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Argument (Letters)

Expressions researched:
"Argumentum baculam" |"Argumentum baculum" |"Argumentum vaculam" |"Argumentum vaculum" |"argument" |"argument's" |"argumentative" |"argumentativeness" |"arguments" |"argumentum ad baculum"

Correspondence

1947 to 1965 Correspondence

Letter to Raja Mohendra Pratap -- Cawnpore 13 July, 1947:

If different men put different dogmatic views about religion and its essentials who is to be accepted and who is not be? Therefore the approach shall be and must be authoritative, scientific and universal. Your delineations do not conform to all these necessary things. That is my main contention. If you have time to discuss on it, I shall be glad to substantiate my contentions as far as possible. My basis of arguments will be Bhagavad-gita which is the most authoritative, scientific and universal. To summarise the conclusions of Bhagavad-gita it may be said that,

1) God is one and everything is in Him and He is in everything.

2) To render transcendental service unto God is to serve everything that be, just like to water the root of the tree is to water the different branches and numerous leaves of the tree or to supply food to the stomach is to vitalize all the senses and the sense organs of the body.

3) The parts are automatically served when the Whole is served but when the parts are served the whole may not be served or not served at all.

4) The parts and the Whole being eternally related, it is the eternal duty of the parts to render service unto the Whole.

5) A recipient of the services of the parts, God's sat-cit-ananda vigraha i.e. the all-attractive Cognizant and all-blissful Personality eternal. He can reveal Himself by His own potency without any help of the external potency called maya in order to be cognizable by the limited potency of the parts and as such He is not only the greatest of all but he is the smallest of all. That is His prerogative.

6) He is better realized when He by His causeless mercy agrees to descend in this mortal world but he He is never realized by the partial speculations of the empiric philosophers however systematic and long-termed it may be.

7) Sri Krishna is the Personality of Godhead and is the Summum Bonum Cause of all Causes proved by fact and figures in the statement of Bhagavad-gita, but He reserves the right of not being exposed to the sensual speculations of the empiric philosophers.

8) One should therefore surrender unto Him if one wants to know Him as He is and that is the real process to approach the Infinite by the infinitesimals.

9) Sri Krishna is easily available by the religion of love i.e. by love and service as conceived by the damsels of Vraja who had practically no education whatsoever and much less any claim for high class birth right.

10) The highest service that can be rendered to the mankind is, therefore, to preach the philosophy and religion of Bhagavad-gita for all the times, all the places and all the people.

I hope you may agree with me and thus make a combined effort in this direction for the benefit of the mankind.

Letter to Govinda Maharaja -- New Delhi 16 September, 1955:

I have read with great interest your article especially the one which is named as "CHALAR PATHE." It is not only very amusing but also instructive. Simple dry philosophical arguments will not be appealing now a days to people in general. They will like to read such articles as written by you with greater relish. In this article I can find out that you have really some parts and in time you can become a great transcendental humorist in the art of journalism. You have complete mercy of your Divine master and you can depend on his blessings for your future improvement. I sincerely wish you all success—Undoubtedly you are now in the highest order of Varnasrama Dharma but we cannot forget that you belong to the category of our affectionate sons.

Letter to Brother -- Jhansi November 1958:

I am prepared to convince you in every respect that there is our Eternal Father and He wants you and all of us to go back to our permanent home. If you argue that there is no such Father God at all, then I am still more prepared to argue with you in all seriousness. In that case you may kindly let me know your definite view points relevantly so that I may try to reply these points one by one. And should you desire to argue with me, then my only request to you will be that for all such arguments we must be always very sincere and serious. Once we are convinced in that way, we must be prepared to act accordingly.

1967 Correspondence

Letter to Subala -- Delhi 29 September, 1967:

Krishna Consciousness is a transcendental science which can be revealed to a sincere devotee who is prepared to render service to the Lord. Krishna Consciousness is not achieved by dry arguments or by academic qualifications. Our senses are all blunt in the matter of receiving transcendental subject matter, but they are purified in due course of time by constant engagement in the service of the Lord. So yours and Krishna Devi's sincere effort to open a branch in Santa Fe is crowned with success by the Grace of the Lord.

Letter to Gargamuni -- Calcutta 19 October, 1967:

I do not believe that Kirtanananda has gone to such an extent of ailing situation but if he does not rectify himself immediately his future is very dark. If he is sincere in his concept of impersonal Absolute he should enter into correspondence with me & I shall refute all his arguments; but I understand that he could not answer you even when you hit him with some questions. I shall request that you save this poor creature from impersonal calamity.

Letter to Rayarama -- Calcutta 9 November, 1967:

The nonsense theory of oneness becomes null and void by the evidence presented in this incident. But we should not be angry with these poor souls. Try to convince them by argument and reason but do not become angry with them. Lord Nityananda when he was dealing with Jagai and Madhai maintained the maximum amount of tolerance and patience in spite of the greatest provocation. The two brothers, Jagai and Madhai, committee. violence on Lord Nityananda. Even Lord Caitanya, the author of Siksastak, became agitated. But Lord Nityananda Prabhu in the matter remained calm and quiet and delivered the two rascals to the highest elevation. We should always try to represent Lord Nityananda Prabhu in the matter of preaching work.

Letter to Pradyumna, Satsvarupa, Jadurani -- Calcutta 21 November, 1967:

Killing proposal is not good. We have to kill them with arguments and reasons not with sticks and weapons.

1968 Correspondence

Letter to Brahmananda -- Los Angeles 21 January, 1968:

Feeling of sex life in young boys and girls is quite natural, but one has to check such sex life by reason, argument, and knowledge. The married boys and girls are there—in our society sex life is not forbidden. If Jagatananda is feeling sex urge so urgently even at the age of 16 or 17, he must be prepared to take the responsibility of married life.

Letter to Mahapurusa -- Los Angeles 12 February, 1968:

You have desired to meet with Maharishi Mahesa for argument, and as Lord Caitanya argued with Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya. Sarvabhauma Bhattacarya was talking on the basic principle of Vedanta. So there was a via media interpretation. This man does not follow any Sastra or any authority. He is authority by himself, and has manufactured his own meditation process. Therefore, he is not standard. We cannot waste our time with a non-standard loafer class man.

Letter to Upendra -- Los Angeles 1 March, 1968:

Yes, you may take up such debate, but not any quarrel or argument should take place. It is good to have such debate, and to know the various arguments which the Mayavad philosophers put forth, and to know how to fully defeat each one. That God can come under Maya is one of their foolish arguments; therefore they say "I am God." This nonsense statement can be refuted in full with our information from Bhagavad Gita, Srimad Bhagavatam.

Letter to Upendra -- Los Angeles 1 March, 1968:

The question, does Lord Rama or Lord Caitanya forget, is like saying, does God come under Maya, or forgetfulness. You must fully understand this before you can successfully debate with the Mayavad arguments. It is very important point.

Letter to Terry and associates -- San Francisco 22 March, 1968:

Maya may put so many doubts and worthless arguments into our minds, but if we continue the chanting, the curing process will go on, never mind the doubts, and gradually we will get a taste of that sweet nectar of Krishna Nama Sankirtana. That is the process; and you may explain it to all your friends, so they may understand the nature of their doubts and skepticism, and be benefited.

1969 Correspondence

Letter to Govinda -- Los Angeles 10 February, 1969:

We can refute any dogmatic arguments against this conviction, and how do we do that? Simply because we start our understanding from the data of authoritative sources like Krishna or His representative. In the Bhagavad-gita, Lord Krishna speaks about spirit soul from the very beginning. Unless one understands what is this spirit soul, his further advancement of the Supreme Spirit God has no value. So this gentleman is puzzled in his understanding about wherefrom we have come, what we are, and where we are going.

Letter to Mukunda -- Los Angeles 20 February, 1969:

My father was very much affectionate, and in my childhood, whatever I wanted from my father he would at once give me. One time he purchased for me one rifle, and so after taking it I demanded that he must give me another. My father denied "You already have one. Why do you ask me for another?" So my argument was that I must have two rifles, one for each hand. Due to my obstinacy my father finally agreed. Later on when I was young and lost my father, I was very sorry to have lost such affectionate father, but by Krishna's Grace, I have now many American fathers and mothers. So I am appealing to all of my American fathers and mothers to help me by this contribution.

Letter to Janardana -- Los Angeles 2 March, 1969:

We should train our disciples as well as ourselves in such a spirit that even if the whole world is against us, which is impossible to happen, the Sankirtana Movement must be pushed on without any reference to archeological evidence or any such scientific advancement of knowledge. Besides that, the argument that archeological evidence will lead many people to accept the philosophy of Lord Caitanya has no evidence. For example, the Christian religion principle is now established in archeological evidence, but still it is not that the whole people of the world are attracted by Christian religion.

Letter to Satsvarupa -- Hawaii 19 March, 1969:

Regarding the tape, you have sent me tape no. 6, so the no. 7 is there, and no. 8 is also there. I am glad to note your arguments with the Yoga meeting people. Actually this so-called yoga system and meditation that is so much popular in your country is bogus. But if we speak the naked truth to the people, sometimes they may get angry. Because unpalatable truth is not tolerated. If we call a black man black, he will be angry because it is unpalatable. So we have to present our case very carefully.

Letter to Pradyumna -- New Vrindaban 26 May, 1969:

So upon hearing from you whether or not you are able to collect the money in connection with Mr. Brahma, Mr. Ghosh and other Indian gentlemen, then we can negotiate further in this matter. Mr. Worley has said that the assessed value is 45% of the value and he has advanced the argument that for Franklyn County tax purposes, the value was assessed as around $59,000. But in our case there is no question of tax. So without tax the assessment of the city authorities is correct. Anyway, I shall talk with them seriously if you give me assurance you can arrange for the $10,000. For the balance I shall arrange; rest assured.

Letter to Upendra -- Tittenhurst 27 October, 1969:

The conditioned souls are always within the Maha Visnu Form, whereas the liberated souls in Vaikuntha, they are engaged in the service of the Lord. Constitutionally every living entity, even if he is in the Vaikuntha Loka, has chance of falling down. Therefore the living entity is called marginal energy. But when the falldown has taken place for the conditioned soul is very difficult to ascertain. Therefore two classes are designated: eternally liberated and eternally conditioned. But for arguments sake, a living entity being marginal energy, he can't be eternally conditioned. The Time is so unlimited that the conditioned souls appear to be eternally so, but from the philosophical view he cannot be eternally conditioned.

1970 Correspondence

Letter to Hanuman Prasad Poddar -- Los Angeles 5 February, 1970:

At that time, I was a young man and a nationalist, admirer of Mahatma Gandhi and C.R. Dass. So I replied Him at that time, who would care for the message of Lord Caitanya while we are a subject nation? In this way, I had some argument with my Spiritual Master, and at the end I was defeated. But at that time, because I was already married, I could not take His words very seriously.

Letter to Yamuna -- Los Angeles 10 February, 1970:

. It is a fact that all other institutions, never mind whether it is Ramakrishna Mission or philosophical speculators, nobody can stand our arguments and reason if we can support them by quoting Scriptures. So if we thoroughly study the books which we have so far published, as well as serve Krsna in great devotion by following the regulative principles, we shall be able to defeat anyone who is not in Krsna Consciousness. So do it nicely, and everyone of you become great preachers.

Letter to Acyutananda -- Los Angeles 15 March, 1970:

Regarding Mayapur land, I understand that ____ Ali is in problem for keeping the money. I understand that he wants to invest the sale money to purchase another suitable land, but he has no such land in his view at present. Therefore he does not wish to sell the land. This plea is not very sound argument. But in this connection, he may be informed that why he should keep the sale money at home? He can make a fixed deposit of the money in a bank at Navadvipa, and he will get interest also. Then when he may find some land, he can withdraw the money.

Letter to Madhudvisa -- Los Angeles 26 March, 1970:

It will be very pleasing to learn that in the morning you are now studying from one and one half to two hours and in the evening you have class from forty five minutes to an hour, and you are stressing the importance of lecturing and preaching with authoritative and substantial arguments.

Letter to Tosana Krsna -- Los Angeles 23 June, 1970:

So on the whole if anyone accepts that God is greater than everyone and nobody is equal to Him, then we welcome such statement. And if he is sober and intelligent then he will try to learn from Vedic literature how God is greater than everyone and nobody is equal to Him. This knowledge is very clearly defined beginning from the Bhagavad-gita. So if you meet such persons who are staunch Christians you can humbly put this argument before them for consideration. But if somebody is dogmatic and blind follower, then avoid to discuss with him. Better spend that time for enlightening a person who is innocent. Do not try to enter into the details of New Testament, but simply say that we agree on the principle that God is great.

Letter to Vyasa -- Los Angeles 6 August, 1970:

Anyone can understand that behind the beauty of nature, behind the succulent fruits and vegetables, and behind the wonderful heat and light of the sun, there is a Friend. So we should contact that Dearmost Friend, Krsna. Any reasonable man will accept this argument. That is rational thinking. In the second chapter of the Bhagavad-gita, Lord Krsna says that "One who restrains his senses and fixes his consciousness upon Me is known as a man of steady intelligence." Otherwise there can be no conviction. How can a man be convinced who will not accept? Krsna says hear from me, "tatsrnu."

1971 Correspondence

Letter to Madhudvisa -- Kenya 15 September, 1971:

Yes, this program is very nice to try to attract the attention of the students seriously. That will be a great success. They should put intelligent questions and they should be answered properly with reference to modern science and philosophy. That will be very much convincing. I think if you read our books thoroughly you will get a supply of material to answer all the questions. Now I am preparing one book answering all types of philosophical arguments. Syamasundara. every morning is putting questions from different angles of vision beginning from Socrates, Plato, Aristotle, etc. and we are trying to answer. We shall discuss also Marx philosophy of communism. It will require some time but I wish that all our preachers should be well versed with all philosophical ideas and after studying all philosophical points of view we will put Krishna Conscious philosophy on the top.

Letter to Bahulasva -- Vrindaban 30 November, 1971:

The example regarding the Swami's argument is that God is the ocean and the living entities are waves. So accepting this argument we may say that the waves are being formed perpetually and again, and they are mixing with the sea water. So what is the question of liberation? That is the example in Bhagavad-Gita. The whole material manifestation is generating and again vanishing. So we are not concerned with this kind of business. We are concerned to go deep into the sea and have our own individual identity exactly like the fish and other aquatic animals, and enjoy perpetually in the sea. This is liberation.

Letter to Patita Uddharana -- Delhi 8 December, 1971:

Your idea to publish a booklet of arguments against impersonalists is very good proposal. Do it nicely by mutual consultation with your learned elder godbrothers and godsisters, and if you like I can provide answers for any such questions that impersonalists frequently ask.

1972 Correspondence

Letter to Atreya Rsi -- Bombay 4 February, 1972:

The secret is to engage everyone, even big businessmen; so at first engage them in some small way so they will not feel threatened, but they will enjoy that small service so much, automatically they will desire for more, and then gradually you convince them by strong arguments and engage them more and more, and then they will perfect their lives in Krishna Consciousness, and go back Home, back to Godhead.

Letter to Dasarha -- Bombay 4 March, 1972:

Regarding your questions on Christianity, we are not very much keen to engage them in argument because for the most part they are sentimentalists and have no philosophy, therefore they become fanatics or dogmatists, and this type of person we cannot change. But if you find some Christian person who is intelligent to understand philosophy then you may argue that if God is unlimited, how He can be confined to having only one son? The son is the representative of the father, and in that sense he is the same as the father, but also he is different than the father. So Christ is speaking in this sense, that only through the representative of God can one come to God.

Letter to Andrew Parco -- San Francisco Calif. 7 October, 1972:

If you are actually very much eager to search out God, you should know that logic and argument cannot help you because the opposing elements may be better logicians and may convert your decision by better logical arguments. So far books are concerned, they are differently described for different types of men and a philosopher. So we cannot decide either from the books or by philosophical speculation or by argument and logic. So the best thing is that you find out yourself who you think is the right person in the matter of science of God.

Letter to Jayapataka -- Bombay 19 December, 1972:

Attachment must be there, for Krishna or for maya. So you have become attached to developing the Mayapur centre, that is Krishna's work, so Krishna appreciates very much when His devotee becomes attached to Him in this way. Yes, the cooperative spirit of working together without any argument is especially prominent in Mayapur, more than other places in India. Therefore you are successful, and the work is going on quickly to completion. That is because all of you working there have become very much attached to the dust from Lord Caitanya's Lotus Feet, and because you have got such deep personal interest with that engagement of work, you want to see that it is done nicely without any hindrance of selfish motivation, never mind all kinds of conditions of the material nature.

1973 Correspondence

Letter to Dr. Aggarwal -- Calcutta 7 March, 1973:

Actually one can be perfectly Krishna-Conscious without being literate. Education is not necessary. Simply it is required to accept the fact, that we are the eternal servants of Krishna, and engage in some tangible service. Otherwise, there are so many convincing arguments, i.e. the Bhagavad-Gita, to bring us to the right point of surrender. Even the Karma-Kanda, and Jnana-Kanda, sections of the Vedas are designed to bring to the proper Sidhanta, conclusion. And that conclusion is made by Krishna in the Gita, that one who knows the purpose behind the Vedas, surrenders unto Him.

Letter to Niranjana -- Brooklyn 21 May, 1973:

Yes, their arguments are quite reasonable. The aim of our education should be, whatever education we might have got, we must satisfy the Lord by such education. That is the perfection of life. I have therefore asked our chemist friend, Dr. Swaroop Damodara das Brahmacari to refute the theory that life comes out of matter. This is not the fact, rather, matter comes out of life. We have discussed this point very broadly and Swaroop Damodara is convinced that everything comes from life, Krsna—aham sarvasya prabhavo/ mattah sarvam pravartate. (BG 10.8). So, I've asked Swaroop Damodara to invite Ramananda Rao to come and join him to present this revolutionary theory to the learned advanced scientists. We know it certainly that matter comes out of life. Simply we have to present this thesis in chemical, technological words. Svarupa Damodara has already written one small booklet, "Krsna Consciousness, Purely on a Scientific Basis." So this is the business of big, big, chemists and physicists to present the real facts in Krsna Consciousness.

Letter to Niranjana -- Brooklyn 21 May, 1973:

So, if they do not believe in Ramayana, Mahabharata, Bhagavad-gita, then they are called unbelievers, so how can you believe their words. Then we come to the platform of reason and argument. If they do not believe in Ramayana and Mahabharata, then we shall reply point to point by argument and reason. Of course, it is not possible to come to the right conclusion simply by argument and reason, tarkanratishtanat.

Letter to Bhakta dasa -- Bhaktivedanta Manor 3 August, 1973:

The first principle of spiritual life is non violence. They will say Killing in this matter means actually Murder, but accepting even this argument, it means that the society in which Christ was preaching were composed of Murderers, so what kind of men they were, and practically we see it is a fact that because they murdered Lord Jesus Christ. At any rate there is nothing in the world thAT CAN COMPARE WITH our Movement of Chanting and dancing. So Chant dance and when you get tired take Prasadm, this is our actual solid preaching work all over the world.

Letter to Bhakta Don -- Los Angeles 1 December, 1973:

Krsna Consciousness is perfect so it can be substantiated by all means of argument and logic. The main theme is that life has come from life and not generated from matter as they foolishly claim. You just prove this point and it will be a great victory.

1974 Correspondence

Letter to Hamsaduta -- Hyderabad 21 April, 1974:

Your chart for reporting book and record distribution is approved by me, as from this chart I can quickly see how the centers are doing. Yes, by all means you may print my morning walk speaking about "Life comes from Life" into a small book; this argument should be spread, as any intelligent man will be convinced that our discussion is thoroughly scientific and exposes the so called materialistic scientists as rascals. So go on printing and distributing as many books as possible; this is your real work and your personal success. From you report of an hour long kirtana at Moscow Airport, I understand that the sankirtana movement has already begun there and now it will go on further.

Letter to Giriraj Prabhu -- Mayapur:

Presented strong arguments for not increasing it, but because of the situation indigenous to Calcutta. If you are getting success there, and similarly thay got success at Natadwara I understand, I suggest that we have the donar membership at Rs. 1,000/- and the life membership at Rs. 2,000/-. I will discuss it with Gargamuni Swami this weekend and try yo get some agreement.

Letter to Giriraja -- Mayapur 19 October, 1974:

Regarding the tax commission case, we are receiving approximately Rs. 18,000/per annum including the tax payments, which means at 10% interest the value is Rs. 1,80,000/-. So we have paid Rs. 14,50,000/-; less Rs. 1,80,000/is Rs. 12,70,000/-. So we have paid Rs. 12,70,000/- for 6,000 sq. yards; which means we have paid approximately Rs. 200/- per sq. yard. At that time the rate was not more than Rs. 150/- per sq. yard; so we have paid more than the market price. This argument should be placed.

1975 Correspondence

Letter to Bon Maharaja -- Los Angeles 24 July, 1975:

Regarding the library building, I am only interested in Caitanya philosophy. As it is stated in the Caitanya Caritamrta, "sri krsna caitanya daya karaha vicara/ vicara karile citte pabe camatkare." If you are indeed interested in logic and argument, kindly apply it to the mercy of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu. If you do so, you will find it to be strikingly wonderful. (Cc. Ādi lila 8.15) But, in the library other books may be kept for comparative study by the scholars.

Letter to Satsvarupa -- Johannesburg 21 October, 1975:

Surrender has nothing to do with your destiny, that will depend on you (the spirit-soul) because you have a little independence, a little freedom. Theirs is atheistic argument. God is not only omniscient, but also Almighty. Predestiny is there but it is cancelled if you surrender to Him, otherwise God is not the controller. Theirs is like karma mimamsa philosophy, that God is our servant and He must reward me according to my activities. If you surrender to Krishna there is no more predestiny.

Letter to Svarupa Damodara -- Bombay 17 December, 1975:

My point is life comes from life. They say life has come from chemicals, so how these things can be adjusted? Besides that the scientists change their theories after some years, this proves that they have no perfect knowledge, otherwise where is the necessity of changing? That is the basic point of our argument. Perfect knowledge is never changeable. If we can prove that life comes from life, or the soul is from the supper soul, then all other things can be brought into serious consideration. So you try to prove that chemical combination can never bring about life, this is our main argument. If we can prove this particular subject matter, that the soul cannot be manufactured by combination of chemicals, then gradually we can prove that vedic knowledge is perfect, while other sources of knowledge by speculation and imagination are all wrong.

1976 Correspondence

Letter to Robert -- Mayapur 8 March, 1976:

You mention that the scientists try "to simplify the problem at hand by neglecting any complex factors that may be present." What is that simplification? That there is no God. Their position is "sour grapes." They try by their speculation to understand things, and being unable they say there is no God. So we can use this science to defeat them, just as I have many other disciples, such as Svarupa Damodara. He is Ph.D. in Chemistry and now he is using his scientific background to defeat their atheistic arguments. There is a Bengali proverb: tor shil tor noda, tor bhangi dater goda. I take your mortar and pestle and I break your teeth. This means that we use the scientists own weapons and with them we defeat their atheistic philosophy.

Letter to Tamala Krsna -- Vrindaban 30 October, 1976:

Regarding the point about whether our movement is bona fide, you can use the following arguments. Bhagavad-gita has got so many editions. Our books are older than the Bible. In India there are millions of Krsna temples. Let the judges and juries read our books and take the opinion of learned scholars and professors. Regarding the second point about the parents jurisdiction over their children here are some suggestions. Do the parents like that their children become hippies? Why don't they stop it? Do the parents like their children to become involved in prostitution and intoxication? Why don't they stop this? When the government takes the children for the draft neither the parents nor the children like it. This question should be raised.

Page Title:Argument (Letters)
Compiler:Visnu Murti, ParthsarathyM
Created:10 of Feb, 2012
Totals by Section:BG=0, SB=0, CC=0, OB=0, Lec=0, Con=0, Let=44
No. of Quotes:44