brahma-jānātīti brāhmaṇa. But there is no law. Lawless country. Therefore one is passing as a brāhmaṇa without any knowledge of Brahman. That is the defect. Formerly the government will see... I was explaining this, this morning. That it is the kṣatriya's duty to see that one is passing as a brāhmaṇa, whether he's qualified. Why he should pass?

Morning Walk -- December 2, 1973, Los Angeles:

Karandhara: One man, Dr. Wyberg from South Africa, he was the first successful heart transplant. So as soon as he got out of the hospital he started drinking and having sex life. (laughter) He was saying, "How wonderful science is. It can prolong my enjoyment." Then he died about a year later from too much...

Prabhupāda: That is material life. As soon as they get some opportunity, they will have sex. That is the only hope. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukham (SB 7.9.45). Here the only happiness is sex. Otherwise they are working so hard like asses. Why? Only for that sex. The only aim is "I will enjoy sex at night." That's all. That is the only aim. Yan maithunādi. It is stated in the Bhāgavata. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham. They are attracted with the most abominable thing, sex life. Yes. Tuccham. Tuccham means very abominable, very insignificant thing. The position of the sex, the... How nasty it is! Just like crows, they enjoy in a nasty place. That is stated in the Bhāgavata. Tad vāyasa-tīrtham. Vāyasa means crows. The crows, as they enjoy... (break) gṛham andha-kūpam, ātma-pātam. As soon as you fall down, you are killed. You are killed. This example is given. That is stated in Bhāgavata. When a woman comes to serve you, you must know it is covered well. As soon as you fall down, then you are finished. Hitvātma-pātaṁ gṛham andha-kūpaṁ vanaṁ gato yad dharim āśrayeta (SB 7.5.5). Therefore in the Vedic system first brahmacārī, become brahmacārī. Learn how to avoid sex, celibacy. That is first instruction. And if you are completely unable, all right, get yourself married. Otherwise there is no need of sex life. Why one should have sex life?

Morning Walk -- December 12, 1973, Los Angeles:

Prajāpati: The psychologists say it is unhealthy to go without sex life. The men these people trust, the psychologists, psychiatrists, say it is unhealthy.

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is also, we know. But there is a process. Just like brahmacārī process is there, sannyāsī process is there. So if you adopt the process, you can restrict. (break)

1974 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation -- February 6, 1974, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: So destiny is that we should devote our life for awakening Kṛṣṇa consciousness. This human life is meant for that purpose. By nature's way, prakṛteḥ kriyamāṇāni guṇaiḥ karmāṇi sarvaśaḥ (BG 3.27), nature is bringing us. As soon as we become sinful, we are dropped down to suffer the sequence of sinful life in different varieties. Again, just like a man, criminal, is put into the jail, but when his time is finished, again he is made free. Similarly, the cycle of birth and death, dehāntara-prāptiḥ, tathā dehāntara-prāptiḥ (BG 2.13), one after another, is going on. So the animal life means reaction of sinful life, and upper class of life, demigods, means result of pious life. Two kinds of things are there, sinful and pious, through the cycle of birth is going on. But this human form of life or above human form of life, it is a chance for understanding the real value of life, and therefore for human beings there are guidances, these Vedas, Purāṇas, Vedānta-sūtra. It is meant for the human beings, not for the cats and dogs. Anādi-bahirmukha jīva kṛṣṇa bhuli gela ataeva kṛṣṇa veda-purāṇa kaila (CC Madhya 20.117). So it is recommended in the human form of life, first of all training as a brahmacārī, then he may remain as gṛhastha for sometime. The life is divided into four parts, twenty-five years. Suppose I live a hundred years: twenty-five years to become brahmacārī, remain as brahmacārī, and twenty-five years to remain as gṛhastha, family man, and twenty-five years as vānaprastha and twenty-five years as sannyāsa. This is system, Vedic system. Sannyāsa means vānaprastha is the prepāration for sannyāsa, and sannyāsa means completely dedicated to the service of Kṛṣṇa. This is our system. Just like you are spirit soul. Our business is not here. Our business in the spiritual world.

Morning Walk -- February 17, 1974, Bombay:

Guest (3): But Swamiji, sexual intercourse after marriage is against law of Manu?

Prabhupāda: No, that is also... There is law. You cannot have sexual intercourse with wife as you like, no. That is also illicit sex. Then... When the woman is in menstrual period, after five days, you can have once. As soon as she is pregnant, no more sexual intercourse. This is human being. Not that like animal. Animals also, they have got restrictions. You see? The lions, they have sexual intercourse once in life. Once in life. Brahmacārī. You see? So as soon as you violate the laws, then you are animal. Because law is meant for man. Just like "Keep to the right" and "left" in the road. It is meant for human being, not for the dogs. Dog, if he keeps right or left, it is not under law. But if you keep your car instead of left to the right, then you are criminal. (pause) So which way we have to go?... Human life begins when he understands what is dharma. That is human life, beginning. Aushikha (?) (Hindi) Jaiye aur Hindu religion hai, Muslim religion hai, Christian religion hai, Buddhist religion hai, Jewish religion hai. The religion must be there. But when we give up this religious process, then there is no more human life; it is animal life. Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- March 2, 1974, Mayapura:

Bhavānanda: Śrīla Prabhupāda asked about this Maṭha.

Prabhupāda: Who, who is he?

Bhavānanda: He's a renegade brahmacārī from one of your godbrothers.

Prabhupāda: Prabhupāda dāsa. (break)

Gargamuni: He seems to be helped by Mādhava Mahārāja.

Prabhupāda: Oh.

Morning Walk -- March 6, 1974, Mayapura:

Viṣṇujana: First we were afraid. Haridāsa Brahmacārī told me: "Oh, these are Mohammedans. They'll not help us in any way, nor will they accept prasādam." But then I said let us go...

Prabhupāda: No, no. Everyone will help us. Maybe... In that way sometimes Hindus are also against. It is not the Mohammedans. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's time, even the Hindus were against His movement, the brāhmaṇas. They complained to the Kazi that "This is not Hindu movement." You see? The saṅkīrtana movement. Therefore Kazi had to take steps to stop the saṅkīrtana movement. So Kazi took step on the ground of complaint by the Hindus.

Morning Walk 'Varnasrama College' -- March 14, 1974, Vrndavana:

Viṣṇujana: My program now is I have ten brahmacārīs in buses, and everything and we're distributing books. But if the people are in chaos, how they will be able to accept the knowledge in the books?

Prabhupāda: No, not all of them are in chaos. There are some of them. Some of them. Not that all of them. Hare Kṛṣṇa (break) ...in separate department.

Room Conversation -- March 20, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: And I have no Indians to manage these big, big temples. Neither they are trained up. Trained up. I have trained up these American boys. They are doing nicely. But they cannot. They have taken a brahmacārī dress, and they will come with pant. And they will argue, "Why? What is the wrong there? Why should I give up pant? Why shall I have tilaka? Why shall I give up smoking?" Why, why... They will put so many "whys" that my life will be spoiled. Because they have advanced. So many rascals swamis have told them, "Yes..."

Morning Walk -- April 1, 1974, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: I think this has become very wild after the Second World War.

Prabhupāda: No, no. It is always there. It is always there. That is material world. Material world means that, sex life. That's all. And if you increase it, then you increase your material life more and more. Therefore the process is tapasā brahmacaryena (SB 6.1.13). The brahmācārya is so much stressed. Tapasā brahmacaryena. Samena damena vā, tyāgena śaucena yamena niyamena vā. This is the process of human life. Nāyaṁ deho deha-bhājāṁ nṛloke kāṣṭān kāmān arhate viḍ-bhujāṁ ye (SB 5.5.1). This human body is not meant for working hard like pigs for sense gratification. So they have been taught to become pigs. No discrimination of sex. The pig has no discrimination. So they have been taught. Not... When it is in śāstra, that means it is from the very beginning. A class of men are like pigs and hogs there are, always. So therefore Rsabhādeva is forbidding his sons that "This human form of life is not to waste like the pigs and hogs." Then what? Tapasā. Tapo divyaṁ putrakāḥ...

Morning Walk -- April 8, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: So? You are not interested in Kṛṣṇa philosophy?

Indian man (2): That's right. They are very interested.

Prabhupāda: The... Every young boy, or even young child... Kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha (SB 7.6.1). And that is the instruction of Prahlāda Mahārāja. He was a five years old child, and he was teaching his class friends Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So in that teaching he said... The other children, they said, "Why you are teaching this Kṛṣṇa consciousness? Let us play." So he answered, "No, no, my dear friends." Kaumāra ācaret prājño dharmān bhāgavatān iha. This science, Bhagavad-dharma, should be learned from the very beginning of life. That is Vedic culture. Brahmacārīs, they were living at the place of guru and learning this science. That is Vedic culture. (break) ...boys of Europe and America, they are accepting this Vedic culture. Why you are keeping aloof? What is the reason?

Morning Walk -- April 14, 1974, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: ...if I go to place, jataji bhikṣā dijiye, so everyone will be compassionate. And it is our duty, at least in Vedic civilization, that when a sannyāsī comes he is received. Aiye, mahārāja, betiye. Still. Still in the villages they do that. Just like it is mentioned in the śāstra that brahmacārīs and sannyāsīs should be taken as the sons of the society.

Morning Walk -- May 28, 1974, Rome:

Yogeśvara: But people are objecting that: If we cannot get divorced, then we are forced to live with each other even if we hate each other."

Prabhupāda: But hate each other, that's all right. We say what is the use of your sexual intercourse? That is animalism. You avoid it. Our Vedic civilization is to avoid it. Therefore they remain brahmacārī, naiṣṭhika-brahmacārī, no sexual intercourse in the whole life. That is perfection.

Yogeśvara: But that's not possible for the mass of people.

Prabhupāda: No, why not possible? We have got so many, just like Śukadeva Gosvāmī. He remained completely brahmacārī, although naked he is. He is. He doesn't require, and neither he is agitated. Just like when he was passing, the girls were taking bath. They did not take care. They knew that he is not at all affected by any woman. And when his father was going, they covered. So father inquired, Vyāsadeva, a personality like Vyāsadeva, said, "Why you covered? I am old man, and my young son he was passing naked." They said that "He is paramahaṁsa. He has no agitation of the mind. But you are gṛhastha. You live with woman. You have got distinction, man and woman." So this is civilization. What is the use of sex life? It is simply entanglement. Therefore, at the last stage, one is supposed to become sannyāsī. What is sannyāsī? Vānaprastha, sannyāsī, brahmacārī—no sex life. Out of the four different status of life, the brahmacārī has no sex life, the vānaprastha has no sex life, the sannyāsī has no sex life. Only the gṛhastha. That means it is prohibitory. It is allowed—it is simply concession to the person who cannot remain without sex life. It is simply a concession. Otherwise, according to Vedic civilization, there is no need of sex life. Because it is entanglement, simply entanglement. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tucchaṁ kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham (SB 7.9.45).

Morning Walk -- May 29, 1974, Rome:

Haihaya: Even one brahmacārī in Argentina. Because they didn't like us very much. They think that we are like the religion that we want to alienate the people.

Satsvarūpa: But we will take people's minds off the fact that they should be fighting for economic rights. We say, "That's not so important. You should become God conscious, Kṛṣṇa conscious." And then the people... Just like Marx said, "Religion is the opium of the people." They think we're just pacifying people, when actually everyone should becoming agitated for equal rights. So when they see us...

Prabhupāda: So where is equal rights? Even in Russia, there is managerial class and laborer class. Where are equal rights? Why there are managers? Yes. I have seen it. The managerial class and the laborer class. So where is equality? Why the managerial class? You know that? There must be required. The old women, they are sweeping the street. Why not Mr. Lenin come and sweep the street? Why he is sitting in a big palace and the poor woman has been engaged to sweep the street? Where is equality? What advancement they have made? We are following opiate. They are following opiate, Lenin's rascal's philosophy. That's all. That is also opiate. But where is equality? That is also opiate. You are advocating equality, but where there is a man manager and another man is working. So why you are accepting this nonsense philosophy being opiated by rascal Lenin?

Room Conversation with Monsieur Roost, Hatha-yogi -- May 31, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: I know several yogis, so-called yogis in New York. They are having sex life with the female disciples. I know. I do not wish to name them, but I know them personally. So many. They are taking fees and having sex with the disciple and are yogis. Just see. This is going on. Brahmacārī vrate?

Nitāi: Manaḥ saṁyamya mac-cittaḥ.

Prabhupāda: Ah, manaḥ saṁyamya mac-cittaḥ: "Always thinking of Me." Viṣṇu-mūrti or Kṛṣṇa-mūrti. Then?

Morning Walk -- June 8, 1974, Geneva:

Prabhupāda: The basic principle is to check population. Now, if they follow the Vedic principles, automatically the population is checked. Just like brahmacārī. So if the, both the boys and girls remain brahmacārī, then where is the unwanted population? Where is the question of this contraceptive method?

Nitāi: No need.

Prabhupāda: No need. Then when the brahmacārī is allowed to become gṛhastha, he can keep more than one wife if he's able to provide them nicely. Here they marry today and tomorrow divorce. The... No meaning of marriage. Simply prostitution. Because he does not need a wife. His sex life is satisfied in so many ways. So why he should be affected, attached to wife? And why the wife should be attached to the husband? Therefore divorce. It is stated in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, Dam-patye ratim eva hi. In the Kali-yuga, married life means sex life. For sex satisfaction, they'll marry. Otherwise, there is no need of marrying. That is... Svīkāra eva codvāhe. Marriage means that they, both of them agree that "We shall live together for some time." These things are happening, already foretold. By agreement, "Yes, we shall live together." That is marriage. "And then I may divorce." Actually, they do not know what is the meaning of marriage. All dependent on sex. Rati. Rati means... Dam-patye ratim eva hi. Vipratve sūtram eva hi: "To become brāhmaṇa means just have a thread only."

Room Conversation with Christian Priest -- June 9, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: We have started a gurukula in Dallas. Small children are being trained up. Just like formerly there was brahmacārī āśrama.

Room Conversation -- June 11, 1974, Paris:

Prabhupāda: We do not deny anything. We simply request, "Be civilized, Kṛṣṇa conscious." And this is practical; everyone is seeing this. We have got gṛhasthas, vānaprasthas, brahmacārī, sannyāsī. We have no such objection.

Room Conversation with Professor Oliver La Combe Director of the Sorbonne University -- June 14, 1974, Paris:

Devotee: They think that... They won't allow even a westerner to marry their daughter, because the westerners have a reputation of marrying for a week and then flying away. So they think like that of the people. Even our own men, sometimes the Indian girls wanted to marry the brahmacārīs, the American brahmacārīs, but the parents would not allow because they said, "After you are married a week, he will just run away back to his country and leave you here." So they are thinking like that about the westerners, that they, the life is so fast.

Puṣṭa-kṛṣṇa: Another brahmacārī saved.

Prabhupāda: One of our man has done so. You know that Rāmānuja? The Mexican boy?

Devotee: There's that boy in Bombay he married one Indian girl.

Prabhupāda: He is staying.

Devotee: Jagat-puruṣa.

Prabhupāda: He has not left as yet. But he can leave any moment. (laughs) No. He is not American. He is devotee. Therefore he is reliable. (pause)

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 14, 1974, Los Angeles:

Bali Mardana: (break) ...sanctify the whole world by your footsteps. You are criss-crossing the world.

Prabhupāda: That is stated in the śāstra. Tīrthī-kurvanti tīrthāni svāntaḥ-sthena gadābhṛtā. Because a pure devotee carries Kṛṣṇa within his heart, therefore wherever he goes he makes a holy place. It is said in the śāstra. So not me, but every one of you, if you are pure devotee of Kṛṣṇa, then wherever you'll go, that is a holy place. Tīrthī-kurvanti tīrthāni svāntaḥ... To become sannyāsī means that, that he'll be pure devotee, and wherever he will go, he will purify. That is sannyāsa means. Mahad-vicalaṁ nṛnāṁ gṛhināṁ dīna-cetasām. Mahātmās, they'll travel so that the householders, who are cripple-minded and full of sinful activities, they'll go there and make them purified. This is the idea of sannyāsa. And in the Vedic civilization a brahmacārī and a sannyāsī has open door. There is no restriction. No "Beware of dog." (laughter) But now they are prohibited. I have got practical experience. After my sannyāsa, when I was touring India, so in Ahmedabad, or Baroda, I was entering one man's house. So he was standing on the balcony. (laughter)

Morning Walk at Marina del Rey -- July 14, 1974, Los Angeles:

Satsvarūpa: Our men have to change their dress before they go out, brahmacārīs. That's the only way they can beg in this country.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

1975 Conversations and Morning Walks

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, other Guests and Disciples -- February 12, 1975, Mexico:

Guest (4): But is it possible to jump from brahmacārī to directly sannyāsa?

Prabhupāda: It is not jumping. It is regular process.

Guest (4): One should go through all the...

Prabhupāda: Yes. Just like student. Then he becomes a family man when he's grown up. Then he becomes again a sannyāsī. So it is a process. It is not jumping. One after another.

Guest (4): Yes, but would you allow one of the devotees to, if he wants to, observe celibacy and then...

Prabhupāda: Yes, that is brahmacārī.

Guest (4): And after that...

Prabhupāda: After that, he should continue the life of celibacy. But if he is unable, then he's allowed to marry.

Guest (4): Because (Sanskrit). You cannot suppress your karma.

Prabhupāda: There is no question of supressing. Regulating.

Guest (5): Do the same rules apply to women as to men?

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is stated in the Bhagavad-gītā, that in the society women, working class, and the mercantile class, they are, according to Vedic scripture, they are less intelligent, women, working class and mercantile men. Just like mercant..., they are after money, that's all. And śūdra, they want, after job. And women means they are after fulfilling their material desires. They have no other idea, that there is Brahmān, one should know Brahmān... They do not care to know. Therefore they are called śūdras, stri, śūdra, vaiśya. Yes. Vaiśya.

Room Conversation with Sanskrit Professor, other Guests and Disciples -- February 12, 1975, Mexico:

Guest (5): Can a woman become sannyāsī?

Prabhupāda: Why sannyāsī? Kṛṣṇa says, māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya (BG 9.32). He does not say to become sannyāsī. He said, "One who takes shelter of Me very firmly..." We have to take shelter of Kṛṣṇa. You become sannyāsī or not sannyāsī—it doesn't matter. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Kṛṣṇa says, mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja. He never says that "You become sannyāsī." He never said. The qualification is how to become firmly fixed up at the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa. That is qualification. But sannyāsī is a process. Brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha—that is a process. But one who takes directly shelter of Kṛṣṇa is above all these processes.

māṁ ca yo 'vyabhicāreṇa
bhakti-yogena sevate
sa guṇān samatītyaitān
brahma-bhūyāya kalpate
(BG 14.26)

Those who are pure devotees—avyabhicāreṇi, anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyaṁ jñāna-karmādy-anāvṛtam (Brs. 1.1.11)—such persons are above this material infection. So therefore he doesn't require to accept sannyāsa or brahmacārī. He doesn't... These are gradual processes, to come to the varṇāśrama system, then accept the varṇa and āśramas, brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha. This is called varṇāśrama system. But this is the beginning of human life. One who does not take to this system, he's animal because animal, there is no such system. And because in this age the varṇāśrama is not observed, therefore men are like animals. Dharmeṇa hīnā paṣubhiḥ samānāḥ. Dharma means this varṇāśrama-dharma. Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā sṛṣṭaṁ guṇa-karma-vibhāgaśaḥ (BG 4.13). So if the human society does not accept dharma, then he's as good as animal.

Room Conversation with three Trappist Monks, Psychologists from the University of Georgia, and Atlanta Lawyer, Michael Green -- March 1, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: This human form of body is obtained after many, many millions of years' struggle. So this is also temporary, as the cats' and dogs' body, they are also temporary. But although it is temporary, it is arthadam. You can achieve the real purpose of life. That is the privilege of this human form of... Therefore as soon as possible, the spiritual education should begin, immediately. If the child simply can understand, "God is great," that is immense profit for him. (break) ...means from five years to twenty-five years, brahmacārī, he has nothing to learn except God, brahmacārī. Brāhme carati iti brahmacārī. He is simply interested in Brahmān. That is called brahmacārī. He has no material interest. That is the foundation of spiritual life. Brahmacārī. And if he can, he remains brahmacārī throughout the whole life. But if he is unable, then he is allowed to marry, gṛhastha. So according to Vedic civilization, any education should begin at childhood. Therefore even one is king's son, he was sent to Gurukula to remain as brahmacārī to learn the basic principle of life. That is Vedic civilization.

Room Conversation -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Prabhupāda: Yes. This is the meaning that kāmasya, we have got some demands of the body. That does not mean it is meant for sense gratification. We require something, āhāra-nidrā-bhaya-maithunam, these four things are the demands of the body. We must eat something, we must sleep for some time, we must have sex life also, we must defend. That is all right but not for sense gratification. That a child is required, progeny is required, for that sex life is good, but they are using sex life for pleasure and killing the child. And implicated in sinful activities and therefore suffering. And scientists encouraging them, "Yes, you can kill child."Why should you create child and kill him? That nonsense, they cannot understand.

Guest (3): That's right.

Prabhupāda: This nonsense thing has created all problems. Therefore Vedic civilization is—first teaching is brahmacārī—how to learn to avoid sex life. If one can continue without sex life he is praised, naiṣṭhika-brahmacārī. If one cannot, all right you become a perfect gṛhastha. So many rules and regulations. Dharmāviruddhaḥ kāma, that is all right, but if you use sex life for sense gratification and becomes implicated in so many sinful activities, then how he'll be happy? A sinful man cannot become happy, that is not possible. All our sinful activities, the so-called scientists are helping, "Yes, you can do this." And the church is sanctioning. This is going on. The Christian religion says, "Thou shalt not kill," and they are now teaching, "yes, you can kill the child. You have killed cows and so many things, that is all right. Again you kill your child."

Room Conversation with Tripurari -- March 2, 1975, Atlanta:

Doug: He always talked in terms of higher states of consciousness, in terms of cosmic consciousness, which I understand to be Brahman realization. Then he talked in terms of, after about the sixth state of consciousness was then God consciousness. And then Paramātmā. Then he talked of the highest state of consciousness, and he said it's Bhagavān realization. But he completely steers away from putting any type of limitation on people's sense control at all, and this is what I have a hard time understanding. Even though the more I was with him he suggested to his close associates to follow the principles of brahmacārī, and he made me one of his brahmacārīs, and he told us to read the scriptures every day, and we had a lot of association...

Prabhupāda: What is his personal character?

Doug: Pardon me?

Prabhupāda: He is observing celibacy or...

Doug: As far as I'm concerned he's been celibate for an awful long time. And he had, his master... He comes from the Śaṅkarācārya tradition. His master was the last Śaṅkarācārya. And supposedly his master is a life-long celibate. So as far as I know, he always practiced that. Some other rumors have come up somewhere. I heard that the rumors originally originated with the Beatles when they were in India, that there was something going on like that. But as far as I know and anybody else who had been involved with him knew that he was very strict about that. And he encouraged the, me to meet...

Prabhupāda: Brahmacārī.

Doug: What was that?

Balavanta: Brahmacārī.

Doug: Brahmacārī.

Prabhupāda: Celibacy. Does he observe?

Doug: Yes, as far as I know.

Room Conversation with Indian Guests -- March 13, 1975, Tehran:

Devotee (1): Can you satisfy equally as brahmacārī or gṛhastha or sannyāsī? Can you satisfy equally in whatever path you have chosen?

Prabhupāda: Yes, yes. The satisfaction is the point. So just like the head of the family, he is asking his wife to do something, children to do something, servant to do something. So if they are doing according to the order, then it is very nice. The head of the family is satisfied, and everything is going nicely. Anywhere, in office also. There are different officers, secretaries, managers, and the director. He has given: "You do this. You do that. You do that. You do that." So if they do their duty, then everything is nice. Just like in your body. Here also we have got different parts. The hand does something, the leg something, the belly something, the brain something. What the brain does, the leg does not do. But the leg is doing for the satisfaction of the whole body. The brain is doing for the satisfaction of the whole body. Hand is doing for the satisfaction of the whole body. That is required, not that what is brain doing, the leg has to do the same. The leg may do his own way, but the aim is satisfaction of the order of the... I ask the leg, "Please take me from this room to that room." That is leg's duty. I am satisfied. So not that Kṛṣṇa is only one-sided. That they do not understand.

Room Conversation with Yoga Student -- March 14, 1975, Iran:

Young man: I am from Ānanda-mārga. My name is Ācārya Sveta Kirtu Brahmacārī.

Prabhupāda: Sveta-kirtu. Sveta.

Young man: And the guru's name is Śrī Śrī Rādhā-Govindaji.

Prabhupāda: Hmm. You have got a branch here?

Young man: I have been here for about three months. I am trying to lead the practices and the sādhana of the people here and trying to set up a unit here.

Prabhupāda: So you follow Vedic principle?

Young man: We follow Tantric principle.

Prabhupāda: Tantric. Tantra, there are two kinds of tantras, sattvata, and there are sattvic, rajasic, anything. So your activity is on the material platform or spiritual?

Interview with a German Girl and Assorted Devotees -- March 30, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: ...kṛpana bahu-duḥkha-bhājaḥ, yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi-sukhaṁ hi tuccham (SB 7.9.45). This gṛhastha life is a concession for sex life. Otherwise, there is no need of gṛhastha life. But everything can be used to make the best use of a bad bargain. That is another thing. Actually, to become free from all responsibility and anxieties, if one remains a brahmacārī, that is very good. That is the recommendation of śāstra. But if you cannot... Because the material world is going on under sex impulse, by nature the sex impulse is there. He will agitate you. But if you can control by becoming a rigid brahmacārī, that is better. But it is difficult. Therefore this concession is given. But what is this concession? The concession is sex life. That's all. Yan maithunādi-gṛhamedhi sukhaṁ hi tuccham kaṇḍūyanena karayor iva duḥkha-duḥkham. It is an itching sensation. And after satisfying the itching sensation, there are so many responsibilities and trouble. But tṛpyanti neha kṛpanāḥ. Those who are kṛpanāḥ, does not know how to utilize this life... So once I have taken to sex life and I am suffering so many after... Of course, now to stop the suffering, the have invented this contraceptive method. He knows there is suffering, but they, in order to avoid this suffering, they're taking this contraceptive method. And that is also suffering. That he does not know. Bhrun hatyā. Contraceptive method means killing the embryo. So that is also another sinful. He's taking so much responsibilities. So either you take contraceptive method or do not take contraceptive method... If you do not take, then the child is born. Then you have to take responsibility. Now they're killing the child, in this way becoming implicated. But if one is trained up to remain a rigid brahmacārī, there is no trouble.

Meeting with GBC -- March 31, 1975, Mayapur:

Prabhupāda: ...otherwise, we recommend everyone become sannyāsa. What is the use of not becoming? (all laugh) We are giving up this world. We are preparing ourself for entering into the family of Kṛṣṇa. So why should we be very much anxious to maintain this family. So actually... Caitanya Mahāprabhu therefore says; "I'm not a sannyāsī. I'm not a sannyāsī. I'm not a gṛhastha. I'm not a brahmacārī." These four, eight varṇāśrama-dharma is unnecessary for spiritually. Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu, when He was speaking with Rāmānanda Rāya... You'll find in the Teachings of Lord Caitanya... As soon as he suggested varṇāśrama-dharma, Rāmaṇanda Rāya, immediately Caitanya Mahāprabhu: "It is not very important. If you know better than this, you go on." He did not give any, much stress on this varṇāśrama-dharma. But for regulated life, that is required. And ultimately, it is not required. So it is not recommended for ordinary persons. But this is also unnecessary. Caitanya Mahāprabhu's teaching is so sublime, that such things, which is the beginning of human life, that is also unnecessary. Iha bahya age kaha ara. Bahya means "this is superflous. You speak something higher than this." That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu. So that is not very easy thing. First of all, we have to live very regulated life. Sannyāsa life is that regulated life. And then we can enter into the real life. That is ideal. So anything more?

Conversation with Governor -- April 20, 1975, Vrndavana:

Brahmānanda: "Regarding the elements in our tradition relating to dharma and saṁsṛti, we must adopt the whole varṇa and āśramas as they are recommended in all the śāstras. If you give up these directions of the śāstras, that is neither dharma nor saṁsṛti, at least in the Indian tradition, as it is directed in the Bhagavad-gītā that the four divisions of social and the four divisions of religious systems like brāhmaṇa, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha and sannyāsī must be adopted. Otherwise there is no tradition of bhāratīya sanskṛiti."

Prabhupāda: If you give up this varṇāśrama-dharma, then where is your bhāratīya sanskṛiti? But they are trying to give it up, abolish this. Then where is bhāratīya sanskṛiti? Then?

Brahmānanda: "Six: Injunctions of śāstras regarding charity and how it should be practiced in the present conditions. So the mutual relationship of dharma and politics in the light of our history and tradition can only be revived when we observe the system of varṇāśrama. It is actually like this: the brāhmaṇa is like the head, and the kṣatriya is like the arms, the vaiśya is the stomach or the abdomen, and the śūdra is like the legs. Similarly, spiritually, the brahmacārī is the trained-up disciple, the gṛhastha is the trained-up householder, the vānaprastha is experienced as a retired gentleman, and the sannyāsī is completely in the renounced order of life for spiritual advancement. There is no question of the head being in an exalted position without the cooperation of the leg. When there is a pin-prick in some part of the leg, the head immediately takes it very seriously and takes out the thorn in some part of the leg. Similarly, whenever there is some outside attack, the arms or the hands spread to protect the whole body. In the same way, within the abdomen there is the machinery of digesting foodstuffs, and after digestion the secretion turns into blood and it is infused throughout the whole anatomical structure of the body. Similarly, the cooperation between the head, arms, stomach and legs is the perfect situation of the human society."

Governor: Coordination.

Prabhupāda: Coordination. As head is also trying to maintain the body nicely, this arm is also. Now this has been nationally centralized. So that is the idea. Not that "Because I am head, brāhmaṇa, oh, here is a śūdra. Oh, don't see his face." Why? Śūdra is also required. Leg is also required. Head is also required.

Morning Walk -- May 11, 1975, Perth:

Paramahaṁsa: In the beginning stage of devotional service when we are trying to make advancement, we have to tolerate the urges of the senses. But is there a point...

Prabhupāda: That is tapasya.

Paramahaṁsa: Yes.

Prabhupāda: That is tapasya, that voluntarily we accept some inconvenience. That is called tapasya. Tapasā brahmacaryena (SB 6.1.13). The tapasa means first brahmacarya, how to avoid sex desire. That is the first tapasa. Tapasā brahmacaryena samena vā, yamena niyamena vā, damena tyāgena satya-śaucābhyām (SB 6.1.13). The steps are there. So tapasā, tapasā... Tapasya means first brahmacarya, how to restrain this sex desire. That is first step. Where is their tapasya? "It is very difficult to do this tapasya. Oh." Therefore Caitanya Mahāprabhu has given harer nāma (CC Adi 17.21). If you chant Hare Kṛṣṇa mantra regularly, you'll be cured. Otherwise, regular tapasya is almost impossible nowadays.

Morning Walk -- May 13, 1975, Perth:

Amogha: He says that in the Īśopaniṣad it says that you should learn the process of self-realization side by side with the process of nescience.

Prabhupāda: Nescience, yes. That is pravṛtti and nivṛtti. Pravṛtti means sense enjoyment. And nivṛtti means self-negation. So when we say that "You shall not have illicit sex," and their inclination is illicit sex, so therefore it is revolutionary. They are materialistic persons. They want sex enjoyment to the best capacity-homosex, this sex, that sex, naked dance, all sexually inclined, pravṛtti. And we say, "Stop this," nivṛtti. They do not like it because āsura. Pravṛtti jagat. They do not know this is essential. They do not know it. This is essential. Tapasā brahmacaryena (SB 6.1.13). Tapasya means brahmacarya. The so-called swamis, they are coming for this so-called yoga practice and..., but they are themself victim of sex. This is going on. Actually, it is a bluff—they have become swami and teaching some yoga system—because they do not know that one has to stop this first of all. Brahmacaryena. So this bluffing is going on all over the world, and we are speaking just against them. Murkhayopadeśo hi prakopāya na śāntaye. If you give instruction to the rascals, he will simply be angry. He will not take advantage of it. This is our position. All the so-called professors, philosophers, they are all in the pravṛtti-mārga.

Room Conversation with Alcohol and Drug Hospital People -- May 16, 1975, Perth:

Guest (1): Do they have to wear those clothes and shave their heads and chanting those things...

Prabhupāda: That is optional. That is also optional. That is not compulsory. But in India because the brahmacārīs, sannyāsīs, they dress in a particular way, they do that. But that is not compulsory. But it has got a psychological effect, because whenever we go, people chant "Hare Kṛṣṇa!" So by this dress, we give chance, the other men, to chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Morning Walk -- May 20, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: And we should do our duty as prescribed by the spiritual master. Guru-kṛṣṇa-kṛpāya (CC Madhya 19.151). Then both sides, you will be favored, from the spiritual master and from Kṛṣṇa. And that is the success. My Guru Mahārāja was publishing one paper, Dayinika (?) Nadiya Prakash. It was worth two paisa or one paisa. So if a brahmacārī could sell a few copies, he would have been so glad. You see? The collection was not even four annas. Still, he was so glad that "Oh, you have distributed so much." Our business is to carry out the order, not to see success. Success is not so easy. That is not so easy.

Room Conversation with Two Lawyers and Guest -- May 22, 1975, Melbourne:

Prabhupāda: Tapaḥ. Tapaḥ, tapasya, austerity. Austerity. Then you have to consult what is the austerity? The austerity is, beginning of austerity is the sex control. That is austerity, brahmacarya. Tapasā brahmacaryeṇa (SB 6.1.13). And that brahmacarya you can observe by following certain rules and regulations, Just like these people are following. In this way everything is there, clear. There is no interpretation. You cannot interpret the word water. Everyone knows what is water means. Where is the question of interpreting? Therefore sometimes reference to the teacher is necessary. Otherwise every word is clear. There is no question of interpretation. Now they are irrelevantly interpreting the first verse of Bhagavad-gītā. Dharma-kṣetre kuru-kṣetre (BG 1.1). So they are interpreting Kurukṣetra means this body. And where is the chance of such interpretation? Kurukṣetra, the land, is still there. Just before coming here I went to Kurukṣetra. So why you should interpret, "Kurukṣetra means this body"?

Garden Conversation with Dr. Gerson and devotees -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: The Vedic civilization, therefore, teaches the student, brahmacārī, how to remain without sex life. Those who are unable to continue that, they are allowed, "All right, be married life." And that is also for twenty-five years. A student remains brahmacārī up to twenty-five years, and if we wants to take this sex license-household life means sex life—so he can get the license for twenty-five years more. So at the age of fifty years, fiftieth year, he gives up voluntarily. He keeps his wife with him just to assist him to advance in spiritual life, and they go from one holy place to another. And then when they are practiced, then the woman is sent to his elderly sons to take care and the man takes sannyāsa. This is Vedic civilization, varṇāśrama, four varṇas and four āśramas: the brāhmaṇas, kṣatriya, vaiśya, śūdra...

Morning Walk -- June 22, 1975, Los Angeles:

Dharmādhyakṣa: Soon they'll get so disgusted with this association, they'll all want to become brahmacārīs.

Revatīnandana: When we noticed that this amusement pier was torn down, I didn't think that it meant that they were less interested in amusement, but they have become more degraded in their approach. The amusement pier... They come here instead to be naked on the beach for their amusement. Or they stay home and use intoxicants mostly. That is increasing. (break) ...like a prostitute house. And almost every place they are, not even one part of the city anymore, but you see them everywhere.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1975, Los Angeles:

Devotee (1): But at the same time, when we were maintaining that, we had the same problems, is that, when we presented sociological applications of the philosophy, for instance, to arrange marriages in a reasonable way, that the women not be sent out on saṅkīrtana to prostitute themselves to sell books, but be trained up to be wives, or that the brahmacārīs in the temple, someone would sit and talk with them and see how many of them want to be married and try and arrange some type of training for them, knowing that most of them are going to become married, rather than just have no training and one day find oneself married, out on the street with no occupation or training.

Prabhupāda: First of all, you are not trained up. You are sometimes becoming astrologer, sometimes this, sometimes that.

Room Conversation -- June 26, 1975, Los Angeles:

Prabhupāda: Now I say, I'll repeat that anyone who is keeping long hairs, he is no more my disciple.

Devotee (2): All right.

Prabhupāda: This is the first condition.

Devotee (1): Does that apply also for householder dharma, or is that simply for brahmacārī dharma? Even you... I have pictures of you on the Bhāgavatam when you did not have shaved head, with a mustache when you were doing your business as a householder. So does that apply to householders, or only to brahmacārīs, that a householder must also keep a shaved head or is that...?

Prabhupāda: At that time I was not initiated. You were seeing my picture, mustaches, at that time I was not initiated. Since I became initiated, I have shaven.

Morning Walk -- July 1, 1975, Denver:

Prabhupāda: Oh. (break) ...Dakṣa accused Nārada that "My sons were not out of the three kinds of debts." One debt is debtor to the saintly sages. Just like we are reading Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, we are indebted to Vyāsadeva. He has given such literature, and we are taking advantage of it. As such, especially the brāhmaṇas, they have got indebtedness to big sages and saintly person. They receive knowledge from them. And they are indebtor to the demigods. Therefore they have to perform yajñas. And they are indebtor to their father because the father has brought them to this world. So in this way, especially a brāhmaṇa is indebted to demigods, the past sages, and the father. So the indebtedness to the sages is performed by becoming brahmacārī, and to the demigods by offering sacrifices, and to the father by begetting children, to continue the progeny. So Nārada Muni was accused that "You keep them indebted to these principles, so how they can be liberated? Simply by dressing like you, (laughs) a mendicant?" Accusing. But perhaps he did not know. There is another version in the Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam,

devarṣi-bhūtāpta-nṛṇāṁ pitṛṇāṁ
nāyam ṛṇī na ca kiṅkaro rājan
sarvātmanā yaḥ śaraṇaṁ saraṇyaṁ
gato mukunda parihṛtya...
(SB 11.5.41)
Morning Walk -- July 1, 1975, Denver:

Prabhupāda: Preaching is for the sannyāsīs, for the brahmacārī. And householder, because they are brāhmaṇas, they can be engaged in Deity worship and also earning money.

Room Conversation with the Mayor of Evanston -- July 4, 1975, Chicago:

Jagadīśa: He says young people today have no sense of discipline. They don't know what it means to be...

Prabhupāda: How they can be? They are not trained up. They are not trained up from the very beginning. For being trained up, there is another four divisions, brahmacārī, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. These are the training divisions. So for the first-class, second-class, third-class, all the students, they are trained up as brahmacārī, student life. Brahmacārī means celibacy, live under the direction of the teacher and accept all kinds of hardship under the teacher's or spiritual master direction. Children, they can easily take it. If a child, a small child, I ask him, "My dear child, you take my shoes and keep it there," he will immediately agree. He has no sense, "Oh, he is asking me to take his shoes." He will immediately agree. Even he is very rich man's son. So this life is advised that a student live just like a menial servant of the teacher or the spiritual master. And they agree. We have got good instances. And he is coming from the first-class family, brāhmaṇa family or kṣatriya family or vaiśya family, first, second, third. So even śūdra family, he can learn also. So brahmacārī. Then he is, if he can remain without wife or without opposite sex, then he continues to remain as brahmacārī. He is encouraged. This process encourages to remain brahmacārī, that "Don't take to sex life, it is entailed with so many difficulties. Practice to remain a brahmacārī. You'll save so much trouble." But if he is unable—the teacher sees-Then he is allowed to marry, marriage. If he is trained up brahmacārī, when he marries, he lives with wife under rules and regulation, not like cats and dogs.

Morning Walk -- July 5, 1975, Chicago:

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: No preaching work? Should they go out for preaching?

Prabhupāda: No, those who are preaching, not for them. Those who are sitting idle, or they... (laughter) (break) ...has no other regulation, simply preaching. A preacher is so exalted. He hasn't got to follow any regulation. But don't take it. (laughter) And actually if one is busy in preaching work, that is first-class. (break) ...not my manufactured word, my Guru Mahārāja, that the... That Mādhava Mahārāja, when he was a brahmacārī, his name was Hayagrīva. So he was to go somewhere. So but he was sick. Guru Mahārāja was informed that he was sick and "Today is ekādaśī. He cannot take his regular meals." So Guru Mahārāja said, "No. Let him take immediately meals and go."

Morning Walk -- July 11, 1975, Chicago:

Devotee: ...Prabhupāda? He had some question whether Lord Nityānanda ever took sannyāsa.

Prabhupāda: No. (break) ...went with the sannyāsīs as brahmacārī. (break) ...philosophy?

Room Conversation -- July 31, 1975, New Orleans:

Nityānanda: So mostly gṛhasthas should stay on the farms, or brahmacārīs also?

Prabhupāda: No, brahmacārīs and sannyāsīs especially they should preach. And gṛhasthas may produce necessities. They also preach, preaching everyone. Especially for brahmacārī and sannyāsī. (end)

Morning Walk -- September 6, 1975, Vrndavana:

Prabhupāda: Brahmācarya. Brahmācarya means completely cessation from sex life. This is brahmācarya. Tapasya begins, austerity. This is the greatest austerity, to cease sex. Tapasa brahmācarya. Our Vedic civilization, the boys are trained how to become brahmacārī from the very beginning of life.

Morning Walk -- September 13, 1975, Vrndavana:

Gopāla Kṛṣṇa: They don't believe in the law of karma.

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are rascals. Rascal. This is a rascal civilization. Rascal civilization: one side, they say contraceptive; another side, they will encourage woman to marry three times a week. This is their civilization. If you want stop population why you are inducing "Indulge in sex life"? Stop sex life—brahmacārī. Everything is contradictory. And it is all sense gratification, based on sense gratification.

Morning Walk -- September 13, 1975, Vrndavana:

Dhṛṣṭaketu: But if Kṛṣṇa is the Supreme and I should surrender unto Him, then why is it so hard to find out this knowledge? Why is it that only in the human form of life... Why is it so difficult to come to this knowledge if...

Prabhupāda: Because you are rascal. For rascal everything is difficult. Easy thing is made difficult by rascals. That is the proof that you are rascal. By nature one is supposed to surrender to the parents. This is easy. Why do you do not do this? This is natural. Just like you have surrendered to me. Why? Because you think I am superior, you have to take knowledge from me. So if you have to accept some superior for your guidance, how you can deny surrendering? You see, brahmacārī, he is being taught daṇḍavat śīraṣi, by touching the head. Yesterday we were talking of that brahmacārī? That is the instruction.

Morning Walk -- October 16, 1975, Johannesburg:

Puṣṭa Kṛṣṇa: One of our life members in Newcastle, a town between Durban and Johannesburg... The city council, they've decided they want to build a road right where his house is. He just built new house. Now they're going to tear it down, so then he has to build another house.

Prabhupāda: Just see. To punish him? (pause) Just see, so much loads of books. He's feeling unhappy, and what he is learning? To become hippie. That's all.

Harikeśa: He's learning to reject it.

Prabhupāda: From the childhood he's supplied so many books, and when he is young man, he is hippie. That's all. Instead of becoming brahmacārī, devotee, he is drunkard, he's drug addicted. That's all. (end)

Morning Walk -- October 18, 1975, Johannesburg:

Prabhupāda: Garbhādāna-saṁskāra. There should be a function, all the brāhmaṇas and relatives should come, and there will be ceremony, and everyone will know that "This man is going to now sex, have sex for begetting children." This is ceremony, not secretly like cats and dogs. Cats and dogs also, they do not do secretly. A human being do it secretly and do not want the botheration. Therefore their scientific advancement means how to kill the child, how to make abortion, how to take contraceptive pills, how to distribute them, how allow the children, "Yes, you go on, but take these pills so that you may not be bothered." Yes. Why not stop it, botheration? That you cannot, because animals. Because animal civilization, they cannot do it. Kaṇḍutive manivasi viṣaheta dhīraḥ. Why don't you teach them to become dhīraḥ, sober—"Let me tolerate this itching sensation"—brahmacārī? That teaching is not good. You do it repeatedly, suffer, and suffer consequences. And to stop it they suffer in so many ways, suffering, suffering. Bahu-duḥkha bhajaḥ (SB 7.9.45). Sex life, illicit or legal, the after-effect is suffering. Even it is not illicit—it is legal—then to take care of the wife or the children, for their education, for their upliftment and so on, so on, so on—suffering. And if it is illicit, then these sufferings: you commit sinful activities, kill the child, contraceptive, with the abortion, go to the doctor, pay, and so on, so on. So where is no suffering? Either legal or illicit, you have to suffer.

Morning Walk -- October 25, 1975, Mauritius:

Prabhupāda: Any woman should be looked upon as mother. This is culture. Except his married wife, all women should be treated as mother. The brahmacārīs were taught like that, "Mother." This is culture. Simply they are trying to elope other's wife, other's woman, exploit them. And they're cultured. There is no culture at the present moment. Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat: "And others' money should be treated just like pebbles in the street." Nobody cares for it. So they are simply making plans how to grab others' money. And Ātmavat sarva bhūteṣu: "And if you feel pains and pleasure, you should consider for others also." If your throat is cut, then do you feel very happy? Why you are cutting the throats of the poor animals? Where is culture? There is no culture. Simply rogues and thieves and rascals and fools. Where is culture? They do not know what is the meaning of culture. Here is culture, three words:

mātṛvat para-dāreṣu
para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat
ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu
yaḥ paśyati sa paṇḍitaḥ

He is cultured.

Morning Walk -- November 2, 1975, Nairobi:

Prabhupāda: (break) ...given by God. Mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanam. You have no intelligence even, so that is given by God. (Hindi) Let them become devotees. Why these old men, they are not coming? They are still after money? Amara ajñaya guru hana tara ei deśa (CC Madhya 7.128), Caitanya Mahāprabhu says. So you have come to this country. Do something good for these Africans. Let them become devotee. Where is that attempt? The white men, they also came to exploit them, and you have also come to exploit them. But Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, "No-para upakara." Upakara kara. That is Caitanya Mahāprabhu's... They are not so advanced; make them advanced. That is real cooperation. (Hindi) (break) Just like every one of them is attached to remain in Africa, continuing to... But they are being forcefully driven away: "Go away." Attachment must be there. The Englishmen, they have got attachment, but they were forcefully driven away. Similarly, this conditioned soul, he has got attachment. And śāstra and śāstra... These people were driven away by śāstra,, by weapon, knife. That is śāstra. And śāstra is the same thing, but it is books. Therefore it is called śāstra. The original word is coming from śās. Sas means ruling, śās-dhātu. Śāstra, śāstra, śāsana, śisya. Śisya. Śisya means voluntarily accepting ruling. That is called śisya. The word is the same, śās. From śās, śisya. From śās, śāstra. From śās, śāstra. From śās, śāsana. These are. So sometimes by force, sometimes by voluntarily... So just like guru-śisya. The guru, he gives enlightenment, and śisya voluntarily accepts. That is guru-śisya. Similarly śāstra means weapon: "If you don't follow, then I shall cut your throat." Similarly śāstra. So śāstra says that "Now you must leave your family life." That is called vānaprastha. So that is not being carried out, although the śāstra injunction is there. Brahmacari, gṛhastha, vānaprastha, sannyāsa. So brahmacārī is the beginning of life, how to become controlled life. Then he is allowed the concession for sense gratification. This is gṛhastha. Then śāstra says, "Now you have done up to fifty years. Now get out." But nobody is following. They are not prepared to get out unless death forces to get out. That Kṛṣṇa does. Mṛtyuḥ sarva-haraś cāham (BG 10.34).

Morning Walk -- November 3, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: I have got little point on this, that after all, the spirituality within you, namely ātmā, cannot remain independently without this body, so you have got to look after the body.

Prabhupāda: No, no, no. That is not the fact. If you are actually spiritually advanced, you don't care for it. Deha smṛti nāhi yār saṁsāra bandhana kāhān tānra. It is just like Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī. He had no spiritual... er, material con... He was eating every alternate day a little quantity of butter. That's all. How he was living in Vṛndāvana? So when one is perfectly on the spiritual platform, there is no bodily necessities. That is the sign. Therefore our civilization is to decrease the bodily necessities, not to increase. Control. Control, from the brahmacārī, control, control, control. Ultimately completely control. That is perfectional stage. Tyāgena. What is that verse?

Dr. Patel: Iśāvāsyam idaṁ sarvaṁ yat kincid jagatyam... (ISO 1).

Prabhupāda: No, tapasā brahmacāryena tyāgena yamena vā (SB 6.1.13). This is wanted. Tapasa. Beginning. Tapasya means that controlling the senses. That is tapasya. And the tapasya begins...

Dr. Patel: (Sanskrit) ...brahma.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Tapasya means... Beginning is brahmācārya. Tapasā brahmacāryena (SB 6.1.13). So where is brahmācārya?

Dr. Patel: Brahman prati ācarati āśā brahmacārī.(?) All the senses. Not only the upasthas, but all the ten senses, including your mind and the discriminating buddhi, all are directed toward serving feet of God, and then he does not... That is real brahmacārī.

Prabhupāda: That, yes. Devotee means brahmacārī. Pure devotee means brahmacārī. Anyabhilasita-sunyam (Brs. 1.1.11). He has no other desire. That is brahmacārī. (break) This building is meant for playing cards. Somebody knows?

Girirāja: Club. I don't think this one is. No, behind it.

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: Our culture was so built as to do work for Kṛṣṇa throughout the life from brahmācārya, gṛhastha āśrama, vānaprastha...

Prabhupāda: But where is the question. Unless...

Dr. Patel: But how they have forgotten this is the greatest, I mean, mystery to me. Because the sādhus voluntarily, I mean, embrace poverty?

Prabhupāda: No, no.

Dr. Patel: All those, sir...

Prabhupāda: This service to Kṛṣṇa has disappeared on account of this māyāvāda philosophy.

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: The first cultural education is how to teach the small children to become purified, brahmacārī.

Dr. Patel: In ancient times it was done by association in gurukula.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is required, gurukula. We are starting, therefore, gurukulas. And it is becoming...

Dr. Patel: Gurukula. Kula of guru.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Brahmacari gurukule vasan danto guror hitam. This is the beginning. A brahmacārī should live in the aśrama of guru, danta, self-controlled, and only for the benefit of guru, not for anyone's benefit. Brahmacārī guru... They'll go, collect alms, and everything should be delivered to guru.

Dr. Patel: When Kṛṣṇa was sent to collect the wood.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Guror hitam. The brahmacārī life means only for the benefit of guru. Everything is there in Bhāgavatam.

Morning Walk -- November 17, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa. Jaya. This is education. There is no question of ABCD. First of all brahmacārī gurukule vasan dantaḥ. He is to be trained how to become sober and gentle.

Dr. Patel: Self-controlled.

Prabhupāda: That is required. That is education. This is not education. They are killing the teachers. They are killing teachers. You do not know?

Room Conversation -- November 25, 1975, Delhi:

Prabhupāda: So in every center they must rise early in the morning. They must follow the regulative principles. They must attend class. Otherwise let them go out. We don't want. And if anyone wants to marry, first of all he must show that he has some earning capacity. Not that "Because there are so many girls, and I marry one to satisfy my senses..." I thought that boy was nice, and I heard all these stories. That is also another defect, that we have got young boys and young girls open for lovemaking. And brahmacārī means strictly prohibited to see the face of woman. But we cannot stop it. That is also another defect. Fire is good and butter is good, but when they come together everything become bad. Is it not? Fire is good, just like heat. And butter is good, healthy. But when they come together the butter melts and the fire extinguished. This is māyā's arrangement. Puṁsa striyā mithunī-bhāvam etam. This whole world is going on by the sex attraction, and when they come together both of them become spoiled. Therefore it has to be dealt with very, very carefully, so many rules, regulation. (break)

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: ...it is the sādhana, completely sādhana (Hindi), then he is, everything is... Sama sarveṣu bhūteṣu.

Prabhupāda: For kaniṣṭha-adhikārī.

Dr. Patel: Sarve sameṣu bhūteṣu. We are not sarve sama as yet.

Prabhupāda: So it depends on the condition.

Dr. Patel: It is said that they are not only look at the female dolls, or even...

Prabhupāda: But that is moral instruction. That is moral instruction. Even if you are not a devotee, you should not think of these things. That is the moral instruction. The brahmacārī, if he thinks of woman, that is also retricted.

Dr. Patel: But in eight ways he must observe brahmācārya. Eight ways. All the five senses and the three..., mind (Sanskrit).

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: I myself, sir, we are all (indistinct) not like you, we are worthless, we people. Unless you understand your worth... We are really worthless.

Prabhupāda: That is very good. /Tṛṇad api sunīcena/ taror api sahiṣṇunā/ amānin mānadena/ kīrtanīya sad hariḥ. That is the qualification for chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa. Humbler than the grass, tolerant than the tree, giving all respect to others, expecting no respect for oneself. These are the qualifications to become perfectly Kṛṣṇa conscious. Amānitvam adambhitvam ahiṁs kṣāntir ārjavam. Amanitva. Although he is very qualified, he says "No, no, no. I have no qualification." Amanitvam. This is amānitvam. (aside to passerby:) Hare Kṛṣṇa, Jaya. This is the beginning of knowledge. Amānitvam adambhitvam ahims kṣāntir ārjavam. The materialistic, everyone, they're not amānitvam, our, "I'm so respectful."

Dr. Patel: Not "I have done this."

Prabhupāda: No, no. I don't say. This is the philosophy. Amānitvam adambhitvam. Where is that thing? That is taught from the brahmacārī. Brahmacārī, a small boy, he is taught that you become amānitvam adambhitvam, and he accepts it. Because he is small, the brahmacārī, he may becoming from a king's family, but if he's ordered, "My dear boy, take my shoes and brush it," he'll do it, because he's innocent boy. He learns. Therefore brahmacār gurukule vasan dānta. The mode of life should be trained from the brahmacārī.

Morning Walk -- December 17, 1975, Bombay:

Prabhupāda: No. That is also imperfect. Anyway, it is something. Amānitvam adambhitvam: they from the very beginning of their life, they address other's wife as "mother," you see? Matrvat paridaresu. This is culture, to see every woman except his own wife as mother. Where is that culture?

Man: Mahātm Gandhi also changed his life after brahmacārī...

Prabhupāda: Hm?

Man: Mahātm Gandhi?

Prabhupāda: We are talking of real mahātmās, not politicians.

Man: No, no. He was changing after brahmacārī, his life.

Prabhupāda: I do not know, but...

Dr. Patel: He took a big vow. He took a big vow at the age of forty-three years. That mahan, mah-vrata, what they call it? For not indulging in sex.

Prabhupāda: That is one of the qualification...

Dr. Patel: That is one of them. But by controlling their sex, people derive much (indistinct).

Prabhupāda: That is a fact.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: And then they are prepared right from the brahmacārī āśrama for the highest goal, till they become a sannyāsī. Here he, he's neither this nor there.

Prabhupāda: No, there is no education. Real education is not there. Just like Cānakya Paṇḍita, he was not a spiritual man, but he was a prime minister. Still, he gave the standard of becoming educated. He said,

mātṛvat para-dāreṣu
para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat
ātmavat sarva-bhūteṣu
yaḥ paśyati sa paṇḍitaḥ

Here is paṇḍita. What is he? Mātṛvat para-dāreṣu: he sees every woman as mother, except his own wife. And para-dravyeṣu loṣṭravat: and other's property, possessions, just like garbage. And atmavat-sarva bhūteṣu: and feeling for everyone as he himself is feeling the pains and pleasures. If one has attained this stage, then he is considered educated. He never says these degrees. No.

Morning Walk -- December 18, 1975, Bombay:

Dr. Patel: They are not soul conscious because they...

Prabhupāda: Therefore they are na te vidhuḥ. They are working hard that "This is my interest." But actually that is not his interest.... (aside:) Hare Kṛṣṇa!

Dr. Patel: The interest of the body.

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is not in his interest because it is changing. Suppose a person comes to a foreign place, and he becomes only interested in where he is staying, and after a week he is driven away. Then what is interest? You are eternal; you must have eternal interest.

Dr. Patel: That education comes from the Vedas.

Prabhupāda: Therefore we say that there is no education. They do not know what is interest. They are making a small limitation, that "This is my country. My interest is to become a national. I will sacrifice my life for this, that, this..." Whole world is going on like this. Na te vidhuḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇum.

Dr. Patel: And, mām eva ye prapadyante māyām etāṁ taranti te. (indistinct)

Prabhupāda: Yes. That is brahmacārī. Where is that education?

Dr. Patel: This education are given to the Vaiṣṇavas in their homes. They are Vaiṣṇavas. But then so-called Vaiṣṇavas, many of them they are ruthless. Ruthless, absolutely ruthless...

Prabhupāda: (indistinct), kṣatriyas, there is no (indistinct) kṣatriya...

Dr. Patel: No, what I mean to say...

Prabhupāda: ...everyone is śūdra.

Morning Walk -- December 24, 1975, Bombay:

Lokanātha: For detachment you suggest they remain separate.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Unless they are separated, it is very difficult to advance in spiritual consciousness. That is the whole Vedic system. Gradual. First of all, brahmacārī, he is educated very nicely that this is not good to marry and enter into a family life. And in spite of education, if he is still inclined, then he is allowed to marry. This is a concession. And that is for a few days, few years. Then compulsory separation from the family life. Vanaprāstha. At that time, wife is allowed to stay with the husband, but finally they are separated, sannyāsa. Wife should go home, remain with their children. That's all.

Page Title:Brahmacari (Conversations 1968 - 1975)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, MadhuGopaldas
Created:21 of Feb, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=124, Let=0
No. of Quotes:124